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This is edscan,
from a recent
Saturday Hate Mail-a-palooza:  

 
The sad part about my "message" not being read
in the Kos is......all of these liars getting to tell their "stories" and the one person trying desparately to tell the truth is being squelched.
This really is un-American !
It's a shame. edscan  
bigjac,
not edscan,
below the squiggly:

First,
the way I break up my words
is different than the way
edscan
breaks up his words.

My phrases are shorter,
since I hit enter
anytime I feel as if I might pause,
even a tiny bit,
if I was speaking the words,
at a podium,
with all of you listening
(or reading texts from your phone
and ignoring me).

Here is how I would break up
the edscan quote above:  

 
The sad part about my "message"
not being read in the Kos
is......
all of these liars
getting to tell their "stories"
and the one person trying desperately
to tell the truth
is being squelched.

This really is unAmerican!

It's a shame.

edscan

 

Do you see the difference?

Do you agree,
that wherever there is a break,
a break in the flow,
I hit the "enter" key?

I want to answer a question,
or a series of questions,
that came up in a comment thread
yesterday.

I wrote my usual kind of comment,
lots of short lines
along the left side of your computer screen.

And another Daily Kos member,
in reply to my comment,
wrote some serious information
about water usage
in California.

I was concerned,
and discouraged,
by the information.

Another commentor,
in reply to both of us,
mentioned poetry,
as if surprised we were both
writing in verse,
but said,

 I like the poetry, actually.  
 

You see my style,
here,
so,
I won't bother to copy and paste
my comment from that thread,
but here's the one about water usage
in California:  

 
Here in California
The counties down south
That take the most water
To irrigate pomagranates and almonds
Utilize illegal labor to harvest
The farm workers drink well water
so polluted, that the UN
Has called it a travesty
Meanwhile, clean Delta water flows
in the canals to water the trees

The state wants to open fracking
on the Monterey Shale
BDCP Twin Tunnels to drain 15K CFS
from the Sacramento River to points South.

Killing the Delta to grow export fruit and nuts?
or Killing the Delta to sell the water and frack?

The Delta fish and the farm worker
It seems that nobody has their back.    

I didn't even see that
as written in verse,
until the other commentor
said she liked the poetry,
actually.

I looked back,
and,
sure enough,
it does look like verses,
and it makes the information
easier to understand,
especially the last four lines:

 
Killing the Delta to grow export fruit and nuts?
or Killing the Delta to sell the water and frack?

The Delta fish and the farm workers;
It seems that nobody has their backs.  

After that,
I bigjac-ized,
or poetized,
the comment
from the one who liked the poetry,
pointing out
that if you break it up
into logical lines,
and you see it as poetry,
and you like the poetry,
then,
you can do it too.

What followed
was almost a pie fight,
but mainly a discussion
of what is,
and what is not,
poetry.

And someone thinking I might be edscan.

That discussion
inspired me to write this diary.

So,
I give you my thoughts.

A few points:

1.  As far as I know,
the definition of
what is poetry,
and what is not poetry,
is not clear.

2.  My primary goal
is to make my words
easy to understand.

I use the enter key,
to force the reader to pause,
just a little,
when I think it might help
to separate one phrase
from the next,
one thought
from the next,
one step in logic
from the next.

3.  If you feel that what I write
is
not
poetry:

Well,
since my stated goal
is to make my meaning clear,
when writing about
overpopulation,
contraception,
famine,
etc.,
then you are correct.

I'm not writing poetry at all.

I'm just another blogger,
bloggin' away,
writing what's on my mind.

4.  If you feel
that what I write
is not only poetry,
but damn fine at that,
I'm not going to argue with you.

Why should I try to tell you
that you know nothing about poetry,
this is just a method
of making myself clear,
and just shut up
about poetry.

I'm not gonna say that,
no way.

Cuz maybe,
just maybe,
long after I'm dead,
there will be a debate about this,
and those on the side of
"bigjac was a poet,"
even if they can never win the debate,
they may at least form
a cult following,
a solid group of fans
of my work.

(There already is,
but it's a pretty small group.)

Why should I argue with my fans?

In conclusion:

If you say what I write
is not poetry,
I will not argue against you.

If you say what I write
is poetry,
and I should be the new editor
of the Daily Kos poetry group
(That already happened;
I'm the new editor
of Indigo Kalliope,
taking over after the death
of ulookarmless.)
I will not argue against you.

One more thing,
(as Columbo always said):

If you feel that my writing style
makes it harder,
not easier,
to understand my words,

I say,

that

simply

cannot

be

true.

The more words are broken up,
the more
absolutely
unavoidable
those
words
are.

