Daily Kos

PANDERING Will NOT Cure HIV/AIDS

Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 12:24:35 AM PDT

cross posted from MyDD with permission

Tonight's debate may have scored some points for Hillary Clinton , but I was insulted and infuriated. Whether or not the Media and the American people would be more concerned about HIV/AIDS among African American women and it would be addressed more if they were White women, does not address this serious issue and I am disgusted that Hillary addressed it as cheaply as she did.

It's called race/gender baiting and this African American female was not impressed. I think , one of the mistakes that Hillary and some of the other white candidates continue to make, is underestimating our intelligence to know the difference between a race baiting panderer and someone who is genuinely concerned about the Black community. They think they can fake a black accent and mimic some in the Black community, and assume that they are relating to us as a people. It's beyond fake. It's offensive and insulting and I have had it with Hillary doing this. It may work on older uneducated Blacks who are still under the impression that ALL of their problems are related to the White man keeping them down, but it doesn't work on me. I am part of a new generation of Blacks and I don't blame the "White Man" for everything. Some things are , gasp , actually my own peoples fault. If Hillary really cared she would have addressed the actual problem. AIDS among African American women.

If I were standing in place of Hillary, I would have stated the following:

"Ladies, we need to start getting real. Seventy percent of the new cases for H.I.V are among us. This is BS. (applause) If we really want to stop this, we are going to have to take steps on our own to stop it, whether or not the Media addresses it. (applause). The most effective way to ensure that we don't get HIV/AIDS is to KEEP OUR LEGS CLOSED! You don't have to wait for the media to tell you that. Tell yourself that(roaring applause) Now, some of you are obviously not going to do that, and that's your choice. You have that right. So, if you are going to insist upon  "getting your freak on" (laughter) then I would strongly urge you to use some common sense. By that, I mean, use a condom, keep it out of your mouth and stop taking it from behind (roar, laughs, applause) ."

"And Brothas, (ooooohhhh) if you are confused about yourself (laugh) and can't decide on just one "partner" or one "type" of partner, the very least you can do , is have some respect and use a condom while you are trying to figure it out. We all know about the practice of DOWN LOW  and you have the right to be whatever and whoever you want to be, but you also have a responsibility to practice safe sex if you are going to have multiple partners. Having unsafe sex and then taking that back to your wife is immoral. I don't care if people get angry. I'm trying to save your lives here. I'd rather have a low approval rating than a 70% approval rating to match that 70% new cases for H.I.V. among African American women. ( applause )"

In all fairness, maybe Hillary Clinton would not be able to get away with talking like that, but I bet you Michelle Obama would.

Poll

How Important Is HIV/AIDS Among African American Women To You?

56%14 votes
20%5 votes
12%3 votes
12%3 votes

| 25 votes | Vote | Results

Tags: Hillary Clinton, African Americans, Women, AIDS (all tags) :: Previous Tag Versions

Permalink | 36 comments

  •  Women... (5+ / 0-)

    ...in the audience strongly disagreed with you.

    When the oak is felled the whole forest echoes with its fall, but a hundred acorns are sown in silence by an unnoticed breeze. -Thomas Carlyle

    by Caldonia on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 12:25:43 AM PDT

    •  Do you disagree? (1+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      KendraStone

      "In all chaos there is a cosmos, in all disorder, a secret order." Carl Jung

      by Unduna on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 12:28:33 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Hil Bots (0+ / 0-)

      The audience was packed with Hillary Supporters. If you knew how to tell us apart, you would have seen members of the Black Caucus who have already come out and endorsed Hillary for President. (Mrs. TUBBS) was there with a large group of Hillary backers. I bet you don't even know who she is , do you?

      "I don't believe in this can't do , won't do , won't even try style of politics , Yes We Can! ~ Barack Obama

      by KendraStone on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 12:38:08 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  "Hil Bots"? ?????? (3+ / 0-)

        Recommended by:
        DCDemocrat, Caldonia, Albatross

        Kendra, pardon me while I read your title phrase in this comment and automatically discount everything you say as coming from an already biased source, and therefore not of much worth as information.

        Hillary was correct in bringing the disparity of the issue based on race into the forefront.  What other candidate had the courage to make such a statement?  

        As for the rest of your suggestions for a candidate, any candidate to use as an answer, seriously?

        You think any candidate could phrase things the way you did and not be excoriated by all sides?  Get real.  You criticize Hillary for what you term as "fake a black accent and mimic some in the Black community" and then later say she should say "And Brothas, (ooooohhhh) if you are confused ".  So, which is it?  She should or should not attempt to communicate in the manner you criticize her for?  Or in the manner you suggest which is clearly akin to the manner which you have already criticized her for?  

        This is just another "trash Hillary" diary, based on the preconceived notion of "trashing Hillary", no matter what action she had taken in reference to the issue.  Your mind was already made up before the debate and before the question was asked that you were going to NOT like her answer.

