Is Edwards done?

I know this is not going to go well here. But isn't it time (or won't it be time soon) to admit that Edwards is out of the picture? OK, OK, I'll be a little more patient and give you until South Carolina, but fact is that he seems to be dropping slowly. He hasn't done all that great during the debates and he is definitely an afterthought for most, except a core group of irreductibles.

I know the polls have shown recently that they are volatile. And we also all know that there is not necessarily a connection between what the media focuses on and what the public thinks. But it definitely feels like we now have a face to face matchup. In my mind, Hillary is still the candidate to beat, but I am very uncertain as to how all the noise surrounding her negative campaign will play out.

•  i heard the far far outside shot on news today

  one of the broadcasts claimed that his shot is if the frontrunner gets crippled by Buyers Remorse by the public... but with the cramped campaign schedule, I'd have to retort... please, pass the butter

  by Steven R on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:05:25 AM PDT

  •  well

    if you mean by "buyers remorse" that people feel compelled by the media to choose either Hillary or Barrack or the "other one" might win, then, yes.

    As soon as Barrack won Iowa the media had their payday storyline, even though Edwards finished a strong second. They immediately painted Edwards as "too angry" - which is odd considering the voters ARE angry.

    But there is hope in Nevada where I'm hearing a lot of talk that union members are starting to look at Edwards in spite of their leaders' endorsements.

    However, we must go back to my first point. Will they have the nerve to vote their conscience instead of playing the media's game?

    Stay tuned.

    by BuckMulligan on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:21:28 AM PDT

    •  Not to be a dick but...

      it's spelled Barack.

      by recusancy on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:48:59 AM PDT

      •  If Barack wants to win the nomination,

        he'd better hope that Edwards stays in, because the numbers show that if it's between Obama and Clinton, Clinton will probably win easily.  

        http://www.openleft.com/...

        by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:21:34 AM PDT

        •  Very interesting.

          Thanks for the link.

          by jct on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:41:28 AM PDT

          •  This is what I've suspected all along.

            Edwards supporters will not necessarily go to Obama.  The general public is still largely undecided.  The primary process is going so fast that there has been little time for people who aren't political junkies to keep up.  For those of us on-line, the cult-like nature of Obama's supporters on the internet and their angry attacks on anyone who dares to question their candidate have turned many people off.  I started off excited about Obama and at this point, I'd vote for Hillary if it were a two-person race.

            by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 09:11:30 AM PDT

  •  I'll try to find a link on this Trippi remark....

    but according to MSNBC several days ago, right after NH, Trippi himself was reportedly describing their situation as: "hanging on to the edge of the drain, hoping we don't get sucked in, and waiting to see if either of the other two have a serious meltdown."

    This was secondhand during one of KO's segments of coverage, but if that's an accurate quote and that's coming from Trippi himself, magic 8 ball says things look bleak ahead.

    My next thought was, if you're running the campaing and still trying to raise $, why in the world do you let this remark get recorded?

    by Ericwmr on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:24:08 AM PDT

    •  eh, drudge blog is the best I could find...

      Yea, Drudge blog is the best I could find, but the quote cited generally squares with what was televised as NH results emerged.

      To quote Edward's man, Joe Trippi, "We're just trying to get out of the way of a bullet called Obama. We'll try to hang around and keep circling the drain and see if we can be the last one left." Not exactly an endorsement for a bright future if one's name isn't Barack, but Trippi's been around long enough to know a fait accompli when he sees it.

      http://www.drudge.com/...

      by Ericwmr on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:29:59 AM PDT

    •  After 2004, this shocks you?

      if you're running the campaing and still trying to raise $, why in the world do you let this remark get recorded?

      The hacks who run Dem presidential campaigns are woefully out of touch with the electorate.

      I fear we're going to end up with a Huckabee Administration in Jan the way things are going.

      by Sharon Jumper on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:51:57 AM PDT

      •  Never Huck: He's getting crazier by the day.

