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Talk about wanting it both ways.  Because President Obama and the Dems haven't caved into their demands over the debt ceiling, and because they don't want the economy to tank while they're using it as a threat, the GOP is out in full force claiming now that a default wouldn't be a big deal at all.  

So if it's not a big deal - than why do they use it as their ultimate leverage?  Obviously they know it's terrible results, and knows that President Obama and the Dems know, so want to threaten Obama and Dems with it, but don't want to be seen threatening great hurt on the American and World economies by using it - so they tell their rubes that it's really not a big deal.  

They're literally wanting it both ways - and the MSM doesn't seem to all out such a glaring inconsistency.  

Either it's really bad consequences and Obama better cave in "negotiations" because he has no choice, or it's not all that bad in which case how did they expect to get that leaked laundry list of demands in the first place?  

And the GOP is so damn short-sighted here, because if they recognize and accept that it is really bad and Pres Obama and the Dem's don't blink (God, I hope they don't), it means the GOP will (hopefully) have to cave on October 16th and get nothing in return (or very little) at which point their voters will be pissed at them for caving at all given the consequences of the fall out - they were told by the same GOP - were minimal.   Boehner and the GOP are setting themselves up for a huge backlash to seemingly try to buy time now.  

Either it's very bad, or it isn't.   But they want it both ways.  It's bad so the President should give in to all these GOP demands, but it's not bad so if America defaults it's not a big deal.  So essentially if you take their claims at face value they're demanding extreme concessions from the President for a result that if happened wouldn't be a big deal at all.  

Why would they think that would work?

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Comment Preferences

  •  Tip Jar (8+ / 0-)

    Glenn Greenwald promotes far-right fringe extremist group The Oath Keepers - https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/statuses/377787818619064320

    by Jacoby Jonze on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 07:14:09 AM PDT

  •  Because one side of the mouth doesn't what the (6+ / 0-)

    other side of the mouth is saying.

    Notice: This Comment © 2013 ROGNM UID 2547

    by ROGNM on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 07:18:08 AM PDT

  •  Complete cognitive dissonance (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Kevskos, Hey338Too

    But this stuff about the default being no big deal is a fairly new development.

    There seems to be some growing consternation in the pundit caste and economic sectors as they watch this new group think delusion take over.

    It's like watching a group of farm boys standing on a barn with homemade wings who have actually convinced themselves that they can fly.

    “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR

    by Phoebe Loosinhouse on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 07:25:32 AM PDT

    •  It's a negotiating tactic. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      litigatormom, bythesea

      In order for the debt ceiling hostage taking to work, Republicans must convince President Obama that they're actually stupid enough to push the country into default.

      "Default wouldn't be that big of a deal" is pretty well convincing that they are, in fact, that stupid.

      29, white male, TX-07 (current), TN-09 (born), TN-08 (where parents live now)

      by TDDVandy on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 07:45:41 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  That may be true because (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        litigatormom

        when you watch them, you can't stop asking yourself over and over- "no one could really be this stupid, could they?"

        It's certainly innovative to use as a negotiating technique your own imbecility and to convince a nation, that, yes, you really are that stupid.

        “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR

        by Phoebe Loosinhouse on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 08:01:52 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  The downside for them (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          bythesea

          is that it's a negotiating tactic that makes it appear as though they should not be running the country without adult supervision.

          29, white male, TX-07 (current), TN-09 (born), TN-08 (where parents live now)

          by TDDVandy on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 08:14:09 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  Prioritization is their goal (0+ / 0-)

      The GOP thinks that the debt and the military will keep getting paid, and everything else -- all those nasty entitlements that we don't really need -- will not. Which is what they really want. Just as we had 6 months of sequester because they wouldn't conference on a long term budget, now they figure they can get indefinite prioritization. And their stupid enough to think prioritization will be easy.

      •  And then they will become the British (0+ / 0-)

        in the Potato Famine who had to step around the bodies in the streets.

        Do they want to engender the everlasting bitterness and hatred of basically 70% of society (minimum)?

        This is their goal?

        “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR

        by Phoebe Loosinhouse on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 09:03:49 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  i think this is known as "flailing" (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bythesea

    er, normal gop posturing, that is.

