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Because this deserves broad attention, here's Van Jones's speech from Friday morning. Given all commentary it has engendered, both positive and negative, it's worth hearing everything he said, including his strong support for the President and his view that "we have to commit ourselves, deeply commit ourselves, now,  to creating an economic program to put America back to work so that we can pull America back together."

There are a few minutes of introduction (via video) by Howard Dean, the speech, and Jones’s interview with Ari Melber.

Originally posted to Daily Kos on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:04 PM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  !!!!!!!!!! (13+ / 0-)

    Enigmatic South Carolina Democratic Senate candidate Alvin Greene responded Thursday to an Associated Press report on the former airman's lacluster Air Force record, which showed that he was repeatedly passed over for promotion due to a general sentiment that he had difficulty completing his duties

    "Those folks are ridiculous and yes and they only promote the terrorists and the communists and I haven't gotten a promotion since I graduated from college and that's just what I'm saying," Greene told the South Carolina Post and Courier. "This is why we need to have things done differently. This is why we need to overhaul the military. We need get rid of these folks.

    and there are some people here supporting this guy.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

    Jerry Brown for CA_GOV 2010

    by GlowNZ on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 09:25:45 PM PDT

  •  Well, yeah (5+ / 0-)

    including his strong support for the President and his view that "we have to commit ourselves, deeply commit ourselves, now,  to creating an economic program to put America back to work so that we can pull America back together."

    So enough of that.

  •  Thank you so much for this. (20+ / 0-)

    Wishing to be there . . . and really wanted to see this.

    I'm also really hoping that you or someone else will post the link/video for the building community panel this afternoon.  I really wanted to see it.

    Thank you, MB.

    Our shore birds; our turtles and fish. Please consider a donation to the National Wildlife Federation to help them.

    by noweasels on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 09:27:50 PM PDT

  •  loved his speech (13+ / 0-)

    Streamed it this morning. Talk about inspirational. I'll probably watch it again. Thanks for posting it, MB.

    MB, How's NN going? Whatcha doing?

    It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it - George Carlin

    by OLinda on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 09:30:05 PM PDT

  •  me and Van. :) (8+ / 0-)

    I learned today I have 2 things in common with Van.

    1. I also have more talk than music on my iPod.
    1. I also like Manilow. (Takes guts to admit that, so I also have guts in common with Van :) so make it 3 things.

    It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it - George Carlin

    by OLinda on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 09:32:06 PM PDT

    •  So much for the "big conspiracy" earlier that MB (9+ / 0-)

      had purposely stopped posting about Van JOnes's speech, to censor it.

      That commenter that alleged that really needs to take a  long break and BREATHE! :)

      •  Strange I read that comment (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        soms, sherijr, foufou, moonpal

        and didn't read it as a 'conspiratoical' type of comment at all. I didn't see the 'censor' line, just that he didn't add it to his blog.

        Sounds like a loong breath is in order, indeed.

        Please vote Democratic in November. If the GOP wins we will all be forced backward another decade, who wants that?

        by Wary on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 09:44:57 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  asdf (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          KateG, willibro, WisePiper, blueoasis

          This was what I was referring to: total bullshit speculation:

          Notice how MB stopped updating his diary.

          I thought that was really funny.

          Let's see how long Van Jones remains progressive hero du jour. There won't be a bus big enough and going fast enough to throw him under.

          LOL! Oh God. Sometimes the left cracks me up.

          "Palin tried marijuana years ago. She said it distorted her perceptions & impaired her thinking. She hopes the effects will eventually one day wear off." - Leno

          by ma

          and then this later, by the same commenter about MB:

          I won't assume the worst about him as soon (6+ / 0-)

          as he stops assuming the worst about the President and those of us who supports him.

          •  People are off the rails. (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            OLinda, joanneleon, JanL

            The divide is getting deeper every day. Sad.

            There is no more important struggle for American democracy than ensuring a diverse, independent and free media. - Bill Moyers

            by StepLeftStepForward on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 02:21:21 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  to bring the whole thing back (4+ / 0-)

            I knew as soon as I posted that first comment I shouldn't have done it.

            I apologize for responding to the first comment about the 'conspiracy' comment.  I see that in doing so, I gave the one who made it the opporturity to repost the whole comment to relive it again for justification.

            Please vote Democratic in November. If the GOP wins we will all be forced backward another decade, who wants that?

            by Wary on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 04:06:09 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  and did you see some of us (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            foufou, StepLeftStepForward

            in the "o-bot" camp who maybe even recced that comment and tend to agree with marabout push back on that immediately?  or did you want to focus on the negative?

            "It's baffling when the netroots bash Obama" ~Van Jones, 7/23/10

            by mallyroyal on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 05:57:51 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  i saw 59 people rec it (0+ / 0-)

              and very few call her on it

              •  then you saw me do both. (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                foufou

                look people have been banging those of us not livid at the admin with "van jones van jones how could he do that to van jones" since he resigned.  

                so you can't blame some of us for feeling vindicated that he holds the same view (ostensibly) we do on certain kinds of pushback against the admin, considering he's one of the few people who, on the face of it, could have really gone after the admin for "throwing him under the bus".

                and when you see a front pager, and such a respected arbiter of the rules of the site create the diary, update, update, update... then when mr. jones weighs in a topic that's been basically tearing dkos apart... nothing... you really can't blame some of us for wondering what that was about.

                as I said I tend to agree with marabout as regards the way criticism is leveled around these parts.  I just wasn't willing to go as far as she was, while I understood the genesis of thought.

                does that make sense?

                "It's baffling when the netroots bash Obama" ~Van Jones, 7/23/10

                by mallyroyal on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 09:10:22 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

      •  she did not really mean it BL (13+ / 0-)

        when you're not feeling good?
        you just view things differently for a day.
        she posted she was in a lot of pain today.
        i know some thing that does not matter.
        but we also have compassion here.
        i know you do.
        i should not speak for her. it's not right.

        "Oh no...you changed your hair color? It's just so dark. You like it? And with your skin tone?" My Beloved Mom, December 25 2007, once again on notice.

        by Christin on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:13:28 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  interesting (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      OLinda, soms

      my mp3 player is loaded with audiobooks and opencourseware courses.  I love Manilow.  My favorite songs are Sandra, Could this Be the Magic (slow version), and Trying to Get the Feeling Again.

      •  I hearts me an "M" too (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ThatPoshGirl

        but it's Mozart.

        Much more melodious music.

        More - er - musical.

        To my ears, Manilow is musical mush, very, very painful for me to listen to. The name alone creates an instant earworm of masticated mush.

        Oh Linda......You came.....and....blahblahblah

        Ouch.

        Sorry to have missed Van Jones. I like his voice as much as I do many of his ideas. As a sound-sensitive person, being able to listen his very pleasant speaking voice would have countered some of the noxious noise that pervades the lower reaches of the Rio.

        You know there's a problem with the educational system that when out of the 3 Rs only one begins with an R. - Dennis Miller

        by 4Freedom on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 11:39:06 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  i like manilow a lot - just not his music (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        OLinda, willibro, ThatPoshGirl

        i don't care for his songs or recordings but i have seem in interviews and i like what he says and how he says it.

        Politics is not arithmetic. It's chemistry.

        by tamandua on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 05:31:52 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  you kid me, Manilow? i must watch this (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      OLinda

      Van is teh awesome.
      :)

  •  Thanks MB - much appreciated. (9+ / 0-)

    For those of us not there and who wanted to be - this stuff is great!

