Obama: 2 Debates

From Politico, Obama's response to the Clinton campaign.   So let the negotiation begin - 5 is way too many, 2 is probably one too few.  I'm guessing the settle on 3.  Perhaps one this Monday, one Sun before OH/TX, one in between.  I would love to see one sponsored by Spanish language media, and focused on Latino issues.   Chance for Obama to make his case to a skeptical audience, and for Clinton to reaffirm her support there.  And for both candidates to reach an important base for November.  

Obama: Two more debates, one in Ohio

So he tells the Plain Dealer.

"I think we said we will do two more debates, and at least one of them will be in Ohio," he told the Cleveland paper.

"What we don't want to do is have a debate every few days, given that it is very important for me to actually reach voters, something that may be less important for Sen. Clinton to do because she is better-known in many parts of the country," he said Thursday.

"We have such a compressed schedule, it is important for us to be able to travel around Ohio as much as possible. Whenever there is a debate, that is a day that is lost," he said.

No way that she accept his dictation of terms (even if they'd agreed this number a while back, but they will compromise.   And if it's only 3, then I say CNN, one on network TV if they would have it (not sure), one co-sponsored by MSNBC/Univision or similar.  

•  Sick of these guys gumming at each other?

  by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:13:04 PM PDT

•  She has no choice

  If she pushes back, he can say "ok then no debates"

  There's no reason for him to debate.. she's lucky he agreed to it at all

  by Capt Morgan on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:13:09 PM PDT

  •  he had to do atleast 1

    and better to do them after alot of likely wins that are coming.

    by nevadadem on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:14:14 PM PDT

  •  You are very confident

    I think the debates could help him with undecideds worried about his readiness.  He did well in LA.  Not as well as Hillary, but did what he needed to do.  

    by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:14:50 PM PDT

    •  He easliy won the LA debate

      Iraq killed her.. she looked like a liar and a fool in front of the entire country

      You can't spin that

      by Capt Morgan on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:17:29 PM PDT

      •  She won the night overall IMO

        Iraq section better for him, but hey, it's the economy...you know.    But winning is in the eye of the supporter.

        by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:19:41 PM PDT

        •  I suppose

          but then again, many of her domestic proposals are terrible

          5 year freeze on interest rates is one of the dumbest ideas I've ever heard a politician propose

          I also feel very strongly that mandated insurance is a TERRIBLE idea.. it's simply a windfall for the insurance companies... Let's garnish everyone's wages to get them a plan with a $7000 deductible.

          So really... it's a tie at best for her except for Iraq.. .where she just can't win.  She's wrong on iraq, wrong on cluster bombs, wrong on iran, etc. etc.

          If we nominate Hillary Clinton then we say everything bush did is ok.

          by Capt Morgan on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:26:16 PM PDT

        •  I support Obama

          But I thought they both had their stronger points.

          She did much better than him in the health care section. And he did better in the Iraq section.

          Overall I called it a draw really.

          by MingPicket on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:51:21 PM PDT

•  2

  before March 4 seems more than fair. Hillary can't force Obama to show up for more and I don't think whining about the difference between how many debates is quite as effective as saying my opponent won't debate at all. Obama had to debate again but he want's more time to do rallies and meet voters.

  by nevadadem on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:13:22 PM PDT

  •  This Clinton supporter says 5 is crazy

    2 is right.   She should push for 3, or for some other change in terms, just so it doesn't seem he got to dictate.  

    by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:15:36 PM PDT

    •  an Fox news debate either

      what hell was she thinking with that one?

      by nevadadem on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:16:40 PM PDT

      •  Head scratcher - maybe thinking to the general?

        by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:20:23 PM PDT

        •  People who watch fox news

          don't vote democrat.

          by redhaze on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 07:04:07 PM PDT

  •  She can't whine TOO much about this,

    or she'll look desperate!

    by elwior on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:16:48 PM PDT

    •  True - she's best taking 2, but changing a term

      by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:20:45 PM PDT

•  He can say this:

    Debates? We don't need to give you no stinkin' Debates!

  by elwior on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:15:11 PM PDT

  •  I would have been overjoyed if he did

    by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:15:59 PM PDT

•  Two debates

  but nothing until after the Wisconsin primary.  If I were Obama, I would want to go into those debates with a good string of victories.

  by IhateBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:15:43 PM PDT

  •  Fine for him, but think the voters should hear

    from candidates once before that, and then once again before OH/TX

    by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:17:01 PM PDT

    •  that's

      just pure desperation

      The fact is we've had more than enough debates.. they are silly wastes of time

      Anyone that doesn't know where the canidates stand has only themselves to blame...

