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The tweet has since then been deleted but has been quoted in many articles even one defending Leigh Alexander.
Throughout this massive internet uprising the voices of blacks and minorities in support of it have been ignored by a white dominated media that found them inconvenient. I see this problem as being created by a white centered perspective on social justice that has naturally come to dominate the discourse. This perspective focuses on white inclusive identity groups such as women and LBGT which is good and well if not for the fact those agendas actively marginalize issues of race, class or material social influence or power which are far more significant in terms of addressing the most disadvantaged groups in society.

These other forms of privilege beyond identity that are far more substantial like being a well connected person with the power to spin media narratives that favor your interest. You might be the one who decides where the money goes, or who get's hired. In white centered social justice identity comes before power, because the last thing privileged whites want is to do is appear as powerful as they really while mimicking the role of under privileged. You also have proxy victims where people  claim the cause of others identities to avoid scrutiny or extend their own influence. Phonies play dirty identity politics sugarcoating bitter pills of injustice with buzzwords and misinterpreting social theories far removed from their relevant context to push self serving agenda.

 The narratives centered on white identities don't control for class or race thus is optimized for the benefit of middle to upper class whites already dominating strong positions of influence while claiming identity oppression. These elite favoring white narratives can't be challenged without a free and open discourse on social justice which is impeded by the intimidating power of white media privileging whites who they know attract more sympathy from white audiences. Minority and the poor are ignored or silenced by elites who'd rather fixate on the issues of those within their tight social circles where authentic minority interest wither in obscurity. Only minorities playing the white game will get a voice. This extends well beyond the issues of Gaming or Tech, and is an indictment of intersectionality itself.  

This post doesn't explain #GamerGate which is unbelievably complex. Here are some links that will get you started from journalist who aren't restrained by a desire to protect their cronies in the media, their political source of influence, or themselves. You'll find many are from the center or right because they're among the few journalist who haven't been invested in playing up identity politics for years.

#GamerGate  An Issue With Two Sides

The Gender Games: Sex, Lies, and Videogames

GamerGate: A Closer Look At The Controversy Sweeping Video Games (6 weeks old.)

Gaming Journalism Is Over 'The gaming press declares that gamers are dead. But they are the ones who are becoming obsolete.' -Slate

Twitter Is Broken 'It stresses conflict over consensus. It rewards trolling instead of reasoned debate. And #GamerGate proves it.' - Slate(Reveals abusive behavior by those in the press)

The August 28 online media bomb that has since then only been amplified by the mainstream. The media has been hate and fear mongering against gamers so aggressively it makes the discussion of Muslims in the aftermath of  9/11 seem tame. What people need to ask themselves is do they really trust a press that regards Americans a the enemy for playing video games? The powers like be don't like losing control, and they will do everything in their power to stop it.
Black support for #GamerGate has been quite strong. Despite the self serving narrative put forth by the media to silence their critics me and a great many other minorities have flocked to the cause raising the issues of white privilege and marginalization with strong support from diverse community in GamerGate.  This was essential to the cause because we had many white men & women in the media speaking for minorities making dubious claims about 'sockpuppets' and 'Uncle Toms' along with women being accused of 'internalized misogyny' who rallied in defense of Gamer identity after over a dozen major media outlets declared that identity 'Dead' supposedly to defense of women and minorities.

A video by a black man going under 'EventStatus' was made in response to this post:

This white man's (SJW) explanation for why minorities are "wrong" to support #GamerGate:

How They Are Wrong
I feel terrible for these people. Again, like the last group, they fail to see their place in the bigger picture, however the tragedy is multiplied tenfold. They are being manipulating into supporting a system that is rigged against them, and they are being manipulated with catchphrases like "egalitarianism," "meritocracy of ideas," and "equality of thought." I understand that they want to be treated as just another person equal to any other in game culture, but they think the way to achieve this is to support the status quo: a system that is systematically designed to trivialize and rationalize real-life racism and sexism.
Do you see the problem? I'm sure this video response will explain it.

There are a lot of privileged white's in the media who've become complacent in speaking for minorities. The same is true for women but minorities have the distinction of being outside of white circles hampering their ability to challenges the narratives put forth.  That said the voices of #GamerGate women have also ignored in favor of the 'chosen' establishment victims controlling and dominating coverage in the media.

There's an assumption that progressive politics is some unifying cause from which any privileged person can take for themselves the moral authority that comes with speaking for the disadvantaged rather than empowering those people to speak for themselves. What we get is a privilege filter that decides who and what is permissible to talk about by only allowing minorities to speak if and when they agree with their narrative.

For example:

Who does this black man speak for? The defense of his fellow white gaming journalist who decided putting forth yet another threatened white women were no longer made them appear sufficiently diverse. If he were to step outside their narrative he'd be blackballed like many people before him in a industry dominated by tight social cliques. Diversity isn't worth very much when the price is forced assimilation to myopic social perspectives. Freedom to think and believe different things is the diversity of substance not tokenism. The elite protect these systems of belief to protect their own power. If you're a Arch Bishop in the church you have more to lose from reformation than a lowly priest. Actual equality is dumped because the lowly priest might end up having equal voice.  What we get 'some animals are more equal than others'.

 The public isn't rising up to wage culture wars, it's actively resisting a unaccountable media elite that has long held them in contempt. It could be said a culture war waged on them through  corrupted identity politics detached form social justice that white journalists have long used to impose coercive control over their peers that has now been extended to the general public. These are white people for themselves as compared to gamers who are diverse and have long embraced diversity. Millions of diverse gamers around the world stand up to reject Gaming Journalist for resorting to a campaign of vicious and stereotyping to malign and subdue them.

 Imagine white supremacist promising to sustain a campaign of hate mongering against blacks in the media until blacks submitted to their dominance without question. That's essentially what the gaming press and wider media by extension has done to gamers. It's far worse than Fox News attacks on Occupy Wall Street. Imagine if the bankers constructed the entire narrative? Would they really allow the public to openly question their integrity? Of course not, and for the similar reasons you don't trust the press to judge fairly critics of the press.

