Clinton tirade at CA superdelegates, claims Richardson lied

SFgate.com reports here about Bill Clinton's tirade at superdelegates and claim that Bill Richardson said five times to his face he wouldn't endorse Barack Obama.

In fact, before his speech Clinton had one of his famous meltdowns Sunday, blasting away at former presidential contender Bill Richardson for having endorsed Obama, the media and the entire nomination process.

"It was one of the worst political meetings I have ever attended," one superdelegate said.

So the question continues, if the Clintons are treating superdelegates this way, is it bluster, bluff, or collapse?

No matter what the nomination's outcome is, these are people who are "keepers of the flame", and one wonders how Bill's legacy will survive if these people are offended.

Discuss. Does Bill need to chill out?

•  tips/recs/don't yell at me Bubba

  by Belvedere Come Here Boy on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 06:42:28 AM PDT

  •  DONT TASE ME BRO!!

    by soms on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 06:43:53 AM PDT

    •  I don't know if "chill" is the word I'd use

      maybe the words "go away until after the General Election" would be more appropriate here.

      by o the umanity on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 06:54:54 AM PDT

      •  STFU

        is the phrase I'd use!

        "The political system, including elections, is carefully managed to prevent the threat of democracy."  ~Noam Chomsky

        -5.25, -4.87

        by cotasm on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:28:45 AM PDT

        •  To be more specific...

          

          "The political system, including elections, is carefully managed to prevent the threat of democracy."  ~Noam Chomsky

          -5.25, -4.87

          by cotasm on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:30:32 AM PDT

          •  Respectfully asking superdelegates to back Obama.

            Taking a cue from Bill Richardson before he endorsed Obama on March 21, it's better to use strategic tactics instead of trying to bully the superdelegates.

            Since President's Day, a coalition of voters has been petitioning Democratic elected officials and other superdelegates to support Obama.

            Our website, www.votersforobama.com, has sparked petition drives to superdelegates in six states including North Carolina, where we first organized.  The site contains everything voters need to contact superdelegates in their states.

            

            Take five minutes and use the tools on our site to contact an undecided superdelegate near you.

            We are focusing on superdelegates who are also elected officials and accountable to their constituents.  Hesitant to call or e-mail superdelegates?  Afraid you'll somehow bother them and keep them from backing Barack?  You can download and sign a petition to your local superdelegate elected officials who remain undecided.

            by latest outrage on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:43:29 AM PDT

            •  Hey, great resource, and

              nice job keeping it on the 'high road'. I can't imagine having a temper tantrum does much to improve weakening support.

              by Lisa Lockwood on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:57:53 AM PDT

            •  do a diary!

              Or have you already?

              Do another one!

              by jancw on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:41:24 AM PDT

              •  I just went and used it

                worked great, took 2 minutes.

                REALLY, DO A DIARY and get this out there!

                by jancw on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:49:48 AM PDT

              •  Here ya go - feel free to recommend :)

                Take the superdelegate challenge for Obama, and thanx for recommending this diary!

                by latest outrage on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:52:13 AM PDT

                •  In North Dakota...

                  ...only the State Chair has remained neutral, and that might be a good thing. The rest of our superdelegates have endorsed Obama.

                  I'm just wondering if ND with it's very popular Democrat congressional team on the stump might put our state into play for the Presidential election.

                  Oh, and W Jefferson Clinton, why not take a vacation, I hear Zimbabwe is particularly good at this time of year.

                  Malcolm

                  by malc19ken on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 12:48:47 PM PDT

            •  I just checked your site

              And I noticed that the contact information is ".gov" - at least for the California supers.

              It was my understanding that elected representatives cannot conduct party business from their government sites.  I've been contacting local supers through their private re-election sites.

              by sand805 on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:44:41 AM PDT

              •  Etiquette for contacting superdelegates

                Thanks for checking out our site.

                You may be right on this point, and there's nothing wrong with contacting superdelegates through their campaign offices.

                But there's a difference between "conducting party business from their government sites" and elected officals being contacted by their constituents about any matter that concerns them.

                We also list links to members of Congress' official websites for informational purposes.

                Erik
                Chapel Hill, NC

                by latest outrage on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:06:58 AM PDT

          •  I didn't know I could lip-read! n/t

            by DaNorr on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:13:37 AM PDT

      •  "chill out" is a quote from Bill Clinton

        In his formal speech to the California Dem Party Convention last weekend, he said that everybody needs to "chill out," referring to people who are getting antsy about the extended length of the primary season and the increasing nastiness.

