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Student protesters marching down Langdon Street at the University of Wisconsin-Madison during the Vietnam War era. UW Digital Collections. January 1965
FreedomWorks' role models?
The latest from the black helicopter brigade: burning Obamacare cards. One little problem. There's no such thing as an Obamacare card. That's not going to stop FreedomWorks any more than it stopped Clint Eastwood from conversing with an empty chair on national television. So what Dean Clancy, vice president of FreedomWorks, has decided to do is to create a fake Obamacare card. Which you have to print to yourself. And then burn.
“The whole scheme is enlisting young adults to overpay, so other people can have subsidies,” Clancy says. “That unfairness reminded us of the military draft.”

While the military has draft cards, the Affordable Care Act does not. Instead, FreedomWorks took an image of the Vietnam draft cards and grafted the word “Obamacare” to the top. The hope is that students will film themselves burning these cards and upload the videos online.

“We’re trying to make it socially acceptable to skip the exchange and pay the fine,” Clancy says. “Our goal is directly opposite that of the administration’s. Our mantra is, ‘skip the exchange, pay the fine.’”

How surreal is this getting? What's next? Chants of "Hey, ho. Obamacare has got to go!" at young Republican conventions? Dirty fucking hippies are the now the role models for a new generation of people fighting The Man. Or having health insurance. Which is just like The Man. I guess. Making it even more ridiculous is that you know Clancy and his friends would have been the people bashing the heads of the draft-card burners had they been around back then.

By the way, there's a flaw in the plan. The money he's telling people to pay in fines will just go back into funding Obamacare for the not really stupid people who do get health insurance. But hey gang, knock yourselves out. Because nothing says Freedom! like spending hours in the emergency room waiting to see a doctor for the burn you got from torching a fake Obamacare card.

Originally posted to Joan McCarter on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 01:28 PM PDT.

Also republished by Daily Kos.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Ok, But Only as an Act of Preemption (15+ / 0-)

    ... even though I don't as yet have my card.  Wingnuts are rarely wrong on public policy issues.

    Burn, baby, burn!

    Support Small Business: Shop Kos Katalogue - A Riddle Wrapped in a Mystery Inside an Enigma

    by JekyllnHyde on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 01:40:08 PM PDT

  •  This really belongs here (14+ / 0-)

    The dirty fucking hippies really were right.
    I've you've never heard the song, please click this link.

    http://www.youtube.com/...

  •  44 years ago this month... (49+ / 0-)

    ... I started my 13 month term for refusing the draft (I didn't burn my card). The only famous person serving with me (for four of those months) was David Harris, then married to Joan Baez (who I never got to meet).

    These guys are a really bad joke.

    Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

    by Meteor Blades on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 01:44:50 PM PDT

  •  How goddamn old are these people? (26+ / 0-)

    People haven't burnt cards in forty years. What's next?  Bashing Jane Fonda?

    "We're now in one of those periods when the reality of intense pressure on the middle class diverges from long-held assumptions of how the American bargain should work" --James Fallows

    by Inland on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 01:44:56 PM PDT

    •  Maybe the older women can burn their bras. (9+ / 0-)

      "We the People of the United States...." -U.S. Constitution

      by elwior on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 02:41:09 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  There are still right wingers on comment sections (4+ / 0-)

      of news articles who

      1. who still want Jane Fonda imprisoned as a war criminal and some advocate execution. I kid you not

      2. Some are still bashing the Japanese for WWII , I was shocked about that one. But it is not just the old WWII guys, there are a lot of guys who never served whose dads served in WWII who still hold a grudge against the Japanese.

      3. Some are still advocating for segregation.

      4. Some what to re fight the Civil War and bring back the Confederacy...

      So yes, they live and dwell in the past.

      Join PA Liberals at http://keystoneliberalsforum.aimoo.com/

      by wishingwell on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:42:17 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Nah... Anita Bryant. Oh wait. (0+ / 0-)

      I'll believe corporations are people when one comes home from Afghanistan in a body bag.

      by mojo11 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:43:42 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  They still do that. (0+ / 0-)

      I had a boyfriend for a couple years in the Reagan 80s who could quote verbatim Jane Fonda's anti-war slogans so he could laugh contemptuously at her. (For a number of reasons, including that, I showed him the door.)

      Remember, these RWs are in a hermetically-sealed bubble where time stands still. In RW-Land, Jane Fonda is always the Commie Traitor Bitch (and yet Oliver North is Jesus Christ's BFF), the Post Office is always as inefficient and slow as it was in the mid-70s, where an African-American Christian minister who said some understandably angry things about American racism was an indelible influence on 11-year-old Barack Obama which proves beyond a doubt that He's A Moozlim. Oh yeah, and Repubs are the only party that's fair to black people because Abraham Lincoln.

      Thank God, the Bob Fosse Kid is here! - Colin Mochrie

      by gardnerhill on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 03:56:34 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I thought draft dodging... (19+ / 0-)

    Was like punching Baby Jesus in the face or something.  I'm so confused...

    “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.” - John Steinbeck

    by RichM on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 01:45:35 PM PDT

  •  I'm going to burn my bra too! (10+ / 0-)

    But wow, good bras are so expensive.

    (Tossing old pair of stained Haines crew socks on the fire.)

    Wow, standing up for my principles made me hungry. I had no idea it would be so invigorating!

    Did anyone bring marshmallows?

    © grover


    So if you get hit by a bus tonight, would you be satisfied with how you spent today, your last day on earth? Live like tomorrow is never guaranteed, because it's not. -- Me.

    by grover on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 01:49:48 PM PDT

  •  Next up they will burn iuds instead (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Joan McCarter, Korkenzieher, JBraden

    Of bras.

    Most of the people taking a hard line against us are firmly convinced that they are the last defenders of civilization... The last stronghold of mother, God, home and apple pie and they're full of shit! David Crosby, Journey Thru the Past.

    by Mike S on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 01:50:45 PM PDT

  •  No Fair Making Fun of Them Poor Repubs (9+ / 0-)

    Of course, they don't get a lot. For example, the difference between  an imaginary "Obamacare card" and a Viet Nam era draft card is quite easy for most people to grasp. But, alas, not so much for the R's.

     Wait a minute. Ya know, that's really pretty dim, ain't it?  Miss Joan, FEEL FREE to ridicule the Repubs as much as you like. I feel a lot better now that I look at the situation more objectively and your assessment of the situation is absolutely correct! TTFN, ;-) Whaddaya

  •  Yet... (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    elwior, Aquarius40, happymisanthropy

    Yet they keep theirs.  Only those who are without health insurance shouldn't get it.  

