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Just one month ago, this was unthinkable.

Well, it was thinkable - but absolutely no one thought it was possible.  People thought that all Hope was lost.  The President was a serial capitulator-in-chief who was destined to cave.  The issue of Wall Street abuse, Banking abuse, the growing influence of the monied and powerful, the shrinking wages, shrinking jobs and shrinking options of the middle-class were a foregone conclusion.

For literally years I wondered - why aren't there people in the Streets - up in arms over all this.

I railed here and elsewhere about the unfairness, the injustice, the war crimes, the lies, the spin, the grift and flat out theft.  

Over a thousand diaries.

Just a few weeks ago Keith echoed my frustration and desperation - Why aren't we in the Streets?

Where is the outrage over these Great Hypocrisies? Do you expect it to come from a corrupt and corrupted media, for whom access is of greater importance than criticizing the failure of a political party or defending those who don't buy newspapers or can't leap website paywalls or could not afford cable tv?...

Do you expect it from those elected officials who no longer know anything of government or governance, but only perceive how to get elected, or how to pose in front of a camera and pretend to be leaders?...

Do you expect it will come from the great middle ground of the country, with a population obsessed with entertainment, video games, social media, sports, and trivia?

Where is the outrage to come from?

It will come From You

In response his boss Vice President Al Gore called for the start of a New American Spring...

This inspired me to do my small part and start a facebook page to try and gather people to do exactly that.

In all honesty, It failed.

But then something else happened... and brother although it hasn't succeeded yet, it certainly has completely changed the conversation.

In case you been living under the Geico Rock, Wall Street seems to have gained a grand new pack of semi-permanent residents.

It began small, it nearly dwindled down to nothing all on it's own....

Then it grew... and grew.

Michael Moore Came.

Russel Simmons Came.

Cornell West Came.

Susan Sarandon Came.

My Old Pal Tom Morello Came.

Even Kanye Came.

These are People who are angry, but not belligerent.  People who are clearly articulate and informed.  People are brave, and willing to put their bodies at risk with the courage of their convictions - standing up to arbitrary and vicious police actions. They've been Maced.  They've been beaten. Kettled. Run over.

And still they remain.  Still they Occupy.

No longer a Silent.  No longer invisible.  The teaming huddled masses of the disenfranchised can no longer be ignored.

They have been dismissed. They have been ridiculed. Belittled.  Called "Dirty", 'Druggies", "Unfocused", "Whiners", "Dangerous".

Yet they remain. And they grow, now - as of today - reaching over 900 Cities, and 100 Countries?

Could we have even Hoped for something like this?

The Dream has come true.  For decades due to the trickle-down Friedman-omics we've been gradually slouching into Corporate Feudalism.

But not anymore.  Now, finally - the people have begun to fight back.  To finally start to stem the tide of endless greed and viciousness that drives the 1%, owns all of the GOP and most of the Democratic Party.

It doesn't matter that they don't have an specific agenda.  They aren't trying to come up with the answers, they asking a question!.

Why does all of our national and international wealth seemed to be disappearing into the massive maw of Wall Street and Big Business?  Why do we work harder and longer and continue to get less and less - while being expected to give more and more?

Some believe they already know the answers, but frankly only an idiot thinks they have an answer before they even understand the question.  

It doesn't matter that they don't have a specific list of legislation or action items.  It doesn't matter that they don't have a "Leader" -- what matters is that they've changed the conversation.  Permanently.

No longer are we obsessed over austerity and how much public services need to be cut to service the needs and whims of the wealthy.  NOW THE NEEDS OF THE MANY ARE BEING DISCUSSED.

The answers won't be easy.  They won't be simple.  They will take time to implement.  Some will fail.  Some will succeed.

The process has finally begun.  And at this stage, I don't think it will ever stop.

I certainly Hope that it doesn't.


Occupy Everywhere

Originally posted to Vyan on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 09:25 AM PDT.

Also republished by ClassWarfare Newsletter: WallStreet VS Working Class Global Occupy movement.

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  •  Tip Jar (286+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Statusquomustgo, Wee Mama, Phoebe Loosinhouse, Tom Stokland, doroma, anodnhajo, artisan, kestrel9000, TomP, princesspat, PeterHug, operculum, Thomas Twinnings, westyny, gloriana, Nulwee, commonmass, Shockwave, MKinTN, semiot, skip945, drnononono, wxorknot, offgrid, elwior, kevinpdx, Dancun74, Bob B, highfive, sleipner, greenbastard, Simplify, jdmorg, DanC, PBen, DiegoUK, RFK Lives, Ray Pensador, deep, opinionated, Gooserock, donnamarie, greycat, unclejohn, myadestes, blueoregon, tgypsy, gulfgal98, IowaBiologist, grannycarol, Trendar, Shadowmage36, UncleCharlie, poco, mikeconwell, think blue, emperor nobody, Eric Blair, TexMex, raina, blue aardvark, satanicpanic, Caddis Fly, stolen water, Pinko Elephant, fallina7, sdf, An Affirming Flame, 3goldens, Ed in Montana, alnep, haremoor, psilocynic, Portlaw, claude, glendaw271, Kurt Sperry, allergywoman, Gowrie Gal, AnnieR, aaraujo, wordfiddler, boofdah, Thinking Fella, Lily O Lady, scarvegas, Mogolori, TofG, Cronesense, middleagedhousewife, LaFeminista, Outsourcing Is Treason, zeke7237, 313to212, notdarkyet, TravnTexas, lotlizard, zerelda, rlharry, Jake Williams, blueoasis, David PA, bluicebank, Susan from 29, ewmorr, Keori, crankypatriot, pat bunny, ten5v1lt4, puakev, Pandoras Box, ibinreno, COkdub, pontechango, stunzeed, radarlady, BrowniesAreGood, Dinclusin, alkalinesky, Zwoof, Sychotic1, Actbriniel, trumpeter, reflectionsv37, LeislerNYC, redstella, DamselleFly, FishOutofWater, JekyllnHyde, houndcat, sostos, jhecht, EdSF, kjoftherock, tofumagoo, markdd, johanus, luckydog, Barbara Marquardt, AnnetteK, eeff, edwardssl, createpeace, ybruti, Medium Head Boy, SoCaliana, ColoTim, camlbacker, beach babe in fl, sherlyle, ExStr8, ItsSimpleSimon, hwmnbn, Nica24, NearlyNormal, Land of Enchantment, maybeeso in michigan, sb, Publius2008, bula, KenBee, Doctor Who, Old Gardener, on board 47, LSmith, maggiejean, clinging to hope, Onomastic, orangecurtainlib, blueoldlady, Sylv, steelman, Mimikatz, TexDem, emal, Catte Nappe, catilinus, Alice Venturi, makettle, blueyedace2, Larsstephens, Preposterous Idea, PoliticalJunkessa, Sanctimonious, cececville, reddbierd, MsGrin, TFinSF, CatCiaoInUSA, dkmich, SteelerGrrl, FarWestGirl, ATFILLINOIS, where4art, krllos, SallyCat, dewley notid, glitterscale, rmonroe, carpunder, timewarp, MikePhoenix, shortgirl, karmsy, LABobsterofAnaheim, chuckvw, science nerd, BigVegan, COwoman, Arahahex, babeuf, rogerdaddy, swampyankee, Mentatmark, bnasley, CT Hank, kazoo of the north, frisco, riverlover, seefleur, yawnimawke, hyperstation, sawgrass727, Ticonderoga, x, dwahzon, Jane Lew, PrometheusUnbound, Cartoon Messiah, TexasTwister, be the change you seek, Roger Fox, Friend of the court, hester, gundyj, mrkvica, magicsister, mconvente, makanda, rage, Siri, DawnN, pixxer, Cintimcmomma, Storey, vivian darkbloom, linkage, cloudbustingkid, boadicea, ItsaMathJoke, renbear, Situational Lefty, ivote2004, La Gitane, noemie maxwell, mookins, aufklaerer, RhymesWithUrple, Angie in WA State, Russgirl, mofembot, Clive all hat no horse Rodeo, filkertom, CTLiberal, coppercelt, Mosquito Pilot, Steven D, sunny skies, molunkusmol, nyceve, jnhobbs, Brit, peregrine kate, reginahny, Babsnc, BlueDragon, TheFatLadySings, Mrs M, nmjardine, Bob Duck, DixieDishrag, BlackSheep1, binkycat, BYw, Chi, RosyFinch
  •  Spectacular! (57+ / 0-)

    So few outside the affected really seem to understand. This isn't about individual issues, its about what we have become as a society and a people. Its people taking to the streets to say " the system" is broken. Not any one particular part of it, its the whole freaking thing.

    Our political, judicial, social and economic practices are all failing us at once, and at the worst possible time.

    Our Congress is corrupted and gridlocked and cannot be relied upon do anything. Our Supreme Court has taken it upon itself to legislate from the bench in their absence. Lesser courts have become nothing more then revenue generators for their localities, with enforcement of overreaching local ordinances meant to strip away more of our freedom as their support, and as you said, our dissappointing President, the Capitulator in Chief.

    I don't profess to see how this all plays out and what the world will look like afterward, but like my name implies, I've been waiting for the day.

