Daily Kos

Hastert: why rebuild New Orleans? It's just gonna get flooded again.

by Plutonium Page

Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:09:01 PM PDT

In the GOP ownership society, if everything you own has been destroyed, well, then, House Speaker Hastert says you're screwed:

House Speaker Dennis Hastert dropped a bombshell on flood-ravaged New Orleans on Thursday by suggesting that it isn't sensible to rebuild the city.

"It doesn't make sense to me," Hastert told the Daily Herald in suburban Chicago in editions published today. "And it's a question that certainly we should ask."

Hastert's comments came as Congress cut short its summer recess and raced back to Washington to take up an emergency aid package expected to be $10 billion or more. Details of the legislation are still emerging, but it is expected to target critical items such as buses to evacuate the city, reinforcing existing flood protection and providing food and shelter for a growing population of refugees.

Why, thank you, Dennis!  Such compassion!

And here's what Breaux had to say:

"That's like saying we should shut down Los Angeles because it's built in an earthquake zone," former Sen. John Breaux, D-La., said. "Or like saying that after the Great Chicago fire of 1871, the U.S. government should have just abandoned the city."

Hastert said that he supports an emergency bailout, but raised questions about a long-term rebuilding effort. As the most powerful voice in the Republican-controlled House, Hastert is in a position to block any legislation that he opposes.

What's that thing they're always preaching?  Oh yeah.  "Respect life".

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Permalink | 188 comments

  •  Except if you are a corporation you (4.00 / 4)

    get bailed out.

    by lecsmith on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:10:02 PM PDT

  •  Why should anyone (none / 1)

    ever vote for a republican? They'll just fuck up again.

    Edwards Democrat voting for Obama would like to remind you, "Concentration Moon, over the camp in the valley" Frank Zappa knew.

    by high uintas on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:10:40 PM PDT

    •  My Letter to Hastert (none / 0)

      I just wrote Hastert a nice e-mail:

      R.e your comments about the disaster in New Orleans:

      You are an idiot.

      I now don't tell anyone I was born and raised in Illinois anymore, because the first response I get is: "You mean the same state where that asshole Dennis Hastert is from?"

      I reply: "Yeah."

      Go to hell, jerk!

      by Orwell2004 on Fri Sep 02, 2005 at 07:36:48 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  how dare they say Congress is "racing" (4.00 / 2)

    Congress has been sitting on its ASS on VACATION for the 5 days since this Hurricane.  They finally decide to get off their butts, and get credit for "cutting short" vacations, and "racing" back to the capitol?!?  

    More like, their UNJUSTIFIABLY DELAYED REACTION.

    No matter how cynical you get ... you can never keep up.

    by LegalSpice on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:11:54 PM PDT

    •  I don't think (none / 0)

      the piss poor response of our leaders is lost on anyone.  I stopped at my boyfriend's work today, full of Bush apologists who have slowly begun to turn, and they were STARK RAVING MAD.

      by One bite at a time on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:18:58 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  EXACTLY! (4.00 / 2)

      The Congressional leadership had no problem in rushing back to Washington, on a Sunday night, cutting short their vacation, when the life of one vegatative woman was at stake, but the same politicians dare to drag their feet on returning when tens, perhaps hundreds, of thousands of people's very lives are threatened.

      Formerly, a voice of objective reason in the partisan din of the U.S. National Security community.

      by mustang dvs on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:19:21 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  To be fair... (none / 0)

      There's nothing that Congress needs to do yet in regards to this disaster.  There are things that need to be done but they are all under the auspices of the executive branch as they should be.  

      Congress writes laws and passes budgets.  Is their a request for money they need to authorize?  No.  Is there a law they need to write or rewrite to facillitate the recover of New Orleans?  No.  In the long term it's likely they'll need to pass some spending measures to fund the recovery, but that can happen in weeks and months from now.

      Having said that, Hastert is a tool.  By this logic, we should never build tall buildings again and certainly not reconstruct anything where the WTC used to be.  We should go ahead and bulldoze all of California because lord knows that's all at risk.  

      In the end, New Orleans would not be anymore at risk than any other coastal city if the proper resources were put into the construction and ongoing maintenance of the levee system.  Consider this akin to building codes in San Francisco or the prevlance of basements in Tornado alley.

      Finally, to put it all in perspective, we've MISPLACED more money in Iraq than it would have cost to fix this problem.  Now we'll have to pay $30 billion or more to undo the damage, and I'm sorry, the "you shouldn't live there" excuse is just not going to cut it.  

      ---
      Photography, Politics, and Chicago

      by sterno on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:23:20 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  the Speaker of the House (4.00 / 2)

    is a Benedict Arnold.

    People are dying, here.  He should shut the fuck up and do his job.

    Get involved...VOLUNTEER...yes.we.can.

    by kid oakland on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:12:25 PM PDT

    •  Exactly. (none / 1)

      Whether or not one thinks N.O. should be rebuilt is not the issue right now. Besides, had the proper infrastructure and environmental systems been in place...we might be having a very different conversation right now.

      "We are Americans and we choose to be inspired." - John Edwards

      by michele2 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:19:49 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  You got it. (none / 0)

        I personally agree (with Hastert the Unspeakable -- who'da ever thunk it?) that NO should not be rebuilt, but:
        A) I am a private citizen, not the freakin' speaker of the freakin' House, and
        B) regardless, NOW IS SO TOTALLY NOT THE TIME TO BE  BRINGING UP THE POINT I SIMPLY MUST SCREAM IN CAPS!!!

        No snowflake in an avalanche ever feels responsible. -- Voltaire

        by Hastur on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:51:58 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Whatever. (none / 0)

          Breaux is a moron.

          New Orleans is in a much more precarious situation than Los Angeles (but I agree fuck Malibu). The worst that happens every 100 years here is basically jack shit and won't destroy the city. And as for the Chicago fire -- all you have to do is rebuild it differently.

          As far as New Orleans goes, it's going to face this every year as global warming increases the intensity of hurricanes, and subsidence, and also, the eventual loss of outflow of the Mississippi to the Atchafalaya basin.

          It's not a sensitive thing to say, but we don't want our leaders to be sensitive, we want them to be smart and rational. It's a bunch of red-neck anti A-Rab anger that got us into Iraq; not rational thought.