      Both present specific policies.. in fact my favorite is obama's govt transparency proposals

      by Capt Morgan on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:19:28 PM PDT

      •  Your comments reflect such certainty andhyperbole

        What you know, what most folks on this blog know, dwarfs the knowledge of the average voter.  

        I venture to say that barring some crazy event or disclosure, no one here's changing any minds.   But there are people in the voting states just now turning on to the process.   They probably know Clinton better.  I think it helps Obama to have the debates.

        by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:22:23 PM PDT

        •  you could be right

          Then again, I dont think that many people watch debates

          by Capt Morgan on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:27:01 PM PDT

          •  Ah the ratings for LA were through the roof

            Did they change minds?  Not sure.  

            by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:28:56 PM PDT

      •  That is a fascinating argument

        So you think the Florida voters were sufficiently educated by January 29th, after so many debates, that if they "don't know where the candidates stad they have only themselves to blame"?  I'm cool with that.  So Florida counts, right?

        No?  Why am I not surprised?

        by dhonig on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:31:20 PM PDT

•  This is all about one thing

  All the states coming up favor Obama and the Hillary cult can not stand that. Basically they use a non-issue to attack Obama in order to take away from his up coming wins. This is pure distraction and spin by Clinton Cults who do not want to see the truth and know that Hillary has a problem so they must lie about it using strawman arguements on non-issues.

  by AHiddenSaint on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:16:04 PM PDT

  •  Debates favor her - that's part of it for sure

    I think that the voters deserve to hear from them in more debates - it's not about what's best for each candidate, it's what's best for the process.  I think 2 is enough - maybe 3 if one is Latino issues.   More is crazy.

    by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:18:43 PM PDT

    •  I guess the previous 18 don't count

      Because Hillary was ahead then. ;)

      by livosh1 on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:19:54 PM PDT

      •  I don't think debates matter a great deal

        probably more than endorsements, but not that much.   But they do serve to inform.

        by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:23:13 PM PDT

        •  There's already been 18

          Crying about not having more than two additional ones is silly to the max.

          by livosh1 on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:25:17 PM PDT

          •  Agree - she can't whine about it, but she'd

            better get some change to his proposal or she looks whipped.

            by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:29:35 PM PDT

            •  She should just accept it and move on

              Anything else makes her look ridiculous and desperate.

              by livosh1 on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:30:43 PM PDT

    •  There's no evidence

      That debates favor her at all

      The fact is the more people see hillary clinton the less they like her

      the more they see obama, the more they like him

      Hillary is at her ceiling... the question is... is that celining enough to win?

      by Capt Morgan on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:20:26 PM PDT

      •  So then why is she proposing 5 debates?

        by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:23:35 PM PDT

        •  Gotta do something

          to change the tide. I don't think after the drug crap/obama is black/jesse jackson is obama stuff that they really have many other ideas left.

          by redhaze on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 07:22:26 PM PDT

    •  Why not make the 1 in Texas about Latino issues?

      3 debates in the next month is nuts...he has less than a month to campaign in all these states. She already enjoys more name recognition and people know her better.

      by democrattotheend on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:35:47 PM PDT

•  Rule of Thumb -- The candidate who is behind

  is usually the one who yaps about not having enough debates.

  Just sayin'.

  by livosh1 on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:17:26 PM PDT

  •  True enough...but...

    I think that the HRC campaign is trying to spin a story of her as the insurgent candidate.  Seems a stretch to me, but they know the next month will be rough.  But despite that, she will be right in the mix on delegates with good states for her March 5.  So play the underdog card a bit, do better than expected in February (which the media has now bought as, not got blown out), and rise up for March and April.

    Maybe crazy.  Maybe they are desperate.  But polls don't suggest they should be.  Delegate map ahead doesn't suggest they should be.  Money (real, not the Clinton spin) doesn't suggest they should be.  

    Even Obama's leaked memo suggests their campaign contemplates a stalemate scenario.  In which case, the establishment superdels favor her (Clintons have donated money and time to many of them), as do FL/MI.   Debate this if you wish, I don't know how much of an edge it gives her, but I know it helps.  So why is she desperate?  Maybe she isn't.

    by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:26:49 PM PDT

    •  I don't know what she is --

      desperate, concerned, worried. . . who knows.

      She expected to be way ahead by this point, never envisioned having to self-finance her campaign, and probably could never have imagined that she would be facing potentially problematic contests for the rest of the month.

