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A recent post on Daily Kos "Did you get a gun for Christmas" http://www.dailykos.com/...

Pointed out that under current laws, you can't just go on line and put a gun in your online shopping cart and have it shipped to your door.  The only way to buy a gun not in person is to have the transfer (sale) run through an Federal Firearm License holder (FFL - dealer) which would require a background check. (and record of the weapon - registration light)

This means Aunt Sue can't go to the local gun shop and buy a gun for little Billy and have it shipped to him either, with out the background check.  

In a reply, I pointed out that there is a way to sort of get around this and have a gun shipped to your door.

More (lots more) after the Squiggle.

Yeah, that was a teaser, but thanks for reading.

The way an average gun owner would buy a gun is to go in person to the store, pick out the gun and go through a background check. In general, each state has requirements for that state. For example, in New Hampshire this is all that is needed - show up, don't be a felon or other prohibited person, be the right age, and have money.  New York requires an owners permit before you can pay for the handgun, you get run through the background check, get a document to take to the sheriff who sells you a coupon and annotates your "new" pistol on your owners permit, which you then take back to the dealer and pick up your gun.

If a gun owner buys a gun from someone out of state or on line, the person selling the gun has to ship it to a Federal Firearm License (FFL) holder near the buyer.  The buyer then has to have a background check from that FFL holder.  So the buyer has to find a dealer near him, pay a fee to 'run the gun through the books', and have a background check done.

The way around this, sort of, is to become an FFL holder called Curio and Relic Firearms.  C&R for short, or "cruffler".  

C&R weapons are primarily firearms that are 50+ years old and have some historical significance. The BATFE defines what is and what is not a C&R weapon. C&R weapons can be bought and shipped right to the license holder's door. Many find that collecting and refinishing these old firearms is a great and relatively inexpensive hobby. (or a very expensive one)

This kind of FFL is not a dealer.  You can't be in the business of selling and buying guns.  You can, resell guns you have or have restored, but not to the point it is a business.  (Many Cruffler's don't sell the guns as much as trade or partial trade them - such as I'll trade you an Ithaca Model 37 Pump S/N USA1972 and $150 for your West Virginia Centennial Colt .45.)

The idea is that Curio's and Relics are not things you find at your local dealership.  You won't be able to find them in person but rather through the phone, mail, or inter webs.  To help you complete a collection or restore something, this allows you to buy directly and have it sent to you with out the added cost and time of finding dealers at both ends.

So, what does it cost? How hard is it to get? What kinds of guns can you get? What about importing Ammo?  And Could this be abused by a gun nut?

First answer is simple: $30 for three year license.

How hard is it to get?  
I'm told it is very easy.  (Full honesty here, I've only just found out about C&R's and will be applying in Feb to get one.)  To get one the BATFE will approve the license if: you are over the age of 21. Are not prohibited from handling or possessing firearms or ammunition. (meaning a felon, dishonorable discharge, illegal alien, user of federally prohibited drugs, renounced your US citizenship) You have not violated the Gun Control Act or its regulations. You have not failed to disclose information or facts in connection with their application. (lying about something or just not filling out the form completely) And you have premises for conducting business or collecting. (since you're not conducting business, just collecting, you can't be homeless.  and no, having a storage locker won't cut it.)

You also have to let the BATFE know that what you plan on doing is not "prohibited by State or local law in the place where the licensed premise is located."  (if local law says no business can be conducted in a house in your area due to zoning, and you want to sell C&R guns from your bedroom, you can't.)  Also within 30 days after the application is approved the business will comply with the requirements of State and local law applicable to the conduct of the business. (comply with the local laws)

The BATFE also requires you to certify that you have sent or delivered the form to the chief law enforcement officer where the premises are located notifying the officer that the applicant intends to apply for a license.  [NOTE: you have to let them know you're GOING to apply for a license.  Not get their approval. They have no say in your getting approved or disapproved.]

That is it.  Fill out the form, send a copy of the form and a letter to the Sheriff (or Chief Law Enforcement Officer in your area), check your zoning, and pinky swear to comply with state and local laws. Oh, and pay $30.