  •  Just wait. By Oct. 17 the Dems will cave. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    limpidglass

    The GOP knows debt default is a big deal.  They are just trotting out the debt default deniers to make the Dems think they are crazy enough to go over the brink.  

    It's Machiavellian power politics.  They aren't dumb or crazy.  They created the crisis on purpose with two goals in mind:

    (1) to shrink government as much as possible (by that they mean cutting non-defense-related and non-corporate-subsidizing domestic spending).

    (2) purely to have a crisis because it will make Obama look weak.  That's why the right-wing media machine is working overtime to call it the "Obama shutdown", etc.  Any damage to the economy or pain to Americans will likewise be blamed on Obama for not negotiating.

    The GOP has no reason in the world to change their stance.  What does Obama intend to do when Oct. 17 rolls around?  

    I don't see what the Dem strategy is.  I fear that in the end the result will be further caving to Repubs in the form of scaling back Obamacare (which is already a weak and silly program) and cutting spending on programs that help working Americans.

    •  They'll pass a short-term raise of the debt limit. (0+ / 0-)

      Then they'll re-negotiate the budget and Obama will save what he can of Obamacare in exchange for shafting middle-class Americans with Soc Sec, Medicare and/or chained CPI.

      The net result will be higher taxes for lower-income Americans and an accelerated wealth transfer to the 1%.

      Sound familiar?

  •  Perhaps they are not telling the truth (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    FiredUpInCA, bythesea

    Just a thought

  •  Come on, give us what we want! (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Kevskos, FiredUpInCA

    But if you don't... well, the hostage will probably live if we shoot him, so what's the big deal?

    29, white male, TX-07 (current), TN-09 (born), TN-08 (where parents live now)

    by TDDVandy on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 07:42:21 AM PDT

  •  The President on Tuesday (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Theodore J Pickle
    The only reason that the Republicans have held out on negotiations up until the last week or so is because they thought it was a big enough deal that they would force unilateral concessions out of Democrats and out of me. They said so.

    They basically said, you know what? The president's so responsible that if we just hold our breath and say we're going to threaten default, then he'll give us what we want, and we won't have to give anything in return. That's not -- again, that's not my account of the situation. You can read statements from Republicans over the last several months who said this explicitly.

    And -- and so for them now to say, well, it wouldn't be a big deal if it -- if it happens -- that's not how they've been acting over the last couple of months. And if it's not a big deal, then why would I give them concessions now to avoid it? It is a big deal. And nobody should be getting concessions for making sure that the full faith and credit of the United States is retained.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/...

    "I am not interested in picking up crumbs of compassion thrown from the table of someone who considers himself my master. I want the full menu of rights." (From "You Said a Mouthful" by Bishop Desmond Tutu - South African bishop & activist, b.1931)

    by FiredUpInCA on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 08:25:41 AM PDT

  •  All they want is to have a "conversation". (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    FiredUpInCA

    What does an extortionist ask for, after the victim refuses to pay up? Calls the victim and makes some demands.

    What does the extortionist do after the victim refuses to have that conversation?

    Maybe they'll send us a few of Lady Liberty's fingers in the mail. Or her ear. Or both.

    Maybe they'll force her PINS out of her, run up her credit cards and drain her bank accounts.

    Oh, wait.

  •  they think it means automatic balanced budget (0+ / 0-)

    Teabaggers think that hitting the debt ceiling means no more federal government debt can be issued ... so presto, the feds can't spend more than they take in as taxes, so the budget is automatically balanced.

    Either Obama gives them what they want, or they take all that and more when the government can no longer [legally] live beyond its means.  They believe that the government will continue to pay interest on existing debt, so there won't be any problems with our creditors.

    Teabaggers don't see eye to eye with the billionaires on everything, and the debt-based financial system - of which a continuous issuing, retiring, and reissuing of US government debt is an important part - is one of the big points of departure.  They think it's just not real: a toy that the rich and the government both use to make money out of thin air for their own purposes, thus screwing the little guy who works hard, lives simply, and plays by the rules.

    Domestic politics is the continuation of civil war by other means.

    by Visceral on Wed Oct 09, 2013 at 10:42:50 AM PDT

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