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Based on observation, our President categorizes people into two groups:

1. Peers to be treated with great respect, such as bankers and other people of great wealth, and other US politicians save for non-authoritarian Democrats. These are people he can work with to solve problems, there is give and take.

2. The governed, whose opinions are of no consequence.  This group includes the press, leaders of countries in the Southern Hemisphere, and the rest of us. Like sometimes-unruly children, we must be taught that he is the daddy, and he will have his way.

Witness Obama's struggle to cut Social Security, which he began a month before taking office, and continues to this day. No matter how hated this effort is by the 99%, no matter how obvious it's become that his proposals will cause some of our aged to go hungry, he continues to cook Social Security's books to claim that it needs "reforms".

Witness the freezing out, even the arrest, of those who wanted a workable solution for health insurance reform.

Witness the war of intimidation against the press.

Witness the widely-hated Trans-Pacific Partnership, a treaty so wretched and destructive that Elizabeth Warren tells us it has to be kept secret or else people would demand that negotiations cease.

Now witness Obama's pledge to "reform" Spy On Everyone, the program he's steadfastly defended. It is a program run for group 1, against group 2.  The "reform", by his own admission, will only be around the program's PR, and Clapper will be in charge of it.  Is this any different than putting Simpson and Bowles in charge of proposing "reforms" for Social Security?  The outcome is decided, and it's not one that most Americans want.

In fact, I can't think of a single issue regarding us little people that Obama's ever changed his mind on, ever stopped fighting to get his way on. His rigidity regarding us children seems absolute.

So I suppose that we can hoot and holler, but unless we pry the Presidents hands off of his security apparatus' levers with a crowbar, ain't nothing changing until 1/20/2017.  And if, God help us, a Republican takes the oath of office that day, he or she will have some pretty awful precedents involving suppression of civil liberties and the press that will allow for some incredible mischief.

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Comment Preferences

  •  You want to know why? (0+ / 0-)

    Because it is the only choice we have. I know, we all thought that the evil Bush was just being, well, evil. Nope. The choice is: use a ton of infrastructure, mechanics, and most important, lives to preempt all the terror threats. Or profile terrorists. You know look at all the Muslims and subject them to special scrutiny just because of their religion or ancestral home, or even surname. We'll that wouldn't fly at all. So we just spy. Spy comprehensively and totally on everyone to make sure the nation is safe while not being discriminatory. This is why little old ladies get patted down in airports. It may or may not be the correct way to go about things, but the truth is, Bush wasn't so bad after all (in this regard). He was just first.

    •  You really bought into the BS, didn't you? (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RuralLiberal, kbman

      I have no idea exactly when it happened, but Americans have become terrified cowards.

      "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire

      by Greyhound on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 08:35:28 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I would think it is those (0+ / 0-)

        who cower at the thought that their government may know one tenth as much about them as do Google and Amazon, who are the true cowards in this situation.

        I think they should grow up and realize life is not a suspense movie. The world is not full of giant conspiracies around every corner. The Matrix is actually a work of fiction.

        Here's my take on it - the revolution will not be blogged, it has to be slogged. - Deoliver47

        by OIL GUY on Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 03:14:31 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Choice. The capacity to say "No". (0+ / 0-)

          I don't fear them either, though, and you assume they know far more about me than they do.

          Amazon doesn't even know I exist as I don't interact with them at all, and I take steps to frustrate Google's efforts to gather data and build a profile on this user location. They are blocked from putting anything on my system that isn't required to use their search portal on the rare occasions that I use them at all, and even then what data they collect from my systems is corrupted and useless.

          But the bottom line is that neither of them can come into my system without my consent, or break down my door and haul me off for any or no reason.

          Terror is a tactic and the criminal actions taken by insane religious nuts are matters for police and the legal system, not the military.

          "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire

          by Greyhound on Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 07:47:14 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Well (0+ / 0-)

        What is your rational for liberals (Obama, Pelosi, et.a;.) doing and defending the exact same thing(s) the neocons did and were pilloried for?

        •  Neither the President nor Pelosi are liberals. (0+ / 0-)

          They are slightly less horrible authoritarian defenders of the ruling class parasites that own our nation.

          They're players on the team we are supporting, while Bohner and (pick somebody else, McConnel?) play for the other team, while the owners of the game do what they will regardless of the wishes of the people that elected them.

