Skip to main content

Remember Poblano? Nate Silver, aka Poblano, posted here before he started his own blog, long before the gig with the New York Times. Poblano became an overnight sensation on the user side of the page because of the exceptional quality of his analysis but as far as I can remember, his work was never picked up on the front page. Nate's new numerical methods of assessing polling information were setting a new standard in political analysis, but Kos didn't promote his writing here. Kos blew it.

Now Kos is blaming the community for following his example by banning someone quickly....because the site lost a huge story. All the eyeballs and credit are going to another site. An editor here could have checked out the Romney videos posted by the autobanned diarist. But neither Kos nor editor did anything until they discovered the videos were posted here first, then buried by the autoban. Whether the diarist was banned or not, Kos always had the power to front page the diaries containing the videos. But, no, he blamed overzealous users for jumping on a new diarist who behaved in an unusual manner. That's pretty rich coming from a guy who has banned long time users for innocently uprating one comment. Kos' quick trigger finger set the example followed by the vigilant trusted users.

Kos continues to blow it. Jed is an excellent political analyst and writer when he takes the time to do it well, but the non-stop political trivia swamps out other talented writers and bigger stories. The collapse of Arctic sea ice this September is as big a story as the collapse of Mitt Romney, but is there any mention of it on the front page. Of course, this is a blog about politics and elections, but what is a bigger political problem than the collapse of stability of the climate of the northern hemisphere?

And where does Kos think California's going to get water when the storm track moves north? There have been 3 major western droughts in the past 10 years. BillaurelMD has explained how wind patterns and sea surface temperatures in the western Atlantic and eastern Pacific are triggering western droughts. These patterns last for decades. Western droughts can expand to the midcontinent, affecting food production and food prices. By the time the patterns change, global warming will make the western drought permanent by killing much of the western mountain forests and melting much of the snow. But does Kos even think about the ramifications of the desertification of the west and the great plains? Apparently not, based on the content of the front page.

Remember the Fishgrease boomer diaries on the BP gusher in the Gulf? Rachel noticed, but Kos didn't.

Why oh why hasn't Kos promoted a teacherken education diary to the front page?

In my opinion Kos has been taking regular users for granted for years.

And today he blamed us.

Kos, take responsibility for your actions and for your neglect.

You blew it.

EMAIL TO A FRIEND X
Your Email has been sent.
You must add at least one tag to this diary before publishing it.

Add keywords that describe this diary. Separate multiple keywords with commas.
Tagging tips - Search For Tags - Browse For Tags

?

More Tagging tips:

A tag is a way to search for this diary. If someone is searching for "Barack Obama," is this a diary they'd be trying to find?

Use a person's full name, without any title. Senator Obama may become President Obama, and Michelle Obama might run for office.

If your diary covers an election or elected official, use election tags, which are generally the state abbreviation followed by the office. CA-01 is the first district House seat. CA-Sen covers both senate races. NY-GOV covers the New York governor's race.

Tags do not compound: that is, "education reform" is a completely different tag from "education". A tag like "reform" alone is probably not meaningful.

Consider if one or more of these tags fits your diary: Civil Rights, Community, Congress, Culture, Economy, Education, Elections, Energy, Environment, Health Care, International, Labor, Law, Media, Meta, National Security, Science, Transportation, or White House. If your diary is specific to a state, consider adding the state (California, Texas, etc). Keep in mind, though, that there are many wonderful and important diaries that don't fit in any of these tags. Don't worry if yours doesn't.

You can add a private note to this diary when hotlisting it:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from your hotlist?
Are you sure you want to remove your recommendation? You can only recommend a diary once, so you will not be able to re-recommend it afterwards.
Rescue this diary, and add a note:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from Rescue?
Choose where to republish this diary. The diary will be added to the queue for that group. Publish it from the queue to make it appear.

You must be a member of a group to use this feature.

Add a quick update to your diary without changing the diary itself:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary?
(The diary will be removed from the site and returned to your drafts for further editing.)
(The diary will be removed.)
Are you sure you want to save these changes to the published diary?

