Open Thread for Night Owls & Early Birds

Kossack MBNYC gave us some idea of what to expect Thursday in Obama, one million Germans, and history. Blowout crowds. But at The Guardian, Jonathan Freedland writes:

^{Obama must curb our enthusiasm: While the world wants to show its support for the Democrats' nominee, foreign popularity is no votewinner in the US}

Obviously a warm reception can only be good for the Illinois senator. But maybe not that warm. After all, one of the hoariest Republican attack lines deployed against Democratic opponents is that they are vaguely foreign, somehow more comfortable abroad, and therefore likely to put America's interests second – after those of their elitist friends in Europe. Remember the Republican nickname for the Democratic nominee of 2004? They called him "Jean Cherie".

If Europeans really want to help Barack Obama next week they should repress their enthusiasm for him – and stay home. Ensure those crowds are thin and lethargic; maybe even offer the odd heckle, perhaps while brandishing a hostile placard. Let the travelling US press report that Obama is not so popular with foreigners after all: nothing will endear him more to the American public.

For those non-Americans finding it hard to feign coolness towards the Democratic candidate, let me offer two thoughts. First, as I discussed here, Obama is already tacking towards the centre, away from positions comfortable to Europeans and others. ...

If it helps, bear all that in mind when Obama hits your neighbourhood. Remember, if you want him to win in November, do your duty – and do nothing.

The Overnight News Digest has been posted.

•  Mmmm... Berliners

  

  by Trix on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:44:27 PM PDT

  •  Woo Woo, Nyuk Nyuk

    

    by JekyllnHyde on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:12:10 PM PDT

    •  That is far more disturbing than...

      anything you'll ever see linked in my sig line.

      by Trix on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:14:25 PM PDT

      •  HoffRoll out, CurlyRoll in n/t

        by MackInTheBox on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:17:48 PM PDT

        •  It's called a Trixroll™

          :-p

          by Trix on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:21:25 PM PDT

          •  Ha! Formerly known as 'Der HoffenZoomer'. n/t

            by MackInTheBox on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:26:45 PM PDT

            •  LOL

              The actual name for the image is the "Hasselhoffian Recursion".

              :-)

              by Trix on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:28:26 PM PDT

            •  David "The Hoff" Hasselhoff - Jump In My Car

              by JML9999 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:34:18 PM PDT

              •  I LOVE THIS!

                I love LOVE this video and all his others. He is so cheesey!!! Thanks for the laugh, it is much appreciated tonight.

                by LokiMom on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:38:38 PM PDT

              •  That was uncalled-for. n/t

                by MackInTheBox on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:41:30 PM PDT

                •  hear have some earworms ;-)

                  by JML9999 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:49:53 PM PDT

                  •  Got me! I was expecting "My War" with the

                    demonbaby! That clip was a classic!

                    by MackInTheBox on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:57:25 PM PDT

                    •  Play them both at the same time

                      Two part harmony

                      by JML9999 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:10:29 PM PDT

          •  Maybe you can sublicense your sig to JekyllnHyde

            "I'm a Stooge, baby!"

            by MackInTheBox on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:32:40 PM PDT

    •  Now THAT is an eyeworm. Damn you!!! n/t

      by MackInTheBox on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:15:59 PM PDT

    •  Brilliant!! n/t

      by Purple Priestess on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:19:35 PM PDT

  •  But are you a

    Jelly Doughnut

    by JML9999 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:31:49 PM PDT

    •  Obama is a fresh-baked chocolate glazed donut...

      to McCain's day-old crueller.

      by Trix on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:36:29 PM PDT

      •  That's not a racial thing, BTW

        As everyone knows, chocolate glazed are the best.

        :-)

        by Trix on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:41:43 PM PDT

      •  McCain is more cruel and...

        an old crueller, he is. crueller than cruella deville even.

        by LokiMom on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:42:32 PM PDT

      •  What's funny

        Is that if you watch the JFK speech, there is about this 1 second pause after he says that famous line where the crowd clearly is like "Why did he say he was proud to be a donut?" but then they understand what he meant, so they cheer.

