Daily Kos

Frugal Fridays: Disaster Looms

Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:02:09 PM PDT

Welcome to Frugal Fridays where we share money saving tips, discuss living frugally and generally talk about personal finance issues.  Folks we have a disaster on the horizon and we need to batten down and prepare.  No, I'm not talking about your favorite candidate losing the nomination, I'm talking about something a little closer to home.  It may be something as minor as a short term power outage or as major as Hurricane Katrina, but each and every one of us will most likely face some natural or man-made disaster in the next 5 years.  A few weeks ago, in the midst of the Southern California fires, I did a diary on how to put together a home disaster kit.  As with many of the topics I write about, I picked that one in hopes of inspiring me to actually assemble a disaster kit for myself.  It turns out that putting such a thing together takes a lot more time and thought than I had realized.  (Or maybe I had realized, which is why I hadn't done it!)  I hope that by sharing some of the lessons I have learned below, I can boost you up a bit on your own learning curve.

When I started to assemble such a kit, I realized that there is an economy of scale to these things, in both time and money.  It  doesn't take that much more time to assemble 2 than to assemble one and some supplies are much cheaper when bought in bulk.  So I decided to make ones for friends and family this Christmas.  I ended up making 10 different kits, each one customized for a particular purpose or person.  As it turns out, my parents have also recently been thinking along these lines and so after the holidays, my stepdad and I put our heads together and traded some ideas back and forth.  Now, today, I am finally ready to reveal the culmination of all this work.

First Make a Plan
Before you can build a disaster kit, you need to think about what kind of disaster you are likely to face and what your needs would be in each situation.  What if it happened when you were at work?  In a public place?  On the road?  What would you need to keep yourself and others around you save and healthy until help arrives?  What kind of help from rescuers or relief agencies do you expect?  What would you do if they couldn't respond for a few days or even longer?

Call me a Pollyanna-ish ostrich, or whatever, but I really think the likelihood of a disaster where all of society breaks down, like nuclear Armageddon, is so remote that I'm just not going to spend my time and money preparing for it.  If you are concerned about these sorts of things and want to know about hard core survivalists, there is a ton of information on the web.  Just google "survivalist supplies" to get started.

Here are some of the types of disasters I think I could face, ranging from most likely to least:

  • short term localized utility outage (such as storm related)
  • major earthquake that could cause extended utility outages (including water) and would make it difficult for us to evacuate the region
  • house fire that destroys all or part of our house and contents
  • being stranded in our car in a remote location, possibly in adverse weather
  • widespread extended power outage
  • flu pandemic
  • neighborhood fire that affects a large number of homes at once

You Will Need Multiple Kits
Obviously no one kit will suffice for all circumstances.  Here is the list of kits that I have decided we need for ourselves.  One type of kit that I've decided we don't need, but you may, is a kit to keep at work.  Mr. sarahnity and I both work in places that have plenty of food, water and first aid supplies available and we wear clothes that would be comfortable if we had to climb over rubble.  We drive to work, so the kits we keep in our cars would also be available.  The only thing I felt the need to add to my supplies at work was a flashlight I can use to find my way out of the building in case of a power outage.

  • Everyday stuff:  These are things you should carry with you every time you leave the house.
  • Day Hike:  Take with you every time you go hiking out of sight of buildings or your car.  These supplies can fit in your pockets or in a fanny pack.
  • Car:  Keep these in your car at all times.  These supplies should fit in an old backpack.  Include the Day Hike Kit as well.
  • Car (cold weather):  Add these supplies to your car kit if you are traveling in or near snow.
  • Documents:  Make copies of important documents and computer files.  Leave one set in a safe location away from your house (with trustworthy friends or family) and keep one set in your home go bag.  A 2.5 gallon ziploc bag makes a good waterproof bag and use plastic sheet protectors to hold papers (get the kind that will expand to hold 10-50 pages).  Keep the document originals in a fire safe or in a safe deposit box.
  • Home - Go Bag:  This should be the first thing (after people and pets) that you grab if you have to evacuate your house in a hurry.  It should include one copy of your Document Kit.
  • List of Things to Grab When Evacuating:  Make a list now of all the things you would like to grab when you are evacuating your house (assuming you have time to safely grab anything) and keep that list in your Go Bag.  I guarantee you that you won't think of everything you'd like to take in the heat of the moment, even if you do have time to go through your house and pack stuff up.  I'm still thinking of things to add to this list weeks after I initially started to make it.  All of these should be transported in a waterproof box, if possible.
  • Home - Disaster Kit:  These supplies should be stored together and should fit in a large backpack or 5 gallon bucket.  Take them with you if you have to evacuate only if you have time to safely grab them.
  • Home - Camping Kit:  These should be kept near your Disaster Kit so you can also grab them quickly in case of evacuation.  These could be very useful if your home is not safe to stay in, but relief shelters are not available.
  • List of Home Disaster Supplies:  These are things you have in your home that would be very helpful in a disaster, but you use them routinely so they aren't stored with your Disaster Kit.  Make a list of them, and where they are stored, in advance and keep it with your disaster kit.