Comment Preferences

  •  Laura Clawson writes education diaries (12+ / 0-)

    sometimes in more detail than I do

    the material gets covered on the front page

    if I have done a diary on the topic first, Laura normally links to me

    "We didn't set out to save the world; we set out to wonder how other people are doing and to reflect on how our actions affect other people's hearts." - Pema Chodron

    by teacherken on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 05:41:49 PM PDT

    •  You are very kind. (7+ / 0-)

      Laura does cover education but your personal experience and in-depth knowledge of the issues makes many of your education posts worthy of the FP in my opinion.

      look for my eSci diary series Thursday evening.

      by FishOutofWater on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 05:58:29 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  All of us old timers (6+ / 0-)

        know very well that they don't fp diaries like they used to.

        I can take a guess why - but the best material here is still in the diaries, and it seems sometimes that the same diary is re-written when an fp of the orginal diary would have done just as well.

        Another example: Markos is now building a page on economics.  Years ago he had two very good writers on economics who could have done the same thing: and both were writers with big followings here.

        And who happened to have been right years before the housing crisis hit.

        That is a missed opportunity as well IMHO.

        The bitter truth of deep inequality has been disguised by an era of cheap imported goods and the anyone-can-make-it celebrity myth - Polly Toynbee

        by fladem on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 06:50:22 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Unlike most of the diaries here, (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          FishOutofWater

          the front page pieces are queued -- so a front page piece may have been written at the same time as the one in the diaries but because of the queue doesn't show up till hours later. So it's not so much a duplication of effort as two (or more) souls with the same thought; great minds think alike and all that.

          As far as the economics writers, they were more or less chased off by members of the community IIRC...which is what Markos was addressing in his diary today. I'm looking forward to the economics portal, if they can explain concepts in words of one syllable or less; I could never make it through an entire quarter of Econ (macro or micro) without dropping midway through.

          "If we ever needed to vote we sure do need to vote now" -- Rev. William Barber, NAACP

          by Cali Scribe on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 08:35:24 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  Some of my favorite diarists have been banned. And (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    MTmofo, overlander, varii, northsylvania

    I'm taking a risk of being banned myself for writing this.

    I don't feel we did wrong in taking this great country away from them. There were great numbers of people who needed new land, and the Indians were selfishly trying to keep it for themselves. -John Wayne (-9.00,-8.86)

    by Jonathan Hoag on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 05:45:29 PM PDT

  •  I will never forget.... (12+ / 0-)

    how he came and promoted his 100 dollar life memberships and once he got the cash he went around banning people, like gchaucer, for minor and often ridiculous offenses.  I've never gotten my ability to uprate back after being punished for supposedly uprating a comment that wasn't popular in a Cenk Uygar diary.  One single uprate after years and years of good mojo.  

  •  I agree with you that we have not paid enough (23+ / 0-)

    attention to climate change and its implications here. I don't think we have done enough about supporting down-ticket races either. Just my 2 cents.

    •  For me, I think the problem (9+ / 0-)

      is that DKos is a commentary site more than a news site.  With all the money and talent here, I think Kos needs to start hiring reporters.  This is what TPM does very well, and DKos should start moving towards.

      Don't get me wrong, much of the stuff on the front page is excellent commentary...but for all of Kos's criticisms, DKos could not survive without articles to comment on from the NY Times, WAPO, MSNBC, etc.

      I think Kos is more a horserace guy...so instead of hiring reporters with the money he makes here, instead he hires PPP to do polling.

      "Empty vessels make the loudest sound, they have the least wit and are the greatest blabbers" Plato

      by Empty Vessel on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 06:22:16 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Yes, he's a horserace guy (5+ / 0-)

        The polling is good stuff.  He can't compete with the big outfits on reporting but he does try to cover the Hill.

