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Let's go back to the 1950s, says Ken Buck, GOP candidate for Senator in Colorado.

Buck: He still has his recorder on right there... [points, laughter]

Question: [brief lead-in] What plans do you have to make public education better in America?

Buck: "Let's talk about that [education] folks. In the 1950s, we had the best schools in the world. And the United States government decided to get more involved in federal education. [Pols emphasis] Where are we now, after all those years of federal involvement, are we better or are we worse? So what's the federal government's answer? Well since we've made education worse, we're gonna even get more involved. And what's gonna be the result?  It's kinda like health care. We've screwed up health care--Medicare--we've screwed up all kinds of other things, so what are we gonna do? We're gonna get even more involved in health care.  What are we going to do? We're gonna get more involved in education.

As Colorado Pols points out in this piece, most of the real federal investment in education came a lot later, in the 60s and 70s. What was the primary feature of education in the 50s (other than Bert the turtle films?).

Is this the "Rand Paul moment" for Ken Buck, folks? Most of the increases in federal funding for education, the federally-guaranteed student loans that Buck so famously wants to do away with, and other federal "involvement," happened in the 1960s, not the 1950s: the federal Department of Education didn't itself exist until 1980. In addition, before the 1965 federal student loan program we know today, which uses private lenders and federal loan guarantees, student loans were made directly by the U.S. Treasury. Is that his conservative vision?


Of course, there was that little matter of the Brown vs. Board of Education decision in 1954, later enforced by federal troops on a rather unwilling local government in Little Rock. Which would very certainly come under the heading of "federal involvement" in education, wouldn't it? As a matter of fact, wasn't that a big argument about "local control," if you set aside the messy racist stuff?

Yeah, that whole pesky Civil Rights era progress again. Wasn't life a lot better for the Ken Bucks and Rand Pauls of the world before brown people could start associating with them? Oh, and before Medicare "screwed up health care," too. You really need no more proof that women, minorities, and seniors don't really have a part in Ken Buck's world.

Originally posted to Daily Kos on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:46 PM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Soooprise, soooprise, soooprise, (9+ / 0-)

    As Gomer Pyle would say.

    A wealthy white guy wants to go back to the '50s.  Color me freakin' shocked.

    I don't think I like all these crazies living next door to me.

    America's military went to war. America went to the mall.

    by talismanlangley on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:50:00 PM PDT

  •  Thanks President Obama! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    third Party please

    "Many students here [at Colorado State University], especially seniors nearing graduation, said that worries about the economy, and about getting a job after graduation, had filtered through the campus, dampening enthusiasm for Democrats in Congress and Mr. Obama.

    Philip Stricker, 21, a biology major who voted for Mr. Obama but says he has not been paying much attention to politics lately, uses a nontechnical term to describe the phenomenon.

    "There’s a vibe," he said on a recent afternoon, while pumping weights at the gym. "Right now it seems like Republicans just care a lot more than Democrats."

    •  That? Is just sad. (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RichM, jj32, third Party please, flhiii88

      Right now it seems like Republicans just care a lot more than Democrats

      Sure.  Yeah.  Okay.

      Well, unless you mean "care a lot more about terrifying the populace with stories of the big brown boogeyman in the closet", then hell yeah, the Rethugs care more.

      But this is extreme fail on the Dems' part, I agree.  /sigh

      America's military went to war. America went to the mall.

      by talismanlangley on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:52:31 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Yeah, the last sentence seems obvious (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ogre, ShowMeMoBlue

      after this one a little bit before:

      but says he has not been paying much attention to politics lately

      Yup, that seems about right.

      •  Well... (0+ / 0-)

        "Kristin Johnson, 23, like many other students interviewed here in recent days, said that a vote for Democrats in 2008, however passionate it was, did not a Democrat make. But she bristles just as much at the idea of being called a Republican.

        "It’s like picking a team when you really don’t want to root for either team," said Ms. Johnson, a communication studies major, who said she was undecided about parties and politics going into the general election campaign.


        "A spokeswoman for the university’s chapter of College Democrats, Mandi Asay, 22, said her group battled apathy on one hand and anger on the other.

        "People are angry — about the budget deficit, health care plan, angry about this and that," she said. "I feel like Republicans definitely, definitely have a chance of getting back on their feet."

    •  some kid who isn't paying attention (0+ / 0-)

      thinks Republicans care more.  So pretty much, low information voters still are low information and pretty much believe crap is true against all facts to the contrary.

      It means that the party needs to be doing more to reach out on campuses and inform these kids.   If they think Republicans have any thing other than semi-permanent unemployment and underemployment in store for them, they need to learn more skills in college. Reading and thinking would be useful.

    •  Feel sad for Mr. Stricker. (0+ / 0-)

      But not sure why the NY Times would interview a biology student? Why not a student in an important people powered discipline such as Gender and Women's Studies, African-American Studies or any of the important aspects of academia where the United States leads the way and where the faculty and students are all people powered and understand the wonderful things that President Obama and Congress have done the past 2 years? It's as if the NY Times sought out a student who is likely to be unncessarily negative, by seeking a student in a non people-powered discipline who probably could care less about the important issues of the day.

  •  It was so good the USSR beat us to space, ICBMs, (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    satelites, manned space flight, the H-bomb...

    Unimportant things like that.