          "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire

          by Greyhound on Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 07:34:16 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  How can you hope for anything to change (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bronte17

    if you basically just called for removing Obama as President. NSA needs to change, but if you want action to be done now is the time for all of us to gather and start a new movement similar to Occupy. Instead of calling for impeach now is the time to gather in all 50 states. Martin Luther King Was a great role model. Learn from those who have truly caused change.

    Wisdom is the result of knowledge through reason and understanding of common sense. Do you have Wisdom or seek it?

    by LonelyPagan1 on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 07:15:38 PM PDT

    •  Can you point out where in the diary (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      quill, RuralLiberal, kbman

      a call for impeachment wad made?

      Exaggerations and reading words into a diary that aren't present do not help foster productive discussion.




      Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has to be us. ~ J. Garcia

      by DeadHead on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 07:48:19 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Typo: *was* not 'wad' (0+ / 0-)




        Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has to be us. ~ J. Garcia

        by DeadHead on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 07:49:21 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  title (0+ / 0-)

        Spy On Everyone" ain't changing while Obama's President

        Obama will be President till the next election. 3 more years unless you are saying impeachment. That title screamed impeachment because you are saying that change can not happen while Obama is in office. Change can happen one just has to work together.

        Wisdom is the result of knowledge through reason and understanding of common sense. Do you have Wisdom or seek it?

        by LonelyPagan1 on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 07:55:33 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Not what I was intending (0+ / 0-)

          Although I suppose that one could infer that we have two shitty choices: a Spy On Everyone state for at least 3 years, or remove Obama from office.

          Both ugly, ugly.

          But do you disagree with the observations?

          •  I do because I remember the Clinton Years (0+ / 0-)

            Obama has been better then Romney would have been. Bill Clinton wasn't the best President, but he did good things as well just like Obama has done good things. I do not agree with both of them on every issue to think what the alternative would have been scares me even more. I rather have Obama then a Republican and I rather make change happen over NSA by working together with other Dems to bring people by starting a new Occupy movement around NSA in order to change it then just say get rid of the President.

            Wisdom is the result of knowledge through reason and understanding of common sense. Do you have Wisdom or seek it?

            by LonelyPagan1 on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 08:14:24 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  Absurd. Try this reading: (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          RuralLiberal, kbman, Valar Morghulis

          "Obama isn't going to change course on this, so it'll be the status quo until the next president takes office."

          Your extreme reading is a bit of a stretch.

          Impeachment is impeachment. Plain and simple. The word wasn't mentioned once in the diary.

          Nice try, though.




          Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has to be us. ~ J. Garcia

          by DeadHead on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 08:21:21 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Sorry, but the only screaming was inside your own (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          RuralLiberal, DeadHead, kbman

          imagination. The diary clearly points out that this is the way it will remain until 1/20/2017.

          "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire

          by Greyhound on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 08:38:58 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  Protecting Obama's "street cred" should not (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    kbman

    be the primary or secondary  goal of anyone here. I say BRAVO to you MannyGoldstein for having  the guts to "speak truth to power on such a "pro Obama" site. Many here seem to care more about Obama's image and how he will look to "history" . They will gladly trade  Single Payer health and a  Public option for the repackaged Heritage Foundation plan we call ObamaCare; allow him to put  Social Security on the table;  swap our Civil Liberties for the illusion of safety.

    It would seem that the "Replacement Liberals" rule the day.

    •  This is what turns people off (0+ / 0-)

      The NSA story isn't about protecting Obama or anything. When you label someone you are causing others not to want to help make real change happen. NSA is a issue that is hard for people to understand because of the way things have happen. Honestly it's also people name calling each other that are causing the issue. Instead of name calling you want real change don't name call help me get a movement going around all 50 states to help change NSA. Real change is action not name calling.

      Wisdom is the result of knowledge through reason and understanding of common sense. Do you have Wisdom or seek it?

      by LonelyPagan1 on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 08:01:52 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  No, it's what turns YOU and perhaps (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        RuralLiberal, quill, kbman

        a few others off.

        You need to better familiarize yourself with the genesis of this story on this site, prior to drawing conclusions about what is or is not the "cause of the problem."

        Name-calling is an unfortunate side-effect, not the cause.




        Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has to be us. ~ J. Garcia

        by DeadHead on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 08:26:48 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  The "more effective of two evils". (0+ / 0-)

    Here is a link to a debate between Glen Ford and  Micheal Eric Dyson:

    http://www.democracynow.org/...

    Dyson made the "lesser of two evils",  argument and Ford called Obama "the more effective of the two evils"   because he got your vote and managed to put in play most of the old GOP plans they could not get through (Heritage Foundation Health Care, Cap and Trade...).

  •  I agree with this sentiment/assessment (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    huntergeo, Valar Morghulis

    Lately,  it's become clear that Obama has a serious patriarchal streak, and he's certainly not listening to anyone in category 2. I guess he doesn't have any reason to even pretend to care anymore.

    History repeats itself, first as tragedy, second as farce - Karl Marx

    by quill on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 07:58:34 PM PDT

    •  The strategy was pure brilliance, I must admit (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      quill, Valar Morghulis

      Obama campaigned from the bottom up in a sense, getting tens of thousands of committed volunteers and millions more making small donations and feeling like they were building an unstoppable movement. It made the volunteers and small money donors feel more politically empowered than they had ever felt in their lives. And there was an assumption that his governance would follow the same pattern of empowering the little people with leadership that focused on them and their needs for once. But it was all an illusion, a presumption that was monumentally wrong.

      Free: The Authoritarians - all about those who follow strong leaders.

      by kbman on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 11:53:30 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I think the loose stone in this dam (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    RuralLiberal, DeadHead, quill, kbman

    is the Amazon's cloud service.  Boycott them and bring down their bottom line to the point that big investors squeal like little piggies, and you'll see more movement on the NSA front than all the "IMPEACH OBAMA" petititions in the world could generate.  Get the corporate bosses of the Democratic establishment (AND the Republican establishment) to tell them what to do.

    That's where I think this is ultimately headed, if there's any hope at all.  People like Dianne Feinstein have their patrons in the military spying industrial complex that will cover for them, but they may not have the firepower that the tech industry has to overpower them and insist on change.

    Kind of sad that we have to look at our politics through such a dirty cynical prism, but I guess it's always been this way in history in some respects.

    •  It may be too late to ever regain market share (0+ / 0-)

      By the time we get meaningful change the business will have all fled already. And even if we DID get the surveillance state tamed, who would believe us or trust us that that was truly the case?

      I think the fallout from this is just beginning and is going to be monumental in its scope and impact on our economy. The greedy bastards have screwed the pooch royally. And I say greedy bastards because those "earning" disproportionate wealth are ultimately the clients of the surveillance state - keeping the riff-raff in line in case anybody sticks their head up and threatens the new social order.

      Free: The Authoritarians - all about those who follow strong leaders.

      by kbman on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 11:59:09 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  And yet, after 4 1/2 years, he still hasn't (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jan4insight, doroma

    cut SS. He hasn't grabbed all the guns up, neither. So, there ya go.

    I'd like to start a new meme: "No means no" is a misnomer. It should be "Only 'Yes' means yes." Just because someone doesn't say "No" doesn't mean they've given consent. If she didn't say "Yes", there is no consent.

    by second gen on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 10:03:01 PM PDT

    •  You underestimate him. (0+ / 0-)

      He's still got 3.5 years left --  plenty of time to make some headway, at least on the first one you mentioned.




      Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has to be us. ~ J. Garcia

      by DeadHead on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 11:28:45 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Yep. You sound just like the folks who are (0+ / 0-)

        sure that any minute now, Obama is going to come knocking on their door and confiscate their gunz.

        I'd like to start a new meme: "No means no" is a misnomer. It should be "Only 'Yes' means yes." Just because someone doesn't say "No" doesn't mean they've given consent. If she didn't say "Yes", there is no consent.

        by second gen on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 11:43:48 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  And you (0+ / 0-)

          sound just like those folks who categorize people without knowing what the fuck they're talking about.

          With a bit of 'enabler' mixed in for extra flavor.

          It's easy to dismiss the opinions of people like you, so you have that going for you, at least.




          Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has to be us. ~ J. Garcia

          by DeadHead on Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 02:39:46 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  shorter title: "spy on everyone ain't changing" (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Greyhound

    the deep state is as the deep state does.

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