Open Thread

Turncoat former Democratic vice-presidential nominees:

1. Joe Lieberman
2. Geraldine Ferraro

Thank heavens John Edwards is still sane!

Recommended diaries at 8 am, Thursday, May 22, 2008 :

8/25/07: Clinton DNC operatives strip FL of all 210 delegates [UPDATED 2X] by JLFinch I'm Telling You. by RenaRF A Florida Dem Weighs In On The Florida Delegates (Updated) by Schopenhauer Telescope A Point It Seems Everyone Missed by OrangeClouds115 "Winter Soldier" Goes 'PrimeTime' by jimstaro Puerto Rico will not give Hillary the popular vote edge, from someone who actually lives in PR by PR for Obama The Maddow Movement Launches! by buhdydharma McCain's campaign has a terrorist connection by teacherken

•  Don't forget...

  Gore and Mondale!

  by NextGenDem on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:15:34 AM PDT

  •  Gore and Mondale are turncoats?

    by texaseditor on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:18:27 AM PDT

    •  Lieberman, Ferraro.... next Hillary?

      Something is very wrong about her latest victim tour in Florida.  If she was so interested in standing up for women, why did she vote to go to war with the women of Iraq in 2003?

      Hillary Clinton's voting record has hurt more women then anyone has dared to admit lately.

      by Seele on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:19:00 AM PDT

      •  The NY Post has a story on Hillary's debt

        http://www.nypost.com/...

        by ccrnjr on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:43:21 AM PDT

  •  They haven't Gone Bye Bye(Technical Term) Yet nt

    by JML9999 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:20:40 AM PDT

  •  It would be wise not to add Hillary to

    the list. She is a fellow traveler with Lieberman and Ferraro.

    by lgcap on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:20:42 AM PDT

    •  She isn't getting the VP slot, so she's not on...

      ...the list.

      by khereva on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:26:03 AM PDT

      •  Excellent Clinton VP analysis

        on Liberal Oasis today. Bill Schere breaks it down nicely. Check it out here.

        Share it with a friend.

        by Oaktown Girl on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:35:46 AM PDT

        •  Pretty straightforward, and exactly what we've...

          ...been saying here.

          Keep her away from the ticket, and away from his campaign.

          by khereva on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:37:28 AM PDT

          •  Yes, exactly what most folks here

            already know. But it's in a nice, tidy compact package that's easy to send to folks who don't follow the details so closely, and easily buy into the media hype that she ought to be on the ticket.

            by Oaktown Girl on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:41:59 AM PDT

      •  No, but she can have Geraldine

        as HER VP on her Womens and Whites party ticket.

        by Eman on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:07:57 AM PDT

        •  [insert standing ovation here!]

          Bravo!

          by CityLightsLover on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:53:24 AM PDT

          •  Settle for sitting?

            

            by Phil N DeBlanc on Thu May 22, 2008 at 07:00:00 AM PDT

        •  She's probably win...

          by HorseThief on Thu May 22, 2008 at 09:23:17 AM PDT

          •  all the wihte racists over 50, yeah n/t

            by Eman on Thu May 22, 2008 at 01:25:53 PM PDT

  •  Since when did Gore turn traitor?

    Shame on you!!!!!

    by TLS66 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:39:02 AM PDT

    •  it's in reference to "Thank heavens John Edwards"

      is still sane.

      And I expect Edwards will be VP again. The Obama/Edwards ticket is polling at +10 to +17 vs McCain and any GOP VP ticket.

      That's how we win Pennsytucky!

      by Jimmy Crackcorn on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:42:55 AM PDT

      •  Well, in that case

        I retract the "shame on you" if it was in reference to the Edwards comment.  In Gore and Mondale's case, I guess they weren't included with Edwards because they actually became VP.  Fritz needs to knock some sense into Gerry.

        by TLS66 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:45:41 AM PDT

      •  That is West Pennsltucky to you

        If you can't get the name right, how can you expect to win the hearts, minds and votes of the worthy Pennsltuckians?

        Did anyone catch Senator Jim Webb on Countdown yesterday?  I suspect we should all be running out to buy his book "Born Fighting" which is said to be a history of the Scots-Irish in the United States.

