Cheney helped force Rove out

by Jackson Thoreau    

Dick Cheney helped force George W. Bush to finally agree to dump top aide Karl Rove, sources say.

Cheney and Rove have engaged in a mostly behind-the-scenes feud since the indictment of Cheney's top aide, Lewis "Scooter" Libby, in 2005.

Rove was included as "Official A" in the indictment who also leaked information to key media members to try to discredit Iraqi war critic Joseph Wilson.

Rove did not get indicted after talking with investigators five times and changing some of his statements.

Cheney, who reportedly masterminded the vendetta campaign against Wilson himself, thought that Rove blamed the scandal on Libby, who he considered a scapegoat. Rove and Cheney have been at each other's throats since.

Cheney's lobbying efforts to convince Bush to dump Rove were aided by Rove's dismal efforts in the 2006 elections and role in ensuing scandals involving the political firings of attorneys general and the improper use by White House aides of Republican National Committee email accounts. Even Bush knew Rove had become too big of a liability.

Rove's lies that he is resigning to spend more time with his family, including a second wife and son in college who won't be around anyway, are laughable, to say the least.

Perhaps Rove wants to spend more time with his gay stepfather, the one who left Rove and his suicidal mother during Christmas time one year, to talk about "family values."

Jackson Thoreau is a Washington, D.C.-area journalist/writer. His latest book, "Born to Cheat: How Bush, Cheney, Rove & Co. Broke the Rules, From the Sandlot to the White House," debuted at the Take Back America conference in June 2007. More info on the book is here.

•  Secret Sources

  Dick Cheney helped force George W. Bush to finally agree to dump top aide Karl Rove, sources say.

  And my secret "sources" say that I'm going to win the lottery.

  Who cares what your "sources" say, when they're secret? You don't even have a persistent publishing company or well-established reputation that could be threatened if your "sources" turn out to be fake or lying.

  Reveal your sources or delete this diary. Even mere comments posted in our DKos discussions require more than just "someone said" to back up such substantial claims as yours.

  by DocGonzo on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 09:53:08 AM PDT

  •  My sources say...

    ...PIE, MOTHERFUCKER!

    by The Termite on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 09:57:24 AM PDT

  •  You are naive and idiotic if you

    think I will reveal sources on this for a blog. Most people in DC fear Cheney and still have to work with him. Why should they go out on a limb and risk their careers just for your gratification?

    by jacksonthor on Tue Aug 14, 2007 at 08:14:51 AM PDT

    •  Just in talking with me they are risking enough.

      I reveal sources when I can, but there are times when I can't and won't.

      by jacksonthor on Tue Aug 14, 2007 at 08:19:45 AM PDT

  •  This story last year says about the same thing

    I'm saying.

    Sources say the rift between Rove and the Vice President's office crystallized when Rove quietly attempted to gauge the temperature for replacing Cheney on the 2004 Presidential ballot last year.

    "Rove was the source of 'feelers' put out before the last presidential election in which he was suggesting that Cheney could be replaced on the ticket with someone who had better poll ratings," said one of the former experts approached who wished to remain anonymous.

    "White House polls were showing that Cheney was a drag on the reelection ticket and that the Iraq war issue might be responsible for about a three percent drop, with Cheney the principal object of voter hostility in this percentage of anti-war sentiment among the general public," the source added.

    Cheney, the source said, got wind of "Rove's political soundings" and the already tense relationship between the Bush and Cheney camps became almost impossible.

    Go here to read the rest - but then you might not believe that either since they don't reveal to you most of their sources.

    by jacksonthor on Tue Aug 14, 2007 at 08:25:53 AM PDT

•  Makes a great story

  but I, too, would like to see sources.

  by A Mad Mad World on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 09:56:18 AM PDT

  •  That

    and delete the "gay stepfather" crap.

    by pamelabrown on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 09:59:43 AM PDT

    •  that is actually true.

      n/t

      by billlaurelMD on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 11:28:20 AM PDT

•  Oops, you stepped in shit

  Perhaps Rove wants to spend more time with his gay stepfather, the one who left Rove and his suicidal mother during Christmas time one year, to talk about "family values."