  •  Leave it to Vyan to always say (24+ / 0-)

    what needs to be said. Your writings are about a million times more exciting to me than anything the front pagers do.  When I see your name on the Rec List, I feel the way I did when I joined this site, years and years ago...

    I guess my enthusiasm for the movement is tempered because we have so much work ahead of us, and so much ugly  push-back to expect. How can we have a historic candidacy in Massachusetts, and no spillover into Connecticutt, and more importantly, Maine, where there doesn't seem to be a real opposition to the Maine sister yet?

    How can we possibly let the middle conversation have a conversation with any weight in the senate with only Elizabeth Warren.  Less than 40 senators will be progressives if we don't get our act together!

    "Hahai nō ka ua i ka ululā'au" -- Hawaiian proverb.

    John Boehner? The sleaze bucket who hands out bribes from big tobacco on the House floor?

    by Nulwee on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 10:09:38 AM PDT

  •  We are changing the world (36+ / 0-)

    This is different.  History is being written.

    100 countries!  900 cities!

    Never before has there been such a global movement.

    This will match and beat global crony capitalism.

    And its started with a handful of people in New York.; an oasis of truth. Truth that leads to action 48forEastAfrica - Donate to Oxfam

    by Shockwave on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 10:10:56 AM PDT

  •  I was afraid in November of 2004. (21+ / 0-)

    I was smitten in November of 2008.
    I was saddened and more cynical in March 2010, when the President signed the new healthcare law, and it had a mandate and no public option as my cynicism had advised it would.
    I was thoroughly discussed in August of 2011, when all the "players" in the power game played their nth rerun of heads we win tails you lose.
    Now, we can answer the question my wife and I have asked each other since Emperor G. Hurler Bush the Elder was sneering at the peasants from the Oval Office - to wit, "How bad does it have to get?" Answer: Bad enough.

    Courage is contagious. - Daniel Ellsberg

    by semiot on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 10:21:21 AM PDT

    •  I was afraid in 12/00 when 5 Supremes installed (43+ / 0-)

      the W/Cheney regime by judicial fiat.  Hell, I started being afraid back in 11/80 when the Reagan tide swept out the likes of McGovern, (Birch) Bayh, and Church.  The Senate Dem caucus has never really recovered from that devastation.  The fear grew as Reagan heated up the Cold War, slashed taxes for corporations and the well to do, and busted PATCO in year 1.

      I was afraid when Reagan, Bush I, North, Poindexter, Weinberger, and the rest skated on Iran/contra.  I was afraid when Thomas lied his way onto the SCOTUS.  I was afraid when Glass-Steagall and the rest of the New Deal regulatory apparatus was swept away at the end of WJC's presidency.

      It's been getting plenty bad for >30 years now.  I'm not sure I've ever seen a prolonged mass protest like this one since then.  There was the nuclear freeze movement in the mid-80's, and other protest movements have come and gone, but this one feels different.  I don't know if it's the timing, the tactics, or something else, but this movement cuts at the heart of established power in a unique and largely unprecedented way.

      I have no clue where this movement is going, but it has stirred up hopes that had long lain dormant for me.

      Some men see things as they are and ask why. I dream of things that never were and ask why not?

      by RFK Lives on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 10:48:55 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Agreed RFK. (17+ / 0-)
        It's been getting plenty bad for >30 years now.  I'm not sure I've ever seen a prolonged mass protest like this one since then.  There was the nuclear freeze movement in the mid-80's, and other protest movements have come and gone, but this one feels different.  I don't know if it's the timing, the tactics, or something else, but this movement cuts at the heart of established power in a unique and largely unprecedented way.

        I have no clue where this movement is going, but it has stirred up hopes that had long lain dormant for me

        This one feels different to me too.  My sense is it's on its way to reaching critical mass across the globe but movement is slow.  Slow can be good sometimes esp for something that has the potential to change global society.

        Where Occupy had its origins isn't definitive to me (Madrid has been protesting for quite some time before NYC...)  but IMO millions worldwide can identify with the name Wall Street.  It epitomizes the absolute greed, corruption, lawlessness, brutality and arrogance of the 1% globally - even though its location is NYC.  I think that's why OccupyWallStreet became the watershed moment, the act of civil disobedience that sparked other movements and is helping to perpetuate others.

        What started it?  Not going definitive here but when people can't put food on the table, can't get a job, can't pay for healthcare, are losing the roofs over their heads - and are then told "Get a job," or are called whiners and/or lazy - well then look out.

        I hope this is the start of something epic...The 99% has EVERYTHING at stake here.

        When everybody talkin' all at once no one can hear the wise one speak, So just be still and silence will provide the wisdom that you seek - by Tori del Allen

        by Dumas EagerSeton on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:53:05 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  This economy is hurting (almost) everyone. (5+ / 0-)

        So many people are suffering, or people they love are suffering, and this movement is asking why we aren't attending to the hurts that can be healed.  Because Lord knows there are hurts that can't be healed.    

      •  ^^^^This!^^^^ (8+ / 0-)

        I remember how in 1980 I thought Reagan was a joke that this country could not take seriously (I and everyone I knew was still about the counter-culture--as we thought of it then).  

        Then he actually got elected, and was inaugurated as the hostages in Iran (whose captivity had a lot to do with his election) were freed on the 1st split T screen I ever saw.

        I thought, well, it will be so bad that people will wake up.  And it was -- and he was elected again.  

        And so it continued. Through 2 terms of Reagan, 1 of Bush, Clinton (who not only killed Glass-Seagal but instituted draconian social spending cuts), through 2 horrific terms of Bush and now 3 heartbreaking years of Obama.

        And throughout that entire time, the right-wing noise machine has completely dominated the national conversation by setting a whole raft of false premises that were taken as "truth".  

        Throughout it all, I wondered what it would take for people to begin to wake up and begin to ask the right questions.  

        I am not sure how all this happened, but my gut tells me that we have encountered a tipping point; there isn't one single thing that created it--I think that it is just that the cummulative lies have become so increasingly so absurd that something had to happen.  And I couldn't be happier.

  •  ? Unions Have Been in Streets and Capitol Bldgs (27+ / 0-)

    and street corners since winter.

    Welcome to it, 2nd wave.

    We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

    by Gooserock on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 10:23:49 AM PDT

  •  And thanks for keeping the faith, and a spark (9+ / 0-)

    of truth alive in the dark years.

    Courage is contagious. - Daniel Ellsberg

    by semiot on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 10:25:11 AM PDT

  •  welcome back! (11+ / 0-)

    I've been silently T&R your diaries and noted your absence.

    For literally years I wondered - why aren't there people in the Streets - up in arms over all this.
    Been wondering about that myself, especially wrt Bush v. Gore

    The world that you are hearing now is the same world that I see. from "I Hear Your Hand" by Mary Jane Rhodes.

    by raina on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 10:57:36 AM PDT

  •  If you haven't been there yourself, (23+ / 0-)

    you have to go.  Even the best diaries won't prepare you for what's happening there.

    #OWS isn't just people hanging out in the park waiting for the next march.  It's people going to working group meetings to bring art, music, performance, and literature into the movement.  It's people sustaining the movement through food, comfort supplies, and medical support.  It's people showing responsibility for themselves through sanitation work.  It's people becoming leaders through facilitation training and direct action planning.  It's people organizing, and then acting on the decisions immediately.

    So go.  Because this is the rise of the liberal movement that you've been waiting for.  But be prepared.  You might arrive as a tourist and be staffing the Info Desk or giving interviews to the Guardian the next day.

  •  President Obama with an activist army (3+ / 0-)

    I think some underestimate President Obama.

    The one who signed the health care bill was handcuffed by Joe Lieberman and the insurance lobby's filibuster in the Senate.

    2012 Obama is backed by a global movement, a tidal wave of activist speaking out against the system that is rigged to the point where even the most upstanding, genuine, ambitious human being (Jimmy Carter, Barack Obama) can't serve the people the way they envisioned.

    The GOP is going to get slaughtered in this election.

    Who is Wall Street presenting to the people this time?

    Oh yeah, Mitt Romney, Hedge Fund Manager, Massachusetts.

    They chose the Wall Street poster boy to run against President Obama - the guy who in 2008 kept drilling it into our heads that we hold the power in a Democracy.

    Occupy Wall Street is here partly because of him.

    We have his back.

    The handcuffs are off.

    The President is free to lead.

    The rich man's media lies. Kill your TV. Smash your radio.

    by GoogleBonhoeffer on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 11:02:44 AM PDT

  •  i think it was last year, gore (8+ / 0-)

    expressing frustration, wondered why protesters weren't using civil disobedience to block the opening of new coal burning power plants.

    i wonder why we aren't doing anything to block the building of the keystone pipeline.

  •  Excellent diary (27+ / 0-)

    I have been waiting for this all my life (64 years).  For the first time, I have real hope for the future.  

    This diary captures that essence of the movement very well.  These sentences jumped out at me because the point you make with them has so rarely been acknowledged in all the criticism and lack of understanding of the #Occupy movement.

    It doesn't matter that they don't have an specific agenda.  They aren't trying to come up with the answers, they asking a question!.