  •  Shouldn't they verify that by taking a poll of (5+ / 0-)

    those of us who actually did burn our draft cards, as well as draft resisters who didn't but resisted all the same?

    That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

    by enhydra lutris on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 02:22:24 PM PDT

  •  Wait a minute (10+ / 0-)

    These people want to avoid getting health insurance just to stick it to Obama?  Priorities are out of whack.

    I wonder how many of them would jump in a lake if FreedomWorks told them it would hurt Obama?

    •  Ask FreedomWorks advocates about their insurance (6+ / 0-)

      The one photo I've seen of advocates encouraging people to not sign up for Obamacare showed a group of advocates with beautiful silver hair--or beautiful white hair.

      Let's see if FreedomWorks limits its front-line activists to those who have joined the movement by not accepting, or withdrawing from, whatever insurance is available to them.

    •  IIRC, isn't it illegal to (0+ / 0-)

      distribute something proporting to be a federal document? I just remember some legislation about 20 years ago that was passed to prevent junk mail marketers printing envelopes that resembled government ones. Maybe I'm wrong, but it would seem like this would not be legal unless they printed that it wasn't a legal card. but I keep forgetting, these folks would never let that get in their way.

      Keep fightin' for freedom and justice, beloveds, but don't you forget to have fun doin' it. Lord, let your laughter ring forth. Be outrageous, ridicule the fraidy-cats, rejoice in all the oddities that freedom can produce.---Molly Ivins

      by never forget 2000 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 04:28:01 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I'm burning my bra. (14+ / 0-)

    It never fit me right, anyway.

    Calling other DKos members "weenies" is a personal insult and therefore against site rules.

    by Bob Johnson on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 02:32:09 PM PDT

  •  Hey, hey, PBO; how many kids did you insure today? (16+ / 0-)

    Yeah I know it doesn't rhyme, but the ANGER they'll scream it with will make up for it.

    In alcohol's defense, I've done some incredibly stupid things while completely sober too. - Ford Mandalay

    by Fordmandalay on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 02:44:20 PM PDT

  •  They have an LBJcare card maybe they would (5+ / 0-)

    like to start with burning that.

  •  The type of stunt Republicans specialize in... (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Amber6541, True North, Dirtandiron

    ...and that every time adds to the pile that will eventually prevent me to EVER vote vote for these idiots.

    Either that or a lobotomy.

  •  This totally cracks me up! (5+ / 0-)

    The Onion can't get more tweeked than the CONservatives anymore.

    If I ran this circus, things would be DIFFERENT!

    by CwV on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 06:26:18 PM PDT

  •  Pay a fine (9+ / 0-)

    rather than actually getting something for your money. Why do Republicans hate their constituents and even their base?

    Get old and do lots of stuff in the process. Half of the fun is trying everything out. --Noddy

    by Debby on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 07:47:53 PM PDT

    •  Yeah (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      True North, Dirtandiron, Debby

      Why are they advocating paying a fine, which has been characterized as a tax?  Idiots!

    •  Or DON'T pay a fine ... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      seefleur, Debby

      At the moment, there's no mechanism by which the IRS can exact payment of this Fine/Tax ... UNLESS the taxpayer is entitled to a refund, of which they can withhold the amount of the "finel".

      Of course any moocher-freeloader Young Immortal who can do simple math can figure out two things ...

      1) Increasing the number of exemptions on your W-2 means there'll probably be no refund the IRS can attach.

      2) The full freight (which comes into force in 2018) of the fine amounts to about 2 months of what high-quality individual premiums cost today.

      Then of course, there's always the reality that one moderately illness   tips the family into bankruptcy ...

      But, y'know, before the States required "mandatory automobile liability insurance" and banks started requiring mandatory Comprehensive for the life of the loan ... a moderately serious auto accident could do the same  (Which is, in part, why we HAVE mandatory insurance for automobiles.)  

    •  No, it is really about mooching (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Debby

      What else would you call it when you refuse to obtain health insurance (with subsidies) and then expect your fellow insured citizens to foot the bill? OOOOoo! I just quoted Romney!!!!

      Keep fightin' for freedom and justice, beloveds, but don't you forget to have fun doin' it. Lord, let your laughter ring forth. Be outrageous, ridicule the fraidy-cats, rejoice in all the oddities that freedom can produce.---Molly Ivins

      by never forget 2000 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 05:00:08 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I had a draft card (6+ / 0-)

    I turned 18 in 1974, which I think is the first year that nobody at all got drafted (in the previous years, I always checked the draft lottery to see what number I would have been).

    Here's the thing about draft cards. You were supposed to have it with you at all times. And it was illegal to burn them, so you could theoretically go to jail. If you did it in public, you could be arrested on the spot.

    --

    I don't understand the point of this protest. This Obamacare card is fake. There are no legal consequences to burning it. What, are kids supposed to ask their grandparents about what it was like in the old days?

    "Stupid just can't keep its mouth shut." -- SweetAuntFanny's grandmother.

    by Dbug on Thu Aug 01, 2013 at 08:36:07 PM PDT

    •  It's symbolic of... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      PsychoSavannah, Dirtandiron

      ...their struggle against reality.

      I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!

      by itsjim on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:24:13 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Excellent point (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Dirtandiron

      If people in that 18-35 age group encounter FreedomWorks protesters of Medicare age, the younger people should ask this very question about the significance of such a protest when it is entirely legal to burn something you printed at home.

      People on Medicare will remember the draft-card burning days. The protesters will also be able to say whether they themselves burned draft cards in those days. (I'm betting: no). And they can say whether they've given up their Medicare or burned their Medicare card.

  •  This is the most hysterical part of the article... (14+ / 0-)

    "Because nothing says Freedom! like spending hours in the emergency room waiting to see a doctor for the burn you got from torching a fake Obamacare card."

    And you KNOW that it WILL happen......

  •  You know what would be fair? (7+ / 0-)

    A universal military draft that the Cheneys of the world could not get out of, and one that prevents the Bushes of this world from enjoying preferential service in National Guard units.

    Want to see people burning their draft cards? Make them all go to war when we go to war, or have the real possibility of going to war. Many civilized nations do this. Of course, many civilized nations also have a universal draft.

    Come on. Even Elvis got drafted. And as a veteran, he probably also had access to the VA.

