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San Francisco values ... the catch-all phrase that Republicans like to toss out to conjure up that conservative bogeyman, the DFH who wants to take away God, mom and apple pie while burning the American flag. Or as they like to call them, Democrats.

If only there were more of them:

A new report on who supplies — and who spends — California's public dollars shows an interesting disparity between the givers and the takers:

Counties that provide most of the state's revenue streams like income and sales taxes reliably elect Democrats, who traditionally want to take more of your money. And counties whose Republican representatives argue most vociferously for social services cuts draw, per capita, the most state aid.

... It also adds new color to the prevailing portrait of poverty for many Californians — it's not fundamentally an urban problem.

Instead, experts say, rural residents would be most affected by the drastic cuts being considered to health and human services programs. The report shows the Bay Area's blue counties are, in many ways, a revenue lifeline for the rural Republican red.

And while Republicans love to blather on about "real" Americans (who seem to only live in flyover country or within sight of Alaska) being screwed over on a daily basis by the government in general and the Democrats in particular, the fact is that both are revenue lifelines for Republicans in California and throughout the country.

So, about those San Francisco values ...

Originally posted to Daily Kos on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:13 AM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Remember liberalism is a mental disorder =) (11+ / 0-)
    Please

    "There is nothing wrong with America can't be cured by what is right with America" -Bill Clinton

    by SensibleDemocrat on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:17:46 AM PDT

  •  Republicans are like parasites (22+ / 0-)

    who are bitter that their host remains healthy in spite of all their attempts to weaken it.

    You don't bring a knife to a gunfight and you don't bring a chicken to the doctor.

    by beltane on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:17:57 AM PDT

    •  temper that a bit (0+ / 0-)

      if we accept that most metropolitan areas vote Democratic and that most rural areas vote Republican (I realize that this isn't always true, but just for the argument) and, as in CA, Democratic areas tend to send tax revenue to subsidize Republican areas it may seem unfair to the point that D areas should retaliate financially at R areas.  But hold on, rural areas provide valuable services to metro areas that don't show up in our valuation system, usually.  
      Most rural areas supply almost all of metro areas' food, and that is paid for when purchased, but still, try to imagine a metro area growing all of its food.
      Rural areas guarantee virtually all of the fresh water supplies for metro areas, and with the exception of NYC, I know of almost no other metro areas that have even attempted purchase or put a value on fresh water environmental services provided by rural areas.
      Rural areas also provide vast amounts of other environmental services that our society does a very poor job of putting a value on, and these rural areas are usually not compensated in any way for these env. services.
      So, feel free to be angry at rural/Republican lack of gratitude for being sustained by metro/Democratic tax dollars, but don't forget that metro areas are also extremely dependent on rural areas for a vast range of environmental services that are usually not compensated in any way.

  •  We (D's) bail them (R's) out. (10+ / 0-)

    They bail the banks and corporations out.
    The people get left out.

  •  SF city has Universal Health Care, USA? no (10+ / 0-)

    Trying to get a politican to do something is like trying to get a pay raise from your bosses secretary. Wrong person

    by Churchill on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:19:12 AM PDT

  •  IIRC, the biggest net taker of tax $$$ in CA is (25+ / 0-)

    Modoc County, which is also just about the reddest county in the state.  They get back roughly twice what they put in, and still they're bitching that they pay too much.  Self-made, my ass.

    They only call it Class War when we fight back.

    by lineatus on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:19:31 AM PDT

    •  Vitral Facts (5+ / 0-)

      This is first hand evidence that the stupid republican philosophy does not work.

    •  Or, more likely (8+ / 0-)

      They're suckers who vote for the Republicans because of "family values" and don't realize that Republican fiscal policy harms them.

    •  A Classic (29+ / 0-)

      "A DAY IN THE LIFE OF JOE REPUBLICAN"

      Joe gets up at 6 a.m. and fills his coffeepot with water to prepare his morning coffee. The water is clean and good because some tree-hugging liberal fought for minimum water-quality standards. With his first swallow of water, he takes his daily medication. His medications are safe to take because some stupid commie liberal fought to ensure their safety and that they work as advertised.
      All but $10 of his medications are paid for by his employer's medical plan because some liberal union workers fought their employers for paid medical insurance - now Joe gets it too.

      He prepares his morning breakfast, bacon and eggs. Joe's bacon is safe to eat because some girly-man liberal fought for laws to regulate the meat packing industry.

