Israelis caught lying again. This time they're training the Kurdish military

What a shock. Once again, the Israelis are caught by the BBC doing what they've been denying for years, and things the "axis of evil" has been saying are true, are... true.

The BBC has obtained evidence that Israelis have been giving military training to Kurds in northern Iraq.

A report on the BBC TV programme Newsnight showed Israeli experts in northern Iraq, drilling Kurdish militias in shooting techniques...

...Iran and Syria, which have long accused the Kurds of allowing the Israelis to operate on Iraqi territory, will most likely demand an explanation from the government in Baghdad.

The Israeli government says it is conducting an investigation into the BBC report because it is against Israeli law to export military know-how without prior permission...

I'm sure this won't make our situation there any worse, especially since the Isralis have also been charged with teaching our spooks how to torture Arabs properly. Caution: More Snark after the flip...

Of course this was no secret, "the closest thing journalism has to a terrorist", Sy Hersh, wrote all about this in June of 2004:

..Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's government decided, I was told, to minimize the damage that the war was causing to Israel's strategic position by expanding its long-standing relationship with Iraq's Kurds and establishing a significant presence on the ground in the semi-autonomous region of Kurdistan. Several officials depicted Sharon's decision, which involves a heavy financial commitment, as a potentially reckless move that could create even more chaos and violence as the insurgency in Iraq continues to grow

Israeli intelligence and military operatives are now quietly at work in Kurdistan, providing training for Kurdish commando units and, most important in Israel's view, running covert operations inside Kurdish areas of Iran and Syria...

I'm sure that's not true either. Because a) that would be an act of war, and b) because they say so:

Asked to comment, Mark Regev, the spokesman for the Israeli Embassy in Washington, said, "The story is simply untrue and the relevant governments know it's untrue." Kurdish officials declined to comment, as did a spokesman for the State Department...

Obviously it's just another case of the Press being antisemitic, like they were when they exposed the Israeli lies about their nuclear weapons, their chemical weapons, their use of poison gas, and on ond on.

I wish the BBC would realize that Israel is the only democracy in that region and that they're with us, so they're OK. They need to be able to lie with impunity, and calling them on it just encourages terrorism. Unlike sending Israelis into Iraq.

Send your letters to BBC, and watch the congressional condemnation of this latest antisemitism.

Updated to say "press" instead of BBC. My bad.

•  tip jar

  Can't say we weren't warned when the war starts with Iran.

  by racerx on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:36:04 AM PDT

•  The Kurds are the good guys

  so why is this so bad?  and please link or otherwise support your statement the BBC exposed Israeli lies about chemical weapons and poison gas.

  by dhonig on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:41:34 AM PDT

  •  Well

    The official US and world position is that Iraq is a state, so arming and training one faction in the brewing civil war is likely contributing to it's collapse.  

    As for the Kurds being "the good guys," that's kind of absurd.  They are just one interest group, much like any other.  The Arab's in Kirkuk who have been driven out by Kurds don't view the Kurds as good guys (though Kurds point out that many Arabs were move in by Saddam in the 80s to control Kirkuk better).  The Turkomen in many of the northern towns don't view the Kurds as good guys.

    Israel is operating under a plan to build allies, and really to weaken any potentially strong and hostile government in the Arab or Muslim world.  As such, Israel sees an interest in forces of disunity in Iraq, especially if those forces could also sow disunity later in Iran.  Thus, Israel is working at cross-purposes to anyone who is working to stablize Iraq and keep it as one country.

    by weasel on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:47:14 AM PDT

    •  Why don't...

      ...the Kurds deserve an independent state?

      by JPhurst on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:49:39 AM PDT

      •  Destabalize

        If contained to what is now Iraq, that wouldn't be a problem.  But the Kurds want a state that would include parts of Turkey and Iran.  That would be way to destabalizing.

        by Paleo on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:52:10 AM PDT

        •  Not the only problem

          They want Kirkuk. Kirkuk has a large Arab population that doesn't want to be "ethnically cleansed" from their homeland.

          But okay, let's take the position of partitioning Iraq into three. Well, since the Sunnis get no oil in that situation they have no choice but to resort to full-on civil war.

          But with 6600 dead in the last two months, maybe that wouldn't be a big change.

          by brainiacamor on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:05:15 AM PDT

      •  Is that the debate?

