Skip to main content

Joe Walsh is right, of course, but it's even harder to leave if you aren't looking for the door.  Given that a majority of the American and Afghan people want the US to leave Afghanistan, it's probably time to start looking for the door there.  As many commentators have noted, the US involvement in Afghanistan looks uncomfortably similar to its involvement in Vietnam, where the US also took a long time to start looking for the door.  While the Vietnam-Afghanistan comparison can be over done, there are some similarities which show why the Administration should be looking for the door.

Among the useful comparisons are these.  In neither country were there any vital US interests at stake.  History has shown that it didn't significantly affect the US when South Vietnam became part of North Vietnam.  Likewise, in and of itself, it doesn't matter to the US who wins the current civil war in Afghanistan among the Taliban and the several other war lords in the country.

Next, President Karzai looks like President Diem, as Frank Rich noted in his September 27, 2009 NY Times Op-Ed piece.  Karzai, like Diem, is the nominal leader of the country, but he lacks popular support or much political or military power.  Both men tried to fill the gap with corruption.  Karzai is using US aid money to buy political support from those willing to sell.  In neither case, are US troops a solution to the political short-comings of our chosen "leader" of the country.  This is particularly so in Afghanistan, where Karzai is the only political leader who is not a war lord. which is pretty much always a losing hand.

The US has tried to make Karzai into a political force by holding elections, but in a country without a history of democracy and with effective tribal leaders already in place, an election will not turn a powerless President into an actual political force.  Equally, it's very unlikely that the war lords and tribal leaders will allow Karzai to become an independent political force, since it's not in their interest to do so.

The US couldn't create a democratic society in Vietnam by force of arms.  Neither has it hasn't created one in Afghanistan in the 8 years we've been there, and it isn't going to create one if we stay another 8 years.  As a British general recently observed about his country's army: "It isn't an armed reconstruction force."  US soldiers can't shoot enough Afghanis to turn the country into a democracy.  

Further, General McCrystal's plan to use US troops to "isolate" the "good" Afghans from the Taliban sounds a lot like the second coming of the Strategic Hamlet plan in Vietnam.  While McCrystal's plan is lacking in details at this point, it seems as unlikely to succeed in turning Kazari into an effective political leader as the Strategic Hamlet plan was in propping up Diem.  If McCrystal's plan is to be carried out by Afghans, it is likely have the same problems with corruption and incompetent administration that killed the Strategic Hamlet plan in Vietnam.  If it's run by US troops, it will only increase the already great dislike by the Afghan people of our occupying their country.

Finally, President Obama seems to be channeling Lyndon Johnson's instinct to make policy by keeping to the "middle road" between opposing views.  Thus Johnson had nice Quaker ladies tell him to get out of Vietnam in one meeting and then an hour later military types would want to do various extreme things to North Vietnam or even China, so sending tens of thousands of more troops to Vietnam seemed to him like the middle road.  President Obama seems poised to conclude that the best policy in Afghanistan is to keep between getting out and sending all the troops that the military wants.  For instance, to properly occupy the country would take over 600,000 soldiers.  Gen. McCrystal is playing on this tendency of Obama's by telling Obama that he has to have 20,000 to 80,000 more troops.  Thus the 40,000 troops he started out requesting will look like the middle road to the President.  

Before President Obama follows President Johnson down the escalation path because it's the middle road and because he doesn't want Republicans to say he lost a war, the Administration needs to figure out when to start looking for the door.  Which means identifying achievable goals for the US in Afghanistan that make sense in the circumstances.  Unfortunately, the President's March goals don't fit that description because they are too ill defined and aren't practical.  Al-Quada is too ill defined and only loosely connected to kill all of them off.  So the goal has to be, as Joe Biden is apparently arguing, to make life operationally  really difficult for them, thus providing all the protection possible for the US mainland.  That's a continuing effort which requires a variety of tactics, but doesn't require the US to continue the to occupy Afghanistan.

There are achievable and rational strategic goals for Afghanistan, which as it turns out, we've already accomplished.  As the Administration's own recent reports show, Al-Quada's leadership that was in Afghanistan is now in Pakistan and has a much reduced ability to cause trouble.  That result with achieved with many fewer troops than are in Afghanistan now, and the situation can be sustain with only a few troops on the ground in the area.  

The second goal should be to make it expensive, in one way or another, for any country to actively protect, train and supply terrorists that threaten the US.  It's not necessary to occupy a country for years and years to do that.  We just need to make it so expensive that no country would want to do it.  And we've already done that in Afghanistan.  If we left the country tomorrow, there is no question that we have clearly made the point to the  Taliban and everyone else in the world, for that matter, that active support of terrorists in their territory which results in an attack on the US is going to be way too expensive to permit.  Nothing else useful can accomplished in Afghanistan.  

There is no reason to think that the Taliban, if they regain control of Afghanistan, will want to do anything that will bring back the US military.  However fondly they think of Al-An Quada, the Taliban cannot want to have a replay of a US invasion.  Further, it's easy to make clear to them what actions on their part will bring about the kind of military action they would want to avoid.  