Now keep in mind, you are not conducting a business.  Your goal is to enhance your collection, not make a living or a "little walking around money".  That is bad juju and could end up winning you a trip to Club Fed.

What kind of guns can you buy with a C&R?  The BATFE says: Weapons "of special interest to collectors by reason of some quality other than is associated with firearms intended for sporting use or as offensive or defensive weapons." To be recognized by ATF as a C&R firearm, a firearm must fall into at least one of the following three categories:

1) Firearms manufactured more than 50 years prior to the current date, not including replicas

2) Firearms certified by the curator of a municipal, State, or Federal museum that exhibits firearms as curios or relics of museum interest

3) Any other firearms that derive a substantial part of their monetary value from the fact that they are novel, rare, bizarre, or because of their association with some historical figure, period, or event. Proof of qualification of a particular firearm under this category requires evidence of present value and evidence that like firearms are not available except as collector's items, or that the value of like firearms available in ordinary commercial channels is substantially less.

It is important to point out that the BATFE says: Firearms automatically attain C&R status when they are 50 years old. Any firearm that is at least 50 years old, and in its original configuration, would qualify as a C&R firearm. It is not necessary for such firearms to be listed in ATF’s C&R list. Therefore, ATF does not generally list firearms in the C&R publication by virtue of their age. However, if you wish for a classification of your particular firearm under categories (b) or (c) above and wish your item to be listed, you may submit the weapon to the Firearms Technology Branch (FTB) for a formal classification.

1963 was not that long ago.  So that Marlin .222 semi-auto sport model with detachable magazine that was in production from 1957 to 1962 is now a C&R.  However, the BATFE has a nice list last updated in 2007, and five amendment updates up to 2010 here: http://www.atf.gov/...

As you look through the list, you will see some very rare guns.  Those, if you can find them, will run in the thousands of dollars to buy.  Others, like the very popular SKS or K98 Mauser might run you $150 plus shipping for a well used model. (go to http://www.gunbroker.com and do a search for C&R guns, most will run in the $500 to $1,500 range, but $6,000+ is not uncommon.)  There is no requirement for these guns to be non-functional.  In fact if they are "de-milled", they don't often end up for sale.

Ammo importation.  You can't import ammo to the US with out a special license…except if the Ammo is a C&R item. (the list of types is in the link with the gun list)

As for the last question: Could this be abused by a gun nut?  Well, yeah.  But the BATFE does a background check before giving the license, and each renewal.  The C&R holder has to keep a "bound book" of all weapons shipped to them or sold/transferred to someone else, and turn that over to the BATFE on demand.  If the person receiving a gun is not an FFL or C&R holder a background check has to be done by the Seller (the C&R holder).

It is possible that a C&R person could hand over guns to a prohibited person, but this is unlikely. It is more likely that they will be a target of theft because by definition, they are collecting guns, meaning having more than one.

I hope that gives you some idea of the current laws on gun ownership and sales. A bit of understanding will better help everyone when we look at gun laws and how to stop illegal guns.  In general, you can't ship a gun across state lines, and the system to do so requires a background check.  This looks like a loophole, but is not really.

Ok. I'm ready for both sides of the RKBA to go nuts on this.

Originally posted to Drill Sgt K on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 05:03 AM PST.

Also republished by Right to Keep and Bear Arms, Firearms Law and Policy, and Shut Down the NRA.

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Comment Preferences

  •  The craziest thing about this diary is this: (10+ / 0-)
    1963 was not that long ago.
    I can't believe that 1963 was 50 years ago.

    All kidding aside, this is a very informative diary.  The system is riddled with loopholes.

    I blog about my daughter with autism at her website

    by coquiero on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 05:12:37 AM PST

  •  These guns are not the problem. (3+ / 0-)

    There seems to be at least an attempt to keep this stream clean.
    It's the Iron River, the conversion of legally owned modern guns into crime guns, that needs to be addressed.