    I cannot begin to say how many times I have tried to explain that fact here to many of those who were so critical of the #Occupy movement for not having a list of demands or of answers. It is heartening to see that people are finally understanding what this movement is trying to do and what they have done so effectively thus far. I might add one more great thing that the #Occupy movement is doing.  It is empowering all of us to ask those questions.

    The United States is not just losing its capacity to do great things. It's losing its soul.--Bob Herbert. gulfgal98's corollary- We are fighting back to save our soul. Thank you, #OWS for empowering us all.

    by gulfgal98 on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 11:10:22 AM PDT

  •  Could we have even Hoped for something like this? (23+ / 0-)

    it's a miracle, as far as i'm concerned.

    It doesn't matter that they don't have an specific agenda.  They aren't trying to come up with the answers, they asking a question!.

    but they do have specific proposals. but you are right, this is the stage where they're running the red sirens (metaphorically speaking) to alert everyone and to get people to notice that things aint right.


  •  Does the Democratic Party have a specific agenda? (8+ / 0-)

    Because nobody seems to be asking them.

    •  Yeah (18+ / 0-)

      Coddle the rich, promote political correctness, ship jobs overseas with free trade, elect Obama.

      "Foolproof systems don't take into account the ingenuity of fools."

      by overclocking on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 11:26:36 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  You do know you are beginning to sound like a (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        broken record, don't you?

        So.  Who the hell are you going to vote for November, 2012, the GOP?

        •  At this point, I probably won't vote for President (5+ / 0-)

          I can justifiably say that Obama in office will continue to be a disaster, and I can also say that a Republican in office will be a disaster.

          I can safely say that since I was born, zombie Ronnie, every President we've had has gotten systematically worse.  With each passing president, regardless of party, taxes get cut for the wealthy, trade agreements ship our jobs overseas, there is more deregulation of the financial sector, subsidies of all forms grow and increase, special interest groups get pandered to even more, the military industrial complex gets even larger, our civil liberties get attacked even further, the executive branch grabs even more power, and the plutocracy gets even more entrenched.

          It doesn't matter who's in office.  But yet, election after election, DNC robots, and zealots who are in the current leaders thrall, come out with "but the other guy would do even more horrible things, he had to do it, don't worry it'll be better the next four years, don't worry when the next Democratic president comes along he will fix it" and shit just keeps getting worse.

          Sorry, but I'm sick and tired of being lied to.  I'm not going to vote for a crook and someone that keeps making things worse.  The Democratic party needs to find it's soul and start primarying sitting senators and presidents when they fail to live up to their promise or become proven liars.

          I want BETTER Democrats, and I'm not going to get better Democrats if I keep voting for crappy Democrats due to fear mongering from the DNC.

          I'm not alone here, both OWS and the Tea Party are essentially different groups of people declaring that they have no confidence in either of the major parties and a desire to change things on their own.  Why not pull a Tea Party and run our own people in local elections and national elections?  I fail to see how a combination of Kos and MoveON along with other groups couldn't actually at least primary the president and start a real debate to move people left.  But we don't, we just blindly vote for whatever shit sandwhich is nominated.

          "Foolproof systems don't take into account the ingenuity of fools."

          by overclocking on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:37:34 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  um. (3+ / 0-)

            every president getting worse? No, that's not safe to say. Obama may not be perfect, you may think he's bad, but he's definitely better than Bush.

            "Sentiment without action is the ruin of the soul." --Ed Abbey

            by progreen on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:48:01 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Umm, no (6+ / 0-)

              The police state has gotten worse.  We've invaded another Arab country and didn't even bother to go through congress for that one.  The ACA was a giant giveaway to insurance and pharma.  Executive power has grown.  The war on whistle blowers has increased.  Wall Street is more coddled than ever with Obama working overtime to make sure nobody goes to jail.  A president is assassinating Americans in other countries.  The drone was has increased.  Yet more free trade agreements that will cost jobs have been signed.  The war against medial pot has grown.

              I could go on.  But things have become objectively worse.  The difference is that many "Democrats" are outright hypocrites who are completely fine with destroying civil liberties, wars of aggression, and corporatism, as long as it is a Democrat that is doing it.  Just as many Republicans only care about their civil liberties when a Democrat is in power.

              This is a problem.  It's not OK when our guy does it.  It's just as bad.  And since we are Democratic voters and in essence "the party", if we do not speak out against this and nominate Democrats who engage in this we are condoning and supporting this behavior.  And many Democrats are perfectly happy to bomb other nations, and are perfectly happy to "shared sacrifice" the middle class into oblivion as long as there is a D in office doing it.

              I for one do not agree with this.  Obama has continued and increased the failed Bush policies, grown the war against our civil liberties and constitution, expanded the war on terror, and done his best to coddle Wall Street.  This is shameful, and shame on anyone that is OK with this happening.

              The main difference between the parties is that some people in the Democratic cacaus, one of them is Sanders who doesn't even identify as a Democrat, actually have a concience and actually want to get things done.  And some Democrats, like the state AGs that want to prosecute the banks, actually care about fixing things.  These people deserve our support.  However we shoot them in the foot when we continue to support Democrats that actively silence them and interfere with their work.  And those Democrats include this White House along with senior Senators and Congress people.

              "Foolproof systems don't take into account the ingenuity of fools."

              by overclocking on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 02:11:43 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  alright... (0+ / 0-)

                I don't want to argue this really, because this is a ridiculous assertion. Police state has gotten worse? Really? What's your evidence?

                "Invaded another Arab state"- well, sure let's start by ignoring the drawdown in Iraq (I'm not going to debate Afghanistan- depends if Obama follows through on promise to end that war too). Libya, on its own merits, was a humanitarian issue of a ruthless despot violently putting down an attempt at democratic change. One not initiated by the US, by the way. We were coming in to the aid of people who asked us to, as a member of a coalition, not trying to rally allies. And with no US troops. Or are you referring to US forces helping against the Lord's Resistance Army of child-torturers? By your standard, Clinton was worse than Bush.

                The ACA was a giveaway that also allowed my parents to continue to have me on their health insurance through this year. So I have health insurance. I got something, too. And they can't deny my mother's pre-existing condition to insure her.

                I could go on.

                Look, I don't question that (since the birth of the country, most notably by Abe Lincoln) executive power has grown. I don't like the growth of executive power. I don't like the precedent. So, if civil liberties, isolationism in the guise of pacifism, and the growth of executive power are your only concerns, then sure, Obama is worse. But if those are your chief issues, you might be a libertarian and not a Democrat after all. Ron Paul would likely address more of your concerns than Obama.

                Myself, I worry about environmental issues. You know, the survival of our species and all that. And on that front, while Obama's been dissapointing, he's been better than Bush. By far. Not even close. So....I disagree.

                "Sentiment without action is the ruin of the soul." --Ed Abbey

                by progreen on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 06:11:05 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  more to the point (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:

                Good luck with President Romney, or President Perry, or President Cain. I'm sure they'll do better.

                The lesser of two evils is still less evil. I will vote for, support, and do everything in my power to keep the Republicans from regaining power. Because, unlike you, I firmly believe Bush was worse than Obama. You, my friend, have too short a memory.

                "Sentiment without action is the ruin of the soul." --Ed Abbey

                by progreen on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 06:13:55 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

            •  He may be better than Bush, (0+ / 0-)

              but that makes him better than how many other Presidents in our nations history?...

              -9.50/-7.59 - "Why are the missiles called peace-keepers when they're aimed to kill?" -Tracy Chapman

              by Situational Lefty on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 11:20:03 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

    •  if we had a democratic primary, (7+ / 0-)

      those kinds of questions would get highlighted.

      republicans are filling the vacuum instead.

  •  i liked the guy who quipped (9+ / 0-)
    They aren't trying to come up with the answers, they asking a question!

    that the kids are making up for the fact that our so called free press refuses to question the powers that be. media demands answers and specifics from ows but failed to be as aggressive in demanding accountability from wall street!

    who had that smart observation? come up and take a bow.

    They have been dismissed. They have been ridiculed. Belittled.  Called "Dirty", 'Druggies", "Unfocused", "Whiners", "Dangerous".

    even fellow kossacks stooped to name calling smears.

  •  It is amazing (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    stolen water, tofumagoo

    It is extraordinarily difficult even for us historians to explain what makes one social movement transformative while another fizzles out, how one fails, despite the passionate effort of fiercely committed people, to gain enough momentum to reach a tipping point, while another, months or years or decades later gains a critical mass (almost, it sometimes seems, accidentally) and causes (or promises potentially to cause) profound or even revolutionary change.

    Of course, we should remain aware, all of the thousands of contingencies that do or do not lead to historical change are multiplied another thousandfold during times of upheaval, and it is almost impossible to see what outcome(s) will prevail during the middle of things (again, it is hard enough to explain how what happened did happen with the benefit of great historical hindsight ...), or whether there will in fact be transformative change at all ...

    -- Stu

  •  Meanwhile, the GOP doubles down on the stupid. (4+ / 0-)

    As in the flavor-of-the-moment 9-9-9 tax "plan", which is as dumb an idea as anyone could come up with.  I can just see the people in the streets calling for virtually NO taxes on the 1%, NO taxes on wealth or estates, NO taxes on capital gains or dividends--just hand the super-wealthy even bigger tax cuts and put the burden on the poor and the middle class.