  •  Dean (6+ / 0-)

    Too bad he couldn't be there in person.

    It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it - George Carlin

    by OLinda on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 09:37:01 PM PDT

  •  "Hope and Heartbreak." - jones (5+ / 0-)

    Ain't it the truth.

    It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it - George Carlin

    by OLinda on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 09:39:33 PM PDT

    •  listen to the very end - he has a lot to say (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      willibro

      about that. I hope Obama gets his speech on his Iphone and listens to it. Definitely worth it.

      "What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know, it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." --Mark Twain

      by mimi on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 06:49:52 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Joe Arpaio endorsed... (10+ / 0-)

    JD Hayworth!  LOL.  This guy's ego is so big he wants prove he has the power to swing the primary.  What a tool.  Last week he made a big stink about how he was going on an illegal immigrant sweep with a .50 caliber machine gun.

    I really hate this guy.

  •  Jones: (13+ / 0-)

    He was "born in 1968, the year they assassinated hope in this country."

    I hope everyone takes the time to listen to this video.

    It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it - George Carlin

    by OLinda on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:00:57 PM PDT

    •  I remember 1968 (7+ / 0-)

      I don't think it was all despair.  I was around 20; probably too young to really experience despair.  I remember it being a year of huge upheavals, of shocking dramatic events, but with a lot of hope in the midst of the smoke and fire.  It was still the time of peace and love (and fairly reasonable pharmaceuticals too).  Somehow, everything was going to turn out wonderful in the end.  If we just could all work together, war would end; hate would end; discrimination would end; and there'd be nothing but endless rock concerts.

      Or something like that.

      Frankly, I blame everything on Nixon.

      by J Orygun on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 11:23:34 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I felt despair--the great hope (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        OLinda, Nellcote, willibro

        for engaging my beliefs and ideals into circles of power was taken out by these assassinations.  It was like the final insult to believing in and acting for change--change in the egregious misuse of power that was the Viet Nam war which so affected my generation.  It was like the older generation wanted to sacrifice us for their greed--our own parents and grandparents.  It left a lasting impression on me.  I did not risk trusting engagement in politics again until the 2008 election, when I was finally inspired by Obama's message of hope and change.

        And Van's right--we did not reach the finish line, we just won a new beginning.  That's hard for me to bear being late in life, knowing I will never see the outcome, but I'm not going to give up again.  I'm just going to keep pushing through heartbreak after heartbreak in blessed unrest.

        Find your own voice--the personal is political.

        by In her own Voice on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 03:31:37 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  1968. A good year (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      OLinda, mightymouse, A Siegel

      I was born.  ;)

  •  So, is his career over? (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    OLinda, willibro, blueoasis, soms

    I haven't watched the video yet. Just wondering if someone plans to give Van a job where he can walk tall and kick ass again.

  •  What...you posted this? (8+ / 0-)

    I was sure that you must have hated it because you stopped liveblogging it?

    Notice how MB stopped updating his diary. (59+ / 0-)

    Recommended by:
       Aexia, Terri, fcvaguy, dansac, askew, Christin, mem from somerville, ChicDemago, Shilohsmama, Barth, Nina, KayCeSF, jim bow, v2aggie2, Lying eyes, Ianb007, Southside, Seeds, Wary, hooper, lordcopper, OIL GUY, chicago minx, dotster, fromdabak, jalenth, Fogiv, krllos, MKSinSA, Houston Gardener, PoliticalJunkessa, sherijr, carmenjones, Adept2u, joe from Lowell, foufou, taiping1, JoanMar, calchala, mallyroyal, Front Toward Enemy, ban nock, vc2, elektra, Escamillo, NedSparks, moonpal, ParkRanger, Jim Saul, Dom9000, lightshine, AnonObamaAid, Nena20409, matrix, APA Guy, flhiii88, FiredUpInCA, Tulips, 2010ftc

    I thought that was really funny.

    Let's see how long Van Jones remains progressive hero du jour. There won't be a bus big enough and going fast enough to throw him under.

    LOL! Oh God. Sometimes the left cracks me up.

    "Palin tried marijuana years ago. She said it distorted her perceptions & impaired her thinking. She hopes the effects will eventually one day wear off." - Leno

    by marabout40 on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 04:49:56 PM EDT

    [ Parent | Reply to This | RecommendHide ]

     title=

    You ruined it for me... :(

    "Ultimately, we need to move beyond the tired debates of the left and the right, between business leaders and environmentalists" - President Obama, March 31

    by justmy2 on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:13:15 PM PDT

  •  interviewer (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    willibro, barkingcat, peachcreek

    I wasn't familiar with Ari Melber. Looked him up. He's a correspondent for The Nation magazine. He did a good interview.

    It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it - George Carlin

    by OLinda on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:23:05 PM PDT

  •  I am a horrible person. (0+ / 0-)
    Obviously. Since I hate left wing thugs as much as right wing thugs.
  •  Van Jones is teh corporatist! Teh betrayer! (4+ / 0-)

    All powr to da peepul!  Not like Obamabush!    

    Man goes into cage, cage goes into politics. Shark's in the politics. Our shark.

    by Troubadour on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:26:34 PM PDT

  •  Van Jones is a righteous dude (17+ / 0-)

    That was inspirational. The year they killed hope, indeed. We need him to be vocal, and we're lucky he's not on the inside anymore, in a weird way. Van Jones has been righteous since college. He's right about jobs/environmentalism, and he's right about what we can do now that the shine of November, 2008 has long worn off. We progressives have to be Obama's backbone and not his attackers. We have to uphold real progressive ideas, and not attack Obama while we're doing it. Easy to say, hard to do.

    Are You a *Real* American?

    by debha on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:31:15 PM PDT

  •  Great singer songwriter I've just learned about. (8+ / 0-)

    Almost everything I've heard from this poet has been near genius.  James McMurtry.

    Levelland

    Paint By Numbers

    Don't believe everything you think.

    by geomoo on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:33:40 PM PDT

  •  doing my best to try to transcribe the talk (20+ / 0-)

    talk...broadly...here's most of it, for those who can't watch, I'm  not a pro...but LOVED this talk today.:

    Since I was here 2 years ago, all my dreams came true and all of my nightmares.  After a long pity party,  realized I was certainly not alone.

    These are the days of hope and heartbreak…even you as truthtellers who built the blogoshphere and tried to strengthen America by reinventing media, suddenly someone has taken your work and using it to undermine America.  Hope,  and now heartbreak.

    We find ourselves in a dangerous situation going from 8 years of despair to 8 months of hope, a few months of change, and it’s in your hands whether we go back to despair once more.  Change is good days and bad days, but if you don’t go all the way back to despair, change is still possible.

    You didn’t lay down for 8 years of GWB, and we can’t expect the right will lay down now.  We didn’t get to a fi ish line I January 09, but to a starting line.

    How can we be more beautiful even though the bullies are more and more ugly.  We don’t want to win the food fight, we want to end it, by creating a contrast so the people can see how beautiful we are.

    We  can’t be distracted into all these side issues, that’s a losing strategy for us..

