Hillary Does the Right Thing: "Vote Dem in November"

This election season has been an intense one for us Democrats without question.  We've gone through a historic primary - of 7 legitimate challengers (sorry Libertarian Mike Gravel no longer counts), only four were white men, and by February, our two candidates still in the race were a white woman and a black man, both of whom looked to be astounding candidates and presidents.

Then the race rapidly turned ugly - there had been bad points before, but after Wisconsin, things got vicious. NAFTA, mailers, Wright, veracity, scandals, the campaign seemed to be spiraling downwards in some senses. Polling begun to make the rounds that suggested that no one would really "win" the primary fight, that the nominee would lose a critical amount of Democratic voters to McCain, making the nomination worthless.

Certainly, Hillary Clinton has taken a beating on this site, with many people claiming that she's attacked Obama far more than he has attacked her.  While I grant that Obama has attacked HRC some, I agree with the belief that Clinton's campaign has been more negative, and I was especially appalled by her referencing Wright this week.

Today, however, HRC did something that I didn't really expect at this juncture...

She stood up for Unity:

Hillary Clinton pleaded for partisan unity on Thursday, urging Democrats not to abandon their party to vote for John McCain if their preferred candidate fails to secure the nomination.

Clinton was asked by a questioner in the audience here what she would tell frustrated Democrats who might consider voting for McCain in the general election out of spite.

"Please think through this decision," Clinton said, laughing and emphasizing the word "please."

"It is not a wise decision for yourself or your country."

The crowd applauded loudly.

She continued:

"First of all, every time you have a vigorous contest like we are having in this primary election people get intense," she continued. "You know, Sen. Obama has intense support. I have intense support."

Clinton stressed that there are "significant" differences between her and Obama, but said "those differences pale to the differences between us and Sen. McCain."

"I intend to do everything I can to make sure we have a unified Democratic party," she said. "When this contest is over and we have a nominee, we’re going to close ranks, we’re going to be united."

Given her position in the race, with many people calling her to quit, this is a bold move.  She could leverage her voters in a nomination fight, encouraging division in the off-chance that she could blackmail the superdelegates to support her.  That would be insanely risky for the party, but it would help her get the nomination. Yet, she declined this part, preferring to stress the need for unity and promising to work for it.

So bravo Sen. Clinton. I didn't expect this at all.  And let me say, without hesitation, that I was wrong about you, and I'm incredibly happy that you proved me wrong.

•  Tip Jar

  For all your mojo needs.

  by Wanderer on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:18:56 PM PDT

  •  Dammit!

    I just posted this on MyDD. We'll see what the response is there :-)

    by MBNYC on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:43:58 PM PDT

    •  I look forward to hearing how that goes. n/t

      by DarthParadox on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:45:22 PM PDT

      •  As do I

        For better or for worse, MyDD and Daily Kos are part of the same family after all...

        by Wanderer on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:50:48 PM PDT

    •  I posted about it...

      at 4 pm CST at myDD.

      Then Todd scooped me and while waiting to be able to post several people scoop me here.  ARRGH.  Anyway I hope the all of the zealous Obama supporters are non biased and hold true if she gets the nom.

      by Student Guy on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 07:39:42 PM PDT

•  Been diaried already..

  by gladkov on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:20:04 PM PDT

  •  Ah Sorry

    I scanned the diaries and I guess I missed it before, though it does seem pretty skeletal...

    by Wanderer on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:23:33 PM PDT

  •  It's a post-Ferraro world.

    Repetition is par for the course.  You have to snap out of your pre-Ferraro mindset.  Otherwise the terrorists win.

    by burrow owl on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:27:28 PM PDT

  •  From Poltran

    Z tego też powodu sądzę, że jeśli Hillary zostanie kandydatką Demokratów, nie wygra wyborów.

    I judge from this cause too, that if become (stay) candidate of democrat Hillary, it will not win choice (election)

    Or...

