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Update: Corrected Mrs. Black's name from the comments

Well, I screwed up with TiVo and lost my buffer trying to get the interview stored, so I'm not going to be able to quote the interview verbatim, but I'll provide the gist, which is STUNNING, below the fold.

I'm afraid I can't stick around to follow up on this as I have to head in to work, but I thought it important to get this out there.

Hillary Clinton supporter and one of the organizers of the planned RBC protest Saturday, Elitta Allida Black was just on MSNBC.  The interview began with the general talking points about counting all the votes.  Black went on to insist we are a nation of voters and how sacred a right that is. Fair enough.

The anchor pointed out the importance of also following the rules laid out by the DNC which would sanction any states that held primaries outside the approved calendar.  Black countered with the now disproved argument that Democrats in the Florida legislature did not want to move up the date.  Unfortunately, she was not pressed on the issue and asked to comment on the video of the minority leader in the state house basically laughing while sarcastically objecting to moving up the primary date.

Black continued by insisting on the importance of accounting for the will of Florida voters.  Of course, the interviewer failed to point out that we don't really know the true will of Florida's voters because Barack Obama never campaigned there which basically gave Clinton the victory based on name recognition alone.

Anyway, the true stunner came at the end.  When asked what should happen if the RBC cannot come up with a satisfactory resolution to seat the Florida and Michigan delegations her response:

"We'll take it to the convention floor."

This is not going to end well for the Democratic party unless our party leaders do some leading and put an end to Clinton's megalomaniacal and quixotic quest.  If this goes to the floor and prevents Barack Obama from beginning his general election campaign within the next few weeks or month we may have too much ground to make up against McCain in defining this election's issues.

Originally posted to figurefive on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:47 AM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  there's a link to video (0+ / 0-)

    over at americablog

  •  Guys...Hillary is not doing that (6+ / 0-)

    I wish this convention talk would just stop.

    Hillary wants to keep her standing in the party. She wants to have a long life in the Senate. She will NEVER take it to the convention. Her supporters are loony, but she is not.

    •  I guess I'd like to see some evidence of this... (14+ / 0-)

      She keeps saying "all the way to the convention" and the like...

      I agree that she's not loony and some of her supporters are, but I don't see any evidence that she plans to stand down. I wish I did!

      •  Wooooooooooooah (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bawbie, chicago DEM, kat68


        Slow down!

        I don't think even HRC would be dumb enough to still be fighting over the nomination on the convention floor. I think the Superdelegates will be quite glad to get the cloud of the Clintons from over their heads. What the hell will they have to be scared of if they DON'T nominate her?

        There is nothing naïve about your impulse to change the world. ~Barack Obama-5/25/08

        by Muzikal203 on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:54:04 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  What exactly is she going to do during (8+ / 0-)

        June, July, and August?

        Shortly after June 3rd Obama will declare victory and start running full-bore against McCain and then name his VP shortly thereafter.

        Do you really think the media is going to cover Hillary's windmill tilting?  No, the primary will be "old news" and they will be focused on the general.

        Then, we get to the convention.  What do the Clintons think is going to happen at the convention?

        Obama will control well more than half of the delegates, she can go to the floor and yell and scream, but it won't matter, Obama will control the convention because he will have the majority.

        Stop being scared of the Clintons.  They are irrelevant.  Obama is in charge now, and fear is done.

        "They're trying to fool you. They're trying to scare you. And they're not telling you the truth." Obama '08

        by bawbie on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:56:27 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  she will go on Fox news and act crazy (0+ / 0-)

          making the party look bad just for scuzz.

          Do you think George Stephanopoulos loves America as much as you?

          by MadAsHellMaddie on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:24:58 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Also, consider the morale among her delegates (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          bawbie, MotherGinSling

          By the time August rolls around how many SD will still support her? My guess is very few.  I'm betting that even her pledged delegates won't have much fight left in them anymore.  They'll be going to the convention after 2 months of time to let Obama's victory settle in.  The media, the public, Democratic voters will all have been looking at the Obama v. McCain contest for 2 months.  How fired up will Clinton delegates be for any sort of floor fight shenanigans after that?  I'm thinking not so much.  People will be ready to get on with the general election and winning back the White House.

