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Wow. Good grief. Looks like this went viral (which was kind of the point, although I wasn't expecting this much of a response, at least to the first Facebook post...)

I'm glad so many people are reposting it, although I'm also slightly embarrassed because I misspelled "Lanza" and "Tucson" on the original version above (I've since corrected this but it's too late for my original Facebook post...ah well...)

Anyway, one argument that some have made (as if it matters) is that the white Christian murderers I listed didn't commit their crimes for "religious" or "political" reasons. This may be true for some of them, but is utter bullshit for the last two.

Eric Rudolph most certainly WAS acting "based on his religious views"--
"Rudolph is responsible for a series of bombings across the southern United States between 1996 and 1998, which killed two people and injured at least 150 others in the name of an anti-abortion and anti-gay agenda.

As a teenager Rudolph was taken by his mother to a Church of Israel compound in 1984; it is connected to the Christian Identity movement. Rudolph and his family were connected with the Christian Identity movement, a militant, racist and anti-Semitic organization that believes whites are God's chosen people. He has confirmed religious motivation, but denied racial motivation for his crimes. Rudolph's motive for the bombings, according to his April 13, 2005 statement, was political.

"Rudolph has also confessed to the bombings of an abortion clinic in the Atlanta suburb of Sandy Springs on January 16, 1997; the Otherside Lounge of Atlanta lesbian bar on February 21, 1997, injuring five; and an abortion clinic in Birmingham, Alabama on January 29, 1998, killing Birmingham police officer and part-time clinic security guard Robert Sanderson, and critically injuring nurse Emily Lyons. Rudolph's bombs were made of dynamite surrounded by nails which acted as shrapnel."

As for Timothy McVeigh, his terrorist attacks may not have been religious in nature, but they sure as hell were political.

The entry is far too long to repost, but here's a tiny snippet:

"Unable to pay back gambling debts, he took a cash advance and then defaulted on his repayments. He then began looking for a state without heavy government regulation or high taxes. He became enraged when the government informed him that he had been overpaid $1,058 while in the Army and he had to pay back the money. He wrote an angry letter to the government inviting them to “Go ahead, take everything I own; take my dignity. Feel good as you grow fat and rich at my expense; sucking my tax dollars and property.”

"McVeigh introduced his sister to anti-government literature, but his father had little interest in these views. He moved out of his father's house and into an apartment that had no telephone, which had the advantage of making it impossible for his employer to contact him for overtime assignments. He also quit the NRA, viewing its stance on gun rights as too weak.

"In 1993, he drove to Waco, Texas during the Waco Siege to show his support. At the scene, he distributed pro-gun rights literature and bumper stickers, such as "When guns are outlawed, I will become an outlaw." He told a student reporter:

"The government is afraid of the guns people have because they have to have control of the people at all times. Once you take away the guns, you can do anything to the people. You give them an inch and they take a mile. I believe we are slowly turning into a socialist government. The government is continually growing bigger and more powerful and the people need to prepare to defend themselves against government control.

"For the five months following the Waco Siege, McVeigh worked at gun shows and handed out free cards printed up with Lon Horiuchi's name and address, "in the hope that somebody in the Patriot movement would assassinate the sharpshooter." (Horiuchi is an FBI sniper and some of his official actions have drawn controversy, specifically his shooting and killing of Randy Weaver's wife while she held an infant child.) He wrote hate mail to the sniper, suggesting that "what goes around, comes around," and he later considered putting aside his plan to target the Murrah Building to target Horiuchi, or a member of his family instead.

"McVeigh spent more time on the gun show circuit,[when?] traveling to 40 states and visiting about 80 gun shows. McVeigh found that the further west he went, the more anti-government sentiment he encountered, at least until he got to what he called "The People's Socialist Republic of California." McVeigh sold survival items and copies of The Turner Diaries. One author said:

“In the gun show culture, McVeigh found a home. Though he remained skeptical of some of the most extreme ideas being bandied around, he liked talking to people there about the United Nations, the federal government and possible threats to American liberty.”

The others were all for the most part Christian--and while they may not have had religious motivations, that doesn't mean a damned thing to their victims. The fact remains that plenty of Christians are going around slaughtering people; does that mean that non-Christian nations should close their doors to Christian immigrants? Of course not.