        Actually, that is also my ancestry, which gives me pause for thought.  My family was in the middle of Pennsylvania for generations, tended to get mixed up in those war things like that Revolutionary one and that Civil one, which my ancestors didn't think was very civil.  I'm not sure my ancestors were as cranky as Jim Webb, but I did hear that my Grandpa Charlie tended to carry a revolver with him wherever he went, since he had fallen in to the habit as paymaster of a steel mill.  Ah, the good old days!  

        by arthura on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:43:56 AM PDT

      •  Oh yeah....

        Edwards endorsement did WONDERS for Obama in Kentucky...

        by HorseThief on Thu May 22, 2008 at 09:24:17 AM PDT

  •  Don't forget..........

    .....the Rethugs have had their veep tuncoats. How about Garrett Hobart? Now there was a real snake in the grass.

    by Hillbilly Dem on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:33:12 AM PDT

•  the question is.

  What is: When I have a hissy fit leave the democratic party because Americans won't vote for me.

  by jalapeno on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:16:44 AM PDT

  •  lol-time 4 a timeout-NO DRAMA. VOTE OBAMA!

    by concerned on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:20:16 AM PDT

  •  are we playing Jeopardy?

    by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:21:00 AM PDT

  •  that's right

    Ferraro kept running for downticket offices and kept losing.

    it's a sign: go away.

    by MFL on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:23:03 AM PDT

  •  Hillary won't leave

    But I'll tell you what I am sick of: this handful of spoiled, tantrum-throwing my-way-or-I-ruin-it-for-everyone Hillary followers getting media attention who insist they will campaign or vote for John McCain. I cannot imagine ANY situation inwhich the words "Well, I'll just vote for John McCain the" would escape my lips. No, not if Hillary stole the nomination. No, not if the Democrats had a divided convention and turned to Joe Lie-berman to "bring us together." Say you'll hold your nose and vote but not work or donate. Even say you'll stay home (which I would if Lie-berman was the candidate). But don't tell me you'll vote for John McCain or you deserve to be smacked.

    by anastasia p on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:58:26 AM PDT

    •  next question for those McCain endorsers

      should be this:

      And your choice for Supreme Court Justice is?

      yes, I thought so, bye Roe V Wade.

      by jalapeno on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:07:44 AM PDT

    •  The irony of this whole thing is that

      if Ferraro or any of those other women do anything that would in any way enable McCain to win the election, they would be betraying women much more than any comment Obama's ever made.  

      A McCain election means more women w/o health insurance, more women dying in Iraq, more women seeing their loved ones die in Iraq, more poor women left with less while rich, white men get more, and more anti-choice Supreme Court justices.  Doing anything EXCEPT supporting Obama to the fullest extent possible would be a huge betrayal of women all around the country.  Perhaps her conscience could stand that.

      by chuckb on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:39:08 AM PDT

•  Where Obama get's his good looks and Smile

  Notice a strong family resembelence?
  

  by Jimmy Crackcorn on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:17:15 AM PDT

  •  that's his grandfather there

    by Jimmy Crackcorn on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:17:53 AM PDT

    •  On the cover of his book

      Dreams from my Father, the picture of his grandfather--holding his mother as a baby--is strikingly similar to Obama. In fact, when I first saw it I wondered when Obama wore a uniform.

      by KFlake on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:54:28 AM PDT

  •  very cool pic nt

    by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:19:02 AM PDT

  •  great pic!

    by concerned on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:20:37 AM PDT

  •  Honestly, when you look@ Barack

    all you see is his mom's side of the family in the facial features ~LoL~

    Those are some STRONG genes, because Malia has them too. . .

    by Muzikal203 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:20:44 AM PDT

    •  Exhibit A

      

      I see Michelle in her smile, other than that she's ALL Barack ~lol~

      by Muzikal203 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:28:57 AM PDT

      •  whenever I see him with his kids

        I wish he were my dad.  

        by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:30:54 AM PDT

        •  They're going to be an inspiring first family

          I almost got teary eyed thinking about it before he started his speech on tuesday.

          by MingPicket on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:34:10 AM PDT

          •  aren't they though!

            it's enough to give me goosebumps!

            by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:34:53 AM PDT

        •  Heck, I wouldn't mind having Michelle

          for a mother either!

          by Muzikal203 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:35:28 AM PDT

          •  maybe they'll adopt us all n/t

            by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:36:55 AM PDT

            •  his cousin may be Brad Pitt

              But I don't think he's going to try to adopt everyone in the world ~lol~

              by Muzikal203 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:37:45 AM PDT

              •  maybe not

                but the world sure seems to want to adopt him!

                by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 07:15:56 AM PDT

          •  I wouldn't mind having Michelle for a wife!