    Of course, in the corporate media, this is a Very Serious Plan worthy of consideration.

    It will take a lot of sustained commitment for the needs and ideas of the 99% to be taken seriously.  OWS is finally giving me some hope--but we can't let up, either now or later.

    Civil marriage is a civil right.

    by UU VIEW on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 11:31:48 AM PDT

  •  let's not forget, (10+ / 0-)

    occupying wallstreet was resonating even before public figures jumped on board. they didn't make the movement.

  •  I wanted to read this diary. I really did but... (3+ / 0-)

    I got to the part about the President being a serial capitulator, as if that was self evident, and that was it.  I could not disagree more.

    Note:  It would be playing right into the hands of those who want the OWS movement to fail to triangulate with supporters of the effort who also support the President's re-election and supporters of the movement who are outspokenly against the President.

    •  Attempts to divide OWS and Incumbent Obama (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      Will fail

      The rich man's media lies. Kill your TV. Smash your radio.

      by GoogleBonhoeffer on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 11:50:59 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Um, what? (13+ / 0-)

        Have you not been in the streets with the protesters? Everyone I've spoken to at Occupy Boston is just as angry with Barack Obama as with Eric Cantor, John Boehner, and Brian Moynihan. There is no impetus in this movement to support ANY politician for re-election, least of all BHO. None.

        Barack Obama got almost $3 million in "campaign contributions" (can we just be honest and call that shit a bribe, already?) from Wall Street firms in 2008. He installed Geithner and Larry Summers as his yes-men. He's courting the same banksters for money again for 2012. He's excited to sign a free trade deal with Colombia and Korea that will eliminate 214,000 American jobs by 2015. The people in Dewey Square know this. They are not stupid. They see through the bullshit.

        OWS is not OFA. I suggest you get that through your head now before you embarrass yourself.

        When are you going to understand that being normal is not necessarily a virtue? It rather denotes a lack of courage. - Practical Magic

        by Keori on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:42:12 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  No kidding. This guy has been (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Cartoon Messiah

          spamming this nonsense all day.  Check this one out:

          And this one:

          And they got recced!

          Unbelievable.  This stuff is laughable!

        •  FALSE: 3 million from voters (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          SaintC, raines

          who happen to be employed by Wall Street firms.

          Corporations (i.e. Wall St firms) are not allowed to contribute directly to candidates.

          Is the 3 million written as a company check?  NO.  That's you can't say Wall Street firms wrote him a check.  Separate employees wrote separate checks.  The firm did not make a direct contribution (bribe).

          3 million equates to 652 individual donors in the banking industry who max out at $4,600 apiece.  Most of those 652 employees are scattered throughout different banks large and small spread throughout dozens of cities across the country.  

          These employees are acting independently.

          None of them are on the lobbyist registry.

          They mostly have zero communication with one another.

          There is no coordinated efforts to control the Executive Branch.

          Those individual donations amounting to 3 million dollars are a pittance compared to the organized money, billions of dollars, that flows into SuperPacs and is secret, and requires a high level of collaboration to generate a pool.  

          If you can't tell the difference then either you are misinformed or you're intentionally spreading a RW talking point that tries to pin the blame on the Bush-Bailout-Paulson Proposal on President Obama.

          Either way, you are spreading a RW talking point.

          The rich man's media lies. Kill your TV. Smash your radio.

          by GoogleBonhoeffer on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 02:12:22 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  So, Obama gets .5% of his total campaign haul (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          from one of the wealthiest sectors in the country, and that means that he's completely "in their pocket?"  So my cousin, who works for Goldman Sachs and gave money to Obama, was just bribing him nefariously?

          I mean, I agree with you that OWS is completely separate from Obama and OFA, and that Obama has been far from perfect when dealing with issues relating to Wall Street... But the whole "Obama is corrupt because a small portion of his campaign contributions came from a relatively very wealthy group" meme is a very simple way of looking at a very complex issue.

      •  As will attempts to unite them (5+ / 0-)

        OWS is not about Obama it seems to me.

    •  damn - i skimmed over that. wish i hadn't... (0+ / 0-)

      then i wouldn't have reached the false "police brutality" diary with the mounteds.

      what a waste of a day to be in this diary - and the other distorting one with the same claim of horse brutality.

      sigh.... should'a caught that serial line and saved myself a whole passel of trouble.

      Is GlowNZ back yet?

      by edrie on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 05:52:33 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Obviously (0+ / 0-)

      you don't know me well, if you think I was endorsing that idea.  The point of bringing it up was to point out that that view was one of the most prevalent attitudes around here and with many progressives.  We were in damn near full-on mourning mode.

      It wasn't my attitude.

      Now things are fantastically better.

  •  Desperation and violence (4+ / 0-)

    It's the surest sign of a failed ideology of hate.  All this means is they are losing and they know it.  Every skull they crack will only multiply the movement, because in the end we outnumber they 99:1.  The end result was always inevitable - we will win decisively.

  •  I've been out of the loop re: media (11+ / 0-)

    so maybe this has already been posted, but I love how succinctly Alan Greyson distills one of the key points of the OWS movement (and takes PJ O'Rourke down):

  •  ... and after all the yelling and sign waving ... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    ... not one thing has actually changed.

    GOP still controls the House.

    GOP is still filibustering in the Senate.

    Obama's left turn pre-dates #OWS (Sept 8 job's bill speech)

    State govs under GOP control. WI recalls pre-date OWS. OH referenda pre-date OWS.

    Restrictive voter ID bills still in effect.

    Put down your signs, take a bath, and start the hard work of electing people to office!!!

    Jon Stewart: Greenspan's problem with the free market is the freedom part. The part he left out of his technical modeling is what slime-balls people are.

    by DeanObama on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 11:56:10 AM PDT

    •  Everyone I've encountered there has been (18+ / 0-)

      clean and showered, so I'm pretty sick of that meme at this point.

      •  Not responsive (0+ / 0-)

        ... to the rest of my comment. There will be plenty of time to protest after President Romney (or Perry) gets elected.

        Also, many of the people that I met at my (one visit to a) GA were NOT showered. Whew!

        Dear #OWS: Put down your signs, take a bath, and start the hard work of electing people to office!!!

        by DeanObama on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:50:27 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Well what did you think? (9+ / 0-)

          We'd grab a couple of signs and then a month later the goopers wouldn't control the house?  Its hard to be responsive to your post since it basically doesn't contain anything but insults and nonsense and a false dichotomy between supporting this movement and trying to get decent people elected.  They are not antithetical, however it may not be the people that you wish for.

          "Nothing is more admirable than the fortitude with which millionaires tolerate the disadvantages of their wealth" Nero Wolfe (Rex Stout)

          by NearlyNormal on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:42:53 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Where is the effort to overturn voter ID laws? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:

            I haven't heard or seen one word about voter ID laws uttered by the occupy movement. Not. One. Word. If that is how you are "standing up for the 99%," count me out.

            GO BACK AND RE-READ.

            Yes. I have been to local occupy meetings in a state where an ID law was just added to the books. I looked through their statement of "demands," and the law's repeal is not one of them.

            Dear #OWS: Put down your signs, take a bath, and start the hard work of electing people to office!!!

            by DeanObama on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 04:18:46 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  You are kidding right? (5+ / 0-)

              If one of your issues (and its certainly a good one) doesn't make your list then we all need baths and lectures from you?  You must really be kidding.  Get a sign and get out there and make it prominent, don't piss on the one hopeful sign I've seen since Obama started doing backroom deals with the insurance lobby.

              "Nothing is more admirable than the fortitude with which millionaires tolerate the disadvantages of their wealth" Nero Wolfe (Rex Stout)

              by NearlyNormal on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 04:41:02 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  It's a really big issue. (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:

                ... and OWS has made it really clear that voting and government action is not on their agenda. Guy Fawkes doesn't do the ballot box. Millions of people will be disenfranchized and they don't care. I'm not going to force my agenda on occupy, but don't expect me to take it seriously until it does.

                When I first heard of OWS, I was really hopeful that the WI movement were finally going national. We were finally going to rebuild the political muscle that we lost in 2009 and 2010 when the Obama campaign ended. Even though I am not in the movement, I wish you all the best from my heart. However, I'm not in the movement because my head knows it's a waste of time and energy. Wake me up when it's time to campaign.

                Also, the bath comment relates to my first-hand experience with the movement. Big turn off, BTW.

                Dear #OWS: Put down your signs, take a bath, and start the hard work of electing people to office!!!

                by DeanObama on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 04:53:30 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

            •  Occupy is like Wikipedia (0+ / 0-)

              If you go and see something missing, it is up to you to add it to the mix.

              •  Read my comment just above yours. (0+ / 0-)

                OWS has made it really clear that voting and government action is not on their agenda.

                Millions of people will be disenfranchized and they don't care.

