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The attack which took the lives of the American Ambassador in Libya was far larger and better organized than first revealed, according to emerging reports, and points to the fact that Al Qaeda forces that have been training in Libya for operations against Syria have been given a safe zone free of US drone attacks.

According to Reuters, US forces attempting to mount a helicopter rescue operation ran into fierce, accurate ambush as they arrived in Benghazi. Two U.S. soldiers were killed.

BENGHAZI, Libya (Reuters) - A squad of U.S. troops dispatched by helicopter across the Libyan desert to rescue besieged diplomats from Benghazi on Wednesday ran into a fierce overnight ambush that left a further two Americans dead, Libyan officials told Reuters.

Miscommunication which understated the number of American survivors awaiting rescue - there were 37, nearly four times as many as the Libyan commander expected - also meant survivors and rescuers found themselves short of transport to escape this second battle, delaying an eventual dawn break for the airport.

Captain Fathi al-Obeidi, whose special operations unit was ordered by Libya's authorities to meet an eight-man force at Benghazi airport, said that after his men and the U.S. squad had found the American survivors who had evacuated the blazing consulate, the ostensibly secret location in an isolated villa came under an intense and highly accurate mortar barrage.

"I really believe that this attack was planned," he said, adding to suggestions by other Libyan officials that at least some of the hostility towards the Americans was the work of experienced combatants. "The accuracy with which the mortars hit us was too good for any regular revolutionaries."

http://www.cnbc.com/...

Meanwhile, a CNN article points out that the US has not been mounting antiterrorism operations, such as drone strikes, in area of Libya known to be a staging ground for Al Qaeda-linked groups. Libya is the source of many of the Jihadist foreign fighters operating to topple the regime in Syria, which is dominated by Shi’ia Muslims.

The US has created safe areas in several countries where Jihadis have free range of operation, and apparently, aren't attacked by armed drones. These are the same countries where we have participated in regime change operations.

This, of course, has created a dilemma, and presents the same problem US intelligence faced in its operations with Saudi-backed militant groups, including al-Qaeda, in Bosnia and Kosovo. Given, if we were to take out al-Qaeda and linked groups inside Libya, we would be destroying the very same Saudi-GCC financed militias that we now help in our effort to overthrow the Syrian regime:

Libyan and Western security officials tell CNN that al Qaeda has taken advantage of a security vacuum to build up a presence in eastern Libya.

A senior Libyan official told CNN in June that the United States had flown surveillance missions with drones over suspected jihadist training camps in eastern Libya. The official said that, to the best of his knowledge, they had not been used to fire missiles at militant training camps in the area.

Another Libyan official told CNN at the same time that five radical Islamist militant commanders were operating in the Derna area, with 200 to 300 men under their command in camps in the area. Ironically, Christopher Stephens -- the U.S. ambassador killed in Tuesday's attack -- had written extensively about the rise of Salafist factions in and around Derna in a 2008 diplomatic cable.

As CNN has previously reported, one of militant commanders, according to several sources, is Abdulbasit Azuz, a long-time associate of al-Zawahiri. Azuz was dispatched by al-Zawahiri to Libya from Pakistan's tribal areas in the spring of 2011 to create a foothold for al Qaeda in Libya, the sources say.

Azuz is a veteran jihadist who fought the Soviet-backed government in Afghanistan in the early 1990s, according to several sources.

Read more: http://www.wptv.com/...

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Comment Preferences

  •  This reeks of warmongering bullshit punditry. (9+ / 0-)

    It has all of the characteristics usages.

    Romney '12: Berlusconi without the sex and alcohol!

    by Rich in PA on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 05:34:31 AM PDT

  •  There's more to this (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    leveymg, G2geek

    than some movie.

    Anniversary of 9/11.

    "Protestors" with rocket powered grenade launchers.

    American flag burned, AQ flag raised.

    •  The focus on the video IS a shiny object (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      annecros, G2geek

      While everyone was trying to chase down the identity of Sam the Producer, nobody was asking who fired the RPGs, and why.

      But, the facts are out there, if you want to put them together in a meaningful way.  I'm shocked there's so little response to this post here and at DU.

      •  It is a bit shocking (0+ / 0-)

        A rush to politicize the thing before finding out the facts. And now Yemen, where we have recently deployed a drone successfully.