You should be aware of Jack Thompsonwho liberals strongly opposed and was inundated with rape and death threats that didn't garner him much sympathy but I digress...
I find it odd how this reversal of values takes place simply by changing the motive behind it but oppression regardless of it's excuse is the same animal. The rise of McCarthyism was also fueled by fear over identity and ideology. Such fanaticism does not liberate us and is readily abused by the powerful to become more powerful.

The Black man who created the #NotYourShield hashtag which is in support of #GamerGate was harassed out of his job.

#NotYourShield was created to counter a media narrative that #GamerGate was a movement of Cis White Males that elevated the voices of women, minorities & LBGT
Here are the women of #GamerGate being interviewed on Huffington Post Live:
Black men are now living in fear of white progressives who will penalize them for disagreeing with whatever narrative on social justice they put forth. I'm one of those black men and I'm fearful of making this post despite being a life long liberal who sees social justice as a means of liberation for my beleaguered people.  The consensus of around simplistic narratives that make progressive whites feel good and noble isn't one that's inviting to those with opposing views of any kind. Too often the first response is to shame, ban or block. This isn't inclusive, it's exclusive.

We have unapologetic racist demanding "violent backlash" against ghetto black men being put forth as heroes of progressive values like Leigh Alexander who was featured in a prior DailyKos post on the issue. I take that as a threat of genocidal racial violence when as a black man living in a white majority country where unarmed black men gunned down by whites causes whites to rally around their shooters.  This women said "Can I start it?".  

I found this profound critique of intersectional feminsm as it relates to #GamerGate: Harassment, Abuse, and Apologism: Sanitizing Abuse in Social Justice Spheres

You see, because our communitys basic standards function on a mixture of middle-class privilege and basic overviews of oppression, social justice rhetoric can be easily exploited by individuals who secretly have ulterior motives for entering activist spheres. You can be an abuser, manipulator, and exploiter behind closed doors: but if you regurgitate the right words, we will think you a™re a good person by default. If you work Really Hard(tm) to bring activism into your life, we will immediately give you the benefit of the doubt. And we accept this as an unquestioning, uncritical fact. Because, after all, why would anyone who seems so compassionate want to hurt people?
I strongly recommend reading the entire post.

Here is another post I think is worthy to understand the mentality of those coopting the struggles of others to empower themselves. Of herself she's said "I suffered through over a decade of physical and sexual abuse at the hands of my caretakers." :

More on her background:

I had no involvement in GamerGate or NotYourShield until I was attacked by their opposition. I avoid identity politics the same way I avoid other sources of faceless drama. This wasn't always the case. Up until a few years ago I worked as a community advocate and inclusion facilitator for the type of worthy causes Social Justice types gush over. I began with high ambitions but in reality no one involved really wanted to change anything. They wanted to fuss over victims, not stop people from being hurt. By the time the Warrior Class of Social Justice enthusiast targeted me for harassment I had already made my resolution; if I could live my life well and take care of myself and the people I care about, it would do more good in the world than empty words and promises. I quit my job and moved on.
In fact, a great many of them originated in the Gamer community. They are white, middle class, cisgender men who project this stereotype back onto the community. In doing so they distract from the fact that they do not share or understanding the experiences of women or marginalized people and have absolutely no right to claim they represent them.

They are spoiled and privileged to such an extent that (much in the same way disadvantaged people fetishize money or success) they fantasize about and fetishize oppression and hardship. Oppression is SJW bling.

Evidently they view the social and political struggles common to marginalized communities as something more 'authentic' and 'worthy' than their own sheltered existence. Oppression is commodified for consumption while the oppressed are infantalized and silenced so they do not expose these privileged people as the role-playing frauds they really are.

These problems are magnified when media under the control of these sorts of people is used to malign any dissent thrown their way from the public. Minorities are apart of that public. I feel as progressives we must embrace pluralism in ideology as well as identity. Those seeking hegemonic control of the social justice narrative end up establishing the very systems of oppression they were meant to dismantle:
That bit of the oppressor is in us all.  We want to control the world and have it reflect our values to the exclusion of others who may think differently.  If we are lucky enough to be privileged and have power we may use it to suppress dissent and vilify those who disagree with us.  These are dangerous things indeed.  White supremacy created such a ideological hegemony and we're still wrapped up in it's other influences aside from unavoidable realities of living as a minority in a white dominated society.

There was also a black gaming journalist who spoke out about how he was treated in these Gaming Media circles:

My week in interacting with the angriest
of consumer revolts

From my experience and conversations with others, the unspoken rule of being a black game journalist was like that archaic thought of how children should be in society: Seen and not heard. If you a™re going to be in that space the general expectation is that you keep your head down, shut up, and go with the flow; I was never good at doing any of those things. Of interesting note, none of these behaviors were ever present when I would speak with a developer; In fact they were pleasantly surprised and almost always welcoming to my point of view or insight. I would almost universally receive this negative treatment when dealing with other game journalists, or the general game enthusiast.
On the diversity of #GamerGate:
he narrative against Gamergate has been that they are nothing but a bunch of angry white men on the internet that hate women and minorities; I have found that to be outright false, in my experience. In fact, I have spoken to and interacted with an even split of men AND women gamers, other minorities, transgender individuals, those of varied sexual preferences , and more.
How he felt about the supporters:
I can't speak of everyones experience in dealing with members of Gamergate, but the majority of what I have personally seen and experienced is that they are passionate people, they'™re incredibly smart and savvy consumers, they are ridiculous levels of inviting and inclusive, and almost anyone that shows up is welcomed with open arms. My experience has been pretty much the direct OPPOSITE of the narrative that has been pushed about these people.
The media is a powerful weapon indeed as can succinctly be expressed by two quotes from Malcolm X:
 
Malcolm X often fell victim to deceptive media narratives painting him and his followers as a radial threat to White America.  The media can have us believe they are the oppressed and the people are oppressors for opposing them. The media can have us believe the guilty are innocent and the innocent guilty.  I've seen a lot of this in #GamerGate.  We ought not trust media when it's acting to silence those who criticize it through a ubiquitous demagogic campaigns of fear mongering. As a liberal and progressive my first impulse is to stand with the people against unaccountable power and I think in this case that is certainly the side of justice.

