CHANGE.gov : empty "marketing" of citizen access? or real idea-submit mechanism?

The first thing that "got" me interested in Obama, back early in the primary process when I was not particularly engaged by him, was his concept he called "Google for Government". And the promise that if he became President he would use the web to bring to light for the average citizen all the processes of government, opening them up to full transparency.

And we've now seen a first instance of this in the transition-initiative website change.gov . In diaries here since the election I see people excitedly suggesting we post our ideas for change over at ... change.gov.

Barack Obama wants us to submit our ideas over the website change.gov

That one was written in the Regional Train System diary yesterday. Now I have no doubt that Barack Obama truly sees this change.gov website as a viable next-generation toolset to help involve citizens in the governmental processes. And it most certainly should be. I also see that it could very well transform our entire at-arms-length/ go-between Representative Democracy into something more closely resembling direct democracy, at least in parts.

But, like Jack Cafferty, here's the question:

How much faith do you have that citizen ideas, proposals, feedback will be smartly shuttled through the Executive Branch, routed to highly experienced point-people in their respective areas of expertise, by task-dedicated Change.gov professional, whose entire jobs consist of thoroughly reading everything, top to bottom, when funneled up from the "first-pass-filter" software used to scan all inputs?

I would love to believe that the entire process is a reinvention of the conventional and ubiquitous web idea-submission forms -- today's version of the bulletin board suggestion box. I think it's fair to say that probably 9 times out of 10, a good and perhaps unusual idea hasn't got a chance in hell of making it past step one, where some admin who's got 5 or 6 other jobs occasionally skims the submissions and evaluates whether they should be passed on.

I'm curious to know what y'all think. Do you think change.gov will operate in a fundamentally different (and better) way?

I think it is reasonable to wonder about this. Afterall, at face value, the front-end is simply a web-mechanism that, simply put, is a neutral pipeline that moves data from our end to some computer, where it gets processed and routed "somehow".

The question is, what does "somehow" look like specifically.

I'm an information designer by trade, and, to date, I have never seen an idea-submission system that really works in an optimal manner. What I consider optimal is, a system that has various fail-safe check-points built in, whether human-based, algorithm based, or combinations thereof, that make sure that first-pass screeners of ideas are not given 100% gatekeeper ability -- to kill submissions that do not trip their personal switches of interest.. But rather, there are built in assurances that novel ideas, things never really expressed before as being possible, are recognized as needing breathing space -- and funneled to people trained in ideation and brainstorming, who know, professonally, how to filter first-pass ideas and discount the parts that may seem like "wishful thinking" or "ridiculous" and weight-heavier those components that look at ideas in completely fresh ways.

Put more simply: Does anyone have any idea of WHO exactly is the "Czar" or frontline manager of the whole routing & filtration system? Or -- is that not yet designed (which is okay and expected; they just won the election 3 weeks ago and can't have been expected to prep for each & every scenario of what might be instituted after winning)?

I don't mean to sound pessimistic in this New Age of Hope in Possibilities.. but, right now I would have zero faith that any new bold ideas would really, currently, get the kind of incubation and development they might truly merit. The last people I would ever hire for such a system would be staffers used to working in a US Senator's or House of Representatives office. If I base that on how my Senators' offices are run -- Boxer and Feinstein -- and my Represenative, Pelosi, I feel confident in saying that any adoption of, or carryover of, practices used in COngressional offices dealing with citizen "input" instantly equates to failure in the "Change" department.

Anyone know?

(this diary dashed off in Cincinnati Airport in between loud gate announcements, while I wait for my connection to New Orleans to visit my Republican family for Thanksgiving. If there are any replies here, please excuse that I won't be able to followup for another 4-5 hours. thanks! and happy T'sgiving all)

•  comments, viewpoints, discussion encouraged.

  I'm going to need something meaty to read after I close my door at home to get away from Obama bashing and snide remarks about colored-folk in the white house...

  by rhfactor on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:32:11 PM PST

  •  New Orleans? Huh

    spent many years there.  Where do your people live?

    by ruthhmiller on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:35:03 PM PST

    •  uptown near Loyola and Tulane Univ

      but my flight is about to be called so i'll be unplugging in a moment :)

      by rhfactor on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:38:53 PM PST

      •  someone, PLEASE! get me the vapors!

        
        i just arrived in new orleans for thanksgiving week with my Republican Family...

        and i was all prepped for anti-obama slurs and innuendos.

        but nothing could have prepared me for this:

        i just got home there, was in kitchen with my fam... normal neighborhood sounds, but then i hear the beep beep beep of a truck backing up.

         i ask my nephew 'what's that?
        he says i think that's our new neighbor Carville backing into his driveway.

        i think nothing of it. i dont know he's refering to because i'm there maybe once a year

        then my nephew says 'you know, james carvile'

         i say 'the guy in Washington Dc?

        he says yep.

        i say, you're kidding, right? you're talking about the ___'s house?

        my dad then says matter of factly, yes, tthey just moved in a few months ago.

        i say you mean Lady McCheney lives 2  doors down?

