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I think I stated this already but just to make sure that you get the story right: I am a guy from Austria and I am married to a wonderful woman from the USA. We are relocating within the next 10 days to the US.

Yesterday I drove home from work and had my wife on the phone. She told me about what's going on right now in the country that we have decided to life in. Guys, I was simply shocked...

When she told me that people damage cars of Obama supporters, when she told me that crowds are standing in front of voting points and yell at voters, when she told me that Obama supporters knocking on doors are attacked, when she told me that people recieve letters, stating that their family will be killed if they go on supporting Obama, when she told me that people tried to vote for Obama but the voting machine switched the vote to McCain - a picture came to my mind that is based on the stories my grandpa told me when I was a kid. It was the picture of Germany in 1938 and before.

I was told a lot of these stories and I learned a lot about this time in school because people here want to make sure that that can happen NEVER AGAIN. And yesterday my wife told me that it starts again, just slightly different, now in the USA.

I shocked my wife right after she told me all this, because I said that these right wingnuts (I think that was the term she used) are acting like the Nazis did here in Europe. She was shocked because I used the term Nazi, a term I usually do not use because from my point of view this is the worst thing you can say about someone. But still I can not find another word to describe this. It is simply shocking and terrible.

So far I was more or less independent. Yesterday changed my life and my political oppinion completely. From now on I will do EVERYTHING I can in order to help Obama to win. As soon as we are in our new home (in a swing state) I will get in contact with the local democrats and offer my help. I will drive people to vote if they can't make it on their own and if necessary I would even carry them to the voting point. I will spend some time every day in order to support my wife in her activities to support Obama.

I hate to do that, but I have to compare McCain and Palin with Hitler. The crowd starts to act in the same way. But the situation in the USA is much more dangerous. In Germany, Hitler had control over his crowd. By eliminating him politicly the situaion could have been stopped at the beginning. McCain lost this control already. People get crazy and he is standing beside, sometimes trying to calm down but with no effect. I he looses this election (and I pray to god he will), he will not be able to stop the crowd. It will be on us, thinking people to show them the difference, to act in a different way, to help Obama to unite this country again.
This guy is not able to control his own party, so why do people think he would be able to lead a nation?

Having the picture of Germany 1938 in mind I think it is time to act now.

If 20 people show up at a voting point,yelling at people who are on their way to vote, show up with 40 people without jelling, just showing that voters are not alone.

If you try to vote and the machine switches your vote, use your cell to videotape it and send it to the big news-channels.

More suggestions very welcome...

I am moving to the US because I felt in love with my wife and with this country. I will not just sit down and watch a development that history already prooved wrong with a world war. I want to life in the UNITED States of Amerika, and this is why it is so important that Obama becomes president.

Originally posted to maninthemountains on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 01:27 AM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  This is it exactly (13+ / 0-)

    This guy is not able to control his own party, so why do people think he would be able to lead a nation?

    He can't manage a campaign.  As an officer in the military, he sucked.

    He's not a leader.  He's scary.

    Hope doesn't come from calculating whether the good news is winning out over the bad. It's simply a choice to take action. ~ Anna Lappe

    by Korry on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 01:40:40 AM PDT

    •  I fully agree (5+ / 0-)

      I do not want to blame this guy. Maybe he did a great job in the army, but I do not want him to lead a country.

      "The issue of economics is not something I've understood as well as I should. I've got Greenspan's book." -- McCain, as quoted in the Boston Globe, Dec. 17,

      by maninthemountains on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 01:42:32 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  There's an argument (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      scotths, maninthemountains
      to be made that McCain IS controlling his party. He's not oblivious to the antics his supporters are engaging in.

      The man has his political life on the line and is upping the ante daily to keep his dreams alive.

      Don't imagine for a second that I accept that the McCain-Palin campaign honors social decorum and works to appeal to a broader America! By design, the campaign appeals to a narrow faction of Americans; a desperate, militaristic, and reactive core.

      America has stumbled, fallen, and lost honor, grace, and respect.

      Like Germany in the 20's and 30's, America is suffering the same indignations. Nationalistic fervor insisted that "someone else was to blame" rather than looking within for the failures of policy and moral indiscretion.

      It is quite simple to blame anyone else for failures. The nature of all people is to blame while introspection will lead to a quicker solution.

      America saw red after 9-11... revenge was elevated beyond the goals of national security; Iraq became the whipping boy but not the solution to creating a safer state of security for America. The waste of resources, while immeasurable, is complete. Everyday that America wallows in Iraq further discredits any absurd claim of "Mission Accomplished". Ominous and equally benign is the goal... "Get Osama bin Laden". Our security solutions are beyond, and greater.

