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CBS national news is reporting that the governors of Virginia and California "...have declined to appear with the President at fundraisers." IIRC these guys are both already in trouble in the polls.

Any other reports of such radioactivity to GW among his fellow Repubs?

Could this be the beginning of a death spiral. One can only hope.

Originally posted to bewert on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 05:40 PM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Virginia? (none)
    You sure? Why would a Democrat like Mark Warner want to appear with Bush anyway?
  •  in the case of virginia (none)
    I think the diarist meant republican candidate for governor.
  •  yup (4.00)
    the governator told Bush to stay away.  he didnt and Arnold played to busy and didnt go visit him.  the Dems told him to live up to his self imposed nickname "collectinator" which referenced his ability to get federal $ for CA.  Arnold was pissed that Bush would drain $ away from his initiative fight by having a fundraiser.  those factors and the fact that both of them have approval ratings in the 30s drove the two appart.

    Lew Uhler, Prop. 75 author: "I think [sic] that Joe McCarthy was on target."

    by juls on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 05:41:57 PM PDT

    •  Can you imagine them together? (4.00)
      I'm a social scientist, so I know a little something about public opinion polls, but the combination of Bush and Herr Gropenfuhrer has even me wondering if approval numbers can ever fall below zero.

      Thwarting the forces of conservatism since 1978.

      by wiscmass on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:06:44 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Below zero, eh? (4.00)
        Bush approval rate among African Americans: 2%

        Margin of error: + or - 3%.

        If Condi and Alan Keyes are both out of the country, yeah, GWB could indeed be at -1% among African Americans.

        Quis custodiet ipsos custodet? (Who will watch the watchers?)

        by The Crusty Bunker on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:12:04 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  The reason (none)
          that 2% number is no good has been explained elsewhere.  The MOE was not 3%.

          George W. Bush -- It's mourning in America.

          by LarryInNYC on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:16:03 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  As I understood it (none)
            the sample size of Afican Americans in the poll was 100, and only two approved. SO the MOE might have ben large, but still, 2 out a 100, is awful.

            Bush is so exhausted by all these scandals that he is praying for another disaster like a flood or a hurricane so he can kick back and do nothing. -Bill Maher

            by jj32 on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:41:43 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Yes, but a sample size of (none)
              89 is so small, the results are essentially unusable.

              I'm not suggesting that Bush has seen an increase in support in the black community, but rather that his support is probably around 10% or so, as found in other polls.

              George W. Bush -- It's mourning in America.

              by LarryInNYC on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:45:42 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  OK, it was an anomaly, (none)
                ...but it was hilarious!
              •  or higher? (none)
                Check out the Survey USA data (50 state presidential approval polls) -- judging from those, I'm thinking it might be higher, like 15% or more. Each state poll supposedly has 600 people, so for 50 states, that'd be 30,000 people polled total. That would mean a sample size of approximately 3690 blacks total, which should be way more than enough to get a good number.

                As for the limitations... (1) this is a telephone poll, and (2) this is in the wake of Katrina, Rita, Wilma, etc., which struck southern states hard. Still, you can get around the second concern by comparing it to earlier surveys. I compared their data for Louisiana to August's data, and it was within 1%...

                •  You guys are hilarious! (none)
                  It was a JOKE, got that?  Here's the clue: You can't have a NEGATIVE person, numerically anyway.  But I'd just bet you that I can walk up to 100 African Americans at random in Detroit, LA, Chicago, Atlanta, any major airport, concert or sports venue, etc. and more than 90% of the time 100% of them will disapprove of Mr. Bush.

                  I'd have to find a very successful broker-type on Wall Street to get an approval.  That guy is out there as a statistic and he has friends.  But not many.

                  Quis custodiet ipsos custodet? (Who will watch the watchers?)

                  by The Crusty Bunker on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 04:53:07 AM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  wtf. (none)
                    Did you even read the post that you replied to? Are you at all interested in statistics? If you were, then maybe you'd question that "90%" figure you just pulled out of your nether regions. Or maybe you'd conduct those surveys, and find out what it really is. Incidentally, you'll find successful broker-types at major airports, concerts or sports venues as well. Each of those will probably skew your sample population in a different way. FYI.
                    •  Whoo HOO! I'm holding my SIDES!! (none)
                      Listen up, you standard deviant, I got an "A" in stats and also "A's" in English which is why I understand concepts like hyperbole and sarcasm.  Spend some quality time reading/listening to Al Franken, Mort Sahl, Tom Lahr or Mark Russell.  Then quit wasting my time and go f*ck up a Republican because I'm on YOUR side dumbass.

                      Yeesh.