          Sorry, I hate Hastert, but he's right here.

          P.S. He didn't say stop the rescue, as the diarist is implying, he said don't rebuild. How's that Darwinian?

          by Attorney at Arms on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 04:17:11 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  disagree (none / 1)

            And you know, it's funny how folks are so sure they are the "rational" ones.  The "tough guys".

            We're rebuilding a huge symbolic skyscraper at ground zero...when the vacancy rate on Wall Street is up, and the future tenants of this colossus are unknown. (Do you want to work every day, eighty stories up, at ground zero?  Would you want your loved ones to?)

            And yet, you're talking about just abandoning the fifth largest port in the world?  You are endorsing a "cut and run" on the site of centuries of our cultural heritage?

            Let's talk about the "how" of rebuilding New Orleans.and the "where" and the "strategy" later...when the loss of life and rescue operations are long over with...but I'd just ask you to imagine if the Speaker of the House had said, in the immediate aftermath of 9/11:

            "Forget Wall Street, it's gonna be vulnerable to terrorists for a century....let's abandon it now."

            That's not leadership.

            He's a Benedict Arnold.  I stand my ground.

            Get involved...VOLUNTEER...yes.we.can.

            by kid oakland on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 05:17:53 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Rebuild but on higher ground (none / 0)

            Somewhere along the mouth of the Mississippi will continue to comprise a huge port just because it's a natural place to transfer bulk cargo from the Mississippi basin from barge to seagoing ships.  But that doesn't need to be done in port facilities built on land that's sunk below sea level.  I think seagoing ships can go all the way upriver to Baton Rouge.  Maybe most of the rebuilding should be there, or someplace else that's less vulnerable to subsidence, hurricanes, and flooding.

            Someone compared New Orleans today to Galveston after the 1900 hurricane.  Most of the port business went inland to Houston after 1900.  What's left is mostly a resort with historical interest.  Galveston even claims to be sort of a sister city to New Orleans.  Maybe both sisters should be fascinating shadows of their former selves.

            We're all pretty strange one way or another; some of us just hide it better. "Normal" is a dryer setting.

            by david78209 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 06:12:02 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

  •  I've heard (none / 0)

    New Orleans called "The Pompeii of America."  I'm sorry, unlike solid ash, the waters will receed.

    Disgusting.

    The budget is a moral document.

    by Sweet Georgia Peach on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:12:26 PM PDT

  •  "Respect life"? (none / 1)

    I thought it was "fuck the poor".

    by ihateemo on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:12:40 PM PDT

  •  here's a better link: the Daily Herald article (none / 0)

    http://www.dailyherald.com/search/searchstory.asp?id=89228

    by espoir on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:14:29 PM PDT

  •  Hastert is a fat jerk (4.00 / 2)

    ...he wouldn't be saying this for some craphole  Illinois town that's been hit by a tornado 12 times.  The hypocrisy is just breathtaking - Hastert just wants to disperse concentrations of Democratic voters living in an area that requires intelligent collective action and investment to sustain - unbelievable

    by PIrish on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:15:32 PM PDT

    •  Hastert evidently doesn't know (none / 1)

      How commerce works.  Grain from the midwest goes down the Mississippi on barges for export, and the Port of South Louisiana is the largest port in the country.  Ditto manufactured goods, and parts of all kinds come upriver.  The port and oil terminals and refineries are absolutely critical.  It takes a whole infrastructure to support the workers at a port that size.  Besides, shores are attractive.  People are going to live down there, period.  Maybe they need to rethink how to engineer the Misswissippi and build proper levees, but that is going to be a city again.  It is too important.  Hastert is an ignorant fool with no concept of how an interdependent economy works..

      John McCain--he's not who you think he is.

      by Mimikatz on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:16:35 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Maybe we should... (none / 0)

    ...ask the Dutch how they keep the ocean out.  Granted, they don't have giant, global warming fueled hurricanes, but they've been below sea level since the late middle ages, and that has to count for something.

    Contrary to popular belief, the Customer is occasionally wrong, and never Right.

    by Mr Customer on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:15:36 PM PDT

  •  Wait Just One Second (4.00 / 12)

    Hastert's agenda aside, the meta-question is worth asking.
    It's a city below sea level, on the edge of the sea, when we know sea levels are going to be rising, and weather is going to become more unpredictable.

    It's a great culture I'm sure, but we're talking about poor people here (well, I am focused on the poor in this case as far as the long term goes, although everyone needs out and to be cared for in the short term).
    The number one thing poor people need is good lives. Being fixtures in a cultural tableaux is less important.
    I know that's not what you are saying precisely but we need to be on the right side of this, for the people.

    by NewDirection on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:16:01 PM PDT

    •  Hastert's Question (3.50 / 2)

      .... is legitimate.  We certainly shouldn't expand developed areas susceptible to natural disasters, but New Orleans is simply a 200+ year old national treasure with over 1 million (regionally) persons living there.  It would really be like sacrificing Venice or Amsterdam to the sea.  

      by PIrish on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:18:51 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  The Best Thing To Do... (3.33 / 3)

        ...Would be to pull up stakes and help the bayou return to reclaim much of the city.

        The diehards and the wealthy alike would probably make something much more like our idealized New Orleans out of what remains. And the wetlands would serve as a buffer to the rest of the lower mississippi from hurricane backwash flooding.

        Who needs frikking Wal-Marts and sports stadiums to have New Orleans? Yes, the poor and middle class should be compensated. And be allowed to return if they want to.

        And no, I haven't made up my mind about this. Nor is it my city. I'm just discussing possibilities and priorities.

        by NewDirection on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:23:43 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  interesting parallels (none / 0)

        Venice is being sacraficed to the sea slowly anyway, and Amsterdam is protected by big hydraulic dams in order to protect it from a super-storm - exactly the way New Orleans was not protected.

        Uff da.

        by a517dogg on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:25:41 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  I think (none / 1)

        that NO could be better protected and is not inherently susceptible to flooding, provided that the necessary precautions are taken. However, I think a lot of Americans are actually going to end up agreeing with Hastert -- that having a major metropolis situated in a bowl by the seaside is a strategically stupid idea to begin with. Don't get me wrong: I personally think that they should rebuild, but I think there is a possibilit that it won't be.

        by ProgressivePrinciple on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:17:18 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  It's not just the culture... (4.00 / 5)

      NO is a port. That's part of why it's there. The new NO can be rebuilt with some creative thinking about how best to deal with the facts of where the town is.

