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A boy listens to U.S. President Barack Obama speak on immigration reform at Chamizal National Memorial Park in El Paso, Texas, May 10, 2011. REUTERS/Jim Young
He'll pay for your Medicare and Social Security.
Here's a critical point of information in the immigration reform debate: Rather than being a drain on federal health care spending, immigrants have been keeping Medicare afloat for the past decade. That's according to a new study conducted by researchers at Harvard Medical School and published in Health Affairs.

In 2009 alone, the researchers found "immigrants made 14.7 percent of Trust Fund contributions but accounted for only 7.9 percent of its expenditures—a net surplus of $13.8 billion." Those born in the U.S. generated a $30.9 deficit in 2009. Over the seven-year period covered in the study, immigrants pumped a surplus of $115.2 billion into the Medicare Trust Fund.

Most of the surplus from immigrants was contributed by noncitizens and was a result of the high proportion of working-age taxpayers in this group. Policies that restrict immigration may deplete Medicare’s financial resources. [emphasis added]
Of course, for opponents of both immigration and Medicare, weakening Medicare could be a desired outcome. But there's no question that, at least as far as Medicare is concerned, immigrants are net contributors. It's a matter of age demographics, primarily. While immigrations and U.S. born individuals paid in roughly the same amount in contributions, the immigrant population is younger and is drawing far less out in benefits. That will be true for a couple of decades to come, as the baby boomers retire and draw heavily from the system. That's probably true of Social Security, as well, the researchers conclude.
Policies that reduce immigration would almost certainly weaken Medicare’s financial health, while an increasing flow of immigrants might bolster its sustainability. Because Social Security’s eligibility criteria and payroll tax–based funding closely track those of Medicare, our findings support the argument that immigration helps sustain Social Security. [...]

Encouraging a steady flow of young immigrants would help offset the aging of the US population and the health care financing challenge that it presents.

Here's one more benefit to the economy from comprehensive immigration reform. It's good for the deficit, too. With the immigration debate heating up, it's a chance for Republicans to show just how much they really care about the deficit. (Spoiler alert: They don't.)

Originally posted to Joan McCarter on Thu May 30, 2013 at 08:39 AM PDT.

Also republished by Daily Kos.

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Comment Preferences

  •  that's a great statistic (18+ / 0-)

    I hear people complain around here all the time about how the immigrants all get medicaid and cost the rest of us money.  We are costing us money and we need more immigrants to pay for us.  I've said that about social security for a long time. I have been known to tell my more unenlightened cohorts who have complained about the large increase in the latino population in this area,  don't complain about those kids, they are your social security check.   We don't need an aged out population of former workers, we need younger workers still working.  But the hate of the 'other' is still strong down here in red state central.

    •  good points (3+ / 0-)

      "Tax cuts for the 1% create jobs." -- Republicans, HAHAHA - in China

      by MartyM on Thu May 30, 2013 at 08:51:23 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  This Diary leaves out... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Bob B crucial point.

      Each immigrant worker displaced an American worker.

      That American worker is now unemployed or underemployed and is contributing less to Medicare.

      Immigrants tend to be young, so they work longer hours and are healthier than average. It's only natural that they are a net gain to the healthcare system!

      But the problem is we already have millions of young, healthy people who would like jobs -- but they are facing race-to-the-bottom wage competition from both legal and illegal immigrants.

      I do not understand how anyone can advocate wage-destroying immigration and claim to be Progressive.
      Rural and inner-city youth face wage destruction from illegal immigrants. Young college graduates face wage destruction from legal H1-B visa holders.

      We must not backstab these groups that have supported us so strongly.

      •  "each immigrant worker displaced an American" (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        puakev, MartyM, Faito, Sentido

        Dude.  Seriously?

        Do we need to get out the old "Americans = immigrants" chart again?

      •  These Are The Same Fucking Fools (0+ / 0-)

        That brought you NAFTA.

        They have now brought you 16% youth unemployment rate and illegal immigrants trying to support two U.S. born kids on food stamps and a job at McDonalds.

