Skip to main content

There have been so many great diaries these past few days, and I for one, appreciate all of them.  This is in fact a pivotal time for our nation, and I believe President Obama has shown great skill, courage and guts in these dark times.  

I don't even pay attention (nor do I ever) to what the Republicans are saying, but I do know this:

We have now come to yet another moment, when we can either forge our financial resources back to the exhausted and weary people of this nation, including our troops, or we can continue down the same path that has proven a disaster.  

Today, I was watching as a spokesperson who lost a loved on on 9/11 was taking about the word: 'Closure.'  She said, that was the wrong word, and it struck me as so true, because when someone you love dies (especially in wars, and they can die in many ways, not just physically but emotionally, mentally and spiritually) sometimes when that final cost comes down, there is no closure.  

The cost is too dear, and it lasts a lifetime.  I happen to believe that when someone you loves dies, especially in your family, it takes a tiny piece of your heart every single time.  

I believe we can honor the dead through memory, and love, and our actions and our deeds, especially because for the past ten years, we have paid so dearly and in so many ways, especially in the 'reactionary politics.'  

We can thank the war criminals for that:  George W. Bush and Dick Cheney.  We can also thank George W. Bush for destroying our national economy, by undermining every single law he could to protect the same 'war criminals' (just a different kind) on Wall Street.  

We have now gotten, what I would call the 'double whammy'...the shock doctrine that has completely done in our nation.  

My dad, a 30 year military man, was very old school.  He was very quiet about what he had been through, and rarely if ever talked about it.  I knew that he had spent a year a half in Stalag 11 during WWII, and I also knew, that night after night he screamed in his sleep.  Three of my own brother suffered deeply from the Vietnam war, and so it goes, that our mistakes, are an opportunity to honor our dead, but to also remember that to glorify war, is and never will be the answer.  

My dad used to tell my six brothers:  the truth worth of a man, is to have the courage to walk away from a fight, and to leave the fools alone.  He also used to say, that real hero's of WWII were buried upon the battle grounds they fought on, in Europe.  In 1968 when he retired, he hated Vietnam, and grew a beard, and even smoked a few fatties with his 'pacifists children,' such as me, his daughter.  LOL.

Today, and yesterday, I was not exactly full of 'blood lust' or whatever, I was fully exhausted after 10 years of the total 'double whammy.'  

Americans are weary, we are just so damn weary of it all, and honest to god, I do not at all envy President Obama, to what is now in front of him.  But you know what?  We have a damn right to be weary.  

But if there was ever a time, when he had more of a new political mandate or capital than this (other when he got elected in a landslide) this is the time.  

Understand, this:  I am not trying to rush away the celebration, or all that.  This is an amazing time in our nation.  

What I keep hearing in my own heart and soul is 'Carpe diem,' seize the day, Mr. President: make it now, and show your true heart as a Democrat in our nation.

This President, has truly show great skill and patience and courage, and I have to say with all my heart:

Sir, my hat is off to you, so let us go forward and show thrice or even ten times the courage and truly, 'Win the future,'  because if you can do that Mr. President, then I believe you may go down as one of the greatest President's in the history of this nation.  

Now you may not believe that is the way I feel, but I do.  I honestly do.  I so want President Obama to succeed, and I want our nation to dig ourselves out of this fucking black hole that George W. Bush left us in, but the first step is this:

We have had real and meaningful accountability for the first time in a long time, but let's not waste that moment.  Let's turn it into an amazing new momentum for our own party platform.  Shall we?  Can we gather this moment in history and repair our own fragmented party and nation?  Yes we can, if we push President Obama now to truly understand, this is his moment and his time to turn our nation around.  Take the damn dice and throw them, and President Obama CAN  show real courage, and lead us all back to our party platform.  God bless you if you can.  Don't let us down now when we need you most, President Obama.  

Let us begin to truly understand this fact, and btw I would appreciate any help that any wonderful, fabulous nerds on this site (and I know who you are) to try to figure out how much money we as a nation have given Pakistan (and other nations: Iraq and Afganistan for bribes and Nation Building over the past 10 years?)  And this is not the fucking costs of business, this is feeding the MIC people: Wake up!!!!!

The big question on the news today is this:

How in the fuck could the Pakistan government not know (with the West Point of the entire nation there being less than a mile from the huge Compound that was built specifically for this mass murderer, bin laden, in 2005, none the less) not know what was going on?

Not only did they know, they 'played us' all the way.  This reminds me of how the exact same bullshit war profiteers stole (via Dick Cheney and Bush, and Black Water, and Halliburton and the rest) from Iraq:

Nearly $9 billion of money spent on Iraqi reconstruction is unaccounted for because of inefficiencies and bad management, according to a watchdog report published Sunday.

An inspector general's report said the U.S.-led administration that ran Iraq until June 2004 is unable to account for the funds.

"Severe inefficiencies and poor management" by the Coalition Provisional Authority has left auditors with no guarantee the money was properly used," the report said.

http://articles.cnn.com/...

I'm just wondering now exactly how much money between the $9 billion dollars that was stolen from us, and all the fucking money spent on so called "nation building' in Pakistan and the bribes and all that other crap has cost us.  Here is clue:

According to a March 29, 2011 Congressional Research Service report, Congress has approved a total of $1.283 trillion for “military operations, base security, reconstruction, foreign aid, embassy costs, and veterans’ health care for the three operations initiated since the 9/11 attacks.” Those three operations include Operation Enduring Freedom (OEF) Afghanistan; Operation Noble Eagle (ONE), providing enhanced security at military bases; and Operation Iraqi Freedom (OIF).