      I am impressed by the vision and capabilities of Barack Obama; a very rare unique blend of intelligence and courage. America's challenges are staggering yet can be overcome. The tactics of his administration will be secondary to actuating a strategy that creates a strong, unified America.

      What is this I hear of sorrow and weariness, Anger, discontent and drooping hopes... Life is too strong for you-- It takes life to love Life

      by Nebraska68847Dem on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 04:08:11 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  TipJar (29+ / 0-)

    "The issue of economics is not something I've understood as well as I should. I've got Greenspan's book." -- McCain, as quoted in the Boston Globe, Dec. 17,

    by maninthemountains on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 01:41:03 AM PDT

  •  I'm from the US.,,, (7+ / 0-)

    so I don't have your perspective but 1938 was probably too late(The Nazis were already in control, Germany and Austria by 38), what we are seeing is hopefully very limited and will end quickly. These thugs will not take over this country but will be isolated and stopped.

    CHRISTIAN, n. One who believes that the New Testament is a divinely inspired book admirably suited to the spiritual needs of his neighbor. A. Bierce

    by irate on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 01:41:17 AM PDT

  •  I mentioned this video in another diary (5+ / 0-)
    but I think it's worth mentioning here too. It's by Thom Hartmann and he lays out the parallels between the rise of Nazi Germany and the atmosphere in America today which are both startling and frightening:

    Video: When Democracy Failed

    "If a company is too big to fail, it is too big to exist." Sen. Bernie Sanders

    by Sagebrush Bob on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 01:42:23 AM PDT

  •  I appreciate your concern, but (5+ / 0-)

    in one crucial respect the United States is very much unlike Germany at any point in its history prior to 1949:

    America is, after all, a relatively stable democracy with a 232 year tradition. This democracy's institutions have outlived some pretty serious challenges, including eight years of Nixon and eight years of W. Never at any point in the 20th century were the United States even close to veering off into the realm of fascism, and there is no reason whatsoever to assume that it is happening now. It is America's destiny that democracy is the nation's political system of choice. Germany never embraced democracy prior to 1949 (when the Grundgesetzt was instituted). Germans throughtout the political spectrum, but particularly on the right, basically considered democracy as a product of western (i.e. Anglo-saxon) "civilization", which was firmly at odds with German "Kultur". Without the rhetoric that opposed "Kultur" to "Zivilisation" and, by implication, authoritarian rule to democracy, Hitler would never even remotely have been possible. I do not see anything of this kind or magnitude at work in this campaign.

    This said, McCain/Palin followers are racist thugs, and the rhetoric of Palin and other McCain surrogates clearly meets the standard of facist ideology as defined by Robert Paxton and, before him, Ernst Nolte (in his seminal 1963 book "Der Faschismus in seiner Epoche"): Where 19th century nationalism identifies other nations as opponents and potential enemies, fascism looks out for the enemy from within – as in "anti-America", "real Virginia", "pro-America regions".

    John McCain: Life begins at inheritance

    by Berliner2 on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 02:01:44 AM PDT

  •  Stand and Fight (3+ / 0-)

    Europe didn't stand and fight in the 1930's for a number of reasons, but one of the biggest it seems to me is because the rise of hate was gradual, like a lobster sitting in water, brought to boil slowly.  Well, now we know where all this can lead.  We must stop it and we will stop it.  I have no doubt we will.  What I don't know is how ugly it will be before it is stopped.  Whenever that is, though, we can't stop until that time comes.    

    •  I hope that it will not become much more ugly (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      mango, craiger

      from my point of view it's bad enough already. Nobody should live in fear because of his political oppinion.

      "The issue of economics is not something I've understood as well as I should. I've got Greenspan's book." -- McCain, as quoted in the Boston Globe, Dec. 17,

      by maninthemountains on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 02:09:29 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  needs (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      Europeans of the time did not have the luxury to stand and fight for high-minded principles because they were in the midst of financial catastrophe.

      Be mindful of Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and consider what Nazism offered at the time relative to what people had or did not have at that time.

      Consider also where "Real America" stands today on this hierarchy.  Conservatives are very insecure of even their "safety" with respect to employment, resources, morality, health, etc.  We cannot talk to them rationally about self-actualization in their current state of mind.  They have baser needs that remain unfulfilled, while once again we are facing a financial catastrophe.  These are very dangerous times.

  •  I don't think we Americans are... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    maninthemountains passive as people were in the '30s.  We can get pretty rowdy if pushed too far.

    Welcome to America!  And thank you for supporting Obama for president.

    It is easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them. Alfred Adler

    by Quicksilver2723 on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 02:42:58 AM PDT

  •  Godwin's Law (3+ / 0-)
    There's an internet concept known as Godwin's Law, which says that in any argument that goes on long enough, someone will compare the other side to Hitler, the Nazis, or Nazi Germany.  Godwin's Law proposes that making such a comparison means you have run out of substantive arguments.  Thus the usual shorthand for Godwin's Law:  "Anytime you compare your opponent to Hitler, the Nazis, or Nazi Germany, you lose by default."