        But Mitt is a scary possibility, especially as he's been developing a more populist message.

        Sure, it's fake, like everything else about Mitt. But his people saw that Huck and Edwards were getting a good response with it, so they went for it.

        I'm wondering if turning the rich guy into the "populist" is crazy enough to work.

        by Bush Bites on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:00:41 AM PDT

        •  Wanna bet a virtual beer?

          by Sharon Jumper on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:14:06 AM PDT

•  This is a diary?

  It belongs in the Open Thread, not taking up space on the diary list. It's a ongoing question, to which you have added nothing new.

  by bewert on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:08:08 AM PDT

  •  "Fight On" is trying to deflate Edwards' campaign

    Deflated, devalue, diminish, eliminate...

    "Fight On" ...  John does  fight on.

    by LakeThomas on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 06:20:48 AM PDT

•  Done?

  He's just getting warmed up!

  I think it's time for Clinton and Obama to consider dropping out of the race and throw their support behind Edwards.

  by Rex Manning on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:08:51 AM PDT

  •  all three of them need to drop out

    and throw teir support behind gravel!

    by Turkana on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:45:09 AM PDT

•  Edwards has pretty much peaked

  and won't be getting much above 20% anytime in the future while HRC and BHO are in the 30's and above.  I'm afraid he is running for VP now and it would be a mistake for either HRC or BHO to add him to a ticket.  He brought nothing to Kerry in 2004, he didn't even win NC for the Dems, and he would do nothing in 2008.  JRE for DOJ!!!

  by jaf49 on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:09:27 AM PDT

  •  Nah.

    He's just biding his time while Clinton and Obama go all ugly on each other which will lead to the public becoming disgusted with them then John Edwards will become the clear choice for real change based on real policy proposals.

    by Rex Manning on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:13:06 AM PDT

    •  when exactly will this

      happen and will it be in time?

      by Number5 on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:52:16 AM PDT

      •  It's happening right now.

        by Rex Manning on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:59:07 AM PDT

•  No...

  he's not done. BTW, in case you missed the NH debate...he won that one.....big time. One more thing, study the polls nationally and in NV, Edwards is trending up not down, no matter what the MSM says.  

  by sarahlane on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:11:11 AM PDT

  •  27-25-14-12 latest Edwards Nevada poll numbers

    hardly trending upwards.

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/...

    by Steve Everett on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:16:25 AM PDT

    •  Actually he is up 5-15 points

      as a trend line in each of the polls since December.

      He is not in first, but his numbers are trending up.

      by GunLovinDem on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:45:03 AM PDT

      •  I haven't heard one pollster willing to stand by

        their numbers - not one.  There are too many variables in play.  Nobody has a clue.  Admit it.  Deal with it.

        by llbear on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:51:50 AM PDT

      •  Not in Nevada

        or anywhere else that I've seen. He is holding steady at 13-15 in South Carolina.

        http://www.realclearpolitics.com/...

        If he'd go ahead and endorse Barack then this thing would be over and John could have himself a quality position in the Obama administration. Lot of talk about attorney general. I tend to believe Edwards is too political for that job but certainly there could be a cabinet position he could be a great fit for.

        by Steve Everett on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:05:18 AM PDT

        •  Edwards supporters won't go to

          Obama, certainly not in South Carolina.  He is getting the conservative white Democrats in SC.  They will go to Clinton if Edwards drops out.  Same with most of the deep south states.  

          I'm an Edwards supporter, and I would vote for Clinton second.  Of course, it won't matter what I do here in Mass., because Clinton is leading Obama by double digits.

          by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:28:01 AM PDT

          •  Not sure why any that considers themselves

            conservative would necessarily choose HRC instead of Obama.

            by Steve Everett on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:27:38 AM PDT

            •  From what I've been reading,

              most voters in SC and elsewhere do not really have a clear idea of what the candidates actually stand for.  The process has been going too fast for most people to keep up with.  Here is an article that explains why Obama needs Edwards to stay in the race.

              http://www.openleft.com/...

              by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 09:07:17 AM PDT

  •  Winning debates is not enough

    Kucinich won a fair share of the debates he participated in and where did that get him?

    by Sagebrush Bob on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 02:08:00 AM PDT

  •  He has done far better in most

    of the debates than Obama, that's for sure.

    by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:23:57 AM PDT

•  Thanks a bunch...

