Skip to main content

You know, I was pretty appalled when President Bush went to California to talk about the war when a portion of the country was undergoing a significant catastrophic natural disaster.  Rita is predicted to make landfall on Saturday.  I don't believe that the anti-war rallies should go on as scheduled.

On a personal level I think it is disrespectful to our fellow citizens who will be having their lives torn to shreds and makes the protestors seem disconnected from the rest of the country.  On a political level, I think it is bad form and has the potential to alienate many people who are finally coming around to the fact that the war was a really bad idea.

I think protests can be productive, but they can also be damning.  I hope the nation-wide anti-war rallies are rescheduled to show respect for the lives of our Gulf Coast brethren.

Originally posted to Peace Monger on Thu Sep 22, 2005 at 07:22 PM PDT.

EMAIL TO A FRIEND X
Your Email has been sent.
You must add at least one tag to this diary before publishing it.

Add keywords that describe this diary. Separate multiple keywords with commas.
Tagging tips - Search For Tags - Browse For Tags

?

More Tagging tips:

A tag is a way to search for this diary. If someone is searching for "Barack Obama," is this a diary they'd be trying to find?

Use a person's full name, without any title. Senator Obama may become President Obama, and Michelle Obama might run for office.

If your diary covers an election or elected official, use election tags, which are generally the state abbreviation followed by the office. CA-01 is the first district House seat. CA-Sen covers both senate races. NY-GOV covers the New York governor's race.

Tags do not compound: that is, "education reform" is a completely different tag from "education". A tag like "reform" alone is probably not meaningful.

Consider if one or more of these tags fits your diary: Civil Rights, Community, Congress, Culture, Economy, Education, Elections, Energy, Environment, Health Care, International, Labor, Law, Media, Meta, National Security, Science, Transportation, or White House. If your diary is specific to a state, consider adding the state (California, Texas, etc). Keep in mind, though, that there are many wonderful and important diaries that don't fit in any of these tags. Don't worry if yours doesn't.

You can add a private note to this diary when hotlisting it:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from your hotlist?
Are you sure you want to remove your recommendation? You can only recommend a diary once, so you will not be able to re-recommend it afterwards.
Rescue this diary, and add a note:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from Rescue?
Choose where to republish this diary. The diary will be added to the queue for that group. Publish it from the queue to make it appear.

You must be a member of a group to use this feature.

Add a quick update to your diary without changing the diary itself:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary?
(The diary will be removed from the site and returned to your drafts for further editing.)
(The diary will be removed.)
Are you sure you want to save these changes to the published diary?

Comment Preferences

  •  Are you (4.00)
    also hoping that the NCAA cancels all the football games because there's a hurricane? What about the NFL?

    Broadway should probably cancel Spamalot and The Odd Couple, too.

    You know what? Let's cancel the war in Iraq as well.  Let's not have that going on while hurricanes are hitting, either.

    Oh, wait...

    <rant>

    Really, I'm sick and tired of hearing this. If it's disrespectful to have an anti-war rally, it's disrespectful to do a damn thing, then, other that sit in front of the TV and worry. Or pray. Is that it?

    Personally, I've been working my ass off for the last two-and-a-half weeks helping Katrina survivors. This weekend, I'm going to DC, to try to do my small part to get this country back on track. I want our federal government's collective head on a platter for what they did to every hurrican survivor I've met over the past two-and-a-half weeks, for every survivor I haven't met, and for those who died. Iraq is a reason why they died. And I'm showing up in DC to make my voice heard.

    And I'm coming from Dallas, damnit, where I'm worried sick that Rita will stall for two days on top of my home and my husband. But I'm not going to sit around on my ass and wish there was something else I could do. I'm going to do it.

