Daily Kos

Alan Keyes Casting Out his Daughter

Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:18:29 PM PDT

I originally stumbled on this story as an entry in Oliver Willis's great blog at: http://www.oliverwillis.com/node/view/1822

Alan Keyes has a daughter who is a lesbian, and she has finally come all the way out of the closet... much to her father's chagrin.

Valentine's Day Rally in Annapolis
Featuring Maya Marcel-Keyes, daughter of Alan Keyes and a self-described young queer anarchist who grew up in Darnestown, MD. Maya is speaking publicly for the first time about LGBT issues. Don't miss this important rally at 5 p.m. in front of the state house on February 14, also featuring Judy Shepard and other community leaders.

The family response?:

Keyes Fired Her and is Throwing his own Daughter Out

Well, it's happened.  Finally and officially.  

A couple days ago I got my official two-week warning that I have to be out of this apartment; so finally for real I'm getting cut off.  I got no severance or anything like that from my sudden termination of employment (don't I have freedom of speech? the right to protest Bush without losing my job? Hehe... most people would think that working under a parent would be security but for me it's quite the opposite.) and so I definitely don't have anywhere near enough cash to find a new apartment; not even one room rented from someone anywhere.  I've been searching craigslist but even places where I'd have enough to pay the first month's rent on some room I never have enough for the deposit as well, so so far I've had no luck at all finding a new home, since shelter requires money. Sad boo.

After all the arguments and tension over the years, I always hoped it would never actually get to this point, although I suppose given our vastly divergent political beliefs it was inevitable.

They -our friends on the far right- like to 'say' they don't 'hate homosexuals'. The just say that they merely 'hate' the sin or 'the lifestyle' that gay people lead. I say bullshit. They hate gay people. Nobody who can do this, to their own child, can pretend that there is any 'love' in this. You have to wonder, after all the garbage about 'family values', about 'God' and 'Jesus' and 'morals', what crawls as thought through the mind of a father who not only fires his own child, but pushes her out the door without the resources to start over. This man, ladies and gentlemen, wanted to be a U.S. Senator, and now wants to be a state Governor. A leader of men, and a crafter of laws. So I ask you, what kind of world would we all be living in if this man had any kind of power or say-so over any of our lives?

They say that it should be a source of pride, not of shame, for my parents that I'm so passionate about my beliefs, and work for what I believe in; even if they are not the beliefs my parents hold.  They say that the only possible cause for shame anywhere in the whole situation is in the fact that after all this I am being cut off, jobless, soon to be homeless, and that although I have intelligence and motivation I won't be able to go to Brown after all because I have no money.

Aaaaaaaarghhh! This is so ugly... so damned petty and cruel that it makes me spit nails. Your child basically debunks all the lies of your movement's beliefs about people 'choosing' homosexuality like picking out a china pattern... by her very existence as your offspring she'd have been crazy to choose this... so you not only fire her after she put family ahead of principle and worked for a cause she didn't believe in, but you throw her, and the college education that will make her an independent human being, away like she is an inconvenient piece of flotsam????

And on the day that another ban on gay marriage gets whacked down in another court as blatant repression. I know crap like this happens every day, in the homes of unknown folks whose names you never hear about unless the child takes his or her own life and ends up as a blurb in the newspaper, but MAN. His own child? Isn't there any human kindness in Alan Keyes?

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Permalink | 202 comments

  •  I'm disgusted. (3.96 / 29)

    I hope that Ms. Keyes soon finds a nice, warm place to spend the winter.

    And I hope that Mr. Keyes soon finds a nice, warm place to spend eternity.

  •  No Shame Is Right (4.00 / 9)

    Apparently among reds, making your child jobless and homeless is no cause for shame. Undoubtedly Mr. Keyes and his wife trot to church every Sunday to proclaim what good observant Christians they are.

    Pharisees would be a more apt description.

    •  Unfortunately it's not (none / 0)

      She's at the age where, according to Lakoff's strict father model conservatism, she's totally on her own and has to sink or swim based on her own merits.

      (-7.00, -5.18)
      Hopelessly pedantic since 1963.

      by admiralh on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 09:18:58 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  A family that doesn't look out for its own (none / 0)

        Is a really stupid family.  Too many families do not work as a collective unit with a united self interest, and instead as a bunch of individuals.  Unfortunately, this is entirely counter productive.  Everyone suffers because of it, and if you can't count on your own family, who can you count on (almost no one).  

        Don't like XOM and OPEC? What have YOU done to reduce your oil consumption? Hot air does NOT constitute a renewable resource!

        by Asak on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 10:06:17 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Tragic (4.00 / 8)

    Someone very close to me had the same situation with her mother.  I don't understand how someone could be so homophobic as to hate their own child and just stop caring about their welfare.

    When I came out as bi to my parents, they didn't say a word about it.  Well, they probably did to each other, but not to me.  But I have the Best. Parents.  Ever.

    I will never understand how being a bigot can come before being a parent.

  •  Unfortunately This Happens All Over (4.00 / 5)

    Her situation becomes the poster-child for this anti-family drama simply because her father is a public figure.  

    But every cause needs a champion, and if her family tragedy helps draw public attention to this all-too-common scenario, then good.

    Fuzzy only works for pets.

    by NotFuzzy on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:27:17 PM PDT

  •  What could possibly be going through his head??? (4.00 / 10)

    I can't fathom it.
    I can't stomach it.
    I know this scene gets played out each and every day in anonymous homes across the world, but this fool wants to be a leader of men, for God's sake! This is your child... where is your humanity if you can do something like this?!?!