      San Francisco has been rebuilt on top of itself before. It can be done well and effectively.

      My impression of Den's statement is that we shouldn't even bother.

      Mariachi Mama Candidate Bickering Moratorium! Signatory to the Carnacki Petition

      by kredwyn on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:21:16 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  you are right (4.00 / 2)

        .....  Hastert just wants to throw his hands up and abandon the City because rebuilding it will take intelligent, innovative urban design, groundbreaking Amsterdam/Venice-style engineering and lots of Federal money - if its done right it destroys his evil ideology that collective Federal action cannot work.  IT CAN, because, New Orleans - as you said - is an essential port, not just a cultural relic (look at the impact on gas prices if you don't believe me)

        by PIrish on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:27:32 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Denny's Exquisite Sense Of Timing (none / 0)

               Right after he helps push through one of the biggest hunks of legislative pork in the history of Congress, he turns around and says taxpayers shouldn't have to pay for rebuilding NOLA.
               Tomorrow he'll probably be voting for more flood control projects for Cairo.
               The GOP used to be the Daddy Party. Now it's merely the Abusive Stepfather Party.

               

          Whatever is real is different.-- B. Traven

          by angry blue planet on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 05:50:43 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Rupugs just being repugs (none / 0)

        They run all branches of gov't and control all agencies -- why not just blurt out what you're thinking?  Let them live on high ground!!

        I've always felt that this ruling scenerio would lead to such unbridled moments of hubris, but I never expected it so soon after The Most Significant Natural Disaster in US History.

        Disclaimer: Any resemblance to actual robots would be really cool

        by Mike E on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:44:38 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Not just a port (none / 0)

        The largest port in the country, 5th largest in the world.  It is where the Midwest grain and aoybeans get exported.  If it has to be trucked to Houston, there go gasoline prices up again.

        John McCain--he's not who you think he is.

        by Mimikatz on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:18:52 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Exactly. n/t (none / 0)

        I am an anti-imperialist. I am opposed to having the eagle put its talons on any other land. -- Mark Twain

        by Meteor Blades on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:49:55 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I dont disagree. (3.66 / 3)

      But Hastert is an asshole for talking about this NOW, when the govt has been ass dragging so horribly.

      But the question is definitly valid. I dont think its an obvious one. But Hastert should have kept his fucking mouth shut until babies and children and sick people arent dying on TV anymore.

      It's a neighborly day in this beautywood. Relentless!

      by ablington on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:21:58 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  It is not valid (none / 0)

        NO was established in 1718 -- if it were not for the ecological destruction of the wetlands (authorized by the GOP) and the funding cuts for the levee reinforcement (ditto) we would not be even talking about this.

        First Congress lets Bush destroy NO, next we have idiots like Hastert blaming the victims! STOP NOW! Enough insanity.

        by numediaman on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:53:53 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Rebuilding New Orleans (none / 0)

      The city of New Orleans should be rebuilt, but parts of it should be relocated away from flood prone areas. The layout of New Orleans was a disaster waiting to happen, this week it happened.

      To prevent the level of disaster from happening again (no way to totally prevent)the parts of the city that are located below sea level should seriously be considered for being moved. While the size of the city is large other cities that have been flooded and that were likely to be flooded again, for example Rapid City South Dakota and cities up river on the Mississippi, have been moved. This is not something that should be taken lightly with global warming the odds are increasing that another such huricane will probably happen sometime in the next 100 years or so.  While I would not look forward to being forced to move, I also would not look forward to having my house be flooded again any time soon.

      The government should exist to help the people, not corporations, as the current administration seems to care more about.  Perhaps there should be congressional hearings into how the Bush Administration has mismanaged the relief effort and the security of the levy system. (Most likely will not happen with the Republican party in charge, one more reason to elect Democrats in 2006).

      -8.63, -3.59

      by WAProgressive on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:32:19 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  So, most of the city should be moved? (none / 0)

        Because most of it is below sea level.  You're arguing against not rebuilding, but basically saying the same exact thing.  

        Don't like XOM and OPEC? What have YOU done to reduce your oil consumption? Hot air does NOT constitute a renewable resource!

        by Asak on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 04:38:00 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Move most of city - yes (none / 0)

          From what I have seen of New Orleans on TV, the downtown area and the area around the Superdome are above sea level, and the French Quarter (and others areas), but for the most part yes the city should be rebuilt, but elsewhere nearby.
          The areas above sea level seem safe to rebuild (repair damage) but the rest would be foolish to rebuilt where it is, that is below sea level.

          As noted elswhere on this thread after the hurricane of 1900 at Gavelston, TX most of the port business was moved somewhat northward to Houston. New Orleans will most likely survive, but as a smaller city.

          -8.63, -3.59

          by WAProgressive on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 06:50:02 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  I'm sure he said the same (4.00 / 6)

    about Florida each of the last several times that state was hit.

    right?

    anyone?  anyone?  Bueller?

    Join Soulforce-seeking Justice for God's GLBT children.
    Time to change the mindset - Obama 'O8!

    by its simple IF you ignore the complexity on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:16:03 PM PDT

  •  Hmmm... (none / 0)

    So why did we bother rebuilding Washington after the British burned it in 1814?  It could very easily be burned down again.

    Formerly, a voice of objective reason in the partisan din of the U.S. National Security community.

    by mustang dvs on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:16:25 PM PDT

    •  Or the Florida coast, or tornado alley, or (4.00 / 2)

      the fire ravaged mountains of the West Coast? Why not just roll over and wait for the rapture?

      The whole administration is in first class on the Titanic!

      "Liberals feel unworthy of their possessions. Conservatives feel they deserve everything they've stolen." Mort Sahl

      by maggiemae on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:24:04 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Or the 1776 foot tall "Freedom Tower" (none / 0)

        The terrists are just gonna bomb it again.

        Incidentally, has 11Sept really been renamed "Patriot Day." Doesn't Massachusetts already have a Patriot Day?