And yes, as I even stated in the original post, you could easily put together a similar rogue's gallery featuring, say, Rudolph at the top with a bunch of Middle-Eastern Muslim terrorists below him to make the same point in reverse: That not all Christians should be lumped in with this one asshole, since there's plenty of non-Christian terrorists out there as well. Either way, the point is the same.

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Comment Preferences

  •  re: religion (10+ / 0-)

    I'm not a shrink, but I do believe that one who is capable of mass murder or contemplating mass murder and mayhem has made their particular agenda -- whatever it is -- their religion.  Zealots for some cause, real or imagined.

    Glad that went viral.  Thankfully, I don't do FB and all the whackjobs in my family and extended acquaintances have already been blocked in my email.

    " My faith in the Constitution is whole; it is complete; it is total." Barbara Jordan, 1974

    by gchaucer2 on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 02:24:15 PM PDT

  •  Sure has (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    belinda ridgewood, Bisbonian

    since I shared it yesterday I've see it shared from me and also seen another half dozen copis  Now I'm likely the market that would receive it, but still . . .

    If you think you're too small to be effective, you've never been in the dark with a mosquito.

    by marykk on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 03:22:13 PM PDT

  •  Glad it went viral. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    2thanks, belinda ridgewood, Bisbonian
  •  Over 20000 Islamic terrorist attacks since 9/11, (0+ / 0-)

    i.e. counting only those committed in the name of Islam (hence, to make it explicitly clear, not counting other kinds of, "usual" and "unusual," crimes committed by Muslims), with over 100,000 deaths and countless more thousands maimed (majority of innocent victims of those Jihad attacks were Muslims themselves, but  a substantial %age non-Muslims as well): that's about 4.9 Islamic terrorist attacks and about 25 dead victims of Islamic Jihad per day, every single f'n day!

    The Boston marathon bombing is just one of those Jihad attacks, and there have been so many more in the just the 6 days since then as well:

    List of Islamic Terror Attacks

    Date     Country     City     Killed     Injured     Description

    2013.04.21     Afghanistan     Paktika     3     5     Three civilians at a shopping mall are blown to bits by a Shahid suicide bomber.
    2013.04.20     Pakistan     Khar     4     4     A female Fedayeen blows herself up outside a hospital, taking four innocents with her.
    2013.04.19     Pakistan     Wana     4     8     Taliban extremists send rockets into an election rally, killing four people.
    2013.04.19     Iraq     Khalis     7     14     A Mujahideen mortar attack on a rival mosques leave seven dead.
    2013.04.19     USA     Watertown, MA     1     1     Jihadists gun down a university police officer sitting in his car.
    2013.04.18     Iraq     Baghdad     32     65     Children are among nearly three dozen people at a coffee shop obliterated by a Shahid suicide bomber.
    2013.04.18     Kenya     Garissa     9     3     al-Shabaab gunmen burst into a hotel and mow down nine people having dinner.
    2013.04.18     Pakistan     Hyderabad     1     0     A secular politician is assassinated by religious radicals.
    2013.04.17     Afghanistan     Shindad     7     4     Seven women and children are dismantled by a Mujahid shrapnel bomb.
    2013.04.17     India     Bangalore     0     16     The Indian Mujahideen detonate a bomb outside a Hindu party office.
    2013.04.16     Pakistan     Peshawar     16     35     Two children are among sixteen innocents torn to shreds by a Holy Warrior suicide bomber.
    2013.04.16     Pakistan     Syed Gai     9     8     A Shahid suicide bomber at a checkpoint sends other nine souls to Allah.
    2013.04.16     Afghanistan     Mali Zai     8     0     Religion of Peace bombers take down eight members of the same family.
    2013.04.16     Pakistan     Khuzdar     3     0     Islamists are thought responsible for the cold-blooded murder of a politician's family.
    2013.04.16     Nigeria     Kaduna     2     0     Islamists gun down two police officers on their way home from work.
    2013.04.16     Pakistan     Jamaldinwali     2     0     Two women are 'honor killed' by their families for moral crime.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Kamaliya     4     13     An al-Qaeda bombing near an elementary school leaves four dead.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Nasiriyah     2     14     Two civilians are sent to Allah by al-Qaeda bombers.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Habibiya     10     12     At least ten Iraqis at an auto mall are taken out by Mujahid car bombers.
    2013.04.15     Afghanistan     Mali Zai     7     4     Seven civilians are pulled into pieces by Taliban bombers.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Umm al-Maalif     4     15     Islamic bombers destroy a market, along with four patrons.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Baghdad     4     29     Two Mujahid bombings leave four dead at a commercial district.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Tuz Khurmatu     6     67     Six people are torn to shreds by al-Qaeda bombers.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Kirkuk     9     79     Six car bombs leave at least nine Iraqis dead.
    2013.04.15     Pakistan     Dera Ismail Khan     2     3     Sunni militants murder two election workers.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Mussayab     2     13     Religious extremists car bomb an open air market, killing at least two.
    2013.04.15     Pakistan     Banjot     1     0     A secular-leaning politician is blown to bits by fundamentalist bombers.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Khalis     1     8     Mujahideen bombers murder a child.
    2013.04.15     Iraq     Fallujah     2     14     A Fedayeen suicide bomber takes out two innocents along a city street.
    2013.04.15     Pakistan     Karachi     1     0     Lashkar-e-Jhangvi murder a man for being a Shiite.

