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Good morning!

This is the weekly DKos Asheville open thread that Randall and I try to deliver every Saturday morning. We hope this group serves to reinvigorate us locally and regionally here on Daily Kos, building on the sense of community that's grown through our online engagement. DKos Asheville can give us all a better sense of connection, a better understanding of who these people are that we stand with, work with, and share with in the political process. We hope, through this community, that we can do a better job of leveraging our orange passion for progressive politics to help elect more and better Democrats.

If you would like to host a weekly open thread, please let us know.

We have a tentative date of July 20 for the next meetup.  So, use the comment section to begin planning.  I'm hoping I'll remember to bring a hat this time; or at least not spend so much time in direct sun.

Our legislature outdid itself once again this week.  On Wednesday, pat of butter in a sea of grits wrote about the latest, perhaps saddest, legislation our representatives have brought forth.

The North Carolina House Committee on Health and Human Services passed a bill that would prevent teenagers from receiving counseling or treatment for sexually transmitted infections unless they have notarized consent from a parent.
This legislation is perhaps a great example of the difference between progressives and conservatives.  Progressives tend toward a world view that looks at the community as a whole, while conservatives tend toward a world view that is focused first on themselves as individuals separate and apart from the world around them.

In this example, progressives can easily think of situations in which a requirement for notarized consent from a parent would not be a good idea.  Conservatives on the other hand view the issue from the perspective of what they personally prefer, and not what might not work for others; and their preference is that their children do not get counseling or treatment for sexually transmitted infections unless they first know about it.  They can not see past their own personal desires for control, they can not see how, or perhaps do not care how, other family situations might be different.  And they can not consider a situation in which their own child might be too afraid to tell them of a mistake which resulted in an infection; and they can not see, or refuse to see, the consequences of a child with an infection who does not get treatment.

It is understandable, in the great flow of events, that some parents raise their children in a manner similar to how they themselves were raised.  And it is understandable that some parents have received a perhaps less than adequate education, an education that perhaps would have availed them of a broader view (and here, education does not necessarily mean formal schooling).  But while it may be understandable that some parents have these views about how they choose to raise their children, it is not ok that they impose these views as laws on the rest of us.

But this self-centered world view is indicative of political conservatism as a whole.  And I think it is perhaps our work to make available to our neighbors, co-workers and fellow citizens a different way to view the communities in which we live.

Enjoy your Saturday!

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Comment Preferences

  •  Good morning, David. (7+ / 0-)

    It's raining. Again.

    July 20th, you say. That seems like a good date for some togetherness. I will have just become a grandfather for the first time, so I might be somewhat addled!

    There are no second class citizens in America, and there are no second class marriages in America. - Eleanor Holmes Norton

    by Captain Sham on Sat May 11, 2013 at 08:31:06 AM PDT

    •  That sounds like a good reason to be addled :) (6+ / 0-)

      Not raining here yet; but it looks likely.

      Love one another

      by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 08:41:08 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  As if I need a reason... n/t (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        davehouck, Joieau, SteelerGrrl, randallt, DawnN

        There are no second class citizens in America, and there are no second class marriages in America. - Eleanor Holmes Norton

        by Captain Sham on Sat May 11, 2013 at 08:59:13 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  It needs to rain, (5+ / 0-)

        I planted tomatoes yesterday and am in no mood to carry water out to them. But then again, I also need to dig up a pepper patch, so maybe not...

        It's surprisingly cool right on the river in July, so we could locate to the area beyond the tracks (if there's no young'uns likely to jump in). I'm thinking it may be a perfect day to park up at the kayak place and put in at the Bywater. Or maybe we should meet someplace else? Barley's is pretty fine, or Pisgah Brewing in Black Mountain?

        •  I planted carrot seedlings yesterday (5+ / 0-)

          But they're just a few feet from the rain barrel, and there's only a few of them.

          Love one another

          by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 09:22:34 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Break now after turning the edges (5+ / 0-)

            of pepper patch. Sited it right in the middle of my giant 4-leaf clover patch (good nitrogen). Shrunk the garden by 3 terraces this year, I'm getting way too old for keeping actual crop-crops. Planted peas, celeriac, carrots and onions in boxes on the front deck this year, they always get lost amongst the weeds if out in the garden (I grow spectacular weeds!). Just trying to arrange things so I can actually mow around or next to plots, that'll keep those derned morning glories down.