          "You must be the change you wish to see in the world." -Ghandi

          by Triscula on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:25:47 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  Did I mishear her, then, because I thought I (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      LordMike, GreatDane, TheUnknown285

      heard her say that...

    •  Prove it... (5+ / 0-)

      Nothing in her past has shown me that she won't do this.

      '[Obama] has treated us like adults throughout this primary, and it is time to act like adults.' - John Cole

      by RichM on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:51:56 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  She doesn't care about her standing.... (5+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RichM, GreatDane, Shhs, DaNorr, ruscle

      ...she probably will quit the senate after this is all said an done...  The presidency is all she cares about... it doesn't matter to her how she gets it.

      The United States of America--the only country in the world where being educated and cultured actually *lowers* your social and political standing.

      by LordMike on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:53:24 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Until it happens one way or the other (0+ / 0-)

      it is all speculation. She may well take it to the convention even though I think that it would kill her career, but I am not her and do not know her thoughts.

      I tend to think she will not, but, again we do not know.

      I am from MN and if you think our caucuses are undemocratic I have a lake to introduce you to.

      by edgeways on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:53:33 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Maybe (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      I think we might separate the idea of a floor fight over fully seating FL/MI delegates and Clinton's candidacy.  Clinton might advocate one way or the other, but it really will not affect the outcome of the nomination.

      Barack Obama, 44th President of the United States

      by winsock on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:56:03 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Operation Chaos and it's cheerleaders laugh (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Cottagerose, Shhs

      I saw this and knew it was time to start putting the spotlight on McCain's problems.

    •  Why not? Ted Kennedy took it to the convention (5+ / 0-)

      with far less delegates than Hillary resulting in a GE loss for Carter. Did Teddy lose his standing in the party?

      Hillary knows her history far too well. She's not stupid, she knows damned well what she can get away with in the democratic party. And that's what scares me. :(

      "Beware the terrible simplifiers" Jacob Burckhardt, Historian

      by notquitedelilah on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:57:49 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Other than wishful thinking that Hillary will not (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RichM, GreatDane, notquitedelilah

      Do you have any insider information.   Because, from everything I'm seeing, this is exactly where we are headed.  

      Everyone WANTS it not to happen.   But that's not the same as KNOWING it won't.  

      If Barack had some huge stack of delegates he had yet to release.  Wouldn't Hillary know of this?  There are only a handful of Super Delegates left.   These people all know each other.  Would such a large block be able to remain secret for 2 or 3 weeks?  

      Hillary has no option but to keep going.   Her name in the party is already muddy.  Winning is the only thing that will clean it up (in her mind).  If she backs down, she gets nothing.   If she keeps going and keeps going and keeps going... she might get the nomination.   (I Doubt it.  But you can't argue with the fact that 1% chance is larger than no chance at all.)

    •  Is Wes Clark "loony"? He said she'd do it... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Joe Beese

      I can't keep up with Clark's latest stock value here on DailyKos, it's sure gone up and down over the past five years... but he said point-blank that she intends to fight all the way to Convention.

    •  Correct (0+ / 0-)

      She isn't crazy, she won't make a floor fight.  The Florida and Michigan delegations may push for full seating on the floor, but Obama will have the nomination wrapped up regardless of how that turns out so noone will pay any attention or care about it.

    •  I have on good (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      slinkerwink, DaNorr

      authority that she is perfectly willing to take it to the floor--- she thinks she can get away with it...She and her minions are pushing this hard with the people inside the party and the supers that they got elected or appointed....New Yorkers are already starting a challenge to her senate seat, she has trashed Bill's goodwill,  and to take her at her word, "ANYTHING COULD HAPPEN"!  She has nothing to lose.

    •  She's not? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      iconoclastic cat

      She threatened to get us into a nuclear war with Iran if Iran and Israel started firing at each other.  Hillary crazier than her supporters.

