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The other day, I saw a headline and link to a story of a Lesbian asking to be stoned at a church displaying a sign that said "Jesus would stone homos".  

The story can be found here:

I'm sorry, but no, Jesus would not stone homos.  I'm pretty sure that he would not stone anyone.  If someone got stoned and Jesus approved, it was probably the way Bill Maher gets stoned.  In the interests of disclosure, I'm Jewish, and I've never read the Sequel.  My acquaintance with the Original is not the most scholarly one.  

However, I feel confident when I say that if you read the Bible and came away thinking that Jesus would stone homos, you read it wrong.  Either that, or you bought a used copy and the person who wrote in the margins before you got it wrong.

Please follow me below the fold.

You are probably familiar with the 10 Commandments.  If you asked me to name them all, I'd probably name six and finish by saying, "Happy, Grumpy, Bashful and Doc."  I'm always amused, though when some wrongwing politician rails about how we need to display them everywhere and he can't cite them all.  In any event, I think it's more important to heed them than to display them.  At least that one about killing.  I think we can all agree that you shouldn't kill.

You probably know the story about how we got them.  Moses led the Israelites out of Egypt and brought them to Mt. Sinai to receive God's laws.  The 10 Commandments are what we got.  Make no mistake about it, they are emphatic.  It's not just that "Thou Shalt Not Kill" It's NO KILL!  In other words DON'T DO IT!

I have heard a story or two about Jesus.  One goes directly to stoning.  Some men presented Jesus with a woman who had committed adultery.  How did they know?  Was she caught in the act? and who was she committing it with and where was he?  Apparently, the wrongwing were misogynistic A-holes even then.  He told the gathered crowd that the one who had not sinned should cast the first stone.  Nobody came forward to claim to be free of sin.

Now, I'm pretty sure that committing adultery is a violation of one of the 10 Commandments.  Yet Jesus did not condone stoning the violator.  Maybe you took that to be a demonstration of His fairness.  That He truly believed that the stoning should commence with someone who had never sinned.  In that case, since we're all born with Original Sin, except Jesus, you'll just have to wait until He returns.  But even then, you can't throw your stone until He does, which He won't.  So, you're just SOL.

Whatever else you might think about the stories of the Bible, the story of the 10 Commandments is the only time where God speaks directly to all the people, not through a prophet.  I'm God!  No Idols!  Keep Sabbath!  No Kill!  Honor Parents!  No Adultery!  No Covet!  Wow, I got seven!  Don't tell me they're out of order.

Nowhere in all of that is a penalty mentioned for violating those commandments.  Now, I'm a strict constructionist.  I believe you have to go back to the original intent.  What did God mean by "No Kill!"?  This is something that the Rules committee got wrong.  The punishment for everything is death!  Work on the Sabbath?  You Die!  Adultery?  You Die!  Wearing a blend of fabrics?  You Die!  Wait a second, that one isn't even a commandment.

God has commanded us not to kill.  Period.  Some people kill.  What should we do with them?  We have to punish them.  So we catch a killer and a death penalty proponent wants to kill the killer.  I remind him that we have been commanded not to kill.  He responds "Why not?  He did!"  I respond, "And if he jumped off a bridge would you follow?"

Jesus got that one right.  He would not stone an adulterer.  I know I'm missing 3 commandments from my list above, but I'm pretty sure No Gay! is not among them.  It was also reported that as Jesus was dying, He called out to God asking for forgiveness for His own killers.

So, if you don't kill people for breaking the Commandments, you definitely shouldn't kill people for lesser offenses.  I wonder if the woman returned for her stoning the next day.

Originally posted to Woody25 on Sat Mar 22, 2014 at 11:51 AM PDT.

Also republished by Community Spotlight.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Blended fabrics, not a commandment? (6+ / 0-)

    Well, to Christians, maybe. Because they just don't get to know the joy* of having 613 commandments (as counted by Maimonides, the great 12th century rabbi, philosopher, Nagid of the Egyptian Jewish community and physician to Saladin) to keep up with.  And it's just linsey-wooley that's a problem--all other combos are kosher.
    *snark alert--just like a shark alert, only one letter off

    If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? When I am only for myself, then what am "I"? And if not now, when?

    by betorah on Sat Mar 22, 2014 at 01:02:59 PM PDT

    •  and if you add (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      third Party please

      6+1+3 you get 10.  Hmmm

    •  Actually, only off by 1/4 of the letter. An 'n' (0+ / 0-)

      is almost an 'h'.

      And we love to wear a badge, a uniform / And we love to fly a flag But I won't...let others live in hell / As we divide against each other And we fight amongst ourselves

      by ban48 on Sat Mar 22, 2014 at 06:07:25 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Hmm, a blend of wool and linen is reserved (0+ / 0-)

      for Chief Priest to wear only on Yom Kippur.  

      As for the commandment of Thou shalt not kill...  The actual wording in ancient Hebrew translates to Don't commit murder (not kill, as killing happens in war).  So planning to murder your neighbor for his property, wife, etc. is the sin.

      As for stoning... read the Oral Traditions (Talmud) and see how often that actually happened and any executions that were recorded (as far as my Rabbi as said - "If the Sanhedrin couldn't find a reason to commute the death sentence then they were considered a Bloody Sanhedrin".  As for the number he only recounted 3 known cases in 150 yrs.

