Daily Kos

Arrested for holding a sign:  what's coming next...

Sun Aug 19, 2007 at 04:46:47 PM PDT

So Jonas Phillips, an everyday hero, occasionally took a few minutes out of his day to stand above a North Carolina highway with a 5' by 1' sign that said "IMPEACH BUSH-CHENEY".

Last Wednesday, he was arrested for it.

Flip for the rest of the story...

On Wednesday August 15, I was standing alone with my sign for about 10 minutes, when I was approached by Police Officer Russell Crisp. He asked me how long I was planning to stay there and I told him just a few more minutes because I had to go to work at 8:00. He asked for my ID and I obliged. I asked him if I was doing something wrong, and he said that his Sergeant was on the way and he was going to wait for him. SO, I went back to my sign holding over the interstate.

A few minutes later Sergeant Randy Riddle showed up with a paper in his hand. He spoke briefly to Crisp, then walked over to me and told me to put down my sign, put my hands behind my back, and that I was under arrest! I was shocked and almost thought he was joking until he told me again to put down the sign and put my hands behind me and I was under arrest. So I peacefully agreed and he cuffed me. I asked him why I was being arrested, he told me I was in violation County Ordinance 16-2, (the print out in his hand that he didn't bother to read to me or show me.) He told me I was obstructing the sidewalk. I told him I was not and that officer Crisp had witnessed a guy walk by me moments before.

Riddle yelled at me, "You were obstructing the sidewalk!" and "I'm sick of this shit!" then he said, "Here's your 15 minutes of fame buddy!" I looked back to see his name plate and he said in a mean condescending tone, "Yea, that's 'Sergeant Riddle' get it right!" He then put me in Officer Crisp's police car. Riddle took my sign with him and I was taken downtown and booked by Crisp. I was never read my Miranda rights.

Since then, the cops, realizing there's no way their initial charge of "blocking the sidewalk" would hold up, have decided to change the charges to something yet to be determined.

OK, so this is the deal...  We've obviously got two wingnut cops that do not believe in "equal protection under the law", free expression, the First Amendment or our sacred Constitution.  They have no business being in positions of authority in their current state (I'm a believer in rehab and counseling - I think it's fine for Bush cultists to be cops, I just don't want them applying their own law to the rest of us.  Get them training, psychiatric evaluations, determine whether they are capable of being neutral arbiters of the law, and, if they are, let them keep their jobs).

That said, the fact that at the Police Headquarters decisions are being made that will provide the state a means to prosecute an innocent man...  Well, that's simply too much.  That demonstrates that this isn't two rogue cops with degenerate ideas about what it means to "Protect and Serve"...  Nay.  This is the entire force...  The rot begins at the top.

So this calls for people of good will to take a stand.

This is the beginning of my effort to organize a trip to Asheville, NC.  Sometime next week I'm hoping that some friends and I will find ourselves standing on the very same bridge with the very same message for passing motorists.

That's why I'm writing this diary.  I need the friends ;-)  

If you live in or near Asheville, are willing to place yourself in jeopardy of arrest and would like to be a part of this, please email me at stark dot m at gma*l dot com.  If you live in Virginia or Tennessee between Charlottesville and Asheville and you'd like me to pick you up on the way there, email me.  

This is our country, but it looks like we're gonna hafta fight to keep it.

Please help.

Update [2007-8-19 20:17:29 by Mike Stark]:  A few good points made in the comments...

Asheville is represented by Heath Schuler.  Call him; his contact info is listed in the comments.

The mayor of Asheville is a Democrat.  Call her; her contact info is listed in the comments.

The Chief of Police is accessible by email and phone.  Tell him about the rights you hold dear as an American; his contact info is listed in the comments.

Finally...  If the police and City of Asheville take appropriate steps to remedy the situation; if they, at a minimum, return Jonas' sign and tell him he is free to express himself in the future (note that I am not insisting on an apology - they probably cannot do that for legal reasons), well, it'll save me a few tanks of gas and an awful lot of trouble because we'll call this off.

Call the Mayor of Asheville, email the officials - tell them to drop the charges against Phillips and to apologize.

Mayor Terry M. Bellamy
Contact Information
Office of the Mayor
Mayor Terry M. Bellamy
Mailing address:
P.O. Box 7148, Asheville, NC, 28802
Location: Asheville City Hall, Second Floor, 70 Court Plaza
Phone: (828) 259-5600
Fax: (828) 259-5649
E-mail: mayorbellamy@ashevillenc.gov

mayorbellamy@ashevillenc.gov mayor
whogan@ashevillenc.gov police chief
jrichardson@ashevillenc.gov assistant city manager
gjackson@ashevillenc.gov city manager

Tags: Asheville, North Carolina, Jonas Phillips, Free speech, Activism, Recommended, protest, police (all tags) :: Previous Tag Versions

Permalink | 589 comments

    •  Asheville area a great place to retire to! (31+ / 0-)

      Way up their on my list. Good community, good people, culture, and an awesome climate.