Broken down individually, the government has spent $806 billion for Iraq, $444 billion for Afghanistan, $29 billion for enhanced security and $6 billion on “unallocated” items. The vast majority of all the money appropriated has gone to the Department of Defense, and of that money more and more is being spent on Operation & Maintenance (O&M) funding, which went from $42 billion in FY2004 to $79 billion in FY2008. Only $67 billion (or 5 percent) went to the State Department or USAID. Only $8 billion (or 1 percent) went to veterans' care, via the Department of Veterans Affairs.

Because U.S. troop presence will remain at relatively high levels in Afghanistan and, to a lesser extent, Iraq in the years ahead -- and because veteran health-care needs will likely only get worse -- the price will continue to rise. If Congress also approves the president’s FY2012 war-funding request, the cumulative cost of post-9/11 operations would reach $1.415 trillion. The Congressional Budget Office -- the nonpartisan accountant for lawmakers -- estimates that over the next ten years, total costs “could reach $1.8 trillion by FY2021.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

And then of course there is this:

Delusions of Debt

The bill that has been rung up is in the form of a national debt that has increased by $4.6 trillion since September 2008, a 48% increase in two and a half years. Over this same time frame real GDP has increased by $200 billion, a 1.6% increase in two and a half years. Over this same period, the Federal Reserve has tripled their balance sheet by adding $2 trillion of debt. Think about this for one second. The leaders of the great American empire have burdened future generations with $6.6 trillion of new debt and increased the Gross Domestic Product by $200 billion. Is this a good return on investment? Did the 30 million unemployed and underemployed Americans benefit? Did the 45 million people on food stamps benefit? Did the 11 million households who are underwater in their mortgage benefit? Did the 3 million people who lost their homes in foreclosure since 2008 benefit? Are Americans paying twice as much for groceries and gasoline benefitting? Did the Tunisians, Egyptians, and other poor people around the world benefit?

The answer to all these questions is NO. The only beneficiaries have been bankers, billionaires, mega-corporations and the politicians who were bought off by these greedy traitors to the Republic. Anyone with an ounce of sense knows the country got into this mess due to the issuance of mountains of debt that was un-payable based upon any reasonable assessment of future cash flows to service the debt. Consumers could never have increased their wages enough to pay off the credit card, mortgage, home equity, student loan, and auto debt they accumulated since 1980. The government could never collect the amount of taxes needed to pay for the $100 trillion of entitlement promises they have made over the last four decades. By 2008 we had reached peak debt delusion.    would bear the brunt of the default. The Federal Reserve Chairman and the U.S. Treasury Secretary rolled out a master plan that revolved around convincing the masses they were being saved, while actually enriching their masters on Wall Street. Their PR machine and captured mouthpieces throughout the mainstream media and in Co.  The only questions that remained were how would the debt be defaulted on and whongress spun the fear mongering message of Depression if the mega-banks were not handed trillions of taxpayer funds.

The only questions that remained were how would the debt be defaulted on and who would bear the brunt of the default. The Federal Reserve Chairman and the U.S. Treasury Secretary rolled out a master plan that revolved around convincing the masses they were being saved, while actually enriching their masters on Wall Street. Their PR machine and captured mouthpieces throughout the mainstream media and in Congress spun the fear mongering message of Depression if the mega-banks were not handed trillions of taxpayer funds.  The proof of what did not happen is borne out in the chart below, showing the total credit market debt in the U.S.at $52.6 trillion, $200 billion higher than it was in 2008. If those who had collected billions in fraudulent profits while using unprecedented levels of debt were rightfully required to take responsibility for the catastrophe they caused, the debt levels would have dropped dramatically. The losses would have been borne by those responsible. The economy would have taken a body blow, all Americans would have been hurt, and many billionaires would have become millionaires or even paupers. The debt would have been written off and lessons would have been learned. The remaining banks (there are 8,000 others besides the 10 who control 50% of the deposits) would have followed traditional risk mitigation methods and the economy would have recovered.

http://www.theburningplatform.com/...

I keep thinking of just how much 'we,' are Americans have paid in the bribes, and Nation building, and war profiteerers, and I keep asking myself this singular question:

If President Obama did have the 'guts' and courage to start bringing our troops home from Afganistan, what jobs would those troops have at home?

And that, my friends is the rub.  There are NO JOBS IN AMERICA FOR ANY AMERICANS.

It truly bothered today, (although I understood why she was doing it) to hear Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton tell us all now,  that it was time for us all to:

Double down on our efforts to completely destroy all the terrorists and al-Qaeda.

I understand the back lash from what is going on, but when do we stop this insane nation building and feeding our borrowed money from China to the wealthiest of this nation, in form of the Bush tax cuts, to pay off the crooks and liars, and to pay off more of the same?  More wars, more feeding of the Oligarchy, more feeding of our failed two party system, that is draining the Middle Class to the bone?  

