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Keep in mind, the original impetus for the anti-vaccine movement was concern over child-brain development and substances found in common vaccines given to kids. It was well worth investigating, the stakes were enormous. But after many studies, so far, the onset of childhood autism remains a medical mystery. Anti-vaxxars have been so discredited at this point that they've fallen back on a tactic familiar to anyone who follows anti-science bullshit artists:
Ah, yes. The old “I’m not ‘anti-vaccine’; I’m a vaccine safety advocate” gambit! No doubt many antivaccinationists believe that they really are vaccine safety advocates. They can delude themselves to believe they are virtually anything, but that doesn’t make it so, any more than I could turn myself into a major league pitcher by believing I’m a great baseball player. For instance, on the MOMV website, there is a story of Brynn Fischer,who in a divorce battle is fighting the father, who, quite reasonably, wants their children vaccinated. There’s a FAQ that asks the question, “Isn’t it really dangerous if a person, especially a child, gets any of these communicable diseases, like whooping cough, diphtheria, measles, mumps, rubella, chicken pox, and polio?” and answers it, “No,” citing the ultimate in intellectually dishonest antivaccine talking points, the claim that death rates for these diseases were falling before the introduction of vaccines.
There are plenty of ugly scams and scammers in the world. But one that exploits the worst fears of any concerned parent while immediately putting every man, woman, and child at greater risk of preventable tragedy has to rank right up there.
  • We knew Van de Waals force was good for Gecko's sticking to anything, now it appears it may help hold Near Earth Objects together.
  • Her name is LUCA and we're starting to know about her.
  • The Field's Medal is the Nobel Prize of mathematics, except it's only awarded every four years. This time, finally, it went to a woman.
  • Whiz kids changing the face of medical research
  • It's hard to believe this actually has to be said in this technological age: police in Ferguson—and everywhere else—there is no way you are going to shut down cameras in crowded public places. There are over 100 million hand-held, wireless video cameras streaming live to a worldwide network in the US alone. Just telling us not to record you is like roller skating onto the set of Tosh.0 in a Wile E. Coyote costume wearing a homemade jetpack and thinking no one with a camera will notice.
  • Speaking of scams and charlatans, it looks like Ken Ham's creationist scheme may soon have some competition:
According to Lutz, the most compelling pieces in the museum are Ica stones from the Aeronautical Museum of Lima, Peru: smooth andesite stones etched with images of humans and dinosaurs interacting. Since Ica Stones suggest the cohabitation of humans and extinct animals, they've been used by creationists as evidence that dinosaurs became extinct far more recently than the 65 million years agreed upon by modern science.

Originally posted to Daily Kos on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 06:00 AM PDT.

Also republished by SciTech.


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Comment Preferences

  •  Thanks DarkSyde nt (16+ / 0-)

    I voted Tuesday, May 6, 2014 because it is my right, my responsibility and because my parents moved from Alabama to Ohio to vote. Unfortunately, the republicons want to turn Ohio into Alabama.

    by a2nite on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 06:02:43 AM PDT

  •  The HPV vaccine is not offered to Veterans (8+ / 0-)

    of a certain age. It shouldn't just be for the kids anymore.

  •  The anti-science 'folks' among us... (14+ / 0-)

    present a clear and present danger, (on so many levels).
    Fighting them, standing up to them, relentlessly calling them out, is one of the most important things we must be doing right now.
    So much depends on it.

    "These 'Yet To Be' United States" --James Baldwin--

    by kevinbr38 on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 06:10:13 AM PDT

    •  In addition to anti science (9+ / 0-)

      there's also the bad science that's being done. The desired result is pre-determined and then tests are designed to validate the desired outcome.

      A true craftsman will meticulously construct the apparatus of his own demise.

      by onionjim on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 06:24:59 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It's the old saw: many people are anti-science (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Lenny Flank, rduran, kfunk937, Joffan

      about something.

      We love science that supports our beliefs and mistrust science that doesn't.

      LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

      by dinotrac on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:09:21 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  the chimp brain in action (5+ / 0-)

        All of us, whether we acknowledge it or not, tend to believe what we already WANT to believe. For purely emotional-tribal reasons.

        Science is unique precisely because, as a collective, it places procedures for the express purpose of preventing anyone's tribal emotional desires from weighing in on its findings. Science doesn't give a rat's ass what anyone believes or wants to be true--it only cares about data and evidence that can be repeated and verified by anyone anywhere of any belief.

