Daily Kos

It's the Moving Goalposts, Stupid

Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 09:35:37 PM PDT

Quite honestly, I've been getting annoyed with certain kinds of diaries around here.  These are the diaries that insist that Hillary Clinton should withdraw from the Presidential race.  Hillary has every right to continue her campaign for as long as she pleases.  

Certainly, her odds of winning the nomination are fairly long -- 4-to-1 against, or 9-to-1 against, or 19-to-1 against, or whatever estimate you might prefer.  But many candidates have remained in the nomination race while facing longer odds, whereas very few have withdrawn while facing odds as short as Hillary’s.  If we are to believe the futures markets, Barack Obama was once facing odds of about 8-to-1 against winning the nomination, and nobody was urging him to withdraw. On the other hand, John Edwards, Mike Huckabee and Mitt Romney, who did withdraw, were each facing odds of at least 50-to-1 against before they did so.

No, the problem with Hillary Clinton’s candidacy is not that she remains in the race.  In the grander scheme of things, having even as much as a 5 percent chance to win the Presidential nomination of the Democratic party is pretty darn significant.  Many, many campaigns have been launched over the years with far less than a 5 percent chance of winning their party's nomination; Joe Biden and Chris Dodd, in a field that was eventually going to include heavyweights like Clinton, Obama, and Edwards, were two of them this year.

Nor is the problem precisely that Hillary is going negative against Barack Obama.  That is a problem, to the extent that this type of campaigning tends to reduce the chances of the Democratic nominee winning the Presidency.  This is, after all, a non-zerosum game, in that both candidates have the ultimate goal of winning the Presidency rather than merely the nomination.  

But that is not the problem.  I think, instead, the particular type of negative campaigning that Hillary has engaged in is symptomatic of a larger problem.  And what problem is that?

The problem is the existence of a contest in which Hillary Clinton is simultaneously attempting to compete and to re-define the victory conditions.  This has gone on all campaign season.  Just within the past week, her campaign tried to establish yet another new and arbitrary standard for determining the "winner" of the nomination contest, while Hillary coyly made the point that pledged delegates were there for the flipping.  

It seems to me that virtually all of the nervousness over the state of the nomination race stems not from the mere fact that Hillary is continuing to compete, nor from the possibility that she might overtake Barack Obama in pledged delegates.  Rather, it is specifically from the possibility of the brokered convention, and that Hillary might seek to overturn a pledged delegate advantage that Obama had earned throughout the nomination process.  

Indeed, the fact is that whatever might happen at the convention, the campaign has already reached the stage where it is being contested more among the audience of superdelegates than ordinary voters.  

Witness, for instance, all the talk about electability.  Electability is not something that most rank-and-file voters are terribly concerned with; in exit polls throughout the primary states, it has almost always scored in the single-digits when voters were asked the reason for picking their candidate.  But, it is high on the list of the decision criteria for many superdelegates.  

Generally speaking, favorability ratings behave like the stock market: they tend to either rise slowly or fall quickly.  This leads to the peculiarity that there are strong incentives to make your fellow Democrat less electable, since it is probably easier to make your opponent less electable than to make yourself more electable.    It seems sometimes that the goal at this stage of the nomination process is not to defeat the other candidate, so much as to mortally wound him.  

This is the particular type of negative campaigning that I'm talking about.  Ordinarily, there are checks and balances against negative campaigning in the primary process, because voters tend to backlash against it.  But if Hillary no longer cares about what ordinary voters decide, and instead her only goal is to make Obama less electable in the eyes of the superdelegates, the rules become much different.

Even more clearly, all the talk about the electoral process talk is aimed at superdelegates.  Think how many conference calls, and how many column inches, have been wasted on debating which states "count" and which ones do not, or what to do about Florida and Michigan, or the proper role of the superdelegates themselves.  Some of this talk has bordered on self-parody.  

Meanwhile, when was the last time the candidates seriously debate their health care proposals, or their proposals for reinvigorating the economy?  (For that matter, when was the last time that a diary that compared Hillary and Obama’s health care plans made the rec list?)  No.  Instead, all we talk about anymore is process.  Even where policy issues are brought up, they are usually brought up (like NAFTA) as "gotcha moments" that are designed to discredit the other candidate rather than to actually explore the underlying issue.  