    </rant>

    Oh well, I wasn't using that civil liberty anyway.

    by think2004 on Thu Sep 22, 2005 at 07:31:39 PM PDT

    •  Who Do You Think Will Be Hearing You? (2.00)
      The political point I'm trying to make here is that you will get virtually NO media coverage during the protests and guaranteed negative publicity afterwards.  Ranting at a protest may make you feel good and like you accomplished something, but that doesn't mean you'll benefit your cause.  If you're looking to make an effective contribution to the anti-war movement you might want to rethink your tactics.  

      "...without a Respectable Navy, Alas America!" - John Paul Jones

      by Peace Monger on Thu Sep 22, 2005 at 07:42:37 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Who will benefit (4.00)
        if we DON'T protest? It sure won't be my fellow Texans who are watching this storm approach.

        According to the Rove contingent, there is no anti-war movement. Cancel this protest, and guess what? You think they'll be saying that the anti-war protestors are good Americans for calling it off for Rita?

        I don't think so.

        The very ones that we're protesting will spin this however the heck they want. That's standard operating procedure, and I expect nothing less, Rita or no Rita. Frankly, I think they'll ignore it - there is no anti-war moment, and Cindy is a clown.

        But it's time to take action, media coverage or not. Tens of thousands will be there... cancelling would be a mistake, and could take the wind out of the movement that's been growing for months, and truly picked up steam since Cindy sat in a ditch in Crawford.

        I respect your opinion, but I totally disagree with it.

        Oh well, I wasn't using that civil liberty anyway.

        by think2004 on Thu Sep 22, 2005 at 07:52:58 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Ya-yas aren't free (none)
          "...if we DON'T protest? It sure won't be my fellow Texans who are watching this storm approach."

          Well, if gas money is diverted to relief aid, a lot of people.

          And if you think Rove isn't benefiting from a motley crew of Liberals, Greens, Communists, Anarchists, and scattered Crazies protesting the main plank of his boss's presidency, you're nuts. He's got the cameras there ready to film for use in campaign ads. Folks in Dem party shirts standing next to the dude with a black bandana round his mouth great.

          It's just an enormous and costly Liberal team-building exercise that you yourself admit will be spun by pro-war folks (successfully if the past in any indicator) against the very thing it seeks, peace. And no one will see the actual march! Just their clips! Fantastic.

          Ya-ya's must be gotten out at all costs.

      •  Has "Peace"monger ever (4.00)
        been to an anti-war rally?

        Ranting at a protest may make you feel good and like you accomplished something, but that doesn't mean you'll benefit your cause.

        What make you think a rally is a rant, monger?  And who are you addressing?  Are you in general, not inclined or at least not aware of the role of gatherings, marches, rallies?
        I dare say you just don't like marchers.  And Rita is just a pretext for others to excuse themselves from not sympathizing with the anti-war movement.

        If your not against the war as a "cause", then shut your pie hole.  You have nothing to offer in opinion on whether or when a anti-war protest should take place.

        "I'm an insect who dreamed he was a man and loved it. But now the dream is over..." - Charles E. Pogue, "The Fly".

        by edsdet on Thu Sep 22, 2005 at 10:22:00 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Wow, Nice Personal Attack (none)
          First of all, I participated in various marches in my youth.  My mother brought me up to be active in the community and I accompanied her to several marches, most dealing with civil rights, some dealing with the environment.  I then joined the Navy and spent most of the next 23 years traveling quite a bit and I was never in an area where there was a march whose cause I supported.

          Am I against the war in Iraq?  Yes, I am and I have been since its inception.  I have a multitude of friends that are in harms way for a cause that never really existed.  Have I participated in any anti-war rallies, no I have not.  I have written my congressional representatives on multiple occasions and donate to various anti-war causes.  Will I go to an anti-war rally in the future?  I don't know.  It would have to be well organized and have a single purpose.