        My personal favorite donut is a Triple Chocolate Penetration from Voodoo Donuts (http://voodoodoughnut.com/) which is a chocolate donut covered in chocolate and with coco puffs on top of that.  I'm not kidding, that's it's real name.

        by skywaker9 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:31:19 PM PDT

        •  The name fits perfectly with their slogan...

          "The Magic is in the Hole!!!"

          :-)

          by Trix on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:41:42 PM PDT

          •  Voodoo Donuts is a fun place to visit

            Especially when drunk at about 2-3 AM.  They used to only be open from 9 PM-9 AM.  Entering that place late at night is a mix of Portland's bizaree folks.  You'd be in line with a cop, a few high school kids, a transvestite, a prostitute, etc.

            by skywaker9 on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 12:24:10 AM PDT

        •  The crowd never thought he said he was ...

          ...proud to be a doughnut. What he said was perfect German grammar, and all those who years later laughed at JFK's "mistake" - somewhat snottily in the case of a few critics - were dead wrong. Yet the idea that he made a mistake lives on.

          by Meteor Blades on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 12:36:51 AM PDT

        •  Read the Wikipedia article...

          because it mentions the "jelly doughnut" joke only to discuss that it is a false urban legend.  This criticism of his speech stemmed from non-native speakers who knew just enough German to get themselves into trouble.

          I get embarrassed whenever someone perpetuates the myth, because it requires a certain amount of smugness to attempt to criticize an important speech for something like that anyway, and then to have it be a false criticism just makes me cringe.

          by Kosmonaut85 on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 07:51:16 AM PDT

•  Meh...

  I'm not sure I buy the storyline that massive European support for Obama will somehow hurt his support among Americans.

  Regardless, that basketball clip is going to play over and over and over again and will works massively to his advantage.

  by anidealiveson on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:45:12 PM PDT

  •  Bet this'll be one of the most-viewed

    youtubes by November.

    Will Chris Matthews swoon in public?

    by Jim P on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:07:52 PM PDT

  •  I'd love to see a video of Obama

    talking seriously with the German leader, contrasted with Bush's ill-advised shoulder rub. That would make the point of who's "presidential" right there.

    by Cali Scribe on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:20:26 PM PDT

    •  i have a policy

      to always rec comments which mention the unwanted shoulder rub

      by itsbenj on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:51:29 PM PDT

  •  haha

    I love the stretching and trying to dissuade high expectations with the "I may not make it the first time."

    by Artchess on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:24:02 PM PDT

  •  Swosh heard round-the-world.

    Totally agree. Winners hit 3-pointers.  Losers throw sissy armed on opening day for the Nationals.  

    The Republican narrative has lost it's resonance.  Dem's and Obama are being given an opportunity with this trip to forge a new narrative.  Crowds help.
    The bigger the better.

    by sledwith06 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:24:32 PM PDT

    •  HAHAHA

      Winners hit 3-pointers.

      I'm total going to steal that line a million times between now and November.

      by anidealiveson on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 08:01:00 AM PDT

  •  agree. i think americans have better view

    of world since 9/11 and bushie years. of course goppies will try to play it up against obama when he is greeted by cheering crowds over there.

    but, more americans now realize we are indeed one global community and that bush has screwed things up diplomatically with so many countries to our detriment that we need someone in the WH that can negotiate, avoid wars, and engage in global missions, such as addressing global warming, poverty, hunger, ethnic cleansing. etc.

    by Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:36:21 PM PDT

    •  Global community ...

      You are right about the "global community". Actually, the whole concept of "they like him over there, so he cannot be good for us" is so strange that it took me some time to realize what Freedland was getting at. I mean, are we living in the stone age or what? To me this sound like political reasoning from an alien planet.

      by RWeede on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 06:17:45 AM PDT

  •  I can totally see this

    I was talking to somebody about McCain/Obama and his comment about Obama was how he didn't like how he had just appeared out of nowhere to become the nominee i.e. who is this black guy with the foreign name and exotic background.  The meme is already taking hold with some folks.  

    by fnb on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:46:48 PM PDT

  •  Three points, baby!!

    Thanks for that video. I'd only seen the stills.