        In the end, reality always wins.

        by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:19:31 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Funny thing: the most common complaint people (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Lenny Flank, rduran, ebohlman

          have about science demonstrates precisely why it is so powerful:

          "Yeah, but I remember they said we shouldn't east blah blah or that yada yada was going to happen, or that the pyramids were built thisaway instead of thataway..."

          The memory is usually fuzzy or wrong, but the point is that science has a self-correcting mechanism.  Just as a thermostat goes a little high and goes a little low to maintain an average temperature, science is willing to entertain some doubt and even some mis-steps on its way to the truth. Science works well even when carried out by fallible and imperfect human beings.

          Pronouncements chiseled into stone not so much.

          LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

          by dinotrac on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:24:34 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  As instruments, tools and acquisition of knowledge (0+ / 0-)

          and collection/processing of data become less costly to the individual, I hope that will make for a more uniformly informed populace.

          Everyone should at least be able to take two vectors of data and plug them into an easy to use calculator to generate statistics.

  •  Interesting Gecko story.... (8+ / 0-)

    Gee I wonder why the Geico Gecko never walks up walls....or why he never licks his eyeballs.....

    "Ronald Reagan is DEAD! His policies live on but we're doing something about THAT!"

    by leftykook on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 06:16:02 AM PDT

  •  The last common ancestor is not "solved" (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    palantir, atana

    This is just a proposal, there's no particular evidence for it. It's just speculation. IBT is a bit dodgy, by the way.

  •  Ica stones (7+ / 0-)

    Wow--can I use a Picasso painting to describe what a bowl of fruit looked like in France 70 years ago?  Not to mention, what the woman who owned it looked like.

    Actions speak louder than petitions.

    by melvynny on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 06:24:42 AM PDT

    •  Might (4+ / 0-)

      as well. I and a number of other science bloggers can readily attest that making a living doing legit stuff seems a lot harder than selling new media pieces on ghosts or the flying sauceri.

      •  the only thing that pays better is starting (7+ / 0-)

        a cult or megachurch.  If that does not work out for me, I can always fall back on ghosts and UFOs

        •  it's a good thing we all have scruples (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Most Awesome Nana, kfunk937, entlord

          Anyone here could make a very nice living by writing good-sounding but utterly-bullshit woo-woo for the gullible. I have often thought I could make quite a nice living by raising money from the foolish to bring Jesus back to life by cloning the blood on the Shroud of Turin.

          In the end, reality always wins.

          by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:03:46 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  maybe we need to rethink this; I would be glad (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Lenny Flank

            to let you be the front man.  I just bought a "Jesus Battery" at the hardware store.  The clerk guaranteed it would recharge in 3 days if I kept the trickle charger on it.  I can foresee an entire line of "Jesus" based products

      •  I used to love watching Ghost Hunters (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Mark Sumner, kfunk937

        Those people are just so freakin' earnest with their infrared gear and cameras and stuff.

        And, of course, they never find anything.

        The really good question (never asked, it seems) is:

        Hey, guy, why do you have to turn the lights out? Are ghosts afraid of the light?

        Maybe they are.  Kind of like Carl Sagan's invisible dragon.

        I did run into an odd moment, though, when chatting with a family member's boyfriend.  He also like Ghost Huners, as it turned out.  Problem is, that he was into ghost hunting. Even had some equipment.


        LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

        by dinotrac on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:14:15 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  the Bigfoot shows are the same way (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          dinotrac, kfunk937

          Lots of cool-looking night vision, lots of "every twig that breaks or sound in the night is a 'Squatch!!", lots of "there's definitely something out there oh noez!!"---and they never find anything. At all. Ever.

          In the end, reality always wins.

          by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:36:47 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  The asteroid/Van der Waals story surprised (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      mungley, atana, kfunk937

      and disappointed me (as much science reporting in the popular press does). Disappointed that it reported "forces called van der Waals, which have never been detected before on this type of object." They weren't "detected," they were inferred (a big difference) as one possible contributor perhaps not previously taken sufficiently into consideration. And surprised if it is indeed true that van der Waals forces haven't previously been taken into consideration. As a biologist, I know that van der Waals forces, tiny and comparatively weak as they can be, are pretty much responsible for making life work (once you look beyond the considerably larger forces of covalent bonds and electric charge, anyway). Van der Waals forces happen wherever molecular/atomic surfaces touch each other (i.e., everywhere); it's not like this is exotic stuff. But I can see how, if you're used to thinking mostly about gravity, then puny van der Waals might seem at first blush to be beneath consideration.