        My criticism is of the small ball nature of much of the commentary here. Krugman is worth reading because he provides informed comments about critical economic issues. I don't have patience for the trivial stuff.

        look for my eSci diary series Thursday evening.

        by FishOutofWater on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 06:46:39 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  meteor blades, terrific newshound, merits pulitzer (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        FishOutofWater, melo, SadieSue, blueoasis

        If Kos would pkg 10 columns from each of last 3 years and send them on to columbia u in nyc, blades might win one.
        I think front page has improved over last couple years.
        There are no duds, and it's often straddling news and advocacy; which I thought was the purpose of the site.
        I believe that DKos still ripples out and sometimes the waves have as big impact far away as here.
        I can't fathom every outcome wrinkle chapter episode memoir decision but I admire more and more kogs as I find them contributing.
         I'm sorry some of you hurt. I despise what republicans have wrought upon us. It's so horrible, far reaching, and not near over. Dkos is a great shelter in that storm, regardless of flaws.
        Cases can be made for changes, of course.
        So make the case, patiently, if you have one. There are daily kog-run forums to promote and discuss topics and posts. We got big eyes and ears for our homegrown talents.
        We have a vital election season to win. After that, we could catch up on all straggling important tasks and goals.

        Republicans Make Our Lives Miserable. Drop Them.

        by renzo capetti on Tue Sep 18, 2012 at 06:36:00 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I agree about down-ticket . . . (0+ / 0-)

      but think "climage change and its implications" poses a different, and perhaps intractable, problem.  It's done, there's nothing to be done about it, there's nothing, really, left to talk about except how bad it's going to get and how quickly it's going to be, well, not over but intolerable.

      Neither "doom and gloom" nor "false hope" do much good (for the front page especially), and people who are willing to face what has happened have other places to go to talk about the gory details.

      I think we've reached the point where if denial lets people be "happy" let them have their denial . . . it doesn't matter anyway.  It is too late to "fix it".  We are past the "tipping point", the snowball has begun its runaway roll and there's no stopping it now.

      Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

      by Deward Hastings on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 08:49:11 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Just as there is a tipping point for losing (6+ / 0-)

        the arctic ice cap, there are plenty of other tipping points. It matters greatly what we do.

        We are destroying the planet. Unless you call someplace else home, it should be a it deal. Yep, it is going to be gloom and doom, but there are many levels of doom with corresponding levels of suffering.

        Once the ice cap melts, then things ought to really change. Things like bad droughts, bad heat waves, crop failure. If we stop emitting carbon today, there will be problems for many of the 7 billion plus of us, not to mention many, many other species. If we continue down our current path, it will be much much worse.

        What could possibly be more important than saving our home?

        There is only one planet suitable for human habitation in our solar system.

        by too many people on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 09:45:15 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  "it will be much much worse . . ." (0+ / 0-)

          It will be much much worse regardless.  As a practical matter it is out of our hands . . . we have initiated processes and feedbacks that cannot be stopped, and which will overwhelm any likely, or even possible, efforts to stop them.  450ppm CO2 is baked into the "economic" system within the next quarter century, and will remain for at least half a century even with an all out effort to reduce human emissions (which isn't going to happen for political and social reasons).  That is the trigger, and it has already been pulled.

          Arctic sea ice will be gone not just in the Summer (five-ten years for that) but nearly year-round, also in the next quarter century, as the refreeze steadily goes the way of the now-nearly-gone multi-year ice.  With that comes enough warming of the Arctic Ocean to initiate runaway release of Methane, both from melting permafrost and from sub-sea clathrates.  The greenhouse effect of that release will swamp human CO2 emissions, and unstopable planet-wide warming will accelerate.  That's when sea level rise really becomes an issue.  Although Greenland has a few surprises in store before that the melt-induced rise is a lagging indicator . . . the failure of the thermohaline currents out of the Arctic will cause much more immediate "issues" as the oceans, and ultimately the abyss, warm.

          It does not matter how important it is to "save our home" . . . it is already too late.  The fire has been started, and we do not have the means to put it out.  It used to be that "denialists" were the ones who said there was no "global warming" . . . the new denialists are those who believe it can be stopped.  Sorry about that . . .

           

          Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

          by Deward Hastings on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 11:58:33 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  We can always make it worse. (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            too many people, SadieSue

            Geologic history shows that there are many possible outcomes to what we have started.

            Of course, we can give up on geology and chose the Venus option by doing absolutely nothing.

            look for my eSci diary series Thursday evening.

            by FishOutofWater on Tue Sep 18, 2012 at 07:51:50 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  So the house is on fire, agreed. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            too many people

            But if we can still save a room, a wall, some framework, that would be better than just letting the whole thing burn down. Not for us - we're screwed - for whatever part of the rest of the life on earth that can survive with whatever part is left. No need to let it all go down the tubes, if we can save even part of it...
            Not for us.

