Daily Kos

Why FEMA turned away help

Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 07:55:38 AM PDT

For days after the disaster, help and volunteers of all sorts headed for New Orleans with relief supplies and expertise, only to be stopped and turned away by FEMA.

Last night, one of my friends joined our regular Sunday chat. He had just come home from New Orleans with his group of volunteer firefighters from Houston, after they had waited outside New Orleans for since Tuesday for FEMA to let them help in New Orleans, or use them somewhere else in the stricken region.

FEMA's "reason" -- they wouldn't let anyone in "until the National Guard has secured the city." The details of his experience are below the fold.

Bill is a member of a volunteer firefighter team in the Houston area. He and his team have a lot of experience helping after hurricanes. And they also have special expertise -- a lot of them work for a living on oil infrastructure and repairs. Bill is a professional logistics expert whose assignments have included getting a client's tsunami-flattened distribution facility back operating within a couple of weeks, and pre-invasion logistics work in Kuwait.

On Monday night, his group assembled their rescue equipment and tools, and packed them into their boats along with all the emergency supplies they could carry. By Tuesday morning, they were almost to New Orleans. "We were stopped at gunpoint by FEMA and told to turn back," he told me. When I asked, he clarified that they did not point the guns at them, but they were carrying and displaying their weapons.

FEMA told him that no one was allowed to enter the city to help "until it was secured by the National Guard." The Houston team asked if they could wait. The FEMA staff told them yes, but that they shouldn't expect anything to change.

So they set up camp in the parking area where they had been stopped, and they waited. By Thursday night, when they were still waiting in the same place, some of the team returned to Houston. The rest decided to wait longer. And still nothing changed, so the remaining team members returned to Houston on Saturday night.

Needless to say, Bill is livid about this. I asked him why they had not been sent to some of the other communities in the hurricane-stricken area where security was not as much of an issue.

"We asked," he told me, "but they said that our expertise was more needed in the New Orleans area." The catch-22 -- they were needed in New Orleans, so they weren't allowed to go elsewhere, but they weren't allowed to go into New Orleans, so the upshot was that they did nothing except sit and wait, and then go home in frustration.

What had him frosted more than anything else is that they also have very specific expertise, as individual professionals as well as a firefighter team, in dealing with damage to oil infrastructure in the aftermath of a natural disaster. "We've been doing this more than 10 years," he told me. "We are not amateurs, and we have an enormous amount of experience with areas which have been hit by hurricanes."

"A lot of the damaged oil facilities aren't even in the city of New Orleans itself," he told me, "so they weren't in an area that you would think would have looters or security problems that were different from any hurricane we've worked in. We're used to arriving and immediately going to work."

They didn't just sit and wait -- they kept going back to the FEMA people who were holding them up and making suggestions about how and where they could be useful. But FEMA had no interest in listening, and the line never changed. "You can wait if you wish, but don't expect any change anytime soon. Or you can go home."

You know all that "help is on the way" BS that was spouted? A lot of it wasn't just "on the way" -- it was already there, but blocked from doing anything because of FEMA.

We've heard so much of this over this past week, of help and supplies arriving and not being allowed in, of the USS Bataan cruising off the city with helicopters, medical facilities, and supplies, but doing nothing because they hadn't been asked to help.

I thought my outrage meter was already off the dial, but I discovered it had new levels when I heard the first-hand account from a friend who had left work for a week to bring specific expertise to the disaster, and who was among the thousands of such people blocked by FEMA and their incompetent bureaucracy from doing anything at all.

Tags: Hurricane Katrina, FEMA, New Orleans (all tags) :: Previous Tag Versions

Permalink | 320 comments

  •  Un*FUCKING*believable (4.00 / 14)

    I think everyone should print this story out and send it to their Representatives. (with your blessing of course...)

    This is just wrong...wrong...wrong.

    I'm not going anywhere. I'm standing up, which is how one speaks in opposition in a civilized world. - Ainsley Hayes

    by jillian on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 07:57:50 AM PDT

    •  But FEMA did even more damage. They blocked the (4.00 / 11)

      local officials in getting what they needed to help secure things - such as blocking the Coast Guard from giving Jefferson Parish fuel like Aaron Broussard said on MTP.  Along with turning away water.  Not even to mention cutting emergency phone lines!???!

      What excuse do they have for that?

      It is all so unfathomable.  

      Plus, they didn't help the local and state bring up any communications operations which was a big contributer to the confusion.

      •  Surreal (4.00 / 10)

        Who are these guys?  What the hell was their game?  Blocking aid, cutting power, denying local people fuel?

        Was this an attempted coup?  Was this the sort of thing our nation did in Central America in order to topple unfriendly governments?

        Is this what FEMA has become?  A domestic branch of the CIA's dirty tricksters?  What next?  Exploding hot links?

        Banana Republicans, indeed!

        •  Here is more information on what they did: (4.00 / 22)

          (I'm not sure if this has been posted on Daily Kos or not, all the websites have been on overload with information flying)

          Posted by Flaxbee on DU on Saturday, September 3rd:

          "My husband used to work in disaster preparedness/relief .....he also worked in Russia for years, both before and after the fall of the Berlin Wall, and organized relief in the immediate aftermath of Chernobyl.

          He doesn't post here, but he wrote this - he's been on the phone day and night for the past five days trying to get someone to OK the offered assistance. Everyone knows this is a first-class fuck up, but here's another perspective.

          ----
          Over the years I have worked in and out of government to solve communications and technical problems, save lives and help where possible. I was managing director of a Russian-American telephone company providing rapid communications in the former Soviet Union and have helped with disaster communications projects around the world.

          This is the first time I have ever encountered this unbelievable kind of absolutely uncaring, Washington/political two-step. When the storm approached the Gulf coast I called offering simple suggestions to government types (since this was obviously from all reports going to be a terrible storm) of how to bring communications systems up as soon as the storm passed. I recommended bringing in Blimps with portable cell transceivers and VHF, UHF and other types of broadcast equipment and also equipment to aid in the search and rescue effort. No one was interested.

          When the storm hit and everyone knew the worst had happened, I contacted the Red Cross, (someone there hung up on me) and then FEMA where someone told me it was all up to the DOD -- and I wondered why the Pentagon was in charge of FEMA? I was also told that FEMA was being privatized and a number of the experienced staff trained in hurricane relief had been told they had to resign from FEMA and then be rehired by the private company.

          I called senators and governors, I even tried to get through to my contacts and no one would listen or respond (though a member of Senator Dole's staff did commiserate with me over the level of incompetence that was growing ever more apparent). Then Putin offered helicopters, search and rescue personnel, water purification equipment, and doctors and so much more. Had the State Department allowed the Russian humanitarian mission to proceed, Russian help would have been on the ground a good 24-48 hours before FEMA was in many of the poorer and worst-affected areas.

          Everyone here now knows that all international help was tuned down (Ms. Rice was shopping and taking in a play while these offers were coming in, so she may not be totally lying when she said no offers of help were turned down b/c she wasn't there to turn them down. But she's been caught lying again with a statement that can be proven to be an untruth empirically by simply making one phone call to Putin's offices or the many other nation offering help, or by reading LBN here).