So here is the deal:  

If President Obama froze the wages of Federal workers, and the Republican Governors are going to knowingly destroying our Unions, and cut Teachers, Police and Fire Fighters, (those on the front line that were honored today on this great day of celebration,) then don't you think President Obama can just stop and freeze:

1.  Any more funds for so called Nation Building in other countries,  when our own nation needs it desperately?

2.  Create a real jobs program, now that he has as much politcal capital than he ever did, in fact a new madate?  (Now bigger than when he was actually elected?)

3.  Bring our Troops home, Mr. President and honor them with a new jobs program. Take care of them for the 10 fucking years they have shown as a so called,  volunteer Army?  (The only real employment opportunity left in our country?)  How many tours of duty did these men and women do?)  How long and at what cost emotionally and physically and spiritually will they suffer?  Let me tell you how much: forever.  And who got rich off of it, is the real question, isn't it?

As I stated earlier, I do not envy President Obama and what he was given to him on his plate, but at the same time, I just want to give our own nation, a great big fucking hug.  We deserve it.  

Now is President Obama's Carpe diem moment.  Now is the time.  

I'm not even going to go into the 'financial fiasco' that Bernanke and Geithner have led us to, because I believe, in this:

I believe that at this moment in history, like other moments in our history, when a President is called to his destiny, then he/she either hears that calling or they do not.  It is a strange moment, and it is calling to their souls that only they can hear.  

You might find that a bit too esoteric for your liking, but then I believe in miracles.  I believe in great leaders, that are called to destiny, whereupon, they dig down deep in their souls and fight the 'better part of their angels' and do the right things.  

All I can hope for is the very best of this nation, because I refuse to give up on all of you, or President Obama.  

This is our moment, this is his moment, and this is 'his time.'

I just hope, that he will not squander it, and rise to his own destiny and greatness that is simply waiting for him to grab it.

Let us remember now how to 'rise:'

Still I Rise:

You may write me down in history
With your bitter, twisted lies,
You may trod me in the very dirt
But still, like dust, I'll rise.

Does my sassiness upset you?
Why are you beset with gloom?
'Cause I walk like I've got oil wells
Pumping in my living room.

Just like moons and like suns,
With the certainty of tides,
Just like hopes springing high,
Still I'll rise.

Did you want to see me broken?
Bowed head and lowered eyes?
Shoulders falling down like teardrops.
Weakened by my soulful cries.

Does my haughtiness offend you?
Don't you take it awful hard
'Cause I laugh like I've got gold mines
Diggin' in my own back yard.

You may shoot me with your words,
You may cut me with your eyes,
You may kill me with your hatefulness,
But still, like air, I'll rise.

Does my sexiness upset you?
Does it come as a surprise
That I dance like I've got diamonds
At the meeting of my thighs?

Out of the huts of history's shame
I rise
Up from a past that's rooted in pain
I rise
I'm a black ocean, leaping and wide,
Welling and swelling I bear in the tide.
Leaving behind nights of terror and fear
I rise
Into a daybreak that's wondrously clear
I rise
Bringing the gifts that my ancestors gave,
I am the dream and the hope of the slave.
I rise
I rise
I rise.

Create Date     :      Friday, January 03, 2003

Maya Angelou

Just wanted to end this diary, by begging President Obama, to 'Rise Up' to his own destiny and his own call.  The American people are so weary and tired, and now you have a great, great moment in history.

It is all up to you.  

I applaud you for your patience, courage, guts and so much.  Now, we move forward, or not, to 'Win the Future.'  If you do this, President Obama, I will follow you all the way, just show us the way, is all we are asking.

Carpe diem, (seize the day) President Obama.  Put those asshole Republican Governors down when they belong, in the devils hole and stand up for the Unions and jobs in our nation.  

Never in this history of our nation, (not since Teddy Kennedy handed over the tourch to President Obama) did our party have more strength or mojo.  

The thing I always loved about my own party (the Democratic Party) was our diversity, all colors, all creeds, all sexual preferences, all about freedom and light and love and moving forward.  The greatest melting pot there ever was.  That is 'American' as it should be.  That is the greatest thing about our nation, we are in fact the greatest melting pot there ever was.  

I am so full of hope and love for my President and this nation tonight.  

Thank you for letting me share my feeling with all of you.  Let us all move on, and hope for a better day in our nation.

Carry on Democrats.  

Ms. B.

 

Originally posted to Badabing on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:09 PM PDT.

Also republished by Frustrati and The Amateur Left.

EMAIL TO A FRIEND X
Your Email has been sent.
You must add at least one tag to this diary before publishing it.

Add keywords that describe this diary. Separate multiple keywords with commas.
Tagging tips - Search For Tags - Browse For Tags

?

More Tagging tips:

A tag is a way to search for this diary. If someone is searching for "Barack Obama," is this a diary they'd be trying to find?

Use a person's full name, without any title. Senator Obama may become President Obama, and Michelle Obama might run for office.

If your diary covers an election or elected official, use election tags, which are generally the state abbreviation followed by the office. CA-01 is the first district House seat. CA-Sen covers both senate races. NY-GOV covers the New York governor's race.

Tags do not compound: that is, "education reform" is a completely different tag from "education". A tag like "reform" alone is probably not meaningful.

Consider if one or more of these tags fits your diary: Civil Rights, Community, Congress, Culture, Economy, Education, Elections, Energy, Environment, Health Care, International, Labor, Law, Media, Meta, National Security, Science, Transportation, or White House. If your diary is specific to a state, consider adding the state (California, Texas, etc). Keep in mind, though, that there are many wonderful and important diaries that don't fit in any of these tags. Don't worry if yours doesn't.