    If I ran this circus, things would be DIFFERENT!

    by CwV on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 05:22:17 AM PST

  •  Excellent diary (6+ / 0-)

    Very informative. I can't imagine anyone on either side taking exception to an educational diary.

  •  Question for the author: (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    exlrrp, Neo Control, theatre goon

    Where have you seen a K98 or SKS for sale for $150?

    Because that is a steal.;)

    Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.

    by FrankRose on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 05:51:09 AM PST

    •  Paid $200 for my Kar98 (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      LilithGardener, FrankRose

      At Cabelas. I thought it was a good deal. Its postwar Czechoslavakian so not that much historical value.

      I collect wall hangers from WWI (Yes I know my Kar98 isn't that old)    Ihave 5 now. Bought them for decoration but I'm getting interested in collecting them now

      Still looking for a good Springfield 03, now THEYRE expensive---cheapest Ive seen was $800

      Happy just to be alive

      by exlrrp on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 06:45:27 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  $800 for an 03 (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        LilithGardener, exlrrp

        I would have to see the gun, but that is a deal.

        "Success is a dangerous as failure, hope as hollow as fear" - Lao Tzu

        by anotherroady on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 08:04:47 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  a buddy just picked up an og Remington bayonet (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        LilithGardener, exlrrp

        with the og sheath ww1 for the model of 17...found it for a bill on fleabay.....about 200 cheaper than normal....

        Mine is og and remington but with a ww2 Aussie sheath...still looking for a ww1 sheath for it....I got it in trade for a very rare full length AFH 1942 Garand bayo that didn't get the recall and cut down to 10".......

        A good non low number shoot-able 03 is a steal at 800....

        Same friend just found a type I Arisaka 6.5  an Italian built Arisaka very similar to the Carcano and pretty rare.

        Vaya con Dios Don Alejo
        I want to die a slave to principles. Not to men.
        Emiliano Zapata

        by buddabelly on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 12:49:21 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  Nice diary. Informative, factual. Republished to (6+ / 0-)

    RKBA.

  •  Too late. (0+ / 0-)

    We have allowed the gun industry to sell billions of guns over the past 3 decades, and anybody, anywhere can buy a gun.  Kind of like buying pot 10 years ago.  Not really difficult.

    We missed the boat on gun regulations.  That ship sailed decades ago, and we are a nation of gun owners.

    " With religion you can't get just a little pregnant"

    by EarTo44 on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 06:29:10 AM PST

    •  A pessimist an oppotimist and a realist walk into (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      We Shall Overcome

      a bar. As they enjoy their libations they talk about the long journey ahead of them...

      "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.” — William Arthur Ward

      "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.” — William Arthur Ward

      by LilithGardener on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 08:42:42 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Straw purchase loophole - someone can have (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    coquiero

    another person stand in for them, perform the background check and a gun can be mail-ordered and delivered directly to that person's doorstep.

    A few extra steps are needed, but a gun can be mailed directly to someone's doorstep without a background check being performed on the ultimate recipient.

    "Looking back over a lifetime, you see that love was the answer to everything." — Ray Bradbury

    by We Shall Overcome on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 06:35:25 AM PST

    •  Except this would be the worst way to (4+ / 0-)

      go about that:

      A C&R FFL has to maintain records on what weapons he owns and who they are transferred to; a nonlicensed individual does not. There would be much less of a paper trail if this was done outside of the C&R process.

      The mail delivery portion is irrelevant, frankly. It's the paperwork that brings down straw purchasers.

    •  So you're saying that making laws is pointless (0+ / 0-)

      because people will break them?
      Irony.

      Quick Hint: Its not a 'loophole' if it is illegal.

      Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.

      by FrankRose on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 07:56:14 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Not at all. If that were the case, then following (3+ / 0-)

        that logic would lead to no laws - absurd.

        I'm simply saying, loopholes, ways around the laws, breaking laws, insert whatever description you like, do exist.  

        To answer your question, some people will chose to break the law. Most people follow their better angels, but that's not a good reason not to try to better regulate the firearms industry and in this case strengthen a weakness in the system.