Best Sources I've Found
I did quite a bit of comparison shopping both on-line and locally and I found that prices could vary quite a bit from store to store for different items.  Unfortunately, I didn't find any one source that was best for all things.  Here's where I looked:

  • My Own House: a lot of items I put in these kits I already had sitting around the house.  It was just the matter of digging them out of the various hiding spots and assembling them all in one place that was tiresome.
  • Amazon:  I found their reviews for some items to be very helpful when deciding what to buy and the prices of their affiliated vendors were usually among the best I found.
  • Google Shopping:  I used them mostly for price comparisons once I knew what I wanted to buy.  Occasionally I would find a better price on something than I found through Amazon, so it was worth checking.
  • Minimus:  This is a great source for travel or sample sized items.  The prices are generally better than the local drugstore, as long as your order totals over $20.  Under that amount, and shipping charges can be significant.
  • Other local stores:  I don't know if it is just in our area, but I was very disappointed in the prices I saw at the locally at the army surplus store or the discount camping store (Sports Basement).  I usually found better deals for the items they carried on the web, even when I factored in shipping.  These are good places to wander around to get ideas of what you might want to include in your kit, however.

If I found a particularly good source for some item detailed in the lists below, I linked to that source in the list.

Other Considerations and Tips
A few more things to keep in mind:

  • Where and how to store your kits:  In general, you want to make sure your kits will be stored in a way to keep the contents safe from water and vermin damage and handy enough that you can reach them in a disaster.  I would recommend a plastic storage bin for anything kept in an outbuilding or garage, while a backpack or duffel bag should be fine for supplies in your house.  I recently saw the damage a rat did to a kit in a canvas bag that was hung on a post in a garage.  It wasn't pretty.
  • Consider making more than one set:  If you have friends or family who need to be more prepared than they currently are, consider making kits for them too.  As I said above, it doesn't take that much more effort and it will be greatly appreciated.
  • Always keep your car gas tank at least half full:  This is definitely one of those "do as I say, not as I do" pieces of advice.  Right now, my car is sitting in the driveway with nothing but fumes in the tank.

Detailed Kit Contents
These are the detailed contents of the kits I put together.  At the end, I also listed some survival supplies that I have seen suggested, but I didn't include in mine.  These kits are designed for 2 adults and one cat.  I've put these lists in a google spreadsheet that you should be able to view.  I'll be updating that with suggestions from the comments or other things that occur to me in the future.  Note that there is a fair bit of overlap between the car kit and the go-bag.  If your car is certain to be available when you evacuate your house (i.e., it is not parked in a garage which could be on fire or collapsed) you could eliminate some of this duplication.