Having accomplish both of the sensible goals for US military involvement in Afghanistan, it's time to declare victory and go home.  When President Obama announces the bringing of the troops home, as he must some day, he should paraphrase Lyndon Johnson's best insight on Vietnam: We are not about to send American soldiers 7 thousand miles away from home to do what Afghan soldiers ought to be doing for themselves.

Originally posted to publius21 on Thu Oct 15, 2009 at 09:22 AM PDT.

EMAIL TO A FRIEND X
Your Email has been sent.
You must add at least one tag to this diary before publishing it.

Add keywords that describe this diary. Separate multiple keywords with commas.
Tagging tips - Search For Tags - Browse For Tags

?

More Tagging tips:

A tag is a way to search for this diary. If someone is searching for "Barack Obama," is this a diary they'd be trying to find?

Use a person's full name, without any title. Senator Obama may become President Obama, and Michelle Obama might run for office.

If your diary covers an election or elected official, use election tags, which are generally the state abbreviation followed by the office. CA-01 is the first district House seat. CA-Sen covers both senate races. NY-GOV covers the New York governor's race.

Tags do not compound: that is, "education reform" is a completely different tag from "education". A tag like "reform" alone is probably not meaningful.

Consider if one or more of these tags fits your diary: Civil Rights, Community, Congress, Culture, Economy, Education, Elections, Energy, Environment, Health Care, International, Labor, Law, Media, Meta, National Security, Science, Transportation, or White House. If your diary is specific to a state, consider adding the state (California, Texas, etc). Keep in mind, though, that there are many wonderful and important diaries that don't fit in any of these tags. Don't worry if yours doesn't.

You can add a private note to this diary when hotlisting it:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from your hotlist?
Are you sure you want to remove your recommendation? You can only recommend a diary once, so you will not be able to re-recommend it afterwards.
Rescue this diary, and add a note:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from Rescue?
Choose where to republish this diary. The diary will be added to the queue for that group. Publish it from the queue to make it appear.

You must be a member of a group to use this feature.

Add a quick update to your diary without changing the diary itself:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary?
(The diary will be removed from the site and returned to your drafts for further editing.)
(The diary will be removed.)
Are you sure you want to save these changes to the published diary?

Comment Preferences

  •  We can't leave Afghanistan until Pakistan... (0+ / 0-)

    is secure.

    Leaving would only embolden the Taliban and their allies in Pakistan. They will have defeated the "Great Satan" and its allies.

    The exit from Afghanistan can happen only when Pakistan has reclaimed territory lost to the Taliban and the Afghan army is capable of taking and holding territory.

    That process has only just started.

    All evils are equal when they are extreme. - Pierre Corneille

    by LiberalCanuck on Thu Oct 15, 2009 at 09:31:24 AM PDT

  •  Excellent diary. (0+ / 0-)

    "The truth shall set you free - but first it'll piss you off." Gloria Steinem

    Iraq Moratorium

    by One Pissed Off Liberal on Thu Oct 15, 2009 at 09:40:17 AM PDT

  •  Let's leave Afghanistan post haste. (0+ / 0-)

    Trying to wage war there is the political version of trying to herd cats. The political, religious and cultural fragmentation of that country is such that "victory" is meaningless. If that were not enough, the mountinous geography of Afganistan makes winning and holding on to territory almost impossible, even assuming that American troops  have the cooperation of natives.

    Always striking to me is the contrast between how American troops and Afghani fighters are outfitted. The Americans wear 50-60 pounds of state-of-the-art military equipment. They have the best weaponry that modern science can provide. For the Afganistan troops (read:irregulars), their equipment consists of the sandals on their feet, the turbans on their heads, an AK-47 rifle and a stubborness honed on centuries of repelling invaders from their country.

    The sides arn't equal, let's get out.    

  •  It cannot work. It never has worked. (0+ / 0-)

    No one can create a democracy at gunpoint. You can only create a dictatorship that way. This is because any government imposed from the outside will be considered as illegitimate to those forced to live under it.

    The French and US couldn't make it work in Vietnam.
    The Russians couldn't make it work in Afghanistan.
    The Japanese couldn't make it work in China.
    The Chinese haven't made it work in Tibet yet.
    The British held India partially by force of arms.
    Even the Genghis Kahn's government was considered "imposed" by his subjects.

    But someone always tries. What's that old saying about "Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is a form of insanity?"

    "Ridicule may lawfully be employed where reason has no hope of success."

    by QuestionAuthority on Thu Oct 15, 2009 at 10:04:35 AM PDT

  •  My Masarati does 185 (0+ / 0-)

    Still shootin' Pashtuns in year 25.

    Unlike the Viet Cong and the NVA, the Taliban and their Al Queda allies do pose a long term threat to the US and to the Pakistan nuclear arsenal.  This is not a problem with an easy solution.  Parallels to Viet Nam are overly simplistic.

    Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!

    by bigtimecynic on Thu Oct 15, 2009 at 10:49:25 AM PDT

    •  The trick is to get accountants to pay for it all (0+ / 0-)

      I agree that not all Vietnam parallels are correct, but there are some disturbing ones.  Be that as it may, surely there are ways to accomplish your goals other than to occupy Afghanistan in hopes that that will create a democratic country which will then accomplish your goals.

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site