    How do we put America back to work and fix everything that has been broken?  Next year kids will be going to school with twice as many kids per class, bridges and roads falling apart around us, because we don’t have any money.  As we do all these things to shut down public services, because we don’t have any money.  But America is rich – we have plenty of money, if you don’t believe me, ask Halliburton, ask the banks, ask the tax-subsidized oil companies…this is a rich country, poor in the execution of our values.

    What we’re lacking is the will and the courage  - there’s plenty of money, don’t  let anyone tell you otherwise – we just need the heart to spend it wisely.  Put America back to work and pull America back together – we need to grow our hearts, and it is our job to grow America’s heart.

    We are the addicts to the big oil and big coal companies, with heroes losing their lives, just so we can power America in the same old way.  We’re the ones who have been pushing.  America’s future is not down those holes..  Want to  see the future, look up.  Look at the sun. Solar panels don’t put themselves up there is plenty of work to be done in America.  We have a Saudi Arabia of solar energy and a Saudi Arabia of wind in America.  We have the best most skilled, hardest working workers in the world, let’s put them back to work.  Put union auto workers and steel workers back to work building wind turbines and solar panels to repower America.  We have smarter ways to do this now.

    Each wind turbine, as much steel as in 26 cars.  Put Americans back to work.  Jobs of tomorrow making the products of tomorrow.  Put the green Ph.D’s back to work and the PhDo’s.  Green belt and rust belt.  Farmers could get three paychecks – 0ne for growing fuel products, one for a win of solar farm, one for smart carbon farming and playing in the carbon markets.

    You don’t want a battleground forever…with more diversity but less prosperity, and that’s not want we want.   Our opponents see that future, and their answer is to reduce the diversity – stoke racial fears, go after immigrants… ours is to increase the prosperity.

    Your heart got broken a long time ago.  You LOVE America, America the Beautiful, and you believed what you were told as children …you believed that song and you would defend it from clearcutters and oilspillers and everyone.  You pledged allegiance every day and you believed it – liberty and justice for ALL. It didn’t say, except for thr gay people, except for the immigrats.

    That’s what motivates us and we don’t talk about it enough.  Someone along the way took that away from you. We should call ourselves patriots,  red states, blue states, we’re defending the best of America.

    There’s a deeper patriotism. That’s what has to motivate us going forward.

    I was born in 1968.  That was the year the assassinated hope in this country..shot Bobby Kennedy, shot MLK.   Grieving didn’t last 5 years, it lasted 40 years until we finally got the hope back.   And it’s a flickering candle now.  You can’t let your own issue let you be part of blowing out that hope in America, you can’t do that, you must…keep hope…alive.

    "Bigger change will come with bigger Democratic majorities. Diminishing Democratic accomplishments is a losing strategy." sja May Peace Prevail

    by revgerry on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:33:46 PM PDT

  •  congress members who say Fuck you to miners. (0+ / 0-)
  •  Love conquers all things; let us too surrender (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Terri, dsb, northanger, revgerry, sherijr

    to love.

    Virgil

    Republican brand of HOPE: "I HOPE HE FAILS"... Country First Anyone?

    by DFutureIsNow on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 10:57:56 PM PDT

  •  Best speech at NN so far. (11+ / 0-)

    I didn't even agree with him on everything, but there's something so refreshing to hear someone in his position say, "Screw it, get back to work and know that you're doing the right thing", and backing it up with specific, concrete examples.  I'm sorry that parts of his speech have been used as a rhetorical club for people in this community to beat each other over the head with, because there's nothing particularly controversial about what he said.

    Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

    by pico on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 11:06:15 PM PDT

  •  what was Anthony Wiener talking about? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    joanneleon

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/...

    "standing up to iran"?!  wtf?

    energy independence should not be motivated by over-exaggerated "threats" from a country in which we've meddled too long.

    the US and israel are a greater threat to the 70 million people of iran than iran is to anyone.

    http://www.amazon.com/...

  •  yay! (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    blueoasis, revgerry

    i am so happy the netroots progressive movement is aligned with progressive ideas and values, and not with any one person.

    A cigar is just a cigar.

    by Krush on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 11:14:19 PM PDT

  •  Wow. Van Jones is terrific (11+ / 0-)

    I had heard a lot about him, but never heard him give a speech.  I'm blown away.  What a terrific guy.  And what a great message.  I was gonna watch a few minutes and ended up watching the entire hour +.  I loved the colorful examples of despair, hope, and finally change.  I think I learned something.

    Frankly, I blame everything on Nixon.

    by J Orygun on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 11:16:06 PM PDT

  •  I am being told that $1,200 per month (0+ / 0-)

    Is a great income to retire on. Wow.

    "They pour syrup on shit and tell us it's hotcakes." Meteor Blades

    by JugOPunch on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 11:26:29 PM PDT

  •  Here's where he has got it 100% (16+ / 0-)

    correct :
    He talks about the hi-jacking of the blogoshphere by mass corporate media. The Fox News organization is expert at this. Read any of their paid bloggers and you see the message they spread and the comments associated with each posting draw on the very worst elements of human nature. To believe that so many unreasonable, intolerant, bigoted individuals, filled with hatred for their fellow human beings, actually exist, doesn't sit well with me.
    Further, try and post a something which contradicts the direction of their stories and you get moderated out.

    There's more to this than meets the eye. Establishing bonafide positions through falsified peer group comments seems to be what the entire News Corp organization has been doing for a number of years.

    "You Still drilling for oil? Well good luck, I mean it. Idiot. Shine, Baby, Shine." JR Ewing

    by Unenergy on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 11:31:28 PM PDT

    •  Unenergy, (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      geez53, Unenergy

      What do you think can be done to quell or stop Murdoch's war on thinking and progressives and democracy itself?

      There is no more important struggle for American democracy than ensuring a diverse, independent and free media. - Bill Moyers

      by StepLeftStepForward on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 02:32:00 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  No one silver bullet ........ (5+ / 0-)

        But it helps to call them (Fox, Rush et al) out on it every time a coworker, neighbor etc. sites one of their lies. It's not hard to keep a mental list of 5, 10, 20 examples of how they completely mislead with out right falsehoods. Don't just let it pass and hope that someday they'll see the truth, it doesn't work that way.

        Also keep in mind that there are always certain interests who are very happy to give the bigots and shallow brained a bull horn and/or bully pulpits to keep the unwashed fighting amongst ourselves.

        Welcome to the Corporate States of America ®, give us your money, then die quietly.

        by geez53 on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 03:50:55 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I agree with you with a caveat. (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          willibro, geez53, brein, Unenergy

          I've just posted a couple of comments downthread to the effect that we need to try to reach out and listen to those who are reachable - the Unbrainwashed. The problem is that the Brainwashed don't like facts: they have a narrative and are sticking to it, no matter what. The only way to possibly reach any of them is to bring it down to the personal level, rather than the political.

          I have no interaction with Republicans because I don't live in the States anymore and none of my friends or family are wingnuts (except two from high school on FB). So, I don't have much opportunity to interact with Americans on the opposite side of the fence.

          I asked Unenergy, an Australian, that question because I know that he/she has a unique perspective on Murdoch's power and motives, and cares deeply about the damage he is doing. I believe he is waging a form of psychological terrorism. I am interested in Unenergy's response because I'm starting a mediaKos group and want to hear all input and insight in order to be as effective as we can.

          Thank you for your comment.