            McCain housing policy shaped by lobbyist

            by Nonconformist on Thu May 22, 2008 at 10:32:10 AM PDT

      •  Eyes an Eye brows are Michelle

        

        by notquitedelilah on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:35:32 AM PDT

        •  Eyebrows look more like Barack's Mom

          in the pic I posted. . .

          by Muzikal203 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:36:44 AM PDT

          •  Maybe, but all I see is michelle.

            The youngest girl, Can't remember her name, is looks like Barrack Sr. and she has her father's eyes.

            by notquitedelilah on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:42:38 AM PDT

            •  Sasha is the younger daughter

              by Muzikal203 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:00:03 AM PDT

        •  That is one fine

          looking first family.

          by Phil N DeBlanc on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:39:59 AM PDT

      •  Has anyone noticed how his kids are growing?

        When I saw the photo of the family in Des Moines I was struck by how much taller and more mature both girls looked.  Heavens, are they going to be tall and willowy young ladies!

        I agree, it is going to be fun to watch them over the next eight years.

        by arthura on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:50:16 AM PDT

  •  Same long face.

    Yes, he has his grandfather's features.  

    by Delaware Dem on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:22:52 AM PDT

    •  yeah, he looks just like him.

      by concerned on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:24:55 AM PDT

  •  There is the chin and a hint of the ears

    But what I can also see is a lot of love and a lot of acceptance of a child that must have come as a bit of a shock to his grandparents.  All else pales beside the benefits of growing up in a household, however it is constructed, that is filled with love and acceptance.

    by arthura on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:47:40 AM PDT

•  Did you say Turncoat?

  

  by notquitedelilah on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:17:27 AM PDT

•  waiting waiting waiting

  for HRC to get out

  and for C&J to post

  by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:17:32 AM PDT

  •  You too?

    F5, F5, F5...

    by Phil N DeBlanc on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:24:06 AM PDT

    •  if only F5 would somehow

      get HRC out of the race LOL

      by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:25:16 AM PDT

      •  :-) n/t

        by Phil N DeBlanc on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:25:50 AM PDT

      •  Try ctrl+w maybe that will work

        or when all else fails ctrl, alt, delete

        by Muzikal203 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:29:40 AM PDT

        •  LMAO

          by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:31:53 AM PDT

        •  I think my Hillary program is caught in an

          infinite loop.

          by ShadowSD on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:32:23 AM PDT

          •  Need that Smite button.

            srsly.

            by khereva on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:35:23 AM PDT

          •  Hit Ctr+Alt+Delete

            McCain housing policy shaped by lobbyist

            by Nonconformist on Thu May 22, 2008 at 10:36:06 AM PDT

            •  Or Alt+F4

              McCain housing policy shaped by lobbyist

              by Nonconformist on Thu May 22, 2008 at 10:37:11 AM PDT

      •  Hmm

        Maybe we will get lucky and a house will fall on her.

        by smoosh21 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:42:23 AM PDT

•  You've got them in the correct order.

  Lieberman is Jerk #1.

  by texaseditor on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:17:44 AM PDT

  •  As Bob Beamon was to ...

    ...track and field records, so is Holy Joe to treachery and betrayal.

    by Hillbilly Dem on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:37:16 AM PDT

•  Maybe this is a sign...