        I won't be coming home tonight, my generation will put it right - Genesis 9:3

        by superscalar on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:37:30 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Except that most, if not all, of the undocumented (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Faito, Batya the Toon

          immigrants around here work in agriculture. This is southern NM where the temperatures reach over 100 degrees during harvest time. Not too many American citizens vying for those jobs. Their labor keeps your produce prices low.

          •  About 4% Of All Illegal Immigrants (0+ / 0-)

            Work in any kind of agricultural job. First place is construction, second place is service jobs.

            Their labor keeps your produce prices low

            The cost of produce is not in the picking, it's in the transportation and storage. You could double agricultural salaries tomorrow, the price of lettuce would increase by about a dime. Read How Much is That Tomato in the Window? Retail Produce Prices Without Illegal Farmworkers

            Their labor keeps your produce prices low

            I'm sure that same justification was used for slavery.

            I won't be coming home tonight, my generation will put it right - Genesis 9:3

            by superscalar on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:15:36 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I have always been (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:

              for easier citizenship and other ways to make sure that anyone that comes to this country to work, is treated fairly and not exploited.  But I also know that much of the anti-immigrant feeling around here is not about taking jobs but about color and language and cultural differences.

              I do care that folks who want it get a chance at citizenship and all benefits.  I don't think trying to close the door will benefit this country in the long run.  I have no desire to continue the WASP model of America as the ideal.

          •  By The Way (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:

            Not too many American citizens vying for those jobs

            What happens when you make American citizens out of the, by your definition, illegal immigrants that are doing those jobs now?

            Once they become American citizens won't they too 'not be vying for those jobs', in which case won't we just get a new group of illegal immigrants to do those jobs.

            Why would anyone agree to making American citizens out of those illegal immigrants who are doing those jobs if the only result is we get more illegal immigrants and a group of now legal workers to do nothing more than increase the surplus of workers we already have?

            I won't be coming home tonight, my generation will put it right - Genesis 9:3

            by superscalar on Thu May 30, 2013 at 12:21:55 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  If there are not... (0+ / 0-)

            ...many Americans vying for those jobs, then Agribusiness must raise their wages.


      •  The facts do not support you. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        The most recent academic research suggests that, on average, immigrants raise the overall standard of living of American workers by boosting wages and lowering

        People who worry about 'importing poverty' are not supported by the social and economic trends of the past 15 years. Even though the number of legal and illegal immigrants in the US has risen strongly since the early 1990s, the size of the economic underclass has not. In fact, by several measures the number of Americans living on the bottom rungs of the economic ladder has been in a long-term decline, even as the number of immigrants continues to climb. Other indicators associated with the underclass, such as the crime rate, have also shown improvement. The inflow of low-skilled immigrants may even be playing a positive role in pushing nativeborn Americans up the skills and income ladder..

        In the absence of immigrants, would African-American (and poor white) workers be mowing lawns, cleaning hotel rooms, and nailing up sheetrock (jobs that are not exportable) at union-level wages? Maybe.

        There are a lot of reasons for dysfunctional (to job-seeking) behavior among some lower stratum working class youth, but understanding them doesn't change employers' discrimination.  Many would rather hire an "illegal" than a young black male, for example, from a Chicago or a South Central LA housing project.  But that's a topic for another diary.  

        •  What A Bunch Of Fucking Bullshit (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          The inflow of low-skilled immigrants may even be playing a positive role in pushing nativeborn Americans up the skills and income ladder..

          Into the same job sectors which are being offshored and replaced by technology.

          American workers who have been laid off from jobs for more than the past decade now have not been moving into jobs which pay more, they have been moving into jobs which pay less.

          So, you import low-wage workers to take the low wage service jobs which can't be off shored, and you off shore what ever isn't battened down.

          And then you float this fucking pablum that 'immigrants raise the overall standard of living of American workers by boosting wages and lowering prices.'

          In 2003 Diana Farrell (who until recently was part of the Obama Admiistration) wrote this in

          Offshoring: Is it a win-win game?