  ...for giving us through South Carolina.

  Do you really not have anything better to do with your time?

  T.

  by trevzb on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:11:50 AM PDT

  •  I Thought that was Very Benevolent of

    the diarist to give us through South Carolina.

    What a smary load of crap!

    Here's a GREAT (and short) video of John Edwards.

    by Ranting Roland on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:38:45 AM PDT

•  I never thought he had a chance

  by Steve Everett on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:13:51 AM PDT

•  He's done when he says he's done.

  Diaries like this do not help.

  by clonecone on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:19:39 AM PDT

•  You want a real answer?

  Ask the Edwards Campaign.

  by Quilldriver on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 12:31:33 AM PDT

•  Edwards and his supporters can do what they want.

  If they want to take it all the way to the convention to get their way in the platform committees, that's their right.

  by Bush Bites on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:02:06 AM PDT

•  I Hope Never

  From the beginning the media defined this as a 2 person race- Obama vs. Clinton.  If this had been the true 3 way race it was, we would know his position better. Given the hard economic times we face, I believe Edwards would have led the race since he is the only candidate with substantial progressive positions. But the corporate opposition against any seriously progressive candidate is great.

  As I have written before, Edwards is the first truly progressive candidate that I have seen in my 60 years of living to run in a mainstream political party.  I hope he goes all the way.  He has successfully set the agenda for the other candidates, I hope he is in a position to help set the agenda of the party at the convention..  

  And then I hope he helps lead a grassroots movement for genuine progressive social change.  I hope he is here to stay!

  by sarakandel on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:02:07 AM PDT

  •  Maybe he should run as a third party candidate.

    That way he can continue fighting for his movement even after he loses the nomination.  

    And if he loses as a third party candidate, maybe he should start his own country.  

    by Dumbo on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:08:35 AM PDT

    •  Your nic sure looks real prophetic right now

      by funluvn1 on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 03:19:06 AM PDT

    •  5 minute rule.

      Thinking seriously about the TR.
      That was completely uncalled for and very disrespectful.  Do you really consider yourself a Democrat?

      by Fabian on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 03:33:11 AM PDT

      •  "somebody" might consider

        removing their uprate.

        by Fabian on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 03:34:03 AM PDT

    •  Stupid comment.

      Edwards has shown no sign that he's not a loyal Democrat.  There is nothing wrong with candidates running to get their message included in the public discussion and the party platform.  If you don't like it, too bad.  Furthermore, Edwards is slowing down Clinton and helping Obama by staying in, so Obama and his fans had better hope Edwards hangs in.

      by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:32:07 AM PDT

      •  Biden, Richardson, Edwards et al have all shown

        merit, but change is in the air.  

        Too bad they couldn't raise enough chips in 2008, but that is the reality "those in charge of the primaries" made it "money imperative".

        Blame the DLC more than anybody for the status quo.

        by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:39:31 AM PDT

        •  OK. Let me get this straight.

          Are you a Clinton supporter or an Obama supporter?  I have been assuming Obama, but maybe I misunderstood.  

          The numbers show clearly that in the upcoming primaries in Nevada and South Carolina, if the race were between Obama and Clinton, Hillary would win handily.  So if you are an Obama supporter, why would you want Edwards to drop out now?

          Obama needs to win both Nevada and South Carolina, or he has no chance.  Again, the DLC is fine with either Clinton or Obama.  That is the reason they both have massive support from corporate sources.
           

          by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 09:04:06 AM PDT

      •  By a poster named "Dumbo"

        ahem

        by LakeThomas on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 06:22:35 AM PDT

•  It ain't done

  until Edwards himself says it's done.