      •  And furdermore... (0+ / 0-)

        I'm no physicist, so please check me out on this. It seems to me that if a body such as this asteroid is held together to any critical degree by Van der Waals forces, then that body must be composed primarily of dust and small grit (since Van der Waals interactions are so puny, they're only important for very high surface-to-volume ratio objects, which have lots of surface area for these forces to act at, and relatively not much mass.

        So...if the asteroid is mostly conglomerated dust and grit, why couldn't you gently disrupt it into a highly dispersed cloud of dust just by landing a big ole Van de Graaff generator on it, to give it a net charge, which would cause the grains to fly apart? This should be easier to control and much more precise than blowing it out of the sky with a nuclear warhead. I would think that the resulting highly dispersed cloud of dust would make for one helluva meteor shower light show upon entering the earth's atmosphere, without doing much if any damage.

        Note to NASA: if this pans out, you have to call the device the DocDawg/Kos disrupter, since you heard it here first. For everyday use the acronym DDK will be fine.

        Buying my ticket to Stockholm now....

    •  van Gogh as an astronomy expert! (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      Just a guy made of dots and lines.

      by BobX on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 06:44:54 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  get ready for more science/religion mashups (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mungley, atana, kfunk937

    while this family is protesting standardized testing as violating their religious beliefs:

    I think we will see more anti vaxxers and such confronting public schools over requiring vaccinations.  The religious Right sees an enormous opportunity to remake the country judicially into their vision of what it should be following the HL decision.

    I note the parents here do not have the conventional trappings of faith but a much more anomalous sort of belief.  It will be interesting to see how much faith it will take to trump government interest.  RW think tanks and organizations plan a plethora of suits in the coming two years  

    •  the crazy RNC (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      is asking congress to investigate the AP US History exam because it is Unamerican.  To be clear, the college board is a private organization, just like all those tea party groups that want tax exempt status and can't be investigated because they are christian and christians are always perfect, yet the RNC was congress to regulate what they can do.

      These exams have one purpose, to allow students to gain credit for certain college classes.  They are written so that Universities can say that a student who performs at a certain level will have the same benefit as taking the class at the university.

      The proper free market way to fight the AP Exam is to set up another pathway for students to receive college credit via exam.  For instance, all the crackpot religious schools could create a test that all the crackpot homeschoolers could take to test out the first semester of college.  It actually would not be hard to do.  The nutjob colleges could put the lectures online and then contract with local testing centers to admister the exam.  If the colleges were bereft with christian charity, it would not cost the student anymore than the AP exam.  These nut cases could even ask for government welfare to pay for the exams if the families were low income.

      There are a lot of kids, even in public schools, whom this would be of great benefit.  A lot of kids are kept out of AP classes for various reasons, and this would be a way for them to have rigorous classes, and maybe be exposed to colleges they never thought of.

      But of course such rationality is beyond some people.  All they seem to want to do is minimize the educational opportunities, keep everyone as mindless as possible so they continue to think the almighty is about profit, not the wonderful life we have been given.

      She was a fool, and so am I, and so is anyone who thinks he sees what God is doing. -Kurt Vonnegut Life is serious but we don't have to be - me

      by lowt on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 07:15:33 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  "My religion practices faith-based arithmetic (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      pdxteacher, kfunk937

      particularly around tax time."

      American Presidents: 43 men, 0 women. Ready for Hillary

      by atana on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 07:44:38 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  the lefty New-Agey nutters are also prone to (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Mark Sumner, entlord, kfunk937, ebohlman

      allowing their religious philosophy to determine their science.  That is why faith-based anti-science "alternative medicine" crapola like homeopathy suck so much money out of the gullible.

      In the end, reality always wins.

      by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 07:53:27 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Here in AZ, we've gone one further (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mungley, DarkSyde, Simplify, Decorina, kfunk937

    Our legislature recently passed a law allowing families who do not vaccinate to become licensed to take foster children into their homes.

  •  Anti-Vaccination people apparently never .... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    kfunk937, ebohlman

    saw photos of kids in iron lungs or experienced a polio epidemic. My parent's Methodist minister's wife died of the infection. I myself had measles, mumps and chickenpox. I don't recommend it.