        Is that the debate we're having?  At the very least, it goes against the stated intentions of the US, UN, Iraq, and the Kurdish government themselves.  Further, the Kurds have a history of allying themselves with very untrustworthy sponsors.  

        The Israelis would certainly follow that model.  They are not there to help Kurds, but to prevent a strong Iraq and to fuck with Iran as well.  The Israelis would sell out the Kurds in a second if their tension with Iran came to an end, if they got a better deal with the Iraqi government, to protect their alliance with Turkey, or for any other reason that suits them.  

        So don't give me Kurdish independence crap.  Israeli commandos are certainly not the way to attain it.  Having US soldiers die in a possibly futile effort to hold Iraq together while our putative ally Israel works to pull it apart is enough to cause a little bile.

        by weasel on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:04:51 AM PDT

    •  You know, it wasn't long ago

      that many lefties vehemently supported the Kurds and the Kurdish desire for a homeland.

      What is one of the main charges against Saddam?  His gassing of the Kurds.

      From my understanding (I haven't been to "Kurdistan," only listened at symposiums or to others) many of Kurds have blondish hair and green eyes.

      Turkey has approved building a dam that will result in the destruction of a vast portion of the Kurdish area there in Turkey.

      Yet, here we are, many will disagree with this aid --simply because it is Israel.

      Our... constitutional heritage rebels at the thought of giving government the power to control men's minds. Thurgood Marshall

      by bronte17 on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 12:18:04 PM PDT

      •  Can't speak for anyone else but,

        objection to Israel's military aid to the Kurds makes sense seeing as how Iraqis and the Iraqi government don't like Israel and as of 9/21/06, a UN recognized Kurdistan does not exist. Iraqis don't like us either, but they for damn sure don't like Israel. Does the Iraqi gov't even recognize Israel? This kind of thing really makes things worse in Iraq and for Iraqis and for us.

        Not good...

        by callmecassandra on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 12:46:48 PM PDT

        •  Like I said, it's funny how things have changed

          now.

          If bush hadn't illegally invaded Iraq and occupied and destroyed that country, I'd bet you would be arguing that we should step up and help the Kurds  gain their freedom from under Saddam's yoke. That topic was on many many liberal lips for many many years.  

          The Kurds, the Zapatistas, the Palestinians.

          But, now you change your tune.

          Our... constitutional heritage rebels at the thought of giving government the power to control men's minds. Thurgood Marshall

          by bronte17 on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 05:04:19 PM PDT

          •  Don't generalize.

            I'm not 'you', I'm Cassandra.

            What does Israel arming Kurds have to do with Kurd's liberation from Iraq? Did I somehow make mention that Kurds shouldn't seek liberation from Iraq? I would no more say that about the Kurds than I would about the Palestinians...But just as you may object to Palestinians receiving weapons from Iraq under Saddam or Iran, I have the same problem with Kurds receiving weapons from Israel.

            It's not good...both Kurds and Palestinians are being used by regional powers and it's only the Kurds and Palestinians who will suffer for it, not Israel and not Iran, neither governments care about the welfare of the Kurds or the Palestinians (note that I said governments). So yes of course, I object. And what Israel is doing now re arming the Kurds will make things worse in Iraq. That's a fact and has nothing to do with whether one believes Kurds should or shouldn't have their own state.

            by callmecassandra on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 06:29:01 PM PDT

            •  Ah, well, I won't invoke your name

              but it isn't as insulting as "you" let on.

              And, hold your pretensions close.  It will make you feel good.

              I have to move on now in the real world.

              Our... constitutional heritage rebels at the thought of giving government the power to control men's minds. Thurgood Marshall

              by bronte17 on Fri Sep 22, 2006 at 08:22:38 AM PDT

              •  No pretensions.

                Just truth. You don't have to like it, but it'll still be there in the morning.