    -5.88, -6.82

    by Debby on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:47:08 PM PDT

  •  Is it OK to have a crush on a pres candidate?

    all respect, Michelle, but he is one cool dude.

    by cityvitalsigns on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:41:05 PM PDT

    •  All Respect POTUS, But She's One Cool Lady!! nt

      by Gooserock on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:50:12 PM PDT

    •  haha

      i was thinking the SAME THING! haha

      nice.

      lucky Michelle.

      by mdmslle on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 03:23:46 AM PDT

  •  Americans love a winner

    ...as shown by how big of a celebrity Lance Armstrong became. I think huge crowds in Europe can only help.

    by Sacramento Dem on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 12:07:37 AM PDT

  •  I hope so

    I really hope Americans are smarter than Washington insiders give them credit for.

    by msrpotus on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 12:58:55 AM PDT

  •  I think the idea is retarded

    We should show that Europeans hate him so that Americans will like him???

    Backwards and stupid.

    Obama still rocks and if Americans have to be oppositional toddlers then there is no

    HOPE.

    by rini6 on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 03:42:37 AM PDT

•  Sigh.

  If the majority of American voters (or the majority of voters in states that rack up the majority of electoral votes) would rather have a President that is less-liked abroad and further-decline our stature in the world, sure, go vote for Crazy McCain, they deserve what they get.

  The rest of us? Maybe not so much.

  Really, there is nothing of merit in that snippet of the article. It's a mix of bad traditional media talking points and apathy.

  by kath25 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:48:05 PM PDT

  •  I believe Mr. Freedland has his tongue ...

    ...firmly in his cheek.

    by Meteor Blades on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:49:38 PM PDT

    •  Yes. And remember the Guardian got burned in 2004

      when it launched a letter writing campaign to American voters pleading with them to vote for Kerry. It went over like a lead balloon and the paper ended up really kicking itself.

      by kat68 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:02:38 PM PDT

    •  OHHHHHH.

      Seriously, totally missed that.

      Too little sleep over too many days.

      Oh well! Thanks for the nudge, MB.

      by kath25 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:08:17 PM PDT

      •  me too. just had dinner and some wine

        gonna have to reread the story here. :)

        by Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:46:26 PM PDT

    •  tongue in cheek?

      I hope not.  He's exactly right in a non-ironic no kidding and no jokes way.  

      Of course the crowds will do what they will do... but his advice is sound.

      Any enthusiasm for Obama abroad will be used against him in America.

      by Miles on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:12:59 PM PDT

      •  I don't think it'll work, though.

        Most people I talk to realize we need to cooperate globally to solve problems, especially the one we're facing everyday--gas prices. People I talk to are happy that Obama is getting a good reception internationally. The few eye-rollers are definitely part of the 30% Club, those last stalwart supporters of Dubya who think everything is going swimmingly.

        -5.88, -6.82

        by Debby on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:50:45 PM PDT

        •  Does dubya's camp still number 30%?

          I thought we were down to about 8% or so. These should be the only fools upset about a positive Obama reception abroad.

          by pvmuse on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 01:14:33 AM PDT

      •  Any enthusiasm ANYWHERE for Obama is used

        against him by the wingnuts and their media sucklings.

        by 417els on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:59:03 PM PDT

        •  which is why I hope Youtube has

          side by side tapes of GWB's anemic EU crowds and the crowds Obama should attract.

          by entlord1 on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 01:33:21 AM PDT

          •  yeah

            or that time he got off t he heli and those dudes didnt even wave back...or the time that little girl ran from him the other day...or the protests he's inspired in England most recently...Yeah.

            by mdmslle on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 03:26:57 AM PDT

      •  By the same token, any lack of enthusiasm...

        Will be used against Obama.  Stop trying to please the Republicans.  There is no pleasing them.  Anything and everything is Bad For Obama; anything and everything is Good For Republicans.

        Low gas prices?  No market for renewables.  High gas prices?  Bad time to invest in renewables.  Enron collapse?  Better deregulate financial markets.  Financial market collapse?  Don't let regulation get in the way of a recovery!  Home mortgage crises?  Deregulate to allow more people to get mortgages.  Social Security working?  Better cut taxes.  Social security not working?  Better cut taxes.  Not at war?  Go to war.  At war?  More war.