      In the morning shower, Joe reaches for his shampoo. His bottle is properly labeled with each ingredient and its amount in the total contents because some crybaby liberal fought for his right to know what he was putting on his body and how much it contained.

      Joe dresses, walks outside and takes a deep breath. The air he breathes is clean because some environmentalist wacko liberal fought for the laws to stop industries from polluting our air.

      He walks on the government-provided sidewalk to subway station for his government-subsidized ride to work. It saves him considerable money in parking and transportation fees because some fancy-pants liberal fought for affordable public transportation, which gives everyone the opportunity to be a contributor.

      Joe begins his work day. He has a good job with excellent pay, medical benefits, retirement, paid holidays and vacation because some lazy liberal union members fought and died for these working standards. Joe's employer pays these standards because Joe's employer doesn't want his employees to call the union.

      If Joe is hurt on the job or becomes unemployed, he'll get a worker compensation or unemployment check because some stupid liberal didn't think he should lose his home because of his temporary misfortune.

      It is noontime and Joe needs to make a bank deposit so he can pay some bills. Joe's deposit is federally insured by the FSLIC because some godless liberal wanted to protect Joe's money from unscrupulous bankers who ruined the banking system before the Great Depression.

      Joe has to pay his Fannie Mae-underwritten mortgage and his below-market federal student loan because some elitist liberal decided that Joe and the government would be better off if he was educated and earned more money over his lifetime. Joe also forgets that his in addition to his federally subsidized student loans, he attended a state funded university.

      Joe is home from work. He plans to visit his father this evening at his farm home in the country. He gets in his car for the drive. His car is among the safest in the world because some America-hating liberal fought for car safety standards to go along with the tax-payer funded roads.

      He arrives at his boyhood home. His was the third generation to live in the house financed by Farmers' Home Administration because bankers didn't want to make rural loans.

      The house didn't have electricity until some big-government liberal stuck his nose where it didn't belong and demanded rural electrification.
      He is happy to see his father, who is now retired. His father lives on Social Security and a union pension because some wine-drinking, cheese-eating liberal made sure he could take care of himself so Joe wouldn't have to.

      Joe gets back in his car for the ride home, and turns on a radio talk show. The radio host keeps saying that liberals are bad and conservatives are good. He doesn't mention that the beloved Republicans have fought against every protection and benefit Joe enjoys throughout his day. Joe agrees: "We don't need those big-government liberals ruining our lives! After all, I'm a self-made man who believes everyone should take care of themselves, just like I have."

      Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the president or any other public official... ~Theodore Roosevelt

      by Pam from Calif on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:23:54 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  The worst offenders think they are independent (6+ / 0-)

      They take tons of state aid per capita and depend on employment by the state and federal gov't on/in public lands and facilities.

      They see this as their due, however, because they pay taxes.  That the rest of us pay even more (because incomes and costs are higher in urban and suburban areas) is of no concern to them, if they are aware of it at all.

      Your new Democratic Party: Billions for the bankster boys and not one dime for abortions. Even if it's your dime.

      by Mimikatz on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:39:54 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  In the Chronicle article (gotta go find the link) (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        BachFan, brein, whaddaya

        one of the things that struck me was that the people constantly referred to themselves as "self-reliant".

        Now, we have an old family cabin in a mountain community and we're fortunate enough to be able to spend a fair amount of time there.  To a certain extent, it is true that you have to be able to rely on your friends and neighbors - and yourself, above all - because it's hard to serve remote communities.  When the power goes off, you need a generator because it may take days to get it back.  When the road to our community washed out during floods in '82, they had to walk in and out of the canyon for three months.  I don't mean to suggest that people in rural areas can't take care of themselves.

        That said, most would not be able to live that far out in the sticks without all of the government spending mentioned above.  It ain't cheap to pay for firefighting in mountain communities.  Building and maintaining miles of lightly travelled roads costs big $$.  (If our road washout had happened in 1882 instead of 1982, how long would it have taken to cut a new road?  Would our modern residents put aside their day jobs for as long as it would take for the community to rebuild it?)  In a county of just a few thousand, it cost much more per citizen to provide public safety services - but I don't think they want to do without a sheriff entirely.

        It costs money to maintain a community, and it pisses me off to no end that a certain portion of the population just won't acknowledge that.