    "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

    by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:28:04 PM PDT

    •  what's going through his head? (none / 1)

      The same S**T that went through Dick Cheney's head when he put his posh VP seat before the welfare and rights of his daughter.

      Republicans always talk like they brought back morality to the White House.  Seems to me like they brought immorality back to it, and left ethics out on the porch.

      You can't have integrity if you sell out your family.

      Hate isn't a value.

      by deep6 on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:20:13 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Alan "Pharisees" Keyes (4.00 / 6)

    Isn't there any human kindness in Alan Keyes?

    Apparently not, but it's hysterically funny that so many neocons and wingnuts have gay relatives.  

    Phyllis Schlafly has a gay son.
    Jesse Helms has a gay granddaughter.
    Newt Gingrich has a gay sister.
    Darth Cheney has a gay daughter.
    Barry Goldwater had a gay grandson--but he didn't count, because he supported gay rights.  

    And now Keyes's kid is a gay anarchist.  

    This?  Is just priceless.

    Wonder if Spongedob Stickypants has any gays in his family tree?

    •  And... (4.00 / 5)

      Good ol' Strom had a black daughter and supported segregation.

      He wanted to deny his own daughter the rights and freedoms he took for granted.

      "Can we all get along?"

      by hotspur on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:13:07 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  And they get away with claiming the 'morality' (4.00 / 4)

        mantle, even after doing things that are anything but moral.

        That's the reason I posted this diary, this kind of thing has to be called 'foul' on when it is a phony 'moral values' man.

        "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

        by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:15:14 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  My bad (none / 1)

        "Good ol' Strom had a black daughter..."

        His daughter is a person of color or mixed-race or whatever she chooses to call herself.

        "Can we all get along?"

        by hotspur on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:18:44 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Yup. (none / 1)

        An inherited evil in the grand tradition of slavery, where "massa" would enslave the very children he sired.  Strom was all about the traditional family, you see.

        Alan Keyes is the worst kind of Tom--and consistent, too.  How many pieces of silver is it worth to cast away your own child?  Pro-life, indeed...his own.

        "Sir, we've already lost the dock." A Zion Lieutenant to Commander Lock, The Matrix Revolutions

        by AuntiePeachy on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 05:33:13 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  She was interviewed on radio two nights ago (none / 1)

        They actually got along decent in later years, and Thurmond always financially supported her, I know, one thinks "hush" money but Thurmond never cut her off, evidently wanted to meet her children, etc.
        •  What About Her Mother. (none / 0)

          The young underage girl who was raped by Strom. What's happened to her? Why is there no concern with her plight -- giving birth as a teenager, and forced to hide her baby? It is, alas, still convenient to ignore her, even by her own daughter.

          "There's no housing bubble..." - Fed Chief Ben Bernanke, 10/27/2005

          by chuco35 on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 08:17:33 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Uh... (none / 0)

            She's probably dead. The daughter's in her 60s, I think.
          •  Not exactly (none / 0)

            Thurmond didn't rape her, even thought the power relationship was not equal.

            He always saw his daughter and asked after her mother, who always had kind things to say about him.

            Her mother died in the late 1940's. Not everything is cut and dried in the way we like to think

            •  Steve, Strom Is Dead Too. (4.00 / 2)

              Yet this story is about how benificent and tolerant Strom was. The reality is that not only was the mother literally an indentured servant to Strom, she was also underage when Strom had sex with her. If it happened today Strom would go to jail.

              Strom abandoned his daughter at birth, the most cowardly thing a man can do. Yet I would suspect that the mother was always there for her daughter, and was instrumental in raising her, and not merely writing checks after she reached adulthood. Do you know anything about the her? I don't. Why does she not get any sympathy to speak of in this story, even if she's been dead since the 1940's? Instead, Strom's supposed tolerant memory is what's feted, rather than the violated servant's sacrifices and triumphs as a mother, and yes, her perseverance in the face of virulent racism.  

              "There's no housing bubble..." - Fed Chief Ben Bernanke, 10/27/2005

              by chuco35 on Sat Feb 05, 2005 at 09:19:34 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

    •  Truffle, I know we live in a Christian country (4.00 / 3)

      where the idea of "turn the other cheek" is equated with proper behavior, and "pharisee" is equated with hypocrisy.

      However, the truth is that what we need is justice, and that Pharisees were the liberal precursors to today's Rabbinic Judaism. For example, the Pharisees said, "A learned bastard takes precedence over an ignorant High Priest." So what we have here is an internalization in our culture of memes that aid repression and autocracy. See the Wiki.

      Corruption is what keeps us safe and warm. Corruption is why we win. -Syriana

      by CarbonFiberBoy on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:28:33 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  i guess (none / 1)

      it's equivlent to Randall Terry (the Operation Rescue wacko) who supposedly grew up with a feminist mother. i always fear having childrne because i suspect anyoen i raised would turn out to be a GOP neocon.
    •  asdf (none / 0)

      Call me evil but ...

      "Wonder if Spongedob Stickypants has any gays in his family tree?"

      Wouldn't it be ironic to find out that the label applied to Dobson himself? But forgive me ... I'm too interested in the study of common sexual pathologies. And he fits a particular "mold".

      John McCain is so (Ned) Divine!!

      by Glinda on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 06:20:14 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  makes you think there is a god (none / 0)

      and she's trying to tell these assholes something.
  •  Hmm... (4.00 / 2)

    Ya know...