  So why you asking us?  The answers are wholly predictable.  I'm for Edwards so my answer is, of course he isn't done.

  by sima on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:09:44 AM PDT

•  then why do it?

  I know this is not going to go well here.

  if edwards wins enough delegates to prevent hillary or obama from winning, he will hold all the cards.

  by Turkana on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 01:43:43 AM PDT

•  It's late and I'm tired and I'm sorry

  I can't remember which pundit on HuffPo (but it was one of the smarter ones) wrote two days ago that Edwards "would be a fool" to throw in the towel now.  Not only because why give up the 15% of delegates he should easily get, thereby becoming kingmaker at the convention, but because that delegate number will also give him the leverage to insert some of his own planks into the Democratic platform.  Those panting for him to drop out would seem to have a good future in the media which can only focus on a two-person narrative.  

  by planetclaire4 on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 02:08:01 AM PDT

•  No Edwards is not "done" and this is a digusting

  excuse for a diary.Edwards has said he is in this through the convention and I support him.I frankly don't give a rats patoot what anyone things abiout it and could care less whether he destroys either Hillary or Barack's chances. If nothing else, I hope we get a brokered convention and they have to let him be kingmaker.

  by Saracat on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 02:41:47 AM PDT

•  Gee, thanks for giving me until South Carolina

  and all your other idiocy.

  Now go be concerned about whatever positive things you might be able to address and don't worry about JRE.

  by funluvn1 on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 03:17:30 AM PDT

•  Edwards for Attorney General

  Richardson for VP....

  It is time to think, fighting the DLC can be done one of two ways, throwing stones or uncle johns band.

  Time for the coalition to commence, the ALL STAR cabinet to present to the voters.

  It is NOT detailed policy, but getting some trusted/tested statesmen to lead the various conversations.

  The GOP voter is tired of Shrubspeak, and Obama has the  oratorial skills to express the newer directions.

  by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 03:24:46 AM PDT

  •  I nominate Obama for press secretary.

    Perfect job.  Spend lots of time in front of the cameras, use his considerable wits, charm and good looks.

    by Fabian on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 03:36:41 AM PDT

    •  I prefer to remember Carter campaign, his attempt

      to educate by wearing the sweater, pushing conversations, doing it the honest-est way.

      Less Perino and SnowJobs, more "big ideas" delivered in a way that is impressing Iowa farmers.

      by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 03:47:05 AM PDT

      •  Wonder if Reagan could have pulled the sweater

        trick off?

        Maybe if Noonan had written him a good speech to go with it?

        by Fabian on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 03:54:43 AM PDT

        •  Reagan never would have survived in THESE

          times, of media replacement.

          That was the point, Reagan could communicate using 1980 media, but scrutiny/transparency of his hatchet job cronies would have ripped that Emporor's clothes off quite quickly had we owned these linked computers.

          That is also the undoing of HRC, letting TaylorMarsh and Hillaryis44 show us "the face of her campaign."

          by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:36:06 AM PDT

    •  & that is the reality, the Iowa strategy Edwards

      employed, for like 4 years, didn't payoff.  

      Not to diminutize Edwards supporters, but 2008 just wasn't going to be easy or forgiving, or even FAIR, with the frontloaded, money driven primary season.

      And Edwards has gained esteem in my eyes, he was irrelevant mere months ago.

      Gore could have kicked all asses, but once he was gone, fresh is the fad.

      by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 03:53:49 AM PDT

      •  diminutize?

        by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:37:01 AM PDT

        •  Edwards supporters are VERY important...

          NOW WHAT?  

          His attitude toward Wall Street and PAC's will be better achieved INSIDE the tent.

          by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:41:48 AM PDT

          •  um...I was questioning the word.

            It's a new one on me.  I couldn't find it in the dictionary.  I can't recall what your comment was about.

            by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 08:57:01 AM PDT

    •  LOL!