        Diarist I'm sure is referring to that quote, suggesting he take his own advice.

        CBS Local News: Bill Clinton Tells California Democrats to "Chill Out"

        by reid fan on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:39:27 AM PDT

        •  When push comes to shove, one falls back

          to ones roots. When the chips are down, a poor southern boy from Arkansas, via Georgetown, Oxford and Yale Law, is still a poor southern boy from Arkansas. He never learned proper manners from his Papa or Mama, and sure enough, he ain't gonna learn it now...

          by mobiusein on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 09:24:04 AM PDT

    •  His finger even looks like a taser.

      Check this out!

      This is a scary photo!

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/

      by kanuk on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:53:23 AM PDT

      •  Someone must have been playing with voodoo doll

        by Sharon Jumper on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:32:40 AM PDT

      •  Almost looks like he's flipping the bird...

        I know he isn't, though.

        by juca on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 09:24:23 AM PDT

    •  Oh..I wish I could double rec this

      by peacemon on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:38:28 AM PDT

  •  Of course he doesn't like the nominating process

    He doesn't want there to be a nominating process.  The Clintons want there to be a coronation.

    by smash artist on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 06:57:55 AM PDT

    •  Bill and Hillary fail to remember ...

      that Bill was only elected president because of Ross Perot's splitting the republican vote.

      by Barry Leonardini on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:05:52 AM PDT

      •  Twice n/t

        by aisling on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 09:23:20 AM PDT

      •  You see here, now theres where you're wrong!

        by FudgeFighter on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:11:34 AM PDT

        •  It's disputed. We'll never really know, but

          face it, Bill never broke 50%.

          by Fonsia on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:38:03 AM PDT

          •  I was giving a Dana Carvey impression

            of Ross Perot- not to be taken seriously.

            by FudgeFighter on Thu Apr 03, 2008 at 12:38:17 AM PDT

    •  They didn't want a coronation, they did want

      a nominating process...they just didn't want a real challenge or a long process and they definitely didn't want her to lose.

      In fact it's like they are saying they will not allow her to lose

      by joynow on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:58:41 AM PDT

  •  I am going to take a wild guess and say that

    Richardson did not lie five times, he told what was the truth five times, he was (past tense) going to vote for Hillary until she pissed him off so badly that he just could not.

    People can change their minds, which is not lying.

    This is another disgusting attempt by the Clintons to smear someone who crosses them.

    Richardson is not a Judas, he is a truthteller.  

    The problem is that the truth is not what the Clintons want to hear.

    by Do Tell on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:09:37 AM PDT

    •  True

      Grown ups let other grown ups change their minds.  Come to think of it, kids aren't that bothered by it either.

      by gas28man on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:14:51 AM PDT

      •  from experience

        I worked on K Street with Richardson's former Legislative Director.

        For a few months before Richardson had left the house to work at the Petroleum Institute before being tapped for Energy Secretary, we were able to get calls actually answered by Richardson's famously intense secretary who was a gatekeeper if there ever was one.

        Anyways, despite the connection in our office, we understood Richardson to be fiercely independent.  He NEVER promised a meeting, a vote, an earmark, a co-sponsorshp - NOTHING - one way or another until he was good and ready to act on something.

        and he wasn't "charming" about evading answers like so many other MC's would be where you are having to diagnose a conversation like a junior high girl after the big dance.

        He would outright say yay, nay, we do not have an answer on that, check back later.

        by MFL on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:29:36 AM PDT

        •  another experience

          I lived in Richardson's congressional district in New Mexico.  And my experience is that he most certainly mislead the voters when it came to an issue near and dear to my heart.  Central to his election and re-election to Congress was his promise to fight a proposed dump for plutonium contaminated nuclear waste (WIPP).  When Bill Clinton named Richardson as Secretary of Energy, Richardson opened the dump.  He opened the dump when environmentalists were still in court fighting for meaningful, independent EPA oversight.

          I'm glad that Richardson endorsed Obama and sent a signal to supers not to overturn the popular will of Democratic voters, but I think that he and the Clinton's both share an enormous credibility deficit.

          And I think that the claim that Bill Richardson misled the Clinton's and some of their supporters might well be true.

          If you want some insight into Bill Richardson's credibility check this out.
          