            "I'm grateful for my job - truly, but still...ugh." CityLightsLover

            by Audri on Tue Sep 18, 2012 at 08:54:31 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  It's not as if (0+ / 0-)

              it's the "end of the world" . . . there have been ice-free (and quite warm) epochs before.  The Earth is not going to "go Venus" as a result of our foolishness.  But it is going to go to a state with which we (humans) are not accustomed, and to which we are not well adapted.  The remaining humans will find that "last room", and overpopulate and pollute it too . . .

              Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

              by Deward Hastings on Tue Sep 18, 2012 at 09:16:52 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Yes but (0+ / 0-)

                do we have to take down as much of the other species as possible with us? Or can we limit the damage as much as possible, even though we won't benefit in the long run?

                "I'm grateful for my job - truly, but still...ugh." CityLightsLover

                by Audri on Tue Sep 18, 2012 at 11:39:19 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  My current sense of things (0+ / 0-)

                  is that it is now, as a practical matter, "out of our hands" . . . far beyond our ability to "limit" anything.  The multiple feedback loops associated with the loss of Arctic ice will force transition to a new equilibrium, and a dramatically different "world climate" associated with that equilibrium.  That is, after all, what "tipping point" means . . . you push the limits of one equilibrium until the whole system inexorably transitions to another.

                  We know what "pushed the limit" . . . the burning of previously sequestered Carbon and the resultant increase in atmospheric CO2.  We do not, at this point, have any way to "push back" (I have seen some suggestions of massive scale "geo-engineering" projects . . . they scare me more even than "nature taking its course").  If we were to completely stop burning fossil fuels tomorrow (which obviously isn't going to happen) the transition to the "new equilibrium" would happen anyway . . . delayed at most by a few dozen years, if that.  The demons we've released are far bigger than we are . . .

                  Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                  by Deward Hastings on Tue Sep 18, 2012 at 12:26:03 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I understand (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    too many people

                    And agree. All I'm saying it that I think maybe we can still have some effect on how far into the ditch it goes.

                    "I'm grateful for my job - truly, but still...ugh." CityLightsLover

                    by Audri on Tue Sep 18, 2012 at 12:34:25 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  The enormous heat capacity (1+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      Quicklund

                      of the two ice caps and the oceans push the final settling point of the "new equilibrium" many centuries into the future.  I doubt that anything we do now will have any effect on it.  There are, though, a number of hints that point to what it will look like.

                      From Earth's perspective it's "been there, done that, left plenty of evidence" . . .

                      Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                      by Deward Hastings on Tue Sep 18, 2012 at 12:57:53 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

          •  Strawman (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            FishOutofWater

            No one thinks it can be "stopped" since it is already in progress.

            That doesn't mean we should just let it happen with no attempt to mitigate it. Climate scientists themselves are split on to what extent we can mitigate: a lot or just a little. But all I know advocate action and action now. The bottom line is HOW BAD are we going to let it get.

            FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

            by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 05:07:34 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  The "bottom line" is (0+ / 0-)

              that once past the "tipping point" (and we are) we no longer have any control (or even influence) over "HOW BAD" it is going to get.  I see no "action and action now" (apart from massive, and highly speculative, geo-engineering projects) that we can undertake that will make any difference.  If you know some way to reverse the (already locked in) energy imbalance and restore Arctic sea ice before massive Methane release begins I'd love to hear what it is . . .

              To use again the "trigger" analogy . . . the trigger is pulled, the hammer has fallen, the primer has ignited, the powder is burning and the bullet has begun (or is about to begin) its transit.  You cannot "unpull" the trigger, and trying to put your thumb over the end of the barrel to stop the bullet is . . . well . . . not likely to have much useful effect.

              It is out of our hands now . . .

              Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

              by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 08:25:36 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Wow (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                FishOutofWater

                You make several assumptions which MAY be true but no global warming scientist thing is inevitable. You are giving up before you even KNOW if the trigger is pulled.

                Defeatism is the lazy person's way out...and if followed is self fulfilling.