Thanks for reading.

Originally posted to Smarter Prepping With Big Jack on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 06:55 PM PST.

Also republished by grok the edku.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Beauty (11+ / 0-)

    Poetry is the highest form of experience and expression. Along with the other highest forms, that is.

    A carriage return, well used, is poetic. Who could doubt it?

    Not I

    Not U

    Not any 1

  •  and you will never be edscan. (15+ / 0-)

    neither will i.
    ceiling cat inspected yet?

    * Join: The Action: End the Bush Tax Cuts for Richest Two Percent * Addington's Perpwalk: TRAILHEAD of Accountability for Bush-2 Crimes.

    by greenbird on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 07:17:02 PM PST

    •  Glad you asked about my ceiling. I'm now one (9+ / 0-)

      third of the way done.

      I didn't realize,
      until today,
      that I can put all the rest of the insulation up,
      quickly,
      tomorrow,
      since it will cling to the ceiling joists;
      then put the sheetrock up.

      The insulation is light,
      and fits tight,
      between the boards.

      The whole project is easier,
      and going faster,
      than I'd hoped.

      I knew I could finish it,
      with ten days off in a row,
      but it looks like
      it'll be done,
      to our satisfaction,
      within five days work.

      And that's working very short days,
      then eat,
      relax,
      take pictures with my phone.

      I'm on a roll.

      Thanks for asking,
      about our ceiling.

      Thanks again.

      •  Gave you a rec... (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bigjacbigjacbigjac, swampyankee, weck

        ...for being true to yourself.

        But I'd find a different guy to write your diaries. No offense, but it was difficult to read, hard to follow. I'm not being "grumpy old man" here. Any editor would have a fit over this. Full screen at minimum. Double-spaced is heaven for old eyes.

        Yes, it's apparent you aren't edscan, mostly because you're HERE. I don't believe the mods have any trouble keeping track of the banned nut-jobs.

        Good luck in your new gig, brother...

        "Wealthy the Spirit which knows its own flight. Stealthy the Hunter who slays his own fright. Blessed is the Traveler who journeys the length of the Light."

        by CanisMaximus on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 10:56:01 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  First, I love your sig line. That's one of my (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          weck, CanisMaximus

          favorite songs of the eighties.

          (It was from the eighties, wasn't it?)

          And I thank you for your gentle tone.

          I'm a lover,
          not a fighter,
          so I always like gentle.

          But what you wrote puzzles me;
          you appeared to contradict yourself.

           
          Full screen at minimum. Double-spaced is heaven for old eyes.  
           

          Those two sentences
          seem to contradict each other.

          I'm double spacing,
          a lot.

          And,
          the short lines
          act as a lateral version
          of double spacing:
          heaven for old eyes.

          Maybe I misunderstood you.

          Anyway,
          thanks again for your courtesy.

          •  Use all the space available... (0+ / 0-)

            ....on the screen upon which you're writing.

            Double spacing between sentences is easier to read and

            redact. My father was an Journalist and Editor his whole

            career. He used to send my letters  back to me

            (remember those?) redacted in red. And yes, the old-

            school newspaper Editors wanted Double-column

            Double-spacing.

            Yes it's from 1980.

            And I CAN be an a$$hole once in a while.... Just don't

            take it personal!

            Again, good luck.

            "Wealthy the Spirit which knows its own flight. Stealthy the Hunter who slays his own fright. Blessed is the Traveler who journeys the length of the Light."

            by CanisMaximus on Sat Jan 12, 2013 at 11:46:32 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

  •  republished to "grok the edku" (10+ / 0-)

    I, for one, miss The Master.

    Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. -- K.Marx A.Lincoln

    by N in Seattle on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 07:19:10 PM PST

  •  I don't always agree with what you say, (7+ / 0-)

    bj3, but I always think you have a fantastic way of saying it. Really.

    Some DKos series & groups worth your while: Black Kos, Native American Netroots, KosAbility, Monday Night Cancer Club. If you'd like to join the Motor City Kossacks, send me a Kosmail.

    by peregrine kate on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 07:22:12 PM PST

    •  In that way, you're similar to my wife, Tonia. (5+ / 0-)

      she really can't stand
      hearing me talk about
      overpopulation
      and
      contraception.

      But she agrees with me,
      adamantly,
      that my writing style
      simply makes it easier
      to follow,
      exactly,
      what
      I'm
      saying.

      She says it's not really poetry,
      so,
      since I feel deep respect
      for my wife's intelligence
      (a genius with a PhD),
      I also respect
      those who say this simply isn't poetry,
      and I explained that in this diary.

      But I just don't
      "get"
      those who can't stand,
      really can't stand!
      my style.