          The screw-ups continue even now. I can name many ways that the Bush administration not only did not help, but also caused people to die and are still causing so many to die needlessly. It is if the government was actively trying to hinder the relief operations.

          I fear there will be the biggest cover-up in the history of America after this is all over (mass graves so reminiscent of Bush 41's Panama disaster). Don't let anyone tell you everything possible was done to prepare or respond when in fact FEMA may have done more harm than good.

          Write, yell, do something, but this has to be fixed before the next disaster. I feel that maybe the only hope for America is to impeach the entire Bush Administration.

          edited for clarification and remove some identifying details

          http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4610127

          •  this hurts (none / 1)

            I still wont be going to walmart any time soon but I am giving them credit and thanking them for stepping up and providing the releif they are
          •  Privatizing FEMA? (4.00 / 2)

            That isn't public news.

            If FEMA was shown to be incompetent the Bushies could 1) blame them for the failure and 2) make an argument for privatization.

            That said, I really hope that FEMA's miserable performance has been due to incompetence and confusion and not some sinister plot. After the Downing Street Memo though, we cannot rule out the sinister plot option.

            •  I saw a report of someone from Georgia who, on (4.00 / 3)

              his own initiative, showed up with boats and gas to do rescues.  He was told, no volunteers - only the contractors could do it.  

              It is like they viewed (and still view it) as primarily an opportunity for their buddies to make billions.  People from all around the country were begging to help save people, but they weren't interested in that.

            •  "public news" or not, privatization (none / 1)

              of FEMA started even before 9/11. Here's a link to a good discussion of such from September 2004 (too much good stuff to quote, just go read it, if you're interested):

              cover story at Best of New Orleans, "A Disaster Waiting to Happen".

            •  FEMA's gutting... (none / 1)

              The Independent Weekly, a small-town, Durham, N.C. free paper covered FEMA's gutting and Mike Brown's inexperience a year ago...

              Excepts follow --

              Disaster in the making
              September 22, 2004

              .. In addition, the White House has pushed for privatization of essential government services, including disaster management, and merged FEMA into the Department of Homeland Security, where natural disaster programs are often sidelined by counter-terrorism programs. Along the way, morale at FEMA has plummeted, and many of the agency's most experienced personnel have left for work in other government agencies or private corporations...

              ... Some FEMA veterans complained that Allbaugh had little experience in managing disasters, and the new administration's early initiatives did little to settle their concerns. The White House quickly launched a government-wide effort to privatize public services, including key elements of disaster management. Bush's first budget director, Mitch Daniels, spelled out the philosophy in remarks at an April 2001 conference: "The general idea--that the business of government is not to provide services, but to make sure that they are provided--seems self-evident to me," he said.

              In a May 15, 2001, appearance before a Senate appropriations subcommittee, Allbaugh signaled that the new, stripped-down approach would be applied at FEMA as well. "Many are concerned that federal disaster assistance may have evolved into both an oversized entitlement program and a disincentive to effective state and local risk management," he said. "Expectations of when the federal government should be involved and the degree of involvement may have ballooned beyond what is an appropriate level."...

              ..."Pretty soon governments can't do things because they've given up those capabilities to the private sector. And private corporations don't necessarily maintain those capabilities."

              The push for privatization wasn't the only change that raised red flags at FEMA. As a 2004 article in the Journal of Homeland Security and Emergency Management would later note, "Allbaugh brought about several internal, though questionably effective, reorganizations of FEMA. The Bush-Allbaugh FEMA diminished the Clinton administration's organizational emphasis on disaster mitigation."...

              ...Nevertheless, FEMA must now get by with a smaller number of in-house specialists. The irony, disaster researcher Claire Rubin says, is that FEMA will now have to hire former employees like Zensinger as contractors. "Now, frankly, the senior brains and the people with 20, 30 years of operational experience, there's more of them in the private sector than there are at FEMA. It's a significant shift. If the government's going to get smaller and the catastrophes keep getting bigger, the net effect will be to outsource what you need. It might be cheaper, it might be more expensive, but it's not a great way to run this part of government." Following the current spate of hurricanes, she predicts, "you will see FEMA contracts flying left and right so they can get these people back who know how to do this stuff."...

              There's a lot more to the article -- it's a good read, especially considering that its tragic predictions were borne-out this week along the Gulf coast.

              Formerly, a voice of objective reason in the partisan din of the U.S. National Security community.

              by mustang dvs on Tue Sep 06, 2005 at 12:59:19 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Didn't even see the 12 hr old post (none / 0)

                I'd been floating this article around DKos for the past couple of days -- didn't think anyone had taken notice. Glad I was wrong...

                Formerly, a voice of objective reason in the partisan din of the U.S. National Security community.

                by mustang dvs on Tue Sep 06, 2005 at 01:01:11 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

          •  re:Criminal Incompetence (4.00 / 14)

            I fear there will be the biggest cover-up in the history of America after this is all over (mass graves so reminiscent of Bush 41's Panama disaster).

            Uh uh.  No way.  No way this baby gets covered up.  For one thing, the whole world has seen and heard the truth behind the pathetic lies coming out of this administration.  For another thing, this firsthand account and others are coming from people who are going to return to their communities and tell all their friends and families, who will tell others, and on, and on.  And when Bush comes on the evening news saying what great work FEMA is doing, they're all going to know they can no longer trust that man: He's been saying the same thing about Iraq and the economy, hasn't he?  Many of these gulf coast areas are heavily--scratch that--were heavily Republican.

            I think Katrina could swamp the Republicans in 2006.  How about this for a stump speech line: Elect me, and I'll call for Congressional investigations into the handling of FEMA  

            You talk about disaffected voters.  Any inroads Republicans may have been making with African American voters are washed out.  Just say Superdome, and you'll hear what black voters (and many more of us) think of the racialized responses to "looting" and to helping the poorer people of New Orleans.

            And just to round things out, electorally, sit down and have a few words with working-class and middle-class voters in colder states this winter.  Let them tell you about their heating bills.  Then ask them if they think the Republicans in Congress care about simple, hard-working Americans.

            Remember how Republicans shamelessly exploited 9/11?  It's time for Democrats to righteously exploit Katrina to clean house on this corrupt administration and the incompetent assholes it appoints to key positions.

            •  I just wrote to our dear leaders (4.00 / 5)

              on just this subject. It took the Black Caucus to come out alone, god damn it, without the rest of our party to say that the atrocities on the ground were unacceptable. Alone! This won't work. No way. We have to come together, not behind them or hiding away, we have to come out together and make some very bold statemnents that send a chilling message to this country, that this is not only the sickest thing our country has watched and endured but that people in charge will be held accountable.
              •  My letter (4.00 / 2)

                Dear Senator Reid,

                The Bush Administration showed a level of gross negligence and breathtaking incompetence in their handling of the hurricane Katrina catastrophe.  Every day I read new stories of FEMA officials turning away expert volunteers, including the American Red Cross.  A public official from Paquemines Parish reported that FEMA cut his emergency communications lines!  I believe that FEMA's actions amount to criminal negligence.  If the Department of Defense is responsible for blocking the rescue of thousands of Americans, the question is, what the hell were they thinking?  And why were they in charge?