    So, yeah, lets go back to the education system of the 50s... with mandatory Chinese language classes.

    Why does Buck hate the US?

    •  You are aware that the H-bomb was (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      litho, Pangloss, trumpeter

      first tested by Americans? The Russians were 3 years behind...

      The first test of this principle was the "Ivy Mike" nuclear test in 1952, conducted by the United States. In the Soviet Union, the design was known as Andrei Sakharov's "Third Idea", first tested in 1955.

      Those who forget the lessons of history are probably watching Glenn Beck.

      by ontheleftcoast on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:54:12 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  No, the 1st bomb was Soviet. Mike was a 'device' (0+ / 0-)

        that took up half a small island, not exactly a weapon.


        •  From the articles you linked (0+ / 0-)

          This on "Ivy Mike", what you call 'a device':

          The device was the first full test of the Teller-Ulam design, a staged fusion bomb, and is generally considered the first successful test of a hydrogen bomb.

          emphasis added

          This on "Castle Bravo" which quotes the Soviet failure in '53. Yes, it exploded, but it wasn't a true fusion explosion:

          The Soviet Union had previously used lithium deuteride in their Sloika design (known as the "Alarm Clock" in the U.S.), in 1953. It was not a "true" hydrogen bomb; fusion provided only 15-20% of its yield, with most coming from boosted fission reactions. Its yield was limited to 400 kilotons and could not be indefinitely scaled as in a true thermonuclear device

          Are you really that dense? You flubbed one, so what? Put down the shovel and stop digging. The facts aren't on your side.

          Those who forget the lessons of history are probably watching Glenn Beck.

          by ontheleftcoast on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 03:23:28 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  10-15% of yeild was from fusion, it was a bomb. (0+ / 0-)

            A fusion bomb, i.e. a weapon/bomb deriving significant yeild from fusing hydogen, i.e. an H-bomb.  We built a better one (i.e., higher portion of yeild from fusion) later.

            BTW, u might go back and read the headlines at the time.  They certainly considered it an H-bomb.

            BTW, the insult was uncalled for.

    •  Sputnik (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Mimikatz, d to the f
       Eisenhower and Congress and the Pentagon (hardly lefty commies) sought to provide Federal monies in education in 1958, with that commie-sounding National Defense Education Act, spurred by the Soviet launch of Sputnik.

      They did so by popular demand, because people were so freaked out believing that the Soviets had surpassed us in science and math.

      Whether it was perception or reality, people in the fifties were not at all satisfied with the American educational system, or they would not have welcomed federal intervention.

      I remember.  I was an elementary school kid then.

      What the heck has Buck been smoking?  Ah, short term memory.  Or is it selective amnesia?

  •  because all the others got messed up in WWII (9+ / 0-)

    In the 1950s, we had the best schools in the world. And the United States government decided to get more involved in federal education.

    "...calling for a 5" deck gun is not parody. Not by a long shot." (gnaborretni)

    by annieli on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:50:58 PM PDT

    •  Exactly my thought. (0+ / 0-)

      He is basing this assessment on relative standards rather than absolute standards.

      Europe has certainly caught up in Education since then, and so has Japan and China.  

      What exactly is his solution?  Spend less and magically our kids get smarter?  Or perhaps bombing the rest of the world back to the Dark Ages will make us the best.  

      Sounds like he could use a critical thinking course himself.  I bet University of Colorado has a good one (oh wait, that is a publically funded University).

  •  I think he should read more history and watch (11+ / 0-)

    less Happy Days.

  •  sweet (8+ / 0-)

    let's get the tax brackets and prosperity of the 50s as well.

    think he'd be for that?

    •  91% Top Marginal Rate, Strict License Regs and (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RichM, Chico David RN, msdrown, hillgiant

      outlet ownership limits broadcast requiring demonstration of public service, double or triple today's union workforce, tariff trade system.

      Weren't we still spending on the GI Bill and Marshall plan too?

      No border fence.

      I think what he means is, women, browns and blacks going back to their proper place.

      We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

      by Gooserock on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:01:15 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Going back to the '50s... (6+ / 0-) something I'm increasingly hearing from Boomers, especially center-right Boomers.

    Not that this is anything new - American Graffiti, Happy Days, Reagan, "family values," etc, all predicated on a return to those supposed glory days of the '50s.

    I'm not part of a redneck agenda - Green Day

    by eugene on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:52:03 PM PDT

    •  The yearn for childhood is a strong human impulse (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      ...that most of us successfully ignore, thankfully.

      "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

      by grannyhelen on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:01:19 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  If the '50s were your childhood ... (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        ... you're at least 60 now. Or as the GOP would call it, "A Young Eagle."

        Seriously, when is this "The '50s were awesome" business gonna end? You have to be Social Security-age to remember them. Not that there's anything wrong with being Social Security-age, but aren't there only so many generations you can sell the recycled myth to?

        Fight until we win. Then we can begin arguing about the details. - Kwickkick (RIP) 2009

        by RickMassimo on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:31:59 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Please!!! In the '50s I learned that adults (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          either believed or wanted me to believe that crouching under a wooden desk would protect me from an atomic bomb.  

          Skepticism is the most useful thing you can teach a kid.