      It may not be art,
      but it simply seems very clear,
      easy to understand.

      Green eggs and ham,
      green eggs and ham,
      I do so like
      green eggs and ham.

      Simple,
      like that.

      Thanks for your comment.

  •  Hi. (9+ / 0-)

    You know
    that I've always liked
    the way
    you post.

    There is a rhythm
    you have
    that is uniquely
    your own.

    hugs...

    lp

    Everyone, rich or poor, deserves a shelter for the soul. -- Sam Mockbee ~~~For handmade silver jewelry, click here.~~~

    by Lorinda Pike on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 07:28:48 PM PST

    •  Remember when ArthurPoet would write nice (5+ / 0-)

      poems,
      to entertain,
      and to give
      emotional support
      to all the Gulf Watchers?

      And I was green with envy.

      So,
      that's when I started
      trying to write poetry,
      asking myself
      why the Gulf Watchers
      were spending
      so
      much
      time,
      gazing at the oil,
      horrified,
      comforting each other,
      and ArthurPoet,
      writing grand words,
      words about the spirit
      of this
      or the honor
      of that?

      I'm not much for concepts like
      spirit,
      or honor,
      but I imagined
      that many of the Gulf Watchers
      might feel a need
      to be able to say,
      years later,
      that they were involved,
      at least as far as
      keeping themselves informed,
      while the rest of the world moved on,
      moved on to the next shiny object
      that came into their field of view.

      I wrote a poem to that effect,
      and it got a lot of positive feedback.

      It got a response
      from ArthurPoet.

      Almost a year later,
      after I'd adopted the habit
      of writing everything in this style,
      I wrote a diary
      about a neighbor of mine,
      who died,
      and that diary was the other turning point,
      aside from the Gulf Watchers comments,
      that gave me confidence.

      Do you remember any of that?

      Thanks for your comment.

  •  wonderful. (7+ / 0-)

    tipped
    and
    recommended.

    You have exactly 10 seconds to change that look of disgusting pity into one of enormous respect!

    by Cartoon Peril on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 07:38:47 PM PST

  •  Edscan is edscan. (6+ / 0-)

    Edscan is not edscan.
    It's a conspiracy.
    I cannot explain.

    "The Taibbi article is a defense of status quo" -- citizen k

    by happymisanthropy on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 07:47:21 PM PST

  •  Looks like poetry to me. (6+ / 0-)

    But then, I am a member of the bigjac fan club.

    I always prefer to believe the best of everybody, it saves so much trouble.

    by Joy of Fishes on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 08:01:09 PM PST

  •  Feels like poetry to me (7+ / 0-)

    Of course you're not edscan. Nicely done, jac.

    -7.75, -8.10; Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary? . . . and respect the dignity of every human being.

    by Dave in Northridge on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 08:17:51 PM PST

  •  You can't be edscan ........ (5+ / 0-)

    ...... because I am edscan.

    (No, wait ... that's Spartacus). Ahhh, here's who I am ......


    All that's missing is a large "N" on my hat.

    "We should pay attention to that man behind the curtain."

    by Ed Tracey on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 08:46:52 PM PST

    •  I'll handle that N, Ed (3+ / 0-)

      After all, I stole the old Netscape throbber for my dKos avatar.

      Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. -- K.Marx A.Lincoln

      by N in Seattle on Sat Jan 12, 2013 at 09:47:06 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  My dear N, I clicked on your link, supposing (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        N in Seattle

        it would lead me to your home page,
        and it did,
        and yes,
        I remember a big company
        with that N logo,
        not so long ago....

        Then I looked at your profile,
        and your date of joining,
        and UID.

        I should bow down very low;
        I'm in the presence of DK royalty,
        here almost from the beginning of Dkos time.

        I've been here since June of 2006 myself,
        and my UID is below 100K.

        But yours is below 1K.

        Below 200.

        Anyway.

        You're older than me,
        too,
        almost exactly 5 years older than me,
        possibly even a true hippie.

        In my childhood,
        Vietnam and hippies
        were just items on the news.

        And,
        I like your sig line.

        I'm really concerned
        that the billionaires and such
        are the new kings,
        and we need another Magna Carta.

        Thanks.

  •  While I don't mind a bit of poetry now and then (3+ / 0-)

    the affectation of using a carriage return in place of a comma, an elipsis or some other form of regular punctuation is what another writer calls "inconsiderate" typography.

    It slows down reading. Perhaps you believe that people who read your words more slowly are more apt to take them in. Perhaps you are right, but to me it is both annoying to have so many line breaks to cope with in expository writing, and comes across as a bit arrogant, as if you are trying to back me into a corner and
    force
    me
    to
    listen
    to
    each
    and
    every
    word.