                I urge you to demand hearings to hold the Federal Government responsible for this disaster.

                Mr Brown and Mr Chertoff should be fired immediately!  

                President Bush and the rest of his Administration appeared to not even grasp the enormity of the impending disaster as it approached, when it made landfall, and for almost a week of seeing the pictures of people suffering and dying on the streets! Frankly, the President and Secretary of State Rice displayed shocking, callous indifference!

                Now IS the time for finger pointing.  This is no politics as usual spinnable PR issue.  Thousands of people were killed as a direct result of the inaction of our Government.

                The fact that most of the victims are Black and/or poor has escaped no one's notice.  The survivors should be paid a million dollars each as reparation for the horrible suffering they were forced to endure.

                I urge you to address this issue forcefully in the Senate.  

                Thank you,
                x xx

                cc: D.Feinstein
                B.Boxer, G.Miller

                http://www.house.gov/

                http://www.senate.gov/index.htm

      •  PEOPLE DIED... (4.00 / 3)

        n/t

        An untypical Negro...since 1954.

        by blksista on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 09:15:36 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Communications being jammed? (4.00 / 3)

        For what it is worth, Wayne Madsen is reporting that communications in and around New Orleans have been being jammed for days.  I know people here regard Madsen with skepticism, and I was skeptical of his reports myself, but Broussard's claim that FEMA cut his communications lines seems to corroborate Madsen.

        The influence of the [executive] has increased, is increasing, and ought to be diminished.

        by lysias on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 10:35:32 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Cutting Communications is Standard Rove (4.00 / 3)

          In order to control the story you need to control th e communications.

          Look at what they're doing in Iraq.

          Look at how they're handling Roberts.

          The Reps always want control of the information.

          •  Communications? (4.00 / 7)

            "A Mole in Gov Blanco's office reports

            Okay, I'm gonna come clean, because I see that Bush and his cronies are going to try to do what I heard they were going to do. I mentioned a few emails back that Bush was doing something despicable and cowardly.

            Well, here is the story: a few nights ago, he met with Gov. Blanco. He isolated her, and attempted to get her to sign an agreement that partly would have exonerated the Feds and FEMA, and placed blame squarely on the state government. Well, I see in these NY Times articles that Karl Rove is orchestrating this cowardly attempt to diffuse blame. This story, by the way, comes from someone very high up in Blanco's administration.

            From someone pretty high up in Mayor Ray Nagin's administration, word also got out just yesterday athta Bush was going to try to aim blame at Nagin and his people. Believe me, this is serious shit. Both the state and city governments have real fears that their lines are being bugged by the Feds (not unfounded by the way). And all this during a disaster such as the aftermath. It is becoming painfully aware that Bush has no conscience, no integrity whatsoever. Okay, so I said if need be, I'd spill the beans on this, and I encourage all of you to pass it around.

            http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4644904#4645205

            •  Who is "he"? (none / 0)

              Are you saying that it was Bush who cornered Blanco? Before I forward this shocking stuff it would be good to get it clarified. Thanks very much.
              •  I read it as Bush. But I'm not the author (none / 0)

                or the mole.

                I'm just sharing the information that I read.

                •  I sure it was Bush (none / 0)

                  The Times-Picayune reported on Saturday that Nagin had said Bush had taken Blanco aside and offered her two options and that Blanco had said she needed 24 hours.  Nagin seemed to be criticising her though he also appeared not to know just what the details of these options were....Note, though, that Sen. Landrieu whho'd been trying hard to please Bush turned on him on Saturday as well....

                   

                  "the fools, the fools, they've left us our Fenian Dead" (Padraig Pearse - Gay Revolutionary)

                  by padraig pearse on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 02:50:54 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

            •  They need to come out with this!!!! (none / 0)

              They need to step out from behind the shadows and TALK about this on national media!!!

              SCUZZBALLS!!!!!  If this is true, it's the most cowardly, dastardly thing I've ever heard of ..... "If you will take the blame for the delay, we will send help" .... (at least, I gather that's the "deal")

            •  Wait, when was this? (none / 0)

              Wait, when was this?

              There was Video on CNN, ( Can't link to the popups, click on the video link for CNN, search for "Nagin still outspoken" 07:57 AM, Sep 05) with Nagin saying that he told Bush and Blanco point blank on Air Force One to get things worked out. Bush and Blanco apparently went to the back of the airplane where they met, and when they returned to the room, Bush said that he had given her two choices, and that Blanco said she had to "wait 24 hours to make a decision" on it.

              That sounds horrible coming from the Gov. but what you said just put a whole new spin on it. I hate to even think this low of even Dubya, but could Bush have actually threatened to deliberately withhold aid unless Blanco took the fall for this disaster?

              •  Blanco refused to sign everything over to (none / 0)

                the Feds and look at all the help that is now in the City.  

                She didn't need to sign anything else for them to help.  They just wouldn't give the orders to do it.  

                •  Blanco is already gone (none / 0)

                  Blanco may as well act as if her career is over.
                  The Bushies are after her and even if she gives in to their demands they're still going to attempt to destroy her all the same.

                  When will people learn that if they aren't on the Bush team they aren't going to get on it? Core Bush people will always be protected, everyone else can be sacrificed as the need arises, regardless of prior promises.

        •  Questionable (none / 0)

          There were streaming feeds of NOPD, NOFD, Marine Radio and Air Traffic at varoius times last week.  Never heard a drop of interference.  
        •  Here's a diary about (none / 1)

          Madsen's diary...In which he accuses dKos censoring stories about blocked communications.

          Pretty pathetic.

          Sorry to Diary Whore, but this makes me ill.

          No one can terrorize a whole nation, unless we are all his accomplices. ~Edward R. Murrow

          by mlkisler on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 09:44:05 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  Bill (4.00 / 10)

      needs to write it all down, have his comrades sign and date the document, and this needs to be sent to every damn politician in this country. Quite frankly I am sick of them all, I begged Senator Nelson (D-FL)last Wednesday to step up and do something, I sent him an email and pleaded for him to do something, but nothing, not a peep.  I am disgusted with this country.

      Good feet giving up good boots. http://www.bringthemhomenow.org/

      by panicbean on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 09:42:20 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  yes, an affidavit now (4.00 / 3)

        get it on paper with witnesses. Please, and Thank you!

        "...yet didn't Mr Windrip speak beautifully about pure language, church attendance, low taxation, and the American flag?" Don't Let It Happen Here

        by nhwriter on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 10:11:35 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  he MUST send it to Hilary Clinton (none / 1)

        from today's New York Times story:

        In one of several such appeals, Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton, Democrat of New York, called on President Bush on Sunday to appoint an independent national commission to examine the relief effort. She also said that she intends to introduce legislation to remove FEMA from the Department of Homeland Security and restore its previous status as an independent agency with cabinet-level status.