          Democrats work to achieve Bedford Falls. Republicans work to achieve Pottersville. It's a wonderful life.

          by Mayfly on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:39:22 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Really about Reagan (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          This was heavily pushed in the late 70's early 80's, via sappy TV & movies, and retro clothing.  So I think the Gen X conservatives are really missing the TV shows of their youth, not the crappy HS or college years of their parents.  How pathetic is that?  

          "A city for sale and doomed to speedy destruction if it finds a purchaser!" --King Jugurtha

          by LucyandByron on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 02:01:54 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Just wait. You'll get your turn., (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          Remember the 2000s?  Really great!  You could live in Arizona then, Florida was twice as big as it is now, there was snow and ice in the Arctic year round etc.  Those were the days!

          And the schools were great then, except that they forgot to teach us about global warming.

          Why does Meg Whitman want China to win the race for green tech dominance?

          by Mimikatz on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 02:53:23 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  As Russell Baker said, "We think we are (0+ / 0-)

        remembering how good things used to be, but we are really remembering how good if felt to be young."

        Democrats work to achieve Bedford Falls. Republicans work to achieve Pottersville. It's a wonderful life.

        by Mayfly on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:54:19 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I think there is a stage in the aging process (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Gooserock, grannyhelen

      where you're more prone to reminiscing about what was.  I believe that coming to terms with what has passed in the face of what is to come is a critical step in reconciling the inevitability of death.

      If government is small enough to drown in a bathtub, then it's too small to clean up the Gulf.

      by electricgrendel on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:03:35 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Well What Was, Was I Was Sail Racing Just (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        after those years in an urban middle class yacht club crewing for a public school gym teacher who had no family inheritance.

        That was my childhood.

        Today no such people can belong to that club or any other club within driving distance. The pension my ex school teacher relative just started to draw is much smaller in adjusted money than that sailor's would be when he retired in the 60's.

        Sometimes real stuff really does go down the drain.

        We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

        by Gooserock on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:22:32 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Only an Old Crow drunk brings back Jim Crow n/t (0+ / 0-)

      "...calling for a 5" deck gun is not parody. Not by a long shot." (gnaborretni)

      by annieli on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:07:41 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  I Think What You Call C-R is Rightwing in Reality (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      eugene, annieli

      The Democrats include people right of center these days.

      Having lived thru it, the major economic policies were vastly better for the nation as a whole than in the adult memory of everyone younger than boomers. Including the President. There are some specific exceptions of course like medicare. And as a result, the middle class has been stalled and in decline since the end of the 60's.

      That's so long it gives us a catastrophic loss of national memory. Anyone pointing to normal or center for any time within decades is invoking a reality that's decline.

      Obviously the opportunity for minorities was a disaster which is conveniently neglected in those reminisces. As is the very violent public struggle over them. Women's lot was crap in many ways.

      Vinyl records got scratchy and often had the holes punched off center.

      We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

      by Gooserock on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:18:13 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  We were the dominant economy in the 1950s (0+ / 0-)

        The industrial capacity of Europe and Asia were devastated during WWII, and we nwere the only standing industrial power when the war ended.  That gave us a tremendous advantage in the '50sw and'60s and up to the mid '70s.  That is a large part of why we were able to have suchn a strong middle class.  Things were also more egalitarian in terms of incomes.  There were families of great wealth then, but many of them were more public spirited then,  True, medicare was needed because so many elderly lived in poverty, and tyreatment of minorities was very bad.  And women had many fewer rights and opportuinities in the '50s than in the '40s and '60s.  

        Things began to change in the 1980s, which means that people who came of age in the '80s and after, like our President and many here, have a different memory of how things can be.

        Why does Meg Whitman want China to win the race for green tech dominance?

        by Mimikatz on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 03:08:04 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Real DFH's want 1969 (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      denise b

      Dubya was born a Boomer on the same day as my DFH cousin, and was a Yale contemporary of Garry Trudeau, who didn't think much of him then either.  Why are the bad ones called Boomers while the good ones are called DFH's?  The conservative jerks of today were the people we didn't like in school then.  In a Venn diagram, Boomers encompasses both Hippies and Conservatives.  

      My husband's posse of sixtysomethings wax nostalgic for the 60's, when they were students discovering sex, drugs and rock and roll, not the 50's when they lacked agency.  People who value freedom miss being young adults; the people who miss childhood miss lack of responsibility.

      "A city for sale and doomed to speedy destruction if it finds a purchaser!" --King Jugurtha

      by LucyandByron on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:41:47 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  & SB1070's OK without the "messy racist stuff"n/t (0+ / 0-)

    "...calling for a 5" deck gun is not parody. Not by a long shot." (gnaborretni)

    by annieli on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:53:28 PM PDT

  •  Repeat: Google "Sputnik" and "Education." (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Treg, arlene
    •  Sputnik (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      Not only did the Soviet Union beat the U.S. into space, our space program relied on German ex-pat scientists that had been recruited after WWII.  Werner von Braun led the program that put Telstar into space.  

      The U.S. was in an anti "egghead" mood similar to the anti-science mood of today's right wimg.  After Sputnik went into orbit, wags dubbed the U.S. space program "Bottlenik."

      Don't look back, something may be gaining on you. - L. "Satchel" Paige

      by arlene on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:03:43 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Ah, yes..., back when we had b/w TV and (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    no racial problems, right?  Where does this man have his head? Besides, most of the federal money that came into education in the U.S. started a couple of years or more AFTER Sputnik, which was l957 if I remember right. So it's the blessed Sixties, not the Fifties.