    This is why I won't buy into christianity...cuz these 'loving' christians pull shit like this...sorry for all you good christians out there, I'm not knocking everybody...I'm just saying, why god let's these people exist is beyond me.  Maybe because he wants them to be around for the meteor hitting the earth or something..WHO KNOWS!!!

    Dr. Dean...Paging Dr. Dean...he's not on-call you say...then get me DR. MATT!! STAT!!!

    by doctormatt06 on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:29:34 PM PDT

    •  Reverse the order (4.00 / 9)

      I think people who hate so easily cling to religion to justify their intolerance.  The Bible is their shield against accusations of black-heartedness.  You can always tell a black-hearted bastard by the way he starts his sentences with "I'm a good Christian..."

      "Liberals feel unworthy of their possessions. Conservatives feel they deserve everything they've stolen."--Mort Sahl

      by jandey on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:44:09 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Heh... (none / 1)

        For me..I tend to lose trust in people when they pull a, "The bible tells us that ___ is ____"  I find the bible says a lot of things, and people tend to warp it to their own predilictions.

        Dr. Dean...Paging Dr. Dean...he's not on-call you say...then get me DR. MATT!! STAT!!!

        by doctormatt06 on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:24:24 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  judgment (4.00 / 4)

      you can't judge an entire religion based on ALan Keyes for god's sake. it's like using Osama bin Ladin to justify your disdain for Islam. it's like smearing all atheists by equating them with Stalin or Mao. and liberals would never do that right? so why tarr all Christians? there's always been Christian slavemasters and the Christians who were abolitionists. trust me, the people angriest about this are the "good" christians, including my gay CHristian friends, some of whom are closeted, some of whom have also been kicked out of their homes (not surprisingly, these tend to be my black gay friends--the Asian ones stay closested).

      Now my family may want to preserve "marriage" and support the FMA, but they also told me if I were gay, they would still love me and welcome me (even as they would try to figure out "where they went wrong"). I just say this to point out the hateful spite of Keyes is extreme and most Christians recognize it as the sin that it is.

      •  No... (4.00 / 2)

        I think yet again, I was too general..sorry..
        My opinion is, that to join a religion you are a tacit supporter of all of its doctrines.  I'm not in favor of that, Christianity is one religion I don't agree with, I don't knock all christians, my mother and father are christain, my friends are christians.  I don't smear ALL christians, I just choose not be associated with religions that have fringe elements.  Besides, more importantly, I just believe in personal faith over faith in a certain doctrine.  I cannot put my thinking on spirituality and religiosity in a comment, because its a complex thing.  I support the good of humanity in all things.  I support secular humanism in all its forms.  I support compassion and love for one's neighbor's and more importantly for one's enemy.  I hope you don't think I have an anti-christian veiwpoint, I really don't, I just don't support organized religion really, and I'm stubborn...that doesn't help either... =OP

        But thanks for your comment

        Dr. Dean...Paging Dr. Dean...he's not on-call you say...then get me DR. MATT!! STAT!!!

        by doctormatt06 on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 04:07:19 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Does not compute (none / 0)

          I just choose not be associated with religions that have fringe elements.

          Um, wouldn't that be all of them? And isn't a "fringe element" by definition a small minority that misinterprets the tenets of a religion? Does Hutton Gibson negate the honest faith and accomplishments of Dorothy Day?

          And "Christianity" is a pretty broad umbrella, covering everyone from Quakers to Branch Davidians. You might want to be more specific.

          •  Every group has a fringe element... (none / 0)

            hence..I will not be part of any group...
            Although that's slightly false since I believe in a judeo-christian sense of basic morals...
            But my main point is...
            I think I can figure out what is right and wrong on my own, I don't need someone to tell me what is right and wrong...
            And I especially don't need someone to tell me gay marriage is wrong, which almost EVERY religion does.
            I don't need someone to tell me my pro-choice position is wrong, as many religions would...
            And I know you will probably find religions that would fit my world view...
            But that's not the point...my point is, I can find my spiritual sense on my own, I don't need someone telling it to me...

            Dr. Dean...Paging Dr. Dean...he's not on-call you say...then get me DR. MATT!! STAT!!!

            by doctormatt06 on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 08:09:20 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Dorothy Day? (none / 0)

            Hamletta, I never knew!

            BTW, there are plenty of folks would would think Dorothy Day was a fringe element...but if they think that, they're a fringe element.

            Kinda like that terrorist/freedom fighter thing...

            The revolution will not be televised, but we'll analyze it to death at The Next Hurrah.

            by DHinMI on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 08:51:00 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  That's the way most religous people are today. (none / 0)

        And since you said that you would not want to pay taxes if that money went to gay who had AIDS, then I can see why you find a kinship with them.
      •  That's Christian love for ya. (none / 0)

        Ah, so if you were gay, your family would "love" you so much that they'd use the government to deny you equal legal rights, right?  "You don't deserve the same rights we do --- but we really really love you."  
        Yeah, that's "Christian love" all right - a sick, co-dependent relationship.    
    •  Bug Bush... Go Vote O/T (4.00 / 2)

      North Dakota Democratic Senator Kent Conrad needs some help with this poll in the Fargo Forum... which asks if Republican Gov John Hoeven can beat him in 2006...  