      "Words ought to be a little wild for they are the assault of thought on the unthinking." - John Maynard Keynes

      by Drew J Jones on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:12:49 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  She's taking it to the convention (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      She doesn't plan ahead that far, she doesn't look at the legacy.  Hillary and Bill are convinced this country is wrong to vote for this uppity black guy and they are the ones to save us from themselves.  Superdelegates, playing with changing the rules mid-game -- it's all there to overturn any result as we see it now.  

      She will call it a "tie" on Tuesday.  This is going to the convention, people.  She believes she should be president, and will not leave until she's pushed out.  We have no evidence that the party will do that:  they have been silent through "hardworking white Americans" and assassination spectres and any number of other things that should have drawn a strong, Democratic party line.  Leadership did not stand up, the superdelegates did not stand up.  

      It's going to the convention.  And she may win it.  Be prepared for that possibility instead of congratulating ourselves over our splendid math.  

      I'm sick to death about it.  But the evidence points in no other direction.  

  •  what will happen is (7+ / 0-)

    Obama will be endoresed by enough delegates after he wins that even if all of fla and Mich were seated the way Hillary wants she still would not win.

    After Obama's eighth straight victory, Penn told reporters: "Winning Democratic primaries is not a qualification or a sign of who can win the general election.

    by nevadadem on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:50:38 AM PDT

  •  Let her take it to the (9+ / 0-)

    convention floor because Obama is already moved on to general election mode.  These pathetic buffoons will be drowned out in the cheering for Obama.  If they are looking for public humiliation, so be it.

    My faith in the Constitution is whole, it is complete, it is total. Barbara Jordan 1974

    by gchaucer2 on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:50:47 AM PDT

    •  We can't let her take it to the floor (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Cottagerose, Coach Jay, soms

      because Clinton and the media will find some narrative to keep some sort of focus on her throughout the coming months so as to take attention away from the real fight for the GE

      -6.00/-5.59. "No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered as patriots." -- George Bush Sr.

      by jcil5 on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:54:27 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  The narrative will (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Shhs, DaNorr, chicago DEM, soms

        be "whiney sore loser" and "implosion of a promising political career."  

        My faith in the Constitution is whole, it is complete, it is total. Barbara Jordan 1974

        by gchaucer2 on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:57:14 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  It won't matter (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        there are often important questions that are decided at the convention, frequently regarding the platform to be adopted.  This is a technical matter of seating delegates but it is not about Clinton, per se, though she is using the issue to gain attention.

        Barack Obama, 44th President of the United States

        by winsock on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:00:35 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Giving platform points to the loser if not (0+ / 0-)

          entirely inconsistent with the winner's on the stump platform, is not an unusual way of easing the departure. After the convention, nobody reads the party platform. So is giving some visibility at the convention, if the loser is behaving. Otherwise, outer darkness.

      •  You can't stop her (0+ / 0-)

        It is her right to appeal to the credentials committee and whatever the credentials committee decides has to be approved by a floor vote at the convention.

        You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is "Never get involved in a land war in Asia".

        by yellowdog on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:02:23 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  how can she when she has no path to the nominatio (0+ / 0-)


          she won't have any way to win if she has no delegates. carter and kennedy were far apart on issues. obama clinton are basically identical.

          she is going to screw herself if she does it.

          •  She is going to screw the party (0+ / 0-)

            Her assertion will be that any delegate, pledged or super, can change his or her mind.

            You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is "Never get involved in a land war in Asia".

            by yellowdog on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:54:03 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

  •  Listen, there is nothing we can do about it... (4+ / 0-)

    ...the party is too weak and spineless to stop her, so we will just have to find a way to make it an advantage, tno a liability.

    People were screaming how the extended primary was bad for us... well, with a few glitches, it still seems to be doing well or better for us than the short one.

    We'll make it work.  Convention fights don't have to be the end of the world.

    It's out of our hands.  The best thing we can do is prepare for it and do the best we can.

