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Politico:

“What Republicans don’t get is the more they fire back at Reid, the more he will fight,” said another top Reid confidante. “And in the end, what will the topic be? Romney and his taxes.”

Reid initially acknowledged to The Huffington Post that he’s not “certain” that the information is correct. But that hasn’t stopped him from repeating the charge to Nevada reporters, saying on the Senate floor that the “word is out” that Romney hadn’t paid taxes for a decade. He expanded on his allegation in a lengthy statement Thursday night that accused Romney of “hiding something” by not releasing more of his tax returns.

“He’s doing what he always does,” said Jon Ralston, a top political analyst in Nevada, “which is to say the things that most partisans and elected officials only dream about saying.”

National Journal:
The July jobs report was a heavy dose of Nothing’s Changed, for the U.S. economy and the presidential campaign.
The report showed that the economy added 163,000 net jobs last month, per the Labor Department’s survey of business payrolls; a separate survey of households showed nearly 200,000 job losses, pushing the unemployment rate up from 8.2 percent to 8.3 percent. Read those numbers thus: The economy is very slowly healing; the pace of recovery isn’t picking up; and, with a big caveat about Europe, we don’t seem to be headed back toward recession anytime soon.
As Jim O’Sullivan, chief U.S. economist for High Frequency Economics, put it in a snap reaction on Friday morning, “The data are consistent with an economy that, while not growing strongly, is not continuing to weaken sharply either.”
Not good news for the guy that's behind.

Nate Silver:

current forecast, 71.8% chance of Obama win
On Tuesday, Mr. Obama was helped in the forecast by a report showing an increase in personal income — one of the economic variables that the forecast model uses, and a reasonably good predictor of voter preferences in past elections. On Wednesday, he polled strongly in a number of swing states. And on Friday, Mr. Obama got a respectable — although by no means wonderful — employment report, which estimated that 163,000 jobs were created in July....

So far, Mr. Obama seems to have persuaded a slim plurality of voters that there are enough hopeful signs to warrant another term for him. Mr. Romney still has plenty of ammunition to make the counterargument, but the flow of economic data this week made it a little harder for him.

Jay Cost makes the case the other way (and not very convincingly):
Is this polling bump an important development? It is hard to say. It is worth noting that in the last two weeks, the Romney campaign and the main Republican super PAC, Crossroads GPS, have upped their ad spending in these states. That suggests they think it is time to engage the president.

But I am not at all convinced that, in the end, Obama is actually winning over voters. Above all, the truly undecided are not really paying attention at the moment. They might have been swayed toward Team Obama a little bit, but I doubt they have been locked down. That being said, I do believe that the president has successfully laid the groundwork for his general election strategy, which Greg Sargent ably summarizes here. Basically, it boils down to the idea that, though the state of the union stinks right now, Romney is an uncaring plutocrat who will make it worse for the middle class. These ads have clearly forwarded that agenda.

Cost's argument is that Romney money will magically make a difference (not likely, since the candidate is dreadful, and money doesn't make up for lousy strategy) and that undecideds can still break for Romney in numbers that matter. All 5% of them? In the end, Cost would do well to use something other than a flawed Rasmussen polling data base to make his case.

Cost links to this Bill Kristol piece which "gets it". Kristol is channelling a "savvy friend":

“One can draw a lot of different conclusions here—but doesn't it seem likely that the Obama attack on Romney is working where it is deployed in full measure? I think many analysts have erroneously concluded that because the national tracking has not moved, the Obama attack on Romney's wealth, Bain, taxes, etc. is not effective. The results in these states suggest otherwise. (And the partisan splits in the polls may be following the ballot test in these states—if you're turning away from Romney, you're less likely to self-identify as a Republican. So the polls aren't necessarily bad. The real trends could well be bad.)
Ezra Klein:
I can describe Mitt Romney’s tax policy promises in two words: mathematically impossible.
TAP:
Romney is offering nothing new in terms of policy. As the Prospect’s Jamelle Bouie points out, “Mitt Romney’s Plan for a Stronger Middle Class” is little more than a “cruel joke”—a recitation of the wealth-first tax and spending plans that Paul Ryan translated into English from the works of Ayn Rand. But the new thrust of the Romney campaign [mentioning his tenure as MA Governor] is a notable development: It shows that the Obama campaign has succeeded in making Romney’s business career, which he wanted to run on exclusively, into a liability. Starting to tout his record as governor, rather than pretend it’s a period of his life that never actually happened, is the surest signal that the Romney campaign is groping for a new way to pitch their man—and that they’ve lost the battle over his attempt to paint himself as a business guy who just stumbled into politics.
CBS on why politicians lie:
Despite a professed distaste for negative advertising, Brands said, the public rarely turns against a candidate for throwing mud at his opponent.

"I can't think of any election where the public said 'enough is enough,' where they were really turned off by negative campaigning," he said. "Many voters have become so cynical that they really don't expect candidates to speak the verifiable truth, and they accept these exaggerations, these mild falsifications, as just part of the game."

They don't just accept them, says psychology and behavioral economics professor Dan Ariely - they come close to demanding them from the politicians they support. His research found that Americans have a high tolerance for dishonesty when it comes from their own candidate, with no difference between Republicans and Democrats.

"I think it basically is about the ends justifying the means," he said.

There's plenty of "both sides do it" bullshit in this interesting report, but the basic premise is true. Politicians lie because they can, and most of the time the media hasn't the balls to call them on it.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Early voting starts today for Florida primary. (14+ / 0-)

    Off to wave sign for JP Alvarez (D) FL HD 53. Time to get some Dems into Tallahassee, that sewer of R mockery and abuse.

    rMoney: Just another jerk, lookin' for work.

    by OleHippieChick on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 04:44:00 AM PDT

  •  The debates will be key (10+ / 0-)

    It will be the first time that the candidates will be evaluated right next to each other.

    It will be very important for Obama to practice, practice, practive, for he isn't the best debater in the world and he is rusty.  Lucky for Obama he has the ideal sparring partner in John Kerry who is a good debater and can get the feel of Mitt Romney down including the annoying laugh.

    President Obama, January 9, 2012: "Change is hard, but it is possible. I've Seen it. I've Lived it."

    by Drdemocrat on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 04:47:52 AM PDT

    •  He turned into a very good debater later into (8+ / 0-)

      2008 because of those many debates vs Hillary. She was a big reason he became a much better debater as the election season wore on. I think he will do very well this time as I am sure he is going to practice a great deal.

      Plus being President of the United States gives him a great deal of knowledge and the ability to be able to defend his positions.  As he does this regularly.

      Follow PA Keystone Liberals on Twitter: @KeystoneLibs

      by wishingwell on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:52:19 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Agreed. (0+ / 0-)

      It was during the debate season that Obama finally pulled ahead of McCain.  I know beltwal CW is that it was the economy tanking - in other words, Obama was a passive player and won because of current events.  But I've always thought it was the debates, particularly Obama's ability to utterly dismember McCain on foreign policy.  Obama was clearly better informed and "tougher" on foreign policy, while McCain was just belligerent.  That's when the public accepted Obama, because they felt safe with him defending against teh terrarists.

