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First, let me say that I realize this may be the wrong forum for me to ask this question, because pretty much everyone here is a clear-headed, thoughtful, logical individual, but just about every conservative blog that I've gone onto has banned me....

Maybe someone here has an idea on this.

How exactly does a business determine who IS and IS NOT a homosexual???

I'm scratching my head over this one.

Sure, sometimes, its easy; if you see two men or two women walking hand in hand, OK you may make your assumptions.


What if two men walk into an establishment and they're NOT holding hands?

Is someone going to ASK them if they have a case of Teh Ghey??

Is there going to be a specially designated hostess at the door with a Bible for swearing on, to assure that the people are telling the truth?

What if the two men REFUSE to answer that question? What then?

What if four women with short -cropped hair come in?

What if they're four straight women from Luke AFB??  Are they going to be questioned??

What if Michael Sam gets drafted by the Arizona Cardinals and he and five other guys go to a "Christian" restaurant?  Are they going to say "OK, you four can stay, but this guy has to leave."

What if they go to a restaurant, get served and start eating, and then another wonderful Christian suddenly looks at them and says "Hey, you're Michael Sam! I don't want you in here! You're distracting my meal!!"

Will management then kick them out?

What about contractors? If you're an HVAC company, are you going to have your phone people ask whether or not the household is one with gay cooties before you agree to send a workman out??  

Is Arizona going to have gay/not-gay fountains and shit?

See, that's the whole thing -- gender choices are not immediately visible.

There are people I worked in offices with who were gay and I didn't know until something came up like an announcement on email saying "Jim in accounting and his partner Mike are tying the knot." and I'd be like, I didn't know he was gay!
Because I'm really not worrying about what my co-workers are doing in their private lives.

So if I can't tell after working with someone for months, how is some business owner supposed to tell who is gay and who isn't?

Does anyone have a clue as to this stupidity??

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Comment Preferences

  •  I was wondering that, too (4+ / 0-)

    but I think the bottom line was the services for gay weddings- bakeries, photographers, venues, etc.

    I think those services who have no problem catering to anyone who is willing to pay should launch heavy advertising announcing they will not discriminate.

    There are alot of people ready, willing and able to boycott- so I'm sure they would be just as willing to use the services of the companies who will not 'turn away the gay".

    Growing old is inevitable...Growing up is purely optional

    by grannycarol on Mon Feb 24, 2014 at 10:47:31 AM PST

  •  Well, the bill doesn't say anything about LGBT. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    sfbob, Cassandra Waites

    It basically says a business can refuse to serve anyone who violates "their religeous beliefs" (or something like that).  So, can they refuse to serve women in short skirts or low cut tops? Anyone who covers their head for their own religeous beliefs?  Long haired hippy freaks? Maybe they will put signs on their businesses so we know who to ignore when shopping.

    “To the world you may be just one person, but to one person you may be the world.”-Brandi Snyder (in memory of my Nick)

    by YellowDogInGA on Mon Feb 24, 2014 at 10:56:45 AM PST

    •  I suppose some sort of labeling system would work (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Wee Mama

      A sign in the business window with a notice and a set of symbols as appropriate...

      "We do not serve..."

      (Two guys holding hands)

      (Woman with short skirt)

      (Interracial couple)

      (Person with large "A" on forehead)

      (I'm not sure what symbol could be used for the divorced-and-remarried)

  •  This seems unserious (4+ / 0-)

    What's not to understand?  Its behavior based.. like we've seen a LOT of discriminatory actions in the past.

    A couple comes in for dinner and shows any kind of public display of affection... customer complains, or maybe they don't.. and the manager tells them to leave.  Like dancing in a nighclub or eating in a restaurant or holding hands in a museum or kissing at a Dodgers' game.

    Or just forcing LGBT couples to sleuth out some business that will take their business or risk being humiliated for trying to do things like hire a florist or buy a wedding dress or hire a bakery.

    or maybe its not even you.  I mean gay adults are just that: Adults.  And they know how to handle bigoted assholes, even though they shouldnt have to.  How about humiliating a child by refusing to allow it to attend day-care because its parents are FREAKS.

    Don't minimize this down to to some absurd "Are they gonna have some kind of gay questionnaire at the hostess booth" level of silliness.

    This shit happens and now they want to make sure that it is protected behaviour and the Teh GAYZ know, loud and clear, that the Law and thereby society, is NOT ON THEIR SIDE.

    Красота спасет мир --F. Dostoevsky

    by Wisper on Mon Feb 24, 2014 at 11:01:45 AM PST

  •  Well there's this: (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dave in Northridge

    The US Supreme Court has this thing about laws which permit discrimination. Ask the people behind California's Proposition 14 (1964) what their experience was. Or if you want to get really geeky, do a Google search on "Reitman vs Mulkey."

  •  Although this attempts to be humorous, (3+ / 0-)

    this post points out the problems with allowing those who are in business serving the public to choose to do business based upon their religious beliefs.  If you are a good Christian, shouldn't you condemn adultery?  If so, do you have to ask any adult who comes into your place of business if they are now or have they ever been married, and if yes, did they cheat on their spouse?  And if you're going to keep out the liars and the covetous, well, you aren't going to have much of a customer base.  And all these "sins" are enumerated in the Ten Commandments.  Homosexuality is not even considered enough of a sin to be mentioned in the Top Ten.  Which, of course, leads anyone with a brain or the ability to think even the slightest bit logically to notice that "good Christians" seem to want to refuse service not based upon eschewing "sinful" behavior (after all, someone who is gay or lesbian may be celibate), but upon who a person is.  That, my friends, isn't religious expression, it's bigotry

    •  This is why I kinda wish I was a pharmacist (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      madreg60, old mule, anon004

      So I could demand that any man filling a prescription for erectile dysfunction meds prove to me that he is have sex with his wife and only his wife, because my religion doesn't condone adultery.  Oh, and his wife must still be fertile, because my religion states that sex is only for the creation of children and is a sin if that is not a possibility.* And she can't be on birth control.  If you are not married, no little blue pills for you! If my customer was a senator who sponsored such legislation, even better.