    For this reason as well, if Hillary becomes the Democratic candidate, the Democrats will not win the election.

    by Yamaneko2 on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:01:46 PM PDT

    •  Very good..

      Just add

      For this reason as well, [I believe] if Hillary becomes the Democratic candidate, the Democrats will not win the election.

      by gladkov on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:27:59 PM PDT

•  Definitely great to hear.

  Just saw this on Countdown, and I applaud her for it wholeheartedly. She could've silently sat by and implicitly embraced her supporters' threats of defection. I hope Obama will make a similar statement, if he hasn't already.

  However, it's unfortunate that voters even need to be implored this way.

  by Johnny Gentle Famous Crooner on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:20:11 PM PDT

  •  I wonder if she saw that poll yesterday

    that freaked everybody out.  The one that stated defections to McCain.  

    by AlyoshaKaramazov on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:44:36 PM PDT

    •  If she didn't, I bet a truckload of other people

      did and bent her ear beyond recognition in the interim.

      I mean running to McCain because someone could not have Hillary is like deciding to choose to jump out of a plane without a parachute because you couldn't get one with Hello Kitty! on it.

      The leaders are screwy, for sure, but it's the followers that scare me to shivver.

      I hope this works and people start to heal.

      I've said my peace about why I changed my mind from Clinton in the 90's to ambivalent in the 00's to Obama, starting just about the time she launched her campaign. It's been sad to watch, and the hardest part was to watch someone cry 'victim' when she was anything but, and became her own worst enemy.

      by snafubar on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:59:43 PM PDT

•  She did it to little to late

  It won't turn her people who have already made up their mind.

  by AHiddenSaint on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:20:20 PM PDT

  •  no, this is the turning point

    She's preparing to concede or let Obama win fair and square.  

    That's what's going on here.

    She may still keep up the fight pro-forma, but we are going to see the rhetoric level turned down to something reasonable.  (And we should be very careful here to distinguish between what the campaign itself says and what some of its supporters, who it does not control, say.)

    OK, fellow Obama supporters, this is what we need to do about this:

    We need to turn down the level of our own rhetoric: no more Hillary-bashing, instead do what we've done best all along which is take the high road.  No scorched-earth policy, no "I told you so," instead reach out a hand and say "It's been a tough fight, HRC was a strong fighter, and now we all have to work together to fight the Republicans and win in November."

    by G2geek on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:01:10 PM PDT

    •  I can't rec this enough

      Start the healing sooner rather than later.  I can't wait for passionate Hillary partisans and all of us Obamaniacs getting together to plow under John Sydney "4 more years" McCain III.

      by Coach Jay on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:14:59 PM PDT

      •  also, starting the healing sooner...

        (BTW, good phrase, that) ...is another example of taking charge of the framing of the issue, staying ahead of the issue.  This is what we need to do.  Good one.  

        by G2geek on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 07:21:36 PM PDT

  •  Before she drops,

    anytime that she does this is good, IMHO.

    Her supporters are experiencing stages of grief, it appears.  This dose of input could help them decide to move closer towards reality and confront their feelings, away from their inner, primarily self-imposed turmoil.

    by wader on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:02:55 PM PDT

•  It's about goddamn time n/t

  by beemerr on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:20:53 PM PDT

•  Good to hear.

  and recommended.

  by Cat Servant on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:21:32 PM PDT

•  Don't be taken in.

  She's being leaned on by the supers, so we're getting the "good Hillary."  The last time she did this, she started shaking her finger at Obama and throwing the kitchen sink the next day.

  by mayan on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:22:05 PM PDT

  •  I usually give her the benefit of the doubt

    For example, I thought her tears in NH were genuine and I didn't question her motives.