    The United States of America--the only country in the world where being educated and cultured actually *lowers* your social and political standing.

    by LordMike on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:51:57 AM PDT

  •  Who? Elitist Black? (6+ / 0-)

    That's not an Obama supporter?

    Her responsibility is to tell them the truth, and to ensure a better government. Not to run against democrats.

    by Inland on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:52:29 AM PDT

  •  I kinda agree (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    chiefsjen, ballerina X, Shhs

    Let her go down in flames at the convention. At this point, I'd like to see her out of the senate.

  •  The louder these fools scream (4+ / 0-)

    the less likely they will get their way.

    The Obama message about not protesting is only about class and dignity, it's also smart strategic move that will ensure he gets what he wants

    This year we can declare our independence...Barack Obama

    by PalGirl2008 on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:52:59 AM PDT

  •  Hillary's people are pumping this but (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Into The Stars

    it is all so she can go down looking like a dighter when she concedes next week after the SDs put Obama over the top and safely out of reach. Look also for alrready pledged Clinton SDs and delegates to also crossover to Obama to make the point.

    Barack and Mark! Obama/Warner '08

    by DWKING on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:53:34 AM PDT

  •  I dont care what they do anymore (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Triscula, Shhs, Muzikal203

    the more they scream the more foolish they look.  Lets concentrate on mccain.  In fact since the scott book story broke I have barely heard a mention of hillary and her clinton.  Perhaps thats justice.

    by GlowNZ on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:54:05 AM PDT

  •  Allida Black (0+ / 0-)

    Womencount PAC

    Here we are now Entertain us I feel stupid and contagious

    by Scarce on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:54:54 AM PDT

  •  She lied on TV, is leading a useless rally (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Triscula, GlowNZ, Shhs, Into The Stars, Junah

    and we're supposed to be worried about what she says concerning the nomination process?


    "So, please stay where you are. Don't move and don't panic. Don't take off your shoes! Jobs is on the way."

    by wader on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:54:57 AM PDT

    •  She looked unhinged IMHO (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      wader, Fairy Tale

      The definition of insanity is voting the same way and expecting a different result. I'm talking to you FL,OH, KY, WV!

      by Shhs on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:08:27 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  And she'll lead a protest on Saturday (0+ / 0-)

        A protest of unhinged protestors.  You think the press will ignore that?  

        How can this be good for us?  In any way?  

        But it's happening.  Be prepared.

        •  My inner worrier says it won't be an orderly (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          demonstration but will be much more nearly a riot. If that's the case, the loser will be HRC, as long as none of us is there. The American people don't much like demonstrators anyway, but they really don't like  loud, abusive and violent ones, especially those who try to interfere with a formal proceeding, which this one absolutely will be, and those who get in absolutely will do.

          Unfortunately, that's what I'm afraid we will get, with stupid signs that Wolfson himself would run out to hide if he could. But he won't be able to, and HRC will be tarred with the photographed abusiveness. Of course, this is not a genie she should have let out of its bottle, but it's too late for that. You wil notice that Ms. Black carefully pointed out that she is a Clinton delegate, like Granthold, Wasserman-Schultz and the other organizers of this.

          And there is NO chance that HRC's position will prevail.

  •  The democratic party (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    will not allow her to destroy the chance of a dem president this year, it is way too important, she will not take it to the floor.

    (-6.50,-6.00)If we settle for nothing now, we'll settle for nothing later. - RATM

    by clew74 on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:55:04 AM PDT

  •  Blahabalaagbalayhagheg... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    philimus, Shhs

    Another bitter Clinton surrogate.

    Obama and the Democrats aren't going to let that happen. That would ensure defeat in November. I trust Obama's team to stop anything Elitist Black or whoever is blathering about in the midst of her brain bleeding.

    "The next time Hillary opens her mouth, she's going to sound like Elroy Jetson in comparison." ~ Some anonymous 'Wonkette' talk-backer.

    by OReillysNightmare on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:55:54 AM PDT

  •  It was always going to go to the (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    RichM, Shhs, Joe Beese

    floor. As soon as Clinton said she was going to the rules committee, it was obvious she would not get what she wanted from the rules committee and appeal to the credentials committee, which requires a floor vote to approve its decisions.