        "Can we all get along?"

        by hotspur on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:32:51 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Bullshit analogies... (none / 0)

        The real analogy would be rebuilding San Francisco or Los Angeles with no earthquake protection.  The city is below sea level and below the level of a lake that's right next to it.  Natural disasters can afflict any city, but New Orleans is completely susceptible because it is built in a location that doesn't make any sense.  In LA you can add earth quake proofing to buildings and other structures, in New Orleans you can move the city (trucking in millions of tons of earth is simply not practical).  

        Don't like XOM and OPEC? What have YOU done to reduce your oil consumption? Hot air does NOT constitute a renewable resource!

        by Asak on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 04:42:34 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Large sections of Boston (none / 0)

          are built on fill dirt.

          A large part of lower Manhattan is built on fill.

          The Back Bay area of Boston was built on fill brought in by railroad about 140 years ago.

          by SingleVoter on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 05:42:05 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  But that was done piecemeal (none / 0)

            over decades.  New Orleans would have to be filled all at once to be rebuilt effectively.  And then you'd still have to deal with the problems caused by restricting the floodplains of the Mississippi Delta.

            by Black Maned Pensator on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 06:28:25 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Much of the SOMA area of San Francisco (none / 0)

              is built on debris from the San Francisco earthquake. All debris from the cities devastation was dumped into the Bay, and even today if you walk near 3rd and Townsend Street, a jagged bronze line with plaque marking the original shore line is visible. Everything south is fill.

              "Liberals feel unworthy of their possessions. Conservatives feel they deserve everything they've stolen." Mort Sahl

              by maggiemae on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 10:56:26 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

  •  Keep talking Denny (none / 1)

    It's time for the people who love New Orleans to vote him out of office. It's about rebuilding smarter and quit gutting our disaster relief agencies to pay for bogus wars!  It's on your head Denny. BTW, Miami will get hit again, too.  But wait, that's Gov. Bush country.

    Winning without Delay.

    by ljm on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:16:54 PM PDT

  •  bad timing (4.00 / 6)

    But New Orleans really shouldn't be located where it is.

    Close it off, turn the whole thing into a national park and rebuild a few miles inland.

    by empath on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:16:58 PM PDT

    •  Ummm.... (none / 0)

      There's this little issue of the most economically important port in the U.S. being located there... People have to work in the port and they need people to provide services and support for them.

      Sure, without the port, the modern New Orleans need not be located there, but then again, without that port, without New Orleans, we wouldn't have an economy.

      Formerly, a voice of objective reason in the partisan din of the U.S. National Security community.

      by mustang dvs on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:24:08 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Amen (none / 0)

      Besides, the Cafe du Monde was relatively unscathed, so there's still reason for me to go (beignets). I think it should be a sort of Jazz-era Colonial Williamsburg, only more boozy.

      "We don't have to put the word 'compassionate' in front of 'liberal' the way conservatives do to prove that we give a shit about people." -- George Clooney

      by amyindallas on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:58:31 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  So Denny... (none / 0)

    The next time someone's cow knocks over a lantern in Chicago, should we not rebuild that either? How 'bout the next time the water along the Golden Mile floods over?

    Wow...just wow.

    Mariachi Mama Candidate Bickering Moratorium! Signatory to the Carnacki Petition

    by kredwyn on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:17:09 PM PDT

  •  heard on CNN (none / 1)

    Wolf Blitzer almost looked horrified when he reported it.

    [America]Are you being sinister or is this some form of practical joke?

    by hstokes on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:17:35 PM PDT

  •  a page out of the Gerald Ford playbook? (4.00 / 2)

    "Ford to City: Drop Dead", Daily News, October 30, 1975

    by PitPat on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:18:33 PM PDT

  •  LA-3 safe now, LA-7 will go Dem, LA-1 in play (none / 1)

    I can see this idiot's words hung around the neck of (LA-3) Melacon's opponent, and current GOPers (LA-1) Jindal & the guy from LA-7.

    by swampwiz on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:19:34 PM PDT

  •  Early reaction (4.00 / 4)

    I thought at first that this would be a golden opportunity to rebuild using energy-efficient techniques, build cluster housing that would preserve open space in neighborhoods, and light the new buildings with solar panels, which would not require oil to turn on the lights.

    OK, so I'm delusional.

    But my other reaction is to wonder if rebuilding will be possible. The materials will be available, and the labor, but what banks and financial institutions, who are required to protect investments, will invest in such a flood plain?

    The degree to which you resist injustice is the degree to which you are free. -- Utah Phillips

    by Mnemosyne on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:19:46 PM PDT

  •  Iraq or ??? (4.00 / 5)

    Hastert would rather spend money rebuilding in IRAQ than in his own country. I wonder if he would be for rebuilding if Jeb's Florida was washed away?
    Hastert is a prick.

    A conservative is a man with two perfectly good legs who....never learned how to walk forward.-FDR

    by vassmer on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:21:54 PM PDT

  •  This Is Big. (4.00 / 3)

    We've gotta wrap this around the old man's neck. He is an R leader, after all. He's gotta start backtracking, it's so damn goofy. His own troops have to desert him. This could be the death of his career as an R leader. Just like Lott.

    "There's no housing bubble..." - Fed Chief Ben Bernanke, 10/27/2005

    by chuco35 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:21:56 PM PDT

  •  Despicable (none / 1)

    The Republicans. They don't even pretend to govern responsibly.

    by NegSpin on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:21:58 PM PDT

  •  I'm glad they're being honest (4.00 / 2)

    I'm glad these scumbags are finally being honest. Let's go kick the shit out of his home town and then say "TS"

    This is the same kinda crap that Bruce Herschensohn, right wing nut job for US Senate in 1992 in California said. ABOUT EARTHQUAKE RELIEF.

    Every day these jerks are causing harm to millions of people. If the Democrats, whoever they are, don't stand up and call BS on this, then we're screwed and we'll just have to accept that the US is run by a pack of lying jackals.

    by schadelmannII on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:22:14 PM PDT

  •  Nahlins (4.00 / 3)

    I love when someone from down there can pronounce it in one syllable. I've always wanted to see The Big Easy and I still hope to one day. Rebuilding has to start with new seawalls and levees coupled with new building standards. Hastert, you ignorant toad - it's gonna get built one brick at a time, and each brick represents one vote for your buddies down the shitter.