      "When I was an alien, cultures weren't opinions" ~ Kurt Cobain, Territorial Pissings

      by Subterranean on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 03:10:54 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Great line: (13+ / 0-)
    “Mitt Romney’s Plan for a Stronger Middle Class” is little more than a “cruel joke”—a recitation of the wealth-first tax and spending plans that Paul Ryan translated into English from the works of Ayn Rand.
    On another topic, Romney's enjoyment of firing people doesn't seem to extend to his campaign crew (with the exception of giving Mr. "Kiss My Ass, it's a holy site" a break from the trail).  And the irony is, these are people that could really use replacing.

    Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it. --attributed to Mark Twain

    by SottoVoce on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 04:49:38 AM PDT

  •  It's not just that Romney's a bad candidate (19+ / 0-)

    but he's actually got nothing positive to run on.  His accomplishments as governor?  Romneycare.  His accomplishments at Bain? Outsourcing.  His accomplishments at the Olympics? Ask David Cameron... or Boris Johnson.

    Every single thing he's done in his career is vehemently opposed by the energized Republican base.  If he starts to run on his record, he turns off his voters.  If he continues to run away from his record, he'll alienate the 20% or so of the electorate that is Republican or independent but does not hate Obama viscerally and is actually interested in good governance.

    There's no way he can win at this point.  And his specious arguments about releasing his tax returns are collapsing of their own weight.

    This election right now is Obama's to lose.  The opposition is folding before our eyes.

    Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free
    ¡Boycott Arizona!

    by litho on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 04:54:11 AM PDT

    •  GOP brand is sorta screwed right now....and Mitt (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      litho, mdmslle, tb mare, nellgwen

      ain't helping.

      •  The Dems are going to have a very nice time (0+ / 0-)

        with Team Bush around the convention.  Why aren't the most prominent among that team at the convention, and also why are there so many backbenchers working for Rmoney.  Oh, it's going to be grand.

        From Neocon to sane- thanks to Obama- and Kos.

        by satrap on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:07:53 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  "I like to fire people." - Rmoney, 2012 (6+ / 0-)

      And that's exactly what he did -
      threw employees on the street, shipped their jobs overseas -
      and pocketed million$ for himself.
      And NOW blames Obama for the unemployment rate!

      "Tax cuts for the 1% create jobs." -- Republicans, HAHAHA - in China

      by MartyM on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:08:12 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I just went and watched that clip (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        MartyM, nellgwen

        on CBS' website.  OOF. And it hasn't even made it into a commercial or commercials yet and Harry Reid hasn't even begun to blister Willard for saying it.

        Oh, Mitt, we hardly knew ye, but it was still too long.

        From Neocon to sane- thanks to Obama- and Kos.

        by satrap on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:11:20 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  His Super Pac is just running ads on how MItt (7+ / 0-)

      saved the Salt Lake City Olympics featuring Kristi Yamaguchi gushing over MItt and then 2 other Winter Olympians. The interesting thing is Yamaguchi did not participate in those Olympics. She won her gold in 1992 Olympics, not in Salt Lake.

      Follow PA Keystone Liberals on Twitter: @KeystoneLibs

      by wishingwell on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:54:24 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  According to her wikipedia page (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        nellgwen, wishingwell

        she hasn't won anything since 1992.

        Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free
        ¡Boycott Arizona!

        by litho on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:30:54 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Yes she went pro, then retired, but won Dancing (0+ / 0-)

          with the STars, I think ..someone told me that?

          But yet she and athletes who were not involved in the Salt Lake games are pimping and gushing over how Mitt made their dream of Olympic gold come true.

          So Mitt trained them in various sports and supported them financially and gave them rides to practice...no that was parents...they should be ashamed giving Mitt credit over their parents and coaches.  I mean really ?

          Follow PA Keystone Liberals on Twitter: @KeystoneLibs

          by wishingwell on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 04:03:05 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  If we don't get the turnout we need (5+ / 0-)

      this election is OURS to lose. It's more than the presidential race, we have to keep the Senate and get more seats back in the House (I don't think we'll win back the majority this time around).

      “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

      by skohayes on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:02:05 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  I think Obama will win too (0+ / 0-)

      but I saw quite a good ad from the RNC today, the He tried/We tried/but it just didn't work out one. Subtle but strong. Their best ad so far. The Romney ads are generally awful but I have a feeling that a tidal wave of ads is on the way. This is going to be tougher than we think.

      I wish we could have a significant effort in lean-R States that encourage those R voters who have lukewarm feelings toward Romney to just stay home.

      The universe may have a meaning and a purpose, but it may just specifically not include you.

      by Anne Elk on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 12:48:11 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  "balderdash" (11+ / 0-)
    Politicians lie because they can, and most of the time the media hasn't the balls to call them on it.
    The sneeringly dismissive, so-called "liberal media" certainly found its voice in pointing out, among other things, Al Gore's lie that he invented the Internet, Dan Rather's lie about Dubya's "service" and John Kerry's "I was for it before I was against it" alleged flip-flops, but it has been surprisingly mum and complicit in pretending that Serial Liar Mitt Romney is completely above-board and disarmingly honest, when the evidence contrary to that view is glaringly obvious.  

    The both sides do it meme is, as Mr. Romney would say, "balderdash."

    •  Voters can't handle the truth! (0+ / 0-)

      Voters are so uninformed, misinformed, and want everything for nothing, they simply can't handle the truth.

      The truth is, Americans are going to have to lower their standard of living, because we live on a finite planet and the rest of the worlds want's a piece of the pie now.

      Try telling the voters their taxes will have to rise a little, Medicare will have to be restructured, and many of those pensions will have to be cut back.  See how many votes that gets you.

      But voters are so uninformed, you can tell them the same lies over and over and they'll believe them.  So politicians not only know they can get away with lying, they CANT hope to tell them the truth and get elected.

      •  You dont know what youre talking about (0+ / 0-)

        Americans have been calling for balanced budgets for 40 years. The majority even owned up to being willing to make sacrifices.. for an Actual balanced budget and not another washington con game. The politicians ignored them and people like you stuck your noses up at "their naivete". Then bill clinton did it....

        Your second paragraph very clearly demonstrates your lack of understanding of history and science. Our standard of living now, with some exceptions, is literally 100 times that of those 100 years go. There is no reason that perpetual trend cannot continue. The computer on my desktop uses an infintescimal percentage of the energy the original mainframes use and is literally a million times faster. The yield for one acre of cropland now is probably 1000 times that of the original farmers and uses very little energy. We make entire luxury yachts out of completely artificial material that didnt exist 100 years ago rather than tearing down entire forests to make one ship a couple would find horrifyingly smallt o live on now.

        People made it EXTRAORDINARILY CLEAR they would be happy with medicare for all.. and paying the taxes for that. Sorry to hit you in the head again with reality.

        There is no reason social security has to be cut back other than low intelligence people reading that somebody said somebody said someone else said they would have to be. The math as has been pointed out 1000 times over.. disagrees.

        Where is the public supposed to get "your truth" exactly? The news? Seriously? Seriously? Are they supposed to get it from partisan websites with agendas? Are they supposed to get it from not very bright commentators who themselves of course couldnt be bothered with actually researching facts??