We must tread very careful with demagoguery. I'm strangely privileged in being able to speak on the black perspective because the mess we've made of identity politics allows few to challenge the group thinks of dominant whites and that certainly excludes the often maligned white male.  I am not privileged in having a platform much larger than this on which to speak.  I plead for understanding while knowing there are many hostile to dissent who will seek to silence me or dismiss my this as trivial because more prominent figures in white social justice have raised the alarm. This isn't anything new. As a black man I'm under no illusions as who holds the power in this country.  

If you want to understand more about why these people have dedicated themselves to the cause of #GamerGate you can read this:  

#GamerGate  An Issue With Two Sides

The freedom to dissent isn't something I take lightly regardless of my politics. Oppressors rely on that kind of power and in their unscrupulous hands it can and will be abused. I've seen it done too much.  If we can't be critical of our own media and demand they be held accountable by adherence to journalistic ethics just like the kind we demand for Fox News then we'd end up handing our power over to unaccountable unelected people who can abuse anyone who dares challenge them using their 'megaphone' as Leigh Alexander put it. The 5th estate is emergent but if we are to trust it then it too must be bound by these principals. In this particular instance the credibility and integrity of social justice itself depends on it.

Understandable Contempt for the right wing aside, if it was not for that pluralism within the media then all these diverse people may have been silenced. We need to make sure in the future the people can count on progressive voices to stand by them instead of letting those in the media seeking to avoid criticism cynically exploit our progressive politics for their own ends.

This commodified and weaponized social justice being wielded in defense of privileged figures in the media seeking to protect their influence is not the real deal. It's a hustle. We would not go to General Motors to be the sole voice on a consumer uprising against their company nor should we rely on solely on Gaming Journalist and their cronies for perspective on those questioning their ethics.

  Diversionary tactics such as a focus on the threats of trolls which goes both ways with a prominent centrist GamerGate supporter receiving threats that went ignored by media carefully crafting a biased narrative. Focusing on these threats is akin to fixating on the Looters in Ferguson. #GamerGate is a leaderless consumer uprising that does not control the entire internet. They've been made scapegoats by those who want them silenced.

Power to the People...

Ranging from 35,000 to 125,000 tweets a day for 2 months this is a monumental effort of consumer protest. We owe them more than accepting a one sided account from those whom they are protesting against. If you have any questions about #GamerGate feel free to ask those on the Hash Tag
This might help those responding to the Poll confront the daunting complexity of #GamerGate:
The ideologies are quite radical when stripped from their substance to promote the implausible narratives that men & women, left & right, black & white have joined forces to oppose diversity in gaming.
Poll

Do you feel disingenuous approach to social justice is being used by the press to silence their critics?

43%7 votes
12%2 votes
43%7 votes

| 16 votes | Vote | Results

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Comment Preferences

  •  Looks to me like the trolls are winning (4+ / 0-)

    The trolls have everyone fighting. They must be gleeful.

    “Industry does everything they can and gets away with it almost all the time, whether it’s the coal industry, not the subject of this hearing, or water or whatever. They will cut corners, and they will get away with it. " Sen. Jay Rockefeller, D, WVa

    by FishOutofWater on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 07:59:56 AM PDT

    •  Who are the trolls? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Kickemout

      I have a problem with the usage of this word of late because it seems people will label whoever disagrees with them a troll. I don't think you can get large numbers of people to voluntarily fight for nothing. You will at the least have to convince them they are fighting for something even if it is nothing.  

      In this case I see the essential value of people standing up to those in positions of power be it a School Principal pushing zero tolerance policies or a abusive journalist spreading their disdain for certain identities through the mass media.

       The resistance of the public to those who misuse power is what keeps a Democracy responsive to the public's interests and the media is a vital institution in that democracy.  Poor coverage has moved far beyond gaming press and I fear that the press and their internal agendas is having too much influence over what we're seeing covered.

      @WikiLeaks said as much:

  •  Different feminists have pointed out (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    BeingHuman

    that the master minds behind institutionalized oppression, need tools or chumps on the front lines, who actually carry out their dirty work.

    The tools are visible and easily scapegoated. They're the street punk or the petty bureaucrat, who is disproportionally PoC or female. These tools become hated symbols in the public consciousness, absorbing and neutralizing the frustration of the oppressed.

    We see the same dynamic here, with the easy scapegoating of the "hooded thug" (PoC, of course) harassing a woman from the car.

    Thanks for the important discussion.

    "Come, come, whoever you are. Wanderer, worshiper, lover of leaving. It doesn't matter. Ours is not a caravan of despair. Come, even if you have broken your vows a thousand times. Come, yet again, come, come." --Rumi

    by karmsy on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 08:11:02 AM PDT

  •  WTF is gamergate? (2+ / 0-)

    It's some feminists criticizing the rampant misogyny in gaming, right?

    Maybe there's something to the idea that games rot your brain.

  •  Wow. You troll hard, don't you? Too bad your co... (4+ / 0-)

    Wow. You troll hard, don't you? Too bad your comment history gives you away.

    •  I'm not a troll. I'm a fucking human being. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Brecht

      Yes I can say things that authoritarian shallow as hell white liberals don't agree with because in their infinite hive mind of wisdom they have figured out every social justice angle  and computed the ideal route to end all oppression that some how manages to center around putting themselves and their friends first. Most minorities don't live in your hoods. Your privileged peoples identity games don't do jack for us.