  • Everyday Kit
    • Photo ID
    • Emergency contact info:  Take a business card from spouse, write "In case of emergency notify:" at the top and then add home and cell phone numbers.  On the back, keep the name and phone number of the out of area contact you and your family members agree to relay messages through in case the local phone system goes down.
    • cell phone:  Don't answer it if you really don't want people to bug you, but do carry it
    • keychain items:  Some or all of these would be useful to also carry and are small enough to attach to your keychain
      • LED flashlight
      • mini Swiss Army knife
      • tweezers such as these or something similar
  • Day Hike Kit:
    • Leatherman Tool or Swiss Army Knife:  Genuine Leathermans are pricey, but fantastic
    • flashlight:  even a tiny LED flashlight will help you find your way in the dark
    • loud whistlewith compass, signal mirror and waterproof holder for matches:  can help to signal for help or find your way out of the wilderness
    • emergency mylar blanket
    • tiny 1st aid kit: bandages, gauze pads, antiseptic wipes, alcohol wipes, antibiotic wipes, aspirin
    • insect repellent, sun burn cream, sun screen: can find these in small bottles or even single-use packets
    • dental floss:  not for oral hygiene, it is nice twine
    • chemical hand warmers:  tuck inside your shirt to keep your core temperature up
    • hat:  shaded brim for summer, warm for other seasons - you lose a lot of heat through your head
    • water
  • Car Kit:
    • charger for cell phone
    • Maps:  local, and regional use to find alternate routes
    • sturdy shoes & socks:  if you get caught wearing sandals or dress shoes, you'll need a good pair to walk in
    • work gloves:  useful if you need to move debris, change a tire, etc.
    • illuminated safety vest:  it is not just reflective but has LEDs in it to improve your visibility if you have to leave your car at night
    • 2 signal flares:  can also be used to signal rescuers
    • Day Hike Kit (see above)
    • Cash: bills for emergency expenses and coins (for payphones) I keep about $50 handy
    • crank flashlight w/ emergency radio:  These combo units are now available.  "Duracell 3 in 1" seems to be best recommended by users on amazon.com.  Flashlight has multi-band radio (am/fm/weather) and USB port.  Can charge to or from USB devices.  (The default merchant on Amazon is not the lowest price.  I ordered from T.F.N., also through Amazon, and was very happy.)
    • First aid kit:  Include pain relievers and cold and allergy medicine and 2 pairs latex gloves.  You can buy a ready made kit or assemble your own
    • spare eyeglasses for everyone in your household
    • 4 emergency mylar blankets
    • 2 rain ponchos
    • 2 light sticks such as these
    • pens, pencils, markers & duct tape:  Wrap a few feet of duct tape around one of these pens.  A knife can be used as a pencil sharpener in a pinch.  Include at least one permanent marking pen.
    • fire starter (tinder):  you can buy commercial tinder that will work when wet, or just keep some dryer lint in a ziploc baggie, or you can make firestarters from candle wax, dryer lint or sawdust and egg cartons
    • small toiletry pouch (we had lots of old pouches sitting around, but a quart sized ziploc bag would work well too):
      • small sewing kit (needle, thread, spare buttons) in dire emergency, could be used to stitch up a wound.  (I've picked these up for free from hotels.)
      • sanitary pads and/or tampons
      • packaged sanitary wipes
      • 2 tissue packs
      • fasteners: plastic cable ties, wire twist-ties, safety pins, rubber bands
      • swiss army knife, leatherman, or camping multi-tool at the very least, this should have a blade and a can opener
      • box of matches
    • power bars or candy  something tasty to keep your blood sugar from dropping while you change your tire (or keep you from starving for a day)
    • water:  at least 1 day supply water (each person needs 1/2 gallon drinking water per day)
    • gatorade or vitamin powdered drink mix  improves the taste of water
    • small towel  as Douglas Adams says, never travel without a towel  (I picked up a multi-pack like this.)
    • deck of cards  to alleviate boredom while waiting for rescue
  • Car Kit (cold weather):
    • candles or sterno cans
    • coffee can or other metal container  melt snow in the can for water - be sure to ventilate the car by cracking a window
    • survival food
    • warm gloves
    • snow boots and warm socks
    • tea bags improves the taste of drinking water from snowmelt
  • Documents Kit:
    • ID documents:  (Include copies of all items, except keep an original of a bill with your local address)
      • birth certificates
      • drivers licenses
      • marriage license
      • passports
      • all medication prescriptions (including eyeglasses)
      • current pictures of pets
      • ham radio license
      • power or water bill with your name(s) and address
    • Financial documents: (Copy front and backs of all cards)
      • credit cards
      • ATM cards
      • auto club membership cards
      • most recent tax return
      • list of all financial accounts: name & phone of institution, account numbers and name on accounts
    • Wills, durable powers of attorney & trust documents
    • Phone List:  Make a list of phone numbers you would need in an emergency.  Here is a sample of the one I use.
    • Computer backup:  DVD or USB thumb drive with copies of critical computer files
  • Home - Go Bag:
    • waterproof luggage tag with your contact info:  attach to the outside of your kit
    • Document Kit (see above) You can double the ziploc bags for extra waterproof protection.  Add the following
      • Disaster Lists:  List of things not in bag to grab in case of evacuation and list of useful disaster supplies in your home and where to find them
      • Blank paper  useful for leaving notes to inform people where you evacuated to, etc.
      • Disaster recovery info  print out info on how to purify water and other helpful info on how to recover from a diaster from the American Red Cross
      • First aid booklet  many first aid kits or courses will give out such a booklet
    • Maps: one local, one state or region use to find shelter locations or alternative evacuation routes
    • cash: a few hundred dollars in 20s and a few dollars in coins.  Coins can be useful in pay phones, if any can be found.  Cash may be needed for several days if power is out and ATMs are down.
    • crank flashlight w/ radio (see Car Kit)
    • tiny 1st aid kit (see Day Hike Kit)
    • insect repellent, sun burn cream, sun screen (see Car Kit)
    • prescription medication and vitamins  keep a one month (or a two week, if that's all you can get) supply of all meds in a ziploc bag.  Rotate out each month when you get prescriptions refilled.
    • spare eyeglasses for everyone in your household
    • 4 emergency mylar blankets
    • 2 rain ponchos
    • 2 light sticks such as these
    • Pens, pencils, markers & duct tape (see Car Kit)
    • other small items: (keep in ziploc bag)
      • 2 pairs of latex gloves
      • fasteners: plastic cable ties, wire twist-ties, safety pins, rubber bands
      • key ring with spare keys to house and cars
      • swiss army knife, leatherman, or camping multi-tool at the very least, this should have a blade and a can opener
      • box of matches
      • small sewing kit (needle, thread, spare buttons)
    • small toiletry pouch
      • sanitary pads and/or tampons
      • soap/shampoo/conditioner/lotion (I used some small samples I've picked up from hotels)
      • packaged sanitary wipes
      • toothbrush
      • toothpaste & dental floss
      • brush or comb (you want to look your best in a disaster)
      • small bottle hand sanitizer
      • 2 travel pack tissues
    • food in ziploc bag:
      • power bars or candy bars (food to keep your blood sugar from crashing)
      • gatorade or vitamin water powder packets
      • salt and pepper shakers or individual packets (some of us would sorely miss salt if we didn't have it)
    • small towel (see Car Kit)
    • deck of cards  to alleviate boredom in the shelter
    • cat food:  enough for a few days
    • harness and leash for cat
  • List of Things to Grab When Evacuating:  Here's a combination of mine and my parents' list.
    • cat (in harness or cat carrier)
    • cell phones, purse, wallets, keys, glasses, sunglasses
    • cash
    • contents of fire safe
    • laptops, computers, hard drives and current file backups
    • photos (wedding album & video, other family photos)
    • personal letters
    • original poetry, music or artwork
    • cameras
    • musical instruments
    • cell phone chargers
    • change of clothes for 5 days & jackets & rain gear
    • rechargeable batteries and chargers
    • ipod, pda, speakers & chargers
    • cat carrier
    • disaster kit
    • camping gear
  • Home - Disaster Kit:
    • plastic bags (various sizes from large garbage to small trashcan sized
    • plastic sheeting and/or tarp use as a ground cloth or for emergency home repairs
    • tube tent
    • 2 dust masks
    • 50 feet of 1/4" nylon rope
    • emergency candles  don't use these after an earthquake, there is too much danger of starting a fire when an aftershock knocks them over
    • water purification tablets
    • manual can opener
    • duct tape
    • emergency food  supplies like this for 2 adults for 3 days)
    • water  1 gallon per person per day for 3 days (1/2 gallon for drinking, 1/2 gallon for sanitation)
    • work gloves
    • landline phone (not cordless)  in case of a power outage, cordless phones won't work in the house
  • Home - Camping Kit:  (we don't camp much, so our supplies are kind of minimal)
    • battery powered lantern great to have if you are prone to power outages
    • tent
    • sleeping bags
    • cooking pans & utensils
    • plates, cups, eating utensils
    • toilet paper
    • aluminum foil
    • folding chairs