    But after the "I'm proud to share the stage with Obama" and the next day's "Shame on you Barack Obama" flip-flop, I will be watching her.

    by droogie6655321 on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:25:02 PM PDT

    •  That's what sunk me, too, and I can't believe her

      advisors did not pull her aside and slap her so that she could see how two-faced and desperate that looked. I never came back even to neutral after that night.

      by snafubar on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:01:27 PM PDT

  •  You're Right

    It is distinctly possible that she's not doing it for a totally pure reason.

    Even so, I'll take it.

    by Wanderer on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:26:07 PM PDT

  •  Even if this is true

    ... and I think that it is...

    It doesn't really make much difference. After all, the supers are hardly going to say "ok, you made your token gesture, now you can have the baseball bat back".

    They've put her on notice; if they have to do it again, they will do it again. And she's got the message - between this and going after McCain much more than Obama in her economic speech today. I don't doubt that she'll swing around again and need another "gentle reminder" from the supers in a few days or weeks. But if she does, she'll get one, possibly less subtly next time (some actual defections, maybe?).

    It's not a big "right thing" that she did here, but she did do the right thing. It wouldn't be that far out of character for her to complain about the superdelegates trying to force her out of the race before everyone has voted; play the victim; somehow try to turn it into an Obama attack. She could go for the nuclear destroy-the-party option. She didn't. That's a good sign that she is at least paying a little bit of attention to the pressure from the superdelegates.

    by sab39 on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:41:27 PM PDT

  •  I think the kitchen sink has come back and

    clocked her in the back of the head already.

    The ship has sailed, all that remains is to have the captain acknowledge that the crew has made their call without her; which I think is coming soon enough. She knows she can either choose to cry "Mutiny!" or accept that we can still all arrive safely at our destination even if she is not at the helm.

    Does anyone actually think she would really go "Al Gore" and disappear for five years? I don't. She is still going to remain relevant and influence whatever she can even if she doesn't get to hear "Hail to the Chief" again...

    I just hope it's not too late to get all the feelings patched up before November.  

    by snafubar on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:06:40 PM PDT

  •  She doesn't have that many bridges left to burn

    and I hope she's seen that she's not going to reach the promised land.  There is perhaps still time for her to re-join the big ole happy Democratic family, but she better scamper back across that last bridge before she's left alone on a desert isle.  I think and hope this marks the beginning of a true retreat from the dark side.

    by geomoo on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:28:03 PM PDT

    •  I wish I could agree with you...

      they are still playing and spinning for everything they got.  There is not the smallest iota of conciliation in the stories that are running from the HRC camp.  Besides, the clip itself was about as disingenuous as the "He's not a Muslim, I guess" interview.  I hope it's just me.  I really do.

      by mayan on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:31:58 PM PDT

      •  Yeah, I've already seen a couple of disgusting

        references since just I posted--blaming Obama for MI, etc.  She's just trying to play both sides of the street.  As I said elsewhere, first Bill's penis, now Hillary's ego.  It's hard to keep the rage and blame at bay.  But I'm going to try to stop focusing on her and keep my attention on her supporters who we will want badly next fall.

        by geomoo on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:46:18 PM PDT

        •  Absolutely right...

          Eye on the prize!

          by mayan on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:53:37 PM PDT

•  "I am honored, honored"

  "Shame on you, Barack Obama."

  She couldn't possibly have answered that question in another way. We've seen it before. She assures everybody that she's a good democrat. And then she goes on to destroy everything around her in order to force her way to the nomination.

  by Mbuto on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:22:28 PM PDT

  •  I don't think that cycle can go around more than

    once.

    IMHO it was those two events that laid bare how utterly obsessed she had become, since Hillary of "We're going to be fine" made a liar out of "He's still not seasoned, he's still not trustworthy, and he should be ashamed" Hillary.

    I think that one finally sunk into her head the way it cracked open so many of ours.

    by snafubar on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:09:24 PM PDT

•  indeed it was good to hear

  And to win people back she's going to have to say this more and more.