        •  The facts are self-evident. There has been (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          annecros

          no rush here to politicize them.  I'm just pointing out the awful truth that blowback from US covert operations in Syria was inevitable.

          •  US covert operations in Syria? (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Quicklund, S F Hippie

            Oh boy.  That's definite CT time.  You work for Putin?

            Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

            by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 06:36:10 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  NYT, Reuters, The Hill, others have reported that (0+ / 0-)

              NYT: CIA Said to aid in steering arms to syrian rebels
              http://www.nytimes.com/...

              Reuters:  Exclusive: Obama authorizes secret US support for Syrian rebels
              http://www.reuters.com/...

              The Hill: Report: Western intelligence agencies feeding information to Syrian rebels
              http://thehill.com/...

              You really should read more widely.

              •  None of which have anything to do (0+ / 0-)

                With salafists training in Libya in2008.  Do you know for example where in Libya these camps were supposed to have been and why that'd make a difference? Do we know whether the memo was merely referring to the FIS or something else?

                Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

                by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 08:27:09 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  It's in the CNN report: Amb. '08 cable. (0+ / 0-)

                  It's linked in the OP and further excerpted in a comment in the thread above.

                  You'll have to read the materials presented to comment intelligently.

                  •  look (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Quicklund

                    I've read your materials, but the links you are drawing are simply wrong and kind of nonsensical.  Yes, I've read them, but theres a lot of confusion in the links you are trying to draw here.

                    Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

                    by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 09:22:12 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  "Growing concern re Libya safe haven" (0+ / 0-)

                      Okay, if you don't believe me, or can't understand the point, here's yet another CNN report on the subject published a few months ago.

                      http://security.blogs.cnn.com/...
                      May 15, 2012, 12:01 AM ET

                      Growing concern over jihadist ‘safe haven’ in eastern Libya

                      By Nic Robertson, Paul Cruickshank and Tim Lister, CNN

                      Diplomats and other observers in Libya say that with elections one month away, the National Transitional Council is struggling to exert control over various militia prominent in the uprising against Moammar Gadhafi. The situation is further complicated by tribal rivalries and a growing presence of Islamist militants in some areas.

                      One source briefed by Western intelligence officials says of particular concern is the city of Derna on the Mediterranean coast some 160 miles (300 kilometers) west of the Egyptian border. The source tells CNN that hundreds of Islamist militants are present in and around the town, and there are camps where weapons and physical training are provided to militants. He said one official had described the area as "a disaster zone."

                      snip

                      There have been a number of car bomb explosions in Derna in recent months, apparently as rival Islamist factions compete for supremacy in the area. One is said to have targeted Abdel Hakim al Hasadi, a former member of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG) who spent time in Afghanistan in the 1990s. He told reporters last year he had been handed over to the Americans and sent back to Libya, where he was jailed for six years. The LIFG formally repudiated al Qaeda in 2009 and disbanded shortly afterwards.

                      The source said that groups sympathetic to al Qaeda as well as former members of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group had converged on Derna – and the presence of one man was especially worrying: senior al Qaeda operative Abdul Basit Azuz. He had been sent to the area last spring by al Qaeda leader Ayman al-Zawahiri and now had some 300 men under his command. Azuz is operating at least one training facility and has sent some of his men to establish contact with other militant Islamist groups as far west as Brega, the source said.

                      Al-Zawahiri’s plan was for him to establish a "home base for al Qaeda" in Libya, the source said.

                      A senior counter-terrorism official told CNN that western intelligence is aware of Azuz’s presence, his recruitment and training of fighters, and believes his redeployment to Libya had the backing of al-Zawahiri.

                      The official said it was unclear whether former LIFG militants were contesting Azuz’z presence in Derna. It was possible, he said, that al Qaeda had grown strong enough in the area to deter such a confrontation.

                      snip

                      Azuz has been close to al-Zawahiri since the 1980s and first traveled to Afghanistan in the early 1990s to join mujahideen fighting the Soviet occupation - as did hundreds of Arab fighters.

                      snip

                      One source told CNN that the situation in the east was complicated by the presence of foreign fighters – from Algeria, Morocco and the Sahel – including some from al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb (AQIM.)

