Palestinian Morality Police

I don't have a favorite religion.   I'm not a fan of any of them.   When people ask me why I point to things like this.

"Are you Muslim or not?" one officer asked the sullen waiter, who'd been picked up for smoking in public during the daily fast for the Muslim holy month of Ramadan. "When I see you eating or smoking, it is shameful."

Officer?  Do the cops normally question your religion?  Sure thing!  Wait until you see the new show "Morality Cops" (bad boys, bad boys, whatcha gonna do when you burn in hell?)

"Tell your boss that tomorrow, the first thing we are going to do is close down his restaurant," warned the second interrogator, who was wearing a thick red armband that read "Morality Police."

The Morality Police have come to the Palestinian Authority. Only the charge isn't being led by hard-liners from the militant Islamist Hamas movement, as many once feared, it's being spearheaded by the secular Fatah party as part of its campaign to undermine growing support for Hamas in the West Bank.

The Morality Police?   I bet George Orwell wish he thought of that one.  Now some critics might say there is nothing wrong with enforcing the law.  This has nothing to do with religion.  Like this member of the morality police.

"Morality is part of the public order," said Murad Qundah, the 27-year-old police captain who heads the new 10-person unit. "We are not a religious police."

Launched two weeks ago to coincide with the beginning of Ramadan, Morality Police foot patrols already have arrested nearly two dozen Palestinians for smoking or drinking in public when they were supposed to be fasting.

Supposed to be fasting.  Sez who?

My apologies if this has been diaried before but I hadn't heard of it until today.   I bet James Dobson is jealous.  And angry.  I'll save my thoughts Dr. Dobson for another time when i do some shower blogging.

•  It's interesting that secular Pan-Arabism

  seems to have gone the way of the horse-and-buggy.  They may have had some truly scummy, vicious leaders, but so do the Islamists, and the former at least understood the pleasures of a cigar and a scotch.

  by burrow owl on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 05:47:56 PM PDT

  •  That's politics

    It's as Palestinian as humus and ful.  With a side of labneh.

    by mbayrob on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 05:56:02 PM PDT

•  Deserves a rec for the Dobson jealousy comment,

  if nothing else.  That is Exactly what this entire admin wanted to accomplish here.  But We Will Foil Them.  

  by gustynpip on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 05:53:57 PM PDT

•  No ruder than Bill O'Really

  Having lived in Israel, this is certainly no ruder than the sorts of things that happen between secular and religious Jews in Israel.  And a lot less rude than most of what comes out of Bill O'Reilly's mouth when he's on his annual "War On Christmas" binge.

  Yeah, from our point of view it would be nice if the police weren't involved.  But that's for the Palestinian authorities to decide.

  Kind of a non-story.

  by mbayrob on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 05:54:16 PM PDT

  •  Sure it's for the Palestinians to decide;

    doesn't mean we can't call 'em insane assholes for their stupid decisions, though.

    by burrow owl on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 05:59:23 PM PDT

    •  I try to stay out of other people's donnybrooks

      Being Jewish, I try to stay out of other folks religious dustups.

      Being Jewish keeps me busy enough those of me and my own :-)

      by mbayrob on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:17:37 PM PDT

  •  i've made this point in the past

    trying to say you are slightly better than bill oreilly is not a winning proposition in my book.

    In your world having armed men walk around with arm bands saying "morality police" is a non story?   wow.  

    by onemadson on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:09:47 PM PDT

    •  In mine. But that's not my world

      My personal strategy is live and let live.

      I also don't make it a practice to get into other people's faces about their religious customs.  And I am watching with some concern how the rights of Palestinians not to practice religion or a religion different than Sunni Islam.  It's especially vital  for the minority of Palestinians who practice Christianity of various kinds.

      That said, the Palestinians will work out their own ideas as to whether they want to "establish" Islam as the state's religion.  If they do as has traditionally been done, this will not affect Christians much; it will only affect the right of people of Moslem birth to be free of religious interference.