      Looks like Bush must have been lining up a challenger for one of our Red State Senators during his visit to Fargo yesterday...  (go vote... middle of page towards the right)

      The Christian Right is Neither...

      by Prairie Logic on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 04:32:22 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Conrad's winning (none / 0)

        He's at 66% right now.  

        This state is a tough nut to crack. Our Congressman and both Senators are Dems, but bush won by 63%.  It just goes to show that Dean's 50 state approach is the right one.  

        McCain housing policy shaped by lobbyist

        by sgilman on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 08:02:08 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Sadly, it's hard to despise that man more (4.00 / 3)

    It's hard to break with your parents, even when you know you're doing the right thing for yourself.

    I got nothing but sympathy and platitudes, it looks like, so I'll sign off here.

    Before you win, you have to fight. Come fight along with us at TexasKaos.

    by boadicea on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:30:14 PM PDT

  •  Even Anita Bryant (none / 1)

    used to say, "Love the sinner, but hate the sin."
    •  I remember (none / 1)

      but just what does that mean? It always struck me as a hollow and empty way to say 'we still love you... even though you are a monster and an abomination' when I was a child... and it still does now more than ever.

      That's hate to me, and I can't stand it.

      "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

      by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:36:11 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  In practice (4.00 / 2)

        Take it out of the realm of homosexuality since homosexuality is not a sin.  But for a sin, the saying makes sense if it were actually practiced.  

        If for instance, love the sinner hate the sin applied to a murderer, then you could hate the crime of murder without hating the criminal. But, then you step into the next circle of hypocrisy with the rationalization that it is "loving" to execute a murderer.

      •  The idea is (none / 1)

        nobody is beyond help. I was raised Catholic, now I'm an atheist (mostly for metaphysical reasons as opposed to philosophical). But the basic premise behind that saying is that nobody, deep down, is a monster even if they've done monstrous things. In other words, you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. If you want to change someone's behavior, the last thing you should do is treat them like a pariah (cf. why our prison system is such a mess); you need to show them love and understanding.

        If they continue to fuck up you have to continue your efforts to help them. This is a very difficult thing to do. For example, I can't forgive the leadership of the current govt for all the things they've perpetrated over the last four years, try as I might.

        Anyway, back to the topic....

      •  it's not like that... (none / 1)

        It's "We don't like the choices you make but it doens't negate the fact that we love you as a person." (and let's face it folks if these people really believed it was genetic/biological they wouldn't be condeming it).

        And that's part of the problem. homosexuality is a sin to them and since most other sins (killing, adultery, stealling, etc.) are all choices we make, they think homosexuality must also be a choice.  Though how anyone would chose that and go through the pain and public degredation that comes from it is beyond me.

        But if homosexuality were to be found to be genetic or biological, then it would be a small hop to conclude that they were MADE that way by their creator.   how can god make people to sin?

        It would make their heads explode.

        •  Maybe not... (4.00 / 2)

          let's face it folks if these people really believed it was genetic/biological they wouldn't be condeming it

          ...but you can be damn sure they'd be sinking a whole lot of money into developing a drug that would 'cure' it.

          The underest dog is just as good as I am, and I'm just as good as the toppest dog. - Jimmie Rodgers

          by GreenCA on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 04:10:43 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  A Muslim lesbian author said as much (none / 0)

          I'm talking about Irshad Manji, author of The Trouble with Islam.  She was asked how a good Muslim could be gay and she pointed out that God was supposed to have made everything perfect, so how could anything be wrong with homosexuals?  

          The book's pretty interesting reading, by the way.  It's not so much a critique of Islam as it is a response to Muslim extremism.

  •  Pattern? (4.00 / 2)

    Sometimes it seems that the most fundamentalist, antigay activists are ones who have gay family members.

    "It's OUR money".no it ain't. It's the Peoples Republic of China's money. You just borrowed it-and anybody want to bet they probably will want it back? -daulton

    by Eric Novinson on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:34:51 PM PDT

  •  C'mon. guys, (4.00 / 4)

    Keyes needs the money for his IL Gubernatorial race - how can he be expected to care about his daughter?

    </retch>

    When "stupidity" suffices, why search for any other reason?

    by wozzle on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:36:51 PM PDT

    •  Sooner or later (4.00 / 2)

      Someone will stop laughing long enough to inform Mr. Keyes that he is ineligible for the Governorship under IL law.
    •  Illinois? (4.00 / 2)

      I thought he was going to go after the governor's seat in Maryland. He's such a nut case, he might go after both at once.

      But the poor daughter. She mentions Brown University. If she's already admitted, can she get some kind of financial aid?

      The degree to which you resist injustice is the degree to which you are free. -- Utah Phillips

      by Mnemosyne on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:28:17 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  asdf (4.00 / 2)

        If she is already accepted, she'll manage somehow.  Student loans, student aid, a year off to go work, part time attendance....

        People do it all the time.  Like many others, I paid my own way through college and while it makes it more difficult, if she is smart enough to get into Brown and she wants it enough, she'll figure out a way.

        In the meantime, whining about the cost of housing isn't going to get her anywhere.

        •  Relatives? (none / 0)

          Does this girl have extended family who can support her?  Surely there are SOME sane people in the Keyes clan.
        •  Ivies hand out need based aid (none / 0)

          using a formula that (almost) always includes both parents income and assets.  Given Daddy's cash flow from his little mail order hate shop, his daughter won't be eligible for much other than cash advances on whatever credit cards she can drum up.
          This actually got me thinking, GOoPers are such cheap hypocritical bastards, maybe he's just doing this to avoid paying for her education and everything gets hunky dory after Brown approves a unique circcumstances adjustment to her aid package.