          There is no more important struggle for American democracy than ensuring a diverse, independent and free media. - Bill Moyers

          by StepLeftStepForward on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 04:08:29 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Good for you SLSF. (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Unenergy, StepLeftStepForward

            I agree 'psychological terrorism' is apt.  When it's on a scale this large though we may have to ramp up the term.

            I want to fight our 'media' soooo bad and look forward to any insight and inspiration mediaKos can provide.  I informally brainstorm on it every couple days.  

            •  Please feel free to leave a comment in that (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              geez53, JordanRules

              diary. For now, until we get some infrastructure for our group, we are using that as a place to brainstorm. Your ideas would be very appreciated. That applies to all Kossacks who are interested in the media's effect and power, in media reform, and in what Kossacks can do. The group is naturally open to all. My motto is for membership: To each according to his/her own interest, ability and time.

              As for Murdoch and the extreme right's psychological terrorism on America: Having lived abroad since 1992, I think I and other foreigners can see it even better than most Americans. They made 'liberal' a dirty word, and now they are succeeding with 'progressive' and 'social justice'. When you have 'Christians' proclaiming that social justice is ruining the world, you know we're in trouble.

              A Brit artist, Fletcher Crossman, had an amazing and thought-provoking art exhibition that could certainly have an effect on the way the 'average, apolotical Joe'.

              h/t to KingOneEye, who diaried it, and the commenter who used the term 'psychological terrorism' (I wish I could remember who it was!). I use it every chance I get.

              Cheers!

              There is no more important struggle for American democracy than ensuring a diverse, independent and free media. - Bill Moyers

              by StepLeftStepForward on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 04:27:55 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

      •  Here's where I would start and then repeat this (5+ / 0-)

        over and over :
        Build a map of Murdoch's network - his influence, where his assets are, how many papers he has, how many readers in each area, how many radio and TV assets, and make a special effort to look backwards at long formed alliances with organizations, individuals who also own media assets and play the same game.
        If you look at Australia for instance, not only does News Ltd own most of the daily newspapers, but it owns a large percentage of its only competitor, and in a state where it has few assets, Murdoch was instrumental in assisting another ideologue who owns much of the newspapers there (and a national TV station) establish his newspaper base.

        Anyone who is genuinely concerned about 'Big Brother' or One World Government or media manipulation of the masses needs to be able to see how and who exactly is doing just that.

        Whenever people like O'Reilly or the rest of the Fox crew put themselves on some sort of pedestal for ratings, it should be stressed that before Fox, never did a cable news outlet have to buy it's audience.

        To accelerate its adoption by cable companies, Fox News paid systems up to $11 per subscriber to distribute the channel.

        Remind people over and over again that Rupert Murdoch is a citizen of convenience, an Australian who changed nationality to come in and mess with the body politic in the USA.
        That the second largest owner of News Corp is a Saudi Arabian. In other words ownership of the organization is by foreign born individuals.
        That Fox gave you witch hunts and trivialities in your national politics when Bill Clinton was President
        That they gave you George W Bush, twice
        That they made sure the world went to war with Iraq.
        There are others, too numerous to mention

        I think if a map of News Ltd assets and thus influence were widely distributed, all the pretentiousness of the anchors about some massive left-wing media conspiracy can be laid to rest.
        As they always do, Fox accuses their opponents of doing that which they are doing.

        "You Still drilling for oil? Well good luck, I mean it. Idiot. Shine, Baby, Shine." JR Ewing

        by Unenergy on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 04:39:42 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Thank you for your comment. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Terri, brein, Unenergy

          Do you know of any resources, organizations, contacts that already have done that map? I don't want to reinvent the wheel :-)

          I could see your idea becoming a mediaKos subgroup effort - to focus fully on exposing and getting the word out about Murdoch,  News Corps' Saudi ownership. I plan to hit up KingOneEye for cooperation, of course. I'd like to get his blog some more exposure, for example.

          If you know of any other sources already working on this, please feel free to add them to my diary, under the comment NEWS CORP/FAUX/MURDOCH, where I have just cut-and-pasted your very helpful comment.

          Thanks, Unenergy!

          There is no more important struggle for American democracy than ensuring a diverse, independent and free media. - Bill Moyers

          by StepLeftStepForward on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 05:07:49 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  What I'd suggest is a good platform which (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Terri, brein, StepLeftStepForward

            can be used to crowd source what you are proposing called prezi.
            http://prezi.com/

            I did start putting together something on the Australian media landscape about 6 months ago with a focus on News Limited, but it is simply too overwhelming for one person to do alone.

            "You Still drilling for oil? Well good luck, I mean it. Idiot. Shine, Baby, Shine." JR Ewing

            by Unenergy on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 08:27:14 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  That's cool. If I understand it right, (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Unenergy

              it's kind of like a web-savvy PowerPointesque tool. Looks good. I'll pass it on to our 'secretary'.

              mediaKos is just starting and we've got some great ideas so far. My first diary didn't get much attention, but I'm thinking the next one will. And by then, we'll have some more concrete ideas and offers and proposals. If people want to form sub-groups, cool. Maybe you'll get some bees to help you out :-)

              Thanks again. I hope you'll contribute somehow. Actually, you already have: with your suggestion. Cheers!

              There is no more important struggle for American democracy than ensuring a diverse, independent and free media. - Bill Moyers

              by StepLeftStepForward on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 09:11:12 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

        •  should do a diary on this. important. nt (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Unenergy, StepLeftStepForward

          "Bigger change will come with bigger Democratic majorities. Diminishing Democratic accomplishments is a losing strategy." sja May Peace Prevail

          by revgerry on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 02:41:03 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  Somehow I missed the part about (7+ / 0-)

    our commitment. Why was that ever a question? It's not whether most of us are/were committed, it's whether the WH is...It really ticks me off when they decide to turn the tables and suggest that we are the ones off kilter and "we" really need to hunker down.

    Give me an extremely huge break!

    Language is wine upon the lips. -Virginia Woolf

    by valadon on Fri Jul 23, 2010 at 11:46:07 PM PDT

    •  Maybe his vantage point (9+ / 0-)

      is just a lil different.  Don't ascribe that small part of his speech to a bigger campaign to question the netroots commitment.  I don't think other folks felt too demoralized by that, instead they were inspired by the totality and pledge to stay vigilant.  

      And the use of 'we', to me at least, gives a much more empathetic rather than accusatory tone. Because we do need to be reminded to hunker down.  We saw the power of the forces against our hope last week in the worst way.  A lot of us needed the hope and heartbreak perspective.  I hope you can look at it in a more 'full game plan' way.

      He hasn't gone from us to 'they'.

      It really ticks me off when they decide to turn the tables

      He is us.

      •  I appreciate your gung ho spirit (0+ / 0-)

        I'm just not there. Everyone is a "we" as long as they need "us" for something.

        He's not me.

        Language is wine upon the lips. -Virginia Woolf

        by valadon on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 03:15:02 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  But he is though (0+ / 0-)

          and that may be the untouchable nexus - where we're not only trying to convince all poor/less privileged folks who go right that we're in it together, but we've also got work to do on the left.  

          •  The problem is (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            valadon, willibro, JordanRules

            and the bottom line is that the Congress and the White House are not acting like they're in this together with us.  We can be the most effective people in the history of the world but the fact of the matter is that if the people we elected are working against us we'll get nowhere.