It would be one thing if we had a presumptive nominee, and he (or she) could start to articulate his (or her) policy differences with John McCain.  It would be another thing if the two Democrats were still debating policy differences among themselves -- at least that way, they’d still be responsible for articulating their own policy visions.  But instead, we have a third thing: our candidates are mired in a quagmire over process, and their candidate gets to have the policy stage all to himself.  Is it any wonder that his poll numbers are rising?

To reiterate, each of these problems stem not so much from Hillary's mere presence in the race, but rather the fact that the victory condition is not well-defined, in such a way as to give the superdelegates more power than was really intended of them.

***

Would it be too much to ask the candidates, in the downtime we have between now and Pennsylvania, to lay out a set of shared expectations for governing the rest of the contest?  One rule set that I think would be reasonably fair to both parties is as follows:

  1. Each side pledges not to go after one another's pledged delegates.
  1. Florida’s delegation is seated in accordance with the results of the January primary, but each delegate counts for ½ vote. Michigan’s delegation is seated, with each delegate counting for ½ vote, but its delegates are split 50:50 between Obama and Clinton.  

This is otherwise known as the Halperin compromise.  Among other things, it is probably a reasonable representation of what would have happened if revotes were actually held in Michigan (where the last public poll had the candidates tied and in Florida (where the last public poll had Hillary ahead by approximately one-half of her January margin).  

By the way, I don’t think either candidate can particularly claim the moral high ground with respect to Michigan and Florida.  It is clear that the Obama campaign played a hand in sort of filibustering away the prospect of a revote in Michigan (and perhaps to a lesser extent in Florida).  On the other hand, the Clinton campaign has no room to complain, when they shifted their position on Michigan and Florida several times, and after Hillary Clinton insisted as late as March 6 that revotes in Florida and Michigan were not a valid alternative.

I would not accept a caucus [in Michigan]. I think that would be a great disservice to the 2 million people who turned out and voted. I think that they want their votes counted. And you know a lot of people would be disenfranchised because of the timing and whatever the particular rules were. This is really going to be a serious challenge for the Democratic Party because the voters in Michigan and Florida are the ones being hurt, and certainly with respect to Florida the Democrats were dragged into doing what they did by a Republican governor and a Republican Legislature. They didn't have any choice whatsoever. And I don't think that there should be any do-over or any kind of a second run in Florida. I think Florida should be seated.

  1. The candidates agree that they will drop out of the race if the other candidate receives an outright majority (not a mere plurality) of pledged delegates.  If the leading candidate receives a plurality but not a majority, the superdelegates may intervene, and factors like the popular vote count may come under consideration.

This sets up a "buffer zone", which is equal to the number of delegates that John Edwards has in his possession (presently 24.5, as he lost some delegates in Iowa but would pick some up some half-delegates under this proposal in Florida).  If a candidate receives 25 more delegates that the other candidate, he guarantees himself an outright majority, and the nomination is over.  If things are extremely close, however, then we get into the area where there is room for legitimate concern about things like delegates having been flipped at county- and state-level conventions, or what happens to John Edwards’ delegates, or potential irregularities in vote counting.  So, the idea of some kind of "buffer zone" makes sense.  

If both candidates agreed to this set of rules, then Barack Obama would presently have 1483.5 pledged delegates, Hillary would have 1335.5, and John Edwards would have 24.5.  566 pledged delegates remain to be allocated.

This produces a total of 3409.5 pledged delegates; a candidate would need to win 1705 to receive an outright majority.  Barack Obama would need to win 39.1% of the remaining pledged delegates to meet this threshold; Hillary would need to win 65.3%.  If Obama wins more than 34.7% but less than 39.1%, neither candidate has a majority, and the contest goes to the superdelegates.

Is Hillary likely to receive at least 61% of the remaining pledged delegates?  It is certainly not likely, but we have to consider the effects of momentum.  If Hillary won a major victory in Pennsylvania -- something like the 26-point margin this PPP poll predicted recently -- that would not only cut significantly against Obama's delegate margin but would also change the narrative give her momentum for future states.  She would have to be looking at something like this:

State	Del	Winning Margin	Obama	Clinton
PA	158	Hillary +26.6%	58	100
Guam	4	TIE		2	2
IN	72	Hillary +19.4%	29	43
NC	115	Hillary +9.6%	52	63
WV	28	Hillary +35.7%	9	19
KY	51	Hillary +33.3%	17	34
OR	52	Hillary +7.7%	24	28
PR	55	Hillary +45.5%	15	40
MT	16	TIE		8	8
SD	15	Hillary +6.7%	7	8
Total	566	-------------	221	345

That would be enough (by 0.5 delegates) to deny Obama an outright majority.  Is such a scenario likely?  No, but this is a better scenario for her than without this plan being in place.  We are essentially spotting her 43.5 delegates -- 19 from the half-delegates in Florida, and 24.5 by saying that Obama must win a majority, rather than a plurality.  The important thing is that it would be a fair fight, and we would have the resumption of the real campaign, rather than the shadow campaign fought before superdelegates.