      Obama supporters need to be good winners down the stretch. Repeat after me, Clinton Democrats care about the same things I do. Clinton Democrats care...

      by TrueBlueCT on Sun Aug 19, 2007 at 05:29:27 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Ditto to that. I lived there (in Arden, actually) (16+ / 0-)

        back in the mid-'70s.  I understand it's grown considerably since then.

        I remember it as a friendly, laid-back place.  Sounds like it's gotten too uppity for its own good.

        People never lie so much as after a hunt, during a war or before an election. --Otto von Bismarck

        by Ice Blue on Sun Aug 19, 2007 at 05:54:27 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  A Wonderful, Sparkling, Shiny Place? (35+ / 0-)

        I heard that about Simi Valley, too.

        And Thousand Oaks.  It's because intolerance of non-white, regular income folks is practiced.  the words "Law and Order", which are held in high regard in such communities, is code for keeping minorities out.

        I am not saying that is true of Asheville, but based on the behaviour of the local cops, I can't see how that isn't a possibility.

        I was talking with a highly-ranked officer of the Indianapolis Police Department two nights ago when the subject came up (guess which side he is on) of safest cities and Simi Valley was mentioned as one of the top.

        He said "... the LAPD have Simi Valley to thank for their good fortune."

        To which I replied, "Yah, and the people of Los Angeles have Rodney King to thank for their luck, eh?"

        He didn't quite know how to take that, as I had not revealed my true colours.  I acted like I was on his side, in fact.

        He started going on about how Valerie Plame wasn't really working for the CIA, and I think I simply changed the subject.  He was my wife's friends' husband, and I practice not being an asshole when I can help it.

        These cop assholes always act like everyone thinks like them.  Yes, I am stereotyping them.  The asshole cops, not the good ones whose name they sully.

        •  NBAA = Not being an asshole! n/t (5+ / 0-)

          Recommended by:
          delphine, Bluesee, 417els, TrueBlueCT, kyril
        •  Umm. Not sparkling, and not shiny (31+ / 0-)

          I've lived in Asheville. I've got a sister and a brother there now.

          I wouldn't call Asheville sparkling and shiny. It's gritty, funky, red-necky, gay and country. Earth tones and bookstores. Wal Mart and boutiques. Poor, aspiring black. And plaid retirees.

          The sky there sparkles, however.

          "We have trouble in the oil states because the President is viewed as favoring cheap energy." ~ George W. Bush in 1992.

          by chapel hill guy on Sun Aug 19, 2007 at 06:33:56 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Well Thomas Wolfe certainly wrote lots about it (10+ / 0-)

            FUKUOKA: Part of my purpose is to create a society where no one has to do anything.PARACELSUS:So then, you wormy and lousy Sophist...

            by abbeysbooks on Sun Aug 19, 2007 at 10:35:04 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  A nervous collection of yuppies (5+ / 0-)

            in the sticks is what I get. They naively build their castles on the muddly hills, eat 50 dollar sushi for lunch, attend the sparse museum shows, and try to avoid the raucous crowds in the square.

            "Don't push the river but don't pull no punches." Van Morrison

            by bob zimway on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 05:32:38 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Ignorance is bliss eh (8+ / 0-)

            I write this from my moms house 20 miles from the center of asheville.

            That "redneck town" is the home of Thomas Wolf. Once home of Carl Sandburg. It is a center of art and culture. A blue gem in the heart of the carolina mountains. In an area that treasures the environment. Where black, white, latino live  as neighbors rather than neighboring communities as they do in "morally superior" areas like Los Angeles, New York city, Cleveland, Chicago et al.

            It's gritty, funky, red-necky, gay and country. Earth tones and bookstores. Wal Mart and boutiques. Poor, aspiring black. And plaid retirees

            A "gritty" city which tens of thousands of people visit every year for its beauty. Funky perhaps if one were only used to city smog rather than the mountain air. The smell of the trees that make the entire area green year round. Gay yes.. as asheville, in the heart of the "intolerant south" has been home of two very large very open gay bars for decades. Walmart yes. And high end art studios. And Designer shops and botique that one part of asheville, Biltmore brims with. Biltmore the home of Biltmore house. A home worth literally billions. Black aye. Because in the south we actually live next door to each other. Rather than forcing minorities to live in ghettoes. Poor in some parts, because you see poverty is rampant in our wonderful capitalist system. But also home of some of the wealthiest of americans. To the point that a nearby town, Hendersonville, not too long ago had more doctors per capita than any place in the nation. In a county that probably has more millionaires per square mile than any place n the nation except perhaps Beverly Hills.

            Yes what an awful town. Home of artists and businessmen. Workers and trust fund retirees. A blue gem in green country inhabited by people of rainbow colors. So ugly that the rainbow people come every year to camp. That floridians are given updates on leaf change so they can visit. In that awful state that gave you John Edwards, the most populist, pro-worker future President since Franklin Roosevelt.

            What a horrible place. We should thank the lord that more of America isnt like it eh?