        What's the lesson for us?  Don't try to appease Republicans.

        by pseudo999 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:35:40 PM PDT

        •  Indeed.

          Don't play chess with mad people.

          by ThatBritGuy on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 03:37:32 AM PDT

  •  Germasn polls show that 11% of them prefer McCain

    If he visits any time soon that may drop. On the other hand, Obama meets with Karzai discussing the options that lay before the two countries and the problem presented by the Pashtun and the Pakistanis to Afghanistan's economic recovery and CNN spends 15 minutes on what the two men are wearing (no earth tones but each had on a dark coat and white shirt and so the discussion was about how to always dress to match your host. But Obama had on a tie; Karzai did not. Karzai was dressed in "Ahmadinejad chic" or what the RW called it. I forget which politician committed the sin of not wearing a tie and was accused of dressing like a "terrorist" but never a peep about Karzai.

    Now if Obama had forgotten his tie, I can already imagine the nationwide outrage that Obama would be getting ready to give Afghanistan back to the Pashtun the way Carter gave the Canal back to Panama. (amazing how Americans are always giving sovereign countries back their own territories. Very white of us)  

    by entlord1 on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 01:32:17 AM PDT

•  CNN never had a "Maliki picks Obama's Iraq plan"

  headline, but now they have a "Lieberman: Obama Choosing to Lose Iraq War" headline.  Shameless Republican scum network.

  by Troubadour on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:48:06 PM PDT

  •  What a fucknut. n/t

    Shirley Schmidt: A Democrat.

    by Jyrinx on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:48:59 PM PDT

  •  CNN's Line Is Total Mistranslation Screwup

    Just heard last hour.

    by Gooserock on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:49:53 PM PDT

    •  Wow. It's *provably* false. Great job, guys. n/t

      Shirley Schmidt: A Democrat.

      by Jyrinx on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:53:06 PM PDT

    •  Lieberman looked the fool on Fox News Sunday

      Evan Bayh of all people swept him under the rug in rebutting Lieberman's "Obama's plan was retreat, surrender, lose the war, etc etc etc".  Bayh put him in his place and Lieberman appeared to lose his temper in turning back to Bayh and interrupting with "No, Barack wanted to lose the war".

      I'm paraphrasing as there is not a transcript up yet, but Lieberman played the total fool in losing his temper and getting schooled by Evan Bayh...and who in the world gets schooled by Evan Bayh?

      by Lauren S on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:56:30 PM PDT

      •  Oops, replied to the wrong comment

        My comment above was meant as a reply to Troubadour's comment.

        by Lauren S on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:58:01 PM PDT

      •  Lieberman also pretty much said that

        losing his leadership positions would not play a role in deciding whether he would speak at the RNC because "I go by the McCain model, country over party".   He also said that he of course would not be attacking Obama, simply touting McCain.  Funny how he hasn't lived by that statement as of yet.

        What a lying ass.

        by Lauren S on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:08:52 PM PDT

        •  Here's the Transcript

          Fox News Sunday: Liberman vs. Bayh TRANSCRIPT

          BAYH: Chris, I think it's important to note that Barack Obama's judgment about these issues has been excellent from the beginning, the kind of judgment you'd want in a commander in chief, and others are now beginning to adopt his positions.

          We wouldn't be discussing surges in Iraq or anything else if Barack had had his way. We wouldn't have started that war to begin with.

          He was right about Afghanistan. That's the place from which we were attacked. He's been calling for more troops there now for over a year. And John McCain, to his credit, has now come around and adopted Barack's point of view on that.

          He has been for, as you say, a phased withdrawal from Iraq. As we heard, Prime Minister Maliki has embraced a more definitive time line, whether it's the 16 months or something else. But clearly, they want a more definitive time line.

          And even President Bush now is coming up with a variety of euphemisms — aspirational goals, time horizons. I mean, it's starting to sound pretty much like a timeline to me.

