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The AP has reported on more Hamas brutality towards Palestinian citizens.  Hamas had already been the subject of a Human Rights Watch report which detailed previous acts of torture including murder which the group inflicted on the Palestinian citizens it was elected to protect.

Today the reporting is of more brutality being inflicted on Palestinians by Hamas:

Witnesses say masked gunmen have publicly killed six suspected collaborators with Israel at a busy Gaza City intersection.

The Hamas military wing claimed responsibility.

Witnesses said the six men were pulled out of a van Tuesday, forced to lie face down on the street and then shot dead.

Every person deserves basic human rights including a free and fair trial, even those Palestinians 'suspected' of collaborating with Israel.

Originally posted to JNEREBEL on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 04:44 PM PST.

Also republished by Team Shalom.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Oh dear, now you've done it. (9+ / 0-)

    Don't you know this conflict has only one side?

  •  Attack a perfect time to settle scores (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    VClib, emidesu, erush1345

    Times like this, with Gaza under constant military attack, are always the perfect time for armed militants and individuals claiming some political or spiritual tie to use the chaos, fear, and panic to pursue and kill whatever enemies they have.

    •  Its the season (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      erush1345

      Very similar events have been previously reported in the past when similar outbreaks of open warfare occur in Gaza and the Westbank. I always found the timing suspiscious and speculated that  the spy accusations were just cover for infighting among Palestinians, but I am hardly an expert. Can anyone else tell us a bit about what is really going on?

    •  That was exactly my thought. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      erush1345

      At a time like this it's pretty easy to claim someone's with enemy in order to dispose of him.

      Stay fired up: now is the time to focus on downticket change! #Forward

      by emidesu on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 06:07:11 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  If the Canadians would shell Detroit or Buffalo (9+ / 0-)

    Or the Mexicans shelled San Diego, Yuma, El Paso, Laredo or Brownsville, how would 99% of Americans react?

    "We have always known that heedless self-interest was bad morals, now we know that it is bad economics." Franklin Delano Roosevelt, Jan. 20, 1937

    by Navy Vet Terp on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 04:51:05 PM PST

    •  If the Iraqis assassinated George Bush (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      emidesu, Ralphdog

      ... claiming that he was a terrorist, how would we react? Not well, I'm afraid.

    •  A five mile radius of the launch site (4+ / 0-)

      would be a pile of rubble.

      "let's talk about that"

      by VClib on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 05:16:23 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  You're frankly out of your mind if you think 20 (10+ / 0-)

      million Mexican Americans would allow this country to engage in a terror bombing campaign against Nuevo Laredo killing hundreds of civilians in response to attacks that killed three in the US, while simultaneously annexing half of the greater Tijuana metro area.

      That's what an analogy would look like.

      "the Agency continues to verify the non-diversion of declared material at these facilities and LOFs."

      by JesseCW on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 05:25:06 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  yeah (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        devis1

        And let's remember that when the US invaded Mexico and stole half their territory, it was not US government policy to ethnically cleanse that territory of Mexicans.  Mexicans were made full citizens of the US.

        If ethnic cleansing was our policy, and we sent Mexicans to live in refugee camps in the desert, there would be ongoing violence and terrorism in the US.

        •  Let's remember that it was a noxious war of (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          emidesu, Tonedevil

          naked aggression and that the treaty which finally ended it was signed under the threat of genocide.

          Let's remember that US forces behaved with such wanton and disgusting disregard for the lives of Mexican civilians that over a thousand troops deserted and joined the Mexican side.

          "the Agency continues to verify the non-diversion of declared material at these facilities and LOFs."

          by JesseCW on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 06:03:18 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  and now (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            JesseCW, devis1

            The population of New Mexico is majority Mexican-American and is a full and equal state of the union.

            Maybe the lesson is that even after war crimes have been committed, if governmental policy changes over the decades and acknowledges the rights of indigenous and local people, peace and stability can still be achieved.

            Perhaps Israel needs to learn this lesson.

        •  We did our share of ethnic cleansing. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          dfarrah, JesseCW

          Maybe not there.
          I sometimes wonder whether US unconditional support for Israel is connected to our denial of our own past. As I say it, actually, I'm sure it's a factor.

          Stay fired up: now is the time to focus on downticket change! #Forward

          by emidesu on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 06:11:03 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  a lot of other countries have similar histories (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            JesseCW

            New Zealand, Australia, Uruguay, etc and have no problems voting against Israel in the UN.

            •  Similar histories, but same denial? (0+ / 0-)

              At any rate, the cultures are different which makes it kind of hard to compare. I am by no means excusing it, rather trying to solve what for me is the utterly baffling question of why Americans roll over for militaristic Israel every time.