        They only call it Class War when we fight back.

        by lineatus on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 12:04:38 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Thank You (9+ / 0-)

    This is an extremely important distinction that needs to hammered over and over and over again.

    Tax revenues help create wealth. Democrats do it better.

    Can we say this seven times a day to counteract the stupidity of imposing austerity measures as seems to the battle cry of the markets are good people.

  •  Remember Jesus was a hyrophobe (8+ / 0-)

    he would avoid the coasts.

    Don't believe me, he hated water so much he could walk on it.

    Just stay away from my body and my rights, and everything will be just fine. ~LaFeminista Mon May 17, 2010

    by LaFeminista on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:20:31 AM PDT

  •  Rich people are stingy and their (9+ / 0-)

    servants are poor.  Also, the merchants who provision them are often stiffed.

    The Constitution is not a menu for an exclusive diner.

    by hannah on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:20:39 AM PDT

  •  So where are the Democratic (7+ / 0-)

    ...challengers who will let these rural people know how they've been buffaloed by Republican rhetoric?

    It would seem like it would be an easy case to make.

    50 states, 210 media market, 435 Congressional Districts, 3080 counties, 192,480 precincts

    by TarheelDem on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:21:03 AM PDT

  •  The degree to which so many... (12+ / 0-)

    ...vote against their own interests is astounding. Has been since at least Reagan, and to a slightly lesser extent, Nixon.

    The GOP Southern Strategy con job applies everywhere - even California. Just keep folks focused on abortion and gays - even after their unemployment benefits run out.  

  •  Whenever I read stuff like this, I really do... (9+ / 0-)

    ...start to wonder whether the old "United States of Canada vs. Jesusland" jokes really should be taken seriously.

    The Texas GOP keeps talking seriously about seceding. Arizona doesn't like brown people. Etc etc...

    Seriously, perhaps it's time for a prisoner citizen exchange of some sort? Every Democrat will move into the northern half of the country, every Republican moves down south, and we slice the nation in half.

    Or, better yet, every Republican moves to Texas (except Oklahoma; they can stay put), the city of Austin mass-moves up north, and we let Texas & Oklahoma say sayonara.

    Yes, I'm kidding.

    No, not entirely.

    "When even Arlen Specter is asking why the Dems got him to be their 60th Senator if they weren't gonna use the 60 votes, you know something's wrong!" --nyceve

    by Brainwrap on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:21:49 AM PDT

    •  Nooooo! Just elect Bill White as Governor (8+ / 0-)

      of Texas, and a lot of this secession nonsense will go away with Rick Perry.

      Texans are just as tired of his crap as the rest of the country. And yes, I live in Texas.

      Kossacks need to call and donate for Mr. White like they did for El Tinklenberg in Minnesota, or Joe Sestak in Pennsylvania, or Bill Halter in Arkansas, or countless other out-of-state races in which they could be -- and often were -- influential. (Of course, I would hope the results would be more like Sestak's, and less like Halter's or Tinklenberg's results.) The Democratic Party, starting with President Obama, need to be putting some resources in Texas instead of writing us off like they always do.

      Rick Perry needs to be put out to pasture, where he can safely practice shooting at snakes with a handgun.

      "The difference between the right word and the almost-right word is like the difference between lightning and the lightning bug." -- Mark Twain

      by Brooke In Seattle on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:34:19 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  bravo (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Brainwrap, bythesea, brein, whaddaya

        I was just discussing this with a local journalist.  One of Rick Perry's biggest allies right now is the liberal Red/Blue, Good/Evil dichotomy that automatically stereotypes Texas as being a "hopeless" state that could never elect a Democrat, hence preventing the race from showing up on the radar screen of national progressive networks (netroots, the party apparatus, etc.).  By all accounts, it's a close race, which is remarkable since White has barely uttered a peep and has no name recognition.  This is one of the best pick-up opportunities in an otherwise dismal electoral cycle; but it could be squandered if the overmatched Democratic Party here doesn't get some national help.  

        I don't care about your farm or mafia! Oh wait -- wrong forum.

        by cardinal on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:41:09 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  A classic, slightly edited, from 2005-06-24 (7+ / 0-)

      Dear Red States,

      We've decided we're leaving. We intend to form our own country, and we're taking the other Blue States with us.

      In case you aren't aware, that includes Hawaii, Oregon,Washington, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, Illinois and all the Northeast. We believe this split will be beneficial to the nation, and especially
      to the people of the new country of New California.