          So it's common sense, Chris. Any important enterprise, certainly something as important as a war — you want to have a plan. And a plan has to have some idea of what it's going to cost, what the adverse consequences are going to be and how long it's going to take.

          So 16 months seems to be a reasonable goal. Let's work toward that. Let's bring this to a conclusion in a responsible way and focus on Iraq (sic) where the focus should have been all along.
          
          WALLACE: But, Senator Bayh, even the Washington Post criticized Obama this week for — and let's put it up on the screen — his iron timetable, accusing him of foolish consistency and that he's ultimately indifferent to the war's outcome.

          And here's an exchange between Obama and McCain this week.

          [...]

          
          WALLACE: Again, two questions, really, Senator Bayh. Why the, quote, "iron timetable" that the Washington Post talks about? And secondly, this issue — why announce your policy before you go to Iraq and talk to the generals and the Iraqis?
          
          BAYH: A couple of things, Chris. First, General Petraeus was asked recently about whether a 16-month period was a reasonable period of time, and he said it would depend on a variety of factors. He didn't say it was unreasonable.

          We've been there — will have been — 16 months from when the next president is inaugurated, almost seven years. We've spent $700 billion. Just think of all the other things we could have done — finished Afghanistan, energy security for our country — with those amount of resources.

          What's really surprising is that John, a man I admire and respect, says that even knowing there were no weapons of mass destruct in Iraq, knowing all the consequences that have been adverse in Afghanistan because of our fixation on Iraq, he would do this all over again. That's what is really surprising.

          So Barack thinks that 16 months from January is a reasonable period of time. Let's go for it. Let's see. Let's try and bring this to a conclusion on that time frame. If there are difficulties, we'll address them when they arise.

          LIEBERMAN: Look, the fact is that if Barack Obama's policy on Iraq had been implemented, Barack Obama couldn't go to Iraq today. It wouldn't be safe. Barack Obama and John McCain saw the same difficulty in Iraq.

          John McCain had the guts to argue against public opinion, to put his whole campaign on the line, because, as he says, he'd rather lose an election than lose in a war that he thinks is this important to the United States.

          The reason I say Barack — if Barack Obama's policy couldn't — had been implemented — if Barack Obama's policy in Iraq had been implemented, he couldn't be in Iraq today is because he was prepared to accept retreat and defeat.

          And that would mean today Al Qaeda would be in charge of parts of Iraq. Iranian-backed extremists would be in charge of other parts of Iraq. There'd be civil war and maybe even genocide.

          And the fact is that we are winning in Iraq today. And you know, you can't choose, as Senator Obama seems to think, to lose in Iraq so you can win in Afghanistan.

          The reality is if we lost in Iraq, which Obama was prepared to do, we would go to Afghanistan as losers. Instead, Al Qaeda has its tail tucked between its legs as it's exiting Iraq to go — to try to...

          WALLACE: I'm going to...

          BAYH: I have to respond to that. Barack Obama was not for losing in Iraq. Barack didn't want the war to begin with.

          John McCain opposed surging troops in Afghanistan until last week.
          
          LIEBERMAN: Yeah, but what...

          BAYH: Excuse me. Was John for losing in Afghanistan? I don't think so.

          LIEBERMAN: Of course not.

          BAYH: And now you have Maliki, even President Bush, are moving toward Barack Obama's position on this.

          WALLACE: I want to...

          BAYH: His judgment was right.

          WALLACE: Gentlemen, I want to — we could continue this...

          LIEBERMAN: Those questions — bottom line, no question that Barack Obama was prepared to lose in Iraq.

          BAYH: That's not true.

          WALLACE: All right. All right.

          LIEBERMAN: Forget what's right or wrong...

          Simply reading Lieberman's bullshit doesn't do justice to the smackdown that Bayh gave him.  Lieberman was visibly losing his temper at one point and Bayh would yield no ground at all, even going back to the Iraq issue on Obama's behalf when the question was about the VP stuff.  

          I'm absolutely no fan of Evan Bayh's, he's the epitome of a DLC centrist that I cannot stand, but he was absolutely great on Obama's behalf against Lieberman today on Fox News.