      Why not?  He's not doing much in his current job in the Senate.  

      by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:36:01 AM PDT

      •  His attendence pre Jan 2006 was excellent

        Fighting the DLC requires what it requires, and the whole Senate, led by Reid/Shumer is a joke.

        by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:43:28 AM PDT

        •  Sorry, I don't get your point.

          Are you saying Obama is fighting the DLC?  Why are they backing him then?

          by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 08:58:29 AM PDT

      •  as Edwards did when he was there; n/t

        by mihan on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:04:20 AM PDT

        •  Senators in Roman times were nearly as worthless

          as they are now.

          As a whole.

          Without Wellstone, they had no soul.

          by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:06:45 AM PDT

          •  Wellstone!

            You mean Paul Wellstone?  The same Paul Wellstone that Obama called "something of a gadfly?"

            by Boston Boomer on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 09:00:08 AM PDT

•  It seems to me that its entirely possible

  no Democratic candidate will secure enough votes by the convention to have a clear winner.

  Certainly, if the Democrats go into covention without having picked a candidate, Edwards will still be in the race.

  by bobdevo on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:37:17 AM PDT

•  if he doesn't win either Nevada or South Carolina

  but that doesn't mean he shouldn't stay in the race. He may always get around 10% in states he doesn't even compete in, and he can direct his delegates to nominate for change at the convention.

  by mihan on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 04:58:39 AM PDT

  •  I have a dream, that nobody plays Kingmaker

    and Teamwork will whup the DLC.

    Elizabeth's health got a lot of mention last spring, and I sincerely hope she can avoid the stress of being the counterpuncher to Bill.

    by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:03:22 AM PDT

•  I don't know. Given a choice between

  Barrack Reagan, Donald Rodham Trump and John Edwards, I sure hope Edwards ain't done.

  by java4every1 on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:03:40 AM PDT

•  He is running for Vice President in case the

  election is not decided by the time the primaries have ended.

  Isn't that fairly obvious?

  by rontripp on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:16:04 AM PDT

  •  He is Running to Keep Alive the Ideas..

    That Democracy is not an Auction
    That Democrats are not Republican Clones
    That Republic and Empire cannot exist simultaneously
    That there is Educational Politics and there is Phony Dogwhistle Politcs
    That race and gender really ARE not worth looking at in leaders
    That Corporate Convenience is the opposite of Democratic Hard Work
    That Capital and Labor really ARE equal
    That Economic systems must be moral as well as effective.
    That People matter, and that Americans will always do the right thing, eventually.  

    That the government of the people, by the people and for the people shall not perish from the earth.

    I am with John Edwards until the Convention, and after, since the power of his simple ideas will succeed, or the Republic will fail. It is very simple.

    by OregonOak on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:33:56 AM PDT

•  I tend to be a conspiratist about

  this.

  Almost every republican candidate is given full coverage in the news, not just the two top contenders.  We see shots of Thompson at his rallies even when there are only 15 people there.  We see pictures of Rudy riding on a fire truck in a supposed parade in Florida when there was no parade and the only people there were those on the truck and the camera people.

  They say Thompson has to get moving and Rudy absolutely has to do something but there is never talk that either of them should drop out of the race.

  Why are there calls for Edwards to drop out of the race?  Is his showing worse than Rudy's or Thompson's?  

  by nupstateny on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:21:45 AM PDT

  •  Edwards & Obama, shoulder to shoulder vs Faux

    Media as a whole worries about being frozen out by boycott, and media as a whole took wrath out on Edwards.

    by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:55:12 AM PDT

    •  And that can also be generalized on WHICH are

      gping to buy future ad time.

      by Theghostofkarlafayetucker on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 05:56:22 AM PDT

  •  That was insightful

    good morning!

    Are you anywhere near Salamanca?  I want to go XC skiing there starting Feb 1 and need some snow.

    by LakeThomas on Sat Jan 19, 2008 at 06:26:58 AM PDT