            I really enjoyed Van's speech and I related to almost all of it.  But there was a really big gaping hole in it -- the hard work and ideas and hope are fruitless if the establishment is still working against you, if you have not been effective in influencing them.  And Van himself is the prime example of that.  And that's the very sad irony of his speech.

            But yeah, we keep trying.  What other choice do we have?  

            I just hope Van is using his connections to try to get through to the administration, and not just trying to influence the blogosphere.  Because his efforts would be much better spent in trying to get them to listen to the people who elected them instead of listening to the Rubinite advisors who already took us down the road to hell before in the 90s.

            •  I agree (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Terri, willibro, Paddy999

              and I don't think anything about this dynamic is new and yet we still have to keep pushing forward.

              This isn't the first time the powerful have aligned against the masses, it would be news if it was.  Do I think they have a new tool in their shed? Yep, the President of the USA is Black.  But my main point is to keep working because 20 and 50 years from now if their tactics didn't work to demoralize us, we will understand the changes better.  

            •  Exactly (0+ / 0-)

              and the bottom line is that the Congress and the White House are not acting like they're in this together with us.  We can be the most effective people in the history of the world but the fact of the matter is that if the people we elected are working against us we'll get nowhere.

              Language is wine upon the lips. -Virginia Woolf

              by valadon on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 03:31:51 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

      •  Last week (6+ / 0-)

        We saw the power of the forces against our hope last week in the worst way.

        I couldn't disagree more.  

        There is another way to look at this.  

        I saw a great victory last week.  Breitbart's attack was effective for a very, very short time.  And then the blogosphere pushed back and the media pushed back.  And this happened really quickly.

        The media started defending Ms. Sherrod.  They took the time to get the full video and they played it over and over and over, in context, and pundit after pundit took the time to explain what she was saying, in context and to show that her message was the exact opposite of how Breitbart painted it.  They went out and found the farmer and interviewed him.  They gave Sherrod tons of time to present her side of the story.  They bent over backwards to make sure this was reported accourately.  I'm talking about the tv media - real media, not Fox News.

        The pressure from the media and the blogs was on the Dept of Ag and the White House to treat her right and to reinstate her,

        This was a sign of real progress.  This gave me hope instead of taking it away.

        This would have played a lot differently a few years ago, I believe strongly.

        •  I am very heartened (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          willibro, brein, StepLeftStepForward

          that you feel this way and maybe I've been burned too many times thinking we've turned the corner.  I think they will find another target and that person may not be as angelic as Ms. Sherrrod; then what?

          A few years ago we had Rev Wright, less than a couple years ago we had Acorn, and then there was the topic of this thread Van Jones; I see no fundamental change and that's what it will take IMO; codified change via law, regulation, cultural expectations etc.

          Most of my friends hadn't heard the updates on the story.  And most of the viewers Fox was targeting with the original story (CNN viewers too) would never believe the correction anyway.  IMO their logic might read like this (given the previous lies Beck, Fox, Rush etc have fed them) - "well they're racist too, of course they would stick up for her". Seriously, that's the level of discourse I think we're dealing with given Fox and right wing radio's MO.

          •  If it happens again (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            StepLeftStepForward

            it will have to be dealt with on a case by case basis.  And I'm willing to bet that the media will treat it a whole lot differently next time and they'll do their homework before jumping on a story like that, as will the NAACP.

            We'll have to disagree on Rev. Wright.  I still find the things he said to be offensive.  Really offensive.  Then he just kept digging and tried to destroy then candidate Obama.  Wright has some serious issues.  That wasn't the same as the situation with Ms. Sherrod.  Not even close.

        •  And I think I forgot the most important point (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          willibro, brein, StepLeftStepForward

          ...the fact that it was allowed to happen in the first place.

          News outlets are supposed to fact check.  It should have never, ever, ever happend. I learned this in high school journalism. There is no excuse for what Breibart and Fox did IMO.

          •  No doubt (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            valadon, willibro, Paddy999, brein

            there's no excuse for what Breitbart and Fox did.  Breitbart is done, as far as the mainstream media is concerned, IMHO.  They'll never entertain anything the man says or does ever again.  He ruined his career, IMHO, except for opposition research type work or right-wing nut job radio.

            You'd think it would have happened after the ACORN affair, but that played out in slow motion and it wasn't corrected immediately like the Sherrod situation was.  Plus, his name and face wasn't as prominent in that case.  This time, his name and face was part of the story.

    •  Interesting discussion, you guys (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      valadon

      Thanks for having it.

  •  just an awesome guy (5+ / 0-)

    glad I listened to the whole thing, thanks for posting!

  •  Agree - have passed it on as best I can (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    northanger, JordanRules
  •  Reminding us of the "long-haul" - good stuff .. (10+ / 0-)

    I'd never heard him speak, before.

    With the "comment burst" as our ubiquitous model, it's so easy to get frustrated with the obstacles to progress that seemingly appear at every corner, like a nightmarish game of "Whack-A-Mole".

    It helped to hear VJ remind us that this is a very gradual movement away from the authoritarian admin. of Bush/Cheney and toward a reflection of our democracy that is truly more representative.

    Not that the corporate apologists aren't truly everywhere, but still.. I haven't felt this positive about "events" in quite some time.

    Thanks, MB.

    Now, where did I leave my torches and villagers..

    by FrankSpoke on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 12:34:56 AM PDT

  •  Good, charismatic speaker (5+ / 0-)

    Nothing on the war, nothing on torture. He's got nothing for me.

    Let's be more "beautiful"? "You can’t let your own issue let you be part of blowing out that hope in America, you can’t do that, you must...keep hope...alive."

    Tell me about the hope of those Obama plans to keep in indefinite detention? Tell me about the hope of Abdul Aziz tonight, sent to Algeria outside his will, after he fled it 17 years ago, only to be sold to the Americans and sent to Guantanamo, then sent back to Algeria again and disappeared.

    Don't listen to me, NN. No, don't listen. Cheer for hope. Cheer for Van. Cheer for the administration. Put those unfortunate souls behind a screen so we don't have to see them. We have to fight Glenn Beck. We have to give billions to the contractors to fight in a war nobody understands.

    Give 'em that old razzle-dazzle.

    War is the statesman's game, the priest's delight, The lawyer's jest, the hired assassin's trade Invictus

    by Valtin on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 12:38:05 AM PDT

    •  This speech didn't (5+ / 0-)

      speak to exacly what you wanted, but can you not find anything worthy in it?

      A lot of others did.  Were we all 'snookered' or do we appreciate what he brings?  He spoke pointedly on what he does 'green jobs' etc.

      What is wrong with hope, Van and the admin in a larger perspective? What did you want this one speech to do?

      If it did give some hope to continue to work for their specific area of influence, isn't that okay?

      Dean:  It's our job to make them progessive enough

      Is he not progressiv enough in regards to what he does or should he try to address it all?

      •  I can't get behind a Green movement (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Pithy Cherub, joanneleon

        that builds its momentum via political support of a party that engages in militarism and follows Bush in ripping to shreds civil liberties.