    Canada - where a pack of smokes is ten bucks and a heart transplant is free.

    by dpc on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:23:47 PM PDT

  •  Have W's Marine One helicopter lower ... (none / 1)

    ... Denny's Hastert into the New Orleans levee breach just before it lands to let W off in order to pretend he gives a shit about this whole mess.

    by iaminillinois on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:23:54 PM PDT

  •  An even better question (none / 0)

    Why let Hastert breathe our air anymore?  He's just going to die one day, after all.

    by Sharon Jumper on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:25:16 PM PDT

  •  gee (none / 1)

    is this the new rethug southern strategy?

    i don't think this is going to play well with the nascar dads.

    what a pig.

    p

    by produceus on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:25:39 PM PDT

  •  LA & SF (4.00 / 2)

    Actually, Hastert commented on Los Angeles and San Francisco too:

    "We ought to take a second look at it. But you know we build Los Angeles and San Francisco on top of earthquake fissures and they rebuild too. Stubbornness."

    What an ass.

    TAKE BACK OUR PARTY: DEMOCRACY BONDS

    by LiberalFromPA on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:26:02 PM PDT

  •  Hastert's Congressional Office Phone Number (none / 1)

    202 225-2976

    I just called, got the answering machine (I guess they've all gone, it's after 5 PM here in DC, after all).  I left a message indicating what a disgrace to the US I thought Hastert was and asking how anyone with any ethics could even work for the man.  It won't affect anyone there, of course, but please feel free to fill up the answering machine with your opinions of Mr. Hastert.

    by ohameh on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:27:27 PM PDT

  •  Rebuilding is an obligation (none / 1)

    At least the argument can be made. That pesky little thing called the constitution. Right there at the beginning. Insure domestic tranquility. Promote the general welfare. I diaried about it here but it didn't get much (any) response. This is a better place to address it. Hastert doesn't really have a choice. Congress MUST do it.

    by Kane in CA on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:27:45 PM PDT

  •  Why rebuild the WTC? It's just going to... (none / 0)

    get destroyed again.

    Right?

    by GeorgeBushytail on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:28:12 PM PDT

    •  Only if politically expedient. (none / 0)

      by magnus on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:33:32 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Not a bad point (none / 0)

      Isn't it true?

      I'm certainly no Hastert lover, but on this point it's frankly hard to argue...

      We've got how many billions of acres above sea level in this country, yet we want to pour billions extra into rebuilding on this particular spot that is below sea level?

      Unlike 9/11, Mother Nature is not a terrorist...and we can alter our behavior this time without "letting them win".

      A pity it was Hastert who was quoted on it first. But I diaried the same point yesterday before he said anything.

      Agreed that the emergency is more important right now.

      You can't be on the team, if you're not in the choir. Sorry.

      by peeder on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:34:08 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Also (none / 0)

        The analogy is a bit off.  It isn't that this city got hit by a hurricane.  It's that this particular city literally fills up with 20 feet of water when that happens.  

        No one is saying don't rebuild Mobile.  They are saying why spend money to build buildings in a bowl that is below a lake.  

        After this, who the heck would want to live there anyway?  I wouldn't.  When you buy a house anywhere in the county, they do a flood plain search.  I can't even imagine an insurer OK'ing the building of anything in that bowl.  

        We as a people need to stop living in places that Nature owns.  

        Whether or not to rebuild NO in the same place or at all is not a partisan issue.  It is an environmental one.  

        "Why does man kill? He kills for food. And not only food: frequently there must be a beverage." - Woody Allen

        by Seattle Slough on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 04:45:38 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  you're from Seattle? (none / 1)

          Well, if you're going to have an attitude like that, when Mt. Rainer blows, don't expect any support from me for rebuilding Seattle.

          by mimi9 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 06:33:46 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  you completely missed my point (none / 0)

            It isn't WHERE New Orleans is situated that is troubling.  Yes that area is susceptible to violent storms.  So is Mobile, AL.  No, it is what happens to that particular city when it does that is the problem.  

            Humans are stubborn.  We will continue to live in hurricane zones, and in tornado alley, and in earthquake territory.  Fine.  But living in a city that fills up with twenty feet of water when one of these things happens is a different story.  

            This is about the topography of that particular place.  You know, the place that is ten feet below sea level.  That place.  Probably not the smartest place to build a city.  Especially when you are in a hurricane zone and especially when there is a large body of water on the other side of a levee.

            It all depends upon what the state of the city actually is (which is unknown).  If they can just pump out the water and fix the levees and buildings, great.  If they have to rebuild entire sections of town, I say, not worth it.

            It isn't just that NO is below sea level.  It is below sea level and is still sinking.  As the water table rises, they pump it out, this lowers the city further.  That city, like Venice, and to a lesser extent Amsterdam is doomed.  The question is not if, it is when.  We would be crazy to rebuild such a city simply because we are attached to its buildings/culture/identity.  We should do so only if it is a logical and reasonable thing to do.

            Would I want to save Venice, of course.  If Venice were lost would I want to rebuild it?  Of course not.  

            BTW, Mt. Rainier blowing won't take out Seattle.  An earthquake possibly.  But not Rainier.  Rather, Rainier would destroy a few roads nearby and then spew ash eastward across the entire planet.  Ironically, when St. Helen's blew, Seattle got less ash than some places much much further to the east.  The trade winds just blow that way.

            "Why does man kill? He kills for food. And not only food: frequently there must be a beverage." - Woody Allen

            by Seattle Slough on Fri Sep 02, 2005 at 01:48:40 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

  •  This has been mentioned in a lot of diaries (4.00 / 4)

    Why did this one get front paged? There has been a lot of good discourse about it. I will pose this to you: We often band together when sound science is thrown out the window in the name of strict dogma (global warming, EPA rules, ESA, etc.). Since its' inception hundreds of years ago, NOLA has been sinking due to geologic and human (dewatering aquifers e.g.)factors. Scientifically it is a bad bad place (at least the lowest parts) to have a city, and there are other options for a port in the area (New New Orleans). Why are you any better than a flat Earth-no global warming pundit if you immediately dismiss discourse on this in the name of some dogmatic, emotional, and hubris filled agenda?
    Look at India or Bangladesh, the monsoons there are bad every few years and wipe tons of people out. Due to socioeconomic factors the poor always have to repopulate the worst places, thus get wiped out again. As an advanced society, can't we try to do better or at least discuss it?
    P.S. I think Hastert is a jerk too but not for this.