          Also note that Bayh was speaking about Obama's leadership judgment in being against the war and Lieberman's response to Bayh acted as if Bayh was speaking about Obama's opinion of the surge, not going to war.

          Lieberman was not only playing the fool, he was an absolutely dishonest shill and couldn't even reply to what Bayh said, turning it instead into a completely different topic and acting as if he was still responding to the topic Bayh had brought up (the invasion of Iraq, not the surge).  

          Lieberman is a lying sack of shit and displayed it for the world to see yet again.

          by Lauren S on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:46:04 PM PDT

        •  Lieberman's answer to the RNC question....

          WALLACE: Real quickly, are you going to speak at the Republican convention?

          LIEBERMAN: I don't know yet.

          WALLACE: If you're asked, will you?
          
          LIEBERMAN: If John asks me and he thinks I can help him, because I believe — this is no ordinary time, no ordinary election. John McCain is no ordinary candidate. I want to help him.

          I'm not going to attack Barack Obama. I'm going to go to explain why I, as an independent Democrat, am supporting John McCain, hoping that I can convince other independents and Democrats to join me in choosing the man who is clearly more ready to be the president America needs today.

          WALLACE: Even if that means Senate Democrats would kick you out of their caucus?

          LIEBERMAN: Well, I'm following the model of John McCain. I'm going to do what I think is right for the country and not worry about the politics. And John McCain is definitely right for the country as our next president.

          WALLACE: Senator Lieberman, Senator Bayh, we want to thank you both. We could have talked a lot more. Safe travels on the campaign trail to both of you.

          LIEBERMAN: Thank you.

          BAYH: Thank you, Chris.

          by Lauren S on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:53:57 PM PDT

        •  Now diaried

          here

          by Lauren S on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 12:14:41 AM PDT

  •  "Shameless Republican scum" -- redundancy!

    by Cartoon Peril on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:54:54 PM PDT

  •  Shorter Lieberman:

    "I have not yet begun to defile myself!"

    by Kimberley on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:56:28 PM PDT

    •  O RLY?

      What do you call it when he checks McCain's bearings?

      ;-)

      by Trix on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:07:36 PM PDT

    •  If he had retired a few years ago

      he would have had a reputation (deserved or not) as an honorable, moral man. Now, he'll always be known as a liar and whore.

      by Jim P on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:10:16 PM PDT

  •  somehow doing anything in Afghanistan is losing

    in Iraq. Maybe Lieberman could enlighten the rest of us on how one is tied inexorably to the other. As it is the lack of manpower in Afghanistan is losing Afghanistan and Iran is the reason we are overextended with our military.

    BTW Obama has mentioned national service for every American and the RW is already claiming he plans to form his own militia or else to reinstate the draft.

    Republicans having to fight the wars they start: O NO!! The Injustice!!!  

    by entlord1 on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 01:36:24 AM PDT

    •  losing in Iraq

      explaining this is easy unless one has a brain. Since we don't have enough troops, by doing anything that takes them out of Iraq loses Iraq. It doesn't matter that the Iraqis don't want Al Queda and when given the weapons to fight they get rid of Al Queda. We have to wait until the generals on the ground tell we can remove our troops. And if you are Bush when the generals tell you something you don't like you just replace them with ones that will.

      by bamahoward on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 01:50:22 AM PDT

    •  America was never at war in Iraq.

      Kind of hard to "lose" George W. Bush's crime.

      by Troubadour on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 10:43:27 AM PDT

•  I think after 8 years...

  of the most disastrous American presidency in recent times, and the utter depth to which American opinion abroad has sunk thereunder, the American people are eager for foreigners to embrace us again.  I think Obama senses that, and is willing to take the risk of the familiar Rethug attack that he cares more about foreigners.  I for one would love to see a million people show up to hear what I think will be yet another brilliant speech.  

  by JTRicher on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:48:20 PM PDT

•  Go Barack

  maybe 2 million will show up in Berlin!

  by eeff on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:48:21 PM PDT

  •  Obama at Netroots Nation (video)

    Hehe. I changed the border to match the dailykos schema. =^)

    by opendna on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:27:45 PM PDT

    •  is it easy to change the color?