      To sum up briefly: You get Texas, Oklahoma and all the slave states. We get stem cell research and the best beaches. We get Elliot Spitzer. You get Ken Lay.

      We get the Statue of Liberty. You get Dollywood.
      We get Intel and Microsoft. You get WorldCom.
      We get Harvard. You get Ole' Miss. We get 85 percent of America's venture capital and entrepreneurs. You
      get Alabama. We get two-thirds of the tax revenue, you get to make the red states pay their fair share.

      Since our aggregate divorce rate is 22 percent lower than the Christian Coalition's, we get a bunch of happy families. You get a bunch of single moms.

      Please be aware that Nuevo California will be pro-choice and anti-war, and we're going to want all our citizens back from Iraq at once. If you need people to fight, ask your evangelicals. They have kids they're apparently willing to send to their deaths for no purpose, and they don't care if you don't show pictures of their children's caskets coming home. We do wish you success in Iraq, and
      hope that the WMDs turn up, but we're not willing to spend our resources in Bush's Quagmire.

      With the Blue States in hand, we will have firm control of 80 percent of the country's fresh water, more than 90 percent of the pineapple and lettuce, 92 percent of the nation's fresh fruit, 95 percent of America's quality wines (you can serve French wines at state dinners)
      90 percent of all cheese, 90 percent of the high tech industry, most of the U.S. low-sulfur coal, all living redwoods, sequoias and condors, all the Ivy and Seven Sister schools, plus Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Cal Tech and MIT.

      With the Red States, on the other hand, you will have to cope with 88 percent of all obese Americans (and their projected health care costs), 92 percent of all U.S. mosquitoes, nearly 100 percent of the tornadoes, 90 percent of the hurricanes, 99 percent of all Southern
      Baptists, virtually 100 percent of all televangelists, Rush Limbaugh, Bob Jones University, Clemson and the University of Georgia.

      We get Hollywood and Yosemite, thank you.

      Additionally, 38 percent of those in the Red states believe Jonah was actually swallowed by a whale, 62 percent believe life is sacred unless we're discussing the death penalty or gun laws, 44 percent say
      that evolution is only a theory, 53 percent that Saddam was involved in 9/11 and 61 percent of you crazy b*****ds believe you are people with higher morals then we lefties.

      By the way, we're taking the good pot, too. You can have that dirt weed they grow in Mexico.

      Peace out,
      Blue States

      All evil needs to succeed is for good people to say "the votes aren't there in the Senate."

      by Jacques on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:49:40 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  We suck. Let's stop giving our tax money (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    esquimaux, slksfca, whaddaya

    to other counties.

    I live in LA county, so I'm pretty sue we can make do on our own.

    Riverside and Inyo might have some trouble though.

    *Cough*....must....re...sist...urge...to...*cough*...meta.

    by mungley on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:22:59 AM PDT

  •  Well.... (11+ / 0-)

    To be a squishy liberal for a second...

    Let's remind ourselves that metropolitan areas such as San Francisco, New York, Chicago, etc. have seen massive gentrification over the last two decades, as soaring property values have squeezed lower income residents out of the central part of the city.

    We're far from the days when bohemians could settle down in some cheap apartment in the Haight or the Lower East Side, and live on practically nothing. Today's bohemians better have a cosigner.

    So we need to be careful when we talk about how poverty is no longer "fundamentally an urban problem." It's not because urban poverty in SF or NY has been taken care of. Maybe it's just been sent packing, moved to the central valley, or to the outer boroughs.

    Nothing requires a greater effort of thought than arguments to justify the rule of nonthought. -- Milan Kundera

    by Dale on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:23:16 AM PDT

    •  Thank you (0+ / 0-)

      That was exactly my reaction.  Also, as Larry Bartels, Andrew Gelman, and other top political analysts have shown, the Thomas Frankian "poor rural folks vote against their economic interests" thesis has little empirical support.  Those most in need of the aid generally vote Democratic.

      I don't care about your farm or mafia! Oh wait -- wrong forum.

      by cardinal on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:45:46 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Well, I don't know if I'd join you there. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        whaddaya

        In my home state, the calls for repealing taxation or undercutting social spending often do seem to come from the rural parts.