  • List of Home Disaster Supplies:
    • fire extinguisher  stored in the kitchen
    • more flashlights (including the kind you can wear on your head) - stored around the house
    • wrench to turn off gas  attached to the gas meter (only use it if you smell gas)
    • cleaning supplies
      • bleach can be used for water purification too
      • ammonia  do NOT mix with bleach ever!
      • dish soap
      • wipes
    • plastic bags  including small trashcan sized ones.  If your water is out, you can use plastic bags to hold waste in the toilet.
    • aluminum foil & plastic storage containers
    • canned and dry food stored in pantry - canned soups that don't need to be mixed with water make better emergency rations than dry food like pasta or rice
    • propane barbecue grill  ours has an extra burner on the side so we can cook on it if the gas and electricity are off in the house
  • Other Items I did not include above:
    • baby & child care items
    • dog or other pet items
    • eyeglass repair kit (add to Go Bag)
    • collapseable shovel add to car kit to help extract car from mud or snow; can come in handy when camping for digging latrines
    • survival manuals: such as US army Survival Manual or The Book of Survival
    • flint/steel fire starter such as this
    • collapseable saw like a Sven saw
    • sterno cans, mini cook stove
    • hatchet  if you are trying to start a fire using wet wood, use a hatchet to cut away the wet surface and get down to the dry core
    • ironed cotton handkerchief in ziploc bag  if you iron it and put it directly into a bag, it is a sterile cloth
    • phone card can be useful in payphones, but these expire fairly frequently and so seem to be more expensive than they are worth
    • water purification system
    • battery powered radio & spare batteries this may be more reliable and long lasting than the crank type
    • firearms and ammunition or other defense weapons you cannot take weapons into a shelter
    • solar powered garden lights  Can pick them up cheap at end of season sales.
    • plastic 5 gallon bucket with lid  Can be used as waterproof storage or line with plastic bags and you can use it as a camp toilet.
    • fire extinguisher (add to Car Kit)
    • ice scraper and snow brush (add to Cold Weather Car Kit)
    • traction mats or old rugs (add to Cold Weather Car Kit)
    • tire chains (add to Cold Weather Car Kit)
    • salt (add to Cold Weather Car Kit)
    • cat box litter or sand (add to Cold Weather Car Kit)

Update Your Kits
Once you've finished assembling them, I know you thought you'd be done for good, but unfortunately, that's not the case.

  • Every Month:  replace prescription medicines with new refills and use the ones you've taken out of your kit.
  • Every Three Months (or more frequently): update your computer backup disk.
  • Every Year: check the expiration dates on over the counter meds.  Replace snack foods and pet foods with fresh supplies.  Review your phone list and other documents for changes.
  • Every 3-5 Years: replace emergency rations and water.
Poll

How prepared for a disaster are you?

0%0 votes
6%5 votes
40%29 votes
22%16 votes
5%4 votes
12%9 votes
12%9 votes

| 72 votes | Vote | Results

Tags: Frugal Friday, Personal finance, teaching, community, disaster preparedness, survivalism (all tags) :: Previous Tag Versions

Permalink | 121 comments

  •  Pessimistic Tips (43+ / 0-)

    After all this work, I'm practically hoping for a big earthquake so I can put this stuff to use!

    If you are interested in writing a diary for this series, or you have a topic you'd like to see covered, or if you want to be added to the mailing list for announcing these diaries, email me: frugalfridays (at) gmail.com.

    Frugal Fridays, where the cheap come to chat.

    by sarahnity on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:03:37 PM PDT

    •  This is really good work, sarahnity! (8+ / 0-)

      Thank you.

      Do you also supply the kick in the a** needed to get me started?

      If all do not join now to save the good old ship of the Union this voyage nobody will have a chance to pilot her on another voyage. Abraham Lincoln

      by 4Freedom on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:43:38 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  to this add... (8+ / 0-)

      TOILET PAPER.  A couple of rolls stashed in each kit and in the car.  Get the high sheet count type that's used commercially, not the soft fluffy rolls you may have at home that have fewer sheets per roll.  Whatever else happens in life, when you've gotta poop, you've gotta poop.  

      Hand sanitizer:  a couple of decent sized bottles of Purell or similar alcohol based sanitizer, not containing Triclosan (which grows resistant bugs).

      Tobacco:  Do you smoke?  Put a week's supply in there.  (For those of us who smoke pipes it's easy: a couple of tins of a favorite blend, or a quarter pound of any decent bulk blend, and remember, pipe cleaners)  If you don't smoke, get a few ounces of bulk rolling tobacco and some packs of rolling papers and put them in a double plastic bag: will be very helpful as trade items and for friendly offers to fellow refugees who smoke.  (After a disaster is not the time to be all sanctimonious about the risks of smoking.)