        Human beings react based on the available data and what they have learned in their lifetimes. Their available data is controlled by the upperclasses who run both parties and the media. Their lifetime experiences tell them both parties are lying and out to fuck them. And they arent wrong.

        A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

        by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:54:29 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Ahhhh, we have infinite resources? (0+ / 0-)

          Infinite oil, infinite copper, infinite water, infinite cropland, crop yields will go to infinity (ask the corn farmers how that's working out this summer), we can put infinite CO2 into the atmosphere...

          Look, I really don't want to fight, but when people start acting like we have infinite resources and everyone on the planet can have an equal share, they prove my point!  They simply can't handle the truth that we don't have infinite resources, and anyone who claims we do, is simply a flat earther with no understanding of the physical sciences.

          I didn't mention Social Security for a reason, it's a fairly easy fix.

          People made it EXTRAORDINARILY CLEAR they would be happy with medicare for all.. and paying the taxes for that.
          This is nonsense.  Show me a poll where people are willing to pay the extra taxes for Medicare for all (something I very much favor).  In election after election people are rejecting extra taxes for the government services they now have, much less for additional services.  Local and state governments are slashing services and employees and deepening this recession.

          Oh, I forgot, They're all the same! They're all the same!
          This false equivalency is a refuge for the extremes on both sides who, can't handle the truth.

          •  So apparently youre slow (0+ / 0-)

            or is it just the strawman you created in your own mind?

            I'd explain the science to you but .. i'm absolutely Certain you wouldnt get it.

            In the future our energy will come from space. It will be literally limitless. To the point that we can literally create factories to terraform the earth should we choose. It doesnt actually have to be that far in the future but a certain class of people with myopic vision makes certain it will.

            Noone claimed we have infinite resources. But your basic misunderstanding of how science, invention, advancement works.. your basic misunderstanding of human history precludes you from "getting" what i just explained i guess.

            If you had been awake during the Singlepayer debate the polls were all over dailykos. But i guess those were mere facts and not enough for a "big picture" guy like you.

            I'll be nice and explain to you how local government works. The STATE governments rely mostly on sales and or income tax. When  the economy hits the dirt their revenue crashs and they have to cut services. Thats how that works. LOCAL governments rely exclusively on property taxes (with tiny amounts in fees and utilities). Guess what happens when real estate values get cut in half?

            You apparently cant handle facts. The trick btw to being a "big picture kinda guy" without being a court jester is.. you have to understand all the small things that make up the big picture.

            One last attempt at explaining how advancement radically lowers material requirements:  Your desktop right now probably uses 600 watts peak energy. In twenty years you'll carry a pocket computer literally smarter than you are that can display on wallscreens the size of a big screen now whos costs are negligible and that use almost no energy. An example of this NOW: digital electronics have been 5v traditionally. Current electronics are 3.3v and moving rapidly to 1.8v as we speak.

            A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

            by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:43:20 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Say hello to those little green men (0+ / 0-)
              In the future our energy will come from space. It will be literally limitless.
              In the words of Barney Frank:
               "On what planet do you spend most of your time?"
              •  I really hate this bullshit (0+ / 0-)

                As a casual observer there is nothing that irks me more than someone who completely ignores the substance of an argument someone is making and instead makes some sort of snide comment with the intention of making the other person look dumb when in actuality you're the one who is completely devoid of substance.

                Congratulations.

                This is your world These are your people You can live for yourself today Or help build tomorrow for everyone -8.75, -8.00

                by DisNoir36 on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:49:51 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  My apologies then, would you like to converse? (0+ / 0-)

                  I'm sorry, but this is very much like having a conversation with a global warming denialist.

                  Let me suggest that we are at Peak Cheap Oil now.

                  Let me also suggest there is absolutely NO possibility of getting limitless energy from space, anywhere in the next several decades, if ever!

                  Let me also suggest that to imply that we have limitless resources, when it defies the laws of physics, is no better than claiming the earth is flat.

                  Now, If someone wants to have a discussion about how much resources are left, how much is economically accessible with today's technology, and what it will mean to prices when places like China and India fight in the market place to grab those dwindling resources, I'd be more than happy to discuss this.  And they should know what companies China has been purchasing around the world over the past several years.

                  But when you say, I want to insert a miracle of limitless energy from space, then this is not a serious conversation from someone who understands the basics.
                   

                •  No I like it sometimes (0+ / 0-)

                        It's interesting. I try to visualize in my mind where the people are, what they look like, what kind of pets they own, what they are wearing, etc...
                          When people argue you get a fuller picture of the psyche of a person that you would otherwise just know from a nickname, who or what they agree with, and the fact that they think baby ducks are cute.

                  "Mitt's OK, as long as everyone he meets is named Mr. Leader or Bruce." Me

                  by nellgwen on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 09:52:26 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

            •  Energy future (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              pollwatcher

              "In the future our energy will come from space. It will be literally limitless."
              Even if the science was understood (not yet), and the technology had been invented (it hasn't), there is still the small matter of rebuilding an entire energy infrastructure.  Even if we had the financial resources to do so (politically implausible), we don't have the energy to reasonably spend during the changeover (especially considering greenhouse gas pollution), and we are out of TIME.  Historically, a change like that takes at least fifty years.  We missed the boat (or went overboard and began drowning) with Reagan.

              •  Thanks for bringing up the energy costs (0+ / 0-)

                The costs of energy extraction, in energy, is another extremely important factor.  We've gone from extracting 15bbl for every bbl of energy cost in places like the big fields in Texas, to 4bbl in places like the Tar Sands of Canada.

                You are absolutely right that Time is running out.  On both the tipping point of CO2 emissions, and a tipping point where it takes more energy to extract a bbl of oil than it does to produce a bbl, as we literally go to the ends of the earth to squeeze the last drops of oil out of the ground.

                Try explaining that to the public, and see if they can "handle the truth".  

    •  The media point out lies (0+ / 0-)

      when it serves their interests.  That's a good rule of thumb.

      "When I was an alien, cultures weren't opinions" ~ Kurt Cobain, Territorial Pissings

      by Subterranean on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 03:18:46 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  The positives of negatives are negative (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    BigOkie, cdreid, wintergreen8694, nellgwen

    Negative ads, if they work can do two things only:
    1. They can make one's own supporters feel a sense of urgency,
    2. They can make people considering the opponent dissuaded.

    Negative ads do not persuade. They aren't designed to get the voter to support a candidate, but rather to prevent a voter from supporting the opposing candidate. Therefore, they make sense in any area with a high number of undecideds.

    Is that today? Is that the presidential race? Has it been the presidential race? No. It is the party primary. However, the GOP has gone negative pretty quickly on the presidential level to get lightly committed and unmoved Democrats to say, "What's the point? They're all crooks." In other words, the goal is to neutralize the registered and to make sure that all their own registered voters feel that the world will burn without their votes (and money).

    This is the first time I know of where the shoe is on the other foot, where the GOP voters can be dissuaded by disgust with their candidate, and the Democrats need to be persuaded that their votes really matter.

    Everyone is innocent of something.

    by The Geogre on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 04:55:33 AM PDT

  •  I happen to be "blessed" (7+ / 0-)

    with a fair number of our [Kossack] opposition in my circle of "friends" on Facebook.  What can I say?  I live in Oklahoma. I am noticing a trend with their all-too-frequent political postings on that venue.