        Here's what the Democratic Congress passed, for instance (thanks Nancy!, for your wonderful attack on the right to a defense, and aping Glenn Beck):

        The House-passed version of the FY2011 defense authorization bill (H.R. 5136) contains a reporting requirement relating to detainees’ legal representation. It would require the Department of Defense’s Inspector General to "conduct an investigation of the conduct and practices" of attorneys who represented non-citizen Guantanamo detainees in habeas corpus or military commission proceedings.63 The Inspector General would be required to submit a report of the findings to the House and Senate Armed Services Committees within 90 days of the bill’s enactment.

        h/t powwow

        War is the statesman's game, the priest's delight, The lawyer's jest, the hired assassin's trade Invictus

        by Valtin on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 12:53:13 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Fair enough. (6+ / 0-)

          You've identified your line in the sand and I can dig it sort of.

          Just don't demonize us too bad because some of ours are different.

          Ending the back of the bus didn't mean the end to a whole lot of foul sh*t (see BP's clean up crew for instance) and still I find hope.  If that's just razzle dazzle to you, that's cool. And still we work...

          •  I understand and appreciate (5+ / 0-)

            the good work of many activists working for change. For environmental change. For economic, racial, ethnic, sexual, and wide-ranging change. My argument is not with them but with this administration.

            It is my contention that one cannot separate out the change that you and many want from the other policies of the administration. It really doesn't work that way. The reactionary militarist policies feed the right wing. The billions to the militarists (who harbor and succor the torturers as well) far outweighs the billions to Green or other projects. The defense budget is now about 1/2 of the entire budget. It is a torpedo headed right at the hopes and dreams of those with a progressive agenda.

            First end the preeminence of the militarists, and then we can proceed. Otherwise, all you'll see are, at best, the crumbs thrown out thus far. And when the GOP inevitably, at some point, get back into power... watch out!

            War is the statesman's game, the priest's delight, The lawyer's jest, the hired assassin's trade Invictus

            by Valtin on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 01:13:17 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  With all due (4+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Terri, Lawrence, joanneleon, A Siegel

              respect...how long has this been goin on (hat tip to Ace LOL)??  I trust you know so we'll have to disagree on the futility of any progess while humans continue to not evolve at a rate that helps us get there faster.

              I know too well how much pointed and limited progess has made it possible for me and my friends to do what we do.

              It's not enough, but there is no finish line and it ain't sexy, but it is part of our limitations IMO.

              If there is a wholesale change model that works without sacrificing the cow for the milk, I think it can only be deployed on a small model...for now.

              But you know what is good about hope...I can still have it for the mapquest to the future that you think is the way without losing the hope in other ways.

              •  I'd be satisfied with moving closer to the goal. (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                joanneleon

                But that's not what is happening.  This administration is effectively institutionalizing torture, assassination and political detention.  We can quibble about what you think is in Obama's heart of hearts, but at the end of the day these are the consequences of his actions.

                This is not pragmatic politics.  It is not only immoral and unconstitutional, it is unnecessary.

                Justice deferred is justice denied. -MLK

                by zephron on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 03:47:23 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  And again I invoke (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Terri

                  Ace's song 'how long has this been going on'?

                  I think we are moving closer to the goal, in many areas, as do others.

                  IMO you are asking him to dismantle in an unrealistic way generations of the MIC.  If the less challenged POTUS's can't do it, then I can look at this with a more pragmatic eye.  

                  I wish he could, but I don't see that he can.  But I think his admin can do a whole lot that will make a whole lot of difference.  And that makes sense to me.  

                  •  Torture and indefinite imprisoment? (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Valtin

                    That's relatively recent.  And it's getting worse.

                    I'm not talking about dismantling the MIC in one fell swoop.  I'm talking about not expanding horrendous violations of Constitution and conscience.  Obama's administration isn't moving in the right direction.  Not even incrementally.

                    Justice deferred is justice denied. -MLK

                    by zephron on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 04:55:06 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

              •  You seem to have missed (0+ / 0-)

                the past 60 years, since Nuremberg. And when it comes to comparing evolutionary change with societal change, you'd have us move at the pace of natural selection???

                In fact, this very nation was born out of a belief in progress and perfectibility of humanity through social change. It was the reactionaries of that time that argued that rule by monarchs had been going on for a long time and there was nothing that should be done about it (except minor reforms).

                I respect you and know you are no reactionary. However, I think everyone here at Daily Kos should consider the power of the existing authorities, who in their ever-present press to maintain their policies, and in particular the polices of military expansion and occupation, and of favoring corporations and the very rich, continually stress adaptation to the status quo. This favors them, and the influence of this, backed by a myriad of outlets, exerts a mighty influence upon popular opinion. So, of course, torture can't change, is embedded in human nature, one starts to think. That's the meme that's handed down, and then unconsciously picked up and asserted at the level of, say, a blog post or comment.

                War is the statesman's game, the priest's delight, The lawyer's jest, the hired assassin's trade Invictus

                by Valtin on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 10:39:17 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

        •  accepted /nt (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Valtin

          "What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know, it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." --Mark Twain

          by mimi on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 07:12:22 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  The irony is ... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      joanneleon, mightymouse, andrewj54

      ... that here Van Jones appears to be conflating Obama with "hope".  It seems to escape so very many that it is possible to imagine other paths towards success besides blindly supporting a single man.

      Van Jones also got the definition of "volunteer" back-asswards.  Obama begged and pleaded for the job.  He criss-crossed the nation for 2 damned years trying to get the job.  And, after much debate, Obama was hired to do the job.  The idea that Obama's doing us some great favor is just offensive.

      Justice deferred is justice denied. -MLK

      by zephron on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 03:55:50 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I don't (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Terri, dotster, brein, Jim Saul, lightshine

        think anybody that is inspired by this speech is doing what you said and I don't think that is what Van was prescribing.

        I don't equate hope with blind support.  I think hope is an essential part of any large grassroots movement.  And I think that's why it is a common signifier for so many movements for progress, (the civil rights movement is but one example).

        I also don't equate campaigning with 'begged' and 'pleaded'.  If so, I hope (yeah hope, LOL) you'll grant that every other candidate did the same thing.

        I didn't hear Van asking us to thank Obama for doing us a favor either.

        •  He's asking us (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          mightymouse, zephron, brein

          to cut him a break and to remember that he took over the Titanic after it hit the iceberg.

          "Volunteer" was a poor choice of words.

          And while I was initially fired up by that line, because I completely understood what he was getting at and agreed with it, now that I think about the statement some more, I can see that it was an unfortunate statement in a few different ways.

          First, he didn't "volunteer".  He and others worked for years to raise the money and support to get the nomination.  Winning the election itself was always a given. Whatever Democrat ran in 2008, assuming no disastrous downfall happened, was going to win that election and everyone knew that.  Mountains were moved to get that nomination.  Some of it was done honestly and some of it was underhanded.

          Second, using the Titanic metaphor probably wasn't the best choice, since the Titanic sank anyway.

          But all that being said, we knew what he was getting at.  It's too easy to blame the current occupant of the White House for the current dismal state of affairs and we can't let people forget what and who brought us to this place.  And we won't, and I don't think there's one person in the progressive blogosphere who forgets that.  The issue is -- what is he doing with the power we gave him?  What direction is he taking us in?  What is Congress doing?  How is he using his power over Congress?  Is he using it to truly fight for the best interests of the people or to capitulate to the establishment and the hugely powerful corporate interests?  That's what it's about and that's what it's always been about.  This isn't personal.  It's about what our government is doing and it's about the haves and the have nots.

          •  I don't think Obama understood that he (0+ / 0-)

            would have to save the passengers of a sinking Titanic, before he took office. I think he believed to be a captain of a ship, who has to go through some hurricanes, but no knowledge of a leak that would sink the boat.