      I could just look at the source I guess here, but not sure how to embed it as orange? very cool, thanks!

      by LokiMom on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:37:48 PM PDT

      •  re

        Check the page for the video. It has a "customize" link to the right of the Embed code. ;^)

        by opendna on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 01:09:48 AM PDT

        •  thanks, did not know that, obviously. :-)

          by LokiMom on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 10:16:05 PM PDT

•  Back home from Netroots Nation!

  Still can't believe I got to meet Al Gore and shake the man's hand!  :-D

  Although I said "President Gore" when I met him.  Heh.

  by BruinKid on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:48:22 PM PDT

  •  have you washed your hand yet?

    and what about pic of you and al?

    by Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:38:08 PM PDT

    •  That's what I was saying...

      to others there.  I can't wash my hand now.  Alas, since that time, it's been washed.  :-(

      I may put up pics, but they won't be of me, because technically I'm still anonymous.

      by BruinKid on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 01:07:23 AM PDT

•  Fortunately, Obama's name isn't nearly

  as vulnerable to Francophonification. "Barraque Eaubamme" doesn't have quite the same punch.

  Shirley Schmidt: A Democrat.

  by Jyrinx on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:48:34 PM PDT

  •  It's all in the pronunciation

    and that's MONSIEUR Barraque Eaubamme, s'il vous plait.  

    by dotalbon on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:53:00 PM PDT

    •  Soon, "Monsieur le président" :-) n/t

      Shirley Schmidt: A Democrat.

      by Jyrinx on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:58:54 PM PDT

      •  Spanish guys, Spanish

        I distinctly remember Barack saying we all had to learn Spanish and then I saw Lou Dobbs head explode on TV ... really .... I did.

        by ancblu on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:53:09 PM PDT

    •  C'est Baroque L'Obama

      by Alec82 on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:41:32 PM PDT

      •  a french friend of mine

        calls him Baroque l'Amerloque.

        :)

        by imisa on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 01:49:31 AM PDT

  •  but he's in Germany, not France

    "Bertolt von Obamastein"

    by shpilk on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:06:25 PM PDT

    •  In German I thought it would be

      Barachtung Baby.

      by ancblu on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:57:30 PM PDT

•  Not buying it

  besides, who wrote that Obama can't be agreeable to Europeans? A European! Don't believe you, John Bull.

  by Karl Rover on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:49:43 PM PDT

•  Overnight Eye Candy

  

  Hagel, Reed, Barack, and Commanding General of Kuwait, Jim Lovelace.

  The GI response has be off the charts.

  I starting to think Hagel may get the VEEP nod.

  by Al Rodgers on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:50:54 PM PDT

  •  No, no, no, a f'n thousand times NO!

    ...to Hagel as vice president.

    by Meteor Blades on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 09:59:27 PM PDT

    •  Out of curiosity

      and since I've never seen your opinion on this, who would you pick for Obama's VP?

      It isn't easy being green.

      by emeraldmaiden on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:01:21 PM PDT

      •  A Democrat, first and foremost. Any person ...

        ...I would prefer, however, would be far too leftist to meet Obama's requirement for non-partisanship.  

        by Meteor Blades on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:10:28 PM PDT

        •  hyperbole

          1. Feinstein isn't prefable to Hagel.

          2. back to the future (pre-iowa) with the non-partisan/ utopian/centrist/reagan labels.  Such a shame, considering McMarbles current hypebole - "Barack is more red than bernie sanders"  

          by Al Rodgers on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:28:46 PM PDT

          •  I am no fan of Dianne Feinstein, as I have ...

            ...noted here at least a hundred times. And. besides, she's too old to be picked as VP, imo.

            But Hagel is bad on education, bad on economics, bad on social issues, bad on civil rights, bad on the environment, something that seems to escape notice of that, fortunately small, group of progressives who think he would be a good choice as vice president.

            And I am not calling Obama out with any label. He is the one who speaks favorably of Team of Rivals.  

            by Meteor Blades on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:34:54 PM PDT

            •  I love it - now you're trashing lincoln.