      Whatever is going on, yapping about needing more than 20 debates seems awfully silly.

      by livosh1 on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:37:22 PM PDT

•  How about one in Pa. for mid-April?

  Another one in May in Puerto Rico!

  by elwior on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:18:42 PM PDT

  •  One in PA before the debate

    at Independence Hall.  Will be huge.  Assuming one of them hasn't wrapped it up by then.

    by ActivatedbyBush on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:27:26 PM PDT

•  Obama

    is under no obligation to agree to any more than 2. He's made that offer, he should stick to it and I think he will.

    Especially since Clinton has broken her word more than once this campaign season. She wants to get upset, let her. It's not Obama's fault that she's hurting for cash (well it kinda is, but too bad). She wants free media, too bad.

  by usmeagle69 on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:21:09 PM PDT

  •  2 is too many, IMO

    1 would have been enough.

    by democrattotheend on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:36:15 PM PDT

•  Perfectly reasonable

  Two is just right, I could live with three. Five is insane.

  by turneresq on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:24:31 PM PDT

•  Good move.

  Running away from debates would have made Obama look like he has something to hide.

  I knew he'd accept some challenege; he's a smart man. After all, despite the predictions of many, this race is far from over.

  May the best candidate win.

  by HairyTrueMan on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:27:53 PM PDT

•  I've seen enough

  No more debates, we've seen enough for one primary!

  If anything, maybe one before March 4th, 5 is fucking ridiculous.

  Good analysis on HB, the underdog asks for debates and the front runner avoids them.  Has hillary accepted that she is behind?

  by zreeb on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:37:26 PM PDT

  •  Well, not behind. Tied, maybe?

    She says "neck and neck."  But she knows how much money he raised in January.  And she is the one asking for more debates.

    The cool thing about debates is, the frontrunner tries to decline them all (unless he's Bill Clinton in 92 or 96, when he actually asked for more debates as the frontunner) and the challenger gets to beat the hell out of the frontrunner for avoiding debates.

    Hillary would much rather be the challenger in this race.  

    by Kevvboy on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:46:32 PM PDT

•  No more debates

  They've had 18 of them, and they're all out there on the internet! I am sick of debates. It's time to interact with voters.

  by The Bagof Health and Politics on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:39:34 PM PDT

•  "Whenever

  there is a debate, that is a day that is lost."

  Damn straight.  If you're Obama, and you debate that day, you lose!

  by Kevvboy on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:44:21 PM PDT

  •  Yup, that's exactly what he meant.

    Or, he meant that is less time he gets to spend meeting the people of our country. How awful of him to want to do that.

    by MingPicket on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 06:59:26 PM PDT

    •  Not awful.

      Just chicken.

      He won't debate five times because he knows it means he would lose five debates.  As it stands now, he'll lose two.

      by Kevvboy on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 07:01:34 PM PDT

      •  Do you really think we need

        23 debates during a single primary season?

        by MingPicket on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 07:26:15 PM PDT

      •  Oh geez...

        What insight.

        I suppose you're right. That Iraq exchange last debate just made him look awful.

        by redhaze on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 07:31:18 PM PDT

        •  If he won that debate,

          why doesn't he want five more?  Seems he'd want to bury her.  If he was better.

          by Kevvboy on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 08:27:37 PM PDT

          •  Two reasons

            1. Three more debates gives him three days less to campaign and...

            2. When you are winning, why rock the boat? A gaffe hurts him more than it hurts Clinton at this point.

            by redhaze on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 09:14:05 PM PDT

            •  I think we are in

              complete agreement.

              The only part you leave out is that she does get to bash him for being afraid to debate a Girl!

              by Kevvboy on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 09:43:27 PM PDT

              •  LOL

                Good point...

                by redhaze on Fri Feb 08, 2008 at 03:30:40 AM PDT

•  Hillary is just looking for Free Media Coverage

  WIth her having to loan her campaign 5 million, she is looking to get her message out without having to spend any money.

  by SmileySam on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 07:32:43 PM PDT

•  That's 2 more than I would have done.

  He doesn't need them.

  by rikyrah on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 07:43:04 PM PDT

•  What is wrong with the state/delegate count on

  Obama's website?

  And what are AS and DA on the North-East?

  http://origin.barackobama.com/...

  And why do they list 16 states for Obama?
  That would include NM and that is still not decided, they will recount.

  And do they include superdelegates?

  Does anyone know who won the Democrats Abroad delegates on Fen 5?

  by elender on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 07:48:28 PM PDT