    When are the Republicans going to understand that "Obamacare" is actually based on their own counterplan to Clinton's health care initiative and Mitt Romney's plan in Massachusetts?

    The GOP hates their own legislation. I guess that's nothing new.

    I resent that. I demand snark, and overly so -- Markos Moulitsas.

    by commonmass on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:23:27 AM PDT

    •  Jimi Hendrix was AIRBONE baby! (4+ / 0-)

      Dunno if he was drafted or just wanted to kiss the sky, but he was in the 101st.

      I'll believe corporations are people when one comes home from Afghanistan in a body bag.

      by mojo11 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:51:42 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  There is nothing wrong with serving your (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        itsjim, ThirtyFiveUp, PsychoSavannah

        country. Baby! Frankly, I think everyone should do it. I'm not pro-war, but I'm pro knowing what war is all about and that anyone in Congress who has a kid of "war age" would know that there kid is going where they send them.

        Every. Single. Overpriveleged. Sonofabitch. Congressman and Senator's kid. Every. Single. One.

        I resent that. I demand snark, and overly so -- Markos Moulitsas.

        by commonmass on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:04:33 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I agree (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          commonmass, itsjim

          I spent my time in the military for that very reason.  Because once in a while there actually COULD be a threat that wasn't totally fabricated by the monied interests.  And nobody should be exempt simply because they're wealthy.  Laugh all you like about the Royals, but both William and Harry have done their time in uniform -- William as an SAR helicopter pilot and Harry as... well... Harry.  And these are heirs to the throne.

          It's real easy to send somebody else's kids in harm's way.  I suspect they'd think a little harder about it if their own were subject to the same rules.  Joe Biden's son shouldn't have to carry all of them dammit.

          I'll believe corporations are people when one comes home from Afghanistan in a body bag.

          by mojo11 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:22:41 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  The great royal houses of Europe have always (0+ / 0-)

            done that. In the Netherlands, all of the royals of both sexes are required to serve in the military in a real and actual way.

            I resent that. I demand snark, and overly so -- Markos Moulitsas.

            by commonmass on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:28:52 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I figured as much (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              commonmass

              but I only knew for sure about the UK.  It seems only fair.  But then, "fairness" rarely enters into the conversation.

              I wonder if this also applies to members of the various European parliaments.  There are countries that have mandatory military service for all able persons.  I think Switzerland is one of them, and maybe Iceland as well.  Not sure about any others.

              I'll believe corporations are people when one comes home from Afghanistan in a body bag.

              by mojo11 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:44:22 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  France, Germany, Austria, Hungary, you name it (0+ / 0-)

                they have universal service.

                I resent that. I demand snark, and overly so -- Markos Moulitsas.

                by commonmass on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:47:13 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  Iceland? (0+ / 0-)

                Lol, we don't even have a military.  ;)

                •  Oh... yeah (0+ / 0-)

                  that's right...  But you WERE part of GWB's coalition, maybe that's what confused me.

                  How hard is it to become an Icelandic citizen anyway? I've always wanted to go there, but I'm afraid I wouldn't ever want to leave.

                  I'll believe corporations are people when one comes home from Afghanistan in a body bag.

                  by mojo11 on Sat Aug 03, 2013 at 07:07:41 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  You first need dvalarleyfi (0+ / 0-)

                    - that is, a residence permit.  Which in the general case means either a job in a technical field or marrying an icelander.  Then you need to live here for the specified length of time - coming from the US, that's 7 if you're single or married to someone who's not an Icelander, 5 years if you're in a registered cohabitation with an Icelander, or 3 if you're married to an Icelander.  The citizenship test includes fluency in Icelandic, although I've heard it's not that hard, and after even 3 years in country you really should be unless you're "one of those" people who never uses the language.

                    Já þýðir já. Nei þýðir nei. Hvað er svona erfitt við það?

                    by Rei on Sun Aug 04, 2013 at 04:12:50 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  Thanks! (0+ / 0-)

                      I guess the hard part is the initial residence permit, eh?  I hope to see the place before I die, regardless.  It's been on my wish list for a long time now.

                      I'll believe corporations are people when one comes home from Afghanistan in a body bag.

                      by mojo11 on Mon Aug 05, 2013 at 01:57:51 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

          •  Harry (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Dirtandiron

            According to news reports, Harry was happy about being sent to Afghanistan. He apparently really likes military life. He was none too happy when someone leaked the information that he was in Afghanistan, which meant he was recalled.

            I've known a couple guys like that, who love serving in the military.

            When Bush was ramping up his two wars, he was also pushing for the wealthiest to pay less tax. So the wealthiest families were not seeing their own sons and daughters go off to war, nor were they asked to do their part by paying even slightly higher taxes.

        •  I think it depends. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Dirtandiron

          From what I've read, Vietnam was one big atrocity, which served no noble national purpose. While I can sympathize with those who were drafted, it has really dampened my spirit for flag waving.

          I think most of the history of subsequent wars is yet to be written. But I doubt that it will be much different.

          I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!

          by itsjim on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:32:49 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  In the sense that it is the government forcing you (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    commonmass, limpidglass

    to do something it isn't a bad analogy.

    How surreal is this getting? What's next? Chants of "Hey, ho. Obamacare has got to go!" at young Republican conventions? Dirty fucking hippies are the now the role models for a new generation of people fighting The Man. Or having health insurance. Which is just like The Man. I guess. Making it even more ridiculous is that you know Clancy and his friends would have been the people bashing the heads of the draft-card burners had they been around back then.
    By the way, there's a flaw in the plan. The money he's telling people to pay in fines will just go back into funding Obamacare for the not really stupid people who do get health insurance. But hey gang, knock yourselves out. Because nothing says Freedom! like spending hours in the emergency room waiting to see a doctor for the burn you got from torching a fake Obamacare card.
    No less ironic is dirty fucking hippies supporting people being forced to give their money to mega corporations.
    •  I oppose the ACA not because I'm a conservative (6+ / 0-)

      or a Paulite, I oppose it because it does not go far enough, and because, in my opinion, private insurance is legalized theft--even with the mandate to insurance companies to use 80 percent of their premium intake for actual care.

      It's a giveaway to private insurance. However, it's also better than what we HAD been getting. But it's not the full answer.