        "who's lady mccheney?"

        youdont know her nickname?

        (they are foxnews watchers, so it stands to reason they'venever heard it.

        i have to stop now.

        their kids are now goi

        ng to same school my niece goes to

        insane.
        

        by rhfactor on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 10:54:59 PM PST

        •  I had never heard "Lady McCheney" either.

          When you go home for the holidays from now on, better bring the "soul protection lotion" that Bill in Portland Maine is always talking about. On the other hand, you probably already do.

          Well, look at the bright side: now your family is exposed to another Democrat (at least nominally).

          by AlanF on Tue Nov 25, 2008 at 07:36:07 AM PST

          •  i don't know of this soul protection lotion

            but i'd buy a vat of it right about now.

            by rhfactor on Tue Nov 25, 2008 at 08:58:35 AM PST

•  I have wondered the same thing. Also the little

  window you are supposed to put your idea into is so small it looks like you have to put in a slogan rather than something well thought out.

  by ruthhmiller on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:34:20 PM PST

  •  Maybe they only want small ideas?

    by PasstheBill on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 06:15:40 PM PST

  •  well to be fair

    You can scroll in the little window.

    But I too wonder if, like when you write your congressman, it's going straight to a bored staffer who simply enters your letter as a tick mark in a box labelled "FOR" or "AGAINST".

    (sorry for being harsh ... just don't want to be disappointed)

    by rilkas on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 07:56:08 PM PST

•  I have no faith. I'm a heathen & darned proud!!!

  As for trusting the new team and proletariat to do the right thing, I'll wait and see what happens.

  by uc booker on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:36:00 PM PST

  •  umm, I'm at an airport and it's loud, so I have

    no capacity right now to know if this is facetious or not.

    either way, thanks for replying.

    I don't have much faith in it... but I hope hope hope I am proven wrong.

    by rhfactor on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:40:17 PM PST

•  Analyisis of text...

  is both difficult, and subject to artificial manipulation.   I heard from my CA Senator that she gets about 3500 emails a day.

  The way that some elected officials handle this is with check offs of major issues, with pro or con selections. This does give some feedback and is easy to analyse trends.

  I would guess that Obama's staff may monitor the recced diaries on this site, and of course certain media.

  You might read this article for a special case of multiplication of message from a Dkos diary.

  by arodb on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:36:19 PM PST

  •  Okay, but Rec Diaries at dK is NOT change.gov --

    -- so I am wondering if you are concluding that it is highly unlikely anything of unusual merit will get filtered up to someone competent and trained in ideation if posted as a "nobody" at chnage.gov ?

    I am not at all suggesting this is an EASY issue to do well. Just the opposite. I would just love to learn from someone who may know what exactly IS the mechanism?

    Pipelines are good. But useless if the stuff that flows through them gets drained out the backend without even flowing through the system.

    by rhfactor on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:43:37 PM PST

    •  I don't know for sure......

      but I would guess that the volume is just too great to have a reasonable chance of it being filtered up in its substantial entirety.

      More likely, if it is read at all, it is reduced to

      Issue and Position.

      It's quite difficult to have one's opinion heard by those who matter.  This is why dozens of people fight to get into congress, and then into the Senate, each having a greater chance for a real impact.

      One of the final negotiation points between Hillary and Obama was that if she took the SoS position that she would have direct access to him.

      That's how valuable, and rare, this is.

      by arodb on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:49:12 PM PST

•  Well, yeah

  The entire liberal blogosphere is a filtration system, so that wouldn't surprise me at all.

  by keirdubois on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 05:44:45 PM PST

•  10 bucks says it filters out into a tag cloud

  and ignored.

  sniff, sniff...and my brilliant idea of mass transit system constructed wholly out of burlap bags and Teflon coated slides will never see the light of day.

  by mrConcern on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 06:09:15 PM PST

•  I posted a specific idea

  that involved a small tweak to an existing program that would produce housing construction jobs within months.  I did so honestly feeling that no one would ever read it.  But, I did it anyway.  

  by PasstheBill on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 06:17:09 PM PST

  •  I posted about energy...

    (1) how ethanol from corn is the biggest fraud of all time....

    but I also should have recommended re-calibrating traffic lights nationwide.  Many lights should be blinking-caution lights after about 10PM.

    by IamtheReason on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 08:25:01 PM PST

•  Why can't we just

  make the site into something like Facebook? We can have different networks (TX-03, PA-09) and suggest everything to our representatives and senators. And if they don't reply to us we'll give them a bad grade on their profiles. It's more fun than e-mails and I'd totally waste my time on it.

  Learn something new everyday.

  by azzayan on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 06:19:22 PM PST

•  Media: Obama's cabinent is not change, but is an

  extension of the Clinton cabinet. Obama is not stupid enough to pull a "Brownie" like GWB did with FEMA. Remember, Clinton's 1992 economic cabinet did fix the first Bush's economic crisis and left with a surplus. Maybe take a hint from history, perhaps? This crisis is on a much larger scale. Daddy can make mistakes, but he sure can't fuck up badly like Jr. can.

  by punkliberal on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 06:24:54 PM PST

  •  this is about the Obama team shaping message

    And the good news is that the GOP are encouraged by the centrist nominees.