       What I've learned form #GamerGate is your kind of liberal is corrupt and power hungry. It's not the kind I should not waste time trusting or begging for approval. You'd throw a thousand black men like me under the bus to elevate yourselves notch and not think twice.

        I don't agree with you. I don't support you, and I don't like you.  If I were gone and banned all you do is prove me right. I have to fear the whites of today more than those of the last generation because they could at least tolerate dissenting views. If not for that quality black civil rights would have had no one in White America it could rely on for support. The baby boomers understood because they saw what people with mentalities like yours did them. I hope you learn some decency because I can't take more of this McCarthyism in what supposed to be the party of diversity.

      •  To repeat what someone else wrote, you are fool... (4+ / 0-)

        To repeat what someone else wrote, you are fooling no one. We see you.

      •  I'm sorry you've been so torched and pitchforked (0+ / 0-)

        here at Daily Kos, BeingHuman. You've made 51 comments here, had 58 Hide Rates dropped on them - and most of those HRs were just a mob pushing back against your opinions, which were going against their flow.

        This does mean, if you want to stay on Daily Kos, and not get banned, you really need to watch yourself. When you see someone coming your way with a pitchfork, the best response is often not to reply. Because they're not interested in listening and grokking your views, they're just looking for more ammunition to rip you apart. If you do reply to someone, you're often fighting uphill here, as you do come across as something of a Men's Rights Advocate, which is anathema to DKos. You came to DKos when everyone was furious about Eliot Rodgers, and immediately raised a lot of hackles and got a bad rep. So when you do argue, you can't afford to get angry or personal - people will gladly smack you down, given any excuse, as an unwelcome interloper.

        I'll give one example of how you've been T&P'ed. Our rule here is "Rate the comment, not the commenter". But here's a comment you made, which got 10 HRs:

        People can STFU to avoid causing offense but... (0+ / 10-)
        The sad thing is that's not a conversation. People can just stop talking until you cease to be angry or offer empty statements of support just to make you happy.

         If you want to change hearts and minds you have to have a open and honest conversation and STFU won't work for that.  We're old enough to understand that fear dominating a space making once free people into pliant drones who'll lie about what they believe to avoid being made a target is not optimal.

         Civility and the free exchange of ideas is progress not retreating to unthinking smug dismissal of all contrary views to protect rigid orthodoxies. The enlightenment brought us out of one dark age, civil & women's rights out of another.  We don't have to sacrifice freethought to treat people as equals and with respect. This is not new to us, we have done this all before and with more grace.

        Anger has it's limits. Great people who moved mountains to free their people had anger, but they also spoke from a place of love and compassion that touched more hearts than their anger ever could have.  We all have rage inside us for some injustice, but it's a choice whether or not we let that rage rule our lives.

        We don't usually drag hidden comments into the light here, because they get hidden for being ugly or offensive. But your comment got pounded into the dirt, even though it was just a differing opinion - it wasn't even impolite. So why did it get hidden?

        Here are the comments from the first two kossacks who dropped HRs:

        Civility free exchange of ideas progress (10+ / 0-)
        protecting rigid orthodoxies blah blah blah says the MRA troll who signed up the day after Elliot Rodger's rampage.

        (and)

        I'd say HOS (= Hide On Sight) (16+ / 0-)
        based on comment history and a huge concern about "male bashing" and female civility etc.

        I don't like to always be the first one to say that it fits a particular user. If there is agreement, I'll HR.

        And, in response to that second comment, moviemeister76 wrote:
        I've been saying it since his first day n/t (10+ / 0-)
        So moviemeister76 decided long ago that you're a troll, and doesn't want to listen, just wants to drive you from the site. And several other kossacks feel the same way.

        Frankly, in the culture of DKos, which is extremely SJW-friendly, you are a bit trollish. But you clearly put a lot of thought and work into this long diary - so you're making a good-faith effort to contribute to the conversation at DKos, and broaden it in a positive way to include more viewpoints. I wish you luck with that. Be more savvy, if you can. If you get angry with someone who you feel is poking at you with a pitchfork, consider not replying to them - or at least take the time to frame and edit your reply with great care, so there's nothing insulting or derogatory in it. You're walking on thin ice at DKos, with all the HRs you've already been skewered with.

        •  Yes, that's it exactly, Brecht. I'm clearly jus... (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          pico, susans, bakeneko

          Yes, that's it exactly, Brecht. I'm clearly just an idiotic, emotional woman incapable of rational thought who irrationally decided this person is trolling. It has nothing to do whatsoever with my vast history of dealing with sexism and being able to see it better than you. But please, continue giving cover to sexist dudes at this site. You are so good at it, after all.

          •  I have a much higher opinion of you than that. (0+ / 0-)

            However, a month ago I was making reasoned arguments, and you were failing to comprehend them and caricaturing and dismissing them. So I know that your drama can swamp your logic, sometimes.

            As I concluded then, "We're not going to make much progress here, if you can't be bothered to have a fair and thoughtful conversation."

          •  Yeah it's all about sexism... (0+ / 0-)

            Your fixation white inclusive forms of oppression tells me something. You're probably white. It's amazing how complacent I've become with watching whites ignore minority issues. If I took black out the title I'd probably double the hits. Every compare the hits/comments on articles about racism versus sexism?  Ever compare the results for 'male privilege' to 'white privilege'?  Minorities aren't half the population and they are vastly poorer people.  Whites would rather ignore their problems if at all possible and focusing on sexism makes that a lot easier. That's the point I was trying to make.  The fact is race correlated issues are vastly more serious but get a fraction of the attention.  I don't expect whites to pull away from putting their self interest first but I also don't want them pretending they discovered oppression and are here to teach the rest of us what it means. I'm not going to call you a racist but a lot of people get crazy selfish with social justice demanding others focus on the pebble in their shoe while ignoring the people with no shoes right next to them. That's not cool.