        "Looking back over a lifetime, you see that love was the answer to everything." — Ray Bradbury

        by We Shall Overcome on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 08:55:10 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  What is this statement: (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Wordsinthewind

          "I'm simply saying, loopholes, ways around the laws, breaking laws, insert whatever description you like, do exist." not true of?

          You just described what might be the least likely scenario to commit a crime that has ever existed; apparently perpetrated solely to have an antique firearm delivered to the home.

          Trying to use this issue (and-wrongly-referring to it as a 'loophole') illustrates that there is literally no reasonable level of gun control you would be willing to accept.

          Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.

          by FrankRose on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 09:06:58 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Ba-dum-chh! (3+ / 0-)

            How can you make a sweeping conclusion such as this after only reading a few blog comments that amount to only 100 words or so?

            Straw purchases are a problem. Here's a report that details that problem and proposes solutions. Please read this, then you can have a better idea of what I think about this issue. Thanks.

            This report presents findings from an investigation into one of the main ways criminals get
            guns: Straw purchases (when one person poses as the buyer of a gun that is actually for
            someone else). The report was prepared by the Mayors Against Illegal Guns based on inves-
            tigative work by the James Mintz Group. It presents 12 specific findings showing how some
            licensed gun dealers sell handguns to illegal traffickers through straw purchases - which could and should be prevented.
            http://www.mayorsagainstillegalguns.org/...

            "Looking back over a lifetime, you see that love was the answer to everything." — Ray Bradbury

            by We Shall Overcome on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 10:10:06 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  You described the most absurd imagined scenario of (3+ / 0-)

              a 'straw purchase' of an antique for a home delivery.

              Nowhere in your Bloomberg website does it say anything about home deliveries of antique firearms for nefarious purposes.

              Sounds like you better call 'CSI: Antique Roadshow Division" to handle this.

              Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.

              by FrankRose on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 10:21:49 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  Oh, you misread what I wrote and then didn't (3+ / 0-)

                read a follow up comment in that thread where I pointed out that I was referring to straw purchases generally and not specifically to antique guns, which was the subject of the diary, so I can understand your confusion.

                Yes, it's a little off the subject, but certainly related.

                Sorry for the confusion, I hope this clears it up for you.

                "Looking back over a lifetime, you see that love was the answer to everything." — Ray Bradbury

                by We Shall Overcome on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 10:25:00 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  As exciting as your admittance is that you decided (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Kasoru, Wordsinthewind

                  to completely ignore the diary's subject, while commenting on the diary itself....

                  This:

                  Straw purchase loophole - someone can have (1+ / 0-)
                  another person stand in for them, perform the background check and a gun can be mail-ordered and delivered directly to that person's doorstep.
                  is wrong.

                  1) Without an FFL a firearm isn't 'delivered directly to a persons doorstep'. The FFL holder can only have firearms delivered to the address listed on his license.
                  2) It's not a 'loophole' if it is illegal. You are describing an illegal (and virtually impossible) scenario.

                  Hope this clears it up for you.

                  Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.

                  by FrankRose on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 10:52:37 AM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Oh, gosh - I'm sorry, you seem to have misread (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Sharon Wraight, coquiero

                    what I wrote again - or made an incorrect assumption.

                    Yes, the firearm has to go through an FFL, that's correct. The point is that the straw purchasers can go to the FFL to pick it up and deliver it to the doorstep.

                    So, a person can indeed mail order a firearm from home and have it delivered to them without ever leaving their home. I'm not sure how often this happens, but the larger issue is that of straw purchases.

                    And, yes, my apologies for incorrectly calling this a loophole - you are right, straw purchasing is breaking the law and we should do all that we can to stop these because they are some of the primary ways criminals, domestic abusers and other violent and dangerous people acquire guns.

                    Again, I refer you to another excellent source on the subject:

                    According to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF), straw purchasers “represent a significant overall crime and public safety problem.”4 When a person with a clean background intentionally buys firearms for prohibited persons, she or he thwarts the background check requirement and allows firearms to be funneled to criminals, domestic abusers and gangs.5
                    http://smartgunlaws.org/...