    The anti-vaxxars may have had a point a few years ago, and we needed to explore it, but the evidence is not on their side, while the evidence that indicates the nasty effects of not vaccinating is overwhelming.

    As to the Ica stones, while P. T. Barnum would be proud!

  •  our own resident anti-vax nutters have been (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    RoIn, kfunk937, ebohlman

    playing that same game -- "I'm not an anti-vaxer, but . . .", and then go on to parrot all the standard anti-vax bullshit about how "unsafe" and "untested" vaccines are.

    Fortunately, every time they have opened their mouths they have been smacked by the science folks here, so now they seem to be shutting up.  Good. Not only does their silly bullshit make this site look like InfoWars with its CT idiocy, but their anti-science crap KILLS PEOPLE. It has no place here.

    In the end, reality always wins.

    by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 07:06:39 AM PDT

  •  It's the Fields medal, not the Field's medal. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
  •  >6% K Students Unvaccinated In Oregan (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    RoIn, Simplify, BelgianBastard, kfunk937

    Men are so necessarily mad, that not to be mad would amount to another form of madness. -Pascal

    by bernardpliers on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 07:35:08 AM PDT

    •  Those bastards are killing people. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kfunk937, ebohlman

      They are just as evil as R govs that refuse Medicaid expansion. I won't bother asking Greg Dworkin or Adam B what the legal view of this is, but in my book, when you knowingly act in a way that will kill people, that's murder - at the very least from a moral standpoint.

      I have no problem with people questioning anything, in fact that's a healthy thing. But these people aren't doing that.; they are fundamentalistswho 'believe' a conclusion and then desparately search for 'facts' that support their beliefs. They are sad little scumbags.

      I ride the wild horse .

      by BelgianBastard on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:14:40 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  The anti-vaccine movement is aided (8+ / 0-)

    by the socio-economic & medical improvements in the US post WWII and (relative) youth of the population.

    You can believe the claims that measles, whooping cough, etc are less dangerous than the side effects of the vaccines if you, your family, your neighbors have no experience with the actual diseases.

    For example: we pretty much ended polio in the mid-50s/early 60s. But my father caught polio right about the time the vaccine first started being distributed. So his children and grandchildren know what the side effects of the disease are.  We know what the long-term effects are,it's not just something you read in a book and we're not going to trivialize the risks of the diseases.  But even though we moved around a lot and went to several schools, and now live in several states, hardly any of our friends or acquaintances have a similar real-life knowledge of the disease.  And most of the medical community that my dad deals with have a similar lack of real-life knowledge (He's 74.  His drs/nurses/etc are a good deal younger usually.)  

    Ditto for whooping cough, measles, etc. My siblings and I are of an early generation to get the measles vaccine. Unfortunately for us the vaccine didn't work (early flawed vaccine) and we all caught it anyways.  That's the sickest I remember being.  Seems like I was in bed for 2 weeks.  German measles was a piece of cake compared to that (yeah, we got that too despite the vaccine. My family's not the poster child for the effectiveness of vaccines.)            


    It's about the Supreme Court.

    by leu2500 on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 07:47:38 AM PDT

    •  here at DKos, the anti-science crowds (including (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kfunk937, ebohlman

      our resident anti-vaxers) seem to be motivated almost completely by an extreme-left anti-corporate ideology, dosed with a big dollop of science-as-conspiracy-theory prone-ness which sees capitalist plots behind every tree.

      That pains me greatly, since I've been a commie since I was 16 and have the same anti-capitalist and anti-corporate ideology, though not the kindergarten cartoon-villain version. So it embarrasses me enormously to have so many anti-science CTers on the same side as me.

      In the end, reality always wins.

      by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:13:05 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  they are benefiting from everyone else being vacin (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kfunk937, ebohlman


      if the larger population wasn't vaccinated then their kids would be at greater risk and they would see that not vaccinating is not safer than the vaccine

    •  On a smaller scale, we're starting to see the (0+ / 0-)

      same dynamic leading a fairly small, but still alarming, number of young gay men to think that condoms aren't really necessary for anal sex if the other guy "looks healthy". They didn't grow up in a time when attendance at their peers' funerals was a common aspect of life.