            •  Now you're playing the victim card, and ignorantly (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              poco, bakeneko, susans

              Yes, those complaints hold against US culture in general. But they hardly apply to Daily Kos. Your making them proves you aren't paying enough attention to the site you're joining here.

              Daily Kos has a vibrant and vocal black contingent, which gets a lot of support from most prominent kossacks. If you truly care about racism and systemic oppression of blacks in the US (and I assume you do), then you should be reading the diaries by the Black Kos Group. You'll also find great, in-depth coverage of black issues from all sorts of angles written by many of our front page writers, such as: Denise Oliver Velez, Egberto Willies, shanikka and Frank Vyan Walton.

              BeingHuman, I've been sticking up for you because you seem to me to be making a sincere effort to speak your mind in a way that engages other kossacks in healthy conversation. But you're not trying hard enough, and you're failing to connect. If you believe that there's a place for your voice on this blog, then you need to put more time, effort and sensitivity into listening and understanding the conversation that was going on here long before you came, and will continue after you leave here. Once you get a larger grasp of that, and of our whole community and culture, you may find better ways to fit yourself in here.

              •  How real am I allowed to be? (0+ / 0-)

                "Look we have blacks and they play ball"

                Yeah I get that but I'm not them. I actually like thinking for myself and if your community is centered on getting approval from group thinking cliques then this isn't going to work out. My critique is valid as ever because throughout the comments only one person has even engaged on the race issue while most deflect back to their gender comfort zone.  Race issues are marginalized. Dominance is granted to gender perspectives favoring whites and I end up having to beg whites for approval on how I talk about black men. This is a oppressive mess and maybe some more self reflection as community on questions of free thought and diverse perspectives so people don't have to be phony just to get along.

                •  You aren't talking about black men. You're (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  bakeneko, poco

                  bitching about everybody else. There was nothing whatsoever substantive about actual black issues in gaming included in your diary that wasn't immediately subsumed in a rant against liberals.

                  Tell us specifically about how you, as a black man, have been oppressed by the gamer community - either side of it. Give some specifics as to what games are so lily white that you feel like an interloper whenever you play them - and tell us why you keep playing them anyway. Something substantive might get you a more substantive answer.

                  As it is, you present the general case, assume that we're all against it (generally, we are; death threats tend to be taken seriously here), and gripe that we won't agree with you that it signifies racial oppression. Huh?

                •  Quite possibly your most fucked-up comment to date (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Brecht
                  "Look we have blacks and they play ball"
                  ...directed at Black Kos, Denise, Egberto, shanikka, Vyan and others here? Maybe chaunceydevega, JoanMar and brooklynbadboy as well?

                  How clueless, dismissive and flat-out rude can you possibly be?

                  Inside of me are two dogs. One is mean and evil. The other is gentle and good. The two dogs fight all the time. Which dog wins? The one I feed the most.

                  by bakeneko on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 01:03:25 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

          •  Rational thought. (0+ / 0-)

            Keep in mind that you're unlikely to convince the person you are talking with until long after the conversation you have with them (if ever).  The main beneficiaries of your conversation are likely to be people reading the chain of comments and making their own conclusions about your conversation.

            Just because a sexist attitude is easy for you to spot, calling it out directly is not optimal because lots of people don't have that experience.  It's better to approach it from either a critical perspective and ask questions about the viewpoint, or give a detailed explanation.

            •  That's a very male perspective (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              poco, bakeneko, serendipityisabitch

              Here's the problem with it: Being a woman who men require to explain to them all the time how something is sexist is exhausting It really is. It's a never-ending task that many men just expect us women to perform as politely as possible so I don't hurt their damn feelings, to hell with how it makes me and other women feel. Some days, I don't have the damn energy for it.

              Two hundred fifty years of slavery. Ninety years of Jim Crow. Sixty years of separate but equal. Thirty-five years of racist housing policy. Until we reckon with our compounding moral debts, America will never be whole. - Ta-Nehisi Coates

              by moviemeister76 on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 06:55:31 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Sometimes it's also blindingly obvious (4+ / 0-)

                when such efforts would be a colossal waste of time.

              •  Yes it is exhausting. (0+ / 0-)

                But every time a conversation about ideas takes place could be the first time someone encounters an idea.

                Not that it's always possible or even optimal to approach every conversation in the way I suggested (I don't do that 100% of the time either), it's just something that should be considered.

                •  Well (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  serendipityisabitch, bakeneko

                  You think I don't know that? Do you think it's easy having to live with the fact that an entire group of people thinks I'm less than just because of my gender, and so doesn't take what I say seriously? I know you are trying to be polite here, but you are coming off as condescending, lecturing me as if I haven't been through this many times before. Some days, I just don't have the patience for men who write sexist nonsense, especially when male regulars at this site are always quick to rush to their defense if I'm not really polite to them and offer them cookies for being liberal.

                  Besides, other women did offer polite critiques in this diary, and look what that got them? The same defensive bullshit from both the diarist and Brecht. Honing in on me in this seems a bit unfair. I can't be the sole weapon against sexism every damn day. We have some fantastic men and women at this site who step up when one of us has had enough all the time. Same goes with the topic of racism, though not as often as it does with sexism, primarily because there's way more white folks here.

                  Either way, I think I've earned at least one day where I can call a spade a spade and not have to take shit for it.

                  Two hundred fifty years of slavery. Ninety years of Jim Crow. Sixty years of separate but equal. Thirty-five years of racist housing policy. Until we reckon with our compounding moral debts, America will never be whole. - Ta-Nehisi Coates

                  by moviemeister76 on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 07:44:18 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                •  Well, that's when you haven't already watched (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  bakeneko, Paul Rogers

                  the same person ignore those arguments repeatedly in favor of a meme that goes "you just like to pick on men, and that's why you're ignoring the real problems men have." There are several variants of that one walking around the site, as well as all the milder strains (including "Why are you getting so angry about this, anyway. Calm down and be rational.")