              One day he's Richard J. Daley (Da Boss), the next day he's Lincoln!

              being compared to Lincoln is not an insult.  Abe will welcome Barack on Mount Rushmore.

              

              Personally, I prefer the comparisons to Shaft!!  

              by Al Rodgers on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:50:49 PM PDT

              •  Al. to quote something someone recently said ...

                ...Geez. Get a grip.

                I did not trash Obama, although I have certainly criticized him. And I did not trash Lincoln.

                You accused me of hauling out old false labels for Obama, and I pointed out that he speaks highly of Team of Rivals. I did not make a judgment in that regard, merely an observation.

                For the record, I'd like to see him put some of his recent rivals into his Cabinet (as long as he doesn't choose any Senators who will be replaced in the Senate by Republicans). But I don't mind if he puts a couple of Republicans in appropriate spots in the Cabinet. But not as SecDef.

                It was a Republican who won the vice presidency in 1860, an anti-slavery Republican. And when the War Democrat Andrew Johnson replaced him after the election of 1864, it presaged disaster.

                Hagel is a terrible choice for the vice presidency, no matter his stance on Iraq. If he were chosen, the chances for which I think are just about nil, it would create a split in the Democratic Party that the PUMAs can imagine only in their most fevered dreams.

                by Meteor Blades on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:28:15 PM PDT

                •  wow, you're vain.

                  Well, welcome aboard.

                  I'll have someone issue you a locker and key.

                  by Al Rodgers on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:43:57 PM PDT

                •  No candy for PUMAs -- No to Hagel

                  I am starting to like Jack Reed.  West Point guy and a Professor.  His military record is off the charts -- this Army Ranger has moved up on my chart.

                  by LV Pol Girl on Mon Jul 21, 2008 at 12:15:43 AM PDT

    •  Geez, get a grip.

      you're supposed to be the grey beard around here.  I already got the Andy Kaufman role sewed up.

      by Al Rodgers on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:05:18 PM PDT

    •  not to worry

      the Bilderberg group already picked our VPs for us, and Hagel is not their choice.

      Totally off topic, but did you see this article:

      Thousand of Former UK Troops Now Mercenaries in Iraq

      Iraq is so destroyed, which was the plan all along, I believe.

      by dancewater on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:09:59 PM PDT

      •  Despite the boosting of the military ...

        ...by 92,000 more marines and soldiers that will occur whether McCain or Obama wins, the future of war, as in so much of the near and distant past, will be found in mercenaries.

        by Meteor Blades on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:19:13 PM PDT

        •  Can I assume you've read

          Scahill's Blackwater book, then? Very, very interesting. I did a book review of it here in December.

          by LokiMom on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:35:16 PM PDT

          •  Yes, I read it after SusanG ...

            ...reviewed it here in Book Review: Jeremy Scahill's "Blackwater".

            by Meteor Blades on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:42:00 PM PDT

            •  cool thanks for her link too! n/t

              by LokiMom on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:43:55 PM PDT

    •  you're gonna hate my comment

      but if hagel is vp, i really, REALLY don't think i can vote that ticket! cripes, straight dem ticket or bust!

      by Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 10:39:53 PM PDT

      •  Love & Hate

        Let me tell you the story of "Right Hand, Left Hand."

        It's a tale of good and evil.

        Hate: It was with this hand that Cane iced his brother.

        Love: These five fingers, they go straight to the soul of man.

        The right hand: the hand of love. The story of life is this: Static. One hand is always fighting the other hand; and the left hand is kicking much ass. I mean, it looks like the right hand, Love, is finished. But, hold on, stop the presses, the right hand is coming back.

        Yeah, he got the left hand on the ropes, now, that's right. Ooh, it's the devastating right and Hate is hurt, he's down.

        Left-Hand Hate K.O.ed by Love.

        Do the Right Thing (1989)

        I love your honesty.

        I love your courage.

        I love honest feedback.

        I love discussion.

        If Hagel is picked, in time, my Love will bring you around.

        Gracias, Amigo.

        by Al Rodgers on Sun Jul 20, 2008 at 11:04:22 PM PDT

        •  recced for everything but this..

          If Hagel is picked, in time, my Love will bring you around.