            I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice cannot sleep forever TJ

            by cdreid on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 08:40:12 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  You don't know dick... (7+ / 0-)

          To compare a progressive community which just elected their first female, African-American mayor, to Simi Valley and Indianappolis?

          Does the fact that the peace movement is alive and well in Asheville mean a damn thing to you?

          Obama supporters need to be good winners down the stretch. Repeat after me, Clinton Democrats care about the same things I do. Clinton Democrats care...

          by TrueBlueCT on Sun Aug 19, 2007 at 10:18:25 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Not Claiming That (6+ / 0-)

            That was an aside, TrueBlue, and I admit I am not as savvy about Asheville; the news is good and well-received.  I guess I'm saying I'm asking for clarification about Asheville.  The comparison is to illustrate how little I know of Asheville: why, for all I know it could be Simi Valley.  You see?

            You're right.  I think I don't claim to know dick, though!

            I am glad that there is an active peace movement in Asheville, again, thank you for the enlightenment; I will add it to my knowledge.

            I was perhaps more recounting my conversation than addressing the actual progressiveness or lack thereof of Asheville.

        •  Indpls. Police Dept has a very long and sordid (7+ / 0-)

          history of abuse and corruption, so I'm not surprised at your experience, Bluesee.  At one time IPD held the national record for unarmed "suspected criminals" being shot in the back...most of whom were young and black.

          Police departments across the country should have mandatory civics courses for new officers before they're allowed out on the streets with a weapon and mandatory continuing ed for every single officer.

          By the way...when and why was civics dropped from high school curricula in the US?  Anybody know the scoop on that?

          "Evil is a lack of empathy, a total incapacity to feel with their fellow man." - Capt. Gilbert,Psychiatrist, at the end of Nuremberg trials.

          by 417els on Sun Aug 19, 2007 at 10:37:37 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Wait, what? (0+ / 0-)

            Civics was dropped from high school curricula?

            Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over!? This is snark, right?

            Right?

            We are caught in an inescapable network of mutuality, tied in a single garment of destiny. Whatever affects one directly, affects all indirectly.

            by dconrad on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 03:12:27 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Not snark...isn't offered, let alone required, in (1+ / 0-)

              Recommended by:
              dconrad

              the IN school systems that I'm aware of...have been told this by h.s. teachers who work in two separate parts of the state..  It was mandatory when I was going through school in the 60's.

              I would love to find out that this is just some quirky anomaly and not wide spread...so I would welcome being told that I'm wrong about this.

              "Evil is a lack of empathy, a total incapacity to feel with their fellow man." - Capt. Gilbert,Psychiatrist, at the end of Nuremberg trials.

              by 417els on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 09:08:56 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Yikes (0+ / 0-)

                I can only offer a data point from MI in the 80's. It was still required when I went to HS. I graduated in '85.

                We are caught in an inescapable network of mutuality, tied in a single garment of destiny. Whatever affects one directly, affects all indirectly.

                by dconrad on Tue Aug 21, 2007 at 01:16:58 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

        •  Ashville? Ugh! (5+ / 0-)

          I had a terrible experience there exactly 15 years ago, which while clearly highly subjective and to a large extent my own fault, did not exactly put it in my good graces. I was around a week into what would turn out to be a 75 day, 15,000 mile, 35 state cross-country car trip (my late-20's attempt at doing the Jack Kerouac thing after leaving an unsatisfying job and wanting to see the country west of the Hudson at last), during which I camped and stayed in motels or with friends.

          After having driven most of the Blue Ridge Parkway (mostly in fog, unfortunately), I arrived in Ashville pretty late on a Friday night--in mid-August, mind you, which was peak vacation season in a town that is all about the vacation business--without a motel, hotel or campground reservation, and no friends or family to stay with for hundreds of miles. I made phone calls and drove around for several hours, unable to find anyplace to stay for the night, except for a couple of ratty-looking KOA spots next to what looked like the world's biggest and loudest NASCAR fans.

          So I decided to give up and drove clear across Great Smoky Mountains NP (which is just west of Ashville and, of course, the country's most visited national park due to its proximity to major urban areas and about a billion rednecks) and the eastern third of Tennessee, which also appeared to have no available motel rooms (it was way to late to set up camp by then) until I finally found a room somewhere west of Oak Ridge, around 3 in the morning. I considered myself lucky, and slept in.

          I had never before and have never since had such trouble finding a place to spend the night, despite having had similar experiences arriving in a populous area during peak vacation season very late at night without a reservation. I don't know if it was Ashville or bad luck, but that was one night that don't ever want to repeat.

          Of course, this has absolutely nothing to do with the topic of this diary (which I find infuriating and hope that someone sues these assholes for their constitutional and statuatory violations). But the whole place gave me a weird feeling and I don't have any desire to go back. Imagine the Las Vegas strip, but without the big fancy hotels and exploding billboards, but rather an endless succession of mini-golf emporiums, fast food joints, commercial campgrounds, cheap motels, pinball arcades, souvenier shops, wedding parlors and check cashing stores, with several NASCAR stadiums' worth of pear-shaped fans strolling the streets and looking for a good time.