  •  nice to see conservatives (0+ / 0-)

    taking credit for what they've ruined in this country
    "we've screwed up all kinds of other things"

  •  The 1950's were the dark ages. (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    litho, grannyhelen, sodalis, RickMassimo

    Home ec for girls, shop for boys.  

    Gotta reinforce those gender stereotypes, and god knows all a girl really needs to know is how to can pickles and sew aprons.

    My dogs think triciawyse is smart and pretty. They think I'm a strange, frumpy woman wth limitless snacks.

    by martydd on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:56:01 PM PDT

  •  Never shoulda let them there wemun vote, much (0+ / 0-)

    less run for office.  Yeah, 'The Good Old Days.' :-(

  •  Damn, America must have been great. (10+ / 0-)

    Apparently it all went to hell right before I was born in 1960, but before that we had the best everything in the whole wide world.

    Think of all the great things that are now gone: Leaded gasoline, apartheid, cheap cigarettes you could smoke anywhere you wanted, disproportionate pay for women, lard, open garbage dumps, flammable waterways, carcinogenic food additives, lynchings, back alley abortions, and all the health care you needed just by bringing the doctor a chicken.

    The good old days.

    If they had killed in the name of the Green Bay Packers, would you fear all cheeseheads?

    by Giles Goat Boy on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:56:55 PM PDT

  •  Repeal No Child Left Behind? (0+ / 0-)

    Damn, if he had mentioned that, I might have listened to the rest of what he had to say.

    Conservatives: They love America. They hate actual Americans.

    by catwho on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:58:00 PM PDT

  •  I hate to point this out (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    grannyhelen, TexasLiz, jfromga

    but Colorado Pols's line of argument could actually serve to confirm Buck's point, rather than contradict it.

    A simple chronological reading of the history of education, showing government involvement increasing in the 1960s and really taking off in the 1980s could provide ammunition to someone who wants to say that the 1950s were an educational golden age.

    To truly address Buck's point, you need to deconstruct education in the fifties, show that it worked for some but not for all, and you also need to provide an alternative analysis for why education is considered to be in crisis today.

    •  And can we bring up the fact that what (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      litho, arlene

      amounted to "history" education in the 1950's in many schools was sort of, you know, wrong, especially in schools in the South.

      "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

      by grannyhelen on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:04:06 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Exactly (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      Not only did it not work if you were the wrong color, it didn't work if you had the wrong disability.

      My kids would likely both have been told to just stay at home, and one would have been forcibly institutionalized for having autism. Which was, at the time, thought to be caused by cold parenting.  

      No, I'm much happier where I am, even if I do hate NCLB with a burning passion.

  •  I'm pretty sure tying insurance to employment (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    d to the f, arlene

    during the WWII period and failing to follow the European example in setting up socialized health care after World War II is pretty much what screwed up health care.  But you know.  It's a Republican.  Facts and logic and sensibility really are option.

    If government is small enough to drown in a bathtub, then it's too small to clean up the Gulf.

    by electricgrendel on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:58:36 PM PDT

  •  Give us (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    shpilk, catwho

    the tax base we had in the 50's and it will be less of a problem to keep our schools properly funded.  And give our teachers as much respect as they had then.

    These [EXPLETIVE DELETED] want the results without the effort and investment.

    My life is an open book, and I want a rewrite!

    by trumpeter on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 12:58:52 PM PDT

  •  The irony is that Obama is killing teachers union (0+ / 0-)
  •  Brown v. Board of Education: they hate it. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    I think that's probably what he doesn't like.

    Because schools weren't better.
    Though upon graduation students had a better chance for 2 reasons.

    1.  There wasn't as much foreign competition.
    1.  Greedy CEOs hadn't shipped many of the best jobs to those foreign countries.

    I play 11-dimensional Smess.

    by Menocchio on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:01:28 PM PDT

  •  I rotflmao from your title (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Thinking Fella

    considering I had my cherry popped and had my greatest athletic time in the 50s, I wouldn't mind going back to the 50s, neither would most men my age. I loved the music more in those days, life was a helluva lot simpler back then, I didn't watch anywhere near the amount of TV that I do now (which is not a healthy thing to do). I know the point you were trying to make, however, even liberals had a better life because we didn't give a shit that much about politics as we do today. In other words, we had less to make us pissed off at all the time. More than that, we didn't have Glenn Beck or Sarah Palin fatigue, although Joe McCarthy pissed me off. Hey, we had the Checkers speech in the 50s. I loved that one. Show me anything today that compares to a VEEP getting on national TV and defending his dog and his wife's coat.

    Solitude is painful when one is young, but delightful when one is more mature...Einstein

    by tazz on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:03:55 PM PDT

  •  I'm with Ken Buck! (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    greendem, shpilk
    By all means, let's bring back the fifties.

    We can start with the 90% top tax rate on the very wealthy.  

    When you punch enough holes through steerage, the first-class cabins sink with the rest of the ship.

    by Roddy McCorley on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:03:56 PM PDT

  •  "...women, minorities, and seniors don't really (0+ / 0-)

    have a part in Ken Buck's world." Nor do teabaggers apparently...