For all I care, seat the entire Florida delegation, and split Michigan 50:50.  This would require Obama to win 42.5% of the remaining pledged delegates to garner an outright majority, a threshold that is a little more palatable for Hillary.  But do something that is within the basic parameters of fairness, and sets up clear-cut victory conditions, and do it sooner rather than later.  

Tags: hillary clinton, barack obama, president, primaries, superdelegates, 2008 (all tags) :: Previous Tag Versions

Permalink | 20 comments

  •  My math might be fuzzy but (1+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    Land of Enchantment

    the way I add it
    Clinton +not enough delegates=Obama Presidency

    The best way to predict the future is to invent it. Alan Kay

    by Robinswing on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 09:49:12 PM PDT

  •  Russian Roulette (2+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    theran, Land of Enchantment

    Skip all the strategizing and just get down to brass tacks. Florida/Michigan are irrelevant now, insofar as they provide fodder for the Clintons to take their case to the convention. That is all that matters at this point. They are essentially daring anyone to stop them, correctly assuming I think that no one will. But what happens if by some miracle the democratic party decides to stand on it's hind feet and just give a collective fuck you to them?

    No! This shall not pass!

    What then?

    Well, we'll likely be seeing the end of the Clinton brand. Given a choice between humiliating the Clintons or winning the White House one would hope the democrats would choose the right course of action.

    We'll see.

    Here we are now Entertain us I feel stupid and contagious

    by Scarce on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 09:57:34 PM PDT

  •  Excellent diary, as usual (3+ / 0-)

    She would never agree to your plan, however, as she clearly sees that her only path to the nomination is through the superdelegates.  As you point out with your scenario, she technically has a chance to win.  But, come on, Clinton winning SD?  and NC by >9%?  No way that it happens.  She clearly thinks that a couple of big wins and then pleading her case to the superdelegates is her chance to win.

    I think you make a fascinating suggestion, by the way, claiming that the shift in emphasis in the campaign to the superdelegates has led to Clinton trying to undermine Obama's viability as a general election candidate.  I not sure, though, that the superdelegates aren't even more hostile to negative campaigning and tearing down one's primary opponent than ordinary voters are.  I would think that what Clinton would be trying to do is to undermine Obama's case for being electable in a stealth manner so that she can't be blamed.  So getting news media to unearth the Wright tapes, for example, would have been a good move for her because she wouldn't be the one attacking Obama.  Just a thought.

  •  Superdelegates (4+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    Land of Enchantment, NMLib, shunpike, Sedi

    I think the race has changed a bit during the past couple of days, and superdelegates seem to be veering away from Clinton.  There are very few Dems who want this to go all the way to the convention (the emerging consensus seems to be that a convention fight would doom the Dems).

    So it might be Clinton, ironically, who has the most to gain from specificity.  While the cw up until now has been that ambiguity preserves her ability to redefine the race to meet her strengths, that will only work if superdelegates don't get impatient.

    What superdelegates will discover they want above all, I predict, is a clean result (one which doesn't lead to any squabbling at the convention), and after NC the way they'll get this, I suspect, is for a significant number of delegates who are now uncommitted to back Obama (that would take the air out of Clinton's campaign).

    "Wear the eye patch, Bret. Wear the funky, funky eye patch".

    by ClaudiusTheGod on Thu Mar 27, 2008 at 10:21:46 PM PDT

    •  I've sensed a change as well (2+ / 0-)

      Recommended by:
      Land of Enchantment, shunpike

      It could just be the media, but it does seem like there has been a subtle shift away from Clinton during the past few days.  As far as I can tell, there seem to be three (possibly more) reasons for this.  1. The Politico article that pointed out what Poblano noted long ago: the race is basically over, as Clinton has virtually no chance to win.  I think Politico is well respected and widely read in the MSM, and I really think the story opened the floodgates to reality-based reporting of the state of the race.  2. Clinton's story about Bosnia being shown to be false, and in such an obvious way.  The incident reinforced her biggest negative (not trustworthy) and undermine her claim to the nomination (experience).  3. Obama wasn't hurt by the Wright incident.  His numbers look fine in the polls vis-a-vis Clinton, and the only real worry is that both Democrats are doing worse against McCain.  This further highlights the desirability of choosing a nominee cleanly and soon.