          Oddly, it reminded me of the Eternal City chapter in Catch-22. Quite surreal. And no doubt mostly filled with huge Bush II supporters. Not surprised this happened there.

          Sic transit gloria mundi - ancient Roman proverb

          by kovie on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 12:34:19 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Typical (2+ / 0-)

            Recommended by:
            kovie, kyril

            Thanks, entertaining story!

            My first night in Ocala Florida was spent in a car; I stayed for nine years.  And so yah, I'm familiar with the redneck lifestyle.

            •  Didn't mean to trash redneck culture (4+ / 0-)

              It's just that for a Jewish northern city boy like me, this was quite the rude awakening and introduction to how SOME of the other "half" (probably more like 75%) live on my first real venture beyond the big coastal cities. It was certainly an adventure! (And no one heading out west alone by car for the first time has any right not expecting one.)

              Sic transit gloria mundi - ancient Roman proverb

              by kovie on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 01:32:54 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Soon as you say redneck, you're trashing. (3+ / 0-)

                Recommended by:
                cdreid, armadillo, TrueBlueCT

                But you knew that, didn't you?

                Your experience had little to do with where you were. It was way more about who you were. Ignorance and fear do that.

                Just thank God you're in the elite 25%.

                "The president was writing checks to the Georgians without knowing what he had in the bank," said a senior administration official.

                by perro amarillo on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 05:25:24 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  rednecks.. (1+ / 0-)

                  Recommended by:
                  abbeysbooks

                  they are rightly defined as such. I live in the South at the moment and everyday I am surrounded by ignorant rednecks.
                  If you don't like the term, too bad. That is exactly what they are. Ignorant fools still driving around with pro Bush & Cheney stickers on their vehicles (90% of which are over-sized trucks/SUV's).
                  Fortunately for me I am getting out of this place after 9 yrs, I can't stand it anymore. The bigotry here is unreal, for example, in one county they are trying to pass a law that would not allow more than 2 adults to live in a residence -- take a wild guess which culture Cobb County is targeting.
                  SE to NW -- I'm bannering my trailer for the drive.

                  live outside 'the box'

                  by AntiHero on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 08:36:35 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Who the fuck made you stay? Are you helpless? (4+ / 0-)

                    And that term began with white southerners, who used it to distinguish themselves from their less-well-off kin who worked the fields for a living. You extend a really nice tradition of bigotry and inorance by using it.

                    It is really a derogatory term used to describe people who work outside. With their hands.

                    And your continual use of "they" sounds like every other race-bashing hater I ever heard. It's the "other" that you fear and thus hate.

                    But I bet you think you're a liberal.

                    "The president was writing checks to the Georgians without knowing what he had in the bank," said a senior administration official.

                    by perro amarillo on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 09:08:11 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  IF you could read.. (1+ / 0-)

                      Recommended by:
                      darrelplant

                      past the first line you would have read that I am moving. Secondly, economic reasons wouldn't allow me to  leave sooner otherwise I would have left a long time ago. Third, I moved to Atlanta for numerous reasons and having a large queer community is important when you are not a heterosexual but the bigotry and intolerance here out-weighs the positives.
                      and okay, 3 uses of the word 'they' is continual? you make me laugh. Twice used to extend the use of "redneck" so I didn't have to retype it twice and finally to define the city government of Cobb County. Big whoopty dooda. What are you angry because I am calling a spade a spade.
                      Finally, no I am not a liberal.

                      live outside 'the box'

                      by AntiHero on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 09:38:56 AM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  At last. We agree. (1+ / 0-)

                        Recommended by:
                        blue vertigo

                        Finally, no I am not a liberal.

                        I have observed, however, that when the place people move from is full of assholes, the place they go to will be too.

                        Just sayin. And good luck.

                        "The president was writing checks to the Georgians without knowing what he had in the bank," said a senior administration official.

                        by perro amarillo on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 09:54:50 AM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                      •  And, if you could read, I used past tense: "made" (0+ / 0-)

                        "The president was writing checks to the Georgians without knowing what he had in the bank," said a senior administration official.

                        by perro amarillo on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 09:56:47 AM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  Well, if you could read (1+ / 0-)

                          Recommended by:
                          mainely49

                          he said 'economic reasons wouldn't allow him to leave', which answers your 'made'.

                          The fact that he apparently had a job there that paid for him not to be on unemployment 'made' him stay.  In the economic climate we've had for at least the last seven years, I can understand why he had a hard time finding another.

                          But I'll point out that none of this back and forth over whose the bigger bigot has any real use, and I actually expected both of you to have userid's from the Billo wave the way you were bashing each other.

                          Chill out, save that anger for electoral fraud.

                          Got a problem with my posts? Quit reading them. They're usually opinions, and I don't come here to get in arguments.