  ... that our method of selecting VP candidates is deeply flawed.

  by lesliet on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:18:15 AM PDT

  •  edwards and gore and shriver

    I think Sargent Shriver, Al Gore and John Edwards are fine individuals....

    by MFL on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:24:22 AM PDT

    •  Lloyd Bentsen

      He did not go batshit crazy either....

      by MFL on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:28:46 AM PDT

      •  Well, he's dead

        He died two years ago at age 85.  If he were still alive, though, I bet he'd be loyal.

        by TLS66 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:41:52 AM PDT

      •  He was awful

        Bentsen was a conservative Democrat who ousted Ralph Yarborough (a decent liberal) in the 1970 primary. Yarborough had been the only Southern Senator to vote for all civil rights bills between 1957 and 1970. There's a reason Bentsen defeated him.

        by pghred on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:42:50 AM PDT

        •  True, but

          he almost nipped the Bush dynasty in the bud by defeating Poppy in the general that year.  Unfortunately, Nixon plucked him from obscurity to be his Ambassador to the UN.

          by TLS66 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:01:15 AM PDT

  •  asdf

    They always try to pick some "centrist" (re: DLC'er) in hopes that independents will vote for the ticket (not that it has ever proven successful).  This year independents will vote Democratic, so they don't need to choose some turncoat centrist for the ticket.  

    by BDA in VA on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:25:20 AM PDT

•  I think Edwards will STAY sane, thank you.

  Signs of Lieberman and Ferraro's "disability" appear way, way back if you know where to look for them.

  Can you say "Joementum?"  Gee, I knew you could.

  by polecat on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:18:18 AM PDT

  •  Could go either way

    his conversion to populism was both fast and comparatively recent.

    by stevej on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:36:39 AM PDT

    •  Edwards was giving "two Americas" speech

      John Edwards was giving his "two Americas" speech throughout the 2004 primaries, and pretty much ever since.  After he left the Senate, he formed his poverty program within a few months (by late 2005).

      I really don't see this as a recent conversion.

      by NCrissieB on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:46:39 AM PDT

    •  Maybe so but

      he's dedicated his whole life to this since leaving the Senate. I seriously doubt a person founds a poverty center and then decides the issue doesn't engage them anymore.

      by anastasia p on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:05:22 AM PDT

•  Morning

  77 degrees in Houston with some spotty showers.

  I like our mayor:

  http://www.chron.com/...

  Mayor Bill White said Wednesday that he is preparing to take aim at a new target in his fight over Houston's air quality â€" the state agency that regulates plants emitting toxic chemicals.

  The still-developing strategy involves challenging the permit applications from nearby plants to force the Texas Commission on Environmental Quality to limit the levels of the carcinogen benzene in the air.

  The plan represents a shift in White's focus from the chemical industry to the state's clean-air officials. It comes after the mayor promised to use a city nuisance ordinance to punish plants, many of them outside the city's borders, that did not reduce emissions of benzene within six months.

  "This approach both takes into account some concerns that the city of Houston not act unilaterally and it will be effective in accomplishing our purposes of trying to reduce the amount of benzene in our air," White said.

  I hope someday he'll be our governor.

  Have a great day everyone.

  by Spathiphyllum on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:19:08 AM PDT

  •  He'd be a helluva lot better

    than Rick "Good Hair" Perry.

    by Phil N DeBlanc on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:25:11 AM PDT

    •  Heard that.

      Chris Bell would have benn, too.

      New rule: only one Republican candidate per office in the general.

      by khereva on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:30:05 AM PDT

  •  moisture moisture moisture!!!!!!

    ahhhhhhhhhhh,
    A heavy dampness hang in the air in San Antonio.
    The earth is wet and I am planning on planting a couple of roses and  some lavender today. Then I am gonna buy my mommy a new canary and a cage cause her other one died.
    ahhhhhhhhhhhhh.
    just lovely.  When I get back to southern Alberta i will go back to dry dry dry almost desert  climate, so all this gulf coastal moisture is a balm on my Texas soul.

    by TexMex on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:36:53 AM PDT

  •  Is he related

    to the same Bill White who was Governor between the two Clements terms?

    by TLS66 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:06:14 AM PDT

•  Farm Bill Gaffe

  Here's what the congresscritters are going to do about the clerical error in the Farm Bill.

  action stalled after the discovery that a 34-page section of the bill had been omitted from the printed bill sent to the White House. That means Bush vetoed a different bill from the one Congress passed, raising questions that the eventual law would be unconstitutional.

  In order to avoid a partisan dustup, House Democrats hoped to pass the entire bill, again, on Thursday under expedited rules usually reserved for noncontroversial legislation, and the Senate was expected to follow suit. The correct version would then be sent to Bush under a new bill number for another expected veto.

