NPR diva Diane Rehm was superb today. The show was an update on Iraq and good discussion of potential policy solutions for the disaster. From the show's
home page:
Ivo Daalder, senior fellow in foreign policy studies at the Brookings Institution, former director for European Affairs for the National Security Council, and co-author of "America Unbound: The Bush Revolution in Foreign Policy" (Brookings, Nov 2003)
Thomas Donnelly, resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute and author of "The Military We Need: The Defense Requirements of the Bush Doctrine" (AEI Press)
Zbigniew Brzezinski, counselor at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, professor of foreign policy at The Johns Hopkins University, and author of eight previous books, including "The Grand Failure" and "The Grand Chessboard."
Yes, that's the Zbigniew Brzezinski, and the A.E.I. Brzezinski enters at time stamp 13:30 and is must-hear radio. Highlights after the fold.
I wish pundits of every stripe would take a lesson from DR on how to foster discussion and explore ideas. She asks great questions ("Do you think this administration and the American people have the stomach for that kind of commitment?" "What happens if the us does not put that kind of a force on the ground?"), including follow ups, and I've heard her say, "Now wait a minute," several times.
DR: What are the options in Iraq at this point?
ZB: This is not yet a civil war, the sectarian violence is localized. (The other commenters later debate the civil war/sectarian violence question at about 35:30.) He sees this as an opportunity and offers a specific plan on how to use the current situation to get the U.S. out within a year.
We will all disagree with parts of his proposal, but it is far, far superior to "Stay the Course." Hear DR's question at 17:00 about whether "staying the course" is going to be more or less damaging than all out civil war. ZB answers with a detailed analysis of sectarian balance of power. This is the kind of complexity and analysis we need in the public debate and in the White House. (ZB says, "I cannot dogmatically assert that I am right, but I am fairly confident that..." How refreshing is that??) "Stay the course," my ass!
Timestamp 18:15--DR: What about the chance for a development of an Iraqi national army? ZB: I think that's a joke. It's a US arrangement for compromise of a sort that literally ignores the reality on the ground.There will not be a national army because the Kurds won't join it (because they don't need to), the shiites have well armed militias that are not going to disarm.
19:30--DR: Many people have said that setting a deadline is too risky, but you disagree. ZB: It's risky, but we have to consider the costs of this continued misadventure....We have destroyed american legitimacy...destroyed morality...killing lots of Iraqis, helping to devastate the country...rising hostility toward America.
20:30--ZB: "I'm amazed, really amazed that there isn't more outrage in America" at the revelation that Bush and Blair 3 months before the war started concluded there were no WMD...he has been misleading the country knowingly. And worse, that the U.S. provides some deliberate provocation to start the war.
22:25-- DR: Is the president's group of advisors too narrow? ZB: Yes, there's no strategic diversity, and there's a tendency on the part of those he trusts the most to reinforce his instincts and even his deepest held beliefs which have a curiously, almost religious dogmatism to them.
27:07--DR: The president continues to speak of victory or defeat. Is that a helpful way for us as Americans to look at what is happening? ZB: I think the way he frames it is very intersting because not long ago, we were proclaiming that the only outcome is victory. In fact we were claiming that we already have victory. (Remember "mission accomplished). Now we're saying "Victory of Defeat?"...
28:25: ZB: ...a prolonged but increasingly mindless engagement, which is continually getting worse.
28:54--DR: What about the Democrats? Why do you believe they have not come forward with a united plan [for Iraq]? ZB: They're clearly in default. It is, in fact, an appalling situation that they criticize the war but don't offer any alternatives. The reason is twofold: widespread fear that they'll be charged with letting our troops down. This has paralyzed them and shows they don't have much guts. Second, Bill Clinton would like his wife to be president, and he feels that a headon challenge to Bush would make it easier to attack Sen. Clinton. ...
And that's just the first 1/2 of the hour. DR, will you have my children?