    The content is becoming less anti-Obama and more "we hate both candidates" with a liberal (pun intended) sprinkling of direct appeals for Ron Paul.  

    Now that may just be particular to this particular sample of people, but coupled with the polling and analysis presented in this piece it does seem that the Mittwit is losing his appeal--even to people who would punch out their chad for him.  That kind of leakage can't be good.  The convention may not give him the bump he would otherwise expect if he didn't suck so badly.

    "The bass player is always right"

    by BigOkie on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 04:56:03 AM PDT

  •  The most excellent (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    cdreid, nellgwen

    Bob Edwards had a terrific program this a.m. (6-9 EDT) on NPR.  First hour dedicated to military sexual assault ending with his challenge to Panetta to answer a couple of questions as to why nothing has really changed.  His last question -- to the non-present Panetta -- "If your granddaughter were to enter the military, would you tell her that rape/sexual assault/sexual harassment is just an 'occupational hazard'?"  Despite repeated requests for an interview to Panetta and the Pentagon -- no reply.

    He then had a wonderful and somewhat recent interview with Gore Vidal and ended with a discussion of Curious, the rover headed for Mars.

    Only reason I wake up early on a Saturday.

    " My faith in the Constitution is whole; it is complete; it is total." Barbara Jordan, 1974

    by gchaucer2 on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:00:14 AM PDT

  •  The first link doesn't work because the "h" (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    DemFromCT, gchaucer2, MartyM

    in "http" is missing. Here's the working link:

    Why Harry Reid keeps attacking Mitt Romney

    For me, Mitt reminds me of Jeff Bridges in Starman. He's like an alien that hasn't read the entire manual. You know, he's going, "Nice to be in a place where the trees are the right size. -- Robin Williams on Letterman 26 Apr 2012

    by hungrycoyote on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:01:16 AM PDT

  •  the politico article (7+ / 0-)

    about Harry Reid and Romney's taxes is perfect. The serious people  are upset with Harry but he's gotta be having a ball with this.

    What's so gratifying abou t this whole adventure is
    that the Dems are speaking with one, coordinated voice while the other team and the serious people are having a fit  Our team has finally learned.  

    Hey Karl Rove, we've beat you at your own game. heh heh  

    Re-elect Barack Obama and elect Elizabeth Warren "Mitt Romney...utterly devoid of charm and mildly offensive."

    by al23 on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:08:44 AM PDT

    •  The message isnt getting out (0+ / 0-)

      I'm in NC..  one of the few states with potential to go blue and stay blue longterm.

      All the people were seeing for a while in NC were the romney ads that intentionally misquoted obama. It didnt get traction because i think a: people assume these things are always out of context. b: people assume the ads are always full of lies. Now we have a small influx of.. badly done minor feints at romney. At first it was kindof positive stuff now it's incredibly wimpy attacks.

      Basicallly a wash. The negative stuff didnt get traction with anyone but those-who-repeat-talking-points. Even with the media doing its "regardless of its true.. is this how you feel!! DISCUSS THIS WATCH OUR SHOW PLEEEEEASE!" stuff.

      What people see now is:
      Democrat erm.. not really saying much.. oh ya.. hope n whatnot! But well .. not really gonna do much about the economy.. shit will get better sit back and wait (to people who are becoming homeless and losing Everything in droves).

      Republican : "SOCIALIST!! Evil! not like! Corporations good!! lifes hard for rich people.. tax cuts so rich people can give you jobs".

      Neither ones flying. Noones moving. People see DC as a waste of space.. honestly i think 90% of americans would consider it disappearing as good riddance.

      Americans arent engaged because they see both parties as full of shit, not willing to do anything to make things better and oh so so so protective of the upper classes.

      A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

      by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:04:48 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Rope-a-Doping Romney (7+ / 0-)

    Every day they have Romney swinging wildly at Obama (via Reid's charges) is a day he is off message...that is if Romney even HAS a message.  The jury is still out on that, is it not?

    It's brilliant, because it costs ZERO money for Reid to talk about this stuff.

  •  its why a certain plant is still 'misunderstood' (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    skohayes, nellgwen
    Politicians lie because they can, and most of the time the media hasn't the balls to call them on it.
    marijuana is still.illegal and many Americans are still....vastly ignorant about it because the media has never done its job
    ...unless one understands that the media's job IS to perpetuate ignorance.

    The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men.

    by xxdr zombiexx on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:31:44 AM PDT

    •  Americans arent ignorant (0+ / 0-)

      something like 30% of americans smoke pot.

      Americans also know that the majority of people in jail are black followed by hispanics.. know that its mostly about drugs..know that its racist.

      People know that outsourcing and globalism are destroying our economy .

      People know that whether you are sent to jail or go home is also determined entirely by your bank account.

      People know that the vast majority of our military bases are for political reasons and that our military budget is all about keeping donations coming in.

      People know our media is bought and paid for, incompetant and lazy.

      People know that our elections are a farce as is our method of selecting candidates.

      People also know theres not a damned thing they can do about it. They know that a big reason for this is that right now if a lefty criticises obama or anything he does he is the antichrist. Just as republicans knew that if they criticised bush or anything he did they were the antichrist.

      IT isnt that people dont know or care . It is that they are powerless to do anything about it.

      A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

      by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:10:33 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Bill Kristol's "Savvy friend" should get a (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Bush Bites, nellgwen

    column.  He seems to have a more realistic vision than Kristol.

    •  What kind of loon has BK been touting for veep? (0+ / 0-)

      I bet it's good.

      "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

      by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:44:17 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I realise dk is (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    nellgwen

    ONLY about re-electing the president now and cares about nothing else.

    But we seriously need to find ways other than spin to counter blazing anger over the economy. Saying "things arent getting worse.. at least not quickly.. which is good for the president!" is just spin/bullshit.

    Clear , simple truths about the alternative would be good. Like romney wants more of what got here in the first place. Like the republicans want to deregulate the banks more. Like republicans wont let us do anything to stop it from happening again (NOTE: there is absolutely NOTHING to stop what caused the crisis from happening again. Nothing).

    But this spin bullshit only flies with the rabid fans. And the radical worshippers on either side dont win elections.

    It's too late for Obama to try to actually do anything about the economy (which is hard to imagine anyway as he's a DLCer who agrees with middle-right economics at least to a point). But he at least has to loudly make the case that a: the republicans are stopping him from fixing the economy. b: he's on the side of people who work for a living and c: Romney is much much much much worse and wants americans to compete  for $1 an hour jobs.

    A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

    by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:40:32 AM PDT

    •  he's actually dong a pretty good job (6+ / 0-)

      of all of the above (a-c) which is why he is leading. He should have done a bigger stimulus, too late for that.

      With less than 100 days left, there's little choice but to concentrate on reelection. And his message has been focused gruoped to death.

      "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

      by Greg Dworkin on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:51:32 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  He's leading because (0+ / 0-)

        nobody has a damn clue who he is or what his "plan" is. He's simply "generic candidate a". Just as Mondale and Dukakis were. Party selected whitebread placeholders.