        It's not that there's no merit to the Thomas Frank thesis. If anything, it points to the changed priorities of the Democratic party over the last thirty years: the  deficit hawkery and business-friendliness of the post-DLC Party probably owes a great deal to the gentrification of Amercian cities. In that climate, who can blame rural voters for giving up on the Dems?

        Nothing requires a greater effort of thought than arguments to justify the rule of nonthought. -- Milan Kundera

        by Dale on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:51:21 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I like Frank's book enough to (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Dale, whaddaya

          assign it in my public opinion class.  His description of the "backlash" is dead-on, and a useful counterpoint to what my students here on Fox News every night.  

          However, the narrow point I was making is that his central empirical assertion -- that a massive number of poor, rural citizens are voting Republican -- simply isn't true.  There is still a very strong correlation between individual wealth and the likelihood of voting Republican.  Not every rural resident is poor.  The poor ones, on average, are far more likely to vote Democratic than the others.  

          I agree, though, with your point about the changed Democratic priorities.

          I don't care about your farm or mafia! Oh wait -- wrong forum.

          by cardinal on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:57:55 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  What about the San Francisco Sound? (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    dumpster, SherwoodB, beltane, whaddaya

    Some of us value that, too.

    The Republican brand: "Consequences, schmonsequences, as long as I'm rich"

    by D in Northern Virginia on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:24:07 AM PDT

    •  One of the wellsprings of which, FWIW... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      D in Northern Virginia

      ...was the music of the rural south.
      The San Francisco Sound was to a great extent the creation of folkies who (like their counterparts in New York, Boston, etc.) discovered electric instruments and LSD at about the same time. And "folk" meant Appalachian traditional music as much as Delta blues.
      Those old folkies may arguably have patronized their sources, and certainly did practice cultural appropriation, but they didn't --- unlike "progressive" anti-populists on dKos and elsewhere --- sneer at them or consider them the enemy. Incidentally, didn't Ralph Stanley endorse Edwards?

      "Think of something to make the ridiculous look ridiculous." -- Molly Ivins

      by dumpster on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 02:48:38 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Of all the ludicrous and offensive ideas.... (11+ / 0-)

    ....that the Republicans have come up with in the last 50 years, the notion that there are "real Americans" and "fake Americans" is possibly the most offensive and obnoxious. It's right up there with Cadillac driving welfare queens, the "liberal media," Iraq being an existential threat, torture as a useful interrogation method, environmental protection as taking away "freedom" in terms of utterly moronic. Oh, and let us not forget praising sheer stupidity and thinking of intellect as being a bad thing (see criticisms of Adlai Stevenson, Mike Dukakis, John Kerry, Al Gore, Barack Obama, etc and praising morons like George W. Bush, Ronald Reagan, and Sarah Palin).

  •  I'm in Lake County (6+ / 0-)

    And we're reliably blue, and reliably poor, but that's because we have a huge number of senior citizens on Social Security. In fact, we in the whole Left Coast counties on Northern California are big-ass Commies, except Del Norte in the upper left corner of the state. I don't know why they're so conservative.

    The Central Valley folks are crazy, though. Probably because it's so damn ugly there and they're constantly exposed to ag chemicals and tule fog.

  •  Same disparity eveident nationaly between States (6+ / 0-)

    that vote Republican and states that vote Democratic.

    Federal Spending Received Per Dollar of Taxes Paid by State,

    "These old Wall Street boys are putting up an awful fight to keep the government from putting a cop on their corner." - Will Rogers

    by Lefty Coaster on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:24:56 AM PDT

  •  I live in rural America (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    whaddaya

    and the reality isn't quite what the statistics say.  I don't see anything that says that rural people are more dependent on social services, just that we make less money - and therefore put less into the system.  And because we are geographically isolated, we take more of the money from the system (it takes a lot more to keep up 100 miles of freeway between two large towns than urban roads, for example, and costs more to keep less busy offices open).

    I, too, am disturbed by the GOP talking points about "San Francisco values" and "real Americans", but one of the reasons we can't break through that is because we take statistics like this and misconstrue it and make it sound like rural Americans are dependent on social services when we look around and know that we aren't.  And if it doesn't ring true in our daily lives, then it isn't true overall, and you're hurting the proposal you're trying to put forward.

    Hope that makes some sense.  I know what you're getting at, but the conclusion doesn't necessarily match the facts.