          

          ````
          peace
          

          by peace voter on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:03:19 AM PDT

          •  thanks

            for bringing that up. always learn something new every day.  but again, my personal experience working with his office was never to expect any favors.

            by MFL on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 03:04:23 PM PDT

    •  Asked and answered

      by Richardson:  his loyalty is to his country, not just to individuals.  

      That he was grateful for the jobs given to him by Clinton.  And that he did his jobs with honor and distinction.  (In other words, I paid you back with a job well done, thank you very much).  

      If Hillary had been the least bit gracious about the Wright business and at least acknowledged the speech as the progressive value that it addressed, things might have been different.  Richardson saw behavior that increasingly horrified him.  How many of us started out as loving and defending the Clintons, and would have been totally happy with any of our candidates, way back in January?  

      Richardson saw what he thought was a bad trajectory for the party and the country and endorsed with his conscience.  And don't whine at me about "selling out" -- as if the Clintons weren't willing to bribe him with anything he damn well wanted.  

      This is what the Clintons don't get.  And they cannot lead the country this way.  

      In case anyone's forgotten, they've already had two terms in the White House.  

      by 57andFemale on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:28:13 AM PDT

      •  Wow. Richardson actually matters! I didn't think

        anything mattered anymore in this election for the Clintons (except what they decree of course). What an honor!

        by Methinks They Lie on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:36:24 AM PDT

        •  of course

          If you notice their frame of mind.  It's all about THEM.  It's about what is entitled to THEM.

          They just need to get overthemselves.

          It's not about THEM, it's about the party and the country!

          Fergi

          by MFL on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:33:45 AM PDT

          •  Or, more to the point

            it is about the country and then the party. We need to get past putting partisan concerns and personal loyalty above the serious problems facing our nation and our world at this time.

            by Question Authority on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:59:46 AM PDT

      •  IIRC

        After Bill Clinton had an affair and lied about it to his cabinet staff and the whole country, Bill Richardson didn't resign in protest or publicly denounce Bill Clinton.  No, Bill Richardson stayed in office without uttering a word all while John McCain and others were voting to boot Bill Clinton out of office.  I think Bill Richardson has a damn good claim on loyalty to Bill Clinton.

        by jim bow on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:37:25 AM PDT

        •  The NM Guv...

          would prolly be one of the last guys around to publicaly denounce anyone for having a zipper problem.
          
          
          ````
          peace
          
          

          by peace voter on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:07:57 AM PDT

      •  Amen

        Absolutely thought exceedingly highly of all our candidates back in January, but the Clintons are just crushing my soul lately.

        by jamfan on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:50:15 AM PDT

      •  The notion that one appointed to an

        office by a president owes undying loyalty to that president "and his heirs and assigns forever," so to speak, is outrageous and offensive.  Bill Clinton, when did you decide to emulate the odious Robert Mugabe?

        by trivium on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 09:27:15 AM PDT

    •  I love me some Bill Clinton

      But coming from the man who "did not have sex with that woman" under oath, I scoff at his accusations of lying.  Yeah, Bill does need to chill out.  He is killing Hillary.  He needs to go back to the feel-good optimism, love for his country and bi-partisan wrangling that got him into office.  This Bill is a sad shadow of his former self.  He's using the absolute wrong tactics, as is the campaign as a whole.  What a tragic drama as it unfolds...

      by Pennsylvanian on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:24:52 AM PDT

      •  Don't you get the feeling

        That the Clintons are sadly out-of-sync with the reality at the grassroots of America?

        Its just that her core support is being out-numbered and out-played by a new generation of voters that want C.H.A.N.G.E.   Pretty darned badly too.

        Its time to wake up Hillary and Bill - that's the only way to make this nightmare go away.

        by griz4u on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:34:47 AM PDT

        •  Most of her supers are DNC or safe-seat congress

          critters. Folk w/ no incentive to listen to the people on the street whatsoever.

          by slaney black on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:05:55 AM PDT

        •  Hey...

          It's not just the new kids on the block, some of us old-timers want change as well, and Obamachange is the best there is right about now. Dang nabbit!

          Malcolm

          by malc19ken on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 12:55:38 PM PDT

      •  My thoughts on Bill and Hillary

        When Bill was in office those that were working and otherwise not effected by his policies thought he was doing a good job.  Even those effected by his policies may have thought it was their fault for having problems in this so called booming economy.  He imported so many workers in my field that I did not think it he was doing that well, but I may have been in the minority.  But there were many that thought he was doing a good job.  Many rallied to support him after the right  irrespective of how they felt about his job performance.  After all this support he must have felt the people loved him.