                Dear #OWS: Put down your signs and start the hard work of electing people to office.

                by DeanObama on Tue Oct 18, 2011 at 05:23:59 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

    •  Wow (14+ / 0-)

      Way to miss the point of the protests entirely. Some are just not prepared for the paradigm shift, I'm afraid. This diary is spot on. How long has it been since you've heard the words austerity? What's going on with the Gang of 6 or whoever it is trying to kabuki theater us some more? The protests are changing the national conversation, in spite of every corporate media outlet desperately trying to hang on to their old memes. This is so much bigger than politics. The system is corrupt, it is broken. Until the corporate money ceases buying political results, this is EXACTLY the action the country needs.

      And the bath comment? Really?

      •  Hurling rocks from the outside ... (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        won't change a thing. Protests have their role to play. However, even the Civil Rights Movement ultimately had to act through the legistlature. See Civil Rights Act and Voting Rights Act.

        For another example, look at the WI protests. It did absolutely nothing to stop Walker's legistlation, but it did give two Senators an early permanent vacation and has fired up the grill for Walker's early ouster as well. I'm more than willing to give that effort my money (and effort if I lived in WI), but I can do without the over-glorified be-in.

        I would also direct your attention to this diary ...

        "The protests are changing the national conversation"

        In the liberal media, yes. The mainstream media couldn't care less. Like it or not, the MSM is the filter through which many people view politics and policy. Moreover, the conversation was already changing b/c Obama beat OWS to the punch by 10 days. While conservatives and the MSM have been fixated on Herman Cain, and while liberals have been sign-waving, Obama has been winning the people's trust on the economy with his jobs plan. He up by 10 over the GOP now. All outside of your view.

        Paradigm shift all you want, but political power still flows through the ballot box. If money didn't buy votes, politicians wouldn't chase it.

        Shower -> I went to the local assembly, and my olfactory senses are intact.

        Dear #OWS: Put down your signs, take a bath, and start the hard work of electing people to office!!!

        by DeanObama on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 04:42:54 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  If you believe this, then (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Cartoon Messiah, aufklaerer
          political power still flows through the ballot box.
          this movement may not be for you.  Nothing wrong with that.  You can go and support the DLC, corporatist, Third Way Democratic leadership.

          OWS is looking for ways to create something different.  That cannot happen unless you move past the old, worn out  better of two evils.

          •  I'm not a moderate. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:

            I was a senior leader in Democracy for Tennessee before I started grad school and had to give it up. My progressive credentials are strong.

            I don't want to occupy anything. I want to take over the Democratic Party and remake it in a progressive image. I want to turn the Democratic Party into a lean, mean machine that can run over the GOP. I want to return to the heady days of 2006 and 2008 when we took back the Congress and the White House. I want more and better Democrats. I want to return to the 1960s and 1990s when jobs were plentiful and everyones' wages went up.

            You can talk and march all you want. However, if the GOP wins in 2012, it's bye-bye Social Security, bye-bye Medicare, bye-bye Medicaid, bye-bye PPACA, bye-bye Dodd-Frank, and bye-bye minimum wage. It's hello 4.5% middle class tax increase. OWS is leading us down the wrong path.

            Dear #OWS: Put down your signs, take a bath, and start the hard work of electing people to office!!!

            by DeanObama on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 06:25:14 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I'm still going to vote (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:

              Of course. Nothing about the movement and voting habits are mutually exclusive. But, if the level of frustration with both parties has wrought this movement, it is not up to the movement to change. How can one say that individuals participating in their democracy is harming the country? No, it is up to the politicians to decide who they work for, once and for all. And this movement is moving the conversation to the left. Every true progressive and liberal should be rejoicing. We are finally having a national conversation of substance, without a predetermined outcome dictated by corporate powers and their political and media subsidiaries.

              •  Howard Dean said: "Voting gets you a D-" (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:

                Talk is impotent.

                Just voting gets you a D-

                It's the hard work of going door-to-door finding voters, drawing up plans to find those voters, raising the money to find those voters, and making sure those voters show up at the polls on election day that changes the dialogue. The GOP was dying before the Tea Party arrived on the scene. After winning a few primaries, they drove the GOP and the political narrative to the right. Then they got elected and started enacting their agenda in FL, OH, PA,  TN, WI, and other states. If we progressives don't get our act together, they are going to drive that force right into the White House. And #OWS has made it clear that they aren't interested in stopping that power. If anything, they are diverting human capital away from the needed response.

                I don't want politicians to make up their mind and hope they come down on our side. I don't want more "consensus building." I want to amass a political force so massive that politicians push our agenda. I want to amass a political force so massive that those who don't push our agenda will be replaced by those who will. I want to kick some ass.

                I know that many people here are disappointed with the "change" that we got from Obama. However, as Rachel Maddow once pointed out, Obama is a master of allowing people to project their hopes and asperations onto him and seeing in him what they want to see. In reality, neither Hillary nor Obama would deliever what we want. Dean or Feingold maybe, but not Obama. Now that it has turned out that we really didn't get "more and better Democrats" in 2006 and 2008 and then lost the House in 2010, we are ready to junk that model in favor of ... some amorphous and undefined movement upon which you are projecting your hopes and asperations? "Fool me once ... you can't get fooled again!"

                No thank you. I'd rather find some bona fide progressives who have a proven track record of producing progressive results and put them into office. I'd rather build up a political machine that will keep them acting like progressives until they leave office. Otherwise, the GOP will win, and they will repeal the 20th century.

                Dear #OWS: Put down your signs, take a bath, and start the hard work of electing people to office!!!

                by DeanObama on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 11:38:05 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

  •  Um I never dreamed of a massive economic collapse (0+ / 0-)

    I'm glad the left is speaking up, but I could do without the economics that got us here. From Dictatorship to Democracy, Guide to Non Violent Protests.

    by sdelear on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:18:36 PM PDT

    •  I've long felt... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kat68, aufklaerer, Mrs M

      that just like an addict, you need to hit rock bottom before you finally turn around and realize you need to commit yourself to a different direction.

      I thought that might happen when George W. Bush was elected Selected.  And when Bush ignored Bin Laden and let 9-11 happen on his watch.  When he lost Bin Laden at Tora Bora.  When he decided instead to go after Saddam Hussein who had nothing to do with it.  When he used torture and forgeries to bamboozle the nation into supporting his War.  When the weapons inspectors said our WMD intel was "garbage after garbage". When we invaded ANYWAY.  When Big Bad Saddam collapsed like a paper napkin. Then the insurgency started.  Then Gitmo.  Then Abu Ghraib. The massacre of Haditha. The massacre of Moumudaiya. John Kerry and the purple heart bandaids. The Sinking of an American City, followed by the second disaster of Bush's disinterest in the starving, dehydrated and stranded citizens of New Orleans. BlackWater. Wackenhut. $25 Billion disappears into a cloud of smoke in Iraq. The Swiftboaters.  Bush re-elected under a cloud of Ohio voter suppression. The Downing Street Memos.  Amnesty International called for Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld's prosecution.  Warrantless Wiretaps. The Prescription Drug Bill. The Midnight Ride back to Congress to SAVE. TERRY. SCHIAVO! And then as Bush finally scampers out the back door the entire deck of wet playing cards that his economic policy of letting the Robber Baron's Rape and Pillage the American Worker, the American Consumer and the American Environment finally came crashing down like a Fat Man and Little Boy over Nagasaki and Hiroshima.

      Then the Tea Party Hate-riots showed up and splashed us all with a firehose anti-Government Fear and Bile, with Koch-Funded, Heritage endorsed talking points of lunacy on the tips of their tongues.

      "Keep your Government hands off my Medicare!"

      I mean, really?  Seriously?!?

      And still it took another Two Years for some real Patriots to finally begin to Demonstrate against the endless Outrage.  It took Occupy Wall Street.

      We finally hit Rock Bottom.  I knew it had to happen, but I also knew it was going to hurt.  Badly.


  •  I remember listening to Keith's comment and (6+ / 0-)

    thinking that he was dreaming, that a mass uprising just wasn't going to happen here as long as the public was so easily distracted by the activities of celebrities famous for being famous.

    Never have I loved so much being wrong.  Thank you OWS.

    There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody. - Elizabeth Warren

    by Susan Grigsby on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:30:55 PM PDT

  •  ya had me with you until... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    the stupidity of posting "police brutality" and showing the mounted patrol.

    get OFF that people!  it only discredits your diaries/posts/purpose!

    as a former new yorker, i can assure you that the mounted patrol are used for crowd control in a very NON brutal way!

    the size of the beast is what makes people move - and their own ignorance of a horse's behavior.

    really - please drop that aspect - it discredits what you're trying to do!

    the rest of the diary was good, btw.  it's just that now, that last video clippy bit has turned me off to the point i'm not interested in reading the comments to hear people raging "ANIMAL ABUSE!  CRUELTY!k etc. like in another stupid diary posted with the same video.

    my point? THINK before you post and be damned sure you know what you're talking about before you hit the send button.

    if you'd wanted police brutality - there is sufficient footage to back that up - girl with backback dragged under orange fence; motorcycle sitting on neutral observer's leg while he screams; pepper spraying white shirt; etc.

    a line of quiet horses standing in a vee formation is NOT brutality - it is a known and SAFE technique to move a large number of people to a different spot without injury (unless you're a dumb*ss kid with a video camera who decides to film and scream a commentary into the camera THEN screams the horse stepped on his foot! - he should'a effin' moved out of the way - even if only moving his foot six inches to the side.  - trust me on this - you can move your foot out of the way of the horse's foot - after all, the hoof is ONLY about six inches in width and depth.  they ain't that big (the feet, that is).