      I don't see this as much different from "blue laws" of some towns in the US (i.e., where you're forced to close your business on Sunday) or similar regulations in Israel.  I dislike them, but don't think they are out of bounds of what a government might decide.

      by mbayrob on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:33:47 PM PDT

      •  religious customs

        I also don't make it a practice to get into other people's faces about their religious customs.

        Me neither.  You want to believe in any of the thousands of various gods humans believe in, you go ahead.  Worship as much as you want.   You want to walk around with a gun and tell me that I need to also do as your god of choice says, we got a problem.  

        You believe people shouldn't get in other people's faces about their religious customs and yet you think the "morality police" are ok?   Sorry if I see a bit of a contradiction there.

        by onemadson on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:56:51 PM PDT

        •  I don't say it's OK

          but I know enough about the history of these sorts of things to understand what pressures Mahmud Abbas and others are under.

          Fatah, the party that rules outside of Gaza, is a secular party that had Christian support from its inception. And Christian Palestinians have pushed for a single political movement for Palestinians irrespective of religion.  This goes back to the first conceptions of modern Arab nationalism, which if anything had stronger Christian support than Moslem support in its early years.

          But right now, with the competition between Fatah and the political Islam of Hamas, a big piece of the struggle is to figure out a balance between traditional (and secular) Palestinian nationalism and political Islam.  It's a hard political problem for Fatah, and I don't presume to know how best to make that judgment.

          So I wish them well, and stay the hell out of the way.

          by mbayrob on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 07:14:32 PM PDT

  •  Bill O'Reilly

    doesn't arrest you or shut don't your restaurant.  In fact, I don't watch his show and just pretend he doesn't exist.

    by HenryVane on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 09:15:54 PM PDT

    •  down n/t

      by HenryVane on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 09:16:48 PM PDT

•  We see this in African Anglicanism, too,

  where the bishops are vying with the Muslims for the moral high ground.

  by ticket punch on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:00:27 PM PDT

  •  heard a story

    on NPR about how conservative churches in Virginia are bringing in conservate African Bishops and preachers?   Honestly, when the white people in VA  who hate gays start bringing in African's to help them I'm not sure i can ever be surprised.

    by onemadson on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:13:01 PM PDT

    •  Yup. Peter Akinola, archbishop of Nigeria,

      comes to mind in both contexts. It's a curious competition, the race to see whose morality is the most severe.

      by ticket punch on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:22:51 PM PDT

    •  About a year ago,

      when the US Anglican church was breaking up over gay bishops, I heard that a few conservative parishes in VA/NC? were officially joining an African Anglican bishopric that was conservative enough for their needs.   Recently, though, I've heard that the US Anglican church has agreed not to ordain anymore gay bishops.

      by HenryVane on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 09:19:40 PM PDT

•  After all

  At some point Bush's boys and Osama will realize they are on the same side, and then there really will be a fight between the forces of light and the forces of darkness.

  BTW, I think that even Bush knows that he and Osama are on the same team.

  by fightorleave on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:01:35 PM PDT

•  Let Us Please Clarify

  There is the Islamic Palestinian majority and the Christian Palestinian minority. Christian Palestinians want to create a modern society imbued with full human rights for all. It is the Islamists who favor morality police and clitoral castration and murder of gays and Jewish genocide. Please do not view Palestinians as being a monolith.

  by Amira ibn Nidal on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:27:27 PM PDT

  •  Is the Turkish "Status Quo" a model?

    Amira,

    This is an aspect of Palestinian politics and society that I've been watching with interest for many years.

    How do different Palestinians look at the the traditional Turkish/Ottoman policy of community autonomy/subordination of the individual to a community?  Do you know if under the PA, that different "religious authorities" continue to operate under the sanction of the state?