        After analyzing his policies after he left office many think he did not do that fine a job and since Hillary wants to campaign on his policies and use him to stump for her she and he should either apologize or otherwise acknowledge his failings and claim they have learned something from the experience.  The response of the public and delegates would not be the same.

        It looks like he still thinks that people love him and that there is still some conspiracy to deny Hillary her rightful place on the throne.  

        by realtime on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:03:55 AM PDT

        •  Iraq

          Iraq sanctions - 500,000 children died - Clinton enforced them.

          No more Clinton.

          Nuff said.

          Malcolm

          by malc19ken on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 12:57:34 PM PDT

    •  Like we should believe what Bill Clinton says?

      The truth is a finely parsed thing for the Rapidly Becoming Unglued Big Dwag.

      by byteb on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:26:10 AM PDT

    •  Exactly. Richardson's declaring for Obama

      was a message to the Clintons and they are not getting it. Too bad. It's just one of the many either one of them don't get.

      In my experience, a person who has good instincts and wisdom knows when to quit and when to keep going.

      A person who keeps going at all costs is tone deaf, an ego-maniac and cares nothing for the people directly or indirectly affected. The latter happened in my own family so it's one of those things I recognize right off as bad business. Avoid these people at all costs! They take everyone down with them.

      by paluxy1945 on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 09:10:33 AM PDT

  •  The second stage of grief, anger

    we still have  bargaining, depression, and acceptance left. At long last he looks like he has made it through that long first stage, denial.

    by lgcap on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:11:25 AM PDT

    •  Hmm...

      We saw some bargaining a few weeks ago when they floated the whole 'Obama as VP' canard.  I wonder if we will see something like that again soon.

      by RichM on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:14:57 AM PDT

      •  The stages don't necessarily

        come in order, or stay in order. People will jump forward or backwards but follow the general trend.

        As recently as yesterday a new "Dream Team" poll was released and promoted. In that one the only ticket that was a "winner" had Hillary on top. Imagine that, slaps face.

        by lgcap on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:44:03 AM PDT

      •  I would say that was the denial stage.

        by dmoore9504 on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:08:30 AM PDT

    •  lol. virtual tip. n/t

      by smartdemmg on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:42:14 AM PDT

  •  The real reason for the Richardson-Clinton

    ..animosity.

    

    Bill was such a crybaby and horse's ass that day.

    by Scarce on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:12:18 AM PDT

    •  Bill looks thrilled

      to be there.  

      by wethepeople on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:28:55 AM PDT

      •  which Bill?

        
        
        ````
        peace
        
        

        by peace voter on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:09:37 AM PDT

    •  where were they?

      cause that is a really ugly couch

      by Isara on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:29:33 AM PDT

      •  Bill brought it to go w/his sweater (eom)

        by ksduck on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:35:42 AM PDT

      •  Richardson's house in Santa Fe

        The rec room, by the look of it.

        by Scarce on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:35:49 AM PDT

        •  Nope

          Although, it may have been misreported as having happend in the Governor's mansion in Santa Fe...

          The former president and Richardson planned to watch the game together at a private residence in Red River, a community of about 500 people in the mountains of northern New Mexico with a small ski area that attracts winter visitors.

          — Barry Massey
          Associated Press Writer
          SANTA FE, N.M. Feb 3, 2008 (AP)

          Now I'm really confused.  Perhaps they planned to watch the Super Bowl up in Red River & changed their minds - I don't know.
          
          
          `````
          peace
          
          

          by peace voter on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:19:43 AM PDT

  •  I'm pissed.

    Bill Clinton, IIRC, had an affair, wagged his finger, and lied to the entire country about it.  He then asked many superdelegates to risk their political careers not to accomplish some grand progressive goal but to save Bill Clinton all while John McCain and other Republicans were voting to boot him out of office.  And Bill Clinton has the nerve to talk about loyalty?

    by jim bow on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:34:10 AM PDT

    •  Do we owe it to Bill to make his wife president?

      I was glad to keep Clinton from being booted out of office and defended him vocally, but frankly, I think that the party membership and Bill are pretty much square at this point, and certainly don't owe it to him to make his wife president.

      by Inland on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:36:22 AM PDT

  •  So an unnamed source?