                  Sorry, Paul, but you have (I believe truly inadvertently) proved moviemeister76's point for her. Not convinced? Imagine directing that comment to Lenny Flank when he's on a roll about GMOs or anti-vaxers. Imagine what response you'd get. ;)

                  •  Yeah, possibly. (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    serendipityisabitch, bakeneko

                    I know a little about Lenny Flank's comment history because we've participated together in comment threads.  When his responses didn't seem justified to me, I have told him the same thing before, though.

                    It wasn't clear to me whether the diarist was honestly mistaken or dishonestly trolling, though comment history would have probably revealed that.  I probably should've tried looking at that first to find out.

        •  P.S. I recced your comment for its subject line, (0+ / 0-)

          "I'm not a troll. I'm a fucking human being."

          The body of your comment was too angry, judgmental, labeling, counterproductive. If you rise above your righteous rancor, and maintain civility and clarity even when others dismiss you unfairly, then you may persuade a lot of kossacks that you're committed to good-faith debate and able to help create a bigger tent for it here on DKos.

          Moviemeister76 is a white woman, but I think she cares and knows a fair amount about racism against blacks in the US. Her last diary was Discounting Black Pain.

        •  You know, Brecht, sometimes context matters (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          bakeneko

          quite a bit. I went back to the original diary and took a look, and that comment managed to ignore not only the original diary, but  most of the replies, as though they had never been written. Quite telling, actually.

          •  But THIS diary is not trolling at all. BeingHuman (0+ / 0-)

            put a lot of thought and work, here and now, into opening up an ongoing debate to include more points of view - so why is moviemeister76 jumping in to beat him up over his errors from months gone by? Don't we want people to learn from feedback, and contribute to our conversations in more constructive ways?

            Most people who got as jumped on as BeingHuman has been would have walked away from DKos by now. You can see from my comments that I think BeingHuman still has a lot to learn. But they're trying pretty hard, which is why I'm standing up for them here.

            I think BeingHuman has some blinders they need to see past. I think each of us does. But BeingHuman has commented in 18 different diaries, so they are trying to listen to us and hear what we all have to say. They clearly listened to you: out of their 75 comment ratings, 4 of them were recs on your comments.

            Tempers were pretty high here, around Eliot Rodger and the STFU diaries. A lot of us were talking loudly and not listening well. I thought the first STFU diary made some good points, but was so strident that the unconverted who most needed to listen to its message would never hear it. In hindsight, it was a necessary explosion, because it led to a lot of discussion on many issues we needed to think about.

            What I want to see on DKos is space for expressing a plethora of viewpoints, and more encouragement and guidance offered to those who have interesting voices to contribute, but who may not understand how to get their ideas across clearly and considerately towards others. Or, who may just not understand DKos culture enough to speak in a way to get us listening.

            •  Brecht, you were calling moviemeister out on her (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              bakeneko, Paul Rogers

              HR of that particular comment, I believe, which is why I replied as I did. And complimenting BeingHuman on it. My point was that, in context, it's debatable whether there was anything to compliment.

              I agree that a fair amount of work went into this diary, but it doesn't gel as an argument against the charges of misogyny which have been raised, which is what I read as its intention. And although I thought my question below was fairly neutral, the answer it got was, effectively, stfu. (I'm paraphrasing.)

        •  Sorry, Brecht, but gamergate is not (4+ / 0-)

          black or white, but is all about trashing women and our allies for pointing out sexism in gaming. Gamergate advocates are suggesting women commit suicide, are offering to rape, torture and kill women. Where is the racism there?

          You know me. You know me personally. I have been following this issue since the very beginning, I know all about it and I find the juxtaposition of topics from the OP is incorrect and incoherent.

      •  You're here to preach & have no patience to listen (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bakeneko

        I respect the thought and the work you put into writing this diary. But after reading every single comment you've made in response to criticism, you're too righteous about your convictions and unresponsive to this community to learn anything. If you can't wisen up and get calmer and kinder fast, you're going to be banned from Daily Kos in the next several months.

        I'm replying to this particular comment of yours, because it was your second in this diary. Moviemeister76 said a line and a half, and you gave 19 lines in reply. So most of those 19 lines weren't replying to what you read, they were just spouting the convictions you brought into this diary before anyone said a word to you. They map out, for us, the huge chip on your shoulder.

        Yes I can say things that authoritarian shallow as hell white liberals don't agree with because in their infinite hive mind of wisdom they have figured out every social justice angle. . . Your privileged peoples identity games don't do jack for us.
        You're here to preach, you're on a righteous crusade to puncture what you see as propaganda. You're going to rip it away and force us to confront the truth. But there's a whole lot of truth on this blog that you haven't even started to look for. Along with the anger and condescension you've aroused with your comments, there have been a lot of sound opinions and evidence given against your arguments. You can't be right about every single thing - yet you're dismissive towards every critic, you're not even taking the time to find the ones who make the most sense, and engaging with them to create a constructive debate. All you want to do is score points and make this "infinite hive mind of wisdom" look stupid.

        Therefore, it's unlikely that you'll take my advice here, and read and learn more here before you crash and burn. Just in case your ears are open, though, please check out this diary: #GamerGate. The battle on the internet you haven't heard of. It was written from the opposite perspective to yours. It has 498 comments and 184 recs. Now, you can dismiss those numbers with, "Of course, it speaks to the hive mind". What I'm asking you to do is skim through it and, when you get to the comments, read the 48 made by Tyshalle. Now, Tyshalle's only been here 2 weeks longer than you, hasn't written any diaries - but has written 6 times as many comments as you. They've been going into more diaries and figuring out (better than you) the entirety of what DKos is about. They've been listening and learning.

        Some of Tyshalle's comments are very long, some are going deep into discussions of particular games - but some are making the same points you're making, but much more effectively. Because Tyshalle's not preaching at all, they're building good-faith balanced conversation. If you can't do more of that, there is no place for you on DKos - you really don't belong here.