        "Hillary Hate" is a disease that will not be cured until after the primaries.

        by emsprater on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 06:25:14 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  You know I am not a Hillary supporter. (0+ / 0-)

        HIV does not have anywhere near the same prevalence in Holland, Germany, UK, Canada etc.  The control factor IMHO is a decent public health policy.

        Solve that and the crappy moralizing is irrelevant.

        "It's a race to decide who the British goverment will follow blindly for the next 4 years" Kennedy/Kerry '08

        by Salo on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 07:45:57 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  No All Caps Titles (1+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    YetiMonk

    Please see the FAQ:

    1. Do not use ALL CAPS or exclamation marks !!! in diary titles.

    http://www.dkosopedia.com/...

  •  I agree (3+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    burrow owl, dvx, corvo

    that AIDS is a very important health issue for all women, more so for African American and Latino women. I am white and I have worked in Emergency Medicine for nearly 30 years, all of it in an inner city and with an international NGO. I did not see tonights debate and I am not a Hilary Clinton supporter, I support no candidate at this time. Considering the attention the MSM gives to missing white women and children and the murders of white women, I think that if AIDS were a major health care issue for this group it would get a lot more attention and funding for prevention.
    I am not sure that Mrs. Obama would have been able to get the message out with the phrasing you suggested and it is a shame that in this country, where we supposedly value free speech, that she can't.

    "By the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes" Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

    by TheMomCat on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 12:47:06 AM PDT

    •  I think she could, though. (0+ / 0-)

      If it were in the right setting. When you watch the debate you will see what I'm talking about.

      "I don't believe in this can't do , won't do , won't even try style of politics , Yes We Can! ~ Barack Obama

      by KendraStone on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 12:52:46 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Who was it fired (1+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    TheMomCat

    Ms. Elders?

    Right.

    Mother Nature bats last.

    by pigpaste on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 12:50:02 AM PDT

    •  Dr. Elders (2+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      alizard, corvo

      I disagreed with the reason that she was fired. It was stupid on Clinton's part. He caved to the pressure of the wingnuts. I liked her policies and would love to see her return as Surgeon General under any administration.

      "By the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes" Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

      by TheMomCat on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 01:02:55 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I don't think Hillary was pandering. (7+ / 0-)

    I think she was trying to point out the urgencyy of the situation.  I've read the rate of new AIDS cases is soaring among African American women and is something like 20 times higher than white women and five times higher than hispanic women.  I think it is an uncomfortable truth that if the AIDS epidemic were soaring among white women there would be much more attention focused on a solution.  I don't think she suggesting that white people are at fault for the surge in AIDS cases among African American women.  But, whatever, if you were insulted and felt pandered to than that's how you felt, and Hillary's rhetoric failed for you.  

  •  KendraStone (4+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    Caldonia, Albatross, emsprater, Niniane

    Congratulations!  You are the first Hillary hater to open a diary that tries to crap all over Hillary's wonderful TRUE comments and the resulting, much-deserved standing ovation.

    Hillay is not a race-baiter and you should know better.  She surrounds herself, in her campaign, with women from many different nationalities and she is loved by African Americans.  Check out the work Hillary has done to salvage one hundred million dollars for HIV/AIDS victims in New York.  She doesn't just talk the talk; she walks the walk.

    •  Right ! (1+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      alizard

      It may be pleasing to you, but it's insulting to me.

      http://www.youtube.com/...

      "I don't believe in this can't do , won't do , won't even try style of politics , Yes We Can! ~ Barack Obama

      by KendraStone on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 01:28:23 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I'm sure lotsa Republicans (2+ / 0-)

        Recommended by:
        Caldonia, emsprater

        are "insulted" by her too.

        Looks to me like you are making shit up.
        I'm guessing you have already sold your soul to another candidate... and are therefore incapable of seeing things in an unbiased manner.

        Get used to it... despite all your misplaced venom and bile, she will probably be your next President.

        Unless AL runs... or the Edwards machine really gets in gear, it won't even be close.

        "As God is my witness, I thought wingnuts could fly".

        by Niniane on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 04:46:12 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  to tell you the truth Kendra... (1+ / 0-)

        Recommended by:
        masslib

        ...very few people evn know that AIDS is th leading cause of death among AA females.

        "It's a race to decide who the British goverment will follow blindly for the next 4 years" Kennedy/Kerry '08

        by Salo on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 07:25:54 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  I'm not a Hillary fan but (3+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    Unduna, Albatross, emsprater

    I don't see that what Hillary said is at all incompatible with what you want to say. If HIV among African American women got more public attention, there would (presuming a reality-based administration) be a lot more public health funding available for aids classical prevention in that community.

    And the message of classical aids prevention is basically the same message that you want to say.

    •  Hillary's Comments (0+ / 0-)

      Feeds into the Blame Mentality and that doesn't help the Black Community. I'm sick of the pandering.

