Chris Hayes examined the resurgent culture war this morning on his program Up With Chris Hayes. After a segment examining the contraceptive "controversy," who better to invite than Maggie Gallagher to defend the righteous cause of culture war?
The founder of the National Organization for Marriage stepped down as president last year to launch a new project The Culture War Victory Fund. She remains on the board.
Chris begins by rightfully addressing why her organization does not address the issue that higher divorce rates coincided with the passing of "no-fault" divorce laws. If the goal was to focus on improving marriage, wouldn't repealing "no-fault" divorce laws be a better target than stopping marriage equality?
Maggie, begins by saying she's not an opponent of "marriage equality," she opposes "same-sex" marriage.
Touchy much?
She completely dodged Chris' question why NOM didn't focus on no-fault divorce laws tacking to the topic how the real problem is out-of-wedlock parents. NOM's strategy has long been to discuss at great length that social science studies that show that kids raised in single parent households fare worse than kids raised in two-parent households. This is a standard talking point and it's deeply flawed from a number of standpoints.
For one, it seems to presume banning or preventing marriage equality will have some effect on whether heterosexual people choose to marriage and/or assume the appropriate responsibility for raising the children they bring into the world? But how?
That kids in single parent households may not do as well should not be surprising. A single parent can only earn one income, a single parent is probably considerably more pressed for time than two. These are socio-economic issues, not morality issues. Single parents are not having a harder time providing well for their children because they are immoral people (who have been sucked into the "gay lifestyle," is that the implication?).
They are having a harder time because there are insufficient social safety nets to catch them when they need it. And, of course, living wages are hard to come by, inflation continues while and incomes stagnate.
Davis (MSNBC)
The problem with Gallagher equating "single parent" homes with "out-of-wedlock" parents, is it is not synonymous. Many unwed parents jointly care for their children, whether from the same roof or different roofs.
Another reason it's a bad talking point is it takes out a lot of collateral damage. Gallagher is tacitly equating "single parents" with "bad parents" and that can earn her the umbrage of people like panelist Michaela Angela Davis, an Editor at Essence magazine. Davis immediately took strong exception with Gallagher's messaging.
Davis was visibly upset that Maggie was defaming her family. She isn't married to her child's father, which is not synonymous with saying he is not involved. And she certainly feels confident she is providing a loving, supportive environment and that her child is thriving quite well (thank you for your concern, Ms. Gallagher). And she was quite clear to inform Gallagher of that.
Maggie called Ms. Davis an "exception" and "over-sensitive."
The sparks really fly when Richard Kim, executive editor of TheNation.com, gets a chance to address Gallagher. He begins by saying:
Kim: I think you and your organization have really failed to present any evidence that same-sex marriage impacts heterosexual marriages. You also however have advocated for gay reparative therapy, as has the National Organization for Marriage, you have called homosexuality a "dysfunction" and not normal...
Gallagher is really quite angry at this accusation.
Gallagher: No! I have not! I have not!
I have not done any of those things!
Kim continues:
Kim: So it's hard to escape the conclusion that there is just antigay animus and bogotry behind your campaign.
Gallagher is full of righteous indignation at the lies, the damn dirty lies!!!
Gallagher: You know you are making up---well, you can make up any conclusions you want. But you have just made up a bunch of facts that aren't true.
Chris Hayes steps in:
Hayes: Clarify, I am sorry, please clarify.
Gallagher: Well, I've never advocated for gay reparative therapy, and the National Organization for Marriage does not. We focus on fighting for laws that define marriage as the union between a man and a woman.
Unfortunately for Maggie, the proof that National Organization for Marriage is a fan of gay reparative therapy
still lives on the The Ruth Institute blog, described as a
"A Project of the National Organization for Marriage." It features an interview with a "therapist" Phillip Sutton, PhD who is affiliated with the notorious National Association for Research & Therapy of Homosexuality (
NARTH). You know, the clinic affiliated with
George Rekkers, who was later caught with a rent boy? They
canned him for that.
My first introduction to serving persons with unwanted homosexuality same-sex attractions or behaviors (SSA) as a mental health professional occurred while teaching in an MA in Counseling Program, 11 years before beginning such service. I have written about my initiation into this work elsewhere. In 2000, I served my first client who wanted help to resolve or better manage unwanted same-sex attractions.
So, the score would be:
Truth: Richard Kim.
Liar: Maggie Gallagher.
Gallagher left unaddressed Kim's assertion she had called homosexuality "a dysfunction." Jeremy Hooper over at GoodAsYou has the smoking gun:
For instance, Maggie has called homosexuality an "unfortunate thing" and "at a minimum, a sexual dysfunction much as impotence or infertility."
Hooper has assembled much more of
the ugliness that is Maggie Gallagher's talk on gays here. In short, yes,
Mrs. Srivastav Ms. Gallagher, you definitely said gays were dysfunctional and not normal. I daresay you genuinely believe it. I would in fact, encourage you to be true to your convictions, and not allow yourself to be bullied into politically correct talking points.
Updated score:
Truth: Richard Kim 2
Liar: Maggie Gallagher 2
I'm not crazy about these haters getting to spew their drivel on credible news outlets. That said, if they must be invited on, this is how it should be handled. Confront them with the honest truth of who they really are and what they really say, and what they really think. And let them stammer, shake, lie and meltdown. They aren't very good at debate because they spend most of their time preaching to the choir.
Maybe next time Tony Perkins comes on TV, as he did the other night, maybe someone will ask him about giving $80,000 to David Duke to buy his Ku Klux Klan mailing list?
Update: Not included in the embed, and unbeknownst to me when I posted this, Chris Hayes circled back later in the program and allowed Richard Kim to address Gallagher's allegation he was "making up facts."
He proved he was not.