    I'm thinking about making it my spiritual journey to love others, [but] I fear the morons will disappoint me. - Rat, Pearls Before Swine

    by Gay In Maine on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:25:00 AM PDT

    •  The report about CA public dollars indicates that (6+ / 0-)

      the services are used more by people in the rural extremes of the state.

      From the article:

      in San Mateo County, for example, Medi-Cal spending in 2007-08 was $257 per resident. In Lake County, the state spent $703. But per capita income tax and sales tax revenue in Lake County was only $879, while in San Mateo it was $4,232.

      The income disparity and the higher cost of services to rural areas might be a fact of life with which we are wiling to live in order to support rural people's desire (or need) to live away from large cities.

      The issue at hand is that the people who depend on a higher tax base and who need state programs the most are the ones most likely to gut them.

      *Cough*....must....re...sist...urge...to...*cough*...meta.

      by mungley on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:34:47 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  This issue is that in CA, the 2/3rds rule (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        slksfca, whaddaya

        allows the small population heavily concentrated in rural areas to veto tax and spending policies that disproportionately benefit them, taking down the whole state in a giant masochistic exercise.

        Rural areas will always need to be subsidized. There are some that realize this. But too many don't, and in CA, they and the exurbs combine to veto the generosity of their urban neighbors.

      •  That makes sense (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        BachFan, whaddaya

        but where we get into trouble is when we start comparing per capita.  I live in a county that is the size of Massachusetts in area but has a population the size of Portland, Maine.  So any use of social services will make a larger dent in per capita use of the money. (i.e. - 15 out of 73,000 vs. 100 out of 730,000 - what you see is a higher percentage, what people here see is 15 vs. 100)

        I agree that there is a strong argument to be made for social services - I'm on DailyKos after all, so I do believe that our government has a role to play.  But for rural people that aren't using the services regularly, telling them that they are because that's what the statistics say isn't a winning argument.  What does make a difference is when you talk about the family who had to sell their farm because grandma got sick and there wasn't enough money and no insurance.  If it's not true in their daily lives, it's not true at all, if that makes any sense.

        I guess what I'm getting at is that we can talk statistics and numbers all we want and feel superior about it, but it doesn't help us make a dent in the way people think if that's our end goal.

        I'm thinking about making it my spiritual journey to love others, [but] I fear the morons will disappoint me. - Rat, Pearls Before Swine

        by Gay In Maine on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:48:12 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Two things (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        slksfca, whaddaya

        San Mateo county is full of rich people who pay taxes which reflect their income and, since they're rich, don't need MediCal.

        Lake county is full of poor people who pax taxes which reflect their income and, since they're poor, more of them (per capita) need mediCal.

        Besides, Lake County is politically progressive.

  •  Conundrum - Is SF worse than Chicago? (5+ / 0-)
    I can't keep straight the cities and people I am supposed to demonize.

    Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!

    by bigtimecynic on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:27:12 AM PDT

  •  Classic case of being wary of what you wish for. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    whaddaya

    If conservatives get the huge cuts in social services they are salivating for one can only hope the resultant misery such cuts will have on their constituents would lead to said pols ouster at the next election.

    And then our state will at least have a silver lining to the tragedy before us.

    "Stay close to the candles....the staircase can be treacherous" (-8.38,-8.51)

    by JNEREBEL on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:28:43 AM PDT

  •  pulling a "little red hen" (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    esquimaux, whaddaya

    on these red counties who pay the least and complain the most would be satisfying as hell.

  •  Stop with the reality already. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    happymisanthropy, brein, whaddaya

    Rarely in history has the information been so readily available to the common person on the actual disparity and inequity in the distribution of resources and wealth. Yet, like the Vendée, it is all about you taking privileges away from my rightful master.

    "You know, just because the thing I saw wasn't there doesn't mean there wasn't something there that I didn't see." Ann Althouse, Conservative Thoughtmeister

    by Bill Section 147 on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:31:06 AM PDT

  •  They can't lose (3+ / 0-)

    If they ever succeeded in severing Red America's lifeline to the wealthy blue areas, the resulting misery would only strengthen conservatism: "Look at all the money and services that big-city liberals and inner-city minorities have that you don't have!"

  •  I've been saying this for years (6+ / 0-)

    much of inland California is a permanent welfare state because of the decisions of leaders there to attract low-wage work...Fresno, for instance. I read an article a year or so ago there in which the mayor lamented that tax increment financing had attracted all the wrong employers and left them no better off.  The unemployment rates in some of these counties are well over 15%, and that's the conservative number, and that didn't start with this recession - it's been true in some areas for decades.