        He should have done a hell of a lot more than a stimulus. I actually disagree we needed another stimulus. I think we needed to slam the brakes on outsourcing and "free trade", passed laws and enforced them to end illegal imigration by fining business heavily, hunted down and imprisoned the wall street fraudsters and gone after the criminals in the big 3 banks and the ratings agencies they owned as well as wall street. And used that impetus to re-regulate the capitalist system.

        I think if he'd done that the economy would be better, some scumbags would be in jail, Obama would be viewed as the new FDR and have that level of political power.. and that instead of 2nd tier gop candidates youd have 5th tier candidates running. And a landslide in november.

        But ignoring that rant he needs to put out a program to CHANGE things for the better and to hammer the gop for opposing it.

        A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

        by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:24:25 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  He tried to compromise too much and for too long. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          cdreid

          I'll give you that.

          I think he learned his lesson and he'll learn it double in the next term -- if he has a next term -- because it looks like the teabaggers will be an even stronger cancer cell within the Repub party.

          "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

          by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:58:23 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  All im concerned about is the election now (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Bush Bites, nellgwen

            Frankly i believe he's clinton jr. Just a more Charismatic Leader version. He's a moderate republican.

            But that just doesnt matter. What matters is destroying the teabaggers and the wingnuts and turning the country around even if we have to use a centrist to do it.

            A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

            by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:00:19 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  btw (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        wintergreen8694, snazzzybird

        "focus grouped to death" is why we dont get Lincolns and Roosevelts in office anymore. Instead we get bland milquetoast nobodies who repeat the wall street mantra.

        Dont forget Dean. It took the combined force of the entire major media openly sabotaging him to stop his message... which was a populist humanitarian anti-plutocrat message. Now imagine if Obama had THAT message instead of the white middle class comfortable centrist focus groups message

        A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

        by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:54:52 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  he'd lose like Dean did n/t (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Bush Bites

          "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

          by Greg Dworkin on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:59:49 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Honestly (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            wintergreen8694, nellgwen

            youre forgetting HOW dean lost? That was the most openly planned sabotage ive ever seen with the possible exception of the bullshit they pulled on kerry. When you have every major network literally doctoring your videos , and then broadcasting it as truth even after theyve admitted it is false... you cannot blame that on the message or  the messenger.

            A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

            by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:01:55 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  Stop with Howard Dean. (0+ / 0-)

          Going into the Caucus he led with fundraising and committed superdelegates -- then he came in third and totally crashed his campaign by trying to turn a concession speech into a victory speech.

          And we won't even talk about "interesting" stuff on the Internet about 9/11 and stars-and-bars bumper stickers.

          He was simply not ready for prime time and he showed it.

          "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

          by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:03:33 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  i guess you didn't see this: (9+ / 0-)

      http://youtu.be/...

      that's been running in swing states for well over a week now and has been viewed online over 2 million times. if you don't live in a swing state or Metro DC you might have missed it. I don't know. he also says this repeatedly on the stump. I'd pull the videos. but, i don't feel like it.

      pay attention.

      no offense but I think Obama's team has a damned good idea what they need to do and who it is that wins elections. can we please not start with the "OBAMA NEEDS TO DO THIS NOW OR WE'E DOOOOOOOMED" diaries again already?

      For the record, I am not a member of Courtesy Kos. Just so you know. Don't be stupid. It's election season. My patience is short.

      by mdmslle on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:57:45 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Um (0+ / 0-)

        Obama ran against literally the worst president in our history. And won.. barely (admittedly he had handicaps to overcome).

        Dont ever tell ANYONE to shut up. You might not like your response... im trying VERY hard to be  kind.

        recced for the link

        A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

        by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:26:02 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  McCain? (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          cdreid, mdmslle, askew

          "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

          by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:41:00 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Hehe (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Bush Bites, nellgwen

            technically of course you are right.

            But in reality we all know he was running against Bush just as Carter was really running against Nixon rather than ford.

            A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

            by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:45:32 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Not sure. (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              mdmslle, cdreid

              The key decision points in the campaign were the Palin Pick, the Banking Meltdown (and McCain's subsequent calling-off-my-campaign/not-calling-off-my-campaign, debate/no-debate, special meeting where I don't say anything) and the Debates.

              McCain failed all those tests, so I think he earned his defeat.

              "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

              by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:50:11 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Not really (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                nellgwen

                The key points were:

                "ZOMG he's f*cking BLACK!"
                "ZOMG he's a DEMOCRAT!"
                "ZOMG his middle name is hussain!"

                Everything else was just pablum for political junkies. Noone takes vp's seriously especially republican ones (lets fae it  the alaskan potatoehead is probably smarter than quayle.. and bush won).

                And mccain sold out his principles and ran as bush3....

                A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

                by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:04:02 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  McCain has no principles. (0+ / 0-)

                  But that's another story.

                  As for veep. They sure do pay attention when the McCain Campaign is trying to make a case that Obama is the untested kid and McCain's the experienced master, then he appoints the least-ready and frankly least-intelligent veep ever to be his backup in the event of an emergency.

                  He sabotaged his own narrative as any thinking conservative (a small group of people, I'll admit) said off the record at the time.

                  "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

                  by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:08:09 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  He did once (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    nellgwen

                    until Dubya CRUSHED him in the primaries using truely disgusting tactics. The viet namese couldnt break him after years in a prison camp. Bush did it over the course of a primary.

                    A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

                    by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:09:50 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  Yeah, I don't know. (1+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      nellgwen

                      The more I read about him, the more it seemed the whole "McCain Reformer" meme was just his way of distancing himself from the Keating 5 scandal.

                      "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

                      by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:20:14 AM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

        •  I said pay attention because your comment (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          nellgwen

          seemed very much like something that one who hasn't been paying attention would say. If it came across harsh well, see my sig line.

          look man,we have  a two party system and a nation of racists. what do you want? Obama to win by 25% not gonna happen.

          bottom line: he's doing all  that what you said he needs to do. he's ahead in key swing states by not an insignificant percentage. in the end the EC that matters. He's got a smart team and they have been effective before and are showing themselves to be effective today.

          For the record, I am not a member of Courtesy Kos. Just so you know. Don't be stupid. It's election season. My patience is short.

          by mdmslle on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:59:08 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  This is going to sound racist (0+ / 0-)

            or stupid.. or something...

            I think america has forgotten he's black. In the way they forgot Cosby or Samuel L jackson is black "Oh he's cool he's >one of us< not like .. you know.. those black people"... (Ok dave chapelle did that WAY better than i did)

            Feel free to punch me if it does sound racist.

            A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

            by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:06:23 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I have relatives in the South. (0+ / 0-)

              That's not remotely true.

              "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

              by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:36:40 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  OK, I'll play ;) (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              DemFromCT

              I don't think the real racists have forgotten that Obama is black -- and by that I mean not only the loud, embarrassing racists, but folks who know better but can't help themselves.

              I don't think people exactly forget that Obama is black. To be really reductive, I think that a lot of whites have stereotypes of "bad blacks" and stereotypes of "good blacks," and Obama is widely categorized as a "good black."