  I hope she'll do it.

  by davefromqueens on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:22:33 PM PDT

•  Bravo

  Indeed!

  by Particle Noun on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:22:39 PM PDT

•  Can you imagine her at the Convention?

  When Obama is offically nominated, every single camera in the place will be focused on her.

  Get ready for one of the fakest smiles of ALL TIME!

  by MJJLWolf on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:22:41 PM PDT

  •  What would your smile look like if you lost? n/t

    by Burned on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:38:10 PM PDT

•  Whilst she is not the most credible

  source of a unity proclamation, I welcome it anyway.  Warmest regards, Doc.

  by Translator on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:23:32 PM PDT

•  I never thought she didn't want this

  ... or that she wouldn't want her supporters to vote for the nominee.

  However, I would like her to take back some of the chummy things she's said about McCain.

  by droogie6655321 on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:23:36 PM PDT

•  Been Diaried...but...

  we need all the unity and love we can get around DKos...so I recommended and tipped

  by dvogel001 on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:24:33 PM PDT

•  I hope it means she's

  beginning to wake up and smell the poopoo.  If she continues in her recent style for too much longer and still loses, she'll have lost the goodwill of most of our party.  

  by Urizen on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:27:24 PM PDT

•  I think we're missing something here

  While I applaud Clinton's good sense in reminding her supporters that November matters more than hurt feelings in the primary, there's a huge inconsistency in her position.

  Basically, what is she going to say to a Hillary supporter who thinks that national security is the most important issue? After all, Clinton has implied strongly that Obama isn't ready to take the 3am call. And yet she doesn't want that voter to vote for McCain?

  by plum on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:30:20 PM PDT

  •  I'd say SHE'S missing something here.

    It seems to me we have a different primary going on than in the past few cycles. I hate to overplay it, but Obama has a freshness and some rules he wants to play by, that is causing consternation in the Clinton camp. For better or worse, they know how to play hardball. But a lot of Democrats don't want hardball this time around, they want to get rid of the Republican vampires at America's throat.

    by pakaal on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:53:47 PM PDT

  •  Easy to get out of

    She said voters PERCEIVE McCain as strong on national security. She can easily turn around now and say that this perception is inaccurate because staying in Iraq for 100 years would in fact be bad for our national security.

    Bill was a total master at un-saying, reclarifying, or otherwise wiggling out of things he'd previously said. I'm sure he can give her better advice on that front than I could. :-)  But yes, it can be done.

    Besides, do Republicans want to play video clips of Hillary talking about her respect for John McCain anyway? His base is already suspicious of him, and that could well hurt him as much as it helps.

    by tjekanefir on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:05:48 PM PDT

•  I applaud, but "once we have a nominee" is a long

  way from today, especially in camp Clinton.

  I'll give her partial credit now, full if she drops out before June.

  by Searching for Pericles on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:30:28 PM PDT

  •  I'll give her credit -- period

    She said absolutely the right and responsible thing.

    Good for her.

    I'm happy to cheer her when I can.

    by livosh1 on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:33:53 PM PDT

•  Well thank god

  Maybe now some of her supporters will be more hesitant about voting for McCain when she doesn't get the nom.

  Obama supporter though I may be, I've been hoping you would disavow that comment about McCain being better than Obama.  So thank you.

  by Harkov311 on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:32:36 PM PDT

•  This should be a given

  I'm not going to applaud Hillary for saying people shouldn't vote for a Republican.  How said that this is even something that people are celebrating.

  by davidkc on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:36:54 PM PDT

•  How to read the statement?

  A quirky "misspeak moment" before returning to the important job of praising McCain while trashing Obama?

  An oblique reference to her own understanding that she probably won't win the nomination?

  The statement is good one way or another, I'll say that. Sad that I no longer have any confidence that anything she says or does, doesn't hide an ulterior motive.

  by pakaal on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:38:39 PM PDT

  •  The statement was in response to a question.

    Read the diary.

    by grimc on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:51:51 PM PDT

    •  My question was about intent.