    Solidarity Now. (We can continue this fight later). See you in Washington 10-02-10.

    by reddbierd on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:04:15 PM PDT

  •  1955 was 55 years ago-- more than (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    grannyhelen, dochackenbush

    half a century ago.  Even so, we have higher percentages going to college now than we ever had, and higher percentages getting graduate degrees.  There's just not as great a gap between American education and foreign education as there was then.

    Who is to say that suburbanization, dependency on cars, de-emphasis on public transportation, and the so-called "Reagan Revolution" weren't the cause of what he perceives as a decline in secondary education?

    "Just because I'm skinny doesn't mean I'm not tough" --Barack Obama, Oct. 26, 2009

    by Pangloss on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:04:24 PM PDT

    •  Back before the meritocracy (0+ / 0-)

      Back when no white students had to compete with brilliant brown kids, like Obama.

      "One man alone can be pretty dumb sometimes, but for real bona fide stupidity nothing beats teamwork." - Mark Twain

      by greendem on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:15:48 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  wow (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    grannyhelen, annieli, croyal

    What an ass.
    In the 50's my schools, The Edwood Independant School district  in the west side of San Antonio were so bad they were mentioned in Jonothon Kozol's book Savage Inequalities.

    And later the funding of Texas schools was decalred unconsitutional.

    Rodriquez v.s. San Antonio ISD

    The panel held the Texas school-finance system unconstitutional under the "equal protection" clause of the Fourteenth Amendment. The state appealed, and the case went to the United States Supreme Court as San Antonio Independent School District v. Rodríguez.

    On March 21, 1973, the Supreme Court ruled five to four against Rodríguez, stating that the system of school finance did not violate the federal constitution and that the issue should be resolved by the state of Texas. It also held that the state would not be required to subsidize poorer school districts. This ruling in effect produced additional legal barriers to equalization. The court denied a rehearing on April 23, 1973. Justice Thurgood Marshall, however, called the decision "a retreat from our historic commitment to equality of educational opportunity."

    Edgewood v.s. Kirby

    The court accepted the MALDEF petition and heard the Edgewood case in Austin between January 20 and April 8, 1987, with state district judge Harley Clark presiding. On April 29, 1987, Clark ruled in favor of the plaintiffs. He found that the state's public school financing structure was unconstitutional and ordered the legislature to formulate a more equitable one by September 1989.

    So of course everything was solved...... at 1:31:20

    by TexMex on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:04:30 PM PDT

  •  I think I got (0+ / 0-)

    a better education than I would have today but who knows.   I certainly wouldn't trade segregated schools, etc, to go back to the 1950's however.  But teachers I know complain bitterly they can only teach to the test, that basic learning is being neglected and administration has taken over the process and classroom teachers are ignored.  I don't know how true it is.

    But clearly the guy's an idiot, how many people really think Medicare has messed up health care?  Or is he saying the HIR bill will ruin Medicare?

    •  Are you crazy??? My son and daughter (0+ / 0-)

      go to Cherry Creek HS in Englewood Co and I can tell you, that they are getting an outstanding education.  Far and away above what I got in high school.  I went to Carmel HS in Carmel Indiana which was one of the best in the state, and my kids are far mare intelligent at their age than I was when I was 17 or 18.

      No question

  •  Can wee tax the rich like in the 50's? n/t (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    greendem, JML9999

    New improved bipartisanship! Now comes in a convenient suppository!!! -unbozo

    by Unbozo on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:08:31 PM PDT

  •  remove "astronaut" from the dictionary! (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JML9999, annieli

    Things were better then!  

    "Glenn Beck ends up looking like a fat, stupid child. His face should be wearing a chef's hat on the side of a box of eclairs. " - Doug Stanhope

    by Front Toward Enemy on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:08:43 PM PDT

  •  racist Tea Party scum (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Buck knows his audience, and he knows that for them invoking the 50s conjures up fond, pre-desegregation memories.

    workers of the world, unite
    -8.75, -7.03

    by Chimes of Freedom on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:09:07 PM PDT

  •  Sounds like Haley Barbour's revisionist history (0+ / 0-)

    New Gooper meme maybe

    We Destroyed this Village in order to save it from the Viet Cong er um Taliban

    by JML9999 on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:12:27 PM PDT

  •  NPR interviewed a white baptist preacher (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    grannyhelen, angry marmot
    at Beckstock.

    He said America started losing its "Honor" in the 1960s. He pointed directly at the "sexual revolution" as the core problem that needed to be reversed.

    He claimed that free love and welfare led to an epidemic of "out-of-wedlock" births.

    "One man alone can be pretty dumb sometimes, but for real bona fide stupidity nothing beats teamwork." - Mark Twain

    by greendem on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:13:33 PM PDT

    •  "free love" was a hot topic in the 1870's (0+ / 0-)

      ...I think he's a little off on his dates ;-)

      "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

      by grannyhelen on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:24:08 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Very fat "early" babies were very common (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      arlene, nicethugbert

      in the 1950's, too. You know, born 7 months after the wedding.

      I actually know an older person who has 2 birthdays - the real one on the birth certificate, and another one 4 months later that they created and celebrated to cover up the pre-wedlock conception date.

      Then there are all those kids whose "mother" turned out to be their be theri grandmother, because their real mothers were their 16 year-old "sisters"...