              Stay fired up: now is the time to focus on downticket change! #Forward

              by emidesu on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 07:20:59 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

          •  birds of a feather (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            emidesu
            I sometimes wonder whether US unconditional support for Israel is connected to our denial of our own past. As I say it, actually, I'm sure it's a factor
            A big problem in this world now and as far back as history records is that a number of the world's more powerful countries will subcribe to the the rule that 'might always makes right'. Pity the weaker countires,nations,peoples who live in a world that is run by such rules.
      •  Seriously? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        volleyboy1

        You think the US citizenry would be offended by a ratio of hundreds to one?

        Have you ever heard of Iraq? And they weren't actually even involved with 9/11.

        Done with politics for the night? Have a nice glass of wine with Palate Press: The online wine magazine.

        by dhonig on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 05:51:10 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  And if we had stolen the land from them (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      emidesu, protectspice

      in the first place?

      The rockets are stupid, militarily useless, and probably counterproductive, but you can't fault the Palestinians for trying to do something to strike back at those who stole their land.

      •  I can absolutely fault any persons who are (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Tonedevil

        involved in lobbing flying pipe bombs randomly at civilian areas.

        Of course, that also requires faulting the assholes who rain white phosphorus on school children, if one is to maintain any degree of self-respect.

        "the Agency continues to verify the non-diversion of declared material at these facilities and LOFs."

        by JesseCW on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 06:07:56 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  Better analogy: how would Canadians respond if... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      emidesu, GeeBee, Johnny Nucleo

      U.S. assassinated their Prime Minister using massively superior force and technology in an effort to provoke an angry Canadian response? One that would be used to justify escalating U.S. bombardment of Vancouver and Ottawa?

      Oh, and one also must presume that the U.S. has Canada surrounded with a brutal blockade, massive concrete walls, and random death from the sky in the form of helicopter gunship assassinations of anyone we feel to be a threat.

  •  Ah... (5+ / 0-)

    and we're off to the races! Let the excuses begin.

    Obama 2012 http://whatthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/

    by jiffypop on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 04:53:09 PM PST

  •  Well, did you know that they dragged one of the (9+ / 0-)

    dead bodies behind one of their motorcycles? Nice, huh?

    I won't post the picture: it's very gruesome. So I'm giving a warning if you want to see it. Here is the link

    Witnesses said the six men were pulled out of a van Tuesday, forced to lie face down on the street and then shot dead.

    Five bodies lay in a pile as a mob stomped and spit on them. A sixth body was tied to a motorcycle and dragged through the streets as people screamed, "Spy! Spy!"

    Hamas posted a sign on an electricity pole, naming the six alleged informers.

    "Say little, do much" (Pirkei Avot 1:15)

    by hester on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 04:54:15 PM PST

    •  Have Israeli extremists ever acted like this? (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      emidesu, protectspice, Johnny Nucleo

      According to Albert Einstein, they did:

      A shocking example was their behavior in the Arab village of Deir Yassin. This village, off the main roads and surrounded by Jewish lands, had taken no part in the war, and had even fought off Arab bands who wanted to use the village as their base.

      On April 9, [Israeli] terrorist bands attacked this peaceful village, which was not a military objective in the fighting, killed most of its inhabitants, 240 men, women, and children, and kept a few of them alive to parade as captives through the streets of Jerusalem. Most of the Jewish community was horrified at the deed, and the Jewish Agency sent a telegram of apology to King Abdullah of Trans-Jordan.

      But the terrorists, far from being ashamed of their act, were proud of this massacre, publicized it widely, and invited all the foreign correspondents present in the country to view the heaped corpses and the general havoc at Deir Yassin.

  •  Well now the sides seem kinda even (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Johnny Nucleo

    Israel still wins on the total body count though

  •  Hamas is a terrorist organization with no respect (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    emidesu, erush1345, FG, lzmd

    for human life.

    That's not news, and no more than half a dozen people active at this site disagree.

    But I do have to note - they didn't blow up the suspects homes with their families inside.

    "the Agency continues to verify the non-diversion of declared material at these facilities and LOFs."

    by JesseCW on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 05:26:33 PM PST

    •  No... they just blew up a bus in Tel-Aviv. Much (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Mannie

      better. (/snark)

      "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

      by volleyboy1 on Wed Nov 21, 2012 at 08:11:29 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I genuinely believe that you're concerned about (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        emidesu

        that.

        The murder of Palestinian Civilians, on the other hand, is something you've repeatedly defended with great vigor.

        The record is clear to anyone with acess to google.

        "the Agency continues to verify the non-diversion of declared material at these facilities and LOFs."

        by JesseCW on Wed Nov 21, 2012 at 12:45:08 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I think your phrasing could use some work (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Mannie

          Let me help you. It should read:

          "I genuinely believe that you're concerned about that." (Vb1 note... you are right - I am)

          "The Strong defense of Israel from terrorist rocket attacks, is something you've defended with great vigor" (that is also true - and the record is clear on that).

          Oh and btw, I believe you would see me say this using the ever vaunted Google:

          The Lunatic Right, both here and there, keep talking about blowing Gaza into little bits and "levelling" the place. Neither one of course, (and as usual) is right. They simply aren't.
          RUH-ROH... something doesn't fit into your little box.