You can add a private note to this diary when hotlisting it:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from your hotlist?
Are you sure you want to remove your recommendation? You can only recommend a diary once, so you will not be able to re-recommend it afterwards.
Rescue this diary, and add a note:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from Rescue?
Choose where to republish this diary. The diary will be added to the queue for that group. Publish it from the queue to make it appear.

You must be a member of a group to use this feature.

Add a quick update to your diary without changing the diary itself:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary?
(The diary will be removed from the site and returned to your drafts for further editing.)
(The diary will be removed.)
Are you sure you want to save these changes to the published diary?

Comment Preferences

  •  B, I believe this is what is known as (15+ / 0-)

    a cris de coeur, cry from the heart.

    Yes indeed.

    I would like to add a few tags.

    Thank you so much.

    •  thanks so much Regina, I am in fact crying out to (13+ / 0-)

      My President, my country and my people, and I'm not ashamed to do so.

      This is a great day in our nation, but I refuse to celebrate war.

      I celebrate change from war.  My dad taught me that.

      Love to everyone here.

      That is all.

      Thanks.

      Ms. B.

      “I hope the two wings of the Democratic Party may flap together.” William Jennings Bryan

      by Badabing on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:25:38 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Gawdalmighty, you've written an inspired diary... (0+ / 0-)

        ...that absolutely SOARS above all the flotsam and jetsam found in the chitter-chatter of the day.  I don't know how you dig all this from inside you, but damn! I am glad you are able to do it, for it feeds my never-once-voted-for-a-Repub-and-I-will-live-and-die Democratic soul. T&R'd, as I'm sure you suspect by now. :)  But, with MORE GUSTO than usual, by golly!

        Down w/DOMA & Theft Of SSI Savings Of Gay Americans

        by Larry Bailey on Tue May 03, 2011 at 05:26:55 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  And also, thanks to Slink who inspired me to write (7+ / 0-)

      this diary.

      We are all so weary, and you know what?

      We have the right to be.

      Thanks Slink.  Sometimes, you just amaze me.

      Carry on strong lady, carry on.

      Ms. B.

      “I hope the two wings of the Democratic Party may flap together.” William Jennings Bryan

      by Badabing on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:27:38 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Very important points and emotional resonancy, (7+ / 0-)

        Ms. B.  Your lips to Obama's ears. We need to get the hell out of that rathole war, which is making regional stability worse, and not better -- as well as making domestic U.S. stability worse, and definitely NOT better.

        Republished in The Amateur Leftgroup site, with pleasure.

        Conservatives are] engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; ...the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. JK Galbraith

        by Vtdblue on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:56:33 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  thanks so much Vtdblue, you got it totally. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Quicksilver2723, Larry Bailey

          We are now at such a total amazing pivotal point, a time when we can move forward of just say virtually as a slave and serfs to the MIC and Wall St.

          So what I see is going on, is a moment in history like no other.

          But I will say this:

          Do not let any other Democrat on this site ever tell me, this moment did not come, and now it has come twice for President Obama.

          Believe me, I know what the Rethugs are about, that is why I pay them no attention:  

          Our only attention, as far as I am concerned is our own party.

          Otherwise:  guess what:  We go no where.  That is where we are now.

          If Kos was serious about 'Crashing the Gates', the only thing he should be writing about is our own party, but then, hey:  that's just me.

          They want our money?  I mean, what is left of it?  Let them fucking earn it.

          Carry on.  Be strong.

          Ms. B.

          “I hope the two wings of the Democratic Party may flap together.” William Jennings Bryan

          by Badabing on Mon May 02, 2011 at 07:20:32 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Thanks Ms. B and Slink (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Badabing, Larry Bailey

        Your diaries helped me process my feelings when I heard the news about OBL. I was troubled that my gut reaction was not in line with the mass celebration. Maybe because I was disappointed that Obama's statements last night seemed to be supportive of the original GWB spin after 9/11 and zero hint that we are going reduce our presence in the middle east. You have beautifully expressed my frustration with the war on terror and noting the cost in life and resources.

        Here is a sign that I found on Maddow Blog that I think symbolizes part or Slink and your latest diaries.

        Share photos on twitter with Twitpic

        Red Hook, Brooklyn

        A lot of us are as weathered as this sign.

  •  Obama is SMART enough to negotiate with the 30 (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Badabing, shopkeeper

    leaders in the Middle East. War is NOT the Answer; but negotiations are. Hopefully we can now give Obama the political cover to speed up that process, and bring the troops home

  •  i agree. we won. now bring the troops home. (6+ / 0-)

    i know it won't happen overnight, but they need to get the ball rolling asap

    if you are trying to tell me who Obama really is... i've already stopped listening

    by Anton Bursch on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:27:09 PM PDT

  •  There is an opportunity to align with democracy (8+ / 0-)

    To break with decades of cynical support of dictators and madmen.  What if we took seriously and respectfully this reaction from the Muslim Brotherhood.

    source

    The Muslim Brotherhood calls for the world in general and the western world's people and governments in particular to stop linking Islam with terrorism and to correct the erroneous image deliberately promoted for a number of years.

    source

    The Muslim Brotherhood calls for the United States to cease its intelligence operations against and to desist from interfering in the internal affairs of any Arab or Muslim country.

    Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood said Monday that Osama bin Laden's killing 'will stem terrorism and eliminates one of the causes of violence in the world.'
    In a brief statement online, the group, which renounced violence decades ago, added that following news of the killing of al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden, the United States should leave Iraq.

    But when I look around at the reporting of this statement in the Western press, I am not encouraged.  In keeping with what used to be Western Enlightenment values, the Brotherhood did say that there should have been a trial instead of a killing.  This is what is stressed in Western headlines such as "Muslim Brotherhood Condemns Killing of Bin Laden."  The hopeful headline would be "Muslim Brotherhood Condemns Bin Laden's Islam as a Perversion."

    Intelligent manipulation of the masses is the invisible government which is the true ruling power in our country. - U.S. propagandist Edward Bernays

    by geomoo on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:27:42 PM PDT

    •  correct geo, it is more of the same: (3+ / 0-)
      Muslim Brotherhood Condemns Killing of Bin Laden."  The hopeful headline would be "Muslim Brotherhood Condemns Bin Laden's Islam as a Perversion."

      These are in fact another fear mongering way to keep the MIC fully greased and going full tilt boogie.  

      This is exactly why McCain and Lindsay Graham demanded 'boots on the ground in Libya' and why it bothered me so deeply when Hillary Clinton said today:

      It was time for us to (supposedly) double our efforts on a bullshit handful of remaining terrorists.  

      If anyone on this site, had the courage to add up what we spend on the MIC (the wars in the past 10 years) and also, what Wall Street stole from Americans, it would be so horrifying, that we could not even look at it honestly.

      But let's not go there Geo (it's like watching that great remake of 'Cape Fear' by with De Niro)   too scary to watch.

      Just saying is all.

      I understand why American's are so damned weary.  We have every damn right to be weary.  

      I feel, personally like I've been run over by a train, about 50 times, and then told to: pull myself up by my bootstraps.

      It truly is rather horrifying.  No one is buying it anymore.

      And for that we have: Palin and Huckabee and Bachman.  That is what happens when you trash the Constitution,  and then call it all legal.  

      It's up to Obama now.  Hope he hears the call.

      Ms. B.

      “I hope the two wings of the Democratic Party may flap together.” William Jennings Bryan

      by Badabing on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:44:18 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I agree that we should forger nation (0+ / 0-)

    building in Afghanistan.  However we should keep several air bases in that country.

  •  But an Imperialist Nation needs to have (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Badabing

    troops overseas!

    An idea is not responsible for who happens to be carrying it at the moment. It stands or falls on its own merits.

    by don mikulecky on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:35:36 PM PDT

  •  I love this quote. (4+ / 0-)
    I am so full of hope and love for my President and this nation tonight.
     

    I am too!

    We have found common ground!

    We will win in the end, you know.

    "The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Thomas Paine

    by shrike on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:36:00 PM PDT

  •  As Obama's number one (0+ / 0-)

    goal is getting re-elected, bumping off a few more terrorists will win him more votes than any peace alternative if most comments on the death of OBL here at dKos are any indication.

    •  Can you explain further what you mean? nt (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      virginwoolf, Larry Bailey

      “I hope the two wings of the Democratic Party may flap together.” William Jennings Bryan

      by Badabing on Mon May 02, 2011 at 06:49:27 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Our friend (and she is), Marie, has had a... (0+ / 0-)

        ...hair up her ass about the elimination of Osama bin Laden since last night.  I like her a lot, but am not touching her 'tude on this.

        Down w/DOMA & Theft Of SSI Savings Of Gay Americans

        by Larry Bailey on Tue May 03, 2011 at 05:31:10 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I doubt it (0+ / 0-)

      How many foreign terrorists other than Usama bin Laden can the average American name offhand?

      IOW, Obama's getting as much out of getting ridf of terrorists as he's going to get by killing Usama bin Laden. I think almost everybody is sick of 'The Great War On Some Terrorists".

      His re-election depends on how he deals with the aftermath. If he uses this as a pretext to start withdrawal from the region and finds more popular uses for the money, maybe he'll win.

      If he continues "business as usual" as I expect him to, this is going to be a short-term approval bump against a political downtrend relating to deterioriating economic conditions.

      Actually, the biggest of several things I'm wondering about WRT Usama bin Laden's execution (or assassination) is ... why now? Did the White House have word that Usama was planning to leave? Did they find out that if they didn't move, bin Laden was about to die of natural causes?

      Peak Oil is NOW! Looking for intelligent energy policy alternatives? Try here.

      by alizard on Tue May 03, 2011 at 01:05:28 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Lovely diary, Badabing. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Badabing, slinkerwink, Larry Bailey

    This is definitely one of your best. It comes from the heart, and it shows.

    I'm gay and I'm pissed. I'm not giving up, I'm not giving in, I'm not backing down, and I'm not going away. I'm one of the Angry Gays. Deal with it.

    by psychodrew on Mon May 02, 2011 at 07:02:26 PM PDT

  •  I don't think...empire building... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Badabing, frandor55

    will end anytime soon. It sure would be nice if there could be a conversation about the hows and why's of our military presence across the globe...and how it dwarfs every other aspect of our government. I doubt there is a person on the planet that can stop an empire from doing what an empire does.