            I also think it's a bit superfluous to even bother discussing that metaphor.

            "What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know, it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." --Mark Twain

            by mimi on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 07:20:33 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  Indeed, every candidate does. (0+ / 0-)

          And worse.  I have never claimed Obama was special in this regard.

          We frequently get hit with the "He's doing the best he can" and "It's a hard job, cut him some slack" and "He took over when no one else wanted the job."  All of these are baloney.  The Presidency isn't a prize to be won.  It's a job to be done.  Wherein the President fails to reach performance goals, he ought to be castigated and, ultimately, fired.  Just like every other employee.  Inasmuch as "he volunteered to captain the Titanic on it's way down" implies these, which it clearly does, it is baloney also.

          I do agree that "hope" need not mean "fealty".  As Van Jones himself demonstrates, the political process is not the only means of effecting the change so many of us seek.  But, at the very least this is being spun as "stop attacking Obama".  And, frankly, it sounds a lot like that when Van Jones said it.  This too is baloney.

          Justice deferred is justice denied. -MLK

          by zephron on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 05:08:46 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  What do we do with Aziz? (0+ / 0-)

      "This is harder than it looks." -- Van Jones

      by LarsThorwald on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 06:30:14 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  I think that's a bit unfair judgement (0+ / 0-)

      I didn't hear a lot of fake "cheer" for hope or the administration, but some thoughts about reflections of why "so many are sad and heartbroken", what it means and how to deal with it. Something people think about a lot these days. How to get out of despair. For most people a pep talk in getting up hope won't do it.

      What you want to hear, we can hear all the time in thousands of comments and diaries, but act upon those issues we can't at no time. That's the problem.

      How do you get out of despair and over the point of hope into acting out the change you want to see?

      I don't think his speech washed that away with "Cheer up people, everything will be fine" kind of rhetoric. But may be that's just me.

      "What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know, it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." --Mark Twain

      by mimi on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 07:06:59 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Dorothy Height & Malcolm X (12+ / 0-)

    Van reminded me of something Dorothy Height said about Malcolm X.

    I've always considered the religious spectrum from MLK (Christian) to Malcolm X (Muslim) an interesting political and spiritual perspective on being Black in America, and the tensions created by these different points of view. Malcolm X was known for strongly criticizing blacks marrying outside their race, challenging the "timidity of mainstream civil rights protesters", and criticizing MLK's non-violent strategy:

    ...by pointing out that Gandhi was a big black elephant sitting on a small white mouse, while King was a small black mouse sitting on a big white elephant.

    So this recollection from Dorothy Height, when Malcolm X returned from his sojourn in Mecca, has always impressed me [check that Poitier link, he was at the White House the day (June 10, 1964) the filibuster was broken on the Civil Rights Act; 3 days later, i think, is the event Ms Height is talking about)]:

    GWEN IFILL: You write about an incident in your book involving Malcolm X and Lorraine Hansberry who was the author of A Raisin in the Sun.

    DOROTHY HEIGHT: Yes.

    GWEN IFILL: Tell us about that.

    DOROTHY HEIGHT: Well, you know, Sidney Poitier really convened a group at his home in Pleasantville, Ossie Davis called it. And it was for Malcolm X, he wanted to meet with the united civil rights leadership group, which was made up of Dr. King and Mr. Whitney Young, Roy Wilkins, A. Philip Randolph, James Farmer, myself, and John Lewis. And he wanted to let us know that he'd been to Mecca [April 1964] and that he had a change of heart.

    He said "we spend all our time talking about the white man and trying to do something about him, and we've been at each other. We need to get together and always be together." And he said, "our unity has to be there, we have to be in unity," and he said, "we have to now focus on our people." And that was a complete change for him. And I'll never forget this strong man saying all of this and he said, "We need to talk with each other."

    And Lorraine Hansberry, the marvelous author, was lying on her couch and she lifted her head and she said, "Malcolm, I hear what you're saying, but how do you think I felt when I heard you on television saying that I was a traitor to the race because I married a white man? You didn't know who he was or why I married him or anything. And you never asked me a thing about him."

    And it was really a tremendous experience to see this huge, vigorous, articulate, militant man simply look at her and say gently, "Sister, you're right. We all must work together and talk to each other before we talk about each other." And that to me was an experience I'll never forget.

    in the past, Civil Rights activism has dealt with issues concerning whether it's effective to criticize Black leaders during times of crisis. i'm learning to be more fluid about the issue of criticism, primarily because of this video from Friday, How can Republicans attract minorities? -- because dammit, it kinda set me off, y'know?

    imho, the problem with the GOP is homogenization and exclusivity (which is totally opposite from "American Diversity": a motley rabble of saucy boys, negroes and molattoes, Irish teagues and outlandish jack tarrs) where dissent during the Bush administration — if not outright crushed — was definitely viewed as unpatriotic. i googled some links about this (as a reminder of how bad it used to be), see: Lawsuit reveals Bush Administration attempts to suppress dissent where ACLU attorney Chris Hansen stated: "The White House has gone too far in its attempt to make dissent invisible" & Treating dissent as treason, where David Sirota coined Intimigate describing "the well established pattern... that the Bush Administration has summarily fired, intimidated and defamed anyone who has had the courage to tell the truth...".

    i'm all for defeating the GOP with amazing diversity :)

    •  Such (4+ / 0-)

      a good excerpt for me to read a 1am!  Seriously, thanks for that contribution northanger.

      That historical nugget was not only sooo cool to read, but is another deposit into my evolving understanding of how to deal with the day - post 8 year of despair and the 1st black POTUS - hmph, what a culmination.

      Great links also. Gosh, I hope we all mine as much as we can at the time at hand to pass on to the next one.

    •  Diary-worthy comment, northanger. (7+ / 0-)

      Malcolm also touched on something I would like to see end: Talking past each other.

      Many seem so beholden to their own opinions that they can't hear those with different opinions. And I think that is something that Barack Obama is also trying to teach us as a nation. And for the record, I'm not a 'centrist' and I don't think Democrats should be advocating and adopting Republican policies.

      As individuals and a society, however, we need to embrace and respect diversity. When we do that, we can foster unity. The current climate of polarization must be broken.

      There is no more important struggle for American democracy than ensuring a diverse, independent and free media. - Bill Moyers

      by StepLeftStepForward on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 03:05:43 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  To expand on that... (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Terri, northanger, brein, JordanRules

        I just read a recommended-by-me rant by NearlyNormal in response to an email from his dad, which ended with this:

        Do I seem pissed?  I have to tell you, it is not just because of some douchebag casino owner.  It is because there seems to be two kinds of people in America:  people who try to make America better for the greatest number of people on one side and people who lie, deny scientific evidence, and try to kill you for being a democrat on the other.  In case Fox hasn't been covering it, there was yet another murderous patriot last week on the hunt for liberals.  He was going to go shoot up the ACLU in San Francisco because Glenn Beck put it in his mind to.  He was going to go kill liberals...liberals like me.  And every time your friends fire off another email full of lies, the world gets a little less safe for people like me.  And that is why I am pissed.

        In my response, I came up with this:

        The 'two kinds of people' part is so true. I think the only way to change the other kind is to get very personal with them, to boil it down to YOU + ME = US.

        Nice that US = United States, America, patriotism.