        The thought of forming a "commission" of course won't be very reassuring to many dKos readers, but getting on board with the idea -- also strongly put forward in the last year by former FEMA director James Witt -- that FEMA needs to be "restored" is an important political move, in my opinion. And remember, Witt was just hired by Gov. Blanco to have "her seat at the table" with federal authorities.

        •  I can't think of anything less productive (none / 1)

          than having Bush appoint a commission. WADR, the fox guarding the henhouse? cmon, Clinton....

          fouls, excesses and immoderate behavior are scored ZERO at Over the Line, Smokey!

          by seesdifferent on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 11:08:03 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  it's not the commission I think is important (4.00 / 2)

            in this news, as I said. Of course, there'll be a commission -- it's just a given.

            What I think is good politics, and good framing, is Clinton's signing on to the idea that it was the Bush administration's POLICIES re: privatization of FEMA and transferring responsibility to an untested and unprofessional (appointing college roommates instead of experts) so-called "Homeland Security" agency that are at the root of FEMA's failures (or criminal dereliction of duty?) here.

        •  As pointed out on another diary- DHS was (4.00 / 2)

          formed to respond to terrorist threats, FEMA was brought under DHS and basically gutted FEMA's original charter. DHS has not given FEMA a new one. Then, in this Hurricane Katrina crisis, FEMA under the overarching umbrella of DHS responded like they would for a terrorist attack. Every attempt is being made to manage and control  information, secure the scene, stop the looting, etc. Not a response in any way associated with a natural disaster. Thus, the numerous suggestions  to set FEMA under it's own cabinet post, seperate from DHS.

          "Liberals feel unworthy of their possessions. Conservatives feel they deserve everything they've stolen." Mort Sahl

          by maggiemae on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 11:17:46 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Terrorist, Hurricane, what's the difference? (4.00 / 7)

            ... except that they had several days advance warning?

            Don't you imagine that a couple of trucks filled with nitrate fertilizer and fuel oil placed next to those canal levees (which are not hugely thick like the main levees) wouldn't have flooded New Orleans the same way?

            Seriously -- if Tim McVeigh and Terry Nichols could do that with the OKC Federal Building as two guys and a truck, do you think it would have taken more than four guys a two trucks to flood NOLA exactly the same way? You wouldn't have had the wind damage, but you also wouldn't have had time for people to get to the higher ground of the SuperDome or Convention Center, either.

            The only difference was we wouldn't have had days of advance warning.

            So tell me how FEMA's focus on terrorism would have made one particle of difference. The only difference I see is that we would be bombing Iran to "get even."

            America will never again be the land of the free... Until she again becomes the home of the brave.

            by Ducktape on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 12:28:51 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Huge difference is degree of devastation (none / 0)

              9/11 and Oklahoma City bombing were limited to relatively small area of devastation.  Hurricane Katrina combined with levee flooding cover 96,000 miles.

              Additionally, the terror response mentality is one of marshal law, containment, security of site, DHS working with FBI and law enforcement.

              The primary focus is never that of humanitarian aid, as a primary thrust, ala the tsunmi.    

              "Liberals feel unworthy of their possessions. Conservatives feel they deserve everything they've stolen." Mort Sahl

              by maggiemae on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 06:08:29 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

    •  You very much have my blessing (4.00 / 13)

      Please help yourself to this, and post it wherever it will be useful. I will put an email address in my profile if you need to get it touch with me.

      I lurk all the time, but rarely post because I'm just too busy, and by the time I have something written, someone else has said it even better.

      But I really felt like this had to be said, so please help to spread the story. I'll be talking to my friend today to see what he's willing to attach his name to, or perhaps if there are also other of his firefighting team who would like to go public.

      America will never again be the land of the free... Until she again becomes the home of the brave.

      by Ducktape on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 09:47:14 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Watch for the spin because that's the response (4.00 / 4)

      Bush loyalists are going to try to get out of this by saying either:

      1. This is all the fault of the city officials
      2. They would have helped sooner but all the terrible people of New Orleans were shooting and causing havoc

      The response to the first one is simple: in a disaster, FEMA is in charge, end of story.  The city did move to evacuate the city as best they could.  The problem is there's a lot of poor people in New Orleans who simply could not get out.  

      As for the second part, this story points out the obvious screw up: THERE WERE NOT ENOUGH GUARD TROOPS TO GET THE JOB DONE.   Why?  Because they were off in Iraq.  Simple really.  Bush has overworked the resources of this country and this is the result.  Not enough troops meant not enough security meant no relief aid until several days after the Hurricane.

       

      •  Au contraire (4.00 / 2)

        ...not in complete disagreement, I should point out, but there were at least some National Guard available.

        Gov. Bill Richardson offered New Mexico's guard, but the feds botched up the request either by sitting on it, squashing it, losing it or rejecting it.

        Anybody else out there recall whether other states' guard were also offered within the early window of Katrina but botched by the feds?

        This is such a clusterf*ck that it's hard to tell where one screw up began and another ended, any way you look at it, though.

        •  Indiana (none / 1)

          Indiana sent NG south to help.  Some guard units and a whole airwing.  They have not yet come home but I haven't heard if they were allowed to do anything to help yet.  Local EMTs with ambulances were sent too, no word on those either.  

          DITCH MITCH-Republican "Bush Buddy" Governor of Indiana

          by libnewsie on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 02:22:07 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  read on here earlier this week... (none / 0)

          ...that mayor richard daily offered help, like, on saturday before the hurricane and was turned down.

          none of this makes any sense to me. i'm so not into conspiracy theories, but this is way beyond the usual ineptitude for this administration. how could they possibly be sooooooo stupid????

          The radical invents views. When he has worn them out the conservative adopts them. - Mark Twain

          by FemiNazi on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 10:41:14 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Question(s) ... (none / 0)

          Were Louisiana's NG troops truly pressed into service when the governor declared a state of emergency? Or were the numbers that were deemed "available" controlled (as in "manipulated") by the Pentagon?

          The fact that it took until Thursday for the Pentagon to approve Governor Richardson's direct offer of his state's NG seemed like a smoking gun from the moment I heard about it. And it immediately seemed like the number of NG deployed to work this disaster was way too low and that they did not appear to be taking their orders from the governor.

          "Not to anticipate unanticipated consequences is a dangerous thing to do." [Ambassador Joseph Wilson to Bill Moyers, Feb. 28, 2003]

          by Robert de Loxley on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 10:54:48 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  One more... (none / 0)

        ...way they are trying to spin out of it:

        3.) This was an "ULTRA-CATASTROPHE," so "nobody could possibly have predicted it."

        Of course, there was nothing especially un-predicted about it at all, since we know that various government officials, scientists, engineers have been worried about this sort of hurricane, and about the levees, for quite some time. But "ultra-catastrophe" has a "beyond all reasonable expectations" ring to it that makes it seem like it was the fault of forces beyond human control.  