              That said, I agree with mdmslle that the current party system (not just the rules, but the social psychology) makes landslides unlikely, and that racial resentment holds down Obama's vote share. I also agree with mdmslle that Obama is running a pretty good campaign.

              The basis for your original comment seems to have been comments in DemFromCT's post that you interpreted as trying to "spin" economic conditions. I don't see it. I see DemFromCT citing political forecasters who think that this economy is good enough for Obama to win. It isn't a matter of "spin"; they're trying to predict voting behavior, not to influence it. What Obama should say about the economy is a fair question, but a completely separate one.

          •  Not harsh enough. (0+ / 0-)

            "Don't be stupid. It's election season. My patience is short [too]" Mostly we need to coddle OUR morons; but sometimes they just need a smack.  In the final analysis, however, Obama needs his share of stupid voters.  His people are masters of the "phoniness and artifice" that Al Gore never quite got and therefor was not too good at.  So the smacking must be done by the more reality-based participants in discussions like this.

        •  2008 electoral vote count: (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          EcosseNJ, askew

          Obama - 365
          McCain - 173

          Yeah, he "barely" won. Nate Silver's recent estimate for 2012 is Obama -300 / Romney - 238.

          Shut up, cdreid...or not. Your prescient analysis is entertaining, as are your attempts at civility.

          •  I'm not sure (0+ / 0-)

            who told you how american politics work child or who told you that you could tell Anyone to shut up anywhere...

            But 1% swing in votes and that would have been RADICALLY different. I'll let you go look up how the electoral system works. And how a literal handful of florida votes turned into more than a handful of electoral votes for bush.

            A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

            by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:13:03 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I know quite well how the electoral system (0+ / 0-)

              works, cupcake. Thanks for your "concern". I'll trust Obama's electoral strategy over your political genius on this one. Obama's path to electoral success looks a lot more feesable than Romney's. A lot.  May I suggest you go to Nate Silver's site and educate yourself cdreid? Or not, I really don't care. We have differing opinions but are on the same team cdreid so carry on with your rants if they help you feel productive.

        •  Obama didn't win..."barely" (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          askew

          Obama received 365 electoral votes to McCain's 173.  That's not "barely."

          "In this world of sin and sorrow there is always something to be thankful for; as for me, I rejoice that I am not a Republican." - H. L. Mencken

          by SueDe on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 09:12:21 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  If you've been listening (0+ / 0-)

      to his speeches, that's exactly what he's doing.

      “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

      by skohayes on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:12:40 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  You think (0+ / 0-)

        joe factory worker listens to political speechs???

        The people who listen to political speechs, read political blogs etc.. are NOT swing voters.

        A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

        by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:26:57 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Elections are won in the surburbs these days. (0+ / 0-)

          Joe Factory Worker is either a Teabagger or a 10 year old Chinese kid.

          "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

          by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:42:49 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  And that is why we lose (0+ / 0-)

            this stereotypical idiocy.

            Suburbanites  are better off financially. Who do you think those people vote for? The single most predictive indicators of party are economic class , race, and age. And not in the way that the predominately upperclass older white kossack population want to believe.

            A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

            by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:08:40 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  OK, let me throw this back at you. (0+ / 0-)

              Why do you assume Joe Factory Worker is white?

              He could just as easily be black or hispanic, especially in some of the swing states, and Obama is doing just fine with THOSE "Joe Factory Workers."

              "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

              by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:18:49 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  Check this out. (0+ / 0-)

              https://docs.google.com/...

              Now, it doesn't show the percentages for factory workers as a whole -- rather, it shows what percentage of a given worker population is employed in factories (called "production" here), but it seems to be showing a pretty tanned factory workforce.

              "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

              by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:32:36 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  Oh, and the data is from 2000. (0+ / 0-)

              But the factory workforce is even darker now.

              "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

              by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:33:17 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

    •  We're blessed to have your objectivity to guide us (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      askew

      LOL.

      "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

      by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:40:04 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Is this supposed to be intelligent discourse (0+ / 0-)

        Or has DK actually devolved to this level of mindless authoritarian worship and groupthink?

        Who exactly told you blind worship and cheerleading won elections? Was it the bush dittoheads? The president's political team needs to step it up, we need coat tails (the bluedogs are going republican officially soon), and he needs the power to accomplish things.

        A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

        by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:50:41 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Sigh. (5+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          cdreid, skohayes, PorridgeGun, EcosseNJ, askew

          You talk about intelligent discourse then throw out a bunch of strawmen characterizations of Obama-Zombies.

          C'mon.

          "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

          by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:53:13 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Nope (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Bush Bites

            not what i meant at all. I'm NOT talking about those people. I'm talking about DK and its users and party democrats right now. It's see no evil hear no evil trust authority repeat the talking points and burn the heretics in the interest of a greater goal. It has nothing to do with the zealots.. frankly they have never been important or relevant to the election. Anymore than the wingnuts are. Either candidate could eat a puppy and those people would cheer it.

            Obama needs a stronger message and to fight back harder but with the class he has shown thus far. That is the point.

            A man is born as many men but dies as a single one.--Martin Heidegger

            by cdreid on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:58:27 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Do you live in a swing state? (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              skohayes

              I don't.

              But, from what I've read, that's where all the hard fighting is going on.

              Personally, I don't know how much mud Obama should throw, but I sure wish they'd keep Biden (and other surrogates -- Obama never has enough surrogates) out there throwing it 24/7.

              As for ads, I'm impressed by what I've been seeing over the internet (ads that have been airing in the swing states, I'm told).

              I'll admit Priorities USA is doing most of the heavy lifting as far as attack ads go. But I've seen some Obama and even DNC ads and thought: "Wow. They're really trying this time."

              Anyway, I'm out of the bubble, so these are just my impressions.

              Should add that I've always thought Axelrod was the slowest-witted piece of fried dough in politics, and I'm actually thinking he's been doing OK so far.

              "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

              by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:14:59 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

  •  Happy Birthday, President Obama (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    satrap, mdmslle, gchaucer2, DesignGuy, askew
    51 Reasons To Vote For Barack Obama. A Birthday Photo Party.

    http://blackwaterdog.wordpress.com/...

  •  One thing that makes Willard's taxes (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    snazzzybird

    very relevant- that Roland Martin tried to flesh out a bit yesterday on CNN but was unable due to a typical 'bipartisan' pie fight- is that the population at large should see his returns to see what kind of deduction loopholes he was fond of.  Since loophole closing is his formulae vitae for increasing the tax collections of Team USA, it would enable the media to query him about which ones might be able to go.  And how the 0.1% might not like losing those loopholes.  And how is he going to convince Grover and Co. to pull the string that closes them..

    So, I think it groundless that Rs are so insistent on the 'distraction' meme.

    From Neocon to sane- thanks to Obama- and Kos.

    by satrap on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:02:09 AM PDT

  •  The Twitter Political Index (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    PorridgeGun

    is going to be manipulated by the paid Repub trolls going forward, now that this thing has been brought to their awareness. I would refrain from using it as any indicator of how popular the candidates are.

    •  way too big to manipulate (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      satrap

      unpossible.

      "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

      by Greg Dworkin on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:10:53 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I was thinking that too. It would (0+ / 0-)

        be a huge conundrum: you could try to employ 10 000 people to do it - at a huge cost and with a premium on non-creativity- or you wouldn't do it at all.