                      •  Here is where I haven't been clear (0+ / 0-)

                        Although this snip points to it.  There are, as the report says, many different competing militant islamist factions in the area, which may, or may not have had anything whatsoever to do with the attack.  Also, many if not most of those islamist factions are not part of Al Qaeda.  yes, there may be an Al qaeda operative in the area, and yes various islamist factions are operating with some impunity.  Because there are so may unclear links and so many different players, it does not make sense to say that the attacks (remember we don't know who, if anyone, planned the attacks, if they were planned) points to, or has any relation to, any groups operating in eastern Libya.  Furthermore, it points even less to the activities of Al Qaeda specifically, which is only one (and not probably the strongest) of the groups that may be involved.

                        As to any  causal links to US support for the FSA, which may or may not have fought alongside jihadists, who may or may not have affiliation with Al Qaeda is another step far beyond that.  

                        So, my objection is that the attempt to link the attacks to Al Qaeda involves a long chain of unproven suppositions, even granting that the various groups are present.  

                        Is taht clearer? (I'll grant you I've been clear as mud up to now)

                        Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

                        by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 12:00:47 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  Libyan AQ is in Syria. They got there somehow. (0+ / 0-)

                          I guess every single point needs to be illustrated for you.  Fine.  Here's another: http://uk.reuters.com/...

                          Exclusive - Libyan fighters join Syrian revolt against Assad


                          REUTERS/Shaam News Network/Handout

                          By Mariam Karouny

                          BEIRUT | Tue Aug 14, 2012 11:26am BST

                          (Reuters) - Veteran fighters of last year's civil war in Libya have come to the front-line in Syria, helping to train and organise rebels under conditions far more dire than those in the battle against Muammar Gaddafi, a Libyan-Irish fighter has told Reuters.

                          Hussam Najjar hails from Dublin, has a Libyan father and Irish mother and goes by the name of Sam. A trained sniper, he was part of the rebel unit that stormed Gaddafi's compound in Tripoli a year ago, led by Mahdi al-Harati, a powerful militia chief from Libya's western mountains.

                          Harati now leads a unit in Syria, made up mainly of Syrians but also including some foreign fighters, including 20 senior members of his own Libyan rebel unit. He asked Najjar to join him from Dublin a few months ago, Najjar said.

                          The Libyans aiding the Syrian rebels include specialists in communications, logistics, humanitarian issues and heavy weapons, he said. They operate training bases, teaching fitness and battlefield tactics.

                          snip

                          In the months since he arrived, the rebel arsenal had become "five times more powerful", he said. Fighters had obtained large calibre anti-aircraft guns and sniper rifles.

                          snip

                          LACK OF UNITY

                          Although many rebel units fight under the banner of the Free Syrian Army, their commands are localised and poorly coordinated, Najjar said.

                          "One of the biggest factors delaying the revolution is the lack of unity among the rebels," he said. "Unfortunately, it is only when their back is up against the wall that they start to realise they should (unite)."

                          Syria's uprising has evolved into an all-out civil war with sectarian overtones, pitting the mainly Sunni rebels against security forces dominated by Assad's minority Alawite sect, an offshoot of Shi'ite Islam. Assad is backed by Shi'ite-led Iran and opposed by most Arab states, which are ruled by Sunnis.

                          "This is not just about the fall of Assad. This is about the Sunni Muslims of Syria taking back their country and pushing out the minority that have been oppressing them for generations now," Najjar said.

                          snip

                          Harati's unit is known as the Umma Brigade, referring to the global community of Muslims. Najjar said thousands more Sunni fighters from the Arab world were gathering in neighbouring countries prepared to join the cause.

                          Harati is reluctant to enlist them because he does not want his cause tarnished by the perception that foreign Islamists are linked to al Qaeda, Najjar said, but he said that many of the foreigners were making their way to Syria on their own.