                          by drbloodaxe on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 10:32:43 AM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  i've been around here awhile myself.. (1+ / 0-)

                            Recommended by:
                            Bluesee

                            I just do not post often nor comment much, I just come to get news and topics that are mostly overlooked by the media. I didn't get my username until after about a year of being a regular (daily) visitor.
                            Yeah, I've pretty much had it with the south, so the guy above just happened to get my rant & observations on the south from a non-southerner. Nothing more.

                            live outside 'the box'

                            by AntiHero on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 10:43:06 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                            •  Good luck with the move, AH. (1+ / 0-)

                              Recommended by:
                              Gator Keyfitz

                              My daughter moved to Oregon last year and likes it a lot. So do I. And we've got cool lesbian friends in Seattle who find it congenial.

                              It's just that I go off on principle over that "r" word. Not to be taken personally.  

                              "The president was writing checks to the Georgians without knowing what he had in the bank," said a senior administration official.

                              by perro amarillo on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 11:38:00 AM PDT

                              [ Parent ]

                          •  just to clear it up (1+ / 0-)

                            Recommended by:
                            perro amarillo

                            I am not a guy :)

                            live outside 'the box'

                            by AntiHero on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 10:56:27 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Wow, you've put us in our places, haven't you? (0+ / 0-)

                            "The president was writing checks to the Georgians without knowing what he had in the bank," said a senior administration official.

                            by perro amarillo on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 11:29:50 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                            •  Doubtful (1+ / 0-)

                              Recommended by:
                              mainely49

                              But given your messages back and forth to each other since, you found your 'place' without me anyway.

                              I just hate to see anger wasted when there's so much the administration has given us to be angry about ;)

                              Got a problem with my posts? Quit reading them. They're usually opinions, and I don't come here to get in arguments.

                              by drbloodaxe on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 03:03:23 PM PDT

                              [ Parent ]

                      •  Down here... (2+ / 0-)

                        Recommended by:
                        perro amarillo, blue vertigo

                        In Florida, they say the same about "ignorant yankees".

                        Just more name calling by people too unimaginative to know better...

                        "As God is my witness, I thought wingnuts could fly".

                        by Niniane on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 09:58:15 AM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                    •  actually, not well-established (0+ / 0-)

                      there's no real certainty about how the phrase red neck originated among white southerners ... wikipedia reference here is a good starting point ... whether it's an old-country protestant Scots-Irish thing, or it referred to mine workers, or it referred to sunburn or red-clay dirt ...???

                      Which pundit most resembles Ruby Rhod?

                      by wystler on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 10:00:57 AM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                    •  Comples and interesting term (1+ / 0-)

                      Recommended by:
                      kovie

                      It has a very interesting and varied history that's worth exploring (for example, in modern US etymology, up through the Carter administration, rednecks were typically more liberal and less church-going than non-redneck southerners. They were strong supporters of the New Deal, and fought for workers rights.

                      Here's the most likely initial origin of the term:

                      REDNECK

                      The origins of this term are Scottish and refer to supporters of the National Covenant and The Solemn League and Covenant, or "Covenanters", largely Lowland Presbyterians, many of whom would flee Scotland for Ulster (Northern Ireland) during persecutions by the British Crown. The Covenanters of 1638 and 1641 signed the documents that stated that Scotland desired the Presbyterian form of church government and would not accept the Church of England as its official state church.

                      Many Covenanters signed in their own blood and wore red pieces of cloth around their necks as distinctive insignia; hence the term "Red neck", which became slang for a Scottish dissenter. One Scottish immigrant, interviewed by the author, remembered a Presbyterian minister, one Dr. Coulter, in Glasgow in the 1940's wearing a red clerical collar -- is this symbolic of the "rednecks"?

                      Since many Ulster-Scottish settlers in America (especially the South) were Presbyterian, the term was applied to them, and then, later, their Southern descendants. One of the earliest examples of its use comes from 1830, when an author noted that "red-neck" was a "name bestowed upon the Presbyterians." It makes you wonder if the originators of the ever-present "redneck" joke are aware of the term's origins?

                      This Wikipedia article has even more interesting information about the term and its various uses. There have been and still are many meanings, including the one to which you're objecting. For example, Edward Abbey, the Monkey-wrenching environmental activist declared himself to be a redneck, and wrote an entire treatise in defense of rednecks - where rednecks referred to working class coal mine strikers.

                    •  Too bad. As my Jewish friend likes to say (0+ / 0-)

                      Jews are smarter than other people.

                      I tend to agree and think it comes from all the family discussions of different oopinions and studying the Torah and doing midrash with it.

                      You know like in Annie Hall where Woody Allen spends Thangsgiving dinner with wasps and then with his Jewish kin where everybody fights at the dinner table.

                      FUKUOKA: Part of my purpose is to create a society where no one has to do anything.PARACELSUS:So then, you wormy and lousy Sophist...

                      by abbeysbooks on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 01:35:31 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                  •  I find there to be something very alien about.... (1+ / 0-)

                    Recommended by:
                    libnewsie

                    .......about the South.  Culturally, it has the feeling of a third-world country.  I never experience this type of feeling in other parts of the country or even Canada.