      I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. - Major General Smedley D. Butler, USMC

      by Marinesquire on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:45:08 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Love to go back to the economics of the 50s (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Byblis, nicethugbert, croyal

    With high union membership and a 91% top marginal tax rate.  Keep the social progress of the last 50 years and let's take the economics back to the good old days.  I also don't remember anybody even asking Eisenhower what church he went to back then.  

    "I was asked what I thought of the mainstream media. I said I thought it would be a good idea" - Amy Goodman.

    by Chico David RN on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:13:50 PM PDT

  •  LOL, this is priceless. (0+ / 0-)

    Cold hearted orb/That rules the night/Removes the colours From our sight/Red is gray and/Yellow white/But we decide/Which is right/And/Which is an Illusion

    by KingofSpades on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:14:51 PM PDT

  •  WIth 1950s tax brackets? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Let's talk.

    "Be just and good." John Adams to Thomas Jefferson

    by ogre on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:16:28 PM PDT

  •  Oooh. Does that mean I'll have a chance with (0+ / 0-)

    Christina Hendricks?

    I could go for some 50s action if I got to be with her!

    I'm gonna go eat a steak. And fuck my wife. And pray to GOD - hatemailapalooza, 052210

    by punditician on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:16:38 PM PDT

  •  What about the Parents? (0+ / 0-)

    The 50's?  I'm not research sure, but I'd bet that most middle class families had one working parent, and that parent's income was enough to 'get by' or even 'do ok'.  Now the idea of only one of the pair working is reserved for the upper class. Even then they have to resist the corporate BUYBUYBUY!! influences.  
     My point is having a parent who is concerned and focused on their child's education is more of a reason why the 50's education was 'better' than it is now.
    But, they (politicians) say these things because the Sheep are out numbers!

  •  Yes we need more "see Dick Run " books (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Inspector Javert

    teachers actually use real literature today. When I was in school, (60's) only the smartest kids in sixth grade learned algerbra. today my wife as a 5th grader teacher is expected to teach all of her kids algerbra. even those with limited english skills.

    It is impossible to introduce into society a greater evil than this: the conversion of the law into an instrument of plunder." Frederic Bastiat

    by california keefer on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:21:30 PM PDT

  •  Buck is a racist. (0+ / 0-)

    No one other than a racist would argue that our schools are not better today than they were in the 1950's. They can spew all of the test scores and "competitiveness" issue in terms of maths and sciences, but the fact is that today we have diversity, the value of which is immeasureable. If given the choice between "leading" in academic "achievement" as measured by some test scores or achievement in maths and sciences vs. leading in diversity, it is clear that the latter is preferable. Because while test scores and preparedness in terms of maths and sciences are short term values, the value of diversity is everlasting and is too important to even try to measure.

  •  Why were schools so good? Underutilized women! (5+ / 0-)

    In the 1950's, public schools were full of women who had the brains and ability to be college professors, CEO's, lawyers, scientists, etc.  But very few opportunities existed for educated women, so a lot of them became teachers.  Now women have a lot more choices.

    The Catholic schools were staffed with nuns, women who were not only smart and talented, but viewed teaching as a religious obligation--and didn't have to be paid!

    Schools didn't have to accept poor minority kids, or kids with disabilities, which certainly made their job easier (though it didn't do much for the kids who were left out, and it denied the kids who did attend exposure to the kind of diversity which makes ours such an interesting and creative society).  There were far more stay at home moms to help with their kids' educations.

    So Buck should realize that the 1950's aren't coming back, and in most ways that's a good thing.

    •  btfjd, you are absolutely right! I remember an (0+ / 0-)

      "ah-ha moment" when I was reading a British detective novel.  The Scotland Yard detective doing the actual work on the case was intelligent and from the lower class.  His immediate superior was not so smart, but had family connections.

      "Ah-ha" says I.  The class system is not fair, but one result of it is that you often get very clever people in mid-level positions where they can do a lot of good.  I thought of the female secretaries that I knew of who were actually propping up their male bosses.

      This doesn't say I'm in favor of class distinctions, gender, income, social, or whatever.  Just that when the cream always rises to the top, sometimes important lower levels are left with less than the best people.

      Democrats work to achieve Bedford Falls. Republicans work to achieve Pottersville. It's a wonderful life.

      by Mayfly on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:48:12 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Not to mention all those stay at home mothers (0+ / 0-)

      who could volunteer for the PTA, and make sure the little darlings did their homework.

      "My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die."

      by davewill on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 02:08:46 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Medicare is a screw up (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    That's the real money quote from this piece--calling Medicare a screw up, not so much the pining for the 1950s, which probably a lot of Americans view (wrongly) as an idyllic time in this country's history.

    I am so frustrated with the Democrats--it seems as though EVERY Republican running for office is campaigning against Medicare and Social Security--why can't we gain any traction with these issues?  These programs have nearly universal support and the people that support them the most are also the people who turn out to vote.

    Turns out that talking about abstinence is a lot easier than practicing it.

    by kayebee on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:35:28 PM PDT

  •  Anyone have a hot tub time machine? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Buck, Paul, Angle need to take a trip to the 50's.
    Don't come back.

  •  alright (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    if they want to go back to the 1950's

    how about a top marginal tax rate of 90 percent?

    The greatest trick the devil every pulled was convincing half of America the GOP gives a damn about them

    by blingbling65 on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:40:59 PM PDT

  •  I went to school in the 1950s. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    If schools were better then, from my experience it was because:

    Kids were better taken care of by parents who were better at parenting and who had enough work/life balance  than is possible nowadays. . . . .time...and money.