        What I've learned form #GamerGate is your kind of liberal is corrupt and power hungry. It's not the kind I should not waste time trusting or begging for approval.
        There's your problem, in a nutshell. You're convinced we're all tools. So why are you wasting any time here, when you don't think there's intelligent conversation to be had?

        Or, if your problem is just those kossacks who are a specific "kind of liberal", then why are you putting so much work into baiting that subset you don't respect, instead of exploring DKos and looking for other voices to engage with. Having been here 10 years I assure you, we do have liberals and feminists - but we also have libertarians, socialists, progressives, militant blacks, transgender activists, deeply-informed native Americans, Zionists, Palestinians, pragmatists, centrists and anarchists. So if all you see here is an "infinite hive mind of wisdom", then you haven't begun to look.

        I don't agree with you. I don't support you, and I don't like you.  If I were gone and banned all you do is prove me right.
        Aha. Your real agenda. If your actual purpose here is any more enlightened than this jihad mission statement, it's going to take a lot of listening and learning on your part to show it. Because all you're doing so far is alienating thoughtful conversation and making a fool of yourself.
  •  There's nothing progressive about GamerGate. (6+ / 0-)

    While some of its goals may be laudable, the broader movement is completely toxic and thoroughly right-wing.

    •  Nothing progressive about BitterExboyfriendGate (8+ / 0-)

      and its only goal is to harass and threaten everyone but right-wing white men into silence.  Coordinated campaigns of thousands of rape threats, death threats, publishing personal information (including home addresses, social security #s and credit card #s) of anyone remotely connected with one of its targets - it's clear what the purpose is.  Just this week, Anita Sarkeesian was forced to cancel a talk on women in video games, because of the threat of a shooting massacre.  No there are not "two sides" to that issue.

      Here's the short version of BitterExboyfriendGate:

      Just a few days after credible, violent threats drove independent critic Anita Sarkeesian out of her home in late August, Depression Quest developer Zoë Quinn withstood a deluge of online harassment, which included the publication of her phone number along with nude photographs. This fury was sired by a bitter online missive from an ex-boyfriend, who accused her of cheating on him and, in a claim he later retracted, sleeping with a journalist, implicitly in exchange for favorable coverage of one of her products.

      What began with a series of moralistic, slut-shaming attacks on Quinn for her supposed infidelity soon turned into unfounded accusations of corruption throughout the industry—trading sex, and personal relationships in general, for good reviews. Those then metastasized into #GamerGate: a social media-fueled movement whose supporters, mostly young men, pledged to expose supposedly unethical practices in the world of games journalism and media. In truth, however, the campaign was apparently a deliberate effort to purge women and people of color from the fledgling world of independent gaming criticism by tarring them with allegations of fraudulence.

      In a stunning report, Quinn announced this past Saturday that she had been lurking in a planning room of the popular online message board 4chan for the last few weeks. Her screenshots expose what appears to be a sprawling campaign that weaponized unwitting anti-corruption gamers against any writer who mentioned so-called social justice issues, such as homophobia, racism, or—you guessed it—misogyny.

      According to Quinn’s logs, 4chan, an anonymous forum that has become infamous over the years for organized trolling and “raids,” provided public-relations instructions, created hashtags, and even encouraged forum users to impersonate people of color, all in order to sow dissension. And their tactics worked. By the time of Quinn’s exposé this weekend, many women had already vowed to leave the industry.

      But hey, thanks for the "black persepective."

      I shall die, but that is all that I shall do for Death; I am not on his payroll. - Edna St. Vincent Millay

      by Tara the Antisocial Social Worker on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 09:25:03 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  So you give gaming media propaganda (0+ / 0-)

        Why don't you go to the KKK for a objective analysis of the NAACP, because you seem to think that Gaming Journalist who's very jobs are on the line are a trustworthy source for perspective on a consumer uprising against them. These same Journalist would defend a Leigh Alexander who aside from her racism has doxxed he readers for just asking questions. I also see you fail to show a lick of concern for anyone who isn't in the high powered elite. The public is supposed to suffer this abuse for what? When and where do they get a voice?

        I don't care for this horrid aristocracy you're trying to prop up. They have too much power and too little respect for the people. That's not a good combination. People stood together against these people because they were hateful and abusive. It's intolerable that we'd have Gaming Journalist who got together and decided they'd encourage people to mock and abuse gamers.  The arrogance behind that behavior is the same reason this has gone on for months when it could have been ended with an apology. It's like the police who threw a flash bang in a babies crib, blowing up the child's face and not apologizing because everything was done by procedure.  Corrupt, unaccountable, POWER!

        You also ignore the harassment of GamerGate supporters, the  tens of thousands of men & women, black & white, Left & right worked their butts off to raise awareness only to have the people like you side with whoever has more power to push a narrative in the media in a battle with powerful people in the media. There is something deeply authoritarian about your biases.

         The black perspective is one that has always been on the losing side of authoritarian whites telling them where they stand in the society. We have our streets flooded with police so whites can move in and feel save. You'd mock that because it doesn't center on a white identity, and for your identity game you empowering the powerful works better than the reverse just like gentrification.

        •  LOL (4+ / 0-)

          You're not fooling anyone.

          I shall die, but that is all that I shall do for Death; I am not on his payroll. - Edna St. Vincent Millay

          by Tara the Antisocial Social Worker on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 10:06:33 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Look who's talking. (0+ / 0-)

            You can go the #GamerGate tag right now and so can anyone else. They will see rare full of it in no time at all. I have nothing to fear from the truth while you must spin a elaborate web of deception to protect powerful people who do terrible things to others. If not for their abuse of people I could care less, but the behavior is such that no professional in any field would defend this kind of conduct towards the public you serve.  Keep in mind this includes criminal acts like launching DDoS attacks against a Charity they didn't like.

            You can watch some grownups talk about these issues.

            Hosted by Erik Kain who wrote lengthy Forbes article linked above:

            Greg Tito (@gregtito) Editor-in-Chief at The Escapist.