      Unfortunately when smart and educated people get crazy ideas they can come up with plausibly truthy arguments. -- Andrew F Cockburn

      by ebohlman on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 05:20:44 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Vaccines and broad brushes (0+ / 0-)

    Plenty of finger-pointing to go around here.
    Remember when Gardasil came out back in 2006?

    There were plenty of people advocating to require the vaccination even though:

    1. It was a brand-new vaccine with no history beyond the manufacturer-designed and supervised testing regime

    2. The disease was sexually transmitted -- nobody was going to walk into a classroom and spread it by coughing, touching, etc.

    3. The risk that had people up and arms -- that a given woman will die from cervical cancer -- is only about 0.08%.

    4. Even safe vaccines cause problems, up to and including death, for a small number people.

    5. Being compensated for damages caused by a vaccine is notoriously difficult.

    Doesn't mean that Gardasil isn't wonderful. Doesn't mean that people shouldn't get their kids vaccinated. Does mean that requiring the vaccination would be a great big present to Merck.  

    LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

    by dinotrac on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:07:25 AM PDT

    •  meh, the amount of profit that pharma companies (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      dinotrac, cyberpuggy, kfunk937

      make from vaccines is miniscule. They probably spend more than that on toilet paper for the executive bathrooms.

      All of the "corporate plots for profit" scenarios fail to impress me. They are cartoon villains.

      Corporations already do enough real-world stuff to require our opposition. We don't need to make stupid shit up.

      In the end, reality always wins.

      by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:26:37 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Gardasil was not developed for charitable purposes (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Lenny Flank, jes2

        It's a money-making venture.
        Nothing wrong with that.

        But -- forcing people to buy a product with no compelling public interest?

        That kind of sucks.

        LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

        by dinotrac on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 09:03:54 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Meh, false. (0+ / 0-)
        The global market for vaccines may only comprise about 2% to 3% of the total pharmaceuticals market but this sector has, and continues to experience a stellar growth rate of 10% to 15% per year versus the 5% to 7% seen in the overall market, according the World Health Organization (WHO). Totaling just US$5 billion in 2000, today the global vaccine market is worth an estimated $24 billion and is projected to rise to $100 billion by 2025.
        That was for 2013.

        Year ending 2017, which is more of a line of sight prediction will possibly be $48 billion based on WSJ estimates.

        •  meh, that's peanuts compared to their total profit (0+ / 0-)

          They'd make far more money treating the disease than they make by vaccinating against it.

          Which is why the silly anti-vax conspiracy theories about it are silly.

          In the end, reality always wins.

          by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 03:31:57 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  Would Mssrs Lutz or Ham be interested in a copy... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    of "Day of the Triffids", because it pretty much proves that plants can walk and kill people. Also, too, 'Science' can't explain it! And for the right price I can furnish them with a whole slew crap 50s B-movies historical artifacts that depict things 'Science' says are impossible, like a 50 foot woman and gigantic tarantulas and what not. Call me...

    I ride the wild horse .

    by BelgianBastard on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 08:07:51 AM PDT

  •  occam's razor = such asteroids most likely solid (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:


    However, a solid object should be able to rotate much more rapidly. This suggests that most asteroids with a diameter over 100 meters are rubble piles
    stress = a solid object should be able to rotate much more rapidly

    thus one can surmise NOT ALL  asteroids are rubble piles and the ones spinning faster are most likely solid

  •  Ica Stones? Seriously? (0+ / 0-)

    I thought they were debunked eons ago.

    FSM please save us!

    "May the forces of evil become confused on the way to your house." - George Carlin

    by Most Awesome Nana on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 09:59:05 AM PDT

  •  Thanks, Darksyde! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    The Field's Medal is the Nobel Prize of mathematics, except it's only awarded every four years. This time, finally, it went to a woman.
    This is real progress. Women have had a tough road in science and engineering, quite like women who join all male conclaves such as fire departments but without the towel snapping.

    This is changing through concerted effort; however, it is still slow to catch up.

    We have it within our power to make the world over again ~ Thomas Paine

    by occupystephanie on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 10:29:08 AM PDT

  •  Another vaccine commercial... (0+ / 0-)
    Keep in mind, the original impetus for the anti-vaccine movement was concern over child-brain development and substances found in common vaccines given to kids.
    It still is.

    The US vaccinates its young children at a higher rate than any other country in the world. There has not been any testing on what the accumulation of over 3 milligrams (that is 3,000 micrograms) of aluminum will do in an infant's body and brain.