    Where we're in for a fight is when we get to Supreme Court nominees and what happens after the transition team reviews Bushco's mess.

    by Benintn on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 07:30:39 PM PST

•  important questions about change.gov

  Thus far, change.gov does not seem to have the kind of vitality that made barackobama.com such an effective means for activating volunteers. When you make a suggestion, you get a thank you and that's it. I'd like to see change.gov, used to make connections among Obama supporters as well as between supporters and the new administration.

  I wonder who ran barackobama.com and if those people being asked to help run Pres Obama's new web presence? Is there a role for volunteers in making change.gov function in a way that will keep the movement alive?

  by Valatius on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 06:49:00 PM PST

•  It will be better

  First of all, based on the responsiveness of the Obama campaign during the presidential race, I'm convinced that Obama is competent and able to govern effectively.

  Second, it's not about "filtering" ideas - it's about listening to them.  Filtering is just as likely to ignore or overlook important content.  Quite simply, as we know from social science research, the nomothetic blocks out the idiographic.

  Third, we don't need to use some sort of "dragnet" at change.gov - we need to cull the data and develop a feedback loop.

  Finally, this is dialogue, not monologue.  It should be obvious by now that the most effective way to be heard is through your local elected officials, not through change.gov. Still, the direct communication to the exec branch does matter.  It gives the marginalized in a particular state or district an opportunity to bypass the bureaucracy.  Does that mean that they'll automatically be heard?  Of course not.  But it gives people an opportunity to contribute to the national dialogue, which includes all 300 million of us.

  by Benintn on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 07:28:48 PM PST

  •  to be honest, i read your comment as a lecture

    ...and one that seems to have bypassed the core questions in favor of the diary title.

    thus, i am not sure what you're adding, other than a pat pat pat to the citizen's head, preaching "there now little fella.. SOMETHING is better than nothing"

    excuse me but i am not sure that is true.
    

    by rhfactor on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 11:02:47 PM PST

  •  Nomothetic and idiographic

    For those not familiar with the terms (a group that included me and probably most of the readers here), here's what Wikipedia has to say about them:

    Nomothetic and idiographic are terms coined by Kantian philosopher Wilhelm Windelband to describe two distinct approaches to knowledge, each one corresponding to a different intellectual tendency, and each one corresponding to a different branch of academe.

    Nomothetic is based on what Kant described as a tendency to generalize, and is expressed in the natural sciences. It describes the effort to derive laws that explain objective phenomena.

    Idiographic is based on what Kant described as a tendency to specify, and is expressed in the humanities. It describes the effort to understand the meaning of contingent, accidental, and often subjective phenomena.

    by AlanF on Tue Nov 25, 2008 at 07:43:17 AM PST

•  Just fishing for personal info?

  When I went to the "submit your ideas" form, it seemed that they were more interested in collecting all kinds of personal information from me than they were in whatever ideas I might contribute.  As someone else mentioned, the area for writing out your idea was tiny and was labeled "tell us your story".  When 3/4 of the page is devoted to filling in entries of your name, address, phone number, email and number of live births and there is only a small spot for your "story" I quickly decided that this is mostly a front for personal data collection. I don't think it's worth our time.  Good diaries on DKos probably will have more chance of influencing people who might be in a position to do anything than submitting them to this website.  

  I would love to discover otherwise - I know I am cynical.  Thanks for raising the questions.

  by seattlebarb on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 09:38:10 PM PST

•  More begging not real direct/rep democracy

  This research shows that "web 2.0" networking won't really engage people: http://www.simoncollister.com/...

  Checks and balances are good. So most people want direct AND representative democracy. Except politicians, the people who buy them, and the lobbyists between.

  The most evolved project for a hybrid direct/representative democracy is led by former Sen. Mike Gravel. Registered voters can now vote to ratify the National Initiative for Democracy at http://Vote.org, much as citizens ratified the Constitution at the Conventions when the Legislatures wouldn't!

  by Evan Ravitz on Mon Nov 24, 2008 at 09:52:13 PM PST

•  Interesting that you choose novelty

  as the chief criterion to determine which ideas should get forwarded up the chain. "Novel" and "crazy" are right next to each other on the spectrum. Since we just know there must be a ton of crazy/spammish input coming in every day, I wouldn't be surprised if the gatekeeper is looking for "well-written" as the criterion to determine what goes farther. I know that I would, and would be all too likely to lean on the side of rejecting too much rather than too little. You make a good point in suggesting that the system be built so as to prevent the first-pass screeners from being able to "kill submissions that do not trip their personal switches of interest".

  It would be cool if someone with inside knowledge of change.gov could answer your question, but it seems unlikely.

  by AlanF on Tue Nov 25, 2008 at 07:27:49 AM PST