          Might and Right are always fighting In our youth it seems exciting. Right is always nearly winning. Might can hardly keep from grinning. -Clarence D

          by Myrkury on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 06:21:08 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  This is sadly very common (4.00 / 2)

    Abuse and being thrown out by ones own parents is really just business as usual for gay kids, and if you look at homeless street kids you'll see gays well overrepresented - check any shelter.

    Believe it or not, it could actually be worse. Some of these whackos send their kids of to christian
    "re-education" camps and even drive them to suicide - so at least she's getting out alive and healthy.

    Everyone detected with AIDS should be tattooed in the upper forearm, to protect common-needle users, and on the buttocks... -- William F. Buckley, Jr

    by tiponeill on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:44:26 PM PDT

  •  I wonder if she feels foolish (4.00 / 3)

    for working against her own best interests... especially now that her father has chosen to pander to his audience of wingnuts rather than to love his child.

    I hope she holds her head high and goes out and becomes a thousand times the person that her father is. (Although, admittedly, that probably wouldn't be that hard right about now.)

    "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

    by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:49:44 PM PDT

  •  I will now make it my mission (none / 1)

     to make sure that Alan Keyes is never elected to ANYTHING in Illinois.
    •  Exactly (none / 0)

      There is no way he deserves to get even 12% of the vote anymore. I want Keyes to be the first candidate ever to get shut out .000 in an election because his followers fear having to vote with a bag over their heads.

      "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

      by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 02:58:32 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  why stop there (none / 1)

      TO make sure alan keys is not elected to anything ANYWHERE.  If he wants to preach let him start a church, but the day he lectures me about morality from an elected public office is the day I can truely say with conviction that democracy has failed in this country.
      •  Not to worry (none / 0)

        He really does freak out Republicans....remember they were all refusing to endorse him against Obama. Heard of a self-fulfilling prophesy? Alan Keyes is a self-defeating politician.

        Not that he's not a son-of-a-bitch or anything, he surely is. But he's not going to win deputy dogcatcher in Illinois anytime soon.

        (Hard to take people as foolish as AK seriously when you're listening to Mr. Marley as I am right now....Everything's gonna be alright....everything's gonna be alright....)

    •  I think (none / 0)

      you could accomplish that mission quite easily if you never got off your ass or spoke another word the rest of your life.
  •  The Statue of Liberty Faces Left n/t (4.00 / 3)

    We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

    by Gooserock on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:04:17 PM PDT

  •  kinda reminds me of the preacher (4.00 / 2)

    in "inherit the wind."

    Anyone who advocates, supports, defends, rationalizes, or excuses torture has pus for brains and a case of scurvy for a conscience. - James Wolcott

    by rasbobbo on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:07:41 PM PDT

  •  IL stays blue (4.00 / 2)

    forget the issue for a moment.

    can any candidate survive an election with any member of  his immiediate family virulently opposing him for any reason?

    think about it.

    could anyone survive their son or daughter appearing in a TV commercial for their opponent?

    not likely- how could you trust the person if you didn't know them, knowing their own daughter didn't trust them.

    not that keyes stood a chance anyway.

  •  A Lot of Gay Kids (4.00 / 4)


    . . . get beaten and physically ejected from the family home when their families discover they are gay.

    I wouldn't be thrilled to learn that either of my kids was gay.  But it's only 'cause it lessens the odds of grandchildren somewhat, and I'd know that they'd have to take a lot of crap for it.

    It defies comprehension to me how any parent could reject his or her child over this.  First, because God or nature or whatever seems to have made a few of us queer, it's just how some people are.  And second, because even if you think it's a choice, and for some reason you disapprove of it, wouldn't it just be a matter of saying "I disagree, but you're my kid and I love you?"  Aren't we supposed to love our kids, even if they make "choices" of which we disapprove?

    Damn.  I hope neither of my girls marries a Republican.

    "A Prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people."

    by proudtinfoilhat on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:10:28 PM PDT

    •  It's easier for gay women to conceive (4.00 / 2)

      and bear children, than it is for gay men.

      Because you have daughters, even if one of them were to realize she was gay, you still might be quite likely to have a grandchild or two.  

      And also, keep in mind, not all straight people want to have children.  One of your daughters might grow up and decide she just doesn't want to have kids, for whatever reason.  You never know what your children will turn out to be.

      My parents sure didn't anticipate my turning out to be a lesbian.  And they assumed they wouldn't be able to have a grandchild from me.  But they are flying out to be at their grandson's fifth birthday in two weeks.  You never know what the world will bring you.

  •  The reason (none / 1)

    Parents react so over-the-top and do hateful things is that they see themselves in their children. IN Alan Keyes' case, he's so afraid and loathsome of his own sexuality, that he committs treacherous cruel and publically reprehensible behavior against his own daughter. We should all remind ourselves that this is happens all the time everywhere, and it's ALWAYS the result of self-loathing on the part of the hater.

    McCain is a Chode.

    by dnamj on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:12:03 PM PDT

  •  I have seen a few posters above (none / 0)

    who had good experiences 'coming out' to their families....

    But are there any Kossacks going over this story who know exactly what this girl is going through? I can't imagine my parents doing this to me if I were gay and opened up to them. But one thing I keep wondering about is when this splits parents and households. My mom, for instance, would have absolutely gone to war with my father over something like this if my brother and I had been gay, come out, and he'd responded like Keyes.