                  •  I agree says I from my neon red town (0+ / 0-)

                    in the Ozarks.

                    FUKUOKA: Part of my purpose is to create a society where no one has to do anything.PARACELSUS:So then, you wormy and lousy Sophist...

                    by abbeysbooks on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 01:33:00 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                •  Quick to judge. (1+ / 0-)

                  Recommended by:
                  Bluesee

                  My father has a beet red neck, and the rest of the skin to match (and a few skin cancer surgeries because he didn't wear a hat enough outside.)  I still use the word redneck, and around here it has NOTHING to do with whether or not you're a manual laborer.  That term locally is 'blue collar' - the guys building the local school, the guys mowing lawns (which, btw, pays better than my IT job.)  

                  And I'm sure as hell not in the elite 25%, or I'd be salaried and making at least twice what I do now.

                  I don't know about the poster to whom you're replying, but a word is what you use it for.  To YOU 'soon as you say redneck, you're trashing'.  Not so much everywhere else.

                  When I'M trashing, I say B & B.  (Best and Brightest) because I'm a cynical sarcastic kinda guy.

                  So don't accuse people of trash talking if you're just going to turn around and trash talk them in return.

                  Hypocrisy is worse than ignorance or fear.

                  Got a problem with my posts? Quit reading them. They're usually opinions, and I don't come here to get in arguments.

                  by drbloodaxe on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 10:42:57 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

          •  Boy you missed out (4+ / 0-)

            Asheville is first and foremost, green. It isnt "next to" the smoky mountains. As you hit the asheville parkway exit you likely were in Biltmore, not asheville.  If youd turned right soon youd have been in very upscale shopping.  If you looked left youd have seen Biltmore house. A placet hat makes these rock star beverly hills mansions look like cardboard shacks.. etc etc

            What you saw were the travel strip.. the part every town in america has where land is cheap enough that little places can grab some travelers cash on their way through. GAs stations, fast food et al.

            Next time you drive the parkway.. dont be in such a hurry. You missed some of the wildest and most beautiful country in the united states. From West virginia all the way to tennessee. STop and smell the roses next time.

            I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice cannot sleep forever TJ

            by cdreid on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 09:04:53 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I took nearly a week to drive the parkway (1+ / 0-)

              Recommended by:
              Bluesee

              including Shenandoah and a drive up Mt. Mitchell, so I actually did stop and smell the (mostly fog-enshrouded) roses. It was only upon reaching its end that I found myself tired and in need of some rest, and instead found tourist trap hell. I definitely intend to drive the parkway again someday, and actually visit SMNP. On this trip I also drove most of the Natchez Trace Parkway, parts of Highway 61, the Pacific Coast Highway from LA to Astoria, Going to the Sun Road, and various "Blue Highways", so this wasn't exactly a rushed trip, and I rarely drove on interstates.

              So I'm not sure where you got the idea that I rushed any part of this drive or trip.

              Sic transit gloria mundi - ancient Roman proverb

              by kovie on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 11:21:47 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Well (0+ / 0-)

                I wouldnt call it a tourist trap. But tourism is huge all the way through WNC. And hotels get really really really expensive here. Try a Ramada inn with no view except parking lot for $130 a night. But the point is that you actually were in the least pleasing part of the area. You were actually in the part  where all you'll see are gas stations, motels, and fast food designed to catch the incoming traffic. Every city in america has parts like that. Would you expect to show up in DC on the 4th and expect something different? Hopefully next time it will be better.

                I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice cannot sleep forever TJ

                by cdreid on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 03:46:54 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Umm... (0+ / 0-)

                  You first write:

                  I wouldnt call it a tourist trap.

                  But then write:

                  You were actually in the part  where all you'll see are gas stations, motels, and fast food designed to catch the incoming traffic.

                  Sounds like a trap to me, albeit perhaps not only for tourists.

                  Not trying to start a silly pie fight over essentially nothing, just to point out that the specific part of Ashville (or some nearby town) that I found myself in was clearly a "tourist trap". But I'm sure you're right that neither Ashville nor the entire region are like this, and are well worth a repeat visit--hopefully better-planned this time around!

                  But like I wrote, I was just passing through this particular area, by design. There are simply way too many worthwhile places to visit in this country for my or anyone else to have been able to see them all properly in 75 or even 750 days, or in one trip. I had set out with a general list of places to see and things to do, and Ashville was one of the optional ones that I'd hoped to do if there was time. As I was already behind schedule I ended up having to pass on it this time around (I had a small window of time to meet my parents a week later in Texas, which I didn't want to miss).