    Teachers were better educated, better trained and more respected. Women who would be able, after the Women's Liberation Movement successes, to enter other professions often became school teachers.

    People didn't 'zone out' on TV. I belong to the last generation that was educated by people who did NOT grow up with TV.

    As for the Federal government....after Sputnik, the Feds put lots of money into science education. My school got some neat equipment.

    Media Reform Action Link

    by LNK on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:45:46 PM PDT

  •  Maybe the rest of the world caught up to us?..... (0+ / 0-)

    Oh, noes we can't have that!  Amerca must always be the best country club!  You can let those people in!

  •  One little point about ACTUAL schools in the 50's (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LucyandByron, arlene

    As an Army brat, I came back to US schools in 1959 after attending French schools for a while (we were the only Americans in the village we lived in, so when my friends went to school - so did I!).

    In the US, I would be entering 1st grade (@6 yrs old), but in France I had already been attending local schools appropriate for my age for 2 years. (There was an earlier grade, but it was basically a nursery school.)

    While my schoolmates were just learning their "ABC's" and basic "1+1=2", I had already been exposed to cursive writing, multiplication and long division as well as fairly complex history instruction (really - still have the book!).  I had been taught to read phonetically (which turned out to be the PERFECT for my somewhat dyslexic brain) and taught myself to read English since that's what we spoke at home.  They wouldn't "advance place" because it would "stunt my social development" - so I read quietly in the back of the room - left alone as long as I got good grades ... and stayed years ahead of my classmates with little effort all through high school.

    Remember - this was over 50 years ago and only the head start the first few years of French education gave me.  I doubt very seriously if US schools have improved much wrt European schools in that time - and, coupled with the provincial mindset of most Americans ("American Exceptionalism?") makes this guy's assertions laughably embarrassing.  I get really tired of having to explain American behaviour to European friends.  

    It's one thing to speak from isolation and ignorance, but this deliberate anti-science, anti-intellectual trend being exploited and encouraged by cynical right-wingers is getting scary.

    "Curiouser and curiouser..."

    by TechBob on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 01:57:01 PM PDT

  •  1950s.Please follow up..... (0+ / 0-)

    I'm sorry not to be able to give you quick talking points but I'm disabled and have to lie down.

    PLEASE BRING UP WAGES the moment anybody mentions the 1950s.

    In the 1950s workers were paid enough to support a middle class family on one income. Home, car, college, vacations. Many things that even two-wage earners can't provide.

    Executives compensation was more reasonable in the 1950s.

    Raw data:

    Bureau of Labor Statistics:

    Media Reform Action Link

    by LNK on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 02:01:27 PM PDT

  •  Remember Sputnik? (0+ / 0-)

    Obviously, his memory of the 1950s was different from mine (I was in high school then). In 1957, when the USSR launched the first satellite in space, Sputnik, Americans were shocked to realize how far behind our educational establishment was compared to the Russians. Suddenly the federal government poured huge amounts of money into education and science, creating NASA and the National Defense Education Administration. If the federal government had not intervened, we could easily have seen the end of the US as we know it. The Communists would have had technical superiority and we would have been toast.

    So much for the good ole days. I get rather bitter when I see these historical revisionists who just make stuff up and expect us to believe them.

  •  imho, it was states, not the Fed, (0+ / 0-)

    that abandoned their commitment to equality and education.  The "Republican Education Blame Game" has really exceeded the reality test shelf life.

    Arizona, Texas, and New Mexico join Mississippi and Kentucky, as leaders in failing to encourage students to achieve an education level above 9th grade.

    Published July 21, 2010 by:
    J.C. Grant

    According to U.S. Census estimates, only seven U.S. states have high school graduation rates above 90%: Minnesota, Wyoming, Alaska, Montana, New Hampshire, Utah and Vermont. The percentage of United States residents  who have earned a high school diploma is 84.5%.

    There are fifteen states with above average high school and college graduation rates: Colorado, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Kansas, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Hampshire, New Jersey, Oregon, Utah, Virginia and Washington. The percentage of United States residents who have earned a Bachelor's degree is 27.4%.

    Another fifteen states have below average high school and college graduation rates: Alabama, Arizona, Arkansas, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Nevada, New Mexico, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas and West Virginia.

    Three states have above average college graduation rates, but below average high school graduation rates: California, New York and Rhode Island. This educational inequality is particularly pronounced in California which ranks fourteenth for college graduation rates, but forty-eighth for high school graduation rates. Similarly, New York ranks ninth for college graduation rates, but thirty-fourth for high school graduation rates. And, Rhode Island, which ranks twelfth for college graduation rates, ranks thirty-eighth for high school graduation rates.

    The border states of California, Texas, New Mexico and Arizona join Kentucky and Mississippi for holding the dubious distinction of having the largest percentage of residents who have failed to complete the ninth grade. More than ten percent of California residents have less than a ninth grade education.

  •  I hope Michael Bennet's watching this vid. (0+ / 0-)

    Seeing that Senator Bennet has a strong education background, this is his opportunity to tear Ken Buck to shreds...