    •  Agreed: and here is former CIA Chalmers Johnson (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      alizard, Badabing

      of "Blowback" fame.

      we need a measure of how we’re doing in the war on terrorism. Well, baby, we have got a measure. We’re losing it. We’re losing it rather badly, and it’s because of an excessively military approach to these problems without any real understanding of the needs to alter our foreign policy in order to do the only known way to deal with terrorism. To try and separate the activists who are incorrigible from their passive supporters. The only way so that you can get information from their passive supporters on who the activists are and arrest them in courts of law. The only way to separate the activists from their passive supporters is to recognize the legitimacy of the grievances of their passive supporters, grievances that are easily illustrated in the Middle East by the fact that we have American troops in Iraq, that we are the world’s sole supporters of the Sharon government in Israel, and its extremely militaristic policies toward the essentially defenseless Palestinians. The result is that the entire Islamic world are now passive supporters of al Qaeda. I’ve spent a fair amount of time traveling in Indonesia. It’s the world’s largest Islamic country. And I guarantee you until very recently, Islam was carried very lightly in Indonesia. More or less the way an Italian man carries his Catholicism. Four or five years ago, 80% of the population were pro-American. It was one of the easiest places on earth to visit. Now 80% of the public distrusts the United States and is sympathetic to al Qaeda. T-shirts with pictures of Osama bin Laden are common on any kid in Jakarta today. Only George Bush could have brought about such a disastrous outcome.
  •  Carpe diem (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Badabing

    Very important on two fronts for leadership, useing the data from OBLs capture to destroy the remnants of Alqaeda, and exiting Afghanistan quickly with victory before victory can be snatched from our grasp.

     It would be wonderful if momentum could be maintained to actually improve the economy for the 99% of the population, but politicians do not seem concerned with that at the moment.

  •  This is clearly sincere (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    MGross

    but it's unfortunately a case of what I call the "priority fallacy," which has always messed with the minds of people on the left.  In a nutshell, the priority delusion says that if Y is a higher moral priority than X, then successfully preventing money from being spent on X will increase the chance that money will be spent on Y.  This has never, ever been true: Money is spent according to political priorities totally regardless of moral ones, and if Y has a lower political priority than Z, then money not spent on X will be spent on Z - even if Z is completely worthless.  

    If you totally disbanded the US military tomorrow, the money would not end up in schools and healthcare, it would simply be stolen or given away to rich people, and there would be no economic counterbalance to the disappearance of the military-industrial complex.  So the economic basis of your views is unfortunately illusory.

    As to the philosophical/diplomatic/humanitarian part of the argument, I'm afraid I have to differ with that every bit as much: Pacifism is a very specialized tool, and when applied too broadly is simply an ideology - imagine if your body tried to peacefully resist a bacterial infection and you'll see how nonsensical its premises are in the grand scheme of things.  We are human, and humans are animals - complex animals with minds and consciences, but animals.  Striving to be more than we are is great - denying who we are is simply delusional.  War is a failure, but people who treat it as the problem in every case what it arises are both morally and politically blind: The point of a war is not merely to stop, but to stop in such a way as to not recur.

    Practically speaking, leaving Afghanistan makes no sense unless we are convinced - rationally convinced, not merely deceiving ourselves as an excuse to leave - that there is a government capable of both survival and modest progress over time.  If there is not, then the taliban will return to power through force, and al Qaeda will inevitably follow, even if there is ambivalence among the taliban - i.e., a return to the conditions that preceded 9/11.  

    Unless your objective is to see history repeat itself ad nauseum, we can only leave in such a way that we will not be compelled to return.  That is, I think, your objective, but you aren't treating the question holistically, just as an isolated exercise in how you react to the condition.  Chemotherapy is destructive and toxic, and it makes patients sicker than their cancer would at the time, but it would be foolish to insist that chemo is the problem - it is a response to the problem, and a rational one at that.  It is a response to the failure of the body's natural control mechanisms, just as war is a response to the failure of diplomacy and subtler forms of manipulation.  

    I'm constantly disheartened and disappointed by the failure of many on the left to understand that we didn't start a war in Afghanistan - war was brought to us from Afghanistan.  With or without proper support in Washington, the purpose of our presence there has, ever since then, been to create a condition whereby our presence is no longer needed.  That is the rational purpose of war to a liberal democrat: To reach a conclusion whereby both the level of bloodshed during and after, and the chances of recurrence are kept to a minimum.  

    People who just say "Leave" are not thinking like this - they think ending war = peace, but that's not true at all: Peace does come from avoiding war under most circumstances, but when war is thrust on you by someone else, peace is only possible by ending the conditions that perpetuate it.  In the case of al Qaeda, those conditions are complex, expensive to address, and in the case of Afghanistan, require nation-building.  Regardless of US foreign policy's role in its creation, al Qaeda will not be uncreated by reversing those policies - a third set of policies that rationally address what is in the context of what is sought are necessary.  When you have some ideas about how to leave Afghanistan a place where al Qaeda cannot flourish, those would be helpful - simply saying "let's leave" is meaningless.

    The conundrum of stable democracy: Reform requires the consent of the corrupt.

    by Troubadour on Mon May 02, 2011 at 09:11:49 PM PDT

    •  So how many more years Troubadour, how much (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      alizard, Larry Bailey

      money, how many lives?