  Rove is one of my least favorite people due to his influence on the country, but your tasteless remark detracts from an otherwise interesting assessment of the situation.

   

  by altoid on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:03:13 AM PDT

  •  Not meant to be against gays,

    just pointing out that he can spend more time with his stepfather, who he apparently accepts despite his political campaigns against gays. Points out further hypocrisy of his stances.

    by jacksonthor on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:11:48 AM PDT

    •  Than you should have put it that way in the first

      place. Because the original phrasing is offensive.

      by PatsBard on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:17:53 AM PDT

      •  I got it so how come you didn't?

        fundie sense of humor?

        by abbeysbooks on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:49:59 AM PDT

        •  Finally, someone else has a sense of humor

          here.....

          by jacksonthor on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 11:34:13 AM PDT

          •  I laughed all the way...

            ... to the toilet.

            by altoid on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 12:57:53 PM PDT

        •  Oh yeah - that's me all right

          Downright prudish even.

          by PatsBard on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 01:48:40 PM PDT

•  Sorry, but I won't buy your book.

  If this diary with its unsupported sources is any indication of the contents of the book you so shamelessly pimp here, then it wouldn't be worth my time.

  by Kronos Blue on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:10:49 AM PDT

  •  Agreed. Delete this is an Ad for a book...... nt

    by duckhunter on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:13:05 AM PDT

  •  No skin off my teeth

    I'm just pointing out Cheney's role in this firing, and I'm not about to out sources I trust. Any astute observer of the White House can see Cheney's fingers on this, anyway.
     Whether you want to believe it is up to you. I'm not trying to "pimp" books, that's just a tag line put on every column.

    by jacksonthor on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:16:57 AM PDT

•  "sources" unreliable

  I deduced in a heartbeat - as did many others - that the "I want to spend more time with my family" line was BS.  I also deduced that Rove would not have left on his own, but had to have been forced out by someone who judged that Rove had become more of a political liability than an asset.  Bush would not have arrived at this decision himself; it must have been Cheney.

  However, all of this is somewhat-less-than idle speculation at this point, as is your story attributable only to "sources".  Put some meat on the bun.

  by TheOrchid on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:16:27 AM PDT

  •  Why don't you get on Seymour Hersh's case for not

    revealing sources? Why should I reveal them and burn my sources just for this? As I said, believe what you want. I'm just saying this is what people inside the beltway know.

    by jacksonthor on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:21:37 AM PDT

    •  Doen't really parse

      no matter who your source is. . .even if it was a drunken Dick Cheney. . .I'd take this with a grain of salt. . .of course, I don't have any inside source, just a functioning brain.

      If "everyone inside the beltway" knows, then why is your source being so secretive?  And wouldn't you have more than one?

      by Last Lemming on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 10:35:13 AM PDT

    •  Please

      Seymour Hersh writes extensive investigative pieces that win Pulitzers, and quite frequently does name sources.  You jot off a two paragraph diary on a blog somewhere and want the same respect and benefit of the doubt accorded to Seymour Hersh???

      What the hell are you smoking?

      by The Termite on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 12:27:21 PM PDT

      •  Not saying I'm Hersh, just giving that as example

        of others who don't reveal sources. And I've done a lot of stories and a few books in my career - I'm not just someone jotting off a few paragraphs. But this exercise is getting old here....

        by jacksonthor on Tue Aug 14, 2007 at 08:17:16 AM PDT

    •  I appreciate

      you bringing this to our attention, and that you would not want to reveal a source that doesn't want to be revealed.  But in the last few years, journalists in general (e.g., Judith Miller) have been so willing to peddle statements from anonymous sources, where the statements only served some political purpose, that we - or at least I - have started treating all statements attributed to unnamed sources as inherently unreliable.

      by TheOrchid on Mon Aug 13, 2007 at 01:42:51 PM PDT

      •  You can't treat every writer the same as Miller.

        But I appreciate your tone more than others here.

        by jacksonthor on Tue Aug 14, 2007 at 08:07:14 AM PDT