    I agree with you. I want to do it. Now make me do it! - Franklin Delano Roosevelt

    by meldroc on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 02:15:50 PM PDT

  •  I would also like to return to the 50's (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    I would love to see labor unions providing strong and able American workers to rocket our economy to be the envy of the world.  I would love to lead the world in productivity, ingenuity, inventiveness, life expectancy, education, manufacturing, literacy, popular culture, communications and militarily.  We had all of that in the fifties because FDR was wise enough and strong enough to impose a truly progressive taxation system.a d reward productivity rather than speculation.  We were the envy of the world a d justifiably so.  We rocked.  And it was because of wise liberal policies that the United States of America reached the zenith of its cultural and political powers.  And then motherfuckin Reagan came along and turned this country into a banana Republic.  God damn him forever.  He ruined the greatest nation on earth.

    ObamaCare because Obama Cares. Next time you're hospitalized you can thank him. Just remember he delivered it for you.

    by Atilla the Honey Bunny on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 02:17:00 PM PDT

    •  Ronnie Ray-gun had help.... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Atilla the Honey Bunny

      ....from Nixon and LBJ in ruining this once-great nation.

      Ya know the really sad, ironic thing about the state of our national political scene today is that Dwight David Eisenhower, and even Richard Milhous Nixon, would not be welcome in today's Republican Party.  In fact, I'm not sure that Ray-gun would be welcome!

      On the other hand, Hitler might receive the red carpet treatment from the GOP.......


  •  Tax rates were 90% in the 50's (0+ / 0-)

    70% in the 60's.

    If they want to go back to the 50's, I say make them pay for it.

  •  The '50's? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    B.C. or A.D.??  Inquiring minds want to know!!!!!!!


  •  Some things were better then (0+ / 0-)

    Lots of things have changed for the better and lots for the worse. I know there is no going back, but if I knew how to bring some things back, I would.

    Great teachers (because brilliant women had so many fewer opportunities. Less anxiety. Less noise. Leisurely Sunday drives in the country. Mostly local business, not too many national chains. Good customer service. Regional language and food. Tastier food. Much less stuff, but better quality. Neighborhood theaters and second-run theaters. More time for friends and family. Hobbies.

    Republicans can't bring these things back any more than Democrats can. History has marched on. But there's nothing wrong with the fact that we mourn what we have lost. The losses as well as the gains were very real.

    The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. --Bertrand Russell

    by denise b on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 02:57:52 PM PDT

  •  DEMOCRATS AREN'T PERFECT..... (0+ / 0-)

    BUT AT LEAST THEY'RE NOT CRAZY...:-)...That should be the main idea going into November.....The difference between now and 1994 is that the GOP really has no credible leaders this time around....They do have some with charisma, but they are following on the heels of GW Bush rather than Ronald Reagan....Rand Paul, Sharron Angle, Jan Brewer, Ken Buck, Michelle Bachmann, Sarah Palin, and Glenn Beck are either borderline lunatics or should be way are Americans going to put John Boehner and Mitch McConnell back in to least Newt Gingrich had some credibility to go along with his least before he violated House ethics rules and cheated on his sick wife....The GOP hopefuls now have no credibility, no ideas, and no sanity....The Dems are going to create history and hold the House and Senate...:-)

  •  AWESOME! (0+ / 0-)

    Hula hoops! Cars with really big fins! Sock Hops!

    A 91% top tax bracket!


    by shpilk on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 03:40:51 PM PDT

  •  Buck Doesn't Know His History (0+ / 0-)
    I believe the first major federal student grant/loan program was the National Defense Education Act (NDEA), which was enacted by Congress in about 1960.  Why?  Because the Russians had successfully orbited the first satellite, and the outcry was that American education, especially colleges, weren't doing a good enough job.  Hence, Congress passed the NDEA, which subsequently made it financially possible for thousands and thousands of students to attend college through grants and loans.  Those work of those college graduates helped to produce the productivity and prosperity of the ensuing three and one-half decades.

    So, Mr. Buck, American education was not at its best in the 1950's, or if it was, it was not good enough to keep up with the Russians.

  •  Top tax rate was 90% in the 1950s... (0+ / 0-)

    Fry, don't be a hero! It's not covered by our health plan!

    by elfling on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 04:04:06 PM PDT

  •  I think that's because the rest of the world... (0+ / 0-)

    ...lay in ruins.  Oh, and you didn't need a college education to be successful in this country.

    The most impressive thing about man [...] is the fact that he has invented the concept of that which does not exist--Glenn Gould

    by Rich in PA on Fri Sep 03, 2010 at 04:15:39 PM PDT

  •  in the 1950s we had apartheid... (0+ / 0-)

    This man is an idiot.

    We had some very good schools in urban areas, but at the same time in rural areas were the worst.

    And not to mention the disparities between education for the whites vs. for those people of color.

    Hmph. This man IS an idiot in the face of the facts.

    Ugh. --UB.

  •  Tax rates in the 1950's (0+ / 0-)

    Were 91% for any income over $400,000.

    Anybody want to ask him about going back to that?

    OTOH, civil rights, women's rights, voting rights, equality of education, of housing, of healthcare, all bad according to this guy.  

    Our messaging sucks if we can't open any eyes about this kind of thing.

    If you are true, but not in the same truth with me, cleave to your companions; I will seek my own. --Ralph Waldo Emerson

    by sopranospinner on Sat Sep 04, 2010 at 09:27:51 AM PDT

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