      I was shocked that we didn't at least talk about adopting the "Bismarck Model", which has been used in Germany since, well, Bismarck (in the 19th Century) whereby everyone is covered by private insurance, highly subsidized, and NO CITIZEN can be refused or have their premiums above what they can afford. That seemed a great model for the US, who seems unwilling to simply allow anyone to enroll in Medicare,which would be the best solution. But no. We got a weaksauce Republican plan with a well-meaning Democratic President's name attached to it.

      Still, it's better than the alternative, and perhaps a good midstream measure which at least puts insurance companies on notice that if people pay their premiums--even if they're subsidized--they have to get something in return.

      I resent that. I demand snark, and overly so -- Markos Moulitsas.

      by commonmass on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:30:17 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  the ACA isn't a step towards universal health care (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        commonmass, Heavy Mettle, dennis1958

        The mandate, and the Roberts Court's carefully crafted verdict on it, is a template for future laws that will allow the government, under the aegis of the taxation power, to force Americans to pay part of their income directly to private corporations. Now Congress can pass a law that requires us to pay two percent of our income to Goldman Sachs, for instance. And, according to the Roberts Court, such a law is perfectly constitutional.

        In the next ten years--perhaps even in the next two years--we will see this precedent used in sweeping ways to take our money. This is the real heart of the ACA, the real reason it was passed.

        The rest is just a giant, convoluted exercise in cost-shifting that will take years to shake out fully. Many of the little bits of sugar they sprinkled on top of this steaming pile (such as Bernie Sanders' community health centers) in order to get people to go along have already been de-funded or eliminated. And more are sure to follow.

        The administration seems highly reluctant to enforce anything like a reasonable minimum standard that the plans have to meet. Many things are left up to the states (indeed some exchanges will be state-run) which means that many insurance companies will be able to exploit inconsistencies in the laws to fleece customers.

        Some states, like Washington, are strapped for cash and considering slashing their state public insurance rolls and dumping those people onto the exchanges--which would create a whole new group of people that would need subsidies if they're not to be undercovered. Given that our Congress is currently sitting around debating whether to cut food stamps, I have no faith that they will agree to subsidize those people, should this dumping occur.

        So we could end up considerably worse, in some ways, if these sorts of things happen.

        Bismarck was a conservative who admitted that his goal in creating a national health insurance system was to dampen revolutionary sentiment and buy support for his foreign policy by bribing the working classes with benefits. Would that our politicians were so pragmatic!

        But since we already have a single-payer system that covers the elderly, why not simply lower the age of coverage to zero?

        "In America, the law is king." --Thomas Paine

        by limpidglass on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:04:31 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I totally agree, and my bringing up the Bismarck (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          limpidglass, Heavy Mettle

          model was on purpose. It should appeal to us. But we're even further right than the 19th Century Imperial Germans. WTF? I mean , really ask yourself that.

          I resent that. I demand snark, and overly so -- Markos Moulitsas.

          by commonmass on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:16:50 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  In Britain - pension auto-enrollment (0+ / 0-)
            You open your payslip and your salary is less than usual, quite a bit less. This could be you come October when 10 million employees not currently in a workplace pension scheme will be auto enrolled into one.
            There will though, from October, be a minimum standard with, initially, employees contributing 0.8 per cent of salary (rising in 2018 to 4 per cent), employers 1 per cent (rising in 2018 to 3 per cent) and tax relief accounting for another 0.2 per cent (rising to 1 per cent in 2018).

            But experts say that although most would be best going with the flow of auto-enrolment some should opt-out at the earliest opportunity, preferably within a month. And it seems these groups come from diverse parts of the earnings spectrum.

            "People with expensive debt that needs paying off, for example those who are relying on payday loans or credit cards to survive, may be best getting this in order first

            http://www.independent.co.uk/...
        •  In Britain (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          limpidglass
          June 2010

          The Government has announced that it will end the effective requirement to use a pension fund to buy an annuity by age 75 with effect from December 2011. Pending implementation of the necessary changes, legislation will be introduced in Finance Bill 2010 to increase to 77 the age by which members of registered pension schemes have to buy an annuity or otherwise secure a pension income. This change will also apply for the purposes of the inheritance tax (IHT) charges that specifically apply to pension scheme members aged 75 and over. The increase in the age by which the member must secure an income has effect on and after 22 June 2010.

          http://www.annuities-online.com/...
          •  With that stunt (0+ / 0-)
            members of registered pension schemes have to buy an annuity...[at age 77]
            If medical technology advances so people normally live to 120 you'll have an annuity funded enough to provide for you until around age 82.

            Expect the US to follow on when the Republicans regain national power. It would apply to public pension plans and Social Security.

    •  That's really kinda splitting hairs (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      True North

      especially since the individual mandate has yet to actually make it to the field.  But the protesters burning draft cards were voicing an objection to an unnecessary, unjust and immoral war where we exported death to another country.  These guys are protesting trying to keep people alive.  Should they burn their seatbelts because we have mandatory seatbelt laws?  Or burn their cigarettes because... oh wait.

      I'll believe corporations are people when one comes home from Afghanistan in a body bag.

      by mojo11 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:54:55 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  No more Frank Luntz for these chuckleheaded... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Amber6541

    ...culture warriors. They've obviously moved on to an actual team of comedy writers. The Republicans have shifted the front line of their utilitarian culture war right up to face Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert eye to eye!

  •  The glaring problem with this "rebellion" (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    commonmass, Amber6541, Dirtandiron

    is that it's oligarchs who came up with it in the first place. Kinda backwards, no?

    It's here they got the range/ and the machinery for change/ and it's here they got the spiritual thirst. --Leonard Cohen

    by karmsy on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:26:25 AM PDT

    •  It is a massive giveaway to private insurance (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      atana, happymisanthropy, karmsy

      and just wait for the scandals when some large companies think they can flout the restriction of spending 80 percent of premiums on actual care. There will be a court challenge, and it will come from insurance companies, and Democrats and Republicans alike will totally cave. Just watch.

      I mean come on. "Obamacare" was pretty much written by Newt Gingrich, at least the basis of it.

      Again, as I said, it's better than nothing. But lots of things are better than nothing. Calling this a victory for progressives is like calling wet "dry".

      I resent that. I demand snark, and overly so -- Markos Moulitsas.

      by commonmass on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:38:55 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It's astroturf, like modern movement conservatism (0+ / 0-)

      in general.

      Where are all the jobs, Boehner?

      by Dirtandiron on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 02:25:59 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Uh, sure, refusing to be (4+ / 0-)

    drafted to go to Vietnam and kill/be killed and refusing to buy insurance so you can (uh, at a loss for the point here) sounds like the same thing to me.    