    Is GlowNZ back yet?

    by edrie on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:33:07 PM PDT

    •  did you see that poor horse almost falling over (4+ / 0-)

      and thrashing about?  Luckily there weren't any protesters right there because that was hella dangerous.

      and if you have ever been in a huge crowd, moving is not always an immediate option. I once had a burning cigarette wedged between my arm and another person's arm and couldn't even move enough to let it fall.  I got a nasty burn from it  which later turned septic.

      #Occupy Wallstreet - Politicians will not support the movement until it is too big to fail.

      by Sychotic1 on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:53:18 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  i've been looking at that video in slomo... (0+ / 0-)

        and am appalled - someone had a poster right over the horses' head - flat and on top of it... people in the crowd were slapping at the horse.

        that the horse wasn't hurt - that the rider was able to stay on and keep the horse upright (and, YES, the rider was the reason the horse didn't go down - he kept the horse's head and neck upright and kept the horse from falling...) that the horse didn't lose the rider and bolt through the crowd was a miracle!

        why were there horses?  obviously, the crowd showed NO respect for the officers on foot - and if you look at that video carefully as to WHY the officers were trying to corral the crowd - there were friggin vehicles moving in the street behind the officers where the crowd kept pushing forward (and pushing the officers INTO the oncoming traffic.

        i'm sorry - this was a mob - it isn't a peaceful protest - it was a mob with people trying to incite the crowd further - as witnessed by those trying to grab the barricades and push them back onto the officers - and that is why the man with the green shirt got arrested - and why the woman was pushed.  the officer CLEARLY is saying "LET GO OF THE FUCKING BARRICADE!"  the damned crowd was pushing them IN FRONT of the moving traffic!

        if this is the way this "movement" is headed, i'm not lending support!

        the behavior of the crowd is appalling - it is a mob.  mobs turn quickly and ugly when there is enough "incitement" - and there was plenty of vocal incitement by a number of males in that crowd.  

        is this movement about changing wall street, income inequality or about rioting in the streets?  too many here keep comparing this to the "arab spring" - well, that turned pretty ugly pretty quickly, didn't it?

        what is WRONG with people who act against their own best interest.  losing the support of the greater population is not going to create change - it will do the opposite and drive many who SHOULD be supporting the reason for this "occupation" into the arms of the tea party and republicans!

        talk about dumb*ss moves! - almost as smart as slapping, hitting a 1200 lb animal!  dumb! dumber!! dumbest!!!

        Is GlowNZ back yet?

        by edrie on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:25:27 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Maybe it has something to do with (0+ / 0-)

          the NYPD antagonizing them for a month. And some bad apples?

          Wish there was more to the front of the video. It looked like there were a few cars going about .1 mile an hour, then moments later there are zero cars behind them to the left, looks like they were trying to pull back the barricade and get access to go into a large empty intersection...

          This is fairly rare. I think it's just a small group fed up, not thinking, and just blindly resisitng a bunch of fucking in-your-face cops in riot gear, hiding behind a large crowd.

          This, is bigger than this. Maybe I'm being pathologically optimistic, oh well the cops love that shit... get to put on their little helmets and stuff...

          civil unrest is messy, maybe a happy little flower power protest won't do anything to change an entire fucking corporate illusion we are all trapped in.

          I think just like after they found out the park wasn't being cleaned a small group later got into some shit, there is always one small faction that instigates, not representative of the whole.

          This video is just a snapshot of one area in the middle of tens of thousands of people.

          •  where i think you're off base (and i agree with (0+ / 0-)

            much of what you said) was assuming the officers "like" this - they are trying to keep a very large crowd from turning into a riot.

            the instigators in this instance were deliberately trying to push the police into acting against them.  the young man who keeps screaming in their faces "who are you protecting" doesn't get that it is their JOB to protect not only the city, but them, as well.

            yes, there are bad apples in the big apple and those officers need to be held accountable - but this instance (and the reason i objected to the label "police brutality" in both this and an earlier diary) does NOT represent police brutality at all!  it shows an attempt at crowd control - a very unruly and threatening crowd menacing the police officers more than the police officers are menacing the crowd.  the only serious risk of injury was to the officer and the horse when some fool slapped at it - either the fool with the sign or another person.  that horse was definitely shying away from something done to the HORSE by the crowd - NOT the other way around.

            that crowd was one step away from a riot.  that is NOT what this "occupation" should be about.  that will undermine and destroy any validity of the purpose of the group.

            again, this current batch of protestors would do well to learn the lessons taught by dr. king - non-violence - emanate peace not adrenalin fed verbal attacks and threats by the crowd toward the police.

            when the crowd becomes the problem, the cause is buried in the division over who was right and who was wrong - just like right now.

            wrong video to make a point - but a good one to show what the officers in new york are contending with - it isn't a simple "occupation" of a park in the city - this is borderline mob that isn't listening to anything but their own voices.  not good.

            Is GlowNZ back yet?

            by edrie on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 02:30:44 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

  •  Tracy Chapman (7+ / 0-)

    Talkin About a Revolution

    Don't you know you're talking about a revolution
    It sounds like a whisper
    Don't you know they're talking about a revolution
    It sounds like a whisper

    While they're standing in the welfare lines
    Crying at the doorsteps of those armies of salvation
    Wasting time in unemployment lines
    Sitting around waiting for a promotion

    Don't you know you're talking about a revolution
    It sounds like a whisper

    Poor people are gonna rise up
    And get their share
    Poor people are gonna rise up
    And take what's theirs

    Don't you know you better run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run
    Oh I said you better run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run, run

    Finally the tables are starting to turn
    Talking about a revolution
    Finally the tables are starting to turn
    Talking about a revolution oh no
    Talking about a revolution oh no

    While they're standing in the welfare lines
    Crying at the doorsteps of those armies of salvation
    Wasting time in unemployment lines
    Sitting around waiting for a promotion

    Don't you know you're talking about a revolution
    It sounds like a whisper

    And finally the tables are starting to turn
    Talking about a revolution
    Finally the tables are starting to turn
    Talking about a revolution oh no
    Talking about a revolution oh no
    Talking about a revolution oh no

    "The most authentic thing about us is our capacity to create, to overcome, to endure, to transform, to love and to be greater than our suffering."

    by rlharry on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:37:17 PM PDT

  •  i am so furious i can't see straight! (0+ / 0-)

    this crowd is dangerous and flat out stupid!

    there WAS no police brutality in that film!  i saw officers trying to calm an out of control crowd - a protester striking an officer with a sign, hitting at the horses, officers saying "HOA>>>>HOA>>>> to calm his horse, another horse trying to back away from the crowd and one that slipped almost falling on the officer (which could have seriously injured or killed him).

    the CROWD was instigating and trying to start a f*cking RIOT!

    this is NOT good - it is NOT GOOD!!!!

    what the HELL is wrong with the so-called "peaceful" protestors?!?!?

    that video shows officers with great restraint trying to stop the crowd from surging and going into the horses - which would cause a great deal more harm than anyone could ever imagine.

    the officer who supposedly was "striking" the "woman" was saying "LET GO OF THE FUCKING FENCE!!!" as the police tried to keep the crowd from rushing forward.

    i'm sorry, vyan, your video shows an out of control, non-peaceful crowd on the verge of riot.  had i been in that crowd, i'd have been looking for any escape to get out.  it was a mob on the verge of succeeding in breaking out of the baracades.

    wanna guess what would have happened next?  well, to give a hint, during the anti war marches, some of these same types of provacative idiots (like the ones striking at the horses and the police) - let's give them their chosen names in s.f., the anarchists - broke out after the march ended and broke windows and tried to do as much damage as possible.

    this "occupation" is no longer an "occupation" according to that "brutality" video you posted - it is a mob.

    i do not agree with this behavior - it hurts more than it helps in getting support and gaining sympathy.  now people will react to the violence of the crowd (and YES, there was violence FROM the crowd toward the police!) instead of hearing what the stated purpose of OWS is.

    this is getting way out of hand - and it isn't the police who are doing it!

    Is GlowNZ back yet?

    by edrie on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:43:42 PM PDT

    •  They should probably (5+ / 0-)

      just let them march and leave them alone in the first place rather than getting all up in their faces with their new $4.6 million in riot gear, horses, batons and pepper spray, corralling them all up and actually causing the "mobs" and "riots".

      One would think that thousands of people marching through the streets of NYC should just be left alone to march down the street.

      If there were no cops there nothing would have ever happened, besides a march.

      Maybe you should check out some other beating or pepper spray videos, and also read how other cities police forces just make an appearance in their cars, smile and let it be over and done with.

      Seems like the cities that arrest everyone and make a big scene kind of never really needed to... maybe it's about money, like everything...