      *Roman Catholic. Gotta love 'em.

      "That being said, I do agree I am going to hell. But for other reasons. Mostly boring tax stuff ' Amy Pohler

      by Annie B on Mon Feb 24, 2014 at 12:35:45 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Well (0+ / 0-)

    The short answer is, it lets them decide however they want.  

    The law doesn't mark out discrimination against gays and declare it special.  What it does is gives Arizonans the right to opt-out of any generally applicable law, if they can convince a court that compliance would place a substantial burden on the free exercise of their religion.  If there's a compelling government interest behind the law, the court will tell them to go suck a lemon, no matter how burdensome the law is, however.

    It should be noted that there's no protection in Arizona law for LGBTIAQ+ people right now.  So in a sense, the law doesn't really do anything.  You can kick someone out of your Grand Canyon restaurant for being gay before this passes.  You're protected only for race, color, creed, sex, national origin, or disability.

    Which means any other reason is legal right now, no matter if it's a religious reason or irreligious bigotry.  You can have a height minimum, and kick out short people.  You could have an age minimum set at 40.  

    You are not obligated to maintain these rules with any kind of structure.  So if your policy is "no gays allowed" it can mean "no gays allowed unless I like them."  Or "no people who I think are gay are allowed."  

    How they find out is just a question in comfortable bigoted entrepreneurs are with uncertainty.  But there's no recourse for kicking out a straight person because you think he's gay, nor is there any protection for the 100th gay person because the previous 99 got in.

  •  If it's religious beliefs, the sign should read... (0+ / 0-)

    " We don't serve no Philistines or Roman Centurions"

  •  It makes more sense ... (0+ / 0-)

    ... if you think of it as a Republican 'get out the base' voter bill.
    (And I do mean base.)

  •  The intention is het/cis terrorism (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dr Erich Bloodaxe RN, old mule

    Make LGBT people afraid. Shove us back into the closet, increase our suicide rates. Make us monitor everything we do in public for fear that some het/cis person might sniff something not sufficiently gender normative.

  •  It's intimidation to push people back into the (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    closet, mostly.  Sure, it'll be obvious if you want a wedding cake with two male figurines, or want names on your cake, or are having photos taken of your wedding.  But for all the 'non-obvious' things, it is an attempt to force gays to simply 'not exist' - to hide anything that might offend the delicate sensibilities of the religious haters from view whenever they're out in public.

  •  What about medical services? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Does this law allow a Christian doctor not to treat someone who is gay? (or even if he/she thinks the person is gay?)

    The focus has been on wedding cakes and photographers. While that may be annoying and sad, it's not the same as a doctor refusing to set your broken leg because he or she doesn't agree with your lifestyle.

  •  hmmm.... (0+ / 0-)

    I was wondering that too, as I look exactly like a guy who participates in the G & L Rodeo series, Stetson, boots all pointy toed, big belt buckle...
    If I ever go to AZ I might have to figger out how to prove that I am a lifetime committed heterosexual, I guess.
    I wonder what form of ID they would accept?
    I wonder what I should wear?
    WAIT! I got it! There are four gay men in our little village, 79842 usa of them could write me a recommendation that I'm not...oh, wait, that doesn't make much sense either.

    Think I will just avoid Arizona for now.

    I buy and sell well trained riding mules and American Mammoth Jack Stock.

    by old mule on Mon Feb 24, 2014 at 02:35:42 PM PST

    •  and (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      sajiocity, CodeMonkey

      along with the snideness and head-shaking, I have not forgotten that this law is designed to be a step backwards, to promote a certain religion, to allow a behavior that is certainly hateful, and we should all remember that when the rights of one group are taken away, that we, the other Americans, are surely affected.

      I buy and sell well trained riding mules and American Mammoth Jack Stock.

      by old mule on Mon Feb 24, 2014 at 02:42:47 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  The purpose of this bill is to stir up fear (0+ / 0-)

    and hatred, and a sense of victimhood among bigoted Christians. It works just fine for that. They know who they are, and it doesn't really matter who you or your friends are.

    A plain reading of the language says that Christians can keep out sinners of any kind, including LGBTQs, adulterers, fornicators, Darwinist Secular Humanists, Liberal Democrats, Muslims, hippies, and FSM-worshippers. Also Muslims can keep out Kaffirs, and Pastafarians can keep out Teavangelical Creationist Global Warming Deniers on the grounds that they are clearly the products of Unintelligent Design.

    Queerty reports:

    Arizona Pizzeria Refuses To Serve Anti-Gay Legislators

    Don't ask what the Satanists can do. The first application in Oklahoma under their non-discriminatory public religious display law was a group of Satanists with a design for a seated Baphomet statue. The plan was to invite the kiddies to sit on Satan's lap. Or anybody!

    Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

    by Mokurai on Mon Feb 24, 2014 at 03:49:02 PM PST

  •  Citizens will be reqiored to carry papers from (0+ / 0-)

    their local rightwing Mega Church, certifying that tithes have been paid in full, and that "sexy times" are Pastor-verified.

    Cuz "freedumb"!

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