    These people are nucking futs.

    The thing about democracy, beloveds, is that it is not neat, orderly, or quiet. It requires a certain relish for confusion. Molly Ivins

    by MufsMom on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:26:38 AM PDT

  •  really they should be burning their Medicare cards (14+ / 0-)

    since Medicare is the "socialized medicine" that they rail against so vehemently, while the ACA does not even remotely resemble socialism.

    And unlike fictitious "Obamacare cards", Medicare cards have the virtue of actual existence.

    But of course they're not going to give up their Medicare. Even though it is the closest thing to "socialism" that we have in America.

    "In America, the law is king." --Thomas Paine

    by limpidglass on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:27:11 AM PDT

  •  enlisting young adults to overpay, so other people (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    commonmass, Dirtandiron

    What a freakin' load of crap.

    Those "other" people are -- ummm -- you.

    It's really pitting young you vs old you, all for the benefit of the insurance company.

    There is, however, a legitimate question of freedom here.  People should not have to contribute to the profitability of insurance companies and the utterly corrupt American health care system.

    I wonder -- will it be any easier to learn the price of a procedure once ACA comes into full force?

    I doubt it.

    LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

    by dinotrac on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:28:34 AM PDT

    •  The whole theory of "insurance" is ... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      PsychoSavannah

      instead of putting aside gold coins and other objects of real value,  to hedge against a predictable future disaster than might happen at any time ... you make regular contributions to a "risk pool"

      Y'know:  if 1 in 10 sailing ships never makes it back from the Slave Coast ... each shipowner puts 1/8 the value of his ship and cargo into a fund ... and in the event of a mishap  Mssrs. Lloyd (of London) cover 7/8 of the loss.

      That, of course was when Lloyde's was still operating out of a coffee house, and their operating overhead consisted of  coffee, cakes, and tipping the waiter.  Before long the "Underwriters" came to realize that the more they spent on administration and overhead, the wider the spread between the premium and the benefit could be.  Insuring things got VERY profitable.

      (I read, to my shock that the spread on an average Homeowners' policy "keeps" 60% of premium value and pays only 80% of actual loss.  By contrast, Obamacare mandates a 15% "keep" for the insurance "house.")

      So ... (seems to me) that what's "unfair" is a population of low-risk individuals staying out of the pool until the near-certainty of illness in old age makes jumping in a good bet.  In the meantime, should the worst happen: there's always bankruptcy, "indigent patient funds", and even Medicaid -- stuff "everyone else" pays for, one way or the other.

      •  There is nothing at all unfair about that. (0+ / 0-)

        Those low-risk individuals will age into higher risk individuals.

        It is essentially us screwing ourselves.

        LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

        by dinotrac on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 10:05:27 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Isn't there a provision that allows anyone to (0+ / 0-)

          provide proof they can self-insure, and opt out of Obamacare?

          •  I don't know. That would be interesting, but I (0+ / 0-)

            wonder what the self-insurance criteria would be.

            LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

            by dinotrac on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 10:58:58 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Sure: pay the trivial "fine" - (0+ / 0-)

            And believe me ... compared to any illness or injury beyond the sniffles and boo-boos level of severity ... the ACA Fine/Tax IS "trivial."   At the moment, in my case, it amounts to less than one months' free- market, individual health insurance premium

             Better than that: there's no mechanism by which the IRS can collect it from a taxpayer who isn't owed a refund for overpayment of income tax.

            Then, if one has a change of fortune ... or does not actually have the wherewithal to pay -- there's always Bankruptcy Court.

        •  Depends on which "us"you mean is "being screwed." (0+ / 0-)

          If you mean: Young Immortals will become Decrepit Oldsters and THEN will pay the full freight for their insurance/care ...

          Well, under the current system, when those Young Immortals have accidents or develop expensive  diseases,  those with good incomes and rich assets DO pay for themselves.  And they pay "list price" ... two or three times more than an insurance company or government agency pays.

          But for those who AREN'T  100%ers or better ...  they pay as much of their bills as they can ...  (one hopes and trusts) ...  and the outstanding balance is passed on to "others."  Then legal and collection costs must be added to the bill that's passed along.

          Of course, there is no assurance that ALL Young Immortals will grow up to be Masters of the Universe.  

          Some will remain hourly employees and day laborers all their lives -- no more able to pay "full freight" medical bills than when they were 20-somethings.

          And for them -- there's OTHER "others" who pick up the difference.

      •  In the USA (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        PsychoSavannah
        Benjamin Franklin helped to popularize and make standard the practice of insurance, particularly against fire in the form of perpetual insurance.

        In 1752, he founded the Philadelphia Contributionship for the Insurance of Houses from Loss by Fire.[19]

        Franklin's company was the first to make contributions toward fire prevention.

        Not only did his company warn against certain fire hazards, it refused to insure certain buildings where the risk of fire was too great, such as all wooden houses.

        http://en.wikipedia.org/...
        Perpetual insurance is a type of homeowners insurance policy written to have no term, or date, when the policy expires. From the effective start date, the coverage exists for perpetuity. The insured deposits money, called a deposit premium, with the insurer for insurance for the life of the risk. The deposit is many times larger than the cost of a non-refundable, annual premium for an equivalent policy with a one-year term.
        In the United States, there are also tax advantages to perpetual insurance. The deposit premium does not yield any income to the insured. However, the expense of the annual premium for term homeowners insurance is eliminated. Therefore, the tax-adjusted, equivalent rate of return to the insured homeowner on the deposit premium can be calculated by taking the gross amount of money he or she needs to earn to net the amount of an annual premium for a term policy, divided by the amount of the deposit premium. For example, a house which costs $150,000 may typically be charged an annual premium of $1,000 for a term policy. That same house would likely require a $10,000 single deposit premium for a perpetual insurance policy of equivalent coverage.
        http://en.wikipedia.org/...
        •  As they tought us in High School Civics (0+ / 0-)

          The ability of insurance companies to offer Perpetual or disappearing-premium  contracts rests on their ability to invest the money at a rate of return that covers the pay-outs, overhead and profits.

          My father (born 1931) had such a policy ... but in his lifetime the rate-of-return dropped, while actuarial life span increased.  Long story short:  the "paid up" policy began to charge premiums again.

          During most of my working life, FDIC insured savings payed a percent or two above real inflation ...  with stocks and bonds offering even better returns.