        This is a clever rhetorical trick to confuse the Category 4 HURRICANE hitting there (a relatively rare act of nature we couldn't affect) with the lack of PREVENTATIVE & RESPONSIVE MEASURES  (levees, evacuation plan/funds for the poor, FEMA), which were within the government's capacity to affect.

        It is no worse, because I write of it. It would be no better, if I stopped my most unwilling hand.

        by ChaosMouse on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 01:29:06 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Sorry that I Don't Have a Link for This ... (none / 0)

          But I was reading the comments of a meteorologist regarding the amount of devastation. To paraphrase him/her: The wind speed (the current measure of a hurricane) might have dropped from a category 5 to a category 4 when Katrina hit land, but the storm surge accompanying it didn't (and doesn't) drop so fast. That's why the meteorologists were going so apeshit--to them it still packed the punch of a category 5 hurricane.

          The one picture that defines the power of Katrina for me is at Webshots.com

          "Not to anticipate unanticipated consequences is a dangerous thing to do." [Ambassador Joseph Wilson to Bill Moyers, Feb. 28, 2003]

          by Robert de Loxley on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 11:18:48 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  my right wing mother in law's response (none / 0)

        was "he wanted to be there, but his handlers wouldn't let him" "no one in LA asked for help" "no one in LA thought that they'd neeed help" ..... yep, the kool aide says its a. the handlers' fault and b.  LA city and state persons' fault.

        Fucking incredible ... and get this .... they live in Jackson, MS .... however they frequent Tunica instead of Biloxi

    •  Thanks for bringing this here (4.00 / 6)

      So much was said in Flaxbee's husband's statement.  But a couple of things really jumped out to me.  The first being:
      I was also told that FEMA was being privatized and a number of the experienced staff trained in hurricane relief had been told they had to resign from FEMA and then be rehired by the private company.

      Yesterday I posted something that, at the time, I thought was, for me,  a bit of a tin foil hat suspicion

      When they decided to fold FEMA into OHS, I had this nagging feeling that FEMA's days as an active entity were numbered. I could easily see it being completely dissolved before Bush left office.  During the elections in '08, the Repubs would use it as one example of getting rid of tax dollar waste, since its role had become nothing more than a duplication of duties the Office of Homeland Security had absorbed.

      I guess I wasn't too far off.  

      The second thing that made me think was this:

      Had the State Department allowed the Russian humanitarian mission to proceed, Russian help would have been on the ground a good 24-48 hours before FEMA was in many of the poorer and worst-affected areas.

      As with so many people and groups who had tried to get into NO and were turned back or with the aid from outside the US that had been turned down, my reaction has been the same.  I can just imagine Rove counciling Shrub that,  "It would be too embarrassing to the US and to the office of the President to have outside forces getting in before FEMA or the National Guard.  The first respondents there have to be ours or we'll look weak and ineffectual."  Of course, if that is the advice that was given, it was the absolute wrong advice by exactly 180 degrees.

      If any event could have shown just how self absorbed this administration is, it was this one.  In this case, it wasn't, "You're either with us, or against us," it was just a blatant, "Thanks, but no thanks.  We can do this on our own."

      I'm not sure how much longer I can live with the rage I feel everyday and I wasn't even there!  I snark and gripe about alot of things this Whitehouse has done, is doing and is planning for the future, but I've always been able to find something that will take me out of the bad mood they put me in.  This time I just can't seem to find any outlet for my anger.  If I can't find release, how are the people who have lived through this supposed to find peace anytime soon?  In the years to come, what is going to be the effect to the collective psyche of this country, as those displaced try to find a way to survive?  

      Reporters have been talking about how the Preznit has this huge opportunity to set his legacy by being able to shape SCOTUS for years to come with the vacancies he has the opportunity to fill.  Well, let's not forget that along side that legacy will also be his glaring failures with his slowness to respond during the first hours of 9/11, the hubris with which he invaded Iraq and the total ineptitude with which the war has been conducted, the push for legislation that does nothing more than pad the coffers of his rich friends and supporters,  and now the totally ineffectual way he handled one of the biggest natural disasters to hit the US in a century. He better pray and pray hard that another severe hurricane, major earthquake or devastating fire doesn't hit anywhere in the US.  His resources are so stretched now that another disaster will only open us up to bigger threat, which is a major terrorist attack.  We've still got 2 months of hurricane season left.  The National Hurricane Center has redone their estimates and they are predicting at least 3 more catagorey 3-5 hurricanes before it's all over.  Now that I think about it again, maybe we'd better all pray.

      What's amazing is that he's got another 3 years and 4 months to add to his list of fuck-ups.  So, I wonder just how kind history will be to this poor excuse for a Commander in Chief.  I can imagine that if any of us or those beaten back or ignored by this guy and his cronies have anything to say about it, he's going to be seen as one of the worst leaders we've ever had.

      Just because a person has faith doesn't mean that he isn't full of crap.-- Pastordan

      by Maggie Mae on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 11:28:46 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Always goes back to the bloody resume, doesn't it? (4.00 / 6)

        This piece-of-excrement masquerading as a human, let alone as POTUS, had a pissy resume before he was elected.

        He sank companies, indulged in illegal activities, or indulged in activities that he believes are illegal for anyone else to partake (like the college girlfriend who was "encouraged" to get an abortion).

        His work to date mirrors the calibre of his previous work history.

        He sucked -- and expected everyone else from his family, friends to countrymen to bail out his sorry ass.  If he was running a publicly-owned business, I don't know how he'd not have been run out on a rail or jailed by now.

        Only difference now: the stakes are no longer tanking stock values, but human lives.  For as long as he lives we should be on hand to protest everything he does, from golfing to speeches.  We owe this much to our fellow citizens who died in vain for a "noble cause" or for the lack of real leadership.

  •  I believe... (none / 1)

    ... someone is compiling a list of stories like this. Anybody got that info?

    hink

    Hyperbole will be the death of us all!

    by MrHinkyDink on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 07:59:07 AM PDT

      •  I hate I didn't see that diary (none / 1)

        I would have recommended it. Very important that there is a central location for these types of stories. Together they are a major indictment against the incompetence that led to the deaths of perhaps tens of thousands (heard an estimate of 20,00 in New Orleans alone).
        •  Wiki, wikki? whatever (4.00 / 3)

          we need a wikki on this asap.
          •  Yes (4.00 / 7)

            And then it needs to be turned into a book. A well written, fast-paced, suspenseful, hour-by-hour account of team after team of volunteers turning up, Air Force and Navy personnel at the ready, public officials pleading for help, AND FEMA TELLING THEM EACH AND ALL TO TAKE A FLYING FUCK.

            This would sell. Internationally. Top of the lists. All proceeds to hurricane relief.

            •  Eric Klinenberg perfect writer, HEAT WAVE (4.00 / 3)

              I would like to suggest Eric Klinenberg as the perfect writer of this human and natural disaster. His experience, perspective and insight is valuable for the many historical parallels in his book HEAT WAVE: A Social Autopsy of Disaster in Chicago.

              Quoting from Siva Vaidhyanathan
              http://www.nyu.edu/classes/siva/archives/001981.html#more
              September 03, 2005

              Chicago: The Precedent for New Orleans
              My buddy and NYU colleague Eric Klinenberg wrote a powerful, important, award-winning book called Heat Wave.