      Sweet goodies:  Same case as for tobacco, even if you don't eat the stuff yourself, stash some for handing out to fellow refugees.  Rotate stock.  Darn, that means you do have to eat the stuff or give it away!:-)

      Note about cellphones: keep the batteries charged.  A dead phone is no good for anything except possibly as a last-ditch weapon to throw at raccoons who try to get at your food, and they probably won't care.  

      Spare gerbils.  Always good to have fresh gerbils on hand, just in case.  You never know when you're going to need one.  In fact I'll bet that gerbils were the last thing on your mind when you were reading this (see?).  OK, now I'm being deliberately silly.  But the rest of the stuff above is serious.  

    •  Excellent and informative! Thanks! n/t (1+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      sarahnity

      Never, never brave me, nor my fury tempt:
        Downy wings, but wroth they beat;
      Tempest even in reason's seat.

      by GreyHawk on Sat Jan 12, 2008 at 08:13:35 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  We had a 21-hour power outage on campus this week (13+ / 0-)

    A bolt of lightning hit a power substation and set it on fire. Egads!

    Not very much of a disaster, despite the fact that there was also some flooding on the roads.

    This is mid-Michigan in early January, mind you!

    "Voting only gets you a 'D'" - Howard Dean | Great Lakes, Great Times, Great Scott

    by ScottyUrb on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:05:31 PM PDT

    •  power out for a week in Davis CA; and phones... (8+ / 0-)

      according to a friend in the area.

      If your phone service was on Comcast cable, it probably crapped out after about 2 hours when the battery backup in your basement ran down.  Ditto cellphones where the towers are on AC mains power & battery backups.  

      Good luck calling 911 if you had a crime, fire, or medical emergency.  Good luck staying in touch with family, friends, work, and school during the storms and outages.

      That's not acceptable, and you can solve this one yourself easily.  

      It illustrates the point that residential telephone should be "central battery" (power comes from the telco central office) rather then "local battery" (power comes from AC mains & battery backup at your house).  This means "POTS" (Plain Old Telephone Service), not Comcast cable or VOIP or fiber or other new-fangled BS that's designed with complete obliviousness to disaster resilience.

      Small business telephone should at least have power failure backup jacks that go directly to the outside lines.  

      And in both cases you need telephones that do not require AC mains power (no batteries, no AC adaptors, look for old fashioned conventional touchtone phones at flea markets or Ebay).  

      Also my friend reported that people in Davis seemed panicky as they ran around looking for supplies that were unavailable.  Bottled water (no well pump with the power out), propane gas (want food?), and a few other items were particularly hard to get.  People in Davis need some serious education about disaster preparedness. At least there were no reported outbreaks of lawlessness (and Davis also has a PD with a reputation for being strict).  

      Anyway, even if you're not a doomer, you need to be prepared for normal range of disasters both natural and economic and other.  As Katrina proved, we cannot count on this incompetent Regime to do jack-squat for us in a disaster, and it'll probably take the next administration at least a year probably two to get FEMA back in good shape.  So plan ahead now.

      And remember: one of your strongest assets in a disaster is your community, the people around you, your family and your friends and your neighbors.  Humans got as far as they did only because they can work together.

  •  My grandparents lost their insurance... (15+ / 0-)

    ...because their home is too close to the shore.  They are profiled as being at risk for rising sea levels due to global warming.  They got another policy from someone else, eventually, at about 10 times the premium.

    "Fascism should rather be called corporatism, as it is the merging of government and corporate power." --Benito Mussolini

    by revelwoodie on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:10:11 PM PDT

    •  ouch! (6+ / 0-)

      That really stinks. Something like that could be a complete financial disaster for a lot of people. And I imagine moving (even if you wanted to) would be tricky, because it'd be a lot harder to sell a house that's been slapped with that kind of warning (and those insurance prices).

      Hope your grandparents are managing!

    •  sell and move. (3+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      TexDem, ladybug53, anotherdemocrat

      Given the increased prevalence of severe storms due to climate change, if you live that close to a coast line, MOVE.    Sell the house and move.  Doesn't matter if you have to take a loss on the sale price right now, the house you buy will also have taken a hit on their intended price too, so you come out even in the deal.  Or do the unthinkable (heh) and live in a smaller house.  

      There is no excuse for living in a place where you have a foreseeable large risk that can easily be avoided.  

      And yes, I have zero sympathy for people who live on steep hillsides, because they are asking for it.  All the reinforced concrete piers in the world add up to doodly-squat when a hillside gets soaked and the mud starts to shift, or when a large quake hits.  It should frankly be illegal to have children in houses of that sort.  And it's not like people live in those places because they're poor and have no other option.  

      •  Actually, my grandparents live... (7+ / 0-)

        ...close to a mile from the ocean.  In the woods.  In a small house that my grandfather built with only the help of his wife and best friend.  They've lived in that house for 60 years.  My mother grew up in that house.  I grew up in that house.  I can't imagine them moving.  Realistically, they will depart this earth before the sea levels rise to their door.  It would break my heart to see them leave home now.