                    "Looking back over a lifetime, you see that love was the answer to everything." — Ray Bradbury

                    by We Shall Overcome on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 11:02:56 AM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  I didn't misread what you said: I directly quoted (0+ / 0-)

                      you.

                      You cannot have a gun delivered directly to your doorstep without an FFL.
                      I'm glad I could clear that up for you....and I'm glad to watch you do your damnedest to try and justify your factually incorrect statement.

                      You never fail to disappoint.;)

                      Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.

                      by FrankRose on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 11:40:05 AM PST

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  I suppose you haven't had enough time (2+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        Sharon Wraight, coquiero

                        to read those reports, there's a lot in there. So, in a nutshell, a straw purchase is when someone purchases for you. So, for example, a roommate:

                        A and B live at the same address - "A" can pass a BC and "B" cannot. The official transaction is done by A and once it's delivered to the doorstep, A gives the firearm to B, and the result is that B has mail ordered a firearm and had it delivered to the doorstep.

                        But again, this is just about a small sliver of the problem, as you aptly pointed out. The much larger problem is straw purchases, in general:

                        Wachtel says one of the most common ways criminals get guns is through straw purchase sales. A straw purchase occurs when someone who may not legally acquire a firearm, or who wants to do so anonymously, has a companion buy it on their behalf. According to a 1994 ATF study on "Sources of Crime Guns in Southern California," many straw purchases are conducted in an openly "suggestive" manner where two people walk into a gun store, one selects a firearm, and then the other uses identification for the purchase and pays for the gun. Or, several underage people walk into a store and an adult with them makes the purchases. Both of these are illegal activities.

                        ... The next biggest source of illegal gun transactions where criminals get guns are sales made by legally licensed but corrupt at-home and commercial gun dealers. Several recent reports back up Wachtel's own studies about this, and make the case that illegal activity by those licensed to sell guns, known as Federal Firearms Licensees (FFLs), is a huge source of crime guns and greatly surpasses the sale of guns stolen from John Q. Citizen. Like bank robbers, who are interested in banks, gun traffickers are interested in FFLs because that's where the guns are. This is why FFLs are a large source of illegal guns for traffickers, who ultimately wind up selling the guns on the street..

                        http://www.pbs.org/...

                        "Looking back over a lifetime, you see that love was the answer to everything." — Ray Bradbury

                        by We Shall Overcome on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 12:02:41 PM PST

                        [ Parent ]

  •  I got my C&R a couple of years ago (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LilithGardener, DrillSgtK

    And it is as simple as the diarist says.  I haven't actually used it, but if the prices ever go back down, I'll be in a position to expand my collection.

    I would like to try out one of those WW2 Nagant rifles, but the prices are still 30-40% up over pre-Obama prices.

  •  Good diary, T&R (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    KVoimakas, LilithGardener

    Happy just to be alive

    by exlrrp on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 06:52:23 AM PST

  •  Terrific diary, I've been curious (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    DrillSgtK

    about this category of FFL license and just haven't had time to do more than a cursory search. I thought about including it in my Christmas gun diary but thought it would make the diary too long. You may have missed my replyto your comment, inviting you to write about it.

    Hi DrillSgtK, please expound a bit for n00bs (2+ / 0-)

    if you have time. And consider writing a diary on the Curios & Relic Federal Firearms License. What's involved? How much does it cost?

    I'm delighted you mentioned this. I've wanted to learn more about it, but it would have made the diary too complicated. In our hypothetical No. 3 - what if Grandpa has a C&R license, and the heirloom gun qualifies as a C&R gun?

    Great minds... and all that. So I'm delighted to read this diary.

    "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.” — William Arthur Ward

    by LilithGardener on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 08:51:31 AM PST

  •  This is one part of federal gun law that makes (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    We Shall Overcome

    a lot of sense to me. This introduction is great and I hope you'll report again later on your experience of the application process.

    Republished to Firearms Law and Policy

    In hypothetical No. 3 from Did you get a gun for Christmas? Grandpa (in Virginia) wants to continue a family tradition and gift an heirloom gun to his 14 year old granddaughter (who lives in New York).