    The Republican Party: The Bridge to Nowhere

    by flounder on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:28:21 PM PDT

    •  whoa! (none / 0)

      We concluded our similarly-themed, same-timed postings with an almost identical closing remark.  Weird.

      Make your voice heard! MichiganDecides.com!

      by cartwrightdale on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:31:46 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  To continue our discussion, flounder (none / 1)

      Noone here is disputing GW, or denying that preserving NO in its present circumstances is challenging.  But there are all sorts of inefficient livlihoods being maintained by the miracle of modern engineering.  And, as others have pointed out, the area seems pretty able to justify its existence as a major port and oil center, without even mentioninbg the UNIQUE and IRREPLACEABLE culture that is New Orleans.  I've seen you on several diaries on this same subject, and I have yet to understand why you are so focused on sacrificing New Orleans to what you preceive to be the only sensible response to climate change, and accusing those of us who disagree as non-reality based.

      Why don't we leave it up to folks in New Olreans whether we want to rebuild?

      No one likes armed missionaries. -- Robespierre.

      by Gator Keyfitz on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:42:19 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I'm not intent on sacrificing NO (none / 0)

        I just think it is foolhardy to dismiss replacing it out of hand. If we rebuild, for instance, the French Quarter with a facsimile French Quarter, how "irreplaceable" was it really in the first place?
        I think replacing NO is a bad way to put it btw, but ceding the lowest areas to wetlands and focusing on building in areas that will weather a storm much better would help the greater city in the longterm and should be on the table.
        I agree that there are all sorts of inefficient livelihoods maintained through engineering, and when shit hits the fan it isn't the engineers and those who fund the engineers who end up paying but those who live on the fringe. I would argue that having them repeatedly pay so you can have your culture and jazz might be a little selfish.

        The Republican Party: The Bridge to Nowhere

        by flounder on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:56:18 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Your concern for the citizens of New Orleans (none / 1)

          is so great, that you would deny them the choice of whether they rebuild their city or not because pushing the climate change meme is more important for your agenda?  Who's being selfish?  Yeah, yeah, I'm just dunking my beignet in blood, heartless monster that I am, all but personally chaining those poor wretches to the French Quarter so that they can shuck oysters for me when I visit.  Has it occurred to you that they may want to live there?  God knows all my friends there love the place.

          The funny thing is, I'm sort of an environmentalist myself, almost an extremist in fact, and I'm sure you and I would agree about a lot.  I just happen to feel that NO is one of the two or three coolest cities in AMerica, and I think it's worth saving, even at tremendous expense, even if it slips beneath the waves in a hundred years.

          No one likes armed missionaries. -- Robespierre.

          by Gator Keyfitz on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:21:20 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Well. . . . (none / 0)

        I think the reason that the issue is appropriate to a national discussion is because the nation will be largely financing it.

        New Orleans is a great city, but to rebuild it without an intelligent, sustainable environmental approach would not be smart, or--in the long run--kind to the returning inhabits (or their children), who may have to go through something like this again.

        The answer isn't higher or stronger walls, but a paradigm that lets the Mississippi do some of what it naturally needs to do to rebuild the buffer, and that might require moving the city some.  I don't see how it's problematic to think along those lines.

        As others here have said, Hastert's timing is stupid and heartless.

        And speaking of the towers, didn't NYC decide NOT to build them so big again, because they didn't want to create another target?  I mean, didn't NYC consider exactly this question?

        Claytonben

        http://www.amazon.com/Underwater-Lengths-Single-Benjamin-Grossberg/dp/0912592583

        by claytonben on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:59:07 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •   Yeah, and New Orleans (none / 1)

          has been "subsidising" your city too by being a major port and center for oil and refining.  Do you want to have a discussion like this every time there's a calamity?  Where do you live, and what might go wrong there?  

          No one likes armed missionaries. -- Robespierre.

          by Gator Keyfitz on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:12:46 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  Let's Tell His Highness to Go to HELL (none / 0)

    Send the bastard an email, call and jam his phonelines. He's a punk that deserves a dose of reality and common sense:

    http://www.house.gov/hastert/contact.shtml

    by schadelmannII on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:28:47 PM PDT

    •  Here's mine: (none / 0)

      How DARE you recommend that New Orleans not be rebuilt?  Is your next suggestion going to be that we might as well just seal the whole area off and let everyone trapped inside it die?

      That's par for your course, fatass, but not for America's.  You and your heartless, hateful, sneering Republican cronies are done.  It took a national calamity to wake this country up and see just how little you and your little golfing friends and oil mavens care, but now everyone can see with their own eyes what you really are.  The breadth of your arrogance is only matched by the depths of your lack of compassion.

      This is your last term, fat boy.  Maybe after the outraged voters of Illinois and around the country turn you and your fellow Republican thugs out into the street, you can go sweat off some of that lard by helping rebuild a levee.  Maybe Habitat for Humanity would let you swing a hammer or carry a wagonload of bricks.  I'd love to see you do something good for this country for the first time in your sorry, hateful political career.

      Hey!  Why wait?  Resign now, apologize for being a worthless piece of plutocratic Republican garbage, and haul your sloppy ass down to New Orleans or Gulfport and ask someone what you can do to help.  It's not too late to do something decent with your life.

      The History Commons needs your participation.

      by Black Max on Fri Sep 02, 2005 at 10:04:45 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Well... (4.00 / 3)

    To be fair, he said RE-building the city as it USED TO BE made no sense, since it would just be destroyed again.  He also stated directly in that interview: "We are going to rebuild this city. We can help replace, we can relieve disaster."  I don't think his comments were particularly harsh in context; this just doesn't seem like something to make a big deal over.