    We've known this for weeks, perhaps months. But a lot of people did not accept the depths of the depravity of the Clinton campaign until now.

    You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is "Never get involved in a land war in Asia".

    by yellowdog on Thu May 29, 2008 at 09:59:20 AM PDT

  •  It. Just. Doesn't. Matter. (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Triscula, philimus, Shhs, ArtSchmart

    Let her take it to the floor.

    Won't amount to a hill of beans.

    •  are you sure? (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RichM, yellowdog, dagnabbit

      She obviously won't secure the nomination, but if she continues her temper tantrum through the end of August, don't you think that'll damage the party, not to mention Obama's chances in the general?

      God bless Gerry Thompson.

      by Tuffygoyf on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:01:13 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  NO the crazier she gets the more of her supporter (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        chicago DEM

        Actually distance themselves.  

        The definition of insanity is voting the same way and expecting a different result. I'm talking to you FL,OH, KY, WV!

        by Shhs on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:09:32 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Imagine the Convention Floor Fight (0+ / 0-)

        An angry, stressed out Clinton supporter pushes an equally stressed out Obama supporter with her sign.   The Obama supporter pushes back.  There's a scuffle which lasts 32 seconds, before cooler heads prevail and order is restored.

        We will see clips of that scuffle over and over on the networks.   The party will be portrayed as being disorganized.   No happy speeches on the stage.   No feel good unity being displayed.  Eventually Obama emerges as the victor.   Lots of shots of Hillary supporters crying and blowing their noses.    

        And then, just as that is fading into the collective memory -- the Republican Convention gets underway.   And its a good show.   It makes McCain look great.  Lots of balloons.   Lots of feel-good speeches praising McCain for being a Maverick and a Straight Talker.  

        That is the first week in September.  

        Then -- November we have the election.  

        And all those independent voters.  All those low information voters.   All those spiteful, angry Clinton voters. -- they are all going to have to make a decision.  

        You really think that taking this to the Convention is not going to be harmful?  Given the Clinton's habit of standing in front of the cameras and saying ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING if they think it might fly, and the highly emotional turn the primaries have taken with sexism and racism and "a black man taking it away from a white woman" -- I don't see any way that we could count on the Convention being anything other than a disaster.    

        If the party can't pull it's shit together BEFORE the convention, why would you believe that they can pull it together DURING the convention?  

        •  Paranoia about imaginary scenarios over which you (0+ / 0-)

          have no control is going to help. Lots.

          Take deep breaths. Go for a walk. Trust the party.

          If we can't trust the party, then we all need to bail on them, anyway.

          I trust them. Dean, Reid and Pelosi seem to have their heads screwed on very tight.

          •  I appreciate you condescension (0+ / 0-)

            But it doesn't accomplish anything.  

            I think it would be smarter for the party (including us) to realize that there is a loose cannon on deck.  WIshful thinking that it won't do any harm is not much of a plan.  

            As for as trusting Dean, Reid and Pelosi.... hmmm.  

            Got any evidence for that?     Link?  

            They have not been able to shut down Hillary's campaign while she runs around sliming the presumptive nominee with charges of illegitimacy, sexism and whatever else she thinks might stick.  

            They tell her to play nice.  Two days later she is musing of assassination being one path to her nomination.    

            She's doing nothing right now but hardening positions of people (Both for and against her.)  

            And every few weeks we are told to wait a few more weeks.  

            When a crazy person tells you she's going to do something crazy -- believe her.  

        •  I just don't see it (0+ / 0-)

          Her delegates just won't be all that fired up for a fight after 2 months of Obama campaigning as the nominee and Clinton barely being able to draw a crowd of 10 people at a local gas station in Denver.  I think they'll be anxious to get the whole thing over with and move forward.  

          "You must be the change you wish to see in the world." -Ghandi

          by Triscula on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:35:57 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I hope you are right (0+ / 0-)

            But there are three sides in this fight.