          Far from being bad for the United States, offshoring creates net additional value for the U.S. economy that did not exist before, a full 12-14 cents on every dollar offshored. Indeed, of the full $1.45 to $1.47 of value created globally from offshoring $1.00 of U.S. labor cost, the U.S. captures $1.12 to $1.14, while the receiving country captures, on average, just 33 cents. (Exhibit 7)

          In the 1990's neoliberals in the Democratic Party made the very same argument about offshoring i.e. that it was a 'win win', it increased American wages and lowered costs, and it would create millions of new high paying jobs.

          More recently however, Barack Obama spent some significant portion of this last election blaming Mitt Romney for 'jobs being shipped to China' while Bill Clinton was feted as the 'truth teller and math expert' at the Democratic Convention

          Horse . Shit.

          I won't be coming home tonight, my generation will put it right - Genesis 9:3

          by superscalar on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:35:12 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Offshoring (0+ / 0-)

            is a different issue, dear.  The only way to address that is with tax incentives for companies who bring manufacturing jobs back to America.  Eventually, it will be a race to zero (for corporate income taxes).  Another strategy would be for the GOTP to eliminate the minimum wage altogether, along with regulations of any kind, so that American workers can work for the same wages and in the same conditions as workers in Bangladesh.

      •  not around here (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        most are agricultural workers,  brought specifically because not enough people would do the work.  The agrobusiness and farmer's groups begged the legislature not to pass their anti-immigrant bills for that very reason in this state.

    •  The only Medicaid benefit that (0+ / 0-)

      undocumented immigrants qualify for in VA is the one for expectant mothers and WIC (but only for the first 3 months of life).  

      Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

      by a gilas girl on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:46:06 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Read the Statistics Closely (0+ / 0-)

        This deals with only "immigrants" not just noncitizen imigrants.  So lots of the people paying in are here legally and are eligible for lots of programs.  The portion about most of this coming from "noncitizen" immigrants is unsourced.

    •  I live near the US/Mexico border. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      You see Mexican people working all over the place around here--as gardeners, in restaurants, salons, homes, carpet cleaners, car washes, etc.  Some legal, some not--I am sure.  It's a very well-to-do area.  Lots of fancy cars, big houses, and Romney/Ryan signs here in fall 2012.  But I still hear the same old caterwauling about anchor babies and welfare sucks and Medicaid moochers and the ruination of public schools by "illegals".  There is a huge disconnect between the people we see all around us every day and the rhetoric.

  •  I believe it (7+ / 0-)

    but try to convince right-winger of this fact.

    “Wall Street had been doing business with pieces of paper; and now someone asked for a dollar, and it was discovered that the dollar had been mislaid.” ― Upton Sinclair

    by gjohnsit on Thu May 30, 2013 at 08:52:46 AM PDT

  •  Two things (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    1) Maybe so, but how about 30 years from now?  Or do we expect to sustain a high rate of immigration forever?

    2) Under our current immigration regime lower-wage people are off the books, neither contributing nor receiving.  The purpose of reform is to regularize those people, so you can't just extrapolate from the recent past.

    You know, I sometimes think if I could see, I'd be kicking a lot of ass. -Stevie Wonder at the Glastonbury Festival, 2010

    by Rich in PA on Thu May 30, 2013 at 09:40:34 AM PDT

    •  Actually, if they're working using fake SSN's (11+ / 0-)

      they're paying in without being able to take out.  The situation at present is one of exploitation - we get their work, we get their taxes, they don't get benefits.  If we clamp down on immigration, we don't get work or taxes; if we legalize, they get benefits.  If you don't have any ethical qualms about the exploitation, the 'ideal' situation is what we've already got - lots of undocumented being exploited :P

      •  Yep. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Batya the Toon

        Unfortunately, path-to-citizenship will add a lot of people to the unemployment rolls, because the very reason they were hired was their exploitability. They'll quickly join the ranks of current US workers in being replaced by a new batch of undocumented workers.