          But in 2000, I suddenly noticed my mutual funds were returning  0.45% on investment.  Today, ,my credit union is offering under 1% on a 1 year CD, less than 2% on 5 year. A conventional savings account pays less than half a percent.

          And the real rate of inflation?   2%,?  3%.  And is that the market basket that includes a lot of high-tech electronics ... or the cost of food, clothing, shelter, education and medication ?

          So ... sure.  Self insurance and Perpetual insurance DID, at one time,  offer an attractive alternative for those with the wherewithal to take advantage of it.

          Is it still possible in the New Normal of the Global Economy ?

          might offer

    •  Some states might fold in the medical (0+ / 0-)

      portion of automobile liability medical coverage.

      It would be fairer to younger people to include automobile medical liability coverage in exchange coverage.

      Mr. Young Invincible might be 100% healthy, but he might hit somebody with his car.

      [Also Aetna and United would have a bigger base of premiums to extract a percentage from.]

      In Florida medical liability coverage is only required up to a long outdated $10,000/person. The state might raise it and make exchanges issue policies covering the increase.

  •  On parents insurance until 26, just what "students (8+ / 0-)

    are there left on campus at that age and what younger people will refuse FREE insuance?

    this will be a test of the stupidest kids on campus

    •  Exactly my friends with kids under the age of 26 (5+ / 0-)

      are loving Obamacare and the coverage they get under their parents' apologies especially since a few of them are in grad school and need that coverage before they start a job.  2 of my friends' kids went straight to grad school after undergraduate degree and this is a godsend for them.

      Join PA Liberals at http://keystoneliberalsforum.aimoo.com/

      by wishingwell on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:48:05 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  They haven't got a clue. I guess this must be (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    happymisanthropy

    another "outreach" program. Next their talking heads will be saying "groovy" in every interview and they'll wan to bring back Laugh-In.

    "We must all hang together or most assuredly we shall all hang seperately." - Benjamin Franklin

    by brae70 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:34:12 AM PDT

  •  The Young Libertarian Party (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    HappyinNM, Dirtandiron

    Now I know why so many of my wife's nephews and nieces call themselves "libertarian". It's just an extension of what they were when slightly younger -- selfish.

    I'm glad the Republicans have found yet one more group of dupes to fleece.

    The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.

    by The Lone Apple on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:34:54 AM PDT

  •  There's another flaw in the theory (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    wishingwell, Satya1, Dirtandiron

    The military (a) doesn't have a draft and (b) doesn't have draft cards.  Any able-bodied male between 18 and 26 must register with Selective Service, but you don't get a draft card because... there's no draft.  Or maybe you do now... but you didn't back in 1979 when I had to register.  But what with unemployment being what it is, especially among the demographic that would be targeted in a general conscription order, the military has no shortage of cannon fodder, and certainly not enough of one to warrant a draft.

    Just another feeble attempt to co-opt a movement that actually made a difference.  Which might be a good strategy if the cause wasn't ... just dumb.

    I'll believe corporations are people when one comes home from Afghanistan in a body bag.

    by mojo11 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:37:11 AM PDT

    •  I went to the office in downtown Balitimore (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Dirtandiron

      when I was about 18 in October 1976 and was told I didn't have to register.

      •  Registration was reinstated in 1979 (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Dirtandiron

        during the hostage crisis in Tehran but only for males born in 1960 or later, so you'd have been safe.  I would have too if I'd been born 6 months earlier.  But they didn't issue draft cards, they just sent reminders out every year that if you moved or lost a limb or something that would change your draft status, you had to let 'em know.

        I'll believe corporations are people when one comes home from Afghanistan in a body bag.

        by mojo11 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 01:26:27 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Republican Party Platform 1936 (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Amber6541, SingleVoter, Dirtandiron

    Read it and laugh.  The GOP will never change.

    For three long years the New Deal Administration has dishonored American traditions and flagrantly betrayed the pledges upon which the Democratic Party sought and received public support.

    The powers of Congress have been usurped by the President.

    The integrity and authority of the Supreme Court have been flouted.

    The rights and liberties of American citizens have been violated.

    Regulated monopoly has displaced free enterprise.

    The New Deal Administration constantly seeks to usurp the rights reserved to the States and to the people.

    It has insisted on the passage of laws contrary to the Constitution.

    It has intimidated witnesses and interfered with the right of petition.

    It has dishonored our country by repudiating its most sacred obligations.

    It has been guilty of frightful waste and extravagance, using public funds for partisan political purposes.

    It has promoted investigations to harass and intimidate American citizens, at the same time denying investigations into its own improper expenditures.

    It has created a vast multitude of new offices, filled them with its favorites, set up a centralized bureaucracy, and sent out swarms of inspectors to harass our people.

    It has bred fear and hesitation in commerce and industry, thus discouraging new enterprises, preventing employment and prolonging the depression.

    It secretly has made tariff agreements with our foreign competitors, flooding our markets with foreign commodities.

    It has coerced and intimidated voters by withholding relief to those opposing its tyrannical policies.

    It has destroyed the morale of our people and made them dependent upon government.

    Appeals to passion and class prejudice have replaced reason and tolerance.

    To a free people, these actions are insufferable. This campaign cannot be waged on the traditional differences between the Republican and Democratic parties. The responsibility of this election transcends all previous political divisions. We invite all Americans, irrespective of party, to join us in defense of American institutions.

  •  Trying to talk people out of health care. (3+ / 0-)

    Making health care sound like a waste of money, better spent on a fine.

    Evil scum-fucks.

    I guess they forgot that this was their own fucking healthcare plan, dreamed up by the Heritage Foundation.

    The tent got so big it now stands for nothing.

    by Beelzebud on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:38:07 AM PDT

  •  My guess... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dirtandiron

    This "movement" will be a monumental failure.  There will be some rallies and fun videos on Fox News of 'patriotic rebels', made up of the same Teabagger bus tours that show up at all the right wing protests, burning their "Obamacare Cards".  The mainstream media will follow the story, as well, in their half assed way.

    But the majority of those folks, either through their employment plans, retirement plans, or Medicare/Medicaid, are already covered.

    If I had to take a guess, people without health insurance because they can't afford it will be running to get it and the, "why should I have to buy what I don't want in 'Murica?" folks represent a small minority.

  •  Ok, Clancy, take the boys and surround the house. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    PsychoSavannah, Dirtandiron

    I need Bugs after that surreal horseshit.

    "Skip the exchange, pay the fine."