      "Death is the winner in any war." - Nightwish/Imaginareum/Song of myself.

      by doingbusinessas on Sat Mar 22, 2014 at 11:23:08 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  As far as the death penalty goes, (0+ / 0-)

        It was said that "If a Sanhedrin carried out one execution in seven years it is characterized as a murderous Sanhedrin. Rabbi Akiva and Rabbi Tarfon say that if they had been in Sanhedrin, no person would have ever been executed. . . ."

        If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? When I am only for myself, then what am "I"? And if not now, when?

        by betorah on Sun Mar 23, 2014 at 08:08:39 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  As Jon Stewart says (0+ / 0-)

      One benefit of a 6000+ year old religion is you have lots and lots of holidays. :)

      And God said, "Let there be light"; and with a Big Bang, there was light. And God said "Ow! Ow My eyes!" and in a flash God separated light from darkness. "Whew! Now that's better. Now where was I. Oh yea . . ."

      by Pale Jenova on Sun Mar 23, 2014 at 09:37:38 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  "God's covenant only protects God's people!" (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    third Party please

    Fundies either argue that or claim that the word was misinterpreted and the commandment only forbids murder, not killing people who violate God's law.

    Note these are not mutually exclusive.

    Domestic politics is the continuation of civil war by other means.

    by Visceral on Sat Mar 22, 2014 at 01:48:42 PM PDT

    •  and "God's people" are the Jews... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      who're commanded to kill everyone they conquered.
      Deuteronomy 7: 2

      ... "You are the chosen people..."
      “When the Lord thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee — the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou—

      2 and when the Lord thy God shall deliver them before thee, thou shalt smite them and utterly destroy them. Thou shalt make no covenant with them nor show mercy unto them.

      The world is my country, all people are my brethren and to do good is my religion ~ Thomas Paine

      by third Party please on Sat Mar 22, 2014 at 06:27:57 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Not only that, (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    but Jesus met what many say was a gay Roman Centurion. He healed the Centurion's "pais" (a younger male lover/slave). And, after healing the Centurion's pais, He complimented the man's faith. Jesus did not even tell the Centurion to "go and sin no more."

  •  You'll be excited to hear that our idiot (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    Georgia Legislature has voted to allow guns to be carried in churches that allow the practice and in bars. So hurray for the 10 Suggestions!

    "The object of persecution is persecution. The object of torture is torture. The object of power is power. Now do you begin to understand me?" ~Orwell, "1984"

    by Lily O Lady on Sat Mar 22, 2014 at 02:55:36 PM PDT

  •  Everybody must get stoned. n/t (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    rmonroe, tuesdayschilde, anon004
  •  The Gospel According to John, Chapter 8, verse 7. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    anon004, Pale Jenova

    From the Authorized ("King James") Version:

    So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
    And adultery is one of the Ten Commandments.

    So, while Jesus said nothing about homosexuality, he seemed to be opposed to stoning. Why do these fundamentalists always get it so wrong?

    The working poor haven’t abdicated responsibility for their lives. They’re drowning in it. -Ezra Klein

    by bubbajim on Sat Mar 22, 2014 at 05:55:10 PM PDT

    •  Ok, a little CURRENT theological thought (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      oslyn7, AJayne, Pale Jenova

      I know that our fundamentalist friends quote Leviticus and Paul regarding the condemnation of homosexuality. Current theological analysis puts these prohibitions in context with their times and points out that a) homosexual rape was a common practice of conquering armies, and given that Israel was a crossroads for a lot of armies coming through, the Israelites condemned that practice as an abomination, having been on the receiving end more often than not.

      b) Paul condemned "sodomites" because of the practice of temple prostitution in the "pagan" society. In other words THEY do that, WE do NOT. It was pure cultural differentiation, plain and simple.

      In no case was the concept of a loving, mutually respectful same gender relationship even considered. The term "homosexual" did not even come into existence until the late 19th Century.

      Of course it hurts! You're being screwed by an Elephant!

      by CAPitBull on Sat Mar 22, 2014 at 06:58:44 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  John, Chapter 8, verse 5-7 (0+ / 0-)
      [5] Now in the law Moses commanded us to stone such. What do you say about her?"
      [6] This they said to test him, that they might have some charge to bring against him. Jesus bent down and wrote with his finger on the ground.
      [7] And as they continued to ask him, he stood up and said to them, "Let him who is without sin among you be the first to throw a stone at her."
      John 8:5-7
      Thanks for diary and discussion.

      My question is: what did Jesus write with his finger?  Considering why the men left, it could be the "without sin" comment and/or it could be what he wrote.  Wondering what he could have written to dismay the men.

  •  No penalty? (0+ / 0-)
    Nowhere in all of that is a penalty mentioned for violating those commandments.
    One way to understand the Ten Commandments is as a set of golden rules for attaining something like earthly happiness in a cruel world.  Avoiding lies, theft, murder, and adultery minimizes the number of enemies you make along the way.  The alternative has the consequence, or "punishment" of an existence plagued with a horde of vengeful enemies.

    Someone who follows the first commandment (translated above in all its original terseness as "Me God!") starts from the standpoint that the universe does not revolve around himself/herself, but rather that there is more to life than "doing it my way".

  •  "Happy, Grumpy, Bashful and Doc"? (0+ / 0-)

    I always thought those were quarks . . .

    And God said, "Let there be light"; and with a Big Bang, there was light. And God said "Ow! Ow My eyes!" and in a flash God separated light from darkness. "Whew! Now that's better. Now where was I. Oh yea . . ."

    by Pale Jenova on Sun Mar 23, 2014 at 09:49:44 AM PDT

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