                          snip

                          •  This is what I'm talking about (0+ / 0-)

                            This article discusses the experience of two  Libyan veterans of the civil war who is NOT a member of Al Qaeda,and in fact the leader of the brigade is reported as

                            Harati is reluctant to enlist them because he does not want his cause tarnished by the perception that foreign Islamists are linked to al Qaeda, Najjar said, but he said that many of the foreigners were making their way to Syria on their own.
                            In other words, he's not Al Qaeda and he's reluctant to bring other foreigners into his brigade lest they be Al Qaeda.  Thus, the example you have of fighters from Libya in Syria strengthens my point that those fighters are not necessarily Al Qaeda as you suggest, becaus ethere are many, many more groups involved.  Also, in this case while Al Qaeda fighters may be there, there are substantial portions of the FSA who are not involved with them and don't want to be.  A lot of people try to blur this distinction, but it is an important point.

                            Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

                            by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 03:47:03 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Who is Khatib, and who supports him? (0+ / 0-)

                            Kuwait, and other other "sympathizers" in Antakya, as far as has been revealed in news coverage, mostly fawning.  He's the fresh-scrubbed face of foreign fighters in Syria.  But, along and the rest of the Liwa al-Ummah, have committed themselves to Jihad against the Shi'ia in Syria, and follows the teachings of Abdullah Azzam, who Osama bin Laden succeeded as the head the Service Organization after Azzam was assassinated.  That makes Azzam the intellectual father of al Qaeda and the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG) offshoot, Liwa al-Ummah, commanded by Mr. Khatib.

                            The Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG) currently arming, funding, and commanding entire brigades of the so-called "Free Syrian Army" (FSA), is designated an Al Qaeda affiliate by the United Nations pursuant to resolutions 1267 (1999) and 1989 (2011), in addition to being listed by both the US State Department and the UK Home Office (page 5).  According to Foreign Policy, http://www.foreignpolicy.com/...

                            Khatib divides his time between Syria and Turkey, where he shuttles between Istanbul and Antakya, the city close to the border that has become a hub for the Syrian rebels, to coordinate with sympathizers. "We're putting the word out and gathering popular support for the political battle ahead," he says.

                            From its uniforms -- all purchased by Harati in Turkey -- to its arsenal, Liwa al-Ummah appears well funded compared with many other rebel brigades. The arms at its disposal include 12.5 mm and 14.5 mm anti-aircraft guns, rocket-propelled grenades, and rifles including PKCs and M16s. Harati says the brigade has access to "new and improved" weaponry now that rebel forces control several border posts along the frontier with Turkey. But as he is quick to point out, "It's still a very unbalanced war." Like other Syrian rebel factions, the brigade is also developing expertise to produce improvised explosive devices to target Assad's forces.

                            Harati says Liwa al-Ummah draws on a network of private donors in Syria and across the Middle East and North Africa for financing. Its Facebook page features several expressions of gratitude to named benefactors in Kuwait.

          •  THAT is what you were just pointing out? Huh. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            S F Hippie

            Because it is not at all clear from reading the diary what it is you intended to point out. I for one did not pick up a hint that your point was Syrian blowback.

            I'll limit my comments to this: You would do well by yourself to consider the world a very complicated place and not the simple one-coincidence-explains-all place you seem to think it is.

    •  You have mixed two different events. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      doc2

      Flag raised: Egypt. No rocket power grenade lauchers.

      Libya: No flag raised but grenade launchers.

      Yes, I agree the Libyan attack was an organized pre-planned attack. But that was Libya not Egypt.

    •  Did you forget what was going on inBenghazi (0+ / 0-)

      Last year?

      Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

      by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 06:35:14 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Not at all (0+ / 0-)

        It is all pieces of a bigger picture.

        A bigger picture than many are seeing at the moment.

        •  A bunch of supposition (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Quicklund

          Isn't particularly useful.  In fact there are a large number of ways trained people with RPGs could end up there to oppose US forces (and we have no other reports of these supposed two other fatalities). The point is that a coordinated attack (if in fact it was that.   It sounds more and more like it wasn't) could have been done by a much much wider range of people than Al Qaeda, who are rather far down the list of suspects here

          Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

          by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 08:32:48 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  where is your source (0+ / 0-)

    for this charge...

    we would be destroying the very same Saudi-GCC financed militias that we now help in our effort to overthrow the Syrian regime:
    ?

    "Fascism is attracting the dregs of humanity- people with a slovenly biography - sadists, mental freaks, traitors." - ILYA EHRENBURG

    by durrati on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 05:58:25 AM PDT

    •  It's all conjecture. It is a (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Quicklund, S F Hippie

      conjecture diary.