    I don't really want to change the subject, just expand on it to include coming out experiences because I know, sickeningly, that Mr. Keyes may be famous, but he isn't all that rare in his views.

    "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

    by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:12:50 PM PDT

    •  Yes (4.00 / 3)

      My mom read my journals when I was 16, found out I was messing around with girls and freaked out. I came home from a friend's house to find a locksmith at the front door changing the locks. I immediately discovered that I didn't legally own even my own underwear. Then she outed me to my whole family and everyone we knew, and no one really responded well, so I was pretty screwed. Further, she outed the girl I was messing around with to her family, so my girlfriend wound up thrown out, too.

      My parents had been divorced since I was 4, and my dad lived on the other side of the country. His initial response was bizarre: "Well, you and your mother have never really gotten along." Um, Dad, she made me homeless because I'm gay. Could you send money, please? No, apparently, he couldn't.

      The first couple of years after that were just a living hell. I had to drop out of high school and give up the college scholarship I'd have certainly otherwise enjoyed. I lost all my material things and most of my friends and family. For a while, I went through more shit than I care to recount in a forum so public as this, but suffice to say, I have a good work ethic, I'm smart, and I got myself a lot of therapy so I eventually got my life more or less together. The whole thing did basically destroy my relationship with my mother, although it's hard to separate out the bigotry from the other issues, like her alcoholism and whatever psychological problems she had (she's since passed away). Fwiw, she was a hippie when I was born in 1970, but did identify as a Republican by the mid-80s, when all this happened.

      My dad is now polite about it even if he doesn't really approve or accept it. (I suspect this would be much worse if I were his son rather than a daughter.) Interestingly, my Catholic grandmother had some pretty intense issues with the whole thing but has ultimately done the best job in the family of coming around. A couple years ago she made me an afghan for Christmas and then asked me for my "friend's favorite color" so she could make one for my partner, too. Yay, Gram!

      Whew, sorry for such a long comment, but this was a pretty big trauma, and even though I've done a lot of healing, I think it will always echo in my life.

      •  Is that even legal? (none / 1)

        At 16 you're not legally allowed to make choices for yourself (unless you're emancipated by a court of law), it should be illegal for a parent or guardian to abandon their children before the age of 18 too.  

        Wouldn't it?

        •  No, not legal (4.00 / 5)

          But the law doesn't count much in situations like that because of institutionalized homophobia--or at least, it didn't at the time where I was. Here's how absolutely fucked up the situation was (and how fucked up my mother was): After she threw me out, she reported me a runaway and I got picked up by the cops the day before my 17th birthday and threatened with going to either juvenile detention or a mental health facility. The only thing that saved my ass that day was a nice lady cop who was familiar with how crazy my mother was because...let's just say this wasn't the first time the cops were involved in domestic problems at my mom's house.

          So my choices were basically thus: report my mom to the appropriate state agency and then wind up in some kind of rehabilitative facility because my mom could legally have me institutionalized (I had essentially no rights), or just keep my head down and try to make it on my own. Obviously, I chose option (b). I still think it was the better choice between the two, but man, talk about your shitty, rock-and-hard-place sorts of choices.

          •  I had an experience... (none / 1)

            I went to highschool with a girl who was kicked out of her house for getting pregant.  So she worked full time, went to highschool, and had to take care of a baby. she had her own apartment but luckily had some help from friends and others but it's still messed up.

            If you kick your child out of the house (as opposed to going the legal process of abolishing your parental rights/privlages), you should have to pay child support TO THE STATE.

            I still can't believe how people can do that!  Rodents will eat their young if they detect any defect in them.  It sickens me to think that there are human parents out there with little more compassion than that.

            •  Yeah, and figure this out (none / 0)

              I still love my mom just as much today as I did when I was 2 and she seemed like a benevolent superhero. I also pity her because of the fear and hatred that consumed so much of her life, but as it turned out, my love for her is unconditional. Huh, who knew.

              Anyway, I hope everything worked out okay for your high school friend and her kid.

              As far as policy goes, I think parents are legally obligated to financially support their offspring, at least until age 18 or a court says otherwise, but ime the thing about situations like this is that it's hard to get the law enforced, especially when you've got other problems, and it's too damn easy for these sorts of parents to get social support for their control issues/bigotry. There's too many groups out there that get behind child abandonment in situations where the child is considered "unacceptably errant" in moral terms and the casualties are outrageous. I guess that's why they call it a culture war.

              •  What a horrible story! (none / 0)

                Where did you stay after your mom kicked you out?  Did you have any friends or relatives to help you?
                •  Here and there (none / 1)

                  For the most part, my family was absent. Depending on who it was, they considered me sinful or too problematic or whatever the rationale was. They weren't really horrible people, just horribly unhealthy in a variety of ways, and as we say in the South, "ignernt". At one point a second cousin and one of my mom's ex-husbands did try to help me out but my mom made their lives so miserable for it that I couldn't handle the guilt and the ongoing drama so I just dropped out of sight.

                  I was homeless for a few weeks, which usually amounted to sleeping in a nearby park, although occasionally I was able to score a couch or floor for the night. Eventually, my then-girlfriend found an older gay cousin who had split off from her family when he was young due to bigotry, and he let us both crash on his floor for a month or so until we got jobs and could afford a hole-in-the-wall apartment of our own. I'll always be grateful to him for that.