    You're probably well aware at the problems the Israelis have had with this.  It does protect the rights of religious minorities to a degree -- as it did for Christians and Jews under the Ottomans -- but I'm curious if the Palestinians continued with the "status quo" in a similar manner.

    by mbayrob on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:42:26 PM PDT

    •  Christian Palestinians are "dhimmis"

      We are basically Southern Negroes in 1940. We are barely tolerated and if we get uppity then we are lynched. My cousin in Tel Aviv has more religious and social freedom than my mother in Nablus, which is why I do not engage in Zionist bashing.

      by Amira ibn Nidal on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:49:53 PM PDT

      •  What would it take establish better protection?

        I will admit up front that I've been hoping that Fatah will succeed in establishing a working and free Palestinian state.  But the rise of political Islam will be a serious challenge from what you're saying.

        Hopefully things will soon become easier and more comfortable for your family in Nablus.  Being a "dhimmi" 300 years ago under the Ottomans was certainly better than being a Jew in Europe back then, but that isn't saying much.

        by mbayrob on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 07:04:14 PM PDT

  •  no worries about that

    I don't hold Israelis responsible for AIPAC.  I don't hold myself responsible for the views of George Bush..   I certainly don't think this is a comment on all the palestinians who I think have a very legit reason to complain about their situation.  What i do think this is, is very very wrong.

    However, while you say Christian Palestinians want to create  a modern society imbued with full human rights for all, I can assure you that there are Christian Americans who want to create a modern society where there is no such thing as human rights for all.

    by onemadson on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 06:52:14 PM PDT

    •  The grass is always greener, maybe?

      If you lack religious freedom perhaps you want more, and if you have religious freedom perhaps you want less?

      by Shaviv on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 07:23:51 PM PDT

      •  and if you lack religion you

        really wish people would follow the golden rules that all of their religions make pretty clear because then we all would be peaceful and kind people.

        Sadly it has never happened and I'm pretty certain it never will.

        by onemadson on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 07:28:20 PM PDT

  •  Could you reference for me, please ...

    ...where Fatah or Hamas state they favor genital mutilation?

    While genital mutilation does occur in the Muslim world - and large percentages of women in Egypt, Kurdish Iraq, Yemen, Oman and Somalia have been victimized by it - it is a pre-Islamic custom, and, just a year ago in Cairo, a conference of Islamic scholars denounced the practice as unIslamic. The conference was attended by Egypt's two top Islamic clerics, the Grand Sheik of Al-Azhar, Mohammed Sayed Tantawi, the foremost theological institute in the Sunni Muslim world, and Grand Mufti Ali Gomaa. Tantawi's and Gomaa's edicts are considered binding.

    by Meteor Blades on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 08:28:57 PM PDT

    •  Custom it may be

      A'immah may well expound what the Quran teaches, and what Islamic law is, but like rabbis in Judaism, what gets taught and what gets practiced are two different things. Kapparah -- that thing where religious Jews take a chicken and turn it around their head as a way of putting off their sins (look it up, and read it and weep) is as good an example as any.  The rabbis have been trying to stamp that one out for centuries, for all the good it's doing them.  The rabbis call it an ignorant superstition, and the guys with the funny fur hats still buy the chickens and give 'em a spin every year.  Go figure.

      Folk customs have a life of their own.  I was unaware that this custom is still practiced by Palestinian Moslems, but if it is, I doubt the people who do it are paying much attention to what scholars in Cairo are saying about it.

      by mbayrob on Fri Oct 12, 2007 at 01:29:27 AM PDT

•  maybe they could team up with the ultra orthodox

  who throw stones at people for violating the sabbath. interfaith wingnuttery.

  by wu ming on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 09:13:40 PM PDT

  •  I was thinking of them.

    The names change. Thea ttiudes and the urge to force veryoen to conform to YOUR morality doesn't.

    by irishwitch on Thu Oct 11, 2007 at 09:41:03 PM PDT