    That's their entire governing strategy in the age of the Black President.

    Ayn is the bane! Take the Antidote To Ayn Rand and call your doctor in the morning: You have health insurance now! @floydbluealdus1

    by Floyd Blue on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:42:56 AM PDT

  •  The American Right Wing (4+ / 0-)

    has been co-opting the political tactics of the '60's Left since the '60's Left left the '60's.

    They've gone from literally beating down Abbie Hoffman for his perceived desecration of the American flag by wearing an American flag shirt, to wearing Abbie Hoffman's American flag shirt. You see it everywhere on college campuses with the College Republicans to CPAC and their annual orgy of insurrection.

    This doesn't surprise me......... they have no ideas of their own.

    What does surprise me is the ease in which they mimic a movement that they supposedly loathe.

    I wish them all the luck in the world. They're still playing to a dying demographic.

    •  I'm old enough to remember that, too ... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Dirtandiron
      They've gone from literally beating down Abbie Hoffman for his perceived desecration of the American flag by wearing an American flag shirt, to wearing Abbie Hoffman's American flag shirt.
      It's like they are perpetually 20 beats behind, they never catch up and yet when they arrive they think they wrote the song in the first place. The stupid never ceases to amaze ...

      "Let us not look back to the past with anger, nor towards the future with fear, but look around with awareness." James Thurber

      by annan on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:14:12 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  It might work (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Amber6541, Dirtandiron

    There are millions of suckers voting Republican every election.

    If you wave a gun, a bible and a flag in front of them they screw themselves over every time.

    So, we can laugh at the stupidity of this but the reality is that lies like this work all the time.

  •  C'mon kids! It's "hip" and "with it!" (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Amber6541, annan, Dirtandiron

    You think kids want to come with their parents and take fox-trot lessons? Burning fake Obamacare cards! That's what the kids want!

    What'll be hilarious is getting a half dozen College Republicans together on a corner of the quad to burn their fake Obamacare cards, and then realizing that none of them actually have anything they can light them on fire with.

    Bet we'll see TV news footage of them using those long BBQ grill lighters to do it.

  •  The cool thing about an Obamacare card (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Norm in Chicago, Dirtandiron

    is that it looks exactly like a Social Security card.

    As a matter of fact, it is.

  •  It is such an insult to those from the Vietnam (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Amber6541, annan, HappyinNM, texasmom

    Era who went to jail  for their beliefs.  It is an insult to their courage for taking a stand. I am appalled having lived through this time where my friends were either serving in the military, going to jail rather than serve, burning their draft cards and going to jail because of that action, or leaving all their family and friends and college behind to go to Canada or moving out of the country. It is an insult to all conscientious objectors.

    Join PA Liberals at http://keystoneliberalsforum.aimoo.com/

    by wishingwell on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:49:59 AM PDT

  •  A bit of bright health care news from NC..... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    annan, True North

    NC officials approve 67 subsidized health plans

    Read more here: http://www.newsobserver.com/...

    Even BCBS which runs North Carolina along with Duke Energy is going to have to "put up".

    About time,  but I'll take the "wait and see", approach...

    “The comfort of the rich depends upon an abundant supply of the poor.” - Voltaire.

    by LamontCranston on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 08:57:34 AM PDT

  •  This is John Birch Society all the way. (3+ / 0-)

    For all the libertarians on this site trying to force the dialog to your world view I would like to point out that this is a part of it, this paranoia and nihilism.

  •  Evidently Dean Clancy has no clue how pool (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    annan, texasmom

    insurance works:

    “The whole scheme is enlisting young adults to overpay, so other people can have subsidies,” Clancy says. “That unfairness reminded us of the military draft.”
    Pool insurance, which is what most private health insurance works, would fail without a large percentage of customers that do not make large claims. It's also known as "spread the risk."

    In fact, the main reason that Medicare was created was to insure the elderly who had effectively been kicked off their private health insurance by premiums so high they could no longer afford them. The for-profit companies didn't want the elderly because they diluted the pool.

    Form follows function -- Louis Sullivan

    by Spud1 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:03:54 AM PDT

    •  Exactly! (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Spud1

      To make this point, I often point out that I'm 56 years old and have only met my annual deductible twice - when each of our children was born.  So I've paid (at least partially) for insurance for over 36 years for the peace of mind it brings me - and never begrudged anyone else their insured medical care.

      Isn't that why we have home insurance, flood insurance and auto insurance?

      The truth always matters.

      by texasmom on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 11:09:54 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  End the War On The Middle Class, ... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dirtandiron

    just like we ended the War in Vietnam, fight injustice, force the privileged to do their part...embrace Obamacare, make America a better society.


    I shared 96% of my DNA with a chimpanzee. In return, the chimpanzee gave me a banana. There is no duty more indispensable than that of returning a kindness.

    by glb3 on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:05:01 AM PDT

  •  #NEEDS #MOAR #HASHTAGS (0+ / 0-)

    "If you mean time-traveling bunnies, then yes."

    by here4tehbeer on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:05:17 AM PDT

  •  I still have my draft card ... (0+ / 0-)

    And one reason for that is ... during the Vietnam Unpleasantness, burning one was, of itself,  a felony -- and (so it was believed) a sure way to get YOUR file moved to the top of the Draft Next pile.

    In any event, draft card burnings were fairly rare occurrences.  Often they were the centerpiece of major public demonstrations.  You might even get a teary kiss on the cheek from Joan Baez and a manly handshake from some recently-released Draft Resister or Civil Rights Celebrity.

    Any way you cut it ... at the time LITERALLY "burning your draft card"  (as opposed to filing an SS-99, Conscientious Objector Status application form) was a significant, newsworthy, and somewhat heroic thing to do.

    Oh ... !!! Duh.  I guess that's why the Freedomworkers are doing the modern parody.  (Someone ought to tell them that the "girls who say yes to boys who say no" now have grandkids in the Occupy Movement."

    Now ... for what it's worth ... a Selective Service Registration care is NOT a 3 1/2 x 8 flimsy ... it's a 2 1/4 x 3 1/2 card stock -- just like the Social Security card ... and somewhat sturdier than a Medicare card ... but not as indestructible as an ATM card.

    Of course, Freedomworks isn't the first to make this mistake.  I once modeled for a cover of True Confessions Magazine: "I may have burned my draft card, but I know your sins too -- Dad !"   Yeah!  Hip and Timely, too !!