                  Honestly, I think the most tragic aspect of the whole thing is that my story isn't uncommon among gay youth. Which, I suspect, is at least partially why so many of us (queers) are so passionate about our politics. We know the personal is political, and we know lives and futures depend on it.

      •  Don't be sorry (none / 0)

        Don't be sorry at all.

        Its stories like yours that make me realize how brave it is to survive so much hostility in this world where we brag about how much other people hate us 'for our freedom'. It breaks my heart how many people who were 'hippes' and flower children in the 60's became Reaganites in the 80's and just went 'June Cleaver' on their lives and innocent bystanders in their lives.

        Its absurd that so much hate and prejudice gets whitewashed and excused by people who should no better just because we are talking about somebodies sexual identitiy and not their race or gender. I am glad you are doing much better today.

        "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

        by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 08:18:20 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  In some ways, to be expected (none / 0)


        The Catholic Church officially teaches that many acts of discrimination against homosexuals are wrong.  If Alan Keyes kicked her out of his home because she is gay, then he has sinned according to Church teaching.  Note that almost all of the permissible or required discrimination against gays and lesbians is reserved to the clergy.  This is more moderate than fundangelical teaching that all acts of discrimination against homosexuals are permissible or encouraged.  

        Then there is the belief among many devout Catholics that if you do a kind thing for somebody else, you are doing it for Jesus.  

    •  I didn't get thrown out or beaten (4.00 / 3)

      But my father tried very hard to get me to keep this a secret from the rest of the family. He was outraged when he found out he was the last to find out. But it helped; it meant he couldn't force me back into the closet, and eventually he was forced to relent.

      If I came out to both parents at once, things could've turned quite ugly.

      The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye; the more light you pour upon it, the more it will contract. -- Oliver Wendell Holmes

      by lilithvf1998 on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:55:37 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Homophobia destroys families (4.00 / 4)

      I was relatively lucky, I've only lost one relative so far, but I know a several people who had their families torn apart by their coming out.  I definitely feel for Maya, and thinking about this gave me my subject line which I humbley submit as a possibly useful slogan.

      "I'm going to dance the dream, and make the dream come true." -Kate Bush (-8.75, -9.18)

      by ellisande on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 04:11:01 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Absolutely (none / 0)

        And I will be damned if I am going to let people who think that its 'okay' because 'we are just condemning a lifestyle choice' win at the expense of other people's dignity.

        "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

        by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 08:19:33 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  You've nailed it (none / 0)

          This is about our right to be acknowledged as human beings and therefore no less deserving of dignity, love, and freedom than any other human.  

          "I'm going to dance the dream, and make the dream come true." -Kate Bush (-8.75, -9.18)

          by ellisande on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 09:58:33 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  Yes, when I came out (none / 0)

      to my parents my mother went absolutely psycho and my father asked me to leave for my own safety (he was more focused on her bieng upset than any trauma to me).  My father's more moderate reaction was love surviving profound disappointment (ya know like if I was going to prison for burglary).  Fortunately I was in my 20's and in a position to at least survive on my own, rather than living with them.  Things got somewhat better over time of course, but I still bear a great deal of anger towards them for not giving a shit about anything but their own situation, not my emotional state at the time (I would have likely suicided if not for very supportive friends).  My mother came to eventually speak to me again, but only after the intervention of a friend who is also a minister on my behalf (she could relate to his thought about me on religious terms) I still await an apology, that I most likely will never get.
  •  If people like Keyes and others (4.00 / 2)

    like him can't let their love (I'm assuming he loves his daughter, although it's hard to believe it) overcome their hate, then what hope is left for Keyes, and others like him?

    There's no point for democracy when ignorance is celebrated...insensitivity is standard and faith is being fancied over reason.-NoFx

    by SairaLV on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:15:26 PM PDT

    •  Do they feel genuine love? (none / 0)

      It seems that if you really love a person, you accept them as they are.  Even if they make a mistake or if you don't approve of their lifestyle, you still love them and you never turn your back on them.

      This man seems incapable of love.

      •  I don't see how they can (none / 0)

        although I am sure that they will claim that they do... I agree that this man seems incapable of real love... what a hollow life he must lead if he can dispose of a child, his own child, for politics.

        "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

        by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 08:20:39 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Ugly website (none / 1)

    I don't mean to detract from the situation because I do feel her pain, but that is one of the most illegible and poorly designed sites I've ever seen. I couldn't even read most of what she said.
    •  That is why I made the choice (none / 0)

      to post a couple of snippets. I found it hard to read as well.

      The pinkish/purplish type on the painted wallpaper background made it tough to read when I followed the link from Oliver's site.

      "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

      by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:19:10 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  she's probably feeling very traumatized... (4.00 / 3)

        Despite her brave front.  As hard as it is for us to even imagine a father abandoning his daughter (and where is her mother btw??) with nothing, it is probably even harder for a her to believe the father that raised her and loved her all these years would do just that.

        My heart goes out to her.  I'm going to check her site and see if I can offer her some encouragement.  No one deserves what she got.

    •  Then (none / 0)


       you'll like this one better, but she has only posted a few times

      http://absolutverve.blogspot.com

       She wrote about criticsms of her site design back in October when she first
      got lots of attention:

      "Before I continue with post, I would like to say one thing:

      If you have any problems with the decor of my little cyber-home - if you think it's hard to read or juvenile or silly or just can't stand butterflies -

      I honestly couldn't care less. I love my butterflies, and anyone who knows me knows how special las mariposas are to me. While I don't mind the rest of you onlookers, this site was, after all, designed for those who know and/or (hopefully and!) love me. So I feel no need to alter anything to suit the rest of you.