    That said, I think it IS something we need to be talking about, especially since the city is sinking, and the potential for destruction gets worse every year.  To not even consider the possibility that we may have to abandon the city for the greater good, and to ridicule anyone who even brings the possibility up, is  inexcusibly narrow-mided of us at this point.

    (Don't worry -- I still think Hastert sucks.  Just not for this, bad taste and timing aside.)

    Make your voice heard! MichiganDecides.com!

    by cartwrightdale on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:29:33 PM PDT

  •  It is Gold Denny, It is Gold!! (none / 0)

    What Dennis Hastert said is solid gold for any Democrat for the 2006 election. Any competent (is there any left??) Democrat should use this ammo mercilessly against him in 2006 using a  Katrina footage and using his press conference clip side by side and asking the question: "Would you Support Denny Hastert if *(put the name of district he is running) was hit by a natural disaster?? Would he say the same about your house?" End of Ad. Methinks it should be used 24/7 until "it catapult the propaganda"!! Oh, I love this phrase..yummy!!

    by Shuvo Dutta on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:30:49 PM PDT

  •  Hastert is a corrupt prick (none / 1)

    but his question is valid. IF the insurance can be found to cover the rebuilding of NO, how much will it cost? And what else can you do with that money?

    The land there is sinking, and the water is rising. The hurricanes are going to get WORSE.

    A new city could be a model of new technology, and it's a wonderful opportunity. But putting it right back in the same problematic place doesn't seem to make much sense to me.

    "we must make the rescue of the environment the central organizing principle for civilization" - Al Gore

    by racerx on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:31:44 PM PDT

    •  Not to mention the Ice Caps will MELT (none / 0)

      and it will get worse inexorably...

      Save the sentimental parts...e.g. French Quarter...help everyone build elsewhere, safer.

      You can't be on the team, if you're not in the choir. Sorry.

      by peeder on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:37:11 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Why the outrage? (4.00 / 3)

    I think it is a very legitimate question to ask. We're talking about a city that is built into a crater, an effectively man-made crater at that. Is it really worthwhile for the country as a whole to help pay the enormous cost of rebuilding a city in a place that is as susceptible to this kind of destruction?

    Now, the answer may in fact be yes, it is still worth doing, economically and socially and what-have-you. But I don't think it's egregious to ask the question at all. In fact it's more egregious to simply state outright that 'you damn well bet we're gonna rebuild, on the same damn spot and everything, just to give Mother Nature and the rest of you a huge middle finger'.

    Personally, based on my reading on the subject, I think the feds should just buy out the residents of the city, cordon off the land, and let the whole delta region recover from the past century and a half of deleterious water projects and gradual environmental degradation. That would still be expensive, but in the longer-term it would still be cheaper and wiser for all parties involved.

    by maxentropy on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:32:32 PM PDT

    •  Yeah (none / 0)

      Plus, frankly, if we criticize someone for the very legimate question of "should we spend $50 billion to rebuild New Orleans" when there are many many other, better uses for that money, we lose a lot of ground on our equally very legimate questions of how money is being spent in Iraq, as well.

      Make your voice heard! MichiganDecides.com!

      by cartwrightdale on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:35:32 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Before everyone over-reacts to this (4.00 / 4)

    and before you flame me, let's take a pragmatic look to the situation in NO, and along the Gulf and Eastern Coasts.

    Regarding NO, there is no question that it should be restored. It is also acceptable to think this is not a pragmatic idea. I think that the argument is easily won, and so let's put that aside.

    What is without question is recent development along the shores in areas known to be susceptible to hurricanes. This was made possible when Congress passed legislation essentially insuring these developments; the private sector new better, or the premiums were so high that it wasn't economically feasable to build. Both Dem's and GOP Congressmen voted for this legislation. It was at best a pig trough event.

    When we consider rebuilding areas destroyed by Katrina, we need to consider when the structures were built. Much of NO and the coast of Miss have weathered decades of storms...one could argue that they have passed the test of time, and that our collective history is served be their restoration.

    Newer construction, however, does not enjoy the same nostalgic feeling. Often, the architecture is of no remark. Often, the construction is shoddy.

    It is these buildings, perhaps even neighborhoods or communities, that have to be looked at critically. Perhaps we as a nation will choose to rebuild them. But as progressives, and I assume most of us reading this are just that, it is beholden on us to at least talk about it.

    Especially when so many of our tax dollars will be used to guarantee loans, in indirect and direct aid.

    Let this diary become an arena for dialog - not just a place to bash Rep. Hastert. He was a wrestler after all, and not known for nuance.

    Four Legs Good

    by Spud1 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:34:52 PM PDT

    •  In fact (none / 0)

      Many of these new developments could actually be responsible for the force with which Katrina hit.

      They were build on drained wetlands.  Formerly the wetlands acted as a sort of buffer between the Gulf and NO, mitigating the force of hurricanes as they landed ashore.

      I have heard meteorologists claim that removing the protection of these wetlands increased the damage done further inland. If this is true, and it makes sense to me, they should not be rebuilt, and the land be left to return to its former state.

      If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. ~James Madison

      by mjshep on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:46:53 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It's Politics We're Talking About... (none / 0)

      Dennis made what on the surface is a very insensitive remark. It sounds like he's willing to abandon NO. Do we give him a pass, because, after all, he might make sense? Did the Rs ever give Dean a pass when his very sensible remarks could be interpreted in a way to hurt Ds? Or do we make hay?

      That's our problem - we give the Rs the benefit of the doubt in our cerebral manner. Shoot,like your post, we look and strain to find the reason in their logic. The Rs just whack us upside our heads - ask Howard.

      "There's no housing bubble..." - Fed Chief Ben Bernanke, 10/27/2005

      by chuco35 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:02:24 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  That is the cross we bear, my friend. Do (none / 0)

        you want to ride the spiral down to the sewer? No one said that being a progressive was easy. In fact, that is part of the allure of reactionary conservatism - it is so easy to simply hate.

        So chin up - argue with well consructed reasons, not bile.

        Four Legs Good

        by Spud1 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:10:33 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Yup, that's my Congressman! (none / 0)

    Ain't he a peach?

    Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men? Well, come on, doesn't anybody know!?!?

    by Erik the Red on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:35:24 PM PDT

  •  what's so wrong with asking? (4.00 / 3)

    I think it was callous of Hastert to say something like that right now, but I do think it's worth considering whether we shouldn't rebuild in a different location above sea level.  Given that we are going to have to rebuild, why should we rebuild in the same place?

    I think it's a legitimate question.  Now that we can plan for a similar storm in the future, maybe building more inland is a good idea?

    A gaffe in Washington is when you tell the truth and people act surprised.

    by hotshotxi on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:35:28 PM PDT

    •  I like the idea of a New New Orleans (none / 0)

      They could probably restore the French Quarter enough for visiting tourists, but other than that, I think relocating might be the most humane thing to do in the long run.

      BUT, Hastert should have known better than to say something like that at a time like this, as a public official.  It's crass.  You wouldn't say "well, she's probably dead" to the family of a missing person a day or two after she goes missing.  The fact that it may be true, as Hastert's comment was, doesn't make it any less inconsiderate as people are suffering.

      Make your voice heard! MichiganDecides.com!

      by cartwrightdale on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:39:07 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  So let's look at IL-14, (none / 1)

    Hastert Country. It's happened before, weather conditions spawn a string of tornados that run, SW to NE, through a whole territory. IL-14 is such a region, running from Henry County to Kane. We could get 40, maybe 50 tornados, tearing up up Kewanee, Geneseo, Dixon, Amboy (my birthplace), Walnut, Compton, Shabbona, DeKalb, Hinckley, Oswego, Aurora, St. Charles, Batavia, Geneva, Elgin, Carpentersville. Should we bother to rebuild these communities devastated by tornados, because after all, they're just at risk for another round of tornados; or should we just all move to somewhere "safer," like, uh, North Dakota.

    No offense intended toward North Dakota, but all you get is winter, right?

    by davelf2 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:36:23 PM PDT

  •  Look (4.00 / 2)

    I think this is the perfect oppurtunity to destroy the Republican majority. Katrina disaster can put a stake through the very heart of dominance of Republican party if Democrats can play it wisely. If a Democrat can bring down Denny Hastert by using this oppurtunity, I say take it. Because, you now if it were Republicans, they would have done it in a heartbeat.

    by Shuvo Dutta on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:37:17 PM PDT

  •  Respect life (none / 1)

    But only if it is unborn or brain dead. Otherwise, you're on your own.

    If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. ~James Madison

    by mjshep on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:40:39 PM PDT

  •  I wonder how Illinois commerce would fare ... (none / 0)

    ... without a major port at the mouth of the Mississippi?

    Or how that major port would function without a major city adjoining?

    The Great Obama might saw the lady in half, but he won't make the elephant disappear. The Confluence

    by RonK Seattle on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:41:14 PM PDT

  •  Denny Hastert Hosts: (none / 0)

    The Fair-and-Balanced Corporation for Public Broadcasting is proud to present:

    Great Moments in World History

    With your host, Denny Hastert...

    Episode I: The Lost City of Rome Before the Goths: Eternal No More
    Episode II: Deep Below Taftville: The Lost City of San Francisco
    Episode III: Prosperity in Europe Before the Wars: A Fleeting Memory
    Episode IV: Memories of Hiroshima
    Episode V: The American Space Program, 1961-1967.  The Dream That Died with Apollo I.

    by fpc on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:43:05 PM PDT

  •  What ever happened to federalism? (none / 0)

    The decisions on how to rebuild New Orleans do have to be made, and it isn't to early to think about them, although this is no time for action -- there are too many lives on the line right now.

    But, ultimately, shouldn't the decisions be made primarily by the people of Louisiana, and not in Washington?  I thought that this is what Republicans believed in.

    "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities" -- Voltaire

    by ohwilleke on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:43:15 PM PDT

  •  Denny's (none / 0)

    why bother to rebuild the World Trade Center? they will just crash planes into again

    why bother have schools? we should home teach acc'd Ricky Sanatorium

    why bother to build any more Denny's?   arent speakers of the house fat enough

    why bother to find cures for cancer or aids?  we are all gonna die anyway

    the fact that hastert, delay, bush, frist even get one vote is a damn shame on humanity

    He may talk like an idiot, and look like an idiot, but don't let that fool you: he really is an idiot...Groucho Marx

    by distributorcap on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:44:34 PM PDT

  •  Sounds like cutting and running to me (n/t) (none / 0)

    -4.00, -5.79 | Visit Illinois Reason.

    by thesill on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:45:13 PM PDT

  •  I guess I'm another (4.00 / 2)

    one who doesn't get the outrage over the comment.  The timing may have been poor, but the man does have a point.  

    I don't understand how saying that NO is in a poor area, and if we do have to completely rebuild the city, maybe we should rebuild it somewhere nearby that doesn't have quite so many drawbacks as the cuurent location.  To me, bringing up such is "respecting life," its just also fairly tactless.

    And Breaux is an idiot.  Its not at all like saying that we should shut down LA because its earthquake prone, its like saying that if LA was essentially destroyed by an earthquake we should consider rebuilding it in a different location.  Nor is it at all similar to the Chicago fire, except in that things were destroyed.

    Pretty sad attempts to disparage the man, I know he is a repub, but still, that doesn't mean we need to make stuff up about him--or completely suspend logic in order to make poor analogies.

    by jhancock on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:45:39 PM PDT

    •  and, the FULL comment is different (none / 0)

      He was saying maybe we shouldn't rebuild it AS IT WAS, since that doesn't work and is unsafe.  

      He also said "we are going to rebuild this city. We can help replace, we can relieve disaster."  

      Now, I'm sure if a Dem had said that, then all the Repubs would be all over him/her as well.  But just cause the other side plays unfair politics doesn't mean we have to.

      Make your voice heard! MichiganDecides.com!

      by cartwrightdale on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 02:52:04 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Analogous to disease and hunger (none / 0)

      Look at the earlier analogy when it is in regards to cancer.

      Disease and hunger are human conditions that can lead to death. Why do we try to alleviate pain and prevent death? Should we bother having medical sciences? Why do we even have sciences? What is the useful purpose of it?

      This plays right into the Bush administration's thoughts on science, especially their positions on global warming and ID.

      by anonymousredvest18 on Thu Sep 01, 2005 at 03:04:51 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]