    I have previously posted the link to the study that was run in which intravenous feeding solutions comparing ones with aluminum and ones without aluminum were compared. In that study the feeding solutions to babies which had only 10 micrograms of aluminum, but still showed impaired brain function when compared to the infants not receiving aluminum. (There are some vaccinations that we give our children that have over 1,500 micrograms of aluminum in a single shot.)

    Another study, from the US National Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health:

    When assessing adjuvant toxicity in children, two key points ought to be considered: (i) children should not be viewed as "small adults" as their unique physiology makes them much more vulnerable to toxic insults; and (ii) if exposure to Al from only few vaccines can lead to cognitive impairment and autoimmunity in adults, is it unreasonable to question whether the current pediatric schedules, often containing 18 Al adjuvanted vaccines, are safe for children?  
    The results:

    Our results show that: (i) children from countries with the highest ASD prevalence appear to have the highest exposure to Al from vaccines; (ii) the increase in exposure to Al adjuvants significantly correlates with the increase in ASD prevalence in the United States observed over the last two decades (Pearson r=0.92, p<0.0001); and (iii) a significant correlation exists between the amounts of Al administered to preschool children and the current prevalence of ASD in seven Western countries, particularly at 3-4 months of age (Pearson r=0.89-0.94, p=0.0018-0.0248).

    Would someone care to explain to me why they think putting in 3 milligrams of aluminum (a known toxin) into babies and infants  is something that we should believe to be inherently safe?

    •  blah blah blah (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      Standard anti-vax crapola.

      PS--the aluminum is safe for the same reason the mercury is safe--because it is chemically bound.

      Just like the deadly-lethal chlorine found in ordinary table salt doesn't do diddley to you--because it is chemically bound.

      I wish the anti-science nutters would at least learn some beginner's science before they spout out their idiotic bullshit.

      In the end, reality always wins.

      by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 03:34:22 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  You do realize there is a big difference... (0+ / 0-)

        ...between injecting a chemical (aluminum) and eating it.

        This comment regarding the adjuvants in was made by Dr. Sotaro Sato after reviewing HPV cases (a vaccine that is no longer being recommended in Japan):

        "...the convulsions, inability to walk, and involuntary movements of hands and toes were caused by encephalomyelitis, or inflammation of the brain and spinal cord. Cervical cancer vaccines, which are chemically bound to special types of adjuvants, often trigger encephalomyelitis. Since the vaccines cause auto-antibodies against the brain's neuronal fibers to be produced in many cases, they have triggered demyelinating disorders. They have also induced many cases of cerebral vasculitis."
        •  I realize that your knowledge of chemistry would (0+ / 0-)

          fit on the back of a postage stamp, and that you have no idea whatsoever what "chemically-bound" means.

          Which is why you make yourself look foolish by blithering about "the difference between eating it and injecting it".  It makes no difference. The aluminum is chemically-bound.  It doesn't do anything to anyone, whether they eat it, drink it, inject it, bathe in it, or shove it up their ass.  (shrug)

          Please get a basic science education before you continue to embarrass yourself.

          In the end, reality always wins.

          by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 09:58:45 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  and more standard anti-vax crackpottery (0+ / 0-)

          Yes, some vaccines have side effects.  This is some sort of surprise to you?

          Let's ask people which they'd prefer----the side effects from the vaccines, or the deaths and sickness from diseases that are preventable by vaccines . . . . . . . .  

          In the end, reality always wins.

          by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 10:02:05 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  ps--your study was NOT done by the NIH (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      and it is flat-out dishonest for you to imply that it was.

      I don't know who your study was done by, since you weren't honest enough to link to it.

      But there simply is no evidence at all linking aluminum or vaccines to autism.  Period.  And no mechanism has been proposed wherein it would even be possible.

      You are simply bullshitting us.

      In the end, reality always wins.

      by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 03:40:28 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Linky Lenny (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        Yep, from the US National Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health.

        •  *facepalm* (0+ / 0-)

          You are either a deliberate liar, or you have no idea what you are yammering about.

          The US National Library of Medicine is a catalogue service.  All it does is list all of the articles published in all of the journals it indexes. It does NOT, repeat NOT, as in N-O-T, mean that any of those articles were done by the NIH.