            Have friends down in the valley who grow really nice corn, okra, pumpkins, paste tomatoes, and even wheat, 'taters if I need more than I've got. We trade out, or they just bring stuff by because they got sick of canning (or ran out of jars again). I dehydrate everything in my nifty solar unit now, only can pickles and apple/pear/berry butters. Will let them with actual machinery do the hardest work now that I'm too old to dig that much. Can't use a tractor or smaller tractor-type machine on my acreage or I'd end up about 200 feet down the mountain! Do have my bean plot almost ready, with support - gimme pole beans every time! Just have to add the compost from where daughter moved the bin uphill yesterday...

            •  Essentially, I live in the woods ... (5+ / 0-)

              ... and there's very little area that gets any sunlight; so my "garden" space is very small, and my gardening is essentially educational in nature (although my tomatoes did well last year, and I cooked and froze enough to keep me in tomato sauce through the winter).  I do plan to sell this place eventually and find something with more garden space.

              And yes, one of the things I read last fall was that clover was a very good winter crop for fixing nitrogen to the soil.  And in the hole I dug yesterday for the carrots, I did turn over the clover that covered the spot.

              My onion seeds failed to germinate; I think it was too cold in the house, and I didn't use a heating pad under them.

              You dehydrate everything?  Interesting; more stuff to learn, must consult the google.

              I have a manual (ie solar) herb dryer that I've never used, but keep on intending to try.  I was visiting a friends house a couple weeks ago, and she had an electric food dryer.

              Love one another

              by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 10:04:25 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Maybe I'll bring mine (5+ / 0-)

                if we have an outdoor gathering in July, show how easy it is to make and show off some of the goodies too. A learning experience! Do sometimes have to finish things in the oven due to the fact that it rains an inch a day here all summer. What I get for being on the south slope of the Blacks (Mt. Mitchell & ridge), where clouds come to dump.

                Apples are wonderful dried. Still have a little water content so would spoil if not kept refrigerated, but they never last that long around my place - kids eat 'em for snacks. Dried tomatoes of course have their nice uses, you can keep them in olive oil for ages and they're still great on pasta or pizza. The rest I dry very hard, then freeze, then grind into powder. I have discovered that 16 pounds of tomatoes makes a good-sized herb bottle full. You can mix it with salt, herbs, garlic powder and such, use as a very nice table salt. Or mix with powdered greens, beets, leeks, celery, etc. for a fine broth powder for soups and sauces. Do have some grape tomato weeds that got away from me a few years ago, they grow in odd places and I let them. I dry those into "tomaisins," and the grandkids love those more than anything.

                Best part is no sterilizing of jars and no buying lids. So I'm a dedicated saver of containers suitable for dry stuff. Still have half a container of kale flakes from last year. Crunch 'em up and toss into soups, onto salads, etc. They keep their vitamins better too!

                •  Great idea for the meetup! (4+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Joieau, SteelerGrrl, randallt, DawnN

                  Learning experiences are very good!

                  Do you peel the tomatoes before drying?

                  Love one another

                  by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 10:27:31 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Nope. Do that for canning (4+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    SteelerGrrl, davehouck, randallt, DawnN

                    (and for making fresh 'mater pie), but no need for drying. The chewy toughness of dried and packed in oil is kinda what you're looking for on antipasto. If you're grinding into powder you want all of it because skins are part just like everything else. Except the seeds/gel, just scoop those out with a thumb when cutting into quarters.

                    That's actually the best thing about drying - nothing goes to waste. When drying scallions, leeks and garlic, I go ahead and dry the greens too. Same with onions. Once it's ground, it all tastes good. The tops of celery too, the greens of beets (if you don't cook 'em for dinner separately), even the tough central ribs of kale, collards and chard.

                    It's also fun to play with drying. Like half-dry something, then re-hydrate in a marinade or flavored sauce, then dry again. Get some very interesting tastes out of that.

                •  I'd love to see it (4+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  davehouck, randallt, Joieau, DawnN

                  Drying is my favorite way to preserve tomatoes, and I've got several varieties of heirloom seedlings ready to go in the ground. "Tomaisins" are awesome!

                   I can think of no more stirring symbol of man's humanity to man than a fire engine.     -- Kurt Vonnegut

                  by SteelerGrrl on Sat May 11, 2013 at 12:10:37 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

              •  You grow tomatoes in the woods? (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:

                Our tomatoes haven't ever done very well and we've got at least "partial" sunlight. How do you do it?

                When lots of people show up to vote, Democrats tend to win.

                by Audri on Sun May 12, 2013 at 06:14:07 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Well, the "garden" is a small "cleared" area ... (0+ / 0-)

                  ... and does get some sun.  Last year I apparently did a much better job at preparing the soil and keeping the plants watered but not overwatered.  Because of the lack of sun, the tomato vines were "stretching" and got very long.  I built a rather elaborate lattice of tree branches to prop up the vines, and kept adding to the lattice as they got longer.  Right now, it's a quarter past twelve and the sun has yet to clear the trees enough to get to the plants.