    •  Here are some mainstream media sources (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      annecros

      It's not a controversial assertion that Libyan groups provide many of the foreign fighters in Syria.

      As Syrian War Drags On, Jihad Gains Foothold - NYTimes.com
      www.nytimes.com/...as-syrian-war-drags-on-jihad-gains-foot...
      Jul 29, 2012 – Syrians involved in the uprising say it is becoming more radicalized: ... better armed Syrian militant organizations pushing an agenda based on jihad, ... The foreigners included Libyans, Algerians and one Spaniard, he said, ...

      Syria Exclusive: Islamist Militants Fight Alongside Rebels | World ...
      world.time.com
      .../time-exclusive-meet-the-islamist-militants-fi...
      Jul 26, 2012 – TIME Exclusive: Meet the Islamist Militants Fighting Alongside Syria's Rebels. As foreign jihadists rally around the cause of Syria's rebels, TIME meets .... some foreign jihadists in his group, from Kuwait, Libya and Kazakhstan.

      •  That's a little different, by which I mean... (5+ / 0-)

        ...entirely different, that claiming Libya is a staging ground for AQ-in-Syria, and that the US gives AQ a safe haven in Libya for that purpose.

        Romney '12: Berlusconi without the sex and alcohol!

        by Rich in PA on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 06:18:26 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Exactly (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Quicklund

          "Fascism is attracting the dregs of humanity- people with a slovenly biography - sadists, mental freaks, traitors." - ILYA EHRENBURG

          by durrati on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 06:27:00 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  What other conclusion is there to draw? (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          annecros

          If you read the CNN article cited you will see that the Ambassador himself wrote a cable pointing out the reconstitution of AQ in Libya, and that we have detailed intelligence about who they are and where they're located.  Therefore, we must conclude there is a reason for why the US has not been pursuing AQ inside Libya by the usual means.

          What's you thinking on this?

      •  Boy (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Quicklund

        Are you confused about the Middle East. You got sixty different pieces all in the wrong order.  

        Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

        by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 06:37:39 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  It's the standard ordering that got us into this (0+ / 0-)

          mess.

          Excuse me if I don't let others do the thinking for me.  

          I suggest you toss the jigsaw board in the air, or find another game.  Fill-in-the-lines with crayons, perhaps?

          Pretty pictures for your walls.

          •  ? (0+ / 0-)

            Was that supposed to make sense?

            I might suggest still dying a little more to understand how salafists, Wahhabis, Al Qaeda, jihadis and mujahideen are different and overlap.  When you can tell the difference between Iranian and Turkish Islamists and the relationship between the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood, Hamas, and hizbollah (Lebanon) then you'll be in a much better position to make sense of the mosaic

            Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

            by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 08:24:28 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  What makes you think I'm unaware of complexity? (0+ / 0-)

              I've been writing country reports about this and other refugee-generating regions with widespread human rights abuses around the world for thirty years.

              •  Here is why (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Quicklund

                The premise of your diary which conflates north African salafists with Al Qaeda suggests that there are some distinctions you are breezing past.  The attempt to link support for the FSA to the presence of jihadis of some kind in Syria to the attack in Libya shows more conflation.  

                In fact, even the link that you provided of the reported presence of Ansar-al-Sharia in 2008 does not really suggest a link to Al Qaeda there, and much less a link between the attacks and those camps.  

                It is a given that wherever there is a war and no strong governmnet control that one or more of the militant groups will show up.  Not that suprising and certainly not any evidence of some grand conspiracy or even of blow back.  The blowback is far more likely from decades of US sponsored oppression and coziness with Israel than from Syria, frankly.

                Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

                by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 09:20:33 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

  •  Warmongering during war on terror=oxymoronic. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Rich in PA

    When did war on terror end? Coordinated attacks like these require a military response. Justice for these terrorists and their allies is a drone counter attack.

    "If the past sits in judgment on the present, the future will be lost." Winston Churchill

    by Kvetchnrelease on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 06:04:41 AM PDT

    •  That's a different issue. (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Kvetchnrelease, Quicklund, G2geek

      I'm all for raining fiery death on whoever the US identified as being responsible for killing our diplomats.  I uprated PatriciaVa's HR'd comment in another diary that talked about that.  I'm in the pro-drone camp, and the pro-SEAL camp when it's operationally necessary. What I don't support is another general war, and the diary's fantastical claims about the US granting AQ a safe haven in Libya are calculated to promote one.