      Just had to get that out of the way; and if you can deal with the perhaps visually painful background, feel free to stay for dinner; there's plenty for everyone."

      http://www.xanga.com/item.aspx?user=Xmisled0youthX&tab=weblogs&uid=144543239

  •  SICK SICK SICK (4.00 / 4)

    I've said it before about Alan Keyes and I'm saying it again.

    This is a guarantee to warm place in Hell as far as I am concerned.  From my Christian perspective.

    I pray his daughter ultimately comes to peace.  To be cast out by ones own parent, for any reason, must be devastating.

  •  How sad. (4.00 / 3)

    for the most part, parents of felons show more love for their offspring than this. sick.

    Idiots of the world, ignite!

    by susanp on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:21:39 PM PDT

  •  fer crying out loud (4.00 / 2)

    I recommended this diary, and mistakenly hit the unrecommend button. This site doesn't let you correct your mistakes! This is a great post and a great find.
  •  What this is... (none / 1)

    GOP / Religious-RightTM "values" writ large.
  •  As a parent... (4.00 / 4)

    ...I can't imagine hating my child for who she is.  And that Keyes can do this shows once and for all (as if it wasn't obvious before) that all his "religion" means is hate.  It's that sad and that simple.  

    Arrogant lips are unsuited to a fool-- how much worse lying lips to a ruler - Proverbs 17:7

    by BarbinMD on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 03:33:07 PM PDT

  •  It's a control tactic (4.00 / 6)

    It's a conservative Christian form of trying to regain total control when your child does things you don't want them to do. They like to call it "tough love." The idea is that if you make it hard enough on your child to do what they're doing, they'll come crying back to you, penitent and pleading for your help--transformed into what they want you to be. Wouldn't be surprised if it's in Dobson's child-rearing books.

    My parents tried it on me. Didn't work, but in some other cases I know, it worked temporarily. The child will sometimes renounce what the parents want him or her to, in order to get back in the parents' good graces so that they can survive in the world, but it's not really a heartfelt change and thus doesn't last.

    I hope someone who reads her story offers to let her be a roommate. That's how I finally managed to break free of my parents' control tactics.

    •  sad similar story (4.00 / 4)

      Didn't mean to imply that I'm gay--not that there's anything wrong with that. My parents used the tactic for other issues, as did many other fundie Christian parents I knew. It's pretty widespread among their circles.

      Saddest case in which I saw this type of tactic used was when a 15-year-old girl in my former church got pregnant. With all the focus on abstinence, and total lack of teaching about birth control, several teens at my church got pregnant or impregnated their girlfriends. Most of the parents were distressed but supportive and helped raise the baby.

      One mother, however, used the supposed "tough love" technique, throwing the girl out in the street and refusing to help her out whatsoever until she "changed her ways" (though I don't know in this case how she could have changed the situation, short of the taboo abortion).

      Didn't see the girl for about a year, when she came back to church for a visit with her baby. The girl was emaciated, looking like an anorexia victim, whereas before she'd been somewhat on the chubby side. A friend of mine whose kids were friends with the girl said that she'd been forced to spend the meager amount she could get from public assistance on rent and bills, and she used what little was leftover to make sure her baby had enough to eat before feeding herself. Don't know how a parent could consider this Christian behavior. Where's the love? And why punish an innocent baby along with her daughter?

      •  Outcasts (4.00 / 2)

        I've known girls this happened to as well, and this was long before I ever heard of fundamentalism. It was just the way things were in a small town in the 60s.  It was scary.  The lucky girls were the Catholics; they got married and their families continued to love and support them.  The Protestants among us were cast out or forced to have abortions or just 'went away' for a time.  

        War is not an adventure. It is a disease. It is like typhus. - Antoine De Saint-Exupery

        by Margot on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 04:35:16 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Not all Catholics, by any standard (none / 0)

          There were the girls you didn't know about who left town to care for an ailing aunt or to summer in Europe. Those girls, at the requirement of their parents, went maternity homes, a misnomer since the girls didn't leave as mothers. The requirement was that they would have to relinquish their children or their families, an impossible choice for a 15 year old.

          The other way to deal with Catholic girls who were impregnated by unsuitable boys was abortion, those girls had appendicitis.  

          Catholics dealt with this as all the other fundies still do, don't doubt it.

          "Rupert Murdoch Loves Hillary Clinton"--CBS News headline.

          by Thistime on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 05:25:07 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  OK (none / 0)

            I'm sure you're right.  In my little town, there were mainly Hispanic Catholics, and the girls I knew among them didn't 'disappear' like some of the other girls did.  But that was just my observation, very limited.

            War is not an adventure. It is a disease. It is like typhus. - Antoine De Saint-Exupery

            by Margot on Sat Feb 05, 2005 at 05:48:54 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  God, that is awful (none / 0)

        I remember the 'tough love' boom in the late 70's and 80's with the half-assed ABC afterschool specials and 'experts' on Donohue pushing the 'plan'.

        It seemed like a huge embracing of social darwinism... as if to say, well if my kid survives that it was Gods will and they got their heads back on straight. A complete abdication of their responsibilites. Sounds perfectly GOP to me.

        "Arguments are extremely vulgar, for everyone in good society holds exactly the same opinion." - Oscar Wilde

        by LeftHandedMan on Fri Feb 04, 2005 at 08:24:00 PM PDT

        [