      I read the diary. Read my comment.

      by pakaal on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:55:37 PM PDT

      •  I read your comment.

        And you treat her response as if it was some prepared tactical maneuver.

        It wasn't.

        by grimc on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:51:38 PM PDT

        •  Saying something doesn't make it true.

          You can say something is or is not a prepared tactical maneuver, but after months of defending Hillary on KOS and in general (despite not really preferring her as a candidate), I've slowly been swayed in the other direction. Her fight over Michigan and Florida (after signing a pledge not to participate in those Primaries, then doing so anyway) started it, having Bill as a 'semiautonomous attack dog' throwing out comments saying McCain is better than Obama (again yesterday in point of fact), the dismissive way she treats any state that she defines as "not mattering"....

          Yeah, Hillary said the right thing, but I no longer have any faith that there isn't some underlying motive behind saying it.  

          You can say it wasn't, I can say it was, and it goes on and on, but I'll tell you one thing; I'm always willing to listen, but much less interested in doing so when someone simply engages in contradiction. A "yes she did", "no she didn't" back-and-forth is pointless and a waste of time.

          by pakaal on Fri Mar 28, 2008 at 02:24:45 PM PDT

•  Now she joins what Obama

  has been about all along.

  Good for her.

  Let's see if she means it.

  by AlyoshaKaramazov on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:40:23 PM PDT

  •  What?

    I'm sorry, but I recall Obama saying that he'd get her voters, but she wouldn't get his.

    Isn't it Obama's turn to talk about party unity now?

    by Angry Mouse on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:41:51 PM PDT

    •  Yeah

      That wasn't a good moment for him. I winced when I heard it. We're all so freaky after such bad 7 seven years. We all know how much this election means. A lot of us have said things online, hell I'll just say I"VE said things online, that I wouldn't deem respectful to say to someone's face. So we all need to be talking about unity, not just the candidates.

      by bookcat on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:25:36 PM PDT

•  I don't trust her

  It was an "honor to share a stage" with Obama, what, 48 hours? before "shame on him" for telling Ohio voters about her NAFTA obfuscations.

  I don't trust her.  I have no confidence in her leadership or character.  I expect another vicious attack from her campaign within the next few days, if not the next few hours.

  by GN1927 on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:40:57 PM PDT

•  Sniper!

  Of course she said that. She thinks she will be the nominee. And, after she gets through saying McCain is better than Obama, she may well be the nominee.

  If she had instead said: "I apologize for unfavorably comparing my fellow Democrat to the Republican nominee. I apologize for the threats my wealthy supporters have made to the Democratic Party. I apologize for discounting some states (that didn't vote for me) and some voters (who didn't vote for me). I apologize for being a hypocrite about Michigan and Florida; I knew those votes weren't going to count when this campaign started and they shouldn't count now. I apologize for misspeaking - about myself and about Sen. Obama.  I am a proud Democrat and for the rest of this campaign, I will campaign in a manner that will make everyone proud of me. I hope everyone will vote Democratic in November no matter who our nominee is; I know I will."   Then, we can have a 'praise' Clinton diary.

  by royce on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:41:48 PM PDT

•  Buying time

  I don't want to bash Sen. Clinton but to my thinking this was just an effort to buy time.  She realized that if she didn't tone down the level of attack the SD's would break sooner rather than later.  

  by Engaged Voter on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:42:21 PM PDT

•  Two Thumbs Up!

  For what Hillary said today from an Obama-ite.

  by Doctor Who on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:44:59 PM PDT

•  Happy but Sad

  While I do applaud her words, I also have to remark that this is how a candidate is supposed to act in the first place, and normally would not be cause for praise.  I'm sorry to say I'm afraid tomorrow will be another "Shame on you".  I really hope to be proven wrong.

  by Hamlets Father on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:47:59 PM PDT

•  She's trying to stop the criticisms

  What did she think would happen after practically endorsing McCain. Her message certainly seemed to be that only her or McCain were qualified. Now she has to try to round up her supporters - bring them back to the fold.