    If I ran into you doing this at a cocktail party, I would excuse myself and find someone less full of themselves to talk to. Write all the poetry you want, bigjac, but don't amuse yourself pretending your style is persuasive to those of us who become annoyed by an overdose of it.

    "The problems of incompetent, corrupt, corporatist government are incompetence, corruption and corporatism, not government." Jerome a Paris

    by Orinoco on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 08:50:52 PM PST

    •  I believe you... (ellipsis) (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Orinoco, Joy of Fishes
      Raised in a barn

      Everyone, rich or poor, deserves a shelter for the soul. -- Sam Mockbee ~~~For handmade silver jewelry, click here.~~~

      by Lorinda Pike on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 09:40:33 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  My dear Orinoco, I took a few minutes, and read (4+ / 0-)

      your profile,
      and read two of your diaries,
      one,
      from 2009,
      something math number seventeen,
      and it was very easy to understand.

      You're a very good writer.

      I read your most recent diary,
      just skimming over it,
      and it was over my head.

      Maybe,
      if I would look up some of your terms,
      I could,
      eventually,
      figure out
      what that was all about.

      But you made it seem fun.

      Anyway.

      I noticed,
      in the paragraph,
      from the 2009 diary,
      in which you explained
      the essential way in which division is different,
      you used
      words in bold
      and
      words in italics.

      And,
      you double spaced between paragraphs.

      You are,
      apparently,
      simply smarter than me,
      at least in some ways,
      and you apparently have a college degree,
      in math.

      I have no college degree
      of any kind.

      I suppose
      that in academia,
      as they call it,
      the world in which you have spent years,
      and may still be working in,
      there are certain rules and regulations,
      and you may be made to suffer in some way,
      for breaking the rules.

      The whole world is on your side,
      when it comes to what is accepted
      as the proper,
      practical,
      or even simply the sensible,
      way to write.

      Even in my little fan club,
      as far as I know,
      none of them have actually adopted this style,
      other than in the comment threads
      of some of my diaries.

      I think the more common style,
      going all the way across the page,
      was used when paper was expensive,
      and was done that way
      because paper was expensive.

      I'm not using paper.

      Scrolling length on computer screens
      is cheap.

      It's possible that
      someday,
      this method
      will become the standard method
      of writing.

      But,
      for now,
      nearly everyone
      is on your side,
      in practice.

      So,
      there's no need to fight me.

      And,
      you guessed correctly,
      about the way I sometimes talk to people,
      face to face;
      many folks find me too loud,
      and very annoying.

      However,
      I have an amazing wife,
      and her family,
      who tolerate my rants,
      and some here at Daily Kos,
      who enjoy what I write.

      But for your reading pleasure,
      apparently,
      I'm just not your cup of tea.

      Glad you came to my diary,
      anyway.

      •  As children (4+ / 0-)

        at least, as English speaking children, we learn to scan text left to right, then top to bottom. Other cultures have other learned behaviors when it comes to scanning text. Japanese learn to read top to bottom, right to left, Semetic languages tend to go right to left, top to bottom. Some ancient languages, for the convenience of stone cutters, I presume, went back and forth, one line left to right, the next line right to left, each beginning near where the other left off.

        In reading, our eyes tend to move along learned patterns, and it is easy to scan along a line, and takes more effort to move the eyes back from the end of a line to the beginning of the next line. Long lines with fewer breaks to find the beginning of the next line is less tiring to the eyes, and when eyes get to be as old as mine, that is a consideration.

        A speed reader takes in several words in a bunch, so, with practice, could find your style of arranging symbols just as convenient, and learn to simply scan down the page taking in each very short line in a single gulp, as it were.

        Reading comment threads on the internet may someday force everyone to read in these patterns, as indents force text into narrower and narrower confines...

        However, while children learn to read from the printed page, or from a computer monitor that mimics a printed page, we will have childhood habits to contend with.

        Yes, I use words in bold, and italic, and white space, and diagrams, and talking goats, and any other method I can think of to try to make my writing, that is, the meaning I am trying to get across, as easy as possible for my reader to take in. It is the author's responsibility, I think, to make the text as accessible as possible, to do as much of the work of digesting the ideas as possible, and to leave as little of that work up to the reader as possible, at least, when the purpose of the writing is exposition or explanation.

        Poetry, on the other hand, has different requirements. But the thought I will end with is an old one: Moderation in all things.