        "Fascism should rather be called corporatism, as it is the merging of government and corporate power." --Benito Mussolini

        by revelwoodie on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 03:29:20 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  While I'm not that sympathetic... (5+ / 0-)

        ...to people who live on the beach or anywhere in California, I live on a "steep hillside" that is the lower south slope of Mount Mitchell, possibly the oldest mountain in the world. In a cabin that is a century old and well-protected by a side-ridge from mud slides.

        Such things need to be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. But we can't get insurance anyway, because we heat with wood. Seems they won't insure anything without "Central Heat" despite the fact that my wood stove is centrally located and does a fine job of heating the house. More probably they're concerned about our non-dependence on gas or electric, since we live in the woods, next to the National Forest, where there's plenty of fuel. Go figure.

        •  interesting.... (3+ / 0-)

          Recommended by:
          sarahnity, Joy Busey, revelwoodie

          I agree, case by case.  As with the person above whose family built their place by hand.  And your situation is a lot different from what I see in the Oakland Hills where it's all about the 16 to 24 foot tall reinforced concrete stilts to hold up 3/4 of a building that's cantilevered out over a 50-degree incline like a drunk who's barely hanging on to a merry-go-round.  

          As for insurance, f--- 'em and their central heat.  As the peak oil & gas situation unwinds, central heat will be a quaint memory, and you'll be toasty warm with your closed-carbon-cycle wood fire whist those who depend on gas or oil for heat will be freezing in the dark.  

          Me & mine are planning to go rural as soon as we can get the land in our desired areas plural.  Heat will be solar thermal backed up by wood stoves, which I understand meets code.  And given what the world is facing, the real physical hazards of ecological instabilities & resource crises, we're going to see insurance companies rolling over with all four paws up in the air, so it's not like their magical pieces of paper are going to be worth anything anyway.  

          One could put it this way:  "In God we trust," and in ourselves and our neighbors we trust, but in paperwork and distant corporations I do not trust.

          •  Going rural... (2+ / 0-)

            Recommended by:
            sarahnity, revelwoodie

            ...was our dream, we made it true 15 years ago. Land was cheap here (and is cheap still - ssshhhh! Don't tell people!). We've 9 acres - that's "more or less," which means they put a grid over an overhead plot and charged us for 9, but it's so up and down there's actually 13 if you walk it. The land is worth far more than the cabin (which is a nice home for us, but would no doubt be demolished for a log McMansion if we sold). Have an acre of terraced gardens, a vineyard and orchard with cherries, apples and pears. All organically farmed since... forever.

            The wood stove's in the basement, which is only half a basement since it's dug into the mountainside and opens out to open air. The pipe goes straight up through the main floor and loft before exiting, which means we get more heat from the pipe than the stove. It also means the carbon exhaust is very minimal. It works great, there's no better heat. Hubby says wood is the only fuel that warms you twice - once when you cut and split it, then again when it's 10º outside!

            People these days are far removed from the truth about their footprints on the earth. Tread lightly, e.e. cummings said, and we do. These friendly mountains are so abundant! We could eat fine on wildings if we had to, and the medicinals are significant. In my woods I've stands of ginseng, goldenseal and a whole mountainside of black cohosh. There's bloodroot, Joe Pye, Jerusalem Artichokes and ground nuts galore, more kudzu than anybody could ever eat!

            If it all goes away tomorrow we'll be okay. The trick is not losing it to The Man at the bank!!!

            •  Can I move in? (2+ / 0-)

              Recommended by:
              sarahnity, Joy Busey

              It sounds lovely.  I've been committed to urban living for many years now, for environmental and social reasons.  But I just looked out the window of my rowhouse, and there was no black cohosh.  I'm a litte sad now!

              "Fascism should rather be called corporatism, as it is the merging of government and corporate power." --Benito Mussolini

              by revelwoodie on Sat Jan 12, 2008 at 07:35:15 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Alas, the cabin's dinky... (2+ / 0-)

                Recommended by:
                sarahnity, revelwoodie

                ...at a mere 28' square (with loft and half basement). Grown daughter turned the shed into her own cabin years ago. Chestnut from this very property, back way before the blight. Big enough for us and grandson #1 (a senior in HS this year), not much floor space for company.

                There is, however, lots of land-space, and a ridge on which a solid wind-baffled cabin with lots of windows could give you a 360º surround of Greybeard, Pinnacle and the Black Brothers plus Heartbreak Ridge to the piedmont. And we've a 120-foot high geyser at the entrance to the driveway, surrounded by parkland and a well-stocked trout creek too!

                I'd only consider Kossacks, though. Committed ones (who will help with the vineyard and garden)! Who don't mind big gatherings several times a year with lots of campers in the yard...

              •  Oh... and I forgot... (1+ / 0-)

                Recommended by:
                sarahnity

                20 holes of "challenging" championship disc golf courses. 10 on the top, another 10 in the bottomland along the creek, and potentially another 10 at High Field.

                If you live here you have to play occasionally, particularly in the post New Year's Kudzu Open. It's a workout (that keeps us young!).

  •  Perfect diary to hotlist or print. (16+ / 0-)

    Thanks for this!  Great work!

  •  AlphaGeek (15+ / 0-)

    Had a great emergency series a couple years ago, right after Katrina. Here is the first diary in the five-diary series, which has links to the rest of them in it.

    Nice lists you've got! I love lists, unfortunately I'm better at making lists than I am at sticking to them. But even so, I'm pretty well prepared for emergencies. I experienced being unprepared in the '89 Loma Prieta earthquake. It sucks.