  I don’t trust her. She'll never give up. And that isn't the sign of a fighter. It's the sign of a ego maniac in the throes of blind ambition.

  by BlueSue on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:49:34 PM PDT

•  If she can make these kinds of remarks...

  ...these conciliatory remarks in the future, and if it appears as though she genuinely means them, this will go a long way towards repairing her esteem in my eyes (for whatever that's worth).  My level of pissed off at her just dropped from a 10 to a 9.

  by SaintCog on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:54:40 PM PDT

•  Very well said

  I've really never doubted that Hillary is a loyal Democrat who will support Obama if he beats her. Unfortunately, she doesn't always communicate that very well, but I really believe it's what's in her heart.

  I'm pleased and gratified to hear her explicitly, and unequivocally, say so today. This will all be over soon. Obama will win, Hillary will concede, she'll endorse him, he'll praise her, he'll become President, she'll do something in the Senate all of us can cheer her for (except for that war authorization her Senate voting record is great), and we can all like each other again. It really won't be long.

  by tjekanefir on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:57:41 PM PDT

  •  I really believe it's what's in her heart

    I really believe it's what's in her heart

    What heart?

    by dynamicstand on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:01:27 PM PDT

    •  She really is not as evil as people here think

      She's somewhat politically clumsy and she takes a lot of seriously crappy electoral advice. I see the things she and her team say about states and voting blocs that don't matter and I want to scream. She puts things badly, she emphasizes the wrong things, and sometimes she ends up reinforcing Republican memes; this also drives me nuts.

      So yes, she would be a poor candidate. But she's not a bad person. She is not a Republican, she is not a racist, and I can practically guarantee you she is NOT going to tear the party apart in a hysterical temper tantrum if she loses the nomination. She'll suck it up and support the nominee just like anyone else would. She will not endorse John McCain; she will not switch parties or form a Connecticut for Hillary party; she will not go on Fox News and talk about how much Democrats suck. She will continue to be a good senator (yes, she voted for that @%#$! war authorization, but so did many other senators who are otherwise good. She is otherwise a competent, loyal Democratic senator with a good voting record.)

      She's not that bad, guys. It isn't necessary to vilify her or even to hate her-- all we need to do is make sure that Obama is the one that wins the nomination.

      by tjekanefir on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:22:13 PM PDT

•  I appreciate her words...

  But hasn't she spent the whole campaign ridiculing Senator Obama for making these kinds of statements?

  Senator Clinton, do you see how dangerous it is to ridicule speeches and comments as "just words."  By your own advice, I will judge how you actually follow through on your words here, by how your campaign conducts itself from now on.

  by BasharH on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 05:59:49 PM PDT

•  "It is not a wise decision for yourself or your c

  "It is not a wise decision for yourself or your country."

  That pretty much sums up Hilary's campaign!

  by dynamicstand on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:00:34 PM PDT

•  Keep reccing

  I really hope this makes it to the recommended diaries. For all the (mostly justified) criticism Clinton has taken, it's time to reunite the party. I hope Obama will make a similar statement, along with his supporters. This one does.

  by saCardinal on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:09:19 PM PDT

•  I'm surprised that anyone

  would think HRC would want people to vote for McCain over the dem candidate.

  Just because they're [Mc & HRC] friendly doesn't mean she would want people to vote repub.

  One thing that would keep me from voting dem in the fall is if BO decides to have a repub or Bloomberg as vp.

  by dfarrah on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 06:13:34 PM PDT

•  I'll take this opportunity to shout:

  "I told you so!"

  Betcha she even hits the road for the nominee if it's not her, too.  

  Democrats vote for Democrats.  Democrats support Democrats.  Even ones they don't much like.

  Because we know what Republicans are.

  by Crashing Vor on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 07:06:29 PM PDT