Bush is on the hook for torture

From No Right Turn - New Zealand's liberal blog:

In the wake of yesterday's admission from the CIA that it had tortured three suspected terorists in violation of US and international law, the White House has come out fighting, denying that waterboarding is torture and saying that they might waterboard more people if they decide it is necessary.

But the real news here isn't that President Bush still loves torture or that he is still in denial about the legal status of what he is doing (hint: if the Spanish Inquisition and the Gestapo did it, it's torture - something US courts have at least had the decency to recognise in the past), but that he personally authorised it every time it was used:

If the CIA wanted to water-board a suspect in future, the head of the CIA would discuss the particular circumstances with the attorney general, who would determine the legality of the issue, and then take it to the president, Mr Fratto said.

(Emphasis added)

There's a word for a person who decides whether someone is tortured or not: "co-conspirator".  And if the process remotely resembles that admitted by the White House, then the President of the United States is now on the hook for three charges of "conspiracy to torture", each carrying a penalty of up to life imprisonment.  And if that isn't a "high crime and misdemeanor" justifying impeachment, I don't know what is.

•  And nobody, anywhere, is surprised

  sigh

  by discocarp on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 07:08:47 PM PDT

  •  It does mean

    That if he sets foot outside the United States, he'll be arrested (or at least shuffled rapidly out of the country to avoid a diplomatic incident). Just like Kissinger, and just like Pinochet.

    OTOH the guy's such an insular little turd that that probably doesn't bother him.

    by IdiotSavant on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 07:14:04 PM PDT

•  This Fratto is the deputy WH press secretary

  He is quoted in this NY Times article last year;

  "I’ve had the awful responsibility to have to work with The New York Times and other news organizations on stories that involve the release of classified information," Mr. Fratto said. "And I could tell you that every time I’ve dealt with any of these stories, I have felt that we have chipped away at the safety and security of America with the publication of this kind of information."

  Fucking asshole.  

  How much has the US reputation suffered in the last 6 years down there?

  by Shockwave on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 07:13:58 PM PDT

  •  Not much

    How much has the US reputation suffered in the last 6 years down there?

    It was already mud due to prolonged bullying over nuclear ships. OTOH, now its totally persona non-grata.

    by IdiotSavant on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 07:17:13 PM PDT

•  Add it tp the list.

  if we can't get this guy impeached under the current congress, can we PLEASE throw him in jail for the rest of his life once he leaves office and some semblance of rationality returns to the country?  Pretty please?!

  by Ran3dy on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 07:20:37 PM PDT

  •  That's why he bought ranch property in Paraguay

    recently...no extradition treaty!

    by Arctor on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 08:22:21 PM PDT

•  The term of art is: Class-A War Criminal

  see Nuremburg Trials, Tokyo Trials, WWII for court precedent ...

  by jfdunphy on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 07:26:52 PM PDT

•  pardon?

  Can a sitting President pardon himself on his last day in office for a crime for which he has not yet been indicted or even investigated for?

  by sjbob on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 07:35:10 PM PDT

  •  no

    by Feanor on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 07:36:26 PM PDT

    •  But

      can he pardon his subordinates - the Yoos, Rumsfelds, and CIA torturers who did it all, in the absence of a criminal charge?

      (And if he did, would other jurisdictions give a damn?  It's not just Bush on the hook for this either...)

      by IdiotSavant on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 07:39:11 PM PDT

      •  He can pardon

        Cheney, then resign.  Then Cheney can pardon him.  Wait and see.  Warmest regards, Doc.

        by Translator on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 08:06:20 PM PDT

        •  The salient point ...

          ... is not whether a President can pardon himself. It's whether he can pardon ANYONE for a crime that has not yet been investigated for the purpose of inditing the suspect.

          As long as Bush is President he will persuade his attorney general away from the process of investigating him for crimes against humanity. But a subsequent opposition party, having gained the presidency, might initiate such an investigation, until such time as the statute of limitations allows. IMO this is preferable to impeachment. The criminal should go to jail, not just be removed from office.

          A related issue is this: Bush has not yet pardoned Scooter Libby for his crime, but merely reduced his sentence. I suspect that before leaving office her will pardon him.

          However, I wonder if the following congress can reopen the investigation and subpoena him to testify again, thus inducing him to talk or commit the same crime a second time. The congressional purpose would be to investigate the role of Cheney in the obstruction of justice alledged to exist in the previous conviction. Libby is subpoenaed to testify again about private conversations with Cheney during the time period for which Libby was convicted of obstructing justice.

          Should Libby continue to perjure himself, he can be re-indited for committing the same crime a second time, in a manner independent of the one for which he was pardoned. With a Democrat in the oval office he might not be so willing to remain silent, since a pardon would be less probable.

          by sjbob on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 09:42:08 PM PDT

•  True to your name, you've found the definition of

  torture! Just ask if the Nazis did it! Think where this stunning assertion puts the US diplomatically? Bush may possibly not be able to travel to Europe for a conference, the Germans would have to arrest him for international human rights' abuses, astounding! Bush better pray McCain is up next to pardon his butt!

  by Arctor on Wed Feb 06, 2008 at 08:20:47 PM PDT