      Just give me that figure, can you?

      You dare to say to me 'leaving Afganistan is meaningless'?  OMFG.  They are a completely corrupt government like our own.  

      So, just in case you did not read the diary here it is:

      According to a March 29, 2011 Congressional Research Service report, Congress has approved a total of $1.283 trillion for “military operations, base security, reconstruction, foreign aid, embassy costs, and veterans’ health care for the three operations initiated since the 9/11 attacks.” Those three operations include Operation Enduring Freedom (OEF) Afghanistan; Operation Noble Eagle (ONE), providing enhanced security at military bases; and Operation Iraqi Freedom (OIF).

      Broken down individually, the government has spent $806 billion for Iraq, $444 billion for Afghanistan, $29 billion for enhanced security and $6 billion on “unallocated” items. The vast majority of all the money appropriated has gone to the Department of Defense, and of that money more and more is being spent on Operation & Maintenance (O&M) funding, which went from $42 billion in FY2004 to $79 billion in FY2008. Only $67 billion (or 5 percent) went to the State Department or USAID. Only $8 billion (or 1 percent) went to veterans' care, via the Department of Veterans Affairs.

      Because U.S. troop presence will remain at relatively high levels in Afghanistan and, to a lesser extent, Iraq in the years ahead -- and because veteran health-care needs will likely only get worse -- the price will continue to rise. If Congress also approves the president’s FY2012 war-funding request, the cumulative cost of post-9/11 operations would reach $1.415 trillion. The Congressional Budget Office -- the nonpartisan accountant for lawmakers -- estimates that over the next ten years, total costs “could reach $1.8 trillion by FY2021.”

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

      but that has nothing to do with what has been lost by the middle class and jobs, and from wall street.

      I doubt you even read my diary.

      As far as I can see Troubadour, you are just another denier of what is really going down in our nation, and in fact, I feel sorry for you for that, but more than that, I feel more sorry for our entire nation.

      Best of luck to you with you delusions.

      Ms. B.

      “I hope the two wings of the Democratic Party may flap together.” William Jennings Bryan

      by Badabing on Mon May 02, 2011 at 09:38:19 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  You're not asking rational questions (0+ / 0-)

        but I will continue to give you rational answers.

        how many more years

        You seem to be confused about the difference between an optional war and a defensive necessity.  You don't just spontaneously stop defending yourself - not unless you're some tiny island nation with a tourism economy.

        how many lives

        If I were to ask how many lives should be sacrificed to terrorist attacks from allowing Afghanistan to once again be an al Qaeda base, you couldn't answer it - and the fact that you couldn't answer it wouldn't change your position.  So why are you asking me, if you know the question isn't a real argument?  It's pure expressionism - you're not helping anyone, just wallowing in clearly unjustified moral superiority.

        You dare to say to me 'leaving Afganistan is meaningless'?

        Obviously it's meaningless unless we're leaving after having resolved the security problem that first compelled our presence.  You're arguing, contra-logically, that the continuation of a problem (i.e., the poor performance of nation-building efforts thus far) is an argument to return the situation to the conditions that caused it: International un-involvement, chaos, and taliban dictatorship.  The only way that could make sense would be if you're claiming Afghanistan would magically fail to produce the same results as before under the same conditions as before.  

        Pretending that doing the same thing will yield different results is not a real option.

        They are a completely corrupt government like our own.

        The government of Afghanistan is nothing like our government, either in form or function.  Your claim is ignorant and stupid on a level I'm not sure how to deal with.  Corruption, in the sense of being beholden to financial interests, is a serious problem in the United States.  In Afghanistan, direct, petty corruption at all levels of government from the presidency to street cops is a daily fact of life that interferes with the mundane functions of civil society.  In your entire life, it's unlikely you've ever seen the kind of corruption that Afghans see every day.  And guess what that means: It means that the Afghan government probably could not defend itself against the taliban at this point, which returns us to the fact that what you suggest is not a real option.

        but that has nothing to do with what has been lost by the middle class and jobs, and from wall street.

        So rebuild it.  Stop looking for scapegoats for why you feel powerless.

        The conundrum of stable democracy: Reform requires the consent of the corrupt.

        by Troubadour on Mon May 02, 2011 at 10:17:58 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Hey BB (0+ / 0-)

        would love if you'd check out my diary

        Questions re bin Laden DNA identification

        Send your old shoes to the new George W. Bush library.

        by maxschell on Tue May 03, 2011 at 12:27:25 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  The third option is to recognize that... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      alizard, Badabing

      there isn't a chance in hell we'll build a functioning government in Afghanistan any time in the next decade. We'll kill lots of innocent people. Lots of our own soldiers, too. We'll make more enemies. We'll empower a corrupt government that will work against its own people. We'll pay private contractors who will pay off insurgents to 'keep the peace'. We'll further enrich and empower corporations whose sole purpose is to skim 5% before getting some Indian company to get a bunch of Afghan companies to build a non-functioning dirt road from nowhere to nowhere.

      But hey, it would be irresponsible to stop standing up for the guys who are literally stealing land from peasants. Can't do that. Have to stick around. Only right thing to do.

    •  your neoconservative narrative (0+ / 0-)

      has no resemblance to known facts and appears to be a regurgitation of what the Very Serious People who lied us into these wars to begin with told us.