          And this paper does not establish ANY causal relationship between aluminum in vaccines and autism. None at all whatsoever. Not surprising, since NO scientific paper has ever established any causal relation between vaccines, any vaccine ingredient, and autism.

          And you are simply bullshitting people by implying that any scientific paper ever has.

          In the end, reality always wins.

          by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 09:51:09 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Never implied that either (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:

            I listed only where it was published.

            Of course, ignore the data. Rinse and repeat.

            It is what you do.

            •  you are a fucking liar (0+ / 0-)

              You implied that the study was done by the NIH. And you are a fucking liar.

              And you HAVE no data. There is NO peer-reviewed science showing that vaccines or any vaccine ingredient, causes autism. None. Zip. Zero. Zilch. Nada. Not a one.

              All you have is dishonest bullshit and arm-waving. And idiotic paranoid conspiracy theories.

              It's what ALL crackpots do.


              In the end, reality always wins.

              by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 10:24:52 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

  •  Here's the thing about anti-vaxxers -- (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Lenny Flank

    They're not dumb -- not all of them.  They're not uneducated -- not all of them.  They aren't even all anti-science.

    I know because I know some of them, intelligent, well educated young activist women, in most ways quite dynamic.  They are the offspring of children of the 60s, young people who were raised to have a robust skepticism about the establishment and distrust of authority figures.

    The power of the anti-vaccine message is that it follows a pattern of money, power and hubris corrupting institutions that is all-too-credible.  It sounds not only plausible, but very plausible.   But being "very plausible" is a long way from evidence.  And once you believe that someone is corrupted and working against your (or your kids!) best interest, it's nearly impossible to retract that belief.  So it's best to be a well-rounded skeptic, stingy with your belief particularly on hot-button issues.

    I didn't raise my kids to be liberals.  I raised them to be emotionally secure, independent thinkers and they turned out liberal.  One thing that frustrated them when they came to tell me about the Internet outrage du jour is that I'd respond along the lines of, "How do you know it actually happened that way? What are the sources of this version of events?"  

    The whole point of liberalism is to believe that you can use reason to understand the problems of the world and do something about them.  We don't have to wait for History or The Market, or God to get around to resolving things for us, although clearly there are a few things best left up to those agencies. But most of the time if the world has a problem, people should try to do something to fix it, and that should start with getting your facts nailed down as far as it is possible to do so.  If you get your facts wrong, the world's better off without you as an activist.

    I've lost my faith in nihilism

    by grumpynerd on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 05:40:38 PM PDT

    •  as I like to say . . . (0+ / 0-)
      The power of the anti-vaccine message is that it follows a pattern of money, power and hubris corrupting institutions that is all-too-credible.  It sounds not only plausible, but very plausible.   But being "very plausible" is a long way from evidence.
      Dubya and Cheney are soul-less inhuman shitheads. But that doesn't mean the "9-11 Truther" conspiracy actually happened.

      In the end, reality always wins.

      by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 05:56:20 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Vaccines (0+ / 0-)

    GSK produces Infanrix Hexa.

    One of their confidential documents showed that 36 children who received this "6 shots in 1" vaccination died during a two year period. A majority died (21) within three days. The others began to show symptoms immediately after the shot was given. That is only over a two year period between 2009 and 2011.

    There does not seem to be the same outcry from the Daily Kos Vaccination staff on these children to investigate why these children had to be sacrificed.

    We don't know from the document exactly how many of these vaccinations were administered (GSK most likely has an estimate), but 36 deaths seems outrageous especially since the "6 in 1" is not the typical shot given out. That makes these results even scarier.

    •  and here's the science that shows your bullshit is (0+ / 0-)


      Please take your idiotic CT quackery elsewhere. It is not welcome in the reality-based community.

      In the end, reality always wins.

      by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 09:55:42 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Please... (0+ / 0-)

        Nice "pharma" website.

        Too bad it does not address the issue as to why a 6 in 1 combination vaccine would kill off 36 infants in a 2 year period.

        I guess you think it is acceptable for those deaths to occur. You are also very rude. The Internet was made for you.

        •  so it's all a . . . . (0+ / 0-)


          In the end, reality always wins.

          by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 10:36:48 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  ps--yes, I am rude to anti-vax crackpots (0+ / 0-)

          In fact, I think they should all be banned from this site, and forced to post their horse shit over at InfoWars where it belongs. And if they are not banned, they should be mocked and spat on until they are too embarrassed to show their faces in public.

