Looking for a gung ho inventor

As many of you have read, Seattle and its environs continue to suffer the after effects of one of the worst storms on record.  Many homes remain without power, and residents who use gasoline powered generators or charcoal fired grills indoors are being hospitalized for carbon monoxide poisoning.  

I went to Eddie Bauer today and ordered a radio that is powered by cranking it.  Seattle has sold out, but there a few still on the shelves in one of their stores in MN.  While doing so, it occurred to me, that someone could build a generator that is powered by bicycling indoors which would have the benefit of 0 production of carbon monoxide, while adding the benefit of increasing one's stamina and overall health as a result.  I mentioned it on a diary talking about the Seattle storm, but think it is important enough to raise on its own.

More below the fold.

I can't tell you the number of health gyms I drive by and see folks working out on their exercise bicycles.  Perhaps you are laughing to yourself, saying how foolish. Well, it was not so foolish to a young British chap who powered the lights and media on his one man play, "The History of Oil," that you can see here:

http://video.google.com/...

Now, who can we contact to get this set in motion?  The Pacific NW is only the latest region of our country to be hit by a natural disaster which cancelled our electricity.  Even if this could only power a few lights at home, plus the electronic ignition for oil and gas furnaces, it would be very, very worthwhile.

Ideas, please.

•  How 'bout these

  from Erols

  from Green Trust

  Lots of DIY stuff out there, too.  Google "bicycle-powered generator."

  by Crashing Vor on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 11:50:04 AM PDT

  •  you link to prototypes

    which, while good, is not what I am envisioning.  Just as I walked into Eddie Bauer and purchased a hand crank radio, I would like to walk into Radio Shack, Home Depot or mom and pop hardware store and purchase a people powered generator with bike attached or that can be immediately hooked up to a bicycle.

    by moe99 on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:03:36 PM PDT

    •  You can hook up your exercise bicycle to

      your electric meter and it will run backwards while you sell electricity to the utility company.

      Just think if all those health and exercise places did the same and all those homes with kids and overweight adults.

      That doesn't solve an outtage problem though. I have lived a year in a cabin without running water, (we had )a wood stove to cook on, and no electricity. We had lots of candles picked up at yard sales and lots of mirrors on the walls to reflect. We played chess every evening after dinner. It was so easy to cook as we wiped our plates clean after eating, so no dishes to do.

      We dressed warm and wore moonboots. The cabin was not insulated.  And we made love every night as we went to bed early.

      I also used to read books in my car with the overhead light on. And then I got one of those little hi intensity battery ones for bed.

      by abbeysbooks on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 01:06:01 PM PDT

•  What is it that you

  want invented / built ?

  by indycam on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 11:50:32 AM PDT

  •  a bicycle powered generator

    for home when electricity fails or for storing when you exercise.

    by primrose on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 11:52:30 AM PDT

    •  That takes a hell of a lot of power

      You could probably put out 100 watts, but not for too long.  With LED lights (maybe compact fluorescents) you could read at night.  No TV, no toast, no hair dryer, no fridge (I assume--not sure how much power those use), no computer.

      by RequestedUsername on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:02:38 PM PDT

      •  You can

        have tv , toast , hair dryer , fridge or computer
        with human power .  Its not that hard .

        http://www.econvergence.net/...

        http://computer.howstuffworks.com/...

        http://www.los-gatos.ca.us/...

        by indycam on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:24:46 PM PDT

        •  Uh

          A toaster uses like a kilowatt.  Have you ever pedaled one of those generator bikes at a science museum?  I can make a single 100 W bulb glow great, 2 good, 3 fair, 4 poor and 5 you  can just tell it's on.  And I can sustain that for no more than a few seconds.  Granted, I'm not in shape, but I doubt the typical homeowner is going to be making toast that way.

          (You can get hyper-efficient appliances [though probably not a toaster], but the question was about inventing a bike generator to power a regular house, not inventing a house that could be powered by a bike generator.)

          by RequestedUsername on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:29:51 PM PDT

          •  I have taken myself up to the top

            of some large mountains .
            I have done 100+ miles in a day .
            You could pedal that science museum bike till you have the battery filled , then turn on the toaster and toast away .
            How long it takes to fill the battery is up to you .
            If you take the battery out of the system , you will need to run a lower wattage toaster over a long time to get the job done .
            If you start from "it can't be done" , you really aren't going to get it done .

            If you like I will bet you some real money that I can toast some bread till its black and or burning .
            Just let me know how much you would like to pay .

            by indycam on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:47:28 PM PDT

            •  Put your bike up on blocks, attach 5-6 bicycle

              magnetos that run the headlight/taillight to the wheels, then connect the output to about 6 car batteries. Buy a 1KW inverter (converts 12VDC to 110VAC). Next, pedal your ass off charging those car batteries whenever you can. When the power goes off, plug a power strip into the inverter and lights, TV, and toaster into the power strip. Don't use your tongue to test for current.

              by skrymir on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 01:15:39 PM PDT

            •  Oh well, BATTERIES

              With facts you can prove anything even remotely true.

              by RequestedUsername on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 01:58:45 PM PDT

              •  Snark ? nt

                by indycam on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 02:15:09 PM PDT

          •  It's time for wood and pellet stoves for heating

            and cooking. Pellet stoves use sawdust pellets for fuel (waste product) and wood for free is not hard to come by but does take labor to fetch and cut. And your uninsulated house is very warm with wood.