  •  We had a power outage for 12 hours on Christmas (12+ / 0-)

    Eve - It started to get a tad chilly, but fortunately I have a gas fireplace to snuggle up to, but if it had lasted overnight, it would have been in the 40's in here.  My neighbors have generators - so I may need to look into purchasing one also. I'm more concerned about the economic disaster that is looming - I've already had 2 neighbors who have lost their homes due to forclosure and several friends who have lost jobs.  Your list of preparedness is excellent though - and I thank you for it.

    "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." - JFK

    by moose67 on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:16:57 PM PDT

    •  It turns out these weren't that expensive (8+ / 0-)

      By using stuff I already had, and shopping around, these weren't every expensive at all to put together.  The biggest investment was the time I spent figuring out what should go in each one and tracking down the best price for things I had to buy.  I think the most expensive single thing I had to buy was the flashlight/radio which came in a 2 pack for about $30.    The mylar blankets I found for $0.68 each (plus shipping) on line, when they were more like $2 each in local stores.

      Frugal Fridays, where the cheap come to chat.

      by sarahnity on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:26:24 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  economic disasters (9+ / 0-)

      Yes, most of us here are pretty good at planning for physical disasters.  However, many of us are in trouble when it comes to planning for disasters of the economic and administrative types.  Disasters that come in the form not of rain or snow or howling wind, but of paper with fine print and numbers on it.  That makes sense because humans did not evolve to be paperwork-munchers.

      Pay down consumer debt.  Do not incur debt for anything that is not a vital necessity such as housing, food, or medical care.  If you have to use debt mechanisms such as credit cards for food, it's time to do a serious review of your economic situation.  Stop buying consumer crap-ola and start saving money.  Keep your savings at a local credit union, which is generally safer than big banks or S&Ls.  Save enough money to cover three months of expenses with no income.  Live as frugally as possible.  

      If you're so poor that any kind of savings have been impossible thus far, then you need to get together with friends and look for ways to collectively decrease expenses and increase income, and then start savings, even a dollar a week in a piggy bank, and give each other mutual support to keep it up.  And you need plans to consolidate households in the event of evictions.  Buying food in bulk collectively can be very very helpful in reducing cost of food.   Car pooling.  Watching each others' kids instead of hiring a baby sitter.  Substitute your own collective labor for things that you would otherwise pay money for.  

      In general:  Use your strength & smarts to outsmart the paperwork monsters.  You can win this one.  

      •  Excellent point (5+ / 0-)

        We are probably all more in danger of a job loss than an earthquake.

        They always say time changes things, but you actually have to change them yourself. - Andy Warhol

        by 1864 House on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 03:41:17 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  actually... (1+ / 0-)

          Recommended by:
          sarahnity

          ..Where I live, within three minutes' bicycle ride of the Hayward fault, a major quake will translate to mass job loss and that will be the least of our worries.  

          I'm getting the hell away from here as quickly as I can save the $$ to do so.  

          But anyway, most of the disasters that most people face most of the time are all about the paperwork monsters trying to take a bite out of them.  All part of the rise of the Administrative State and the parasitic & predatory elements in the economy.  

          It'll be a good day when, in order to buy a house, all of this financial paperwork nonsense will be gone and people will have to demonstrate skills in carpentry, masonry, plumbing, and electrical.  

  •  Fabulous list (10+ / 0-)

    I'm printing it out and putting on the frig - we don't get much hurricane wind in my part of Florida, but you never know these days.  Thanks for all your hard work on this!

  •  First Aid Kits... (8+ / 0-)

    I'd at least get the training on how to use First Aid 00 you never know when you'll be out of gas, or crashed and need to fix someone fast (stopthebleeding, stopthebleeding, stopthebleeding). With a cell, that might not be too long.

    But still...

    Oh, and getting accredited isn't the smartest idea (they can sue you then...). weird american laws.

    Jesus ain't comin', go ahead and put the Nukes back now.

    by RisingTide on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:23:17 PM PDT

    •  It depends on where you are I guess (6+ / 0-)

      In California, we have "Good Samaritan" laws.  If you are accredited, you can't be sued for doing what you thought was best.  If you aren't I think you can be.  Where do you live that it is the opposite?

      Frugal Fridays, where the cheap come to chat.

      by sarahnity on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:28:52 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  PA. and I'm told that EMT's (1+ / 0-)

        Recommended by:
        sarahnity

        cannot stop CPR until a doctor says that the patient is dead.

        Jesus ain't comin', go ahead and put the Nukes back now.

        by RisingTide on Mon Jan 14, 2008 at 06:44:53 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Right, nobody can (1+ / 0-)

          Recommended by:
          RisingTide

          It's one of the things they teach you in CPR class.  You don't have to start, but if you do, you can't stop unless the patient is declared dead by a doctor or unless you are relieved by a medical professional (like an EMT).  Unless, of course, your own physical safety is in danger (i.e., you are in a burning building or in a car parked on railroad tracks with an oncoming train).  

          As for being sued, if you heard that from an EMT, the Good Samaritan laws don't protect people who are being paid for their services (EMTs, doctors in emergency rooms, etc.) but they do protect civilians who are certified and doctors who come upon the scene of an accident.  Here's the Pennsylvania law if you want to look it up:
          http://www.concentric.net/...