  Lawmakers also will have to pass an extension of current farm law, which expires Friday.

  New York Times

  by JG in MD on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:19:50 AM PDT

  •  I heard this on NPR this morning..

    Um, like Bush actually reads the bills before signing (or vetoing) them?  The guy can barely get through Marmaduke without a dictionary...

    by wry twinger on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:21:44 AM PDT

    •  Not true

      Suspect that he has never been in the same room as a dictionary.

      by stevej on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:35:08 AM PDT

      •  Not true...

        He's been seen perusing the Dr. Seuss collection at the University of Texas Library...

        by wry twinger on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:49:32 AM PDT

        •  But he put it pack, claiming,

          It's already colored in!

          by khereva on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:51:27 AM PDT

        •  Dr. Seuss is too heady for Bush ...

          by RevJoe on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:56:51 AM PDT

          •  I read Green Eggs and Ham

            in Spanish with my tutor last week.  Sam I Am is Juan Ramon (rhymes with jamon).

            by wry twinger on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:31:23 AM PDT

      •  To answer that question

        Cheney would invoke Executive Privilege.

        by kfred on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:06:14 AM PDT

  •  Didn't they have another screw up where somebody

    added a passage after it was passed and Shrub signed it into law.

    by JML9999 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:22:53 AM PDT

  •  More Information about the Farm Bill

    from The Hill online

    and from

    my diary yesterday.

    by JG in MD on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:28:30 AM PDT

•  Wasn't Ms. Clinton almost a vice president

  Shouldn't she also be almost a Republican?

  by shawk on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:20:39 AM PDT

•  It's sad to see this happening

  I mean, this should be a banner year for the dems....  and here we are.  If Mccain wins and we end up with a third bush term, and the end of roe v wade....  I just can't even think about it!!  we really have to make sure the dems get real control of the house and senate!!  

  by ejpoeta on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:20:41 AM PDT

  •  $140 barrel of oil

    McCain is not getting elected with gasoline prices going up and up and up.

    No way.

    by MFL on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:26:37 AM PDT

    •  Thats what I said about W in 04

      no way he's getting reelected with gas going up and up, and the body count as well. Look how that turned out.

      Though I do think this time is different. I don't think as many people will fall for the compassionate conservative bull shit this time.

      by ryan81 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:52:20 AM PDT

      •  I share your sentiments

        I said "no way" in '04 with a war hero at the helm of the Dem Party -- remember Abu Ghraib had just been uncovered in the spring of '04, and the body counts were rising on both sides. But the majority had not yet turned against the war, and US citizens are loathe to change presidents in the middle of a new war. (I still maintain that this was the crown jewel of the Bush campaign -- "they won't throw me out if there's a war on" -- and I think that's one of the main reasons Iraq happened in the first place.)

        But it is different this time. Iraq has turned and people have turned on their support of it. And Iraq is not the number one issue -- though it is probably the second issue. It's the economy, and the GOP has no leg to stand on. They got us into this mess and the three congressional races Dems have captured indicate how deep and impactful the American distate has been influenced by these issues.

        by RevJoe on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:02:50 AM PDT

      •  $28 to $50

        The day before the war in Iraq, oil was $28 a barrel.

        in 04 I think it went up modestly to $50.

        Now it is triple that amount.

        Since '04:  Katrina happened, which could not be whitewashed no matter how much they tried,  the housing market is affecting everything, food prices are 20% higher and gasoline is significantly higher than in 2004.

        by MFL on Thu May 22, 2008 at 07:43:37 PM PDT

  •  Well, you will have Hillary, the over 50 women,

    the Whining Florida delegation,
    your good friend Mark Penn,
    and those 9 out of 10 KY voters to thank for it.

    by Eman on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:12:11 AM PDT

•  The Democratic Party Definitely Needs to Vet VPs

  with a bit more rigorous psychological testing.

  by SteamPunkX on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:21:41 AM PDT

  •  Ya think?

    Or more of them need the Eagleton treatment.

    by khereva on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:29:10 AM PDT

    •  Eagleton?