                  As for mansions, I did end up seeing Graceland, the Hearst Castle, and the Winchester House, so I wasn't exactly deprived for over the top "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous" abodes. Some people sure do live well in this country. Too well, if you ask me... ;-)

                  Sic transit gloria mundi - ancient Roman proverb

                  by kovie on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 05:16:22 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Biltmore is different (0+ / 0-)

                    re: mansions. It's a whooole different scale. It literally is worth billions. Ill bet the winchester house was awesome eh?

                    Tourist traps.. not so much. There are a couple here you missed like Maggie valley. Big valley full of nothing but places that want your money. The strips i was talking about exist to provide services to travellers. They're usually areas that are nothing like the town they're in (im a truck driver i pretty much live on these places). You never get to see the actual area from them.. theyre always just like every other one. Nashville im sure you noticed was pretty much like that as you probably travelled 40.  

                    When i do what you did (year biking across country someday) hope i get to do what you did. See the cool places. The winchester house, the home of robert frost, daniel boones' fort. ET al. Much more interesting stuff!

                    I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice cannot sleep forever TJ

                    by cdreid on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 07:36:36 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  I'd like to see Biltmore someday (0+ / 0-)

                      I may even decide to buy it if it strikes my fance. ;-)

                      But seriously, having driven through quite a few such touristy strips (but not nearly as many as you have, I'm sure), this one was different, in a bad way. It just went on and on for miles, was super-crowded and brightly and garishly lit, and I just had a feeling that I didn't want to spend the night there (which turned out to not be an option in any case). It was like every ugly tourist strip on the outskirts of every city on steroids.

                      But yes, one of the things that I sadly discovered on this trip was that just about EVERY US city of any size has at least one of these strips, and they ALL look the same. They lie either off an interstate or on a US or state highway just outside the city itself. And they always feature the same string of fast food joints and corporate "restaurants". I'm guessing that you tend to stay away from them unless you have no choice. I found it really hard to avoid them, and they always got me down and took away from my trip.

                      This is certainly a strange country. Some incredibly beautiful and uplifting places, some incredibly ugly and depressing places, and mostly endless in-between blah. Go figure.

                      Sic transit gloria mundi - ancient Roman proverb

                      by kovie on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 10:04:14 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

          •  Next time find a parking area and pull into a (3+ / 0-)

            Recommended by:
            libnewsie, Bluesee, kovie

            spot with cars on each side and go to sleep. No one will notice you until morning.

            FUKUOKA: Part of my purpose is to create a society where no one has to do anything.PARACELSUS:So then, you wormy and lousy Sophist...

            by abbeysbooks on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 01:32:13 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  I hear Berchtesgaden was nice, too (3+ / 0-)

        Recommended by:
        darrelplant, NCrefugee, elmo

        Lovely scenic vistas, clean streets, happy villagers . . .

        "we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex" Dwight D. Eisenhower

        by bobdevo on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 04:55:12 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Yes, but (0+ / 0-)

        the economy is slanting more and more to pure service economy and the people who do the work are having a harder time affording houses these days.

        And the gated communities that are going in there are blighting the landscape if I do say so myself.

        Just saying.

        Places that become meccas for retirement/entertainment, often become economically hostile to the working class.

        Politically, Asheville is a VERY strange bird. A progressive town surrounded by some pretty extreme religious types. Some of the old schoolers are having a hard time handing over the reins.

        I lived there in 1997 and have visited my friends there many times since.

        There is no avant garde. There are only people who are a little late. --Edgar Varese

        by thepdxbikerboy on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 09:50:15 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Asheville a great place to get arrested too... (0+ / 0-)

        (¯`*._(¯`*._(-IMPEACH-)_.*´¯)_.*´¯)

        by dancewater on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 03:45:53 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Bryson City. (6+ / 0-)

      Heath Shuler's hometown has been my second home all my life; I've had 3 first hometowns, 6 houses (not counting dorms), and one constant in my life: the Smokies.

      Please get the cops to understand that they live in the United States of America.

      I'm not asking you to take the country back, I'm asking you to take it forward-Van Jones.

      by Judge Moonbox on Sun Aug 19, 2007 at 06:26:50 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Smokies Supporter here! (5+ / 0-)

        I moved here by choice 5 years ago and have never regretted it for a moment.  A citygirl who had tired of the noise and the madness and mayhem, I chose to give up a good job and take a 75% pay cut just to live here in the mountains.  Yes it is crowded in the summer and fall, but it's a beautiful place and I live in the Peaceful Side of the Smokies away from the Touristy "Longest Midway in the World" madness of Pigeon Forge, etc.  Although I live in Tennessee, we love it across the mountain in NC.....and love staying in little Dillsboro.

        There really are a lot of progressive people here even though we are outnumbered by a few wingnuts but the tide seems to be turning even here and some of the wingnuttiest ones are even getting tired of Bu$hit which surprises me a bit.

        I hope that this situation in Asheville resolves itself and the Policia apopogize, although that would be a lot to hope for.  Unfortunately I cannot go to protest this time but I will be there in spirit.  

        What DID happen to civics classes in high school?
        We need to bring them back......how many thousands of kids out there have NEVER read the Constitution???   Like maybe these Ashville Police maybe, eh???