    2013.04.15     USA     Boston, MA     3     170     Foreign-born Muslims describing themselves as 'very religious' detonate two bombs packed with ball bearings at the Boston Marathon, killing three people and causing several more to lose limbs.

    (don't just dismiss the TROP site off-hand; you and DK are better than that. If you dissent with the findings of the list, take it up as a challenge to rigorously disprove the claimed data.)

    -- 3 (innocent and apparently wonderful) people killed + 170 injured on 4/15/2013 in Boston, and
    -- 163 killed + 434 injured in the six days since,
    by Islamic terrorists.


    Don't you think the time has come for the left to become reality-based regarding Islamic Jihad?

    The fact is that violent Jihad as well as political Jihad (Islamism in its various forms) are both real and present phenomena, and they pose a lethal threat to the human rights of countless non-Muslims in Muslim-majority lands, as well as to innocent Muslim victims there, and they're forces diametrically and severely opposed, just about everywhere, to the values and ideals that we consider progressive and seek to advance around the world.

    In your list, only Eric Rudolph can be said to have committed, and that too only tangentially (Scott Roeder's murder of George Tiller would have been direct; why didn't you include him in your list), terrorist acts in the name of his religion.

    Bill Maher's calling out of the left's BS on Islam (v Christianity) is a truthful and sanguine rebuke, indeed.

    •  This is growing tiresome. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Bisbonian, aitchdee

      I don't give a shit whether they did it "in the name of their religion" or not. The 6 men listed above murdered a total of at least 227 people and wounded over 1,000, and every damned one of them was a white, Christian American-born male. Their victims don't care what their rationale was.

      As for the tenets of Islam commanding followers to kill infidels, etc, what of it? The vast majority of Muslims ignore that, just as the vast majority of Catholics ignore the Vatican's official stance on birth control, and most Jews (in America, anyway) are known to eat a cheeseburger or pepperoni pizza from time to time.

      Here's a classic clip from The West Wing which points out how many commandments to kill people for idiotic reasons were found in the Old Testament. Yet, the vast majority of Christians and Jews ignore these with good reason.

      And list "over 100,000 dead", which is a shocking number indeed--almost as bad as the 120,000 Iraqi civilians that we slaughtered for no particular reason other than, according to George W. Bush himself, "God told me to". Another white, Christian, American-born male. The fact that he happened to be President doesn't change that.

      I am NOT "defending Islam" here. For fuck's sake, I'm an Israeli-supporting Jew myself. A quick Google search suggests that there's roughly 2.2 billion Muslims and an equal number of Christians, so it would be fascinating to find out just how many "civilians" (hard to define in many cases) have been murdered by each worldwide. Perhaps the numbers are significantly tilted towards Muslims, perhaps not. I have no idea which has a higher body count overall.

      How about serial killers? It's my understanding that the vast majority of them (in the U.S. at least) are some form of Christian, though I could be wrong about this. Should we include them here?

      What I do know is that there are scumbag murderers within EVERY religion. Perhaps Muslims are more likely to openly connect their acts to their religion, while Christian murders are less likely to, but again, that doesn't change the results of their actions.

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