            The corporate media

            As I see this, that 2 month lag where Obama is the focus is going to be a lot about perception.    

            Who controls perception in this country?   MSM

            What does the MSM want?   Not Obama.  

            How this plays out?  Is anybody's guess.  

        •  I don't think there will be a floor fight (0+ / 0-)

          because, whatever else, Clinton is a good strategic thinker.

          Here's what's coming up . . . RBC on Saturday will reach some kind of compromise to seat the delegates and the magic number will switch over from 2025 to 2105 (that's with half of the MI and FL delegates seated.)  After Tuesday, SD's will endorse Obama, putting him over the magic number, regardless of whichever it is.

          Clinton can always appeal the decision of the RBC to the Credentials Committee at the end of June, but by then the point will be moot.  Seat all the delegates and still the point will be moot.

          She is much more likely to push for something from the DNC (good speaking slot in prime time at the Convention for example)and perhaps something in an Obama administration - cabinet position, perhaps.  As Bubba has said, she has earned it.  (We can argue that point, but she's earned a hell of a lot of votes and support.)

          If the Democratic Party is smart, they will find some place for her (not VP, I think that card is now off the table), allow her to wind down her campaign with some dignity and turn to the main event.

          She is just as aware of the history as we are here.  A floor fight would do her no good - a dignified place on the podium would.

          I think both of these things - the nomination secured by Obama, however one choses to calculate the "magic number," and her own desire to repair and/or maintain her public standing, will bring this to a better conclusion then we worry about here.  (Apologies to Rachel M. as well!)

          Be calm, everyone, breath deep, and enjoy the fact that this part of the struggle is over.  Obama has prevailed.  Enjoy the victory!


      •  She'll only damage herself. (0+ / 0-)

        Who will want to go down with the S.S. Clinton Failboat?  She'll end up all alone on this if she pushes it that far.  People protect their interests.

        "You must be the change you wish to see in the world." -Ghandi

        by Triscula on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:32:15 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  It won't affect the outcome (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RichM, yellowdog, philimus

      certainly, but it will have an effect in terms of damaging Obama's chances.

      by dagnabbit on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:02:39 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  GW student against Allida Black right here. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Fairy Tale
  •  I wish people would stop listening to (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ye ye ye

    HRC surrogates.  When the hell do they ever tell the truth about anything? When are they ever right about anything ever?  It's grandstanding pure and simple.  They are on message trying to put pressure  on the rules committee to do what they want or else, even though have no power to force anyone to do anything.  

    "If Appalachia was a country, Hillary could be President " - Ron Reagan

    by Into The Stars on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:00:47 AM PDT

  •  One Thing Never Mentioned is Precedent (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    slinkerwink, notksanymore

    In HRC's frantic battle to win this primary and get MI and FL seated, why does nobody every mention Precedent???

    If the DNC seats any delegates from these two states, then why the hell would any state ever even think twice about ignoring DNC primary rules?

    I mean the precedent would be that its no big deal.  The candidates would also be forced to campaign in those states in the event that the votes will count.  

  •  This will be a moot point anyway ... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    ... In all probability, Obama will secure enough delegates to clinch the nomination shortly after the final primary votes are cast. When the math is so stacked against Clinton that she cannot win this thing even with all of the Florida/Michigan votes counted and delegates seated, the remaining Hillary deadenders will be as irrelevant as a carnival freak show (and my apologies to carnival freaks BTW).

  •  I'm sure she's also saying (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    soms, Fairy Tale

    milliions of Hillarycrats will be voting for John McCain, too.  Don't take it too seriously, this is all just posturing and bluffing.  

    •  What gives you that impression? nt (0+ / 0-)

      There's no reason to become alarmed, and we hope you'll enjoy the rest of your week. By the way, is there anyone here who knows how to run a government?

      by iconoclastic cat on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:21:57 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Is Black anyone with real power? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        Do you think she could instigate a convention fight if all the democratic leaders are united and say it won't happen?  No.  

        Clinton has told her supporters and surrogates to make incendiary claims as a way to intimidate the rules committee to give them what they want.  It's standard hardball bargaining tactics.  Not going to work.  