        "What, Me Worry?"...King George Walker Alfred Eusless Newman Bush

        by RantNRaven on Mon Aug 20, 2007 at 04:06:23 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Visit Jonas' blog (69+ / 0-)

      This is Jonas Phillips, the Asheville Freeway Blogger referred to in the article. If you would like to follow my story, view our blog, http://gaiastears.blogspot.com

      That was a comment to an excellent letter written to the Asheville mayor and posted at the Scholars & Rogues blog.

      The Honorable Terry M. Bellamy
      Mayor, Asheville NC
      P.O. Box 7148
      Asheville NC, 28802

      Dear Mayor Bellamy:

      As you no doubt realize by now, you have something of a PR nightmare on your hands. One of your police officers, Russell Crisp, recently arrested a resident named Jonas Phillips for obstructing a sidewalk. Since people were apparently having no trouble walking past him, and since the police department is reportedly trying to decide whether or not he ought instead be charged with some sort of state violation for "endangering motorists," you can see how people like me (a North Carolina native who loves your wonderful city, has vacationed there, and who has recommended it highly to friends and family contemplating where to spend their tourism dollars) might suspect that the real reason he was arrested had something to do with the "Impeach Bush-Cheney" sign he was holding at the time.

      Especially since the officer reportedly said things like "I'm sick of this shit!" and "Here's your fifteen minutes of fame, buddy." As I'm sure you're aware, it's almost impossible not to read these reports in an ugly political context and to wonder whether the officer was abusing his authority by harassing a man whose political views he didn't like.

      Your Honor, Asheville is the budding jewel of the Carolina Blue Ridge. It's a city that has worked hard to establish itself as a center for the arts and culture, and it has begun to reap the rewards of those efforts. In some ways, Asheville has done a model job of developing the kinds of "human capital" that researcher Richard Florida says are essential to attracting top-flight talent and economic development. I noted this on my last visit, and others I've talked to as well nod in agreement when I say that Asheville is becoming the "Boulder of the South."

      The key to this equation is talent. In order for a smaller city to thrive, as yours clearly wants to, it must attract certain kinds of young professionals (and by all means, please read Florida if you aren't already familiar with him, although I strongly suspect you or some of your people probably are). This has overtly political implications. Not to put too fine a point on it, but the core culture you need tends to be strongly progressive.

      The actions of Officer Crisp, and the city's failure to quickly remedy what can't help but look like a heavy-handed crackdown by a conservative law enforcement officer who didn't like the way a citizen was exercising his Constitutional guarantee of free speech - Your Honor, these events are the sorts of things that cause vibrant young professionals and artists, some of who are considering a future in Asheville, to step back and take a harder look at their other options.

      Not only that, a lot of people who are doing vacation planning are reading about this story, as well.

      These developments are bad for Asheville and its citizens, Your Honor. I'll go further and argue that they're bad for America, too - if we can't agree on a citizen's right to public expression of a perfectly legal viewpoint (and a viewpoint that has strong support nationwide, to boot), then economic development and tourism dollars are the least of our worries. You and your police officers don't have to agree with me or Mr. Phillips, but if your fine city is to thrive, you and they must share a commitment to the rights to speak and disagree, which are the very foundation of our Republic.

      I'll be watching as this case develops, Ms. Mayor, and rest assured that my opinion of Asheville, along with how I choose to spend future vacations and the advice I give my friends and readers, will depend on the statement you make about free speech in your city. I strongly encourage you to exercise your influence in making sure the charges against Mr. Phillips are dropped. After all, this one doesn't look that complicated. If an officer can't decide what a man holding a sign is doing wrong at a glance, then perhaps the officer and his colleagues in the Asheville Police Department aren't competent for their jobs.

      Or - and this seems more likely to me - perhaps Mr. Phillips wasn't doing anything wrong at all, and now the police have convinced themselves that rigging a charge they can make stick will somehow save the city further embarrassment. If so, they're tragically mistaken, and your office will likely find itself wasting a lot of productive time answering for their misjudgment.

      I thank you for your time and wish you and your staff the best as you work to set this unfortunate situation aright.

      Sincerely,

      Samuel Smith, PhD
      Editor, Scholars & Rogues
      Boulder, Colorado


      link to give comment on an awesome letter
    •  Feds training clergy to quell dissent (3+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      mataliandy, blueyedace2, kyril
    •  Asheville - site of film BEING THERE :) (6+ / 0-)

      Asheville is the location of the mansion where Chauncey Gardner comes to live, then advise the President of the United States. Too bad Peter Sellers is gone; a brilliantly subtle performance. Oscar-winning director Hal Ashby, gone. Melvyn Douglas as well.

      But the film lives on, a complete original, based on Jerzy Kosinski's  novel.

      If you've never seen the film, here's the trailer, at IMDB.

      If you rent it, wait for the outtakes after the end of the credits... one of the rare occasions where they really are truly A-list.

      Asheville: BE THERE !