      Romney '12: Berlusconi without the sex and alcohol!

      by Rich in PA on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 06:20:59 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  There's no fantasy about it, and there's no (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        annecros

        promotion of another general war in this diary.  Quite the opposite.

      •  what Rich in PA said. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        leveymg

        I'm with you on all of your points.

        And: look at all the places in the world that could really benefit from NRO satellites watching them.  Know what sucks?  Somehow I don't think we have as many of those as we need.

        "Minus two votes for the Democrat" equals "plus one vote for the Republican." Arithmetic doesn't care about your feelings.

        by G2geek on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 07:30:36 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  If we really wanted to kill AQ, we'd get them (0+ / 0-)

          going into Syria.  But, we're playing the same dangerous game as we did in Bosnia and Kosovo of using our enemies to kill other enemies.

          Problem is, we seem to forget who our enemies are.  I would hope the death of the American Ambassador and the others would remind us of who's been killing us.

          It isn't the Syrians.

    •  How about a cold war approach (0+ / 0-)

      in which we not borrow money from China to send to Egypt and Lybia until they hunt these animals down?

    •  No they absolutely do not (0+ / 0-)

      Require a military response.  They require investigation to find out what happened and then probably an intelligence and criminal response.   Drone strikes are a blunt and stupid instrument

      Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

      by Mindful Nature on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 06:40:17 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Whew... a heady mix of (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    FishOutofWater, Quicklund, sofia

    blame-the-victim and connect-the-dots here. The suggestion, taken to its (il)logical end, seems to be that Ansar al-Sharia is, if not a creation of the U.S., at least an organization whose training, methods and goals "we" tolerate and facilitate.

    It's whack ... and it's Thursday.

    Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time. (Terry Pratchett)

    by angry marmot on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 06:25:44 AM PDT

    •  The same was said about AQ. And it's true. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      annecros

      We're repeating exactly the same errors of cooperation with terrorist groups backed by hostile partners that we committed before 9/11 - it's called blowback.

      It will get worse before it gets better.

      •  It's all shifting sands. Militants won't go away (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        S F Hippie

        What's wrong with this post is the implication that we could have stopped this attack from happening by doing drone strikes in Libya.

        That's pretty fucked up.

        Drone strikes in Libya could turn the population against us.

        look for my eSci diary series Thursday evening.

        by FishOutofWater on Thu Sep 13, 2012 at 07:03:44 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  The point isn't drones, it's safehaven for AQ (0+ / 0-)

          in Libya that have been apparently been treated according to a more permissive set of rules.

          I agree there are other factors at work here behind the decision to not use drones in Libya up to this point.  Undoubtedly, there are concerns about the appearance of expanding US military operations in Libya, and about further destabilization of the new regime in Tripoli.  But, why are we dealing with AQ in Libya differently from Yemen, Afghanistan, and Pakistani?  

          Here's a related question: why is there no apparent effort to hunt AQ cells as they transit through Jordan, Lebanon, Iraq and Turkey on their way into Syria?  

          The answers have to do with the policy of regime change.  We have been conducting regime change operations in Libya and Syria, and the use of drones in one, someone apparently thought, might interfere with the execution of the other mission.   These layers of complexity entail risk, and sometimes risk has costs.

          •  More imaginations (0+ / 0-)
            Here's a related question: why is there no apparent effort to hunt AQ cells as they transit through Jordan, Lebanon, Iraq and Turkey on their way into Syria?
            You are aware of the overt and covert operations underway by the Jordanian, Lebanese, Israeli, Turkish, US, and Iraq governments ... how?
            •  Because AQ is manifestly in Syria, and there has (0+ / 0-)

              been no mention of any particular obstacles being placed in the way of their transit to that destination by any of the states you mentioned.

              Just as there was no particular effort to block the entry of Jihadists into Bosnia and Kosovo.  In fact, just like Syria, we facilitated and aided the foreign fighters there, some of whom went on to kill 3,000 Americans on 9/11/01.

              History has a way of repeating itself for those who repeat their mistakes.

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