          Anti-vax crackpots like you KILL people with your idiotic anti-science dumbfuckery.  I see no reason to be polite with you.

          In the end, reality always wins.

          by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 10:39:27 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  ps--your number doesn't mean diddley doo until you (0+ / 0-)

          tell us what percentage those 36 deaths are of the total number of people vaccinated.

          We already know that vaccines have side effects, some of them fatal. We've known that for over 100 years now.

          It's worth it, considering the enormous number of lives that are saved by vaccines every year.

          Or perhaps you'd like to tell us how many people have been killed in total, by vaccines over the past 100 years---so we can compare that to the number of people who DID NOT die because they were vaccinated against lethal diseases.

          PS--more than 36 people are killed by eating PEANUTS every year.  Do you think peanuts are unsafe and should be banned?

          You are just talking out your ass.

          In the end, reality always wins.

          by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 10:46:28 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Ask GSK (0+ / 0-)

            They know how many of the children have been given this vaccine, but have not disclosed that information. They don't have to tell us anything. Are you suggesting that the loss of 36 healthy infants (not just people as you suggest) is acceptable in some bizarre logic in your mind?

            My guess is that you did not even do any research on Infanrix Hexa until I mentioned it. Just assume it is safe and inject it in innocent two month olds, and let them deal with the consequences.

            In fact, most of the data they (GSK) were referencing in that report was from VAERS. That information is supplied by doctors, so there is a good chance it has been underreported. It is not mandatory for doctors to submit information to VAERS even if parents insist that there is a tie between a reaction and a vaccination.

            Here is some more education for you:

            In 1964 Merck produced the adjuvant 65-4 that contained up to 65 percent peanut oil plus Arlasel A, aluminum stearate, and other ingredients with 13-fold higher levels of antibodies than previous vaccines. During the 1970s and 1980s peanut oil became a common practice and ingredient in vaccines. Coincidentally, peanut allergies began rising exponentially in children as more vaccines were administered. Heather Fraser in her 2010 book, The History of the Peanut Allergy Epidemic, documents this.
            So, yeah, it has been well documented that peanut oil has been a major ingredient in the manufacturing of vaccines and continues to be used (but is not listed, since it is not a "major" ingredient.)
  •  now that one of our resident anti-vax nutters has (0+ / 0-)

    piped up, I am mildly curious as to how many of the others will join in.  Or if they will play it smart and shut their mouths.

    They should all be bojo'd for idiotic CT crackpottery.

    In the end, reality always wins.

    by Lenny Flank on Sat Aug 16, 2014 at 10:48:25 PM PDT

  •  Your condescending, disrespectful tone stinks. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    And just so you know, condescension does nothing to support any kind of scientific proof. Ultimately you suffer from the same delusion you accuse "anti-vaxers" of, which is that you seem to believe that you do have scientific proof that there is no potentially appreciable danger from vaccinating every single child with man-made serums.

    Not only do you not have any proof that vaccines are perfectly safe. On the contrary you do have absolute proof that vaccines can, will and do harm individual kids. So please quit following the piss-poor lead of this unfortunate jerk you link to, "Orac", and try to stick to real science if that is what you really are all about.

    "Have a good time... all the time." -Viv Savage

    by The House on Sun Aug 17, 2014 at 05:22:00 AM PDT

    •  (sniffle) (sob) boo hoo hoo (0+ / 0-)

      The anti-vaxers are anti-science crackpots who KILL people with their idiotic horse shit.

      They deserve all the scorn and contempt that they get.

      And it pains me greatly to see anti-vax nutballs here in the reality-based community. Your tinfoil-hat CT just makes us all look like InfoWars kooks, and you should all be bojo'd, along with creationists, global-warming deniers, Holocaust-deniers and 9-11 Truthers.

      In the end, reality always wins.

      by Lenny Flank on Sun Aug 17, 2014 at 07:47:55 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Interesting how those who can't cope with (0+ / 0-)

        the fact that both science and the world are very complex are so motivated to call those they disagree with names. It is entirely childish. You don't get what you want so you sniffle, sob and name call... which, btw, in no way supports any kind of case in support of science. It seems that fear has debilitated your sensibilities. I hope your mental health improves soon.

        "Have a good time... all the time." -Viv Savage

        by The House on Sun Aug 17, 2014 at 08:10:05 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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