                However, the IPCC and Union of Concerned Scientists and global warming scientists I personally know (my wife is one) all think action, not lazy defeatism, is needed. From just last year the IPCC issued a report on energy policy and mitigation. There is a scientific journal dedicated to the mitigation as well as adaptation to climate change started, I believe, in 2010 (or at least able to be included in citation databases then). There is a Handbook of Climate Change Mitigationtigation written by scientists. A friend of my wife's who got her Ph.D. in atmospheric sciences the year or so before my wife did has sought employment in the mitigation field. So the people MOST knowledgeable about it are making policy recommendations about mitigation. That trumps your assumptions that justify doing nothing in my book. I prefer listening to the scientists than some random defeatist.

                FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 09:12:31 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  By all means post (0+ / 0-)

                  (or better, ask her to post) your wife's prescription for restoring the Arctic sea ice (before it's too late, if she doesn't believe it's already too late).

                  I'm all eyes (but not holding my breath) . . . your denialist handwaving is less convincing than PIOMAS and CryoSat-2 . . .

                  Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                  by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 09:32:03 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Not what I said (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    FishOutofWater

                    Restoring Arctic sea ice is not the same as mitigating global warming's effects. This is one of the assumptions you are making that I referred to earlier. There are many tipping points. I have no doubt we have passed some. I see no reason to assume that passing ONE tipping point automatically means we have triggered them all.

                    And honestly, calling ME a denialist is about as logical as calling Thomas Huxley a creationist.

                    FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                    by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 09:45:01 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  You're no Thomas Huxley . . . (0+ / 0-)

                      and I still await your wife's prescription either for restoring Arctic sea ice or mitigating the inevitable consequences of its loss (in any meaningful way).

                      "I see no reason to assume that passing ONE tipping point automatically means we have triggered them all."

                      That is the logical equivalent of saying you see no reason to assume that pulling the trigger will make a bullet come out of the barrel.  It reflects your failure of vision, not mine . . .

                      Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                      by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 10:18:36 AM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  No it isn't (1+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        FishOutofWater

                        There is no reason whatsoever to assume the loss of Arctic ice will automatically trigger all other possible tipping points. If you have evidence otherwise please link to it. It is clear that reaching one tipping point means others are that much nearer, so don't give me evidence of that. Give me evidence that reaching one tipping point necessarily means all tipping points are reached.

                        Your science seems faulty.

                        FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                        by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 10:28:40 AM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  It doesn't have to (0+ / 0-)

                          "trigger all other possible tipping points" . . . it only has to trigger runaway Methane release.  That all it takes, and it's quite enough, thank you.

                          Of course denying that is where your denialism leads you . . .

                          Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                          by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 11:01:13 AM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  Sigh... (0+ / 0-)

                            And your evidence that it DEFINITELY does? Scientific citations, please. No one in their right mind says it MIGHT, but you assume it is a given and surrender in response. Citation please?

                            And seriously. I have been talking about global warming and following the science (in the scientific journals) for about 20 years. My wife works under Jim Hansen (not directly). I have talked to some of the top scientists in the field (e.g. Gavin Schmitt). My wife is now actively studying climate change.

                            So calling me "denialist" just because I think you are being lazy in your attitude and wording makes no sense whatsoever.

                            FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                            by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 11:13:26 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  and I still await (0+ / 0-)

                            your wife's prescription either for restoring Arctic sea ice or mitigating the inevitable consequences of its loss (in any meaningful way).

                            Next time you "talk to" your authority figures ask what the consequence of runaway release of Arctic Methane is going to be.

                            Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                            by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 11:57:04 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Why? (0+ / 0-)

                            I NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT RESTORING IT. Stop with the damned strawman arguments.

                            I challenge your defeatism about the situation and your ASSUMPTION that loss of Arctic sea ice means game over and do nothing. I still await your evidence for that. Until then it is an assumption YOU are making and I see no scientist make. Most scientists I know are still saying we desperately need to ACT and you are saying "don't bother, too late."

                            FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                            by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 12:24:29 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  "Most scientists I know (0+ / 0-)

                            are still saying we desperately need to ACT".

                            Don't ask them what ought to be done (assuming that anything still can) or what ought to have been done (when it still would have made a difference).