    There are real differences between what we know about what's happening in the 2008 U.S. election and what we know about what happened in Hitler's rise to power.  The Weihmar Republic was only a marginally sovereign state, in that it did not have a total monopoly on the legitimate use of force within Germany.  Almost every political faction in interwar Germany had its own private army; for the Nazis this was the Sturmabteilung (SA) or Brown Shirts, so-called because they were outfitted with surplus African colonial uniforms.

    Political violence in interwar Germany was not only organized and commonplace, it was expected and indeed legitimized, in large part due to the harsh restrictions of the Treaty of Versailles.  The Polizei were comparatively small and impotent, and the Reichswehr was capped at 100,000, too small to defend Germany's borders.  The Friekorps were organized to fill that role, and formed the pattern for subsequent party militias.  The party militias could and did wear their uniforms in public, without fear of arrest, and they often scuffled in the streets.

    Indeed Adolf Hitler first encountered the Faktion that became the Nazi Party as a Reichwehr spy.  He was assigned to infiltrate the party and report on its activities.  Hitler was quickly so taken by its ideology that he resigned from the Reichwehr and joined the nascent party's leadership.  His doing so was no great cause for concern at the time, as the party was hiring many former soldiers into the SA.  This again shows how political violence - carried out by uniformed party militias - was not only common but expected in interwar Germany.  It was not secret, not even at the time.

    This is not true in the United States of 2008.  Yes, there have been threats and acts of violence against Obama supporters and the Obama campaign.  But they are not carried out by uniformed party militias acting without fear of arrest or legal sanction.  They are the work of criminals who - so far as we know - are acting alone or in small groups.  If many escape punishment, it's because vandalism is always difficult to investigate and prosecute.  There are rarely witnesses, and often few if any worthwhile forensic leads to follow.

    So Godwin's Law applies here.  It's a mistake to compare 2008 America to 1928 Germany on the basis of political violence.  In 1928 Germany that was violence by organized, uniformed party militias; in 2008 America it's violence by angry, stupid, and cowardly criminals.

    •  Godwin can go to hell (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      labradog, maninthemountains
      Sometimes the people in partisan gear calling for violence - then acting on that fervor - really are fascists.

      Getting between Americans and their right to vote. Not a good idea.

      by cskendrick on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 04:41:57 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Godwin's unproven theory is not law. (0+ / 0-)

      It is a means by which some people seek to avoid scaring themselves.

      I'm the plowman in the valley - with my face full of mud

      by labradog on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 05:21:21 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  I'd only refer this commenter to (0+ / 0-)

      Sinclair Lewis and It Can't Happen Here.

      Indeed, fascism in America does not look like fascism did (and does) in Germany.  It will be uniquely American, wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross, and somehow conflated with American individualism and exceptionalism.

      Article 6: " religious test shall *ever* be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the U.S."

      by billlaurelMD on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 05:34:48 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I am not worried (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    We will see more of this by individuals but I would not get too upset. There are a number of reports of Obama supporters scratching KKK on cars in Ohio that stopped in early to vote with McCain bumper stickers. It is part of politics that maybe we can change.

  •  My dad lived in England in '38. I (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    compare events here in the U.S. now, to what did go on in Nazi Germany. My Dad won't use the same words as do, but he agrees with me.

    I'm Exxon John and I approve this message---McCain's Scumbags

    by Obamacrat on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 04:09:01 AM PDT

  •  The vandal party has always been with us (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    MariaWr, maninthemountains

     I have never allowed anyone to put up a yard sign supporting any candidate on my property and I never put a bumper sticker of any kind on my truck. The mere possibility of my property being vandalized pisses me off too much to take the risk.

  •  If they want a civil war I say bring it (3+ / 0-)
    They can take their beatdown any way they please.

    I jus think their chances of getting back to power the peaceful, lawful way are a lot better than what will happen to their movement proves itself to be an existential danger to the Republic and is dealt with once and for all.

    Now perhaps they think they same of us. So be it.

    But they need to check on their logistics a bit more closely before they entertain bloodthirsty fantasties.

    And they need to take a closer look at ours.

    The young of this age are not their daddy's dirty hippies.

    And most of them do not like Republicans very much.

    Getting between Americans and their right to vote. Not a good idea.

    by cskendrick on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 04:46:05 AM PDT

  •  Write your Representatives (0+ / 0-)

    Tell them ENOUGH!

    We are all Droogie....f*ck the AP

    by crazyshirley2100 on Tue Oct 21, 2008 at 05:30:56 AM PDT

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