                  I am concerned that the forecast for tonight is 34 degrees.  I guess I should cover the plants with something.

                  Love one another

                  by davehouck on Sun May 12, 2013 at 09:16:04 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

    •  Congrats, Cap'n!!! (5+ / 0-)

      Grandkids are great... you can spoil the heck out of them, then hand 'em back!

    •  You don't even (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      davehouck, Captain Sham, randallt, DawnN

      look old enough to be a grandfather. Congrats!

       I can think of no more stirring symbol of man's humanity to man than a fire engine.     -- Kurt Vonnegut

      by SteelerGrrl on Sat May 11, 2013 at 12:12:10 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Morning, 20th should work. :) (6+ / 0-)

    "Lets show the rascals what Citizens United really means."

    by smiley7 on Sat May 11, 2013 at 08:39:04 AM PDT

    •  We're hoping it will be a little warmer ... (5+ / 0-)

      ... than last time; but I haven't actually checked the forecast yet.

      Love one another

      by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 08:43:27 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  They never change the forecast (5+ / 0-)

        in mid-summer. Hot with a chance of thunderstorms.

        •  So I won't need a sweatshirt? (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Joieau, SteelerGrrl, randallt, DawnN

          Yes, we do indeed get into long periods of unchanging daily forecasts in mid-summer.  But with each passing year, as the United States Congress continues to do nothing to address the increasingly extreme weather conditions resulting from climate change, the chance of snow in July increases.  So it might be a good idea to bring gloves and a toboggan.


          Love one another

          by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 09:18:17 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Y'know, we are pretty lucky (5+ / 0-)

            here in WNC, while much of the rest of the state/country are in for some serious adaptation issues. All the forecasts I've seen - and I have been paying attention for some time now - have us making out okay over the next century or so. Overall average temperature rise of 4-6 degrees, about 20 inches more rainfall. So long as the temp. rise is mostly spring/winter and fall, we'll be able to cope. Extra rain doesn't hurt. And we can always plant peaches and figs instead of cherries and apples.

            Biggest problem are those intensified storms. Too much rain and the mountains start slipping downhill. A rail worker got killed last week just up the tracks from us, double landslide. And those tend to bring down big trees and very large boulders while they're at it. Don't suffer much from tornadoes, but you never know. Hard for them to travel much in these steep environs, but if one's got your name on it, it'll drip right down on top of you.

            I'm stocking up on heirloom/open pollination seeds, have a nice box in the freezer should I ever need more than what I'm growing. That's a good storage place for most varieties so they retain fertility. And it's a really good idea for people to familiarize themselves with the many food choices that grow wild all over these abundant mountains. Check out A-ville's new wildings market, down by the French Broad Co-Op and its tailgate market -

            Asheville Wild Foods Market

            •  A friend of mine is involved in that project (4+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Joieau, SteelerGrrl, randallt, DawnN

              (In the picture, he's the one on the left with the "ears".)  And some of our potlucks have been graced by greens collected by foraging.

              Love one another

              by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 10:09:59 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  Also, one of the folks at our last meetup ... (4+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Joieau, SteelerGrrl, randallt, DawnN

              ... has been learning wild plant foraging too; she had just collected some Japanese Knotweed and Bamboo.

              Love one another

              by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 10:17:08 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Nice! I'd like to grow (4+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                davehouck, SteelerGrrl, randallt, DawnN

                bamboo and cattails in my bottomland, but it apparently doesn't get enough sun. We do have an ample supply of kudzu, though. It's a very nutritious green a lot better for you and better tasting simmered in broth than poke. Occasional morels, oysters, puffballs (great stuffed) and shelf 'shrooms, wild Jerusalem artichokes, groundnuts and acorns. Heck, some of the weeds in my garden are way more nutritious than spinach!

              •  Hi everyone - that would be me, and what I gather (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:

                foraging goes to the Wild Foods Market. It's my antidote to in town apartment living and environmental despair.

                Have been enjoying the gardening and drying discussion. Looking forward to more when we meet in July.

                Meantime, there's an Asheville segment of May 25's worldwide March against Monsanto at 2pm - originally set for Pack Square - I'll look at their facebook page to see details. If anyone else is planning to be there, it would be fun to meet before or after.