    Of course our photographer had an excuse: in his artistic judgement little 2x3 cards wouldn't "read" as well in print as big white 3x5's -- and he didn't want his models burning their fingers.

  •  Si and I went to the circus... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    HappyinNM

    Si got hit with a rolling pin
    Si and I got even with that circus
    Bought us a ticket and never went in


    i just baptized andrew breitbart into the church of islam, planned parenthood, the girl scouts and three teachers unions. - @blainecapatch

    by bobinson on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:23:25 AM PDT

  •  Hey! Ho! BHO! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dirtandiron

    We defend the status quo!

  •  The Teabaggers in Steven Colbert's video (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dirtandiron

    and their stage set looked eerily like the 700 club of televangelists.

    Coincidence? I think not.

    In a world of the blind, the one eyed man is a pariah. Ask Galileo. Ask Darwin.

    by OKParrothead on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:38:21 AM PDT

  •  I wonder (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    texasmom, Dirtandiron

    If they can tell the difference between war and health care

    “The Republicans believe in the minimum wage — the more the minimum, the better.”-Harry S Truman

    by Generic Democrat on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 09:45:04 AM PDT

  •  Republicans & Koch Bros. need to look (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dirtandiron

    in the mirror.  They ARE the man and no self-respecting rebellious youth is going to take direction from them.  

    Plus, apparently they have forgotten that the youth of America have watched their parents struggle to pay medical costs and make ends meet.  But then, Republicans always underestimate the intelligence of everyone who isn't them.

  •  Young people don't need insurance? (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    HappyinNM, SingleVoter, Dirtandiron

    Sadly, here is a list of fundraisers we have attended (or otherwise supported) since July:

    Fundraising lunch and dinner (different days) for teenage girl seriously injured in accident.  She was hospitalized in pediatric ICU for 21 days and has now graduated to a regular room.  She is in a halo and will need extensive rehab. The family has NO insurance on the children.

    Fundraising dinner for 20-something girl with cancer.  She has NO insurance.

    Fundraising lunch and golf tournament (different days) for 20-something young man recently diagnosed with aggressive cancer.  He has NO insurance and is self-employed and unable to work.

    This Sunday:  Lunch & silent auction for family of young boy killed in auto accident.  He was hospitalized for less than 48 hrs.  but ran up several hundred thousand dollars of medical expense, plus the funeral & burial.  The family has NO insurance.

    This Sunday afternoon:  Bake sale for 8 yr. old girl who suffered a massive stroke and will be hospitalized and in rehab for up to a year.  The family has NO insurance.

    Life is fragile.  No young person thinks "it" will happen to them - but I see it all around.  Americans should NOT have to pay medical bills with fundraisers.

    The truth always matters.

    by texasmom on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 10:10:32 AM PDT

  •  Wow great framing (5+ / 0-)

    i hope they roll this out  when Obamacare starts

    this is actually great framing

    a person can pay for health insurance
    or they can pay NOT to have health insurance

    this puts the two choice in stark contrasts
    either you pay and get NOTHING
    or pay and get insurance

    "Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative." - John Stuart Mill

    by smartone on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 10:18:48 AM PDT

  •  The right-wing churches will issue (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ChadmanFL

    fine exemptions because they don't like abortions:

    FINE EXEMPTION CERTIFICATE

    This document issued with the PPACA in mind certifies that [blank]:
    1. loves Jesus
    2. accepts Jesus as his savior
    3. fervently opposes the murder of babies inside and outside of the womb
    4. opposes the PPACA in good faith because it subsidies and pays for the murder of innocent babies

    Issued by [blank2], pastor of The Church of the Baby Lovers on this [day] of [month] in the year of our Lord [year]

  •  They are STILL pissed off that they (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dirtandiron

    were on the wrong side of the Vietnam War. Shamed, trampled, made to look like clowns, fools and moral lightweignts, played by the Republican Defense Contractors.

    This is the same reason Limbaugh co-opts the "Four Dead in Ohio" theme for his insane ranting show. They were wrong, they were blindsided, they hitched their wagon to a dying horse, and they looked like, and now look like utter fools.

    "The Conquest of Cool," by Thomas Frank says it best:

         "Regardless of the tastes of Republican leaders, rebel youth culture remains the cultural mode of the corporate moment, used to promote not only specific products but the general idea of life in the cyber-revolution. Commercial fantasies of rebellion, liberation, and outright "revolution" against the stultifying demands of mass society are commonplace almost to the point of invisibility in advertising, movies, and television programming. For some, Ken Kesey's parti-colored bus may be a hideous reminder of national unraveling, but for Coca-Cola it seemed a perfect promotional instrument for its "Fruitopia" line, and the company has proceeded to send replicas of the bus around the country to generate interest in the counterculturally themed beverage. Nike shoes are sold to the accompaniment of words delivered by William S. Burroughs and songs by The Beatles, Iggy Pop, and Gil Scott Heron ("the revolution will not be televised"); peace symbols decorate a line of cigarettes manufactured by R. J. Reynolds and the walls and windows of Starbucks coffee shops nationwide; the products of Apple, IBM, and Microsoft are touted as devices of liberation; and advertising across the product category sprectrum calls upon consumers to break rules and find themselves."

    And so, its PERFECT to burn your Obamacare Card, whatever that is, because it was so COOL for the hippies and yuppies and the Cool Kids to burn your Draft Card in 1968, but their grandparents, holding the estate and the will as a sword of Damocles over the heads of these Young Republicans, forbid it. Now, they can reenact history, and THIS time, be COOL!

    Figures don't lie, but liars do figure-Mark Twain

    by OregonOak on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 11:24:39 AM PDT

  •  So, they are trying to get people (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dirtandiron

    To refuse health care/insurance, while many of the leaders who are promoting this get health care provided for them by taxpayers?

    Yeah, how many will listen to this?

    Let these "leaders" go first, amirite?

    Women create the entire labor force. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sympathy is the strongest instinct in human nature. - Charles Darwin

    by splashy on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 12:38:20 PM PDT

  •  Because being sent to die in rice paddy in Vietnam (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    texasmom, Dirtandiron

    is just like being forced to buy private health insurance.

  •  I'll bet a lot of these young people get insurance (0+ / 0-)

    BECAUSE of Obamacare forcing insurance companies to allow dependents on their coverage until they're 26.

    Intelligence agencies keep things secret because they often violate the rule of law or of good behavior. -Julian Assange-

    by ChadmanFL on Fri Aug 02, 2013 at 03:01:42 PM PDT

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