      •  yeah, right. let the crowd march into oncoming (0+ / 0-)

        traffic - smart move!  let the instigators start breaking windows... right.

        that'll teach all those monied bastards, won't it - and those same monied bastards will have the votes to remove dems from congress and possibly the white house when the average person at home sees rioting in the streets.

        the "average person" isn't looking for riots, he/she is looking for security and safety.

        this plays right into the hands of the right.

        stupid moves on the agitators - very VERY stupid moves!

        ny hasn't been stellar by any means in this situation - however, there was great restraint shown in that last video - the "white shirt" who backed off the officer who lost control and tried to use his baton.

        LOOK at that video!  LOOK at it!  the officers are trying to keep the traffic and the protestors apart!  there are cabs and cars driving behind the officers - and there are a few in the crowd trying to push those same officers into the path of those cars.

        the people who are on the streets doing this learned nothing from MLK, Jr., they learned absolutely NOTHING from the protests (PEACEFUL) of the 60s and 70s.  these goons that are inciting and baiting the officers in this particular video are there to foment trouble.

        and, yes, i've seen the other videos and have registered my opinion on those - had this diary chosen to show the most vivid disgusting example from yesterday (the motorcycle sitting on top of the observer's leg), then i'd not be in this diary or the other one objecting.

        it is the deliberate distortion and misrepresentation of fact and then cheering on the self-righteousness of the indignation at that same distortion that really gets to me.

        talk about discrediting your own cause!  we have a small group who think nothing of distorting the clearly visible to try to score cheap points with their audience.  that hurts me, you, every single person affected by the corruption and inequality in our system right now.

        we need to be ever vigilent of the truth otherwise we hold no credence with the rest of the population... but being a star on the orange seems more important than truth, sometimes.

        that is the real pity... and shame.

        Is GlowNZ back yet?

        by edrie on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:33:27 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  btw, just an fyi.... in ny, it is common every (0+ / 0-)

        new year's eve for between 500,000 and 1,000,000 to peaceably gather between barricades in a tight space to celebrate the coming of the new year.

        there are no riots.  there is no pushing and shoving.  there are no voices hurling out slogans - just people in a VERY tight space working together.

        imagine what would have happened if these same rules applied to this movement.  tens of thousands of very quiet voices holding vigil - drawing attention to the inequities of our economic world - instead of calling attention to their "foes" - the police.

        this WILL backfire - it WILL cost votes in november.  the american middle fears the mob - and now, that mob is us!

        the worst part is that it won't "fix" the problems that drew so many to the protest to begin with... it will only exacerbate them.

        Is GlowNZ back yet?

        by edrie on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:37:19 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Olando police were great! (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ohmyheck, blueoasis, Cartoon Messiah

        The Orlando police HELPED the marchers march.

        As it should be.

  •  Freedom from Obamacentric-ness (7+ / 0-)

    was key imo.

  •  Occupy Congress 2012 (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    My heroes have the heart to live the life I want to live.

    by JLFinch on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 12:54:45 PM PDT

  •  Thanks for this great post! I walked the fringes (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    blueoasis, raines

    of the Times Square protest Saturday.  I'm not the type to jump in with both feet, especially since I can't risk bogus arrest and/or lose my job.  (I'm sole breadwinner.)

    It was quite stirring to watch actual democracy in action. So much diversity in the crowd: young, middle-agers, some 60+'s too, white, black, Latin, Asian, men, women and some kids too w/their parents.  People were orderly, respectful.  There was a real feeling of togetherness, commeraderie.  I hope that has more time to build before the authorities come in hard core to break this thing up.

    I would love to see this thing keep going.

    So to borrow a line from "Hill Street Blues": Let's be careful out there!

    When everybody talkin' all at once no one can hear the wise one speak, So just be still and silence will provide the wisdom that you seek - by Tori del Allen

    by Dumas EagerSeton on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:07:45 PM PDT

  •  "They" remain? (5+ / 0-)

    "We", my friend! As of course you know. Because it's not just people on the street that are a part of this. There are many of us who can't make it to the street but we will do our part elsewhere.

    Because we are with you!
    I am with you!

  •  I was probably less than 100 feet... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Old Gardener, blueoasis

    From the "equestrian siege" and didn't see any of it. I did hear some of it, and chant along, but that behavior on behalf of police is just completely unacceptable. Now I know why that Marine was so angry. The police have no crowd control plan whatsoever, apparently, in confines that close. And to be honest I'm almost equally as angry that they're putting the horses in danger. The one that slipped could have easily broke a leg.

    Slap happy is a platform.

    by averageyoungman on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:36:10 PM PDT

  •  Long time coming. (5+ / 0-)

    Way overdue, in fact.  Like you, I was wondering if we'd ever see it.  This is the most hopeful development of our times.  Inspired and inspirational.  Don't know why this particular thing caught on.  I do know I'm glad it did.

    From Nashville last Saturday:

    Grab all the joy you can. (exmearden 8/10/09)

    by Land of Enchantment on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:38:11 PM PDT

  •  I agree with the need for a Movement, but .... (0+ / 0-)

    First and foremost, this movement is long overdue. I wish there had been this sort of galvanizing event before the 2010 elections. instead, the GOP had the momentum.

    let's translate it in to success at the ballot box. the way to do that is to broaden the appeal and draw in more folks. they will not come if they think we are violent, or espousing violence.

    Now, the one comment I would make, is about the "police violence" depicted in all these videos. Some of these videos, shot at night, were of very poor quality, but the one today with good lighting showed a clearly planned and well-executed response to crowd control, almost as if the police were the linemen of a football team. in fact, you could diagram what they were doing as if it were a sports paly-by-play. The horses were in a phalanx, under control except for one incident in which a horse was momentarily spooked - I sure hope it was not due to having been assaulted by a protester.

    the street patrolmen in front of the horses were maintaining a line, and trying to reset the barricade despite the crowd. Yes, I did see them going at it, with a couple of the protesters. One in particular was a bald guy with a green jacket. the cop had a stick but did not hit him in the head; yes, I saw the cop in the video punch him, I think this was a two-way exchange. the cop in the white shirt came over ( a captian I guess) and you could then see them pull the green shirted guy out of the line, through the police side, on his way to getting arrested..... so, the police were able to execute an orderly process of separating out the ones they wanted, as evidenced by this video.

    so, I think the action overall was a success; but as far as police over-reaction is concerned, I do not think there was any. I think the accusations of police violence here, need to be toned down, and people who are going to be particpating in these events as demonstrators, need to be better trained.

    to be violent, or to escalate, or even to espouse violence, is not the answer. it never is.

    "I want us to live up to her expectations. I want our democracy to be as good as she (Christina Taylor-Greene) imagined it." President Obama

    by guavaboy on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 01:40:09 PM PDT

  •  We've been so used to the world the shit way (3+ / 0-)

    it's been for so long that we think it has to stay that way. Most still do - but maybe it doesn't?

  •  Asking Just Another Question (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ohmyheck, blueoasis

    It doesn't matter that they don't have an specific agenda.  They aren't trying to come up with the answers, they asking a question!.

           Just Another Question

    Another day working for the laugh track
    Third of my pay I get nothing back
    Another day in the two-party system
    One speaks for the devil the other for the businessman
    And what the hell's up with that?
    All of a sudden
    Laws start getting passed
    That I don't remember requesting
    Am I citizen or am I just a guest here?
    And didn't I express my opinion?
    Oh yeah, but you weren't fucking listening
    And then the bombs start falling
    Distraction from what's really going on.

    And it's just another question
    Just another answer I won't be getting.

    We are the 99%. We are the mob. We areToo Big To Fail.

    by ActivistGuy on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 02:11:49 PM PDT

  •  Feels better doesn't it? (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ActivistGuy, ohmyheck, blueoasis

    Not until people take to the streets can the magnitude of just how many people have been damaged by the financial disaster.  I'm really amazed at some of the comments people really think that many of our current Democratic leadership didn't have a part in all of this?  At the very best they were enablers, at the worst they were co-conspirators.
    This is the American people speaking, both parties will be held accountable.

  •  I have a terrible admission (7+ / 0-)

    Some of you know that I have three grandchildren.  When the first was born five years ago, when I saw his little face, heard the first little "meepy" noises he made, when I first held him, my joy was mingled with sadness and fear.  What kind of world would he grow up in?  Did he have a chance at a decent education?  Would there be clean water for him to drink?  Would there be untainted food for him to eat?  Would he be trampled in the upheavals of global warming?  Would he find fulfilling work?

    I wondered if it would have been better if he had not been born.  

    That isn't how a grandmother should feel.  

    Decades before, my husband and I had independently come to the quiet conclusion that it was too late for humans on Planet Earth.  That we had destroyed too much, that we had grown too much, that we had let our social structures get out of control, that no matter how many of the good people that we knew worked at it, we were really powerless to change what seemed to be an ever-darkening future.

    I was blessed with two granddaughters seven and nine months ago.  I admit I greeted them with the same mix of love and grief.  

    Much as I love children, much as I have always surrounded myself with children, much as I wanted to know the special relationship that a grandparent has with a grandchild, I had hoped for years that my children would not have children.

    Because I didn't believe there could be a good future for them.

    I have worked hard for (and sometimes felt betrayed by) what I thought were good causes and good candidates.  But the world just kept getting worse.  I believe in making the best of things, and approaching situations positively, but in my heart of hearts I did not have hope.

    Until the last few weeks.  