      What huh?

      by SteamPunkX on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:30:21 AM PDT

      •  Wasn't he the VP pick who was dropped

        for having had ECV?

        by khereva on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:31:54 AM PDT

        •  Yes

          By George McGovern in 1972.

          by penguins4peace on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:37:07 AM PDT

          •  He died last year

            I think he was treated horribly.

            by TLS66 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:43:02 AM PDT

        •  ECV?

          Speak in the Queen's English man! Or Klingon, I loves me some Klingon.

          by SteamPunkX on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:38:48 AM PDT

          •  ElectroConVulsive Treatment.

            aka electroshock.

            by khereva on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:39:53 AM PDT

            •  Oh! thanks! nt

              by SteamPunkX on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:41:32 AM PDT

•  Yeah yesterday on NPR

  they did a report about these women's groups banding together to boycott/not vote for Obama. I thought to myself, there's a name for these kinds of people:

  Republicans.

  by plok on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:21:56 AM PDT

  •  They're a disgrace to this country

    by Brad007 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:27:07 AM PDT

    •  After much fighting with my wife

      I agreed, some weeks ago, to hold my nose and vote for Hillary if it came to it.

      by plok on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:35:08 AM PDT

    •  No, they are upset and venting... it's okay

      Åt this point in any campaign it is not so smart to listen to the rantings of those who feel they are on the losing end of the stick.

      But what you should also realize is that they would NOT be doing this if they seriously thought they had any chance to undo things and win it.  They'd be reaching out to unite the party.  So in a funny way it is a good sign.

      And it is just one stage of grief, for something that many were and are passionate about.  If Obama had not won, Clinton would have won the primary.  They realize that now and this reaction is the cussing and stomping phase of coming to terms with something that seems inevitable to them as well.  Give them space, this meant a lot to them.  It must have been particularly tough to see Clinton become a much, much better campaigner as the campaign went on.  And still not good enough, soon enough, to overcome the odds and her negatives.  Could she have beaten McCain?  We'll never know.

      by arthura on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:59:01 AM PDT

  •  asdf

    There is a saying that applies - cutting off your nose to spite your face.

    by BDA in VA on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:27:19 AM PDT

•  McCain/Ferraro

  Kill me now.

  by Dr Funkenstein on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:22:29 AM PDT

  •  McCain/Lieberman...unbeatable!

    /snark

    by ezdidit on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:26:59 AM PDT

    •  Actually... my worst fear is

      Hillary doing a back door deal to become McCain's VP in her desperation to become President in 2012 due to his age.
      Gods, now that would drag votes from Obama...

      by RElland on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:56:44 AM PDT

      •  I believe it would cost McCan't more.

        Imagine what the Publicans that mistrust-to-loathe him already would do if he teamed up with their public enemy #1.

        by Crashing Vor on Thu May 22, 2008 at 06:49:08 AM PDT

•  Just joined facebook

  so I could join the dailkos group and the Obama group and the Rachel Maddow group.  

  I'm 50!! for god's sake and joined facebook!

  by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:22:52 AM PDT

  •  50 is the new 20. LOL.

    Well, I am 32, and I am on Facebook.  It's not for college students any more.  

    by Delaware Dem on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:25:37 AM PDT

    •  my age is showing as I have

      NO idea how to use it :-).

      by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:29:26 AM PDT

      •  watch out for too many fun wall alerts!

        damn!

        by TexMex on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:38:48 AM PDT

        •  fun wall alerts??

          see, told ya I'm too old.

          by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:43:32 AM PDT

  •  Join the Million Strong for Barack Obama group

    that's where all of the action is!

    by Muzikal203 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:30:36 AM PDT

    •  And I didn't know there was a DKos group there!

      by Muzikal203 on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:30:52 AM PDT

      •  yup

        by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:32:38 AM PDT

    •  did

      by juslikagrzly on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:32:29 AM PDT

  •  I'm 60 and joined Facebook

    Never too old to learn.

    by SharonColeman on Thu May 22, 2008 at 08:06:24 AM PDT

•  George W. Bush is an ass.

  That is all.

  by Phil N DeBlanc on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:22:54 AM PDT

  •  You are too kind

    he is actually a baboon's shiny red ass.

    by Zwoof on Thu May 22, 2008 at 05:25:54 AM PDT

    •  How insulting