            I used one of those Bucket a Day Ben Franklin coal stoves in Philly in Northern Liberties in the 70's and it was great. Very warm.

            A wood back-up at least is necessary.

            by abbeysbooks on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 01:10:00 PM PDT

            •  Wood or pellets

              I like the idea of pellets and pellet stoves - there is plenty of wood waste to manufacture pellets, they have higher energy density than plain wood, and the stoves are very efficient.

              However, the pellet stoves I've seen require electricity to operate (to feed the pellets), and having just gone 60 hours without electricity, some of it with outside temps in the single digits, I'm glad we have a wood stove.

              by badger on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 01:23:33 PM PDT

              •  Don't they use glue to hold pellets together?

                That is, toxic stuff that you'd be putting in atmosphere (hint, and falling on ground of your place)?

                by AllisonInSeattle on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 03:36:53 PM PDT

                •  Not sure

                  There may be several different processes for manufacturing pellets, and I don't really know the details of any of them.

                  If they're in fact made from sawdust. they probably require some kind of binder, and I'd wonder what that is. However, I was talking to a BLM forester not too long ago about the amount of wood waste that already exists or would be created by forest restoration projects, and the subject of pellets came up.

                  There's a logging company in W WA that has a pellet plant on three flatbed trailers. They can haul it to some location where wood is available and end up shipping the finished pellets instead of trees, which is more economical and less energy intensive. The process seems to involve heating the tree (maybe after some sawing or other processing) which separates the fibers somehow, and then compressing the resultant into pellets - no glue involved it seemed. It also seemed to me from the discussion that they needed the entire tree (although small trees would be usable), and I don't know if they can use a lot of what currently turns into waste, like limbs.

                  That said, it seems to me that making pellets still requires a lot more energy than simply cutting logs for firewood, or processing forest waste by shredding it (which can use almost 100% of the material - limbs, twigs, needles, brush, etc.). There are a couple of projects going on right now using shredded forest waste for institutional heating, and even one to replace coal for generating electricity.

                  In terms of CO2 production, that's no different than any other kind of biofuel process/use, and probably uses the biomass more efficiently than making diesel out of it.

                  However, for home heating, pellets are easier to distribute than other forms of wood, they have higher energy density, they're cleaner (in terms of ash, or just the mess a wood stove invariably makes), and most wood pellet stoves will burn shelled corn too. My understanding is that pellet stoves are fairly popular in some Scandanavian countries, and used more in the eastern US than in the west.

                  by badger on Tue Dec 19, 2006 at 10:01:40 AM PDT

      •  Not if you have...

        enough cats at your disposal.  Dangle a little catnip in front of them and harness them up to a treadmill...

        Power for hours and more fun than watching TV...;)

        by cometman on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:45:33 PM PDT

•  Air conditioning

  I wonder why they can't use the power generated by the bicyclists in these gyms for the air conditioning.  And the more energy you generate the lower your monthly gym costs would be...

  A good idea to have our own ability to power our homes and loose weight at the same time.

  by primrose on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 11:50:50 AM PDT

•  I noted with interest your reference...

  to health clubs.

  Where I live, we rarely have any storms that knock out power. However, there’s a horrible strain on the system due to sprawl. As a result, we suffer frequent (albeit short) outages.

  At my local gym, when we have these everyone scrambles to grab one of the bikes because they are powered by the peddler. Try working out on a treadmill when the power is flickering on and off every two minutes!

  by The Eyewitness Muse on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 11:53:37 AM PDT

•  I'm a gung-ho inventor

  In fact, I got an idea for an invention the other day when I hit my head on the toilet. It's called the flux capacitor. I dunno, I think it may be a dead end.

  by droogie6655321 on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:08:44 PM PDT

  •  You'd need a pretty powerful energy source

    to make it work--most of the flux capacitors already on the market require 1.21 jigawatts, either nuclear or lightning-based...

    by CalvinTheBold on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:26:11 PM PDT

    •  Heh

      "I'm sure that by the 1980s, plutonium is available at any corner drug store, but here in 1955, it's pretty hard to come by!"

      by droogie6655321 on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:33:00 PM PDT

    •  Dilithium Crystals! They worked just fine on Star

      Trek for a power source. Just go down to the power crystal store and ask for Bob - he'll give you a good price. Tell him I sent you.

      by skrymir on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 01:18:38 PM PDT

      •  Bobs

        your uncle ?

        by indycam on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 01:27:42 PM PDT

•  human energy consumption?