        "The problems of incompetent, corrupt, corporatist government are incompetence, corruption and corporatism, not government." Jerome a Paris

        by Orinoco on Sat Jan 12, 2013 at 12:30:48 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  I think edscan and generic are (3+ / 0-)

    still the only people
    on my blogroll.
    Wait...
    Are you generic?

    (I've always liked your particular "voice".)

    Also,
    I checked.
    andycoster is also on
    my page.

    We're trapped in the belly of this horrible machine,

    And the machine is bleeding to death.

    by Marcus Tullius on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 09:18:08 PM PST

  •  Biggest givaway: (5+ / 0-)

    no mention of "oil maggots"

  •  I do enjoy me a bit of creative individualism (4+ / 0-)

    Thus my Tip & Rec. I'm not quite as peeved by this style of writing as Orinoco (see comment above) but yes, it is unnatural. There is a certain flow to it I'll admit but it does seem to take four times longer to read than a similar quantity of words all mashed together in a plump little paragraph.

    I also find that,
    in my mind,
    instead of emphasizing
    each idea
    this style
    separates them --
    leaves each timid cluster
    to fight
    on their own
    for my
    attention.
    And by the time
    I've reached
    the end
    I have forgotten
    which idea won.

    - Marko the Werelynx

    And yeah, it's all poetry baby. And it's all good. Thanks for helping to make the violent orange pie-toss booth at the carnival a more playful place.

    “The right of the people peaceably to assemble, to consult for the common good, and to petition the government, or any department thereof, shall never be abridged.”

    by Marko the Werelynx on Fri Jan 11, 2013 at 11:40:02 PM PST

    •  My dear Marko, thanks for the insight. (3+ / 0-)

      One thing that got me started,
      on breaking words up,
      for emphasis,
      was this,
      years ago:

      Whiskey.  Tango.  Foxtrot.

      And you know what that means.

      As I read your sample poem,
      I do not feel the confusion you describe
      in your sample poem.

      Your idea,
      with no example to show me how it works in practice,
      is very clear,
      very unified,
      no separate little chunks,
      allowing me to forget earlier chunks....

      Thank you for your friendly tone.

      If all debates on this topic
      are this friendly,
      I'll gladly debate this
      for the rest of my life,
      when I'm not preaching contraception,
      or living out my face to face life.

      Thanks again.

      •  Not so much a debate (3+ / 0-)

        as a matter of personal taste. And as we're presented with new tastes our palette, and indeed our world, broadens.

        There is no right or wrong in this. For me to say that your use or abuse of the carriage return or "line break" <BR> is somehow wrong would make me feel like I was looking out of Mitt Romney's eyes as he was assaulting someone and cutting off their hair.

        I ain't here to clip your wings.

        It's just how my brain works. I get lost in the cadence, all I hear is rhythm and music -- and the vocals are just another instrument. The lyrics are reduced to notes. I may enjoy the song but I'd have a hard time telling you what message it was carrying.

        I suppose I got this way by traveling and listening to the music of the world. I have some music from Denmark and the only song I can scavenge words out of is a drunken pub song about beer included as a parting joke by the band. And I used to know a wee bit of Danish, and German, and French, a phrase or two of Punjabi, a few words of Russian, a lunch menu of Croatian, an Italian appetizer ... a bit more Japanese, still more Spanish. Now my world is Czech and I find myself struggling to find words even in my native English. Like old schoolmates, we've grown apart.

        So, I see no debate here. You will write how you write and I will read it and enjoy the music.

        “The right of the people peaceably to assemble, to consult for the common good, and to petition the government, or any department thereof, shall never be abridged.”

        by Marko the Werelynx on Sat Jan 12, 2013 at 01:32:23 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I envy you. I know very few words outside of (4+ / 0-)

          American.

          (English is different)

          I know how to say
          what the KLM stands for,
          on a jet out of Amsterdam,
          since I was once a shuttle driver
          for the flight crew,
          in Houston.

          (The English translation is printed on the plane)

          I know a little German.

          A little Spanish.

          A little sign language.

          I love sign language.

          I imagine,
          from the way I think,
          that if I would get a good text book
          on any language,
          and the same book on tape,
          so I could read along
          with the tape,
          so I see how it's spelled,
          and hear how it's spoken,
          I would learn very slowly,
          but I would enjoy it.

          I took two years of Latin,
          and many languages
          use Latin root words.

          And in other languages,
          I imagine I might still see root words,
          and their various variations.

          Anyway.

          I think I see what you're saying.

          You feel boom boom ba boom,
          as you read my lines,
          and when you're done,
          instead of a point,
          such as,
          get yourself vasectomized,
          and here's why,
          all your brain absorbs
          is boom boom ba boom.

          At least I entertain you a little.

          Thanks again.

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