      The way to reduce Islamic terrorism is to get rid of the irritants that produce it, starting with the US military presence in the Middle East.

      Remember that the end of oil is coming, and after the oil runs out, the Middle East is going to become irrelevant to the rest of the world with the exception of Afghanistan, which I expect to become either a puppet or a province of the gigantic industrial powerhouse next door which has a need for Afghanistan's mineral resources.

      The US is guarding a multi-billion dollar copper mine for the Chinese right now. You want to pay for it? Do it yourself and get your fellow neocons to chip in.

      Peak Oil is NOW! Looking for intelligent energy policy alternatives? Try here.

      by alizard on Tue May 03, 2011 at 01:16:31 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Some thoughtful analysis outside USA, USA, USA, (4+ / 0-)

    What the Foreign Op-Ed Pages Say About Bin Laden's Killing

    Impassioned Poetry from France

    An editorial in the French Le Monde stands out:
    "His death will close a somber decade in relations between the Arab world and the Occident, opened by the attack of September eleventh and closed up by the Tunisian Jasmine Revolution, by Tahrir Square in Cairo, and by the aspirations of the Arab peoples to democracy and the rights of man. ... The change in the Arab world ... is reinforced by the death of the most charismatic of the jihadists--and the prudence of which the White House communications are proof guards again all triumphalism ... This president, sneered at by his tea party adversaries for pusillanimity ... has succeeded in what the braggarts in the previous administration failed to do, despite the liberticidal drifts of the war on terror: kill those responsible for the September 11 attacks, "do justice" according to its proper meaning, to the innocent victims of the World Trade Center, of the Pentagon, and of the airplane which crashed in flight."
    Sharply Contrasting Views of America from Germany
    Compare this glowing review from Die Welt's Thomas Schmid...
    The USA worked persistently for this goal, never taking its eye off it. If it is true, that crucial information on the whereabouts of the target came from the Guantanamo detainees, this would throw a new light on America's handling of terrorism suspects: as problematic as the stockpiling and choosing of detainees is--there were good reasons to set up Guantanamo and not to close it prematurely. ...
    In words that could come on the lips of no German politician, [Obama] justified a man's murder from America's horizon of values. No word of revenge, but the signal was clear, that at the end, despite all pragmatism, Americans' indivisible nation is so holy to them that they will always be ready to defend it--the Pilgrims will not have fled the European despots for nothing. ... Now as it seemed to all the world that America after the attacks of 9/11 had, as a result, done everything wrong: from Afghanistan to Iraq to, again, Afghanistan. Today it looks a bit different. ... The world of 2011 is no longer the world of 2001.
    ...to Henryk Broder's much more critical take in the same paper. Several readers left notes saying things like, "I hope this is satire," but a quick perusal of Broder's Wikipedia page suggests he has something of a reputation for polemic.
    And today the Americans celebrate again as if they had solved all their problems with a single blow: high unemployment, galloping national debt, failed health care reform, the tarnished image of the USA in the world. The execution of Osama bin Laden--or should one call it murder?--lets them quickly forget their cares, and is a balm to the wounds of the nation. ...
    In the USA too the rule applies that every suspect must be innocent until proof to the contrary. Guilt or lack of guilt can only be decided by a fair judge. ... Probably [Osama] was not offered the chance to give himself up. Such a procedure is unworthy of a constitutional state. Even Adolf Eichmann, the mastermind of the Final Solution to the Jewish question, was charged and judged with due process.
    From Spain, a Comparison to Moby Dick
    Some pretty heavy stuff here from El País's Enric Gonzáles:
    Each society is reflected in a story that, mysteriously, contains the code of collective instincts. The U.S. worships a strange tale of horror, obsession, purity, vengeance and catharsis written by Herman Melville in 1851: Moby Dick. On September 11, 2001, the metaphor of the monster seemed to be fierce and elusive reality. The white whale was transformed into a tall, soft-spoken man with which a whole country had something akin to an outstanding bill.
    ...If Osama bin Laden took to the collective condition of cruel and elusive monster, Americans were put in the shoes of Captain Ahab: there was no other purpose than revenge. Never mind the means, no matter the consequences. It was a moral issue with absolutely no possibility of nuance. ... With Osama bin Laden, the American story took on a dark mystique. ... A vapid president who came to the White House through a judicial fluke, George W. Bush was capable of things unthinkable. And these things he did, by popular acclaim.
    ...
    As in Moby Dick , the end of the "monster", the man called Osama bin Laden, provokes a certain bitter stupor. As if waking from a nightmare and finding that the nightmare is still there.
    From the Arab World, Some Thoughts About Al-Qaeda's Survival
    Here's just one of several offerings in the pan-Arab daily Al-Hayat. More to come. This is from Ghassan Charbel:
    Killing bin Laden does not mean the end of Al Qaeda. And it does not mean the end of terrorism.Yet it may be considered an important event in the battle of symbols. And it confirms to the base the punishment of the perpetrator, whoever it was. The battle against terrorism will remain open. The drainage of its resources requires combating injustice and poverty, marginalization and occupation. It requires freedom, prospects of openness, development and reform and participation.
  •  The oddest form of diary... (0+ / 0-)

    ...is one that congratulates their opponent on being ideologically vindicated, then asserts they should still take your contrary position.

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site