          You must be certified to be protected by this law.  If you aren't, you can be sued

          Frugal Fridays, where the cheap come to chat.

          by sarahnity on Mon Jan 14, 2008 at 08:59:30 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  This is utter insanity, and I would refuse to be (1+ / 0-)

            Recommended by:
            sarahnity

            paid.

            "If you start, you can't stop until the patient is declared dead by a doctor"??

            These laws presume more civilization than I'm likely to be in, should I ever be doing any sort of first aid (higher than bandages) -- i would just call a doctor otherwise.

            If there is no one there to send for help, and no estimated time of a good samaritan arriving (think weeks), how long should you continue to perform CPR? (two days? -- any more and you're at serious dehydration levels...).

            [can you tell I hike a lot?]

            Jesus ain't comin', go ahead and put the Nukes back now.

            by RisingTide on Mon Jan 14, 2008 at 10:15:35 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  How long do you have to keep doing it...? (1+ / 0-)

            Recommended by:
            sarahnity

            If your physical safety is not in danger?
            Is that two days without sleep (serious dehydration risk), or does lack of sleep count in stopping?

            Jesus ain't comin', go ahead and put the Nukes back now.

            by RisingTide on Mon Jan 14, 2008 at 10:16:40 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I would presume (2+ / 0-)

              Recommended by:
              anotherdemocrat, RisingTide

              that stopping due to sheer exhaustion would not be a problem.  I haven't been trained as a CPR instructor and I don't know all the subtleties of the laws involved.  My impression after taking the class was that if you have a really good reason to stop, you of course are permitted, but that "I don't want to anymore cause this is gross or icky or tiring" is not a good enough reason.  Why don't you ask your instructor for details the next time you take a CPR class?  If you haven't taken such a class, now would be a good time, don't you think?  

              I really don't see your strenuous objections.  If you don't want to give CPR, or provide any first aid, no one is forcing you to do so.  All the laws are saying is that if you do try to help, that you should be trained to a minimal degree and should perform, to the best of your abilities, to the standards you were trained in.  If you do that, you cannot be held liable for any damage you may have inadvertently caused, or have failed to prevent.  Why is that so outrageous?  What sort of liability laws would you propose instead?

              Frugal Fridays, where the cheap come to chat.

              by sarahnity on Mon Jan 14, 2008 at 11:37:15 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

  •  I guess (10+ / 0-)

    I've never bothered to formally put something like this together for my house.  The power once went off for 3 days, but we still had hot running water, the woodstove was enough to keep us and the pipes reasonably warm, I always have candles and a kerosene lamp on hand.  And enough dry staples in the cupboards to keep us for at least a week.  There's a stream less than a mile from us and I learned how to make any water potable years back.  No earthquakes, no tornadoes, no hurricanes, we're too high for a flood, ice and wind storms is as bad as we get.  Nuclear war - the experts mostly seem to say 'pray you're at ground zero'.

    I did make sure my husband's car has a flashlight, tools, flare, first aid kid and a sleeping bag in it.  He can't even get cell phone access on the part of his commute that isn't near a house.  However, he does know how to keep warm in a snowbank!  

    So, I guess that puts us on the 'slacker' list....

    "Civility costs nothing and buys everything." - Mary Wortley Montagu

    by sarac on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:27:54 PM PDT

  •  car kits (10+ / 0-)

    are important. Last year here in PA we had the Valentine's Day Blizzard. A few trucks got stuck in the ice and snow on Interstate 78, trapping motorists behind them on a 50-mile stretch of highway. With the storm (and fecklessness of some people), emergency crews couldn't clear the trucks off the highway, and a lot of people were in their cars in freezing weather for 24 hours. It was ugly.

  •  very helpful, Sarah. Thank you! (8+ / 0-)

    Why do you think the likelihood of a disaster where all of society breaks down is so remote?

    •  It would take something really big, for one (7+ / 0-)

      Even in Hurricane Katrina, the effects were pretty localized geographically.  If you had a car with a tank of gas, you could get out to a region that wasn't affected at all.

      So it would need to be something of that magnitude that affected a vast geographic region and the only thing I can think of like that would be a full on nuclear war between super-powers.  A single nuclear bomb wouldn't be enough.  

      Call me crazy, but I just don't see that happening.  

      Frugal Fridays, where the cheap come to chat.

      by sarahnity on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 02:38:36 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  And if it does... (5+ / 0-)

        Really, would two weeks worth of food and a crank radio be that much help?  

        They always say time changes things, but you actually have to change them yourself. - Andy Warhol

        by 1864 House on Fri Jan 11, 2008 at 03:43:12 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  For my area the potential explosion of (4+ / 0-)

        the Yellowstone volcano would prevent me from being able to escape on a tank of gas.  If/when Yellowstone goes, the entire upper midwest will be gone.  Basically anything north of Arkansas/Missouri border and east to Pennsylvania would be gone.

        Now what are the chances of Yellowstone of going off in the foreseeable future.  Not very likely, but one never knows.

        The next disaster that could affect me and would be more than localized would be the New Madrid fault going off again.  It's about due again.  It's been 200 years since the last one and its apparent cycle is 200-250 years.

        Should the New Madrid go, the state of Missouri to Minneapolis, MN, to Ohio will have significant damage due to buildings not being retrofitted.  Most new buildings have to meet seismic codes.  I know that I've felt earthquakes with epicenters in Indiana here in eastern Iowa.