                      Quis custodiet ipsos custodet? (Who will watch the watchers?)

                      by The Crusty Bunker on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 08:42:36 AM PST

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  That figures. (none)
                        I got an "A" in stats and also "A's" in English which is why I understand concepts like hyperbole and sarcasm.  Spend some quality time reading/listening to Al Franken

                        If you were only a comedian and political commentator like Al Franken, would you understand concepts like statistics and polite discourse better? If you want to quit wasting my time, then (a) reply with a relevant comment that (b) has to do with the topic I'm discussing, like (c) the actual statistics of the matter. (If I thought you were actually interested in facts or at all sane, I'd tell you the real number here is probably closer to 15.5%, with a sample size of at least 2,700 people or so, probably more--but that does not appear to be the case so far.) Until then, fuck off.

                        •  ROFL!!!!!!!! (none)
                          GOD you are an idiot.  I still think that number is high. Meanwhile I've done a fucking lot more for your and my cause than you will ever know.

                          You are a waste of these elctrons.

                          Quis custodiet ipsos custodet? (Who will watch the watchers?)

                          by The Crusty Bunker on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 05:38:42 PM PST

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  Oh really. (none)
                            I'm so impressed. I'm sure your first month here has been very productive. Forgive me if I don't take your insulting personal assessment of me with the gravity that I'm sure you--in your impressively qualified wisdom--think it should have. However, I will make one more request of you, for the cause: why don't you do one more thing for us that I have done and you apparently haven't--some research, preferably before the next time you start shooting your mouth off.
                          •  Hey, how about this: (none)
                            Let's put aside our petty bickering (or if you prefer, MY petty bickering) and JOIN IN CELEBRATION of Harry "Houdini" Reid's escape today from the Republican Lockbox on the open Senate floor!

                            Howzaboutit?  I APOLOGIZE!  Now let's virtually shake and pop the champaigne cork!!  Win or lose at least we're IN THE FIGHT TOGETHER!!!  

                            KNOCK 'EM DEAD HARRY AND TAKE NO PRISONERS!

                            Quis custodiet ipsos custodet? (Who will watch the watchers?)

                            by The Crusty Bunker on Tue Nov 01, 2005 at 07:57:53 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

      •  Negative approval ratings (none)
        If we could somehow poll the ghosts of all African Americans from days gone by, that might count as a <0% approval. We might even switch into modal space and determine his approval in all possible worlds, which presumably is disastrous all the way through.
        •  That's the problem with using approval ratings (none)
          It's one thing to disapprove of someone's performance. It's another thing to disapprove so strongly that you think the someone in question has performed worse than anyone else in history who has ever held the same position. Approval ratings typically don't measure the intensity of respondents' opinions.

          Thwarting the forces of conservatism since 1978.

          by wiscmass on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:57:32 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  New approach on intensity (none)
            If in Mr. Bush's presence would you demonstrate your disapproval with

            a. Stern words
            b. A slap with a chenille glove
            c. A squirt from a seltzer bottle
            d. A right jab to the solar plexus
            e. A Louisville slugger applied to the knee
            f. A rusty chainsaw applied repeatedly

            Quis custodiet ipsos custodet? (Who will watch the watchers?)

            by The Crusty Bunker on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 04:57:07 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  That would work... (none)
              ...though I think under BushCo, you get a visit from the Secret Service for even thinking about expressing anything as severe as option (a), let alone anything more severe.

              Thwarting the forces of conservatism since 1978.

              by wiscmass on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 07:21:18 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

  •  The bigger scandal is (4.00)
    That money is still flowing into the Republican party, people are not burning their Republican Party cards, and plans are going forward as though there can be business as usual. Reminds me of an old New Yorker Cartoon, where the dining steward tells someone at the dinner table, "I think we've stopped to take on a little ice."
  •  Arnold sucks almost as bad as Bush. (none)
    When you hang around with turkeys, you turn into a girlie man.

    "The concentration [of the legislative, executive and judicial powers] in the same hands is precisely the definition of despotic government." - Jefferson

    by El Payo on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 05:54:09 PM PDT

  •  here's the shizzle (none)
    As Bush Visits Va., Kilgore Stays At Arm's Length

    By Lisa Rein
    Washington Post Staff Writer
    Saturday, October 29, 2005; Page B01

    NORFOLK, Oct. 28 -- President Bush, flanked on both sides by servicemen in fatigues, began a speech on terrorism and the war in Iraq on Friday with a few thank-yous to Virginia leaders with front-row seats, including Sen. George Allen (R) and Rep. Thelma D. Drake, the local GOP congresswoman. Even the mayor -- a Democrat -- was acknowledged.

    Our diarist is on the money - when jack booted Nazi racist pigs like Kilgore don't want to be seen with loser Shrub, things are looking up!