                All that we do now must be done in a sacred manner and in celebration.
We are the ones we’ve been waiting for.”–The Elders, Oraibi, Arizona Hopi Nation

                by DawnN on Sat May 11, 2013 at 11:27:47 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

  •  Meteor Blades has a very eye-opening diary ... (6+ / 0-)

    ... currently on the front page about voting demographics.  Very useful information in looking ahead to 2014 and getting the vote out for picking up seats in our state legislature.

    Love one another

    by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 09:39:01 AM PDT

  •  I just noticed that some of the pictures ... (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Joieau, SteelerGrrl, randallt, DawnN, gulfgal98

    ... from our last meetup have disappeared from gulfgal's diary.

    Love one another

    by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 10:18:39 AM PDT

  •  20th should work for us (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    davehouck, Captain Sham, randallt, DawnN

    At the rate he's growing, Jaco will be the size of a pony by then!

    My garden's off to a slow start this year. I started several varieties of heirloom tomatoes from seed in March and have had them outside for a couple of weeks. They're growing, but barely -- they need more love from the sun. Aside of that I'll probably keep it to a few pepper plants from the farmer's market and lots of dill, cilantro, and basil from seed.

    SD is into exotic and ornamental plants, so we also have an assortment of palms, bamboo, citrus and avocado trees. I'd be happy to host a weekend thread with more on what we're growing and how, what dates do you need?

    My tie dyeing has suffered the same stagnating fate as the tomatoes in the cool weather. I still haven't opened my Etsy shop because the sun won't stay out long enough for me to photograph my inventory. Tomorrow's forecast is promising, which is good because I have a batch of hearts to dye for a benefit and a few more 4/20 shirts to do.

    We'll try again on the group tie dye thing in July, and I will make it into at least one picture ;)

     I can think of no more stirring symbol of man's humanity to man than a fire engine.     -- Kurt Vonnegut

    by SteelerGrrl on Sat May 11, 2013 at 12:54:15 PM PDT

    •  Thanks! I'll kosmail you about hosting (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      SteelerGrrl, randallt, DawnN

      I have a box on the deck with mint, which was there when I moved here nine years ago and is still thriving.  I have two or three other boxes that I can make use of though, and basil sounds very interesting; it's something I use a lot.  I would love to plant some seeds for herbs I frequently use in the kitchen.

      Love one another

      by davehouck on Sat May 11, 2013 at 01:14:43 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Basil is easy peasy (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        davehouck, randallt, DawnN

        to grow from seed. I even don't bother starting it indoors, just sow in cells after danger of frost (you still have time) and transplant to containers or beds when seedlings have two sets of "true" leaves. You can get a head start by purchasing basil plants, but once the weather warms up, it grows so fast it's hardly worth it spending $2-3 or more apiece.

        I also grow dill and cilantro in containers. Dill hates to be transplanted and cilantro bolts quickly, so you have to plant every 2-3 weeks to keep it fresh.

         I can think of no more stirring symbol of man's humanity to man than a fire engine.     -- Kurt Vonnegut

        by SteelerGrrl on Sat May 11, 2013 at 02:17:14 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  I put an X on the 20th in my appointment calendar. (5+ / 0-)

    I had planned to go to the Grandfather Mountain Highland Games, but don't think I can manage the walking as I have in years past. I'll explain when I see you guys.  I am about to pick up Burns Lass and take her to the bookstore to get her mom a Mother's Day gift.  She loves books.  

    I will be sure to tell BL about the meetup. I am sure she will want to be there. She had a great time last time.  However, she was upset because she forgot to bring some sort of ID. Said she wanted to "sample the cider."

    Rudeness is a weak imitation of strength. - Eric Hoffer

    by Otteray Scribe on Sat May 11, 2013 at 02:49:38 PM PDT

  •  Hi folks! (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    davehouck, DawnN, gulfgal98

    I get the feeling the 20th is a good day. Let's do this! I'll get in touch with navajo. Please kos mail me or reply in this diary so I can start building our New Day segment. This is going to be great y'all.

    Otteray Scribe
    Captain Sham

    Had two good shows at LEAF this weekend and juggled in the parade. Steele Pulse tomorrow. :)

    Libertarianism is something that most people grow out of, not unlike, say, hay fever or asthma. Bob Johnson

    by randallt on Sat May 11, 2013 at 07:04:00 PM PDT

  •  lol...It's Tuesday and I'm just now reading this! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    I think the 20th will be great.....will be going to Floydfest the following weekend and celebrate aliciamom's 80 birthday the weekend after that...Fingers crossed! Hope everyone has a great week.  :)

    We're walking temples of noise, and when you add tender hearts to this mix, it somehow lets us meet in places we couldn't get to any other way.-Anne Lamott

    by alicia on Tue May 14, 2013 at 07:44:15 AM PDT

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