                Come by anytime you want more...

                by callmecassandra on Fri Sep 22, 2006 at 09:13:25 AM PDT

  •  Begs the question

    That begs the question of whether the Israelis should be doing it.

    by Paleo on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:52:55 AM PDT

  •  Depends

    It depends on which Kurdish group they are training.  The PKK is a Kurdish group recognized by the US as a terrorist group that has been operating inside Turkey and Iran.

    by Brother Maynard on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:54:08 AM PDT

    •  The term, "terrorist," is now a propaganda ploy..

      which brings alleged enemies, Washington's mostly, under the cloak of the war on terrorism. When history gets written, we will all eventually find out that the war on terrorism was largely a right wing conservative fabrication. For the most part, Al Qaeda ceased to be operational after the Northern Alliance, with the help of our airforce, conquered Afganistan. Pretty much it has been small groups of independent radicals that have continued terrorist activity, as in Spain and Britain, largely on their own.

      War on terrorism: the great political tool Rove didn't invent. It fell into their laps.

      by shergald on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:50:18 AM PDT

  •  You still believe in good guys

    and the tooth fairy???

    by curmudgiana on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:48:16 AM PDT

•  The Israeli poison gas attacks?

  You're bringing up that tripe?

  Oh, spare me.  This is garbage.

  by Jay Elias on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 10:55:29 AM PDT

  •  Wait Jay, wait

    I'm SURE the diarist can support his statement, or it would not have been written.  Don't you think?

    ...   tap tap tap   ...    ...    ...

    by dhonig on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:04:02 AM PDT

    •  You'll find it covered...

      ...on the "we have nothing to do with Pat Buchanan, honest!" antiwar.com site.

      by Jay Elias on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:05:07 AM PDT

      •  screw both of you

        everyone knows how you are. You're as bad as Republicans apologizing for Bush.

        I listed several things they have lied about, and you go after the one that hasn't been totally 100% documented. Yeah, that proves that Israel isn't a criminal regime.

        Well it has been documented, by people you like to impugn, and maybe it will never be proven to your satisfaction.

        There are other examples:

        The Washington Post of 14 April 1988 concluded that there appears to be:
        ... much evidence indicating that on numerous occasions soldiers and police have violated the manufacturer's printed warning by firing the gas into enclosed areas such as rooms or small courtyards.

        And it gets worse than that, of course.

        And what was in El Al flight 1862?

        editors Harm van den Berg and Karel Knip of the prestigious Dutch daily NRC Handelsblad provided their readers with incontrovertible documentation that LY1862 was transporting three of the four components required for the manufacture of Sarin nerve gas.

        With all the other examples of Israeli duplicity and subterfuge standing there pointing in the same direction, it's pretty easy to see who's full of shit here.

        by racerx on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:41:42 AM PDT

        •  Yeah..

          ...funny, you repeat bullshit, and then you are taken less seriously by people.

          Beyond that, I defy you to show where I've suggested that Israel does not use duplicity and subterfuge.  I'm not pretending Israel is sanctified, or always right.  I'm saying you're repeating not only garbage, but the worst sort of scurrilous garbage that is too thin for it even to make it onto a serious site.

          Everyone knows how I am, that's right.  What's nice about that is that more people who are reasonably open-minded will trust me than you.  Because I don't post bullshit, unsubstatiated claims of nations using poison gas against civilians.  Funny how that will happen.

          by Jay Elias on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:47:39 AM PDT

        •  Screw me? Screw you!

          You said this:

          Obviously it's just another case of the Press being antisemitic, like they were when they exposed the Israeli lies about their nuclear weapons, their chemical weapons, their use of poison gas, and on ond on.

          I asked you to support your statement.  Instead, you attacked personally, and provided out of context quotes from propaganda organs.  By the way, for anybody reading, the Washington Post quote about was about TEAR GAS used to quell riots during the intifada.

          The whole I-P debate has plenty of blame to go around.  It doesn't need made up crimes, and it doesn't need fools sputtering personal attacks out of frustration for the inability to support their own inanities.

          by dhonig on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 12:09:37 PM PDT

          •  tell ya what

            Sit in a room filled with "non chemical weapon" tear gas, and after that suck on this

            From Israel and Chemical/Biological Weapons:
            History, Deterrence, and Arms Control by AVNER COHEN

            A near-consensus exists among experts— based on anecdotal evidence and intelligence leaks—that Israel developed, produced, stockpiled, and perhaps even deployed CW [chemical weapons]...