        This is why I think the corporations found guilty of exploitation should be required to pay massive, MASSIVE damages to those exploited.

        If you can find money to kill people, you can find money to help people. --Tony Benn

        by rhetoricus on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:04:51 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Isn't that the reason the immigration reform bill (0+ / 0-)

          specifically requires better border security? What Dr Erich Bloodaxe RN was saying doesn't mean exploitation (not that immigrants aren't exploited in other ways). The immigrants choose to have jobs now using fake SS numbers because otherwise they couldn't work at all. They know that those SS numbers won't entitle them to SS benefits when they retire. But they're stuck. So they accept it. It sucks, but it's not exploitation.

          •  Couple of things: (0+ / 0-)

            1) U-Is working here aren't always rushing the border. Many overstay a VISA, or are ushered in with the help of big corporations.

            2) Right, the exploitation comes with the workers' fear of not being able to protest if they are denied payment, or harassed, or subjected to unsafe work conditions, etc.

            If you can find money to kill people, you can find money to help people. --Tony Benn

            by rhetoricus on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:02:13 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  exactly (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        thank you for pointing this out.

        Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

        by a gilas girl on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:48:10 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Correct. (0+ / 0-)

        The IRS collects both federal income taxes and federal payroll taxes from illegal immigrants, who are required to pay regardless of their immigration status. Because such workers don’t qualify for a valid SSN, the IRS issues a nine-digit Individual Taxpayer Identification Number. An ITIN doesn’t authorize the user to work legally in the U.S., and doesn’t entitle him or her to Social Security benefits, which many Americans (R&D) do not grasp.

        Illegal immigrants don’t qualify for Social Security, Medicare or other federal bennies hospitals.

    •  We need population growth. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      Right now, we need more immigration, because of the bulge in boomers moving into their senior years. The demographics won't always show that.

      Also, if what you say about people being off the books is true, that just makes the case for immigration reform even better. Those people, who skew younger and healthier, will then contribute to SS and MC by moving out of the black economy.

      •  But that just kicks the can down the road. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        It's bringing in a new bubble of working-age people, who will in turn need a bubble to support them.  Besides, the idea of solving social needs by bringing in more people, rather than a more equitable tax regime, doesn't really appeal to my progressive happy place!

        You know, I sometimes think if I could see, I'd be kicking a lot of ass. -Stevie Wonder at the Glastonbury Festival, 2010

        by Rich in PA on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:22:12 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Yep. The system needs to evolve (0+ / 0-)

          Something has to change.  As people keep living longer the amount of cost for retirees will keep climbing, and so we'll keep needing more and more people to pay for it.

          What I think needs to happen is that over time it needs to shift from a system where the next generation pays to a system where the current generation pays for their own retirement.  Perhaps benefits will have to move away from being fixed to a more floating level commensurate with the amount their generation put into the system and made through investment.  That's the only way I can see it becoming sustainable long-term.  Unfortunately, the generations caught up in the transition will have to pay a lot more.

          •  What's driving up the cost (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Rich in PA

            isn't that people are living longer, it's the costs of managing chronic diseases like diabetes and CHF.

            If we had a health care system that kept people well instead of treating sick people, it would be cheaper, even to treat those really sick people.

            Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

            by a gilas girl on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:50:20 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  That's the real issue (0+ / 0-)

              We are focusing too much on who pays for health care and not enough on the reality that it costs way too much, because of an ingrained assumption that health care should be a huge gravy train to match our defense sector.

              You know, I sometimes think if I could see, I'd be kicking a lot of ass. -Stevie Wonder at the Glastonbury Festival, 2010

              by Rich in PA on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:53:05 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  Too bad (0+ / 0-)

              the US Gubmint cannot convince Madison Avenue to do some pro-bono work aimed at getting Americans off their fat asses and into a gym, or a farmer's market.