        I'm certain Rove and Reince are scratching their heads over how to employ a bunch of young Beijingers right now....

        From Neocon to sane- thanks to Obama- and Kos.

        by satrap on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:14:18 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Put up or shut up, Mitt. n/t (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    tb mare, skohayes

    "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

    by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:30:33 AM PDT

  •  BS indeed (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    tb mare, skohayes, PorridgeGun

    In the Quoted passage "CBS on why politicians lie" some people at CBS equate "negative" and "false" . Swift boating is both negative and false.  The latest ad from the Obama campaign which asserts that Mitt Romney proposes cutting his own taxes and increasing taxes on the middle class is extremely negative.  It is also completely accurate.

    The problem in the quoted passage, which makes it not bad reporting but anti-reporting is that it presents truth vs falsehood as irrelevant while tone and balance are key.

    I think the thought behind the passage is clearly "why can they get away with stuff we can't get away with".  The problem is that the non-journalists at CBS lump together lies and true but damaging claims about Republicans together as stuff they can't get away with.  

    •  Thank you! (0+ / 0-)

      For CBS or any other media outlet to sit there with the "both sides do it" and not say somthing about a complicit media failing to call these lies out on the carpet is simply ridiculous.
      They use the Obama campaign's charges against Mitt Romney on the auto industry bailout as one of the false charges against Mitt:

      For the past few weeks, Mitt Romney's presidential campaign has been aggressively pushing a deliberate misreading of President Obama's now-famous "you didn't build that" comment. The Obama campaign, meanwhile, has spent much of the campaign falsely casting Romney (link to another CBS piece quoted below) as an advocate of letting the American auto industry die. They're just two of the claims that have kept groups like Factcheck.org and Politifact very busy during the 2012 campaign season.
      Then have the gall to use themselves as the source of that claim!
      Back in 2008 - at the height of the financial crisis - Mitt Romney wrote an op-ed for the New York Times opposing the Obama administration's plan to bail out the American auto industry. The headline put on the column: "Let Detroit Go Bankrupt."

      In the op-ed, Romney argued that a "managed bankruptcy" could benefit General Motors, Ford and Chrysler because it would "permit the companies to shed excess labor, pension and real estate costs." Romney did not suggest the Detroit auto industry be liquidated, and he called the industry "vital to our national interest."

      Of course no one in the Obama campaign ever claimed that Romney wanted to "liquidate" the auto industry, he just wanted them to file for  bankruptcy, lay off workers, slash their benefits and sell off assets.

      “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

      by skohayes on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:11:25 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Re: Negative campaigning. (0+ / 0-)

    I think just the opposite.

    A certain percentage of voters respect a street fighter. (The rest of the voters just figure "both sides do it" so you can't penalize any one candidate.)

    Just my impression.

    "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

    by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:38:47 AM PDT

    •  my favorite is the quote from a (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Bush Bites, Ohkwai

      political operative, paraphrased:  the difference between positive and negative ads is the negative ones contain some facts.

      "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

      by Greg Dworkin on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 06:53:26 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  sometimes, somewhere (0+ / 0-)

      My impression from conversations here in Madison, WI, is that Kelda Roys' totally negative TV campaign against fellow Dem Mark Pocan is hurting her.  

      This is a high-information, largely Progressive area; most of us don't get our 'facts' from TV ads.  And we don't think nasty people will represent us effectively,  no matter  how Progressive their politics.  

    •  The danger of a negative campaign... (0+ / 0-)

      ...is not from excessive negativity but from a negative attack that backfires. While people say they don't like negative campaigns, they generally vote for the guy who attacks the most, except when one of those attacks go spectacularly wrong. Then they turn on that person with a vengeance.

      The lesson is that it is okay to attack, but you better not fuck it up and miss.

  •  Caught this link on Twitter (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    DesignGuy, askew

    Michael Tomasky on the (Possible) Coming Obama Landslide

    So if Pennsylvania is off the boards, let’s look around. Imagine it’s election night, say 10:45 east coast time. Four eastern states haven’t been called yet: Ohio (18), Virginia (13), North Carolina (15), and Florida (29). Also, in some Western states, the polls haven’t closed, or the races are too tight to project just yet—Colorado and Nevada, say. Arizona has just been called for Romney. At this point, Romney actually leads, 188 to 182. In this scenario I’m assuming Obama has won Iowa (6), which is admittedly close but where his lead has been stable at three or four points, and New Hampshire (4), where Obama has a similar fairly small but stable lead, and Michigan (16), where the gap appears to be opening up a little.

    So it’s a six-vote Romney edge. They’re feeling great up in Boston. Especially with the big Eastern four still up in the air. Right?

    Not really. Let’s look at these West Coast states. Even though they’re still voting in California, obviously Obama is going to win it (55). And equally obviously, he’s going to win Washington (12) and Oregon (7), where neither side even bothered to spend a dime. Throw in Hawaii (4). Those 78 votes haul Obama up to 260. That’s something to keep in mind for election night: Whatever Obama’s number is at 10 pm Eastern, add those 78 EV’s—they’re a mortal lock, and a hefty insurance policy. If he wins Nevada (6) and Colorado (9), it’s over.

    “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

    by skohayes on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:14:44 AM PDT

  •  there aren't any "undecided voters" left in the US (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    nellgwen

    Over the past dozen years people have been brainwashed to have faith that their candidates support  what they believe in. The GOP brand is strong and bring, the Dem brand is not so bright, but it's certainly not anti-GOP, but everybody has chosen sides.  If you tell a pollster that you don't know how you're gonna vote in 3 months you're just lying to yourself and the pollster.  You might say you haven't made up your mind, but really, would a Wind-Nut vote Dem? NEVER,  Would a real liberal vote for the Romney-Robot spouting GOP talking points?  NEVER.

    80 % of success is showing up

    Corporate is not the solution to our problem

    Corporate is the problem

    by Churchill on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:15:17 AM PDT

    •  I disagree (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Subterranean

      there are some jaded, cynical voters who are turned off politics to a large extent, but feel compelled to make a choice between the lesser of two evils.

    •   The Undecideds is just a polite way of saying: (0+ / 0-)

        None of your fucking business who I'm voting for that's who. You'll find out when I feel like telling you and not one moment sooner.
      What is that your business anyway?
      Who died and made you God of voting.
      You just want me to tell you, so you and your friends and enemies can speculate on who my friends and enemies are.
      Who are you voting for?
      That's the more important question.
      Who are you voting for?
      Because I want to know, that's why.
      We're not allowed to say.
      Well that's convenient.
      I'm not allowed to say either.
      Now if you don't mind I'm late for a thing.

      That's what The Undecideds means.
      You'll never hear it said that way because the media doesn't like people telling them to fuck off.

      So the media speculates about them anyway because people hate it, and who are they to tell us to fuck off.
      And all of that is why the Undecideds exists.
      It's tit for tat. Sour grapes.
      You know something we don't know, and we hate it.