            ...The issue of BW [biological weapons] is more politically sensitive than CW, not only because BW are far more lethal, but also because Israel has presumably employed biological or toxin weapons for special operations...

            by racerx on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 01:19:27 PM PDT

            •  a fighting retreat

              what a putz.  you've gone from "poison gas" to tear gas (while carefully snipping a quote to hide the whole truth), and somehow you still sound aggressive and self-righteous.  wouldn't it be easier to just admit you were full of shit?  

              by dhonig on Fri Sep 22, 2006 at 06:11:28 AM PDT

          •  The funniest line today

            I listed several things they have lied about, and you go after the one that hasn't been totally 100% documented.

            Well, um, yeah -- document something and people will believe you.  Don't and they won't.  As we say in Brooklyn, "Ya gotta problem wit' dat?"  

            Of course, even a well documented argument is undercut by Israelophobic raving about a "criminal regime."

            by richter on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 01:31:27 PM PDT

•  Is it government sanctioned

  or are some citizens working for contractors? I'm not sure that's any violation.

  by McGirk on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:12:47 AM PDT

  •  Good point...

    ...even Juan Cole, who never passes up an attempt to take a swipe at Israel, recognizes this.  If it's a contractor that has hired some former Israeli soldiers to do training, that's a world of difference from the Israeli government cooperating with the Kurdish leaders.

    I believe Iraq, unfortunately, still has its rather hateful laws on the books which forbid Israelis from entering the country.  So it probably is illegal to simply have them in the country, even if not sanctioned by the government.  But again, it's not nearly the same issue.

    by JPhurst on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:17:51 AM PDT

    •  Illegal under Israeli law

      The scoop the BBC got was to obtain film of the Israeli trainers. The existence of the training sessions themselves were revealed in an Israei newspaper - hence the reference to the possible attack on Iran using the airfield to refuel on the way back having to be abandoned.

      The Israeli government spokesman who actually managed to keep a straight face claimed that the contract was being investigated as it was illegal for Israelis to conduct business with Iraq. That's why their passports were not stamped.

      There was a long report on this in Tuesday's Newsnight programme - not available at the moment but should be in either the weekly summary or the video podcast of the programme.
      http://news.bbc.co.uk/...

      by londonbear on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:46:44 AM PDT

      •  If it's illegal under Israel's law

        wouldn't that be in order to keep Israel's military tactics and training secret? I would think that's the idea behind it. If these people are doing so, they're defying Israel rather than doing anything sketchy on the governments behalf.

        by McGirk on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 02:29:22 PM PDT

    •  Juan Cole

      If you don't like the truth, you don't have to read his books or his blog. What "knowing" American can support Israel's treatment of the Palestinians, and their disingenuous not-so-hidden attempt to colonialize the West Bank? Read the "Letter from 18 Writers." Juan Cole is not among them, but which one do you have problems with? Before you answer, let's see you creditials.

      by shergald on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:55:58 AM PDT

•  BBC being antisemitic?

  This is a case of the Israeli PR machine being unable to bring Britain and the BBC under the propaganda veil that now covers the USA. It is likely due to its proximity to the rest of Europe and its freedom to monitor Middle East events without having to get it from the Israeli government or the Israel Defense Forces, from a pretty uniformed young woman. Unfortunately, the Israelis have been unable to figure out that it takes cleavage to distract most Americans, and there have been cracks forming in the PR machine in the US.

  Still, this story will not make the MSM news in America. We still have blogs, however.

  by shergald on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:43:19 AM PDT

•  It can't just be the anti-semitic BBC

  reporting this, since the story was in Ha'aretz http://www.haaretz.com/...
  yesterday.

  by curmudgiana on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 11:47:08 AM PDT

  •  Haaretz is antiSemitic.

    Just kidding curmudgiana, but I can assure you that if you should repeat its stories and editorials, you will surely be labeled an antiSemite, by right wing extremist religious radicals, at least.

    by shergald on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 12:00:04 PM PDT

    •  The attachment of rightwing extremists to truth

      is tenuous, at best.

      by curmudgiana on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 12:53:09 PM PDT

•  That "anti-Semitic" reference is asinine

  Nowhere do you cite anyone who remotely suggests anti-Semitism is playing a role in the coverage of this story.  Thus your comment is not snarky -- it's just stupid... although in all fairness, you are not the only Kossack who feels a rather bizarre need to respond to charges of anti-Semitism that exist only in your head.

  by richter on Thu Sep 21, 2006 at 12:34:13 PM PDT