        While the overwhelming majority of the Faux-hate-radio-Talebangelical-teabagger-militia-racist folks aka The Brainwashed are very likely lost causes, there are plenty we can save from that fate, if we try.

        There is no more important struggle for American democracy than ensuring a diverse, independent and free media. - Bill Moyers

        by StepLeftStepForward on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 03:55:35 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  current climate of polarization must be broken (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        StepLeftStepForward

        totally totally agree.

        btw, this started as a diary. there's a Brandeis quote on the Constitution being "deliberately inefficient" (diverse?), "to preclude the exercise of arbitrary power".

        once I gnaw on Teh Van a little more -- I mean his words of course! -- I'll post it.

    •  MLK wasn't necessarily for (0+ / 0-)

      "marrying outside his race" either. Don't remember exactly the phrase he used in his speech, but something like "I want to be the white man's brother, not his brother-in-law ..."

      Just saying, and just because you are in a mixed-race marriage or relationship and are not against it at all, doesn't mean you can't have racist feelings.

      "What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know, it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." --Mark Twain

      by mimi on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 07:29:43 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  A call from Mumbai (4+ / 0-)

    So tonight at the hotel I got a call from an Expedia rep. She had a slight Indian accent and explained to me a guest would be late because his flight had been canceled due to "snowstorms in the Midwest."

    I told her I was in the Midwest now and there were no snowstorms. She then switched to flooding, which is more likely.

    Still, it was an interesting experience. I'm in the middle of a text right now about call centers in India and women working night shift, so a diary might appear later when I'm finished.

    Snow would be a nice change from the heat index today!

    Fluorescent, flat, caffeine lights / It's furious balancing

    by CayceP on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 02:02:46 AM PDT

  •  Howard Dean (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    OLinda, uzeromay

    What he said!

    "If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities" -- Voltaire

    by Sagebrush Bob on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 02:18:27 AM PDT

  •  22 TARP Supporters Vote Against (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    geez53, brein, StepLeftStepForward

    “Small Business Lending Fund”
    http://www.opencongress.org/...

  •  Van Jones worked for the man. (0+ / 0-)

     His criticisms of Obama or his administration would be news worthy. Telling the masses to stfu is ridiculous.  Obama may be as pure and well intentioned as the driven snow, but it is results that count; and his results aren't so hot for a Democrat. Now if Obama was a Republican doing what he's doing, you'd have historical.  

    Don't tax the rich, starve the poor.

    by dkmich on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 03:40:43 AM PDT

    •  Which man does Mr. Jones (6+ / 0-)

      work for?? Geeez, I thought resigning from the admin would at least shelter him from that canned criticism.

      I didn't get the sentiment that most folks, here anyway, got the message that he said STFU when they listened to this speech.

      Interesting yard sticks you have for Dem Presidents considering it isn't over and time always judges better.

      We shall see...

      •  It's these damnable machines i tell ya !!!!!!!!!! (3+ / 0-)

        18 months, gawwww, we should already be to the rainbow and pony phase of Warcraft.

        Nearly 6 decades of sailing around on this ship of state has taught me that it doesn't turn to the left very quickly, nor does it stay on a steady course really well.

        But the biggest source of angst i've seen in the last decade, i believe comes from point and click perception that things should move faster than they do. These new toys/tools only move some mental processes faster, but not all and certainly do little to make physical processes move closer to the speed of light.

        It's like pushing a Bugatti Veyron to 210 mph then pulling behind a school bus in traffic for 20 miles.

        Welcome to the Corporate States of America ®, give us your money, then die quietly.

        by geez53 on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 04:11:00 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  LOL (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Terri, geez53, Jim Saul

          'Point and Click Perceptions'  Yes!!!

          Consider yourself a victim of Dkos theft. LOL  No seriously, that term crystalizes a good deal for me.

          Technology. Yep, it plays a role, good and bad.

          And I'm guilty of allowing it's effects to sometimes color my perceptions in a way that don't make sense when you take humanity as a whole into account.

          Sometimes I wish they could make certain physical processes move faster. Heh!  

  •  The new BP Catastrophe Mothership (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    geez53, StepLeftStepForward

    is up here. A big thanks to everyone who takes the time to rec her to keep her afloat on the rec list. Come join us in the ROVs to keep up with the latest news and to comment or ask questions.

  •  I'm really surprised (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mimi, brein, Adept2u, mallyroyal

    ...at the failure of many people to view the entire video of Jones's speech.  It was very good and intended to point people back to the grassroots and organizing and action at the grassroots.

    Instead, too many folks pick up the way that the national media and certain bloggers framed the speech as being about Obama.  It wasn't.  And contra Atrios, who I generally agree with, Jones was not saying "Clap louder."

    He was telling us that we don't understand how big a fight we have on our hands and that our response should not be the despair that followed the Democratic National Convention in 1968 (and he did not say that directly).

    It's either hard work in local communities and states, or another 40 years in the desert.  That is the choice facing progressives.  It's the days between elections that are more important than the three-month to year-long campaign seasons.  Failure to understand that has hurt progressives; that failure has extended to third parties as well.

    Contrary to the view of most in the Obama controversy on both sides, Obama is not Frodo.  The truth is that we are Frodo.  Breaking the cynical power that grips this country is our task.  And it can't be done by being more cynical.

    50 states, 210 media market, 435 Congressional Districts, 3080 counties, 192,480 precincts

    by TarheelDem on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 05:46:53 AM PDT

  •  Wow, ttere were so many lines in his speech (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    revgerry

    that I would love to put in my sig line.

    Thank you very much putting up the link to the Van Jones speech. That was very much worth listening to.

    I didn't catch the first diary and what happened there, but I really don't want to know about. What he said was dead serious and very honestly heart-and mindcatching.  

    I hope there will be a word by word transcript somewhere, otherwise it's actually worth writing one. Some "wisdom" lines almost broke my heart, as the one that said something about the importance of what you do in the moments of heartbreaks to how long the hearbreak lasts ... or something like that, which was one of the lesser ear-popping ones, near the end, but nevertheless rang a bell that I couldn't help but hearing clearly.

    "What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know, it's what we know for sure that just ain't so." --Mark Twain

    by mimi on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 06:43:07 AM PDT

  •  You'll notice if you watch the speech (0+ / 0-)
    that there is no injunction to "stop beating up on Obama."  Jones is far too savvy a speaker and advocate to tell a room full of frustrated advocates that they need to keep silent about their grievances.  His speech was a plea not to give up hope.  He did not browbeat in the way that Calchala's diary and the TPM piece alleged.  The excerpt published on TPM was an excerpting only Andrew Breitbart could love.  It began with the statement "I can't stand it."  It does not make clear the antecedent of "it" in that statement, suggesting, given the thrust of the article, that Jones can't stand the criticism of Obama by the netroots.  This was not the context.  Jones radiated empathy for the heartbreak and disappointment of the netroots, and advocated not losing hope because of that.  That is all.

    "Fighting for us, good. Winning, better. Talking about fighting? Not so good."--Atrios

    by andrewj54 on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 09:56:53 AM PDT

  •  Gawd DAMN I heart smart people. (0+ / 0-)

    I'm gonna go eat a steak. And fuck my wife. And pray to GOD - hatemailapalooza, 052210

    by punditician on Sat Jul 24, 2010 at 12:18:20 PM PDT

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