          But here are Hamas and Palestinian reactions to blowing up that bus. Please tell me about their concerns regarding civilians:

          Crowds of jubilant Palestinians danced in the streets of Gaza and handed out sweet cakes (vb1 emphasis) to patients at the main hospital.

          “You opened the gates of hell on yourselves,” Hamas's armed wing, the al-Qassam brigades, tweeted. “Oh Zionists, you have to drag yourselves out of hell, go back home now, go back to Germany, Poland, Russia, America and anywhere else."

          or hey... how about this:
          Hamas spokesman Sami Abu Zuhri hailed the explosion.

          "Hamas blesses the attack in Tel Aviv (vb1 emphasis) and sees it as a natural response to the Israeli massacres...in Gaza," he told Reuters. "Palestinian factions will resort to all means in order to protect our Palestinian civilians in the absence of a world effort to stop the Israeli aggression."

          I know you will be out there calling this a "war crime" any second now....

          That Jesse is what is happening in the world today. That is where this conflict is at. So, in my opinion Israel has a right to defend itself and punish those who fire on her cities. Period.

          "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

          by volleyboy1 on Wed Nov 21, 2012 at 02:04:51 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

  •  wow (5+ / 0-)
    Every person deserves basic human rights including a free and fair trial, even those Palestinians 'suspected' of collaborating with Israel.
    Lets remember that millions of Palestinians have lived under a brutal military occupation for more than 4 decades, and they are denied any protections of civil law.  

    A Palestinian does not have the right to an attorney in occupied territory, nor do they have any legal avenue to protest destruction of property or the seizure of land.

    We both agree with your above quote.  Every person does deserve basic human rights, including free and fair trials.  

    So are you advocating for a final legal disposition for Palestinians that would allow them to be protected by law?

  •  It's Hamas, what do you expect? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    volleyboy1, Mannie
  •  Seems you forgot.... (3+ / 5-)
    Recommended by:
    Ray Blake, protectspice, emidesu
    Hidden by:
    sanchez96, erush1345, FG, aseth, ubertar

    Seems you forget that the article did mention that "Israel relies on Palistinian informants to identifiy targets"

    How convenient.

    How conveninet that you somehow claim that executing a spy that has sold out his own people is 'brutality toward Palistnian citzens'  

    These lower than life spy scum may have given the Israelis the identity of a house or other place (target) in which innocent people were murdered.  Who is to belive a traitor who would sell his soul to the devil for an extra slice of bread.

    To me a traitor is no longer a citizen of anything, not even humanity.  I would have turned thier slime over to the Israelis...and see how much brutality the people they kissed the ring of would treat them.

    I think they got off light.

    Oaths and alleginaces only become valid after being tested in adverstity.

    by Nur Alia Chang on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 05:53:54 PM PST

    •  No one is a traitor unless proven to be so (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      JNEREBEL, erush1345

      in a free, fair, and open trial.

      The death penalty is always unjust, by its very nature.

      "the Agency continues to verify the non-diversion of declared material at these facilities and LOFs."

      by JesseCW on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 06:09:42 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Does your sense of injustice extend to... (0+ / 0-)

        scores of dead Palestinian civilians who are 'collateral damage' of Israeli airstrikes? Or do they not count?

      •  So...it is just to... (0+ / 0-)

        So, is the death penalty 'just' to the people in that bank, or the people in that broadcast studio, or the police station, or an apartment, or parliment building that the Israelis bombed becasue 'there was a jihadist in them' for just being near or in the building?

        Who knows...maybe these traitors...on command of the Israelis, were launching rockets into Israel themselves in order to provoke...I mean excuse...the barbarians they work for to murder innocent people.

        Who is to belive such lower than life people.  For all we know, they could have turned in thier neighbour because he liked a different football team, and of course, the savages he worked for would have no problem killing thier family.

        There is nothing on earth worse to me than those who profit from war...except those who turn agains thier own people to get an extra slice of bread.

        Oaths and alleginaces only become valid after being tested in adverstity.

        by Nur Alia Chang on Wed Nov 21, 2012 at 04:26:31 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  You could absolutely be right. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      JesseCW

      There are many people who have met ends like this- Gaddafi a florid example- for whom I have zero sympathy while completely empathizing with their executioners. At the same time, it's a slippery slope. I for one would rather maintain international law with clemency for certain situations.

      Stay fired up: now is the time to focus on downticket change! #Forward

      by emidesu on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 06:21:41 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Right (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JesseCW, protectspice, Johnny Nucleo

    Just like Obama summarily executes American citizens in Somalia.

    This aggression will not stand, man.

    by kaleidescope on Tue Nov 20, 2012 at 05:58:06 PM PST

  •  Don't you know that true progressives are supposed (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    sandbox, volleyboy1

    to support Hamas freedom fighters? Seems like most other diarists got the talking points but not you.

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