            But, the purse string holders just love The Undecideds, they love them more than anyone in the whole wide world. They love them better than Bobby Sherman who they realize now was just puppy love.
            I love you Undecideds, I want to marry you and have your babies.
      'cause I want (yeah-yeah yeah)
      A girl (yeah-yeah yeah)
      To call (yeah-yeah yeah)
      My own (yeah-yeah)
      I want a dream lover so I don't have to dream alone

           The Undecideds, make it a race. And the beauty of it is they exist. We don't have to make them up. It's beautiful.
           The more the race exists the more people tune in to watch me, or us, the more people tune in to watch me or us, the more money is to be had, by me or us, as well as the people that sell their shit on our air waves, or newspapers, or on the intertubes.
           And the more we do our job, which is to annoy people, the more Undecideds it makes. We can't lose.
      And the ultimate beauty of the whole thing is we really don't give a shit who wins.
      We win,
      That's who wins.

      But, The Undecideds love holding back their intentions just on the principal of:
      A. It's none of your business.
      B. It's the one thing they can do to make it an honest race. They can't be got to, they are incorruptible.

      So we'll go along with you.
      We will not call you the pesky, obstinate, sophomoric, I know you are but what am I, taunting, road blocks that you are.
      But rather the more diplomatic The Undecideds.

      Because even though you maintain what you want, your anonymity, and we just hate that.
      We get the notoriety, and the cash.
      You get everyone to make a fuss over you, like Alan Brady.
      And we get even more notoriety, and medals, and awards, and tons more cash.
      We are the cash people,
      We're cash 'n carry
      Cash is our middle name,
      Hello my name is Johnny Cash,
      You drive to the Slauson Cutoff, get out of your car, cut off your Slauson.
      My name is Sue,
      how do you do,
      now you're gonna die.

      The Undecideds are the final reveal in What Not to Wear, the last page of an Agatha Christie novel, the iron maiden in The Pit and the Pendulum, aahh, the blessed marinara sauce in Goodfellas.

      And when our side wins it's us singing Stairway To Heaven to the other side.

      "Mitt's OK, as long as everyone he meets is named Mr. Leader or Bruce." Me

      by nellgwen on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 12:37:40 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Uh oh, Drudge is turning pro-Obama (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Bush Bites, kitebro, askew, Subterranean

    from Jeff Gauvin (@JeffersonObama)

    LOL MT @yourrant: Gallup has Obama approval above 50%, there's no way that's possible. Drudge report is turning pro Obama & unreliable
    https://twitter.com/...

    Because Drudge talked about a Gallup poll that had Obama approval numbers up.

    “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

    by skohayes on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:26:22 AM PDT

    •  That's funny. (0+ / 0-)

      Guess Stormfront is the only "objective" website left for people like Jeff.

      "The disturbing footage depicts piglets being drop kicked and swung by their hind legs. Sows are seen being kicked and shoved as they resist leaving their piglets."

      by Bush Bites on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:44:34 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Not Jeff (0+ / 0-)

        He's the Poll Master.
        The "MT" at the beginning of the tweet means it's a "modified tweet" from another person (@yourrant).
        I'm reading the same thing all over the internet- right wingers dismiss every poll except the ones that show Romney ahead.

        “We are not a nation that says ‘don’t ask, don’t tell.’ We are a nation that says ‘out of many, we are one.’” -Barack Obama

        by skohayes on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 08:22:32 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Most of the GOP reality is a fiction! (0+ / 0-)

    created from years of repeated talk radio lying to people who believe liberals are always lying.

    The whole problem is many Americans don't know who's lying!!! And that's mainly because the left doesn't get up in front of the biggest liars and call them that loudly enough that the MSM has to pay attention.

    There's a huge difference between having team limbaugh create a lie or excuse or rationilize a lie or lying politician or party and attack liberals for the same.

    There's a huge difference between lying us into war and believing the critics are liars.

    They both do it is bullshit indeed.

    I suppose once again- another study without asking the polled where they get their information, another study conducted within the talk radio political paradigm.

    This is a list of 76 universities for Rush Limbaugh that endorse global warming denial, racism, sexism, and partisan lying by broadcasting sports on Limbaugh radio stations.

    by certainot on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 07:46:49 AM PDT

  •  The voters are liars (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    nellgwen, Subterranean

    They say they want politicians who are honest. That is a lie. They want politicians who will tell them what they want to hear. And if they have to lie to do so then so be it.

  •  romney's plan is recycled trickle-down (0+ / 0-)
  •  oh, about the undecideds... (0+ / 0-)

    There's no question that the Pew polls (pp. 16-17 and following) show many fewer undecideds in June-July 2012 than in the same period in 2008, or even 2004.

    On the other hand, if you look at Obama's margins (in Pew) over Romney so far, there seems to be more variability than in 2008 through late summer -- or at least more volatility than one would expect just by looking at the undecideds. In Pew's two polls last fall, Romney had 47-48% support, with 3-4% undecided. The last two polls give him 41-43% support, with 4-5% undecided. It isn't just "undecideds" who have broken in Obama's direction.

    I'm not saying that the decrease in undecideds is meaningless -- but I suggest that experience counsels caution about how to interpret those figures. It's not at all shocking that Romney has lost support since last fall, but it might be if one had fixated on the undecideds at that time.

    •  Alan Abramowitz presents data from (0+ / 0-)

      2008:

      The data from the ANES panel survey can be used to classify voters into four basic types. Stayers, those who did not change between June and November, accounted for 92% of the electorate; returning partisans accounted for 5%; departing partisans accounted for 2%; and shifting independents accounted for 1%. And the net result of all of the movement between June and November was an increase of one point in support for Obama. Despite the dramatic events that transpired between June and November, including John McCain’s selection of Sarah Palin as his running mate and a major financial crisis, the preferences of American voters barely budged.
      http://www.centerforpolitics.org/...

      So 2008 was preternaturally stable.

      Now, if Romney support fading in 2012 is simply stray D partisans coming home, we can account for some volatility without expecting a whole lot more of it, and without overly sweating the undecideds, who remain a small lot.

      "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

      by Greg Dworkin on Sat Aug 04, 2012 at 05:22:58 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  well... (0+ / 0-)

        In early September, McCain basically had overtaken Obama in the polls. "Preternaturally stable" is not the phrase I would choose. But it was "pretty" stable through late summer.

        I would venture that Abramowitz's one-point change between June and November is substantially a fluke of timing. Per pollster.com, June is the first time that Obama opened up as much as a 5-point lead -- and the last time until late September.

        (It may also be partly a methodological artifact. Participants in NES panels aren't exactly like the electorate at large, and become somewhat less so in the course of answering all those questions. Not a big deal for most purposes -- and probably not for this one -- but something to keep in mind.)

        Anyway, if you're going to argue that the large percentage of self-reported undecideds in 2008 was irrelevant, then why are we talking about undecideds at all? Warn't my idea.... ;)

        Now, if Romney support fading in 2012 is simply stray D partisans coming home, we can account for some volatility without expecting a whole lot more of it, and without overly sweating the undecideds, who remain a small lot.
        Just to be clear, I'm not saying that I "expect" a lot more volatility. I'm saying that small undecided percentages don't necessarily mean low volatility. I think Romney is gonna have a hell of a time turning around his negatives, but I don't really see what the undecided numbers have to do with it.

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