    As Vyan said so simply and beautifully, I never dared to dream we might see change of this kind.  I could imagine a better world, but I couldn't see how we could get there together.  I couldn't imagine that our grandchildren or our neighbors' grandchildren might grow up in a better world.  

    I can't offer enough gratitude to the people who have literally put their lives, their safety, their freedom on the line.  Thank you.  You've given Nana hope.  

    I have no help to send. Therefore I must go myself. Aragorn

    by Old Gardener on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 02:30:01 PM PDT

    •  Old Gardner, three granddaughters and one grandson (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Old Gardener, aufklaerer, Randtntx

      here.  Aren't they a joy?  

      Confession.  I got an American Girl catalogue in the mail today and almost cried.  My granddaughters are out growing dolls!

      Oh well, I have a two and a half year old grandson, and he is in to dump trucks, anything mechanical or construction related, and oh, the Apple Store in NYC is his favorite place to visit.

      I too hope for a better world for our grandchildren.

      •  Yes, they are a joy. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        Our grandson likes trucks and Hexbugs and Legos, but he is also very nurturant, and takes good care of his Curious George stuffed toy.  Do you know what he wants to be when he grows up?  "I want to be a Papa."

        I have no help to send. Therefore I must go myself. Aragorn

        by Old Gardener on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 06:17:13 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  My three grandkids... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Old Gardener, blueoasis, aufklaerer

      ... are in Germany, with my daughter and her husband who is in the Army.

      The two who were born in Germany I was looking into how hard or easy it will be for them to move back to Germany when they are grown up.

      How's that for a sad statement on the U.S.A. these days?

      "I believe in a government which acts, which exercises its full powers and full responsibilities. Government is an art and a precious obligation..." JFK

      by Rick Aucoin on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 04:02:37 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  My kids (30 & 26) decided in (4+ / 0-)

      high school they would not have any of their own. They report others in their generations (genx & mill) also will not continue the overpopulation. Patients my age have told me the same thing about their kids.

      I am still fighting for humanity, here and globally. I was convinced as a teenager (~45 years ago) that the multiple global problems would escalate to a point of conflict/uprising during my lifetime, probably just after the new millennia.

      I had been watching and hoping ever since. There is no doubt in my mind that it has started.  This was linked in another diary.

      Occupy Wall Street Seismic Effects

      Really superb analysis by Peter Beinart. A long view of protests and politics, past and present.

      "People, even more than things, have to be restored, renewed, revived, reclaimed and redeemed; never throw out anyone. " Audrey Hepburn "A Beautiful Woman"

      by Ginny in CO on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 04:15:39 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Occupy Everywhere! (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    blueoasis, aufklaerer

    Thanks to all the Occupiers and those who support them.

    All Occupations need water, blankets, food.

  •  Just a brief comment. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Catte Nappe, NWTerriD, SwedishJewfish

    There has been a lot of focus here on what some call police brutality and I don't doubt that there has been some pretty bad behavior by some of the NYPD.  I don't also doubt that the protestors haven't been model citizens and may have infiltrators.  Call it false equivalency, if you want but it is likely the truth.  

    I would not like to think that the focus of OWS has turned from the real issues of inequality, jobs, and disfunctional government, to a focus on bad behavior by police, or the protesters.  

    If it does, Wall Street wins.  

    I would not like to think that the focus of OWS has turned into an Obama vs. the Anti-Obama crowd.

    If it does, Wall Street wins.      

  •  It can still be stopped, don't kid yourself into (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    blueoasis, NWTerriD, aufklaerer

    being complacent. OTOH, it is so encouraging to see this finally happening and catching on. I fervently hope we can stoke it and keep it growing till it hits critical mass. In the US and around the world.

    Does anyone know if the Uncut movement has joined in? That was getting some pretty good traction in the UK, but I haven't heard anything about them in a while.

    Information is abundant, wisdom is scarce. The Druid

    by FarWestGirl on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 03:23:42 PM PDT

  •  Great diary. (4+ / 0-)

    You're right, of course.   One step at a time, and of course, the first step is to change the conversation.  

    What kind of people are we, and what kind of a society do we want to live in?     I'm done with them privatizing the profits, and socializing the loses.  They bailed out Wall Street, and they hung Main Street out to dry.  

    Matt Taibbi:  This is an issue for the traditional "left" because it's a classic instance of overweening corporate power -- but it's an issue for the traditional "right" because these same institutions are also the biggest welfare bums of all time, de facto wards of the state who sucked trillions of dollars of public treasure from the pockets of patriotic taxpayers from coast to coast.

    Both traditional constituencies want these companies off the public teat and back swimming on their own in the cruel seas of the free market, where they will inevitably be drowned in their corruption and greed, if they don't reform immediately. This is a major implicit complaint of the OWS protests and it should absolutely strike a nerve with Tea Partiers, many of whom were talking about some of the same things when they burst onto the scene a few years ago.  

    Yes we can, but he won't.

    by dkmich on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 03:31:49 PM PDT

  •  The best part about OWS... (4+ / 0-) that it's not about all the celebrities you list here, and it wasn't started because of anything Keith Olbermann or Al Gore said.

    I'm talking about my grades! What can I say, I studied hard.

    by I Am The Top One Percent on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 04:39:59 PM PDT

  •  The forces of reaction have already begun (3+ / 0-)

    their attempt to divide and sow discord. Those forces, sad to say, are not all republican.

    They have been playing this game for a long time.

    They always demand the biggest carrot and then offer to rent us the stick. Occupy!

    by chuckvw on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 05:27:12 PM PDT

  •  I wasn't surprised that I was protesting (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    blueoasis, aufklaerer

    What did shock me was the 150,000 other people that were there. The parade that very nearly ran me over, because I didn't see them coming surprised me as well. I got a pat on the back from the Senate minority leader so that I would turn around and see that I was in the way.

    That was a day I thought I'd never see. It still seems like a dream. Madison lit the fire. I never thought everyone else would shake off the apathy. I had waited for everyone else to come around more to my way of thinking for all my life. Now, all reasonable people sort of had to...

    Before that, I had always assumed that I had no problem voting for a black guy, especially one so obviously much more qualified than the other guy, but I really thought he'd lose. I had assumed that everyone else was far too racist to get it done.

    Everyone else has been surprising me a lot, lately. Lately, I've been consistently underestimating there potential.


  •  Well, I made it this far (0+ / 0-)
    The President was a serial capitulator-in-chief who was destined to cave.

    It's a shame, I might have agreed with the rest of the post.

  •  Re (0+ / 0-)
    Why does all of our national and international wealth seemed to be disappearing into the massive maw of Wall Street and Big Business?  Why do we work harder and longer and continue to get less and less - while being expected to give more and more?

    Because there are seven billion people on the planet, all who wish to live like Americans do. Since the resources for that outcome do not exist, someone has to take the hit, and the people taking the hit are workers in the developed world.

    Not the answer you wanted, I'm sure, but there it is. The top 1% make 23% of the income of the nation. Even if you cut their income in half and redistributed it, the other 99% would only get slightly more than a 10% raise.

    OWS is a spasm of the dying suburban culture, a seething rage by people who spent years and years building an unsustainable mess out of the country and are now enraged that it cannot be sustained. Expect more of this as peak oil and fierce economic competition for resources continue to turn the screws.

    (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
    Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

    by Sparhawk on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 08:29:46 PM PDT

  •  At best, the system is deeply flawed (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    and in need of serious reform, because it's not doing what it's supposed to do, which is to create fairly if not necessarily equally distributed wealth that provides us with the goods and services we need to live comfortable and safe lives. It once was able to do this (for the most part), but it no longer is, and needs reform.

    At worst, the system has been steadily rigged precisely in order to unfairly AND unequally distribute wealth, away from the masses and towards the already rich. It was never entirely fair or equal, but now it's hugely unfair and unequal.

    In reality, it's a mixture of both. In fact the legitimate need for modernization reform (because all systems need to be updated from time to time) was exploited by the rich as an excuse to game the system in their favor. It's as if you took your car in for routine maintenance, and they put in a new engine and transmission and charged you triple what the entire car was worth--and threatened to take your car if you didn't pay on the spot.

    They are shakedown artists and racketeers posing as bankers and corporate executives. They don't create, they extract, destructively, and leave us the slag heaps. They are the financial equivalent of fracking. And they're fracking us over.

    Time to frack them back--big time.

    "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

    by kovie on Mon Oct 17, 2011 at 09:19:26 PM PDT

  •  Participate! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Mrs M

    You don't have to go all in.  
    Spend a Saturday at your local Occupy.  
    Stop by after work.  
    See how a General Assembly works.  
    Go when you can and support those who represent you by being there everyday.

    It's not how much you do that matters because no one person's efforts will affect the outcome in any meaningful way.  What matters is that everyone engages to the extent they are able.

    The day will come when someone, perhaps your children or grandchildren, will ask "What did you do in the Occupy movement?"  We are the people we've been waiting for.

    Houston, Tranquility Park here, #occupyhouston has landed.

    We kidnap. We torture. It's our policy. Embrace it or end it!

    by Mosquito Pilot on Tue Oct 18, 2011 at 04:20:12 AM PDT

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