    •  .. woops (none)
      left off the important part of the article by mistake

      One politician who was nowhere near Chrysler Hall to wave to what would seem to be a friendly crowd was Jerry W. Kilgore, the Republican candidate for governor, who is in a tight race with Lt. Gov. Timothy M. Kaine (D).

      Having a sitting president with similar views fly into town 11 days before Election Day would usually count as political gold, but not if the president's popularity has ebbed and scandals are dominating the news cycle.

      Where was the intrepid Kilgore?
      Hiding his KKK badge, and polishing up on his faux  "Tolerance" badge.

      Kilgore instead attended a luncheon in Richmond for the Virginia NAACP. The candidate's campaign aides have said that Bush's speech, which sounded a familiar message that the United States must be vigilant in fighting terrorism, was a policy address, not a political event.
  •  Not surprising look at Gore 2000 (4.00)
    For much of the campaign Clinton kept his distance because Gore wanted to keep some seperation between him and the fallout from the Lewinsky affair.  Yet Clinton maintained high approval ratings compared to Bush currently throughout it.

    If Gore looked at Clinton as somewhat radioactive, imagine how scary Bush must look to the GOP right now.

    •  Oh, the irony! (4.00)
      BushCo is so hated right now in large part due to the lies about WMD in Iraq and the subsequent immoral and unnecessary war. Yet Bush himself is no seen as radioactive -- he has become WMD to Rethugs all over the US!

      Thwarting the forces of conservatism since 1978.

      by wiscmass on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:08:13 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I Think You Meant To Say It...... (4.00)
        And if so it's gotta be coined phrase.....We found the "Weapon of Mass Destruction" !....and now we should start calling it the "Weapon of Self Destruction"....George W Bush...!!!!!!!!!

        GWB = WMD = WSD...It's over folks!!!!!

        I miss the good ole day's of Bill Clinton...

        by JellyPuddin on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:26:16 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Was Wondering About This (4.00)
    When I see ads for our next guv (in NJ) starring Bill Clinton.

    For all those rightwingers who claim Clinton was worse than W., why don't any Republicans want to run ads starring Shrub? Are there any?

    Ted Hitler on bloggers: They have no credibility, all they have is facts.

    by EastFallowfield on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:18:22 PM PDT

    •  Clinton's "evil" is in perspective now (none)
      Does not excuse him by a long shot, but remember, that whole thing started with the Paula Jones suit which was eventually dismissed as "meritless" and the key linkage to impeachment was the fact that the Clintons were under scrutiny for Whitewater--and were cleared completely.

      This does not excuse Clinton lying under oath but that was a personal failure.  By contrast, this Shite House's legal problems are embedded in how it governs (or fails to govern).

      Quis custodiet ipsos custodet? (Who will watch the watchers?)

      by The Crusty Bunker on Sun Oct 30, 2005 at 07:31:27 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Somehow I Don't Think We'll See That...Except (4.00)
    Maybe when Tom Delay puts his adds out in Texas...he'll only have one friend left over..the Monkey Boy will probably be asked to act in a mini movie I mean political ad for Delay the Crook..but I don't see anyone else wasting good ad money on the Monkey Boy

    I miss the good ole day's of Bill Clinton...

    by JellyPuddin on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:29:17 PM PDT

  •  A little birdy (none)
    named Charlie Cook was on MSNBC today with Buchanan et all, and in passing he described the 2005 elections as "going south". Sounds like we might have a good night.

    "We must all hang together or assuredly we will all hang seperately." - Ben Franklin

    by RandyMI on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 06:35:15 PM PDT

  •  kilgore desperate (4.00)
    kilgore is now attacking kaine on illegal aliens which  i don`t think is a major problem in va.kaine has warner talking up how virginia has come so far and kaine was a big part of it.kilgore has no positive commercials, all negative, i`m pretty sure he is in a death spiral, if kilgore wins it will be by fraud!
    •  I'll try and find the article (none)
      but I read that Kilgore was attacking Kaine through an email about abortion, saying Kaine "supports the 1973 SCOTUS ruling that made abortion on demand legal." Yet, Kilgore still hasnt publicy said he would sign a ban on Roe and I think even said he understand it is the law or something. I find it unbelieveable he is attacking Kaine on an issue that he isnt even clear about. Looks to me like he is getting desperate.

      Bush is so exhausted by all these scandals that he is praying for another disaster like a flood or a hurricane so he can kick back and do nothing. -Bill Maher

      by jj32 on Sat Oct 29, 2005 at 10:09:27 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  This isn't new for Arnold. (none)
    He's been asking Bush to keep away for at least two months now. He keeps saying Bush will hurt his poll numers which is interesting since Bush usually scores higher in the polls these days.

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