            •  Longer lifespans is a big factor (0+ / 0-)

              Countries with public health care systems where a lot of this stuff IS caught are also facing rapidly expanding health care costs.  A big part of it is that people are simply living longer and will have more ailments that need to be treated before they pass away.  Another part, however, is that newer treatments with specialized equipment and expensive drugs are driving up the coss as well.

              The US could certainly reduce costs by getting better prevenatative treatment and being smarter about recourse allocation for certain ailments.  With those in place you'd see a big drop but it would then trend back upwards as lifespans get longer, just like everywhere else.

              •  yes but the way to deal with these costs (0+ / 0-)

                is precisely what the ACA is designed to do: restructure the way that care is delivered to patients at the end of life, using fewer expensive specialists and more team-based care; keeping people in their homes whenever possible and engaging in more integrated and coordination of care.

                There is movement to deal with these predictable rises in costs through an alternative means of delivery of care. It isn't simply a moment for hand wringing.

                Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

                by a gilas girl on Thu May 30, 2013 at 02:18:01 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

  •  But...but the Heritage Foundation has proven (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Mother Mags

    beyond the shadow of a doubt that immigration will destroy the economy:
    "Ahh, but immigartion, that's... that's where we had the Democrats. They laughed at us and made jokes but we proved beyond the shadow of a doubt and with... geometric logic... that immigration would bankrupt social security and medicare, and we'd have produced that proof if the lamestream media hadn't distorted our report. I, I, I know now they were only trying to protect Obamacare..."

    "They will not collect a ransom in exchange for not crashing the American economy. The full faith and credit of the United States of America is not a bargaining chip."

    by TofG on Thu May 30, 2013 at 09:55:58 AM PDT

  •  If it's not apparent to the Beltway Conventional (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Los Diablo, HappyinNM

    Wisdom, it sure is apparent to Kossacks..

    R(egressives) don't care about facts.  
    It's all about power and influence:
    - to reward cronies
    - to keep their base stoked with fear,
    - and  to punish opposition -- to stick it to the Dems and the Dem constituencies.

    If the rest of the country is harmed in the process.. well, too freepin' bad.

    "..The political class cannot solve the problems it created. " - Jay Rosen

    by New Rule on Thu May 30, 2013 at 09:57:53 AM PDT

  •  Is the complaint that they draw on Medicare? (0+ / 0-)

    I thought the complaint was that they draw on emergency rooms. I appreciate the sentiment behind the study, but  it's not a true measure of the medical costs incurred by undocumented immigrants, and in this regard seems disingenuous.

    I don't think it's wise to defend the fraudulent use of Social Security numbers, which this study seems to do. If we want open borders, let's open them to everyone (like the 4 million Iraqis whose lives we destroyed), and be honest about what that will mean in terms of draw on public services. If we don't want open borders, why are we (if obliquely) defending a corrupt, dangerous system that allows corporations to destroy unions and end-run fair pay and taxation and safety and overtime and anti-harassment laws?

    If you can find money to kill people, you can find money to help people. --Tony Benn

    by rhetoricus on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:00:36 AM PDT

    •  The authors briefly addressed this (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      puakev, rhetoricus, HappyinNM

      Uncompensated care is about 2 percent of national health care spending, as opposed to 21 percent for Medicare. It might be true that undocumented immigrants get the most uncompensated care (I haven't seen a study on that) but it's not nearly as significant a spending issue as Medicare.

      And the authors are not defending fraudulent use of Social Security numbers. They address it as a fact of current life in the U.S.

      "There’s class warfare, all right, but it’s my class, the rich class, that’s making war, and we’re winning." —Warren Buffett

      by Joan McCarter on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:12:34 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Thanks, Joan. (0+ / 0-)

        I should not conflate the studies' authors with extrapolations from the study I've seen.

        In terms of folks who aren't paying their fair share for the relative costs of having a permanent underclass, it's the corporations that are exploiting undocumented workers. Whatever costs the workers' presence incurs, they should come out of corporate hides.