    I thought we were supposed to take these with a "grain of salt",

    It is great to hear it from Elizabeth Edwards own mouth that that article is false.  Again people should take what they read with a grain of salt for people just make shit up especially when it is from an unnamed source who isn't part of the campaign but "knows" the Edwards well.

    I suppose it doesn't matter when it comes in an article attacking a Clinton now does it.

    by SteveLCo on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:40:48 AM PDT

    •  Situation is considerably different.

      The unnamed source's position is identified - super delegate. The source was in the room when the event described happened, and a direct quote is provided. None of these things occurred in the Edwards article.

      by mr crabby on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:15:05 AM PDT

    •  it's not "an unnamed source." click the link

      they have reports from several delegates at the meeting.  No, Matier & Ross did not make up a false story involving half the superdelegates at the CA Dem Convention meeting with Bill Clinton. they're not that stupid.

      Plus they name Rachel Binah, a superdelegate from my neck of the woods, and former Richardson supporter who made it into the NYT not long ago quoted as somebody who'd been convinced to support Clinton after Richardson dropped out by a gracious phone call from Hillary Clinton.

      It was Binah who sparked Bill's tirade about Richardson, and although Matier and Ross make it clear they have multiple sources confirming the tirade, they also have a paragraph about how when Binah got home, there was a message from Art Torres, saying Bill Clinton had asked him to call to apologize to her -- so it seems pretty clear to me, that Binah talked directly to Matier and Ross.

      Bill Clinton should be ashamed of himself. (not the first time, IMO).

      by jennifer poole on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:34:08 AM PDT

      •  It's ridiculous how people find whatever

        way they can to discredit news they don't want to hear.

        by LJW on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 08:57:55 AM PDT

  •  Richardson denies he ever promised Clinton

    his endorsement!

    His Op-ed in WaPo:

    Carville and others say that I owe President Clinton's wife my endorsement because he gave me two jobs. Would someone who worked for Carville then owe his wife, Mary Matalin, similar loyalty in her professional pursuits? Do the people now attacking me recall that I ran for president, albeit unsuccessfully, against Sen. Clinton? Was that also an act of disloyalty?

    And while I was truly torn for weeks about this decision, and seriously contemplated endorsing Sen. Clinton, I never told anyone, including President Clinton, that I would do so. Those who say I did are misinformed or worse.

    As for Mr. Carville's assertions that I did not return President Clinton's calls: I was on vacation in Antigua with my wife for a week and did not receive notice of any calls from the president. I, of course, called Sen. Clinton prior to my endorsement of Sen. Obama. It was a difficult and heated discussion, the details of which I will not share here.

    by kanuk on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:58:59 AM PDT

    •  Promises in eye of beholder, no surprise n/t

      by rugbymom on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 09:17:07 AM PDT

  •  Bill needs to go away from the political scene

    And NOW!

    by victoria2dc on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 09:25:58 AM PDT

  •  You left out one part

    He said that Richardson told him to his face five times that he would not endorse Obama.

    by AJsMom on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 09:59:31 AM PDT

    •  Until Richardson changed his mind

      for his own reasons.

      And looking at the kitchen sink dirty tactics, I can believe he had VERY good reasons to change his mind.

      by MAORCA on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:02:39 AM PDT

    •  Richardson denies this

      And I can tell you who I believe.

      by slippytoad on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:30:06 AM PDT

•  Lied...isn't that a trait of the Clintons.

  by jamaicanblood on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 06:43:16 AM PDT

  •  the politically correct term is

    "Misspoke"  

    i think thats what the MSM media calls the Bosnia snafu.

    by wargolem on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 07:12:20 AM PDT

•  (Finger wag)

  (Finger wag)
  (Finger wag)

  I did not get angry...at those superdelegates...

  (Finger wag)

  by billysumday on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 06:43:43 AM PDT

  •  Somebody needs to grab that finger and...

    ...twist it off.  

    To think I once admired the guy.  

    by David Kroning on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 06:49:57 AM PDT

    •  Ugh, talk about buyer's remorse

      I want to take the party back from those people in the worst way.

      by chicago minx on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 09:17:46 AM PDT

      •  Buyer's remorse indeed

        This, in fact, is a REAL case of buyer's remorse among myriad former Clinton supporters. I don't think Chicago minx and I are the only ones with that remorse.

        Adam Nagourney needs to write THIS story up, instead to doing a hack job trying to discredit Chairman Dean.

        by MAORCA on Wed Apr 02, 2008 at 10:05:01 AM PDT

  •  Every time I see that finger wag