      "I don't believe in this can't do , won't do , won't even try style of politics , Yes We Can! ~ Barack Obama

      by KendraStone on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 02:13:58 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  She's basically right, though (2+ / 0-)

        Recommended by:
        jabney, emsprater

        And if she's right, she should have said what she said.  That said, there's plenty of room to blame both the homophobic black community and the larger culture for the piss-poor public health environment among blacks.

        •  For me it's an issue of lack of healthcare... (0+ / 0-)

          ...the disease does not have the same prevalence in states with a good National Health Service. It disgusts me that anyone assumes this disease is the result of normal sexuality.

          At the end of the day the reason the disease ravages poor and uninsured people is because they are poor and uninsured.

          "It's a race to decide who the British goverment will follow blindly for the next 4 years" Kennedy/Kerry '08

          by Salo on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 07:40:44 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Then stop pandering. (1+ / 0-)

        Recommended by:
        emsprater

        "As God is my witness, I thought wingnuts could fly".

        by Niniane on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 04:47:21 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  HIV is a disease... (0+ / 0-)

        ...it's not a 'moral' problem for the people who suffer from catching it.

        It's something that needs to be cured.

        Sex is a normal part of human behaviour, the disease takes advantage of human behaviour.

        The overarching reason that HIV is ravaging the AA female community is because of lack of access to healthcare.

        HIV is not prevalent in other nations with a good National Health Service.  

        The issue is that blunt.

        "It's a race to decide who the British goverment will follow blindly for the next 4 years" Kennedy/Kerry '08

        by Salo on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 07:38:07 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  just to be clear (3+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    Caldonia, corvo, emsprater

    So, your first advice to the ladies would be to abstain from sex and your first advice to men would be to wear a condom when they are involved with multiple partners?

    Do not be overwhelmed by the enormity of the world's grief...You are not obligated to complete the work, but neither are you free to abandon it.

    by Albatross on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 03:44:06 AM PDT

  •  I can't fathom (5+ / 0-)

    stop taking it from behind

    why Hillary didn't bring this home.

    •  I'm sure that would have got applause. (1+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      masslib

      yay!

      Perosnally I think that linking the issue to access to healthcare is more important than normal experimentation and sexual behaviour.  

      All people get up to all sorts of nasty stuff.

      "It's a race to decide who the British goverment will follow blindly for the next 4 years" Kennedy/Kerry '08

      by Salo on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 07:29:23 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Wow. Issues. (4+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    Caldonia, jabney, emsprater, Niniane

    By that, I mean, use a condom, keep it out of your mouth and stop taking it from behind

    Guh?

    hey think they can fake a black accent and mimic some in the Black community, and assume that they are relating to us as a people.

    Snuh?

    FWIW, I have no doubt that if Clinton had answered differently, I'd be sitting here reading an Outraged! diary about how Clinton is racist because she failed to acknowledge that the problem of AIDS and blacks is tied in to racialized social notions.  

    In fact, I don't doubt that if Clinton said she likes puppies, there'd be Outrage! because she neglected to mention kittens, and therefore must support drowning them in the East River.  

  •  It's called "raising awareness"... (3+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    Caldonia, Albatross, emsprater

    And it's damned important to provide the support necessary for the cure and prevention effort.

    "As God is my witness, I thought wingnuts could fly".

    by Niniane on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 04:33:34 AM PDT

  •  I disagree (4+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    ademption, Caldonia, Albatross, emsprater

    I heard her quote on NPR and said right on.

    It isn't pandering. We all just know that there are some issues that will go by the wayside if white people are not involved. plus ca change plus c'est la meme chose. some people would prefer we didn't exist.....there's a reason Europeans were utterly shocked when the footage from Katrina was beamed around the world. That's the real America. What they normally saw was not.

    Natalie Holloway: Hours upon hours of TV coverage. They even had psychics look for her, live, on CourtTV

    nameless missing black women of the same age: NONE. I am ashamed I don't know their names.

    Laci Peterson: same.

    nearly identical murder of a pregnant Latino woman from the same time period: barely a peep.

    Senator Clinton is exactly right. If it were a crisis in the white community to the extent it is in the black community, there'd be an uproar and half the Federal budget would go toward fixing the problem.

    lurking surreptitiously ask about Central PA Kossacks(-0.12, -3.33)

    by terrypinder on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 06:08:46 AM PDT

    •  Zackly. (1+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      Caldonia

      HIV is not the result of a lapse in personal morality. It's an indictment on the American health care dysystem.

      "It's a race to decide who the British goverment will follow blindly for the next 4 years" Kennedy/Kerry '08

      by Salo on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 07:41:51 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  The best thing to do is find a cure. (0+ / 0-)

    ...that's not pandering that's a scientific breakthrough. In the meantime practice safe sex.

    "It's a race to decide who the British goverment will follow blindly for the next 4 years" Kennedy/Kerry '08

    by Salo on Fri Jun 29, 2007 at 07:24:24 AM PDT

Permalink | 36 comments