    The problem coastal Calfornia has is it's being denied the right to properly tax itself to pay for its own priorities, and then it has the albatross of inland california dragging it down even further.

  •  Red Amer is heavily subsidized by Blue Amer Taxes (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    esquimaux, happymisanthropy, whaddaya

    Trying to get a politican to do something is like trying to get a pay raise from your boss's secretary. Wrong person

    by Churchill on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:35:54 AM PDT

  •  I was born and raised in San Francisco (12+ / 0-)

    and my values are just fine.  I'm also a real American, having actually served in the military during the Viet Nam War---unlike the draft dodgers Limpballs, and Cheney.
    Also drive a cab here part time, best tippers are blue collar workers (well, actually drunks are the best tippers, but I digress) and the worst tippers are the super wealthy. Once took a woman to her mansion in Pacific Heights and got a $0.35 cent tip: she actually got in her purse and took out a quarter and a dime.  I gave it back to her with the words: "Here, you need this more than I do."

    "It took us a couple of days because I like to know what I'm talking about before I speak." President Barack Obama 3/24/09

    by sfcouple on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:39:25 AM PDT

  •  Ah...those Marin County tea baggers. (3+ / 0-)
  •  I tend to ask people (5+ / 0-)

    precisely when giving a crap about other people and wanting to help them was considered a bad thing.

    Bonus points when you do this in front of their kids. I fight dirty.

    Are you on the Wreck List? Horde on Garrosh.

    by Moody Loner on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:43:12 AM PDT

  •  We've known for years... (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    zedaker, happymisanthropy, brein, whaddaya

    that it's the hicks voting against their own actual self-interest, and instead for their idiotic and bigoted perceived self-interest.

    It's not surprising that that phenomenon scales down to the intra-state level.

    And all of the "leave hicks alone!" whiners do nothing but help enable them.

    I'm gonna go eat a steak. And fuck my wife. And pray to GOD - hatemailapalooza, 052210

    by punditician on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:43:16 AM PDT

  •  State by state (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    happymisanthropy, whaddaya

    most red states spend more federal dollars than blue states. I think last I checked NJ got only half it's federal tax dollars back in federal spending.

    And when we ask you why, you raise your sticks and cry and we fall.

    by Ninbyo on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:48:15 AM PDT

  •  Cities always pay for the rural counties (7+ / 0-)

    Seattle and the coast pays for all the roads and crap in the pro-secession east side of this state. I laugh every time. Sure, go be your own state. It'll save us money on bridges. Seattle is blue as the Puget Sound. Eastern Washington is as red as its apples. Cities tend to be bluer than counties around these states. And they tend to finance the counties.

    "Take the victory and keep on marching"

    by SeattleProgressive on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 11:49:46 AM PDT

  •  It's true everywhere (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    brein, whaddaya

    The same is true where I live in Northern Virginia.  We supply the vast majority of the tax revenue to Virginia, we supply most of the economic growth to Virginia, we have by far the best schools in Virginia, and we vote overwhelmingly Democrat while the rest of the state - that soaks up social (read: government) services like a sponge - votes overwhelmingly Republican.  But Northern Virginians are reminded constantly by the rest of the state that we're not "real Virginians".  I guess that means that "real Virginians" are poor, uneducated, and lazy parasites.

  •  The GOP (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    whaddaya

    Hates the fringes of the two coasts- all of New England- the Bos-Wash corridor. Southeastern Florida

    The upper Midwest- especially Chicago

    The west coast CA-along the coast- the Pacific NW west of the Cascadesand Hawaii.

  •  Seceders (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    brein

    You'll notice what states have made headlines with talk of secession.
    Alaska is the absolute top for federal aid (to states and municipalities as well as individuals) per capita.
    Texas is lower, but not all that much lower.

    Corporations are people; money is speech.
    1984 - George Orwell

    by Frank Palmer on Tue Jun 22, 2010 at 03:08:52 PM PDT

  •  San Francisco values (0+ / 0-)

    I'd like to remind the Beck's/Limbaugh's/Hannity's and O'Reily's that San Francisco is part of the United States also.

  •  You forgot... (0+ / 0-)

    the San Francisco platform was supposed to include free mandatory abortions for everyone regardeless of race, creed, sexual orientation, or gender.

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