          As I said originally, I am NOT against the anti-war rallies.  I DO believe that nature has made the timing very bad for this one.  As I see it, the purpose of anti-war rallies is to get positive media attention for the anti-war cause.  I truly believe that the timing of these rallies will cause the opposite effect.  I would prefer that the anti-war effort maintain its positive momentum and not be set-back because people are unwilling to change a schedule.  I have friends whose lives are at risk and  want the anti-war message to be heard and heeded, not ignored and ridiculed.

          "...without a Respectable Navy, Alas America!" - John Paul Jones

          by Peace Monger on Fri Sep 23, 2005 at 04:18:49 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  Heh... (2.50)
    ...it would be far more useful -- for the peace movement and the nation -- if everyone saved their travel money and sent it to Rita's victims via a massive PayPal account. Even possible hypocrisy vis-a-vis paralleling Bush's action w/ Katrina, there ain't going to be coverage of the march. None. It will occur in a vacuum, affecting none but the participants.

    Meanwhile, Bush will be jetting off Saturday afternoon to survey the damage, which along with all the lefties in DC will be quite the unfavorable juxtaposition.

    So, you're right, the protests shouldn't go on as planned (though I've never thought different, I admit). An relief account should be set up, gas money should be put there instead of into NoVA's air, and that'll be more constructive than any C-Span 3 covered march ever coulda been.

    Understand this will never happen. Useful, private, and silent actions will never trump cathartic, public ones where you get to yell. Ya-ya's must be gotten out at all costs.

    •  I don't know who this (4.00)
      Michael Nathan Gottlieb person is, but he needs to understand that troll ratings are for TROLLS--NOT for when you disagree with someone. Here's a 4 (and another one above, as well) to balance out an inappropriate 1.

      I understand that people might get frustrated by the suggestion that suddenly the timing of this protest, which has required a lot of work and is the focus of a lot of passion, mightn't be so great anymore. But that concern, and the way it's been expressed in this diary, is legitimate and deserves neither vitriol nor 1-ratings.

      It makes perfect sense that people are worried about how the protest will be viewed now, in light of another storm. And yet you can't just call it off and say "come back next week instead." It really is quite unfortunate. I agree that there's a possibility for some negative fallout from this protest. Is that a reason to cancel it altogether? I have no idea.

      Part the goal of this protest, however, is not to simply preach to the choir. There are plenty of us who don't need convincing. There are plenty of us who don't need to be reminded that, yes, there is indeed an anti-war movement, and a righteous one at that.

      It just seems, with the media's recent (read: last 5+ years) track record, that it'll be a lot easier to turn millions of people off to "more damned protesters" than it was to turn them off to Bush playing the guitar as NOLA drowned--because Americans who get their news exclusively from FOX and CNN are becoming increasingly irrational and more easily manipulated and it sometimes takes a second smack on the face for them to wake up out of their Doritos-Dr. Pepper haze and become indignant about something.

      I'd hate to see them be led willy-nilly into being indignant about the protest on Saturday just because of the timing.

      No, people are too revved up (and rightfully so) to cancel this protest. It's just unfortunate--that's all.

      It'll be interesting to see, though, how many people DO decide to skip going for gas/Rita/media reasons.

    •  To paraphras Judas : (none)
      ...it would be far more useful -- for the peace movement and the nation -- if everyone saved their travel money and sent it to Rita's victims via a massive PayPal account.

      Judas: "Why wasn't this expensive perfume not sold and the money given to the poor!..." Others following Jesus knew Judas was stealing from the purse.

      A classic and ancient sign of hypocrisy, self-interest, blindness.

      "I'm an insect who dreamed he was a man and loved it. But now the dream is over..." - Charles E. Pogue, "The Fly".

      by edsdet on Thu Sep 22, 2005 at 10:36:05 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Huh? (none)
        I think I'm being accused of being Judas here, but for the life of me I'm not sure how I'm stealing from the allegorical purse here...
        •  Not Calling You a Judas (none)
          Just juxtaposing the classic argument in the New
          Testament that is used as a foil against good works
          while cloaking the real intent.
          There's a lot of things that need response to.  But there's a proper time and place to make those cases.
          It tends to be a red herring.

