I’m a fan of the Jimmy Dore Show. It’s very funny, and I like all of the regulars on it.
On the December 1, 2011 podcast of the Jimmy Dore Show, Jimmy and his guest hosts Frank Conniff, Paul Gilmartin, and Robert Yasumura discussed a phone call between Jimmy and UC Davis spokesman Andy Fell about their disgusting pepper spray incident.
Jimmy asked him to clarify the university’s policy for use of chemical weapons on non-violent protestors. Mr. Fell hemmed and hawed, and Jimmy blew a gasket.
The co-hosts were somewhat uncomfortable with the relentlessness of Jimmy’s questioning, and his anger Level. Jimmy was accused by a listener of coming off as a bully with a chip on his shoulder.
Paul ”[W]ished that journalists were somewhere halfway between where they are and where you were on that phone call.”
(Note: I like Paul Gilmartin and appreciate where he was coming from, that he’s enough of a friend to Jimmy to tell him when he thinks he’s wrong. Don't entirely agree with him, though.)
I wrote to Jimmy about the feedback from the call:
Speaking as a progressive blue shirt (rank and file 911 call-runner), your phone call to that English guy was the most satisfying piece of coverage I’ve heard among progressive commentators thus far. It was also highly effective activism IMHO, for reasons I’ll discuss below.
For the Cliff Notes version, please understand that the interplay between citizens and public safety is rock, paper, scissors. Remember how that works and who beats who – rock breaks scissors, scissors cuts paper, paper covers rock.
Rock = blue shirts (police, firefighters, paramedics who run 911 calls/rank and file)
Paper = politicians —> public safety department heads —> white shirts (supervisors)
Scissors = citizens
You calling from a podcast to chew on one of their department heads is “scissors v. paper.” Demanding that he clarify the parameters of their use of force policy is again, “scissors v. paper.” (See: WINNING)
Unfortunately almost all civilians approach it from “scissors v. rock,” or want the rock to initiate “rock v. rockpile.” If civilians don’t want to get hit by rocks, they need to cut the paper, or at least credibly threaten to. Similarly, they need to get the paper off the rocks so they can see them. Right now the situation we have is paper covering rocks 24/7, in way that benefits only paper and ugly rocks.
We need to get the rocks out from under the paper, sift through and find the diamonds (which will be be vastly outnumbered by hunks of gravel just like in the rest of life). A few diamonds like Captain Lewis do exist, but softer beautiful stones like rubies, opals, and emeralds get routinely ground into dust in the current environment.
Regarding the “they’re afraid to lose their jobs” trope, that’s a byproduct of a monologue that gets mistaken for a dialogue. Both sides of the argument are taken by civilians, so the whole frame is goofy. From my email to Jimmy:
It isn’t a simple matter of “losing their jobs.” You know enough cops to understand that it isn’t their job, it’s their identity. And it won’t just be this job that you lose. You won’t just be figuring out how to avoid foreclosure until you can get another cop job (which takes much longer than getting a civilian job anyway, even when they’re hiring, unlike now when they’re all laying off). Showing up on radar as an activist will get you blackballed forever. They will not only find a way to get rid of you, they will shit on your name with every speck of shit they can muster.
I guess it’s hard to understand how far beyond losing your job it goes. It’s more like forfeiting your identity and being cast out of your tribe, and oh, by the way, you’re out of a job. Hopefully your vocational retraining goes well, because you’ll need a whole new career. Tick tock!
Robert Yasumura’s comment blew my mind. Let me say that I like Robert, he’s a good comedian and seems like a nice guy. By all means if he knows something I don’t know I’m all ears. My jaw literally dropped when I heard this:
Robert Yasumura: By the way, they’re not going to lose their jobs, they’re unionized. You get a lawyer the moment someone calls you into the office.
I don’t know where he gets his information, but in my personal experience the only thing my union did for me was give my chain of command a way to not have to deal with me or answer my questions. “I can’t discuss that with you, you have union representation.” They were wrong and they knew it, but they also know how to maneuver through the union and use it as a wedge against employees when it serves them.
Jimmy Dore: That’s hilarious. I didn’t even think of that. The cops are unionized so they have protection for their jobs.
If “hilarious” is a euphemism for “wildly inaccurate,” then yes, this whole segment of the podcast is hilarious.
Paul Gilmartin: So if one of them had refused to move those students or do anything –
Jimmy Dore: There would have to be a hearing.
Remember the IA Detective who wouldn’t harass Bill O’Reilly’s boyfriend-in-law? His name is Richard Harasym. He got demoted for demonstrating his integrity. There’s no way to know how that incident affected the unnamed officer in question. That was one ethical officer standing behind another ethical officer against the 1%. My guess is they’re both collateral damage, but we’ll never know because police aren’t allowed to express personal opinions.
Was there a civilian outcry to protest their treatment? Any “scissors on paper” action to support ethical law enforcement? I missed it if there was. Did the union help them?
Robert Yasumura: It would be very hard to fire them.
Jimmy Dore: I think they would be in the clear right now, but they would also probably not be considered for a promotion. So while you might not lose your job, you might lose a career trajectory that you hope for.
I like all of these guys. I’m gobsmacked by the misinformation here. From my email to Jimmy:
The idea that the unions will protect any police who choose to advocate for citizens made my jaw drop. I literally made an audible gasp when I heard it. It’s perfectly logical from a civilian perspective, and in theory. In reality, for a blue shirt to publicly support/advocate would come down to “rock v. rockpile plus paper.”
In practice, in my experience, what public safety unions do is keep the primacy of bullies on lockdown. (This is also true of fire and EMS, on the rare occasions when medics have unions.) The unions are entirely political, and their agendas have almost nothing to do with the best and highest good of the membership or the citizens.
Money talks and bullshit walks.
I have to say that the blogger at www.fuddlesticks.com would probably not agree that the union will protect officers who stand up for the citizens. I wish podcasters would start calling Mayor Denis Law and asking him to clarify the city’s policies on personnel actions, shredding of incriminating public records, malicious prosecution, and cronyism in the promotion process.
That blogger, by the way, received numerous emails and phone calls that included threats, attempted bribes, attempted trickery, and other harassment from union members. S/he at one point took the blog and cartoon repository down for fear of being identified by internet providers. S/he has no doubt that if they (the union or the city) find out who s/he is, his/her life will get really ugly really fast.
I’d LOVE to hear what a great job the union has done of getting lawyers out to protect the ethical officers of Renton who stood up for the citizens.
::crickets::