        If you can find money to kill people, you can find money to help people. --Tony Benn

        by rhetoricus on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:54:38 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  There should be figures that differentiate (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        between ER spending on citizens vs. immigrants. Medicaid has several categories (at least in this state). There is one specifically for undocumented immigrants using the ER.

    •  Illegal workers (0+ / 0-)

      need an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) from the IRS, which is not fraudulent, and it doesn't mean they're suddenly 'legal'.

  •  Facts mean nothing to racist xenophobes (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    cocinero, stewarjt

    I imagine that the immigrants in the study include undocumented ones.  One of the issues I have with the ACA is that it leaves out undocumenteds.

    Daily Kos an oasis of truth. Truth that leads to action.

    by Shockwave on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:02:52 AM PDT

  •  Bet the numbers work for Social Security too. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    stewarjt, HappyinNM

    Always thought Immigration Reform should be sold as a way to strengthen Social Security and Medicare.

    Throw in a fine for the undocumented immigrants seeking citizenship that's earmarked for SS and MC, and you're really kicking.

  •  There Goes The Moocher Demagaugery (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Of course the right wingers won't believe the facts right in front of their faces.

    If I was a communist, rich men would fear me...And the opposite applies. The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles.

    by stewarjt on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:07:52 AM PDT

  •  That is certainly true, especially for this (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:


    Though I am not complaining, I want to see the poorest among us treated with respect. People don't want to be poor.

  •  Excellent data, especially for those who argue (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    immigrants are freeloaders, only taking out of the system rather than putting in their fair share.  Thanks much!

  •  Which immigrants are we talking about? (0+ / 0-)

    Legal immigrants or illegal immigrants?

  •  It's true, immigrants contribute, and yet... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    HappyinNM, dream weaver

    ....anti-immigrant sentiment, which is often racist in nature, runs rampant in this country.  Just today, for example, in the deep blue state in which I live, I saw an old white man driving a van with this vile, xenophobic bumper-sticker: "Why the hell should I have to press 1 to speak English?"

    Failure to Publicize Acts of Hatred Only Allows Them to Fester and Metastasize.

    by BoxerDave on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:36:25 AM PDT

  •  I can't imagine what the word Immigrant means. (0+ / 0-)

    Everybody I have ever met is a citizen of the world and should be entitled to live any where in the world that she/he chooses to.

  •  I've been saying this for years (0+ / 0-)

    Anyone who has worked in those industries where undocumented immigrants tend to be working (cough food service cough) knows that both SS and Medicare taxes are being paid into the system and are not being tapped into.

    Immigration is the way to counter the aging of the US born population and always has been a fairly simple path out of the SS/Medicare manufactured "crisis" that the right has been bellowing about.

    Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

    by a gilas girl on Thu May 30, 2013 at 10:44:53 AM PDT

  •  So, Let me Get this Straight (0+ / 0-)

    We make noncitizen workers into citizens and we increase tax revenues even more, because right now a lot of those noncitizen workers are paid in cash and don't have taxes of any kind withheld.  To "Republicans" this should sound great.  More revenues for tax cuts and no new taxes on voters.  To Dems, well, it will take the pressure off cuts elsewhere, and in 10 years, these noncitizens will be citizens and will probably vote for the Dems.  Good news all around for everyone, even John McCain.

  •  This is no damn surprise. (0+ / 0-)

    At one of my previous jobs pre 9/11 the company would hire seasonal workers and a few of them would be illegal in the sense they had fake IDs. Cannot say they were undocumented as they always had a SS card and or Green Card or else we could not hire them. Anyway, after the end of the season and we had submitted W-2's I would be notified of a list of people that their SS#'s did not match the name in the system. Anyway my point the govt knows that SS and Medicare was being paid by "undocumented" employees that contributed taxes but would never collect them. The RW lie is that they get free social security when they do not. The fund is and was being funded by workers that will never collect.

  •  But when they are legalized, they'll be eligible (0+ / 0-)

    to start getting benefits, and the "surplus" they're creating will disapear.

    Besides, most recent immigrants are still young, so OF COURSE tney contributed more to Medicare than they received!

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