  I've often thought of this as well, but I always wonder what the REAL benefits might be. I imagine the human body is probably a bit (at least!) more efficient when it comes to converting our food energy into motion (more than, say, a combustion energy), without any of the obvious....erm..."emissions". But how efficient is it really? Anyone have any numbers?

  How does the energy put into growing, packaging, and distributing the two cans of beans (arbitrary number) needed to give us the energy to pedal for hours compare to that of, say, the same tiny amount of gasoline that would give us the same output?

  There's so much to factor, too...especially when it comes to the production of the said beans (for example!). And, no doubt, a more efficient production plant would probably require less energy and produce less pollution than a smaller one, since it's probably more centralized and streamlined. Same goes for oil, which has an enormous infrastructure set up to mine, refine, and distribute.

  by milkmit on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:11:56 PM PDT

  •  well I don't know about beans...

    but since I have a can of chunky soup in my drawer I looked at it and it has a total of 220 calories in the can.  That's equivalent to 92kJ of energy.  (Note that food calories are not the same as other 'calories' used in thermodynamics)  Gasoline provides 48kJ of energy per gram of gasonline so the energy equivalent of a can of chunky soup would be about 2 grams of gasoline (roughly about a shot glass full of gasoline).

    The waste products resulting from the consumption and conversion of chunky's soup to energy are carbon dioxide, urea, along with the obvious solid waste.  All 3 waste products are nutrient sources for most plants (the urea in particular is rich in nitrogen) which, when combined with sunlight, provides energy for plants.  A beautiful symbiotic relationship when you look at it.  Each group provides energy for it's counterpart and nothing is wasted.

    The waste products of gasoline combustion are too long to list here and so technical in nomenclature that I can't name them off the top of my head.  Throw into that diesel exhaust as well and you're talking about close to a hundred different toxic compounds.

    The reality of a bicycle powered generator seems sort of ridiculous to me.  For essentials yes, but to power A/C, television, computer just doesn't seem like a rational idea.  Solar and wind power is much more practical for such a task.

    I once heard that the cost of the Iraq war was enough to hook every house in the US up to solar panels.  Don't know if that's true but if it is then that's just so very sad!

    by pullbackthecurtain on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:57:06 PM PDT

    •  Iraq & solar panels

      WOW. That's incredibly, incredibly sad... If true (I'm going to try to do a bit of amateur number crunching myself), I only wish so much resources and will would be put into something so useful and productive in our lifetimes. THAT is what the Dems need: a modern equivalent to JFK's pledge to land a man on the moon.

      Thanks for that bit of info!

      by milkmit on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 01:26:29 PM PDT

•  can't vouch for...

  here's one (haven't tried it)

  here's one

  As a longtime (though not current) liveaboard, I recall seeing several of these, though it would take more hunting time than I have today for the net.  I do recall that the max output was about 120-180 watts, that is to say about a 10 AH charge on a 12 volt battery -- so you're looking at several hours for lights and radio.  

  You might want to check out the wind power sites.  The whisper 500 is a scaled up land version which can dump 3kw into the storage system, albeit by the time you've got it set up, you're looking at $10K USD or more, for generator, a big pile of 8D cells, regulator, and inverter:

  whisper

  I took the trouble to put my boat before last on a power diet -- fully self contained, at least in theory, for 30AH a day in -- and it was a heap of work to make sure that each day's budget did not exceed supply.  

  Good luck!

  by jessical on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:17:35 PM PDT

•  Thirty year old movie scene...

  That's in the first five minutes of Soylent Green--sorry, but Edward G. Robinson holds the patent!

  by MrMichaelMT on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 12:32:12 PM PDT

•  On a slightly related note

  At a gym I used to go to, a local YMCA branch, I would often see men in the cleanup area running tap water like it's going out of style. It truly bugs me to see someone brushing their teeth, standing there with toothbrush in the mouth, and a full-blast stream of water coming out of the tap right down the drain. How many minutes does one man let that tap run, with how many gallons of fresh water being wasted...back into the sewer system to be recycled, cleaned, etc.

  People act like resources are "free" when they pay the bills only indirectly.

  I just hate pure, 100%, serves-no-purpose waste like that. I do apologize for not having the guts to at least say something on any of the many times I observed this atrocious behavior.

  And don't even get me started on the guys who go through 7 or 8 towels in a single session. Those are the ones who never even work up a sweat. Not that they're using any of those towels to wipe down the equipment they touch...

  by kensa on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 02:03:31 PM PDT

•  Did anyone else try Google?

  There's 1,250,000 hits for Bicycle Generator. Of course many of those would be for generator lights for bikes., but the first page has some for what the diarist is after.

  Rodale published a book with plans for one, and how to hook up a bunch of household appliances to it. It described having the kids power the TV. The book is out of print, but may be available through a used book dealer.

  by Halcyon on Mon Dec 18, 2006 at 03:25:11 PM PDT