    Let's suppose that he has a Curios & Relics license. What are their options? The 14-year old girl can't apply for a C&R, but what about the parents?

    Can the parents apply for a C&R license to facilitate transfer of just one gun. At $30/3 years that sounds very reasonable.

    "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.” — William Arthur Ward

    by LilithGardener on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 08:58:53 AM PST

    •  Easier to ship to a dealer, I think (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      FrankRose, LilithGardener, KVoimakas

      Most dealers (FFL businesses) will transfer guns between themselves to facilitate a private interstate sale (for a fee, of course). As long as the NY recipient is allowed to own the firearm (and passes a background check at the destination dealer), it could be done that way, and thus avoid the hassle of getting a federal permit in addition to anything NY might require. This presumes that the gun itself is legal in NY (and the NY SAFE Act does have a curios & relics provision, if I recall correctly).

      And if they already have any NY paperwork necessary, it would also be faster.

    •  Grand-pa's plinker (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      LilithGardener

      At the Federal level it is pretty straight forward.  It gets messy at the state and local level. (I just moved a few months ago and am learning my new state's laws.)

      Your heirloom gun, more than 50 years old, likely qualifies as a C&R.  The transfer would be ok for Gramps to give to the Adult the granddaughter lives with. (till she is 18, a long gun can't be owned by them)  Granddaughter will not be able to get a C&R as she is not 21. The Adult might, but since you're talking one rifle, one time, it would be better to simply use a local FFL.

      Or, you could conduct the transfer in person in VA.  This would not require a FFL or shipping.  The transfer would be to the adult of course.  The thing to be really careful with is the local NY laws.  Rochester has some very strict laws on rifles, Horseheads follows state law only.  (i lived in NY for 10 years, had a permit for upstate pistol carry, and when living in NYC did the "kept the rifles and shotguns upstate" thing.)

      Now keep in mind, this is a transfer between to private citizens. In person, with good knowledge of the qualifications of the receiving person to own a firearm.  As such, VA does not require a background check.  Connecticut requires ALL transfers to undergo a background check.

      Officially, Granddaughter can't own the gun for four more years if it is a long gun, till she is 21 if it is a pistol.

      I understand that situation.  My 8 year old daughter "owns" the .22 Winchester 1903 that I was given when I was 9 years old.  I got it from my mother who received it when she was 7 from her father who got it in 1921 when he was 8 from his dad (my great-grandfather) who got it as a gift for his 7th birthday in 1904.  I was the first "underage" person to "own" the rifle.  For all but legal purposes, she is the owner of the rifle, I have to ask her permission to shoot it.

      That is hard for some people to accept.  It stays with the rest of the weapons in the house (a mounted fire resistant safe - we have a bit of a crime problem in our neighborhood, i'm not going to let them have easy access to more guns), but when she wants to shoot it, we make the time to go to the range or farm.  It was an easy transfer each time, all done in person in states that did not require 100% background checks.

      New York use to have an exemption for internal family transfers, mostly for estate transfers, but i'm not 100% on the new SAFE law and its aspects.

      Stupid question hour starts now and ends in five minutes.

      by DrillSgtK on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 08:25:10 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  I have a C&R license. (7+ / 0-)

    Two small points.  The notification to the local chief law enforcement officer is so that if they have recent info that the applicant should be denied, they have a chance to let ATF know about it.

    Second, any C&R firearm I might order can be sent only to the address on my license.  So I can't order a Mosin-Nagant 91/30 and say ship it to my cousin Billy.  When it arrives I must, by law enter it into my book.  If I later get rid of it, that must go into the book showing who it went to.

    At any time ATF can check my book and do an inventory of the C&R firearms I have.  If they don't match, well, hello fines and prison time.  Trying to game the system is so not worth it.

    Fight 'em 'til hell freezes over, then fight 'em on the ice. -- David Van Os

    by Naturalized Texan on Tue Jan 07, 2014 at 09:24:44 AM PST

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