                            Ask them what they think is going to be done, and what is going to happen as a result . . . and compare that answer to what I'm saying.

                            It helps to couch the question as "between you, me and the fly on the wall" . . .   I find that few are willing to say in public what they will admit in private . . .

                            Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                            by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 12:43:44 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Difference (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            FishOutofWater

                            Difference between what should and what is going to be done is a valid point. However they are BOTH different from advocating doing nothing. I suggest you ask them if they think we should do nothing.

                            FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                            by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 12:51:04 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Oh, and if Arctic sea ice is not restored (0+ / 0-)

                            what will prevent continued warming of the Arctic Ocean and the decomposition of Methane Hydrates (and release of Methane gas) that will result?

                            Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                            by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 12:47:58 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Depends... (0+ / 0-)

                            First, what do you mean by ice-free? I pointed out that complication earlier. Seasonal loss is different from permanent and would have different consequences on the ocean below.

                            Second, the dynamics of what the ocean below will do are not clear. Many things are likely, but when, how and over what period the methane release will occur is by no means clear. You seem to assume it will all bubble out at once. Not necessarily true.

                            Point is you seem to be making claims as if you know with 100% certainty that the Arctic will be COMPLETELY ice-free soon and that methane will all be released within a very short period of time.

                            I don't dispute most of the individual elements of your view. Your calling me "denialist" was a meaningless taunt. I have clearly agreed with you on the basic science. But I believe you go beyond the science and take worst case scenario as a 100% certainty in a short period of time and advocate surrender. In fact seem to get angry when people advocate action (actions along the lines I cited before coming from scientists).

                            Quote me one non-denialist scientist who advocates inaction?

                            FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                            by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 12:57:03 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  It seems you are willing to misrepresent (0+ / 0-)

                            (or fantasize) pretty much everything you imagine I'm saying in order to "win" (whatever it is you think you're winning).  Whatever.  Make up whatever you want to make up, and "argue" with it however you want . . . just stop putting my name on it.

                            In fact why don't you just stop replying to my comments altogether, since you have nothing honest to add to them.

                            Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                            by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 01:39:26 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Seriously... (0+ / 0-)

                            Now you flounce off? Fine. If that's what makes you feel better.

                            FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                            by mole333 on Thu Sep 20, 2012 at 04:19:27 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  The truth doesn't need repeating. (0+ / 0-)

                            I've said it, you've denied it, we're done.

                            Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                            by Deward Hastings on Thu Sep 20, 2012 at 08:00:17 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                •  Ps. and by the way, (0+ / 0-)

                  back in 2007, when the IPCC was boldly predicting the passing of the summer Arctic sea ice by 2100 I was regularly denounced as "alarmist" and "crazy" for calling 2020 at the latest.

                  Doesn't look so crazy now, does it . . .

                  Granted that one correct prediction does not a "track record" make, still I find it personally reassuring that my assessment bested (in accuracy) that of your "experts" . . .

                  I'm still working on the same "several assumptions" (somewhat refined) that led to that correct prediction.  And it is certainly not true (as you assert)  that "no global warming scientist" accepts those same assumptions that I do.  In fact it is from "golbal warming scientists" that I get most of them . . .
                   

                  Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                  by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 11:31:40 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Good for you... (0+ / 0-)

                    But I still don't see how your assumption that an ice free Arctic means Game Over and we should all just give up.

                    Reading this article (which talks about the consequences) I don't see it:

                    http://www.wunderground.com/...

                    Those who directly highlight the very problem you discuss are calling for ACTION, not defeatism (though I am not convinced of all the actions they advocate for):

                    http://www.wunderground.com/...

                    And they question the simplistic view you have of "ice-free Arctic" (exactly how do you mean "ice-free" matters...seasonal is different from permanent):

                    http://www.realclimate.org/...

                    You are the only person who believes in global warming I have heard advocate inaction in the face of what is going on.

                    FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                    by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 12:17:06 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  "they question the simplistic view you have" (0+ / 0-)

                      Your insults, coming as they do from an idiot, don't phase me . . .

                      There, how do you like it "back in kind" ? ? ?

                      And just what "simplistic view" do you suppose I have ? ? ?