        •  In a way, I actually admire her. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          She's like Richard III: doomed, but irrepressible.

          There's no reason to become alarmed, and we hope you'll enjoy the rest of your week. By the way, is there anyone here who knows how to run a government?

          by iconoclastic cat on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:33:01 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Can't wait to the movie about the 2008 (0+ / 0-)

            democratic primary race comes out.  

            My cast:

            Hillary Clinton - Amy Poehler
            Bill Clinton - Fred Thompson
            Chelsea Clinton - Michelle Tractenberg
            Barack Obama - Will Smith
            Michelle Obama - Halley Berry
            Howard Wolfson - Chris Elliot
            Lanny Davis - Lanny Davis
            James Carville - Ed Norton
            Terry McAuliffe - Jim Carrey
            Harold Ickes - Dick Cheney
            George Bush - Will Ferrell
            David Axelrod - Dabney Coleman or Kevin Kline
            John McCain - Bob Dole
            Rush Limbaugh - Ned Beatty
            Bill O'Reilly - Steven Colbert

      •  Because most of the Hillary Supporters are (0+ / 0-)

        rational people. Not like the talklefties. Many are grandmothers and mothers. They want respect but know it can be lost in their own eyes if the ones in place at the hearing on Saturday or at the convention shame them. Shame their cause. Already, this site has heard from a large number of feminists who want a female president but not this particular woman. Listen to that and don't panic.

  •  At least the convention would be interesting for (0+ / 0-)

    a change. They have become infomercials.

  •  Clinton is trying to strong arm the (0+ / 0-)

    DNC with the threat of taking this to the floor.  I heard it as a veiled threat from several of her surrogates, including her husband, but it now appears that they're willing to verbalize boldly in order to get their way.

    Please Hillary, take a look in the mirror and get off the merry-go-round.

    The religious fanatics didn't buy the republican party because it was virtuous, they bought it because it was for sale

    by nupstateny on Thu May 29, 2008 at 10:23:21 AM PDT

  •  Letter I just sent to Women Count PAC (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    kat68, Deoliver47

    To Whom it Concerns:

    I've just seen Ms. Black's appearance on MSNBC and I must say--are you kidding me?  I'm a woman (single, white, college grad in her 40s) and I wish to go on record with your organization as being totally opposed to Ms. Black’s suggested course of action.

    Is a Pyrrhic victory so important to you that you're not only willing to split the Democratic Party but lose the general election as well?  Pay attention--by all conceivable rules and regulations of the DNC there is no way in this time-space continuum that Senator Clinton can win the nomination.  Nor, do I want her to do so.

    My only reason for this is the fact she employs union-busting, NAFTA-loving traitors on her campaign staff.  To me, that's a clue that she won't really work very hard to reform trade and tariff matters.  Further, they are lobbyists who are tied to Charlie Black, who guides Senator McCain's campaign staff.  Didn't think regular people would catch that, did you?  I have come to realize that she is a "business as usual as long as the business is in my pocket" centrist, which is really too bad.  

    Moreover, what about the unexpectedly close down-ticket races in "red" districts that could be flipped if there is a solid, democratic front presented for November?  Won't happen if there is no nominee until September.  And, won't happen if Senator Clinton is the nominee.

    A McCain presidency is a presidency that will reshape the Supreme Court for a generation and a presidency that will further restrict women’s issues.  I'm surprised you, as women, can't see that.  

    Sincerely disappointed in you,

    My secret identity

    P.S.  You’re more than welcome to share this with Senator Clinton.  

  •  C'mon,, Supers where are you??? n/t (0+ / 0-)
  •  Nervous Nellie me has some good news! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Obama jumped ahead of Hillary in the Gallup tracking poll:  52%-42%!

    If enough supers come out by June 4, there may actually be fatigue in the party for this to continue.  

    I've been very upset and depressed today.  We really need to see supers come out and their coolness continues to trouble me deeply; but I was heartened by the Gallup tracking.  

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