              Friday he wrote an article for Slate.com called When Chicago Baked - Unheeded lessons from another great urban catastrophe.

              Sept. 11 was an epochal event in American culture, so it's no surprise that it's everyone's favorite comparison to the destruction of New Orleans. But the more instructive analogy is another great urban catastrophe in recent American history: The 1995 Chicago heat wave, when a blend of extreme weather, political mismanagement, and abandonment of vulnerable city residents resulted in the loss of water, widespread power outages, thousands of hospitalizations, and 739 deaths in a devastating week. This summer is the heat wave's 10th anniversary. Yet the event has been largely forgotten as government agencies charged with protecting Americans from disasters have ignored the lessons it offered -- and people are dying on the Gulf Coast as a result.

              Long before 1995, American public-health officials warned of the dangers of extreme summer weather. Heat waves in a typical year kill more Americans than all other extreme weather events combined (between 400 and 1,500). After cities including Philadelphia, St. Louis, and Chicago itself experienced heat disasters in the late 1980s and early 1990s, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention began prodding government agencies to develop plans for preventing heat-related casualties. But few cities took this advice seriously. Chicago's Health Department shelved its heat-emergency plan in the office's back regions.

              A strong emergency response might have compensated for the poor advance planning. As with Katrina, meteorologists identified the treacherous weather system at least a week before it hit Chicago and advised the city to prepare for the worst. Instead, Mayor Richard M. Daley and many of his Cabinet members set off on summer vacations, returning to Chicago only after dead bodies began piling up at the morgue. In the absence of its leaders, the city failed to pull its forgotten heat-emergency plan from the shelf. Local emergency managers refused to call in additional resources to help with the unfolding health crisis, even though paramedics and ambulances were readily available.

              Affluent and middle-class Chicagoans had little trouble getting out of harm's way. They either turned on their air conditioners or fled for cooler destinations. Thousands of poor, old, isolated, and sick people, especially those concentrated in the city's segregated African-American ghettos, on the other hand, were effectively trapped in lethal conditions. Neither federal nor local agencies did much to assist them. Instead, city patrols cracked down on young people who opened fire hydrants.

              Images of the "water war" between the teens and the city workers featured prominently in the local media, as did long sound bites from political officials who insisted that no one had foreseen the danger of heat waves and that they had done everything they could to respond. The commissioner of human services said that people died because they neglected to take care of themselves. The mayor blamed families for refusing to protect their kin. Outraged representatives of Chicago's African-American neighborhoods argued the obvious: Everyone knew which people and places were going to be most affected by the heat. The victims' vulnerability was predictable, and so was the city's neglect. Yet their complaints got little attention, and the story of what happened to their communities remains largely unknown.

              Katrina is in some ways a different species of trouble. The hurricane has destroyed New Orleans and damaged smaller cities in addition to killing people. Yet the parallels are striking. Federal officials ignored several urgent pleas--from the Federal Emergency Management Agency, the Army Corps of Engineers, members of Congress, Gulf Coast politicians, and scores of disaster experts--for major infrastructure improvements to prevent catastrophic flooding on the Gulf Coast. Paul Krugman reports in the New York Times that FEMA rated this crisis one of the top three threats to American security. Yet the White House denied requests to shore up levees or build larger drainage systems for the lower Mississippi River.

              Emergency preparations during the week before the storm were also weak. As in Chicago, top political officials--this time President Bush and his Cabinet members--refused to interrupt their vacation schedules until the death toll spiked. As in Chicago, city leaders neglected poor African-American neighborhoods where residents were certain to be vulnerable, failing to send evacuation buses there or to the hospitals and homes where the frail, elderly, and sick are clustered.

              In contrast to Chicago, however, New Orleans officials have clamored for more assistance from Washington. The New York Times reported that Col. Terry Ebbert, director of Homeland Security for New Orleans, said the disaster response has been "carried on the backs of the little guys for four goddamn days. ... It's criminal within the confines of the United States that within one hour of the hurricane they weren't force-feeding us. It's like FEMA has never been to a hurricane."

              In part because of such open condemnation, the media coverage of Katrina has been more critical than the coverage of the Chicago heat wave. Yet little of the most valuable coverage, local radio broadcasting, is available inside New Orleans. Without TV, Internet access, newspapers, and telephones, people are depending on radios--battery-powered, in automobiles, or hand-crank--for emergency information. But as of Thursday evening, only one station, Entercom's WWL-AM 870, had its own reporters on the air. Clear Channel Communications, which owns roughly 1,200 stations nationwide (about six times more than any other company) owns six stations in New Orleans. The company has been criticized for failing to provide emergency information or expansive coverage during other local disasters in recent years. During the first days of the disaster, none of the Clear Channel stations provided their own reporting on the crisis. One, KHEV, retransmitted audio from WWL-TV. On Friday, the Web sites for Clear Channel's New Orleans stations announced that they had joined other broadcasters in setting up "United Radio for New Orleans" and removed the promos for syndicated programs and paid advertisements that had been visible on the site over the previous days.

              It's important to keep asking questions about all the things that have gone wrong in New Orleans. Let it not be another Chicago disaster story, in which wasted lessons compound the catastrophe of wasted lives.

              many green, yellow, blue and now purple dogs are a majority.

              by Prove Our Democracy with Paper Ballots on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 12:25:52 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Klinenberg's book is great (none / 0)

                I wrote a paper last year, when all of the hurricanes hit Florida, about the ways in which the Orlando Sentinel newspaper presented the events. In short, they were presented as events requiring official and corporate response, and the reports effectively undermined what I called "place-making imagination". Bureaucracies and governments tend to want to treat places like morality - the simpler the better. Bush's moral code, very black and white (true in more sense than one) is presented as character when it is really the lack of moral imagination to not see possibilities that are between the extremes. The same is true for places - they can be presented in very flattened ways (public/private, good/evil, safe/threatening), and so the ways of making place are essentially not seen.

                The result in Orlando last year was that the truism that communities pull together in times of disaster was not presented at all. In fact, there was one story titled "Want to help? Stay out of the way", which reflected the idea that the corporate and official response was the only correct response.

                In many ways, NO is the opposite. The response was neither corporate nor official, and all people had to fall back on was each other. That wasn't enough for very many. But NO is renowned as a place of community, a place where no one wants to leave as they grow up because it is so strongly home.

                NO has the reputation of being a rich place, from the point of view of quality of dwelling. People matter to people. From the point of view of money, on the other hand, it probably isn't. True (classical) conservatism would agree with contemporary liberalism, in that it would celebrate that richness, seeing it as rooted in the complexity of human culture. This present version of conservatism, on the other hand, is scared of rich places. The quintessential neo-con place is the gated community, where everything is controlled and the scary world is kept out. And, you are told which 3 colors you are allowed to paint your house. Both moral imagination and place-making imagination are all but extinct.