                      Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

                      by Deward Hastings on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 12:31:00 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  As I have been pointing out... (0+ / 0-)

                        Loss of Arctic Sea Ice = Game Over

                        Simplistic because a.) you seem to be basing your assumption on seasonal ice free Arctic, and b.) you consider it a given that loss of the Arctic ice guarantees all methane below is then released.

                        I do not see the basis for that.

                        FREEDOM ISN'T FREE: That's why we pay taxes. I Had A Thought

                        by mole333 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 12:49:14 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                      •  Name calling is not helpful (0+ / 0-)

                        Even if large amounts of methane are released as may have happened in the PETM, there's a big difference between the Paleocene and the end Permian.

                        look for my eSci diary series Thursday evening.

                        by FishOutofWater on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 04:33:38 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

    •  I've always loved the two-brained aspect of dkos.. (5+ / 0-)

        The causes, lives, and experiences of the members resonate with, inform, and propel the politics.
         Global warming is probably the biggest example of this, but even compelling stories of losing a loved one or sharing photos of backyard birds weave us together and strengthen our bonds.
         And then we can take that strength of community to our political goals.
         That's why I've always been leery of the authoritarian aspects of the site, kind of like an open manhole in the middle of whatever the topic is that day.

  •  Kos blows a lot of things. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    varii, Audri
  •  Asking for proper verification is sensible (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Bill W, Eyesbright

    You can cry about lost stories if you want to but it's not about being first. It's about being correct and having all the facts before you shoot.

    That's the problem with you, 24/7 news and the Romney campaign. The let's shoot before we have a good shot philosophy you sprout is the dumbest argument possible. People were asking for context and facts about a video that no one knew of its origins. But to you, it's about being first to get credit.

    Dumb.

    •  Are you responding to me? (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      gustynpip, renzo capetti

      Kos is the one who complained about the user getting banned. Perhaps he would have liked to get credit for it being posted here. That's the impression I got from his post.

      I had nothing to do with the autoban. I was on vacation.

      My approach to diaries like those is to let them be. It takes time to check out stories.

      look for my eSci diary series Thursday evening.

      by FishOutofWater on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 06:20:50 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It reminded me... (0+ / 0-)

      ...of the Monica Lewinsky business.  Michael Isikoff had the story, but he couldn't confirm it, so he didn't run it.  Matt Drudge had the story, couldn't confirm it, but didn't care, so he ran it anyway.  I guess by Markos' standards, that makes Matt Drudge the superior journalist? He did have it first, after all.

  •  Also, why won't kos wash my effin car? (7+ / 0-)

    It's been sitting in my driveway for years, and still he hasn't washed it.

    Frankly, it needs washing bad, and kos has had dozens of opportunities to do so.  But so far, nothing.

    Talk about blowing it.

    Faby-o, downrec me again. You know I love it!

    by Cheez Whiz on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 05:59:25 PM PDT

  •  Our favorite pirate captain on the subject. (5+ / 0-)

    The general who wins the battle makes many calculations in his temple before the battle is fought. The general who loses makes but few calculations beforehand. - Sun Tzu

    by Otteray Scribe on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 05:59:45 PM PDT

  •  I'm one of the people Kos was yelling at. (7+ / 0-)

    And i fully accept blame and have apologized to the diariast. To be fair to Kos, i didn't give the earlier diaries the attention they deserved, jumping to a wrong conclusion that because the new diariest didn't follow protocol, his evidence was bogus. You do make a good point about diaries on climate change but, we all are here voluntarily, ya know? I have never considered myself a "citizen journalist" , just one more puny member of the peanut gallery here.

    "Let us never forget that doing the impossible is the history of this nation....It's how we are as Americans...It's how this country was built"- Michelle Obama

    by blueoregon on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 06:10:09 PM PDT

  •  See that mouse? (0+ / 0-)

    Just move it to the little x over this tab and click it. You won't have to take any more abuse from Kos.

    And are you rally equating not being picked up on the front page with banning?