      •  Why the shift? (1+ / 0-)

        Recommended by:
        Sedi

        I think the Wright story is responsible for this shift in a round about way.  Most journalists realized that Obama's campaign could have been sunk by this story, if that had occurred it wouldn't have been fair, and this got them to thinking about how they've reported the campaign up until now.  For all of the allegations about favoratism, the biggest bias so far has been in favor of whatever allows the horse race to continue, builds suspense, and so on.  

        "Wear the eye patch, Bret. Wear the funky, funky eye patch".

        by ClaudiusTheGod on Fri Mar 28, 2008 at 08:42:31 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  The Tonya Harding Strategy (0+ / 0-)

      The emerging blowback seems to coincide pretty closely with the emergence of that image.

      John McCain voted against health care for kids.

      by Land of Enchantment on Fri Mar 28, 2008 at 05:18:33 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Reuters: Race Over (1+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    Land of Enchantment

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Somebody forgot to tell Hillary Clinton the Democratic presidential race is over and Barack Obama won.

  •  The consensus is brewing regardless (4+ / 0-)

    Agree 100% that the lack of any clear definition of 'victory' is a serious problem, and should have been nailed down well before Clinton embarked on her 'my daily argument for why I'm winning' subversion.

    However, there does seem to be a consensus brewing behind the scenes for the notion that the pledged delegate leader will get the superdelegate support. Ironically, it has probably emerged specifically because Clinton changes the terms of victory so often. By doing so, she makes people want to find something concrete they can hang their hat on, and pledged delegates is the only logical choice.

  •  Hillary's continued presence in the race is bad (2+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    Land of Enchantment, shunpike

    As an abstract point, I agree that anyone should stay in the race as long as they wish, but in this particular case, there are special circumstances that trump the principle. Richard Wolffe made a great point on KO tonight: Clinton's path to victory is currently dependant on an Obama collapse. If she suspends her campaign, she still would be able to 'ride in on her white horse' and save the Party if Obama went Spitzer on us before the convention. However, as things stand now, she is trying to create that collapse by her own efforts, and that is another, more sordid, move altogether.

  •  A few points of disagreement. (2+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    shunpike, Sedi

    First, you begin by saying it Clinton has even a 19-to-1 chance of winning. That's ridiculous. It's closer to 100-to-1 odds.

    Second, you conflate starting a campaign with a 5% chance of winning with going into the end of a campaign with a 5% chance of winning (and that's a gross over-estimation). Sorry, but going in and having no real chance and prolonging the inevitable when you have no chance aren't the same thing at all.

    Third, given your compromise, Obama wins, and Clinton should concede immediately. No sane person who can count would argue otherwise. For Clinton to win in pledged delegates, she'd need to do better in every future contest than she's done in any contest that has occurred thus far.

  •  Poor Hillary (2+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
    zackamac, Sedi

    Not.

    It's that sense of entitlement.  Apparently the other rules are all subservient to that overarching principle in her circle.

    And it's bringing other unattractive aspects of her campaign to light.  That thing about "loyalty", as evidenced by the Judas remarks from James Carville about Bill Richardson.  The loyalty thing?  It shows more adherence to the past than looking forward to what's best for the future.

    Then there's the three-card monte about the Clinton I administration.  If you liked something about that time, Hillary gets credit for it.  If not?  She wasn't part of that - it was her husband's administration after all, not hers.

    Last but not least, there's the overall strategy:  completely turning its back on Dean's 50-State-Strategy.  The party, overall, did not fare well during the Clinton years.  Dean gets a fair amount of the credit for taking back the House and Senate, in my thinking.  Left to the Clinton (MacAuliffe, etc.) approach, it would never have happened.

    The organization that Obama has built on the ground, the online infrastructure, and the extensive fundraising amongst small donors.

    Just rambling thoughts.  It's still quite early here.

    John McCain voted against health care for kids.

    by Land of Enchantment on Fri Mar 28, 2008 at 05:11:09 AM PDT

  •  As usual... (0+ / 0-)

    ... your commentary is awesome.

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