                Except, they can't be extinguished forever. I think we're going to hear a few things about the people who were left behind in NO. One, they are going to be livid at a government that didn't care, and so should we all be. But second, once the dominant stories about looting have run their course, I think we're going to hear about the ways in which that community supported each other. I think they're going to remind us what a place looks like, and that it really did shine at the worst moment, and that it isn't lost even with people scattered all over.

                To me, that's one thing that those who are sick of this status quo should latch onto. It is life together that people want, and that the current administration (and any I could imagine with similar people) can't even imagine, and certainly can't provide. The president's disingenuous first name/nickname familiarity ("Browny"?!!? What the hell is that, something left on someone's underwear?) will be seen as completely fake, compared to real community. His is just in-crowd cronyism, not real community.

                I pray to God to be rid of God. - Meister Eckhart

                by mitumba on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 02:33:46 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

          •  Perhaps a contribution to dKospedia (4.00 / 3)

            And link to the diary of collected stories and other important diaries.

            One stop shopping, conserve bandwith.

            Folks can link to that site in their sig lines.

            Just some suggestions for keeping a record.

          •  I've added (none / 1)

            this to the Hurricane Katrina Chronology.  I am trying to add entries for any incidents like this where FEMA turned away help.

            Also, this is definitely a story to take to local Houston media.  I think they'd pick it up and then it might go national.

            John McCain doesn't think kids need health insurance

            by katerina on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 10:17:36 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  excellent! (none / 1)

              How do I/can I/we create something like this in dkosopedia that people can update with links to answers?

              PROBLEM: People in Superdome not provided security, provisions, evacuation after hurricane.  
              CAUSE:? Nobody came. RESPONSIBLE: ? Why wasn't the Red Cross in there from the start, from before the hurricane? Who made that decision? Were they asked to be there? Mayor announced use of Superdome as facility at noon on Sunday. What was the expectation of the Mayor for how long people would have to be there? What was the expectation for who was responsible for providing resources for provisions and evacuation? Coast Guard was Johnny on the Spot. Who called them? Who coordinated that?   Clearly it was never possible for local resources to handle the scope of the needs even just at the Superdome without outside assistance (or at least clear to me. Is that self-evident or not?) Local police were considerably overwhelmed: 1,000 police officers on the force, with approximately 100,000 people left in city, NOT counting the Superdome and Convention Center.  EACH AND EVERY ONE of those people needed either rescue, medical help, evacuation, or to be handcuffed and put in jail, WWAY beyond the scope of local officials. Some of those officials were initially stranded as well, and then later some deserted. How many STATE Natl Guard went to NOLA, as opposed to other areas of Louisiana, other counties? Sheriffs Dept also needed to secure jails and make sure there weren't jail breaks. (Where are THEY now, by the way? They were camping on that overpass in handcuffs for days. Now what? Presumably the jail is in the same condition is was before.)

              CONVENTION CENTER filled up after flooding began, I presume. Local officials had knowledge, presumably, that it was being used. Were they expected to communicate this need to Fed officials? Press was reporting on existence of need there starting when? Tuesday?

              Where was central search and rescue command post and who was in charge of that? Honore? When did Honore arrive? What exactly is the scope of his responsibility? Just NOLA? Does he command Coast Guard too? Does he command STATE National Guard as well asWho was he reporting to? Was HE responsible for reporting on existence of and needs at the Convention Center as well, since presumably he was Fed Man in Charge in NOLA? Did he? Did it go unheeded?

              FEMA is not in charge of security, I presume, but is in charge of provisions, along with Red Cross, but can't go where it's not secure. Who tells Red Cross where to go and when?

              PROBLEM: NOLA not secured after hurricane
              CAUSE: Not enough security personnel to handle it. No leadership?
              RESPONSIBLE: Louisiana Gov called in STATE Natl Guard. How many were there? Clearly not enough. FED NATL GUARD - many offers came in, apparently paper didn't go through. When did it finally come?  Friday with the President's press junket, or where there more before that? How many STATE National Guard w/ equip, if any, are in Iraq? Did that have an effect? Clearly (to me) there was no leadership in NOPD. Can you imagine desertions of police officers under William Bratton? Doubtful, but still only my opinion and assumption. However, presumably personal issues with family members missing and security as well as communications breakdowns were factors. Stories of abuse and negligence and disregard for the emotional state of evacuees on the part of police officers around the Superdome and Convention Center were also evident.

              What are examples of timelines for other national guard deployments? How fast?

              Were there different people responsible for rescue and evacuation? Coast Guard and others left people who had been evacuated from rooftops and homes on overpasses and piers, and then nobody came to get them causing possibly hundreds of fatalities as they waited. Was the Coast Guard responsible for communicating need for evacuation and specific info about urgency based on medical conditions of specific groups of people? To whom? Who then was responsible for further evacuation?

              PROBLEM: Hospitals not evacuated in timely manner
              CAUSE: ?  Not enough help came
              RESPONSIBLE:?  Clearly above the capabilities of local resources. Coast Guard?

          •  We have a wiki here already (none / 0)

            With a Katrina section, among others. dKosopedia
    •  How about an accountability list? (4.00 / 3)

      Has anybody started compiling a list of answers or gaps in answers to questions like:

      - How many LOUISIANA State National Guard were deployed (deployable by Gov Blanco without waiting for feds) vs. those deployed from elsewhere? How many went to NOLA to secure city, and how many went elsewhere?

      _ Which entity/agency/accountable leader was responsible for evacuation AFTER search and rescue dropped people on overpasses and piers, etc?

      • Who exactly was/is responsible for where Red Cross goes?

      • Is Honore in charge of Coast Guard, Police and National guard? Is he also responsible for communicating to FEMA? Who exactly is he reporting to?

      etc
      •  Honore is not in Charge of Coasties (4.00 / 3)

        The USCG has it own command and control structure, basically they answer to no one.  Not the Army, Navy, Air Force, National Guard, not even the FAA.  They have their mission, the mission is always the same, protect lives, secure navigation, protect property.  They may coordinate with other units, but they are never under the command of anyone else.  
        •  ok (4.00 / 2)

          So that brings me to the question of how they decide where to go first, and when they drop people off on some pier, who is then responsible for the evacuation part? Who do they tell that to? I'm trying to figure out who exactly should have been responsible for making sure that those 100 people didn't die waiting on that pier.
          •  Not sure (none / 0)

            From what I've picked up, Monday Afternoon USCG was flying assessment flights, then communicating to State Emergency Response & FEMA the extent of the damage.  
            At this point the levee's were holding.  So they started with helo's on the barrier islands and later in the night they got the small boats in the flooded areas, south of the city.  At this point it was essentially nearest acessible high ground.  At one point they had to move a couple hundred from a high school shelter which had been a collection point but then began to flood.  
            The pier became a collection point.  I believe the intent was to get a ferry which had been displaced by the storm going to evacuate the people on the pier.  Whose responsibility, don't know, but I'll try to find out.  Late monday, the levee's collapsed, at this point resources were split and some moved into the city.
            The news release Monday evening stated 7 Helos flying rescue, later Monday evening I believe the small boats were out running rescue.  
            As far as where the boats and helo's were going, the statement said "numerous calls for assistance prioitized based on need".  This was night operations, so I'm pretty sure they were heading for locations they knew had victims.