    GOP: The Party of Acid rain, Abortion of the American Dream, and Amnesty for Wall Street.

    by Attorney at Arms on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 06:10:12 PM PDT

    •  I see a sleeping cat. I don't have a mouse. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Otteray Scribe, northsylvania

      Main point follows:

      In my opinion Kos has been taking regular users for granted for years.
      Kos is reaping what he sowed.

      look for my eSci diary series Thursday evening.

      by FishOutofWater on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 06:31:15 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  This makes me very sad. (3+ / 0-)

        The aforementioned Fishgrease and his diaries on the Macondo blowout , one of the guys from Weather Underground who was invaluable leading up to Katrina, the two economists who got into a cat fight, and now you. All of them saw something intrinsically wrong with the site and how it was run, and subsequently quit. There are a whole lot more from Welshman to Patric Julliet who seem to have just given up on the level of discourse as well.
        Quite frankly, you and these others was why I joined the site, paid my subscription, and have continued to read it. Frankly, the rah rah about elections should be a given to those of us who care enough to be Democratic activists. These now absent diarists, including you, showed why we are involved at all.
        I have come to dread election years because ___(R, prez incumbent and/or candidate) is the SUCKS is all that is found on the main page for six months straight.
        FOoW, I know you are frustrated and frankly can't blame you, but you have provided an invaluable service, and writing that has been clear and comprehensive. Kos, like most Americans, is clueless as to the long term effects of the disaster that is unfolding in the Arctic. He, as much as the rest of us, needs educating.

        "There's a crack in everything; that's how the light gets in". Leonard Cohen

        by northsylvania on Tue Sep 18, 2012 at 12:55:46 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Speaking of Nate... (4+ / 0-)

    ...when Nate tweeted that there was something screwy about the Libya attacks, and that the movie producer might have been in league with the terrorists, the person who reposted that took huge abuse.

    It turns out that there probably was not a connection (which is not to say there was not a symbiosis that both parties would celebrate), but still, that was perfectly acceptable free speech by a smart guy.

    Toto, I've a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore

    by Minerva on Mon Sep 17, 2012 at 06:11:34 PM PDT

  •  Sure, start a circular firing squad. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ZoBai, slothlax, SadieSue

    Who needs agent provocateurs when DKos digs it's own dirt?

    Quit whining and let's elect some democrats!

  •  kos doesn't need to "promote" content (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Bob Love, joynow, SadieSue

    for it to be seen. This is a community. We can promote each other.

  •  Thank you for saying this (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    FishOutofWater, too many people

    Was thinking this myself but didn't know how to say it. Thank you for putting it into words.

    All the talk of dickishness, no tolerance, don't care just gonna start banning people ... the tone of a place is set from the top. Promoting trigger fingers promotes trigger fingers, and this is what happens.

    Without checks & balances it's too easy for 'community moderation' to devolve into mob rule, complete with firebrands and pitchforks.

    I don't know the answer. But thank you for asking the question.

  •  Many, many Progressives have been chased off (3+ / 0-)

    or squelched by a little 'more and better dems' cabal under Kos's radar, though I have seen one by one these people change into sock puppets and keep a lower view...

    Us old timers remember when Dkos was a PROGRESSIVE sight as in moving society FORWARD!

    "Time is for careful people, not passionate ones."

    "Life without emotions is like an engine without fuel."

    by roseeriter on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 02:34:18 AM PDT

  •  just saw this now - real life has kept me (0+ / 0-)

    submerged for several weeks. But it's spot on.

    Kos is a politics person who considers climate change a pet issue, and not his pet issue at that. There are few and far between FP'ers who write on climate.  We do have some good diarists on climate, but diarists are not FP'ers; diarists are volunteers with little time.

    Ice and certainty dissolve as we watch. Nothing else in politics matters. @RL_Miller

    by RLMiller on Wed Sep 19, 2012 at 07:55:41 PM PDT

  •  Working groups can and should be able to contact (0+ / 0-)

    flesh and blood admins who can make real time decisions on published works. Tossing groups a few $ for their efforts wouldn't hurt either. I would rather see people given token compensation for their time and effort with those works remaining visible for a length of time.

    Even if I knew that tomorrow the world would go to pieces, I would still plant my apple tree. -Martin Luther

    by the fan man on Thu Sep 20, 2012 at 04:20:48 AM PDT

  •  the colorado will no longer (0+ / 0-)

    support southern california agriculture after 2019

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site