          "I'm an insect who dreamed he was a man and loved it. But now the dream is over..." - Charles E. Pogue, "The Fly".

          by edsdet on Fri Sep 23, 2005 at 01:25:14 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  Respectfully, (4.00)
    I agree with Think. There is a segment of America which feels that protesting a war is in some way disrespectful of the members of our armed forces, disrespectful of our elected political leaders, or less than fully patriotic (or actively treasonous, in some quarters). This is simply flat-out wrong, and we shouldn't accomodate the sensibilities of those who hold such opinions; we should argue with them. Calling off antiwar protests isn't going to aid the government's emergency response to Hurricane Rita. So who cares?

    The reason we were angry the President was busy with other priorities during Katrina and its aftermath is that the President is responsible, ultimately, for the federal government's emergency response. The antiwar movement is not delegated any responsibility for natural disaster emergency response, unless the DHS organigram is even more screwed up than we knew it was. Let the protests proceed as planned.

    "When I came to this town, my eyes were big blue stars. Now they're big green dollar signs." - Jean Arthur, "Mr. Smith Goes to Washington"

    by brooksfoe on Thu Sep 22, 2005 at 07:41:41 PM PDT

    •  How effective (none)
      was Cindy Sheehan's protests during Katrina and its immediate aftermath?  I don't think protesting a war is disrespectful of the troops fighting the war.  I do think it is disresptful to try and shine a spotlight on yourself whenthere is a catastrophic event killing your neighbors.

      Bottomline - on a political level I think the anti-war rallies will actually turn back some of the anti-war momentum that has been building.  I'd prefer we retain the momentum.

      "...without a Respectable Navy, Alas America!" - John Paul Jones

      by Peace Monger on Thu Sep 22, 2005 at 07:47:47 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  umm...hello? (none)
        maybe you'd care to tell the katrina survivors at the rally that it was inappropriate for them to protest?

        there is a catastrophic event known as the bush administration that is killing all the neighbors of the world - some more overtly than others.

        cindy was weeks into her crawford vigil before katrina even attained prominence.  she had already stated her intentions and she stuck to her word - what would you have her do?

        you also conveniently ignore all the donations and work she and crawford peace house put into katrina relief.

        your comment could not be more specious or irrelevant if it tried.

        •  Yes, I think it was inappropriate. (none)
          Just as I thought it was inappropriate for Ms. Sheehan to try and push for anti-war publicity during the height of the Katrina disaster. I think your one line of reasoning, "she had already stated her intentions and she stuck to her word - what would you have her do?" is pretty funny.  It sounds like the lines President Bush and his cronies use to validate their bad decisions.  

          No, I don't believe that Ms. Sheehan should have "stayed the course."  When circumstances change a review of the situation is called for and different actions might be required.  I, on a personal level, believe this was the case for protesting during a major natural disaster.

          I prefer that  massive efforts actually gain supporters, not lose them.  You can berate and disagree with me all you want, that's your right.  But the fact is I am against the Iraq war (always have been) and the anti-everything Saturday protest during Rita's destruction of the Gulf Coast turned me away from the anti-war movement.  I am sure that I am not alone.

          "...without a Respectable Navy, Alas America!" - John Paul Jones

          by Peace Monger on Tue Sep 27, 2005 at 04:08:40 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  They Have to Be Smart, Careful & Respectful (none)
    Most Americans see a connection between Iraq and Katrina, in part because they believe that all the Guardsmen and military over there did play a part in the government's appalling response to the disaster, and partly because they see all this money being spent in Iraq that needs to be spent here at home instead.  So, if the rally can somehow make that connection, which won't be easy, it might help put the protest in a better light.  
  •  I think it would help to (4.00)
    include some prominent signs demanding the Bush admin  bring our Nat Guard troops home to help with hurricanes. I think that would help establish the proper context during a hurricane.

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site