            The press release, Tues Noon, reported 1200 saved overnight + 1000 Tuesday morning.  This point they also report victims with medical needs were going to the superdome, others to the nearest high spot.  First mention of coordination:

            "Coast Guard rescue boats, hazardous materials disposal teams, aids to navigation teams and Disaster Assistance Relief Teams are coordinating with local, state and federal agencies in land-based rescue efforts"

            Starting with a 5am briefing on Sept 2nd, the press releases start referring to "joint-agency" Rescue operations and references to FEMA.

            Cutters and larger craft were just starting to arrive from staging locations.  Helos still spread across entire affected area.  As SAR operations wound down in MS & AL helos and other craft moved to NO.  

            There was a post last week from the brother of LT Commander on boats in NO.  I'll try to find it.

            USCG Press Releases

        •  US Coast Guard is under Homeland Security (4.00 / 4)

          That might explain why the Coast Guard was so busy on Monday/Tuesday, plucking people off of roofs (something like 1200 rescued I believe on Tuesday) but then they were suddenly AWOL.

          Did Homeland Security also order them out because the city had to be first secured by the National Guard?

          I still can't get the image out of my head of the president's Thursday press conference where you can see two orange/white Coast Guard helicopters and their crews standing around in the background. My God, what must have been going through their minds?

          "[Republicans] swapped principle for power. They ended up with neither. They deserved to lose." --Alan Greenspan

          by lanshark on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 09:35:49 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Coast Guard (none / 0)

             "but then they were suddenly AWOL. "

            Really? Link, please? I thought they've been the only constant in this whole effort. The helicopter roof rescue footage has been non-stop since Monday night.

          •  Not AWOL just quietly doing their job (none / 1)

            New Orleans (New Orlean Station Destroyed) - 1200 Rescued by noon Tuesday
            Average about 1500 Tuesday & Wednesday
            Thursday they were able to bring in Larger Craft (Ferrys Barges Etc) By 8am Sun over 17,000 and still counting

            Station Mobile AL - (no real flooding so lower numbers, mostly medevac - Over 300 Monday night, about 800 total as of Saturday, Most of the Resouces moved to New Orleans area.

            They are part of DHS, but have an entrirely separate budget and command and control structure.

      •  Honore is in charge of the active duty military (4.00 / 3)

        The Admiral who is the Commander of the United States Northern Command (basically, he is Honore's boss) was in a press conference a little while ago.  He said that Lt.Gen. Honore is in charge of all of the active duty military, with the Governor being in charge of the National Guard, and the Governor and local officials being in charge of police and other state and local governmental operations.

        He also said, as Lt.Gen. Honore did earlier, that although he understood that the subject of federalizing the National Guard had been the subject of some discussion between the White House, Defense Department, Sec. Chertoff of DHS and Director Brown of FEMA, that he didn't think there was any particular need to have the National Guard federalized, and that the National Guard and state and local police were responsible for law enforcement, while the active duty forces were operating in support of the federal civilian authorities (namely, FEMA).

        As a practical matter, it sounds like Lt.Gen. Honore is a forceful enough guy that a lot of people who aren't formally reporting to him are sort of de facto reporting to him, but one thing the military is used to is having different reporting relationships for different purposes.

        I think that when the investigations finally take place, we're going to find out that a lot of the delay was attributable to some FEMA bureaucrats not being comfortable with National Guard reporting relationships that the active duty military found not to be a significant problem.

        "Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither liberty nor security." -Ben Franklin

        by leevank on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 09:35:25 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  helpful but still confused. (4.00 / 2)

          But I thought they hadn't even deployed active duty military yet until this weekend? Plus, the reports I've been hearing have been saying that he's "in charge of NOLA operations."
          •  He's in charge of NOLA operations for DoD (4.00 / 6)

            I think the distinction is that he's LEGALLY only in direct charge of the active duty military personnel, but when a 3-star General tells a Colonel or somebody of lower rank (active duty or non-federalized National Guard) to do something, they generally salute and do it, rather than say, "F*** you, you're not legally in my chain of command."

            It only becomes a problem if they have directly contrary orders from somebody who IS in their direct chain of command, and then only if things can't get promptly worked out.  Since it doesn't sound like either the Governor, or the LA National Guard commander, or anybody else in the National Guard chain of command has had a problem with the National Guard personnel following Honore's orders, as a practical matter, it's a non-problem.

            I'm a lawyer, and I've been involved in some cases involving the National Guard, and the relationship between the National Guard and the active duty military has always seemed a little screwy to my lawyer brain.  But all of the military personnel I've ever talked to, both National Guard and active duty, tell me that's it's virtually never a problem in the real world, which is maybe because the military folks (even the JAG officers) are more attuned to actually accomplishing a mission than worrying about precisely who is legally responsible for what.

            Here's my theory:  Chertoff, the head of DHS, is a lawyer.  Brown, the head of FEMA, is a lawyer (when he's not a horse show administrator).  My hunch is that Chertoff and Brown were dithering around trying to get all of the legal niceties worked out, while the National Guard and active duty military were waiting for orders that never came while the lawyers were trying to solve a problem that didn't exist.

            I've always thought that the head of FEMA should in normal circumstances be a recently retired top-ranking general or admiral who is used to dealing with crises, dealing with logistics, and giving orders -- and if it's not somebody with that background, it should be somebody with as similar a background to that as you can get in the civilian sector.  The LAST occupational qualification I'd look for in a Director of FEMA is a law degree, and as I told some of my friends when Chertoff was appointed, that's also the last qualification I'd look for in a Secretary of Homeland Security.  It might not be an absolute disqualification, but it would come close -- and I say that as somebody who has spent nearly 28 years of my life practicing law.  I think I could count on the fingers of my hands the number of lawyers I've met who think the way a Sec. of DHS or a Director of FEMA should think, and with all due respect to estate lawyers, NONE of them have been estate lawyers, who tend to obsess (with good reason) over the legalities of dotting every "i" and crossing every "t."  

            "Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither liberty nor security." -Ben Franklin

            by leevank on Mon Sep 05, 2005 at 10:32:49 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  People on the ground need and want a commander (4.00 / 2)

          And Hornoree is that guy.  He might have authority over everyone, but if he can tell them where to go to be of most and best use, they'll follow his orders willingly.
        •  I heard the press conference and I thought it (4.00 / 7)

          was very important.

          The Admiral was asked how federalizing the operation would help. His response was that it would make NO DIFFERENCE in their operations although he knew it was a big point of debate between the Pres, VP, Chertoff, Rummy, and Gonzalez.

          That is what they were debating for days while people were dying. No additional actions from the Governor was required for the help from the Feds. They just argued over stupid bureaucratic details while people died.

          He just blew away their excuse for blaming this disaster on the Governor. He also showed that the battle was at the very top of the Administration.  

          Thanks, Admiral.

          Thanks, Admiral.