            Janelle Bonanno (@s0osleepie) Editor-in-Chief at GameFront.com.

            TotalBiscuit (@Totalbiscuit) YouTuber at The Cynical Brit.

        •  This is ultimately what it comes down to: (6+ / 0-)
          It's intolerable that we'd have Gaming Journalist who got together and decided they'd encourage people to mock and abuse gamers.
          This oozes from the same sort of pseudo-victim entitlement that leads Christians to think they're the most persecuted people on earth, and men to shout "misandry" when they feel like they aren't getting their way. Gamers are not a persecuted class. Gamer journalism is not an oppressive elite. Women, who are both marginalized and harassed within the industry, do not deserve death threats because of a group of - let's repeat - entitled non-victims feel like they deserve it. Drawing parallels to the Klan, to white supremacist policies, to police violence? What a fucking joke.

          Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

          by pico on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 12:26:29 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Yes, overblown rhetoric. But there is corruption (0+ / 0-)

            throughout gamer journalism, and a self-righteous mob enforcing conformity of opinion in the framing of this whole story. There is no excuse for the death threats, but those are the work of a cabal of trolls, and don't represent the views or feelings of most gamers speaking out on this.

            Here is a Huffington Post interview with 3 women gamers:

            If you go to 14:40, you find Georgina Young, a Staff Writer for Gamesided, saying:

            It's a huge movement, and there is always gonna be a couple of people within that movement who, you know, aren't doing the nicest of things, and you're never gonna stop that with a movement of this scale. But at the same time, the vast majority of Gamergaters that I've spoken to, they're the nicest, intelligent, respectable people and they came and they approached me because of my article which was sort of hanging slightly on the anti-Gamergate side.

            When I wrote it they came to me and they said, "Well, if you want to know more about Gamergate then we're more than welcome, you know, to answer the questions." On the other side with the anti-gaters, they banned me, they called me - am I allowed to swear? - they called me "shitty", they started sending me harassing tweets, and actually I felt that if anything I was slightly fighting for them. But now I'm definitely completely neutral, if not leaning on the Gamergate side, because everyone there has been nothing but nice to me, and everyone on the other side has started to harass me actually.

            •  #notallgamers, right? (8+ / 0-)

              This is beneath contempt, man. This is Allen West saying that Republicans welcomed him in because Democrats are the real racists. This is Phyllis Schlafly calling feminists anti-women. Anyone whose ideological position is based on whether someone was "nice" to them is not what I'd call a useful voice on the issue.

              Gamergate didn't develop a "cabal of trolls": it started from there, attacking a woman for a marginal game that got marginal press, ostensibly under the banner of press corruption, but with no interest in addressing the widespread corruption that produces and promotes the game they like: it's a portion of the press who occasionally argues for better representation of women and minorities that came under attack for not listening to consumers. In fact (the diarist says below) the criticisms of gamers have been rooted in misandry! Misandry, fer chrissakes! That's the aggrieved class here, men who flipped their shit over positive press for a female developer. So, no: fuck anyone who treats as any more legitimate than Tea Partiers freaking out about losing "their" country to the nonwhite, queer, non-religious, etc. I don't care if they consider themselves aggrieved, much less deserving of serious consideration - even, and especially when they try to frame their grievance through an (odious) appropriation of civil rights rhethoric.

              Kyle Wagner over at Kotaku (one of the sites wrongly implicated in Gamergate's initial complaint) summed it up perfectly:

              The demands for journalistic integrity coming from Gamergate have nothing at all to do with the systemic corruption of the gaming media. They've centered instead on journalists purportedly pursuing social-justice agendas and on ridiculous claims that the press sees gamers as vectors of social contagion. Some of the complaints, like the idea that outlets ought to reconsider their editorial positions if enough readers disagree with them, even stand in direct opposition to traditional journalistic ethics.

              All of this makes sense, though, if you think about Gamergate as a mutant variant of the traditional American grievance movement, a rearguard action marching under the banner of high-minded media critique. The claims from what we like to call the "bias journalisms" school of media criticism aren't meant to express anything in particular, or even, perhaps, to be taken seriously; they're meant to work the referees, to get them looking over their shoulders, to soften them up in the hopes that a particular grievance, whatever its merits, might get a better hearing next time around. The problem, in other words, isn't that journalists have agendas; it's that some of them have the wrong agendas.

              Gamers are not a "disadvantaged group". The backlash against women in gaming and gaming journalism is not just some fringe "cabal of trolls." People who point this out are not a "self-righteous mob."

              Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

              by pico on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 03:38:10 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Wow. That's a whole lot of contempt you dripped on (0+ / 0-)

                me for civilly expressing a different opinion. You know me, pico. If you want to convince me of your argument, you'll be much more effective with logic than demagoguery (Allen West, Phyllis Schlafly, Misandry, fer chrissakes!, Tea Partiers freaking out, (odious), #notallgamers etc.)

                I think you make some very good points; you don't see the entire picture here; but you're convinced that you do. You're more interested in shutting down my perspective than listening to it. Your over-the-top aggression, when you know how capable I am of thoughtful debate, speaks volumes. I guess I'm not a "useful voice" coming from the correct "ideological position".

          •  Like men can't be hurt... (0+ / 0-)

            You know it's possible to hate and harm any group of people on this earth. We have persecuted Christians who've been slaughtered for their faith.  We have men who have been killed for being male. In fact that's the reason for the huge gender imbalance in the wake of the Rwanda Genocide.  There are a lot of things you don't know about this world.

            I was going to just talk about minorities but poor whites need attention too even if they statistically fair much better than their PoC counterparts. I don't want to leave people behind but you seem intent on segregating who we feel compassion for in our society. That's what we did before that created the need for all this social justice. At least leaving the door open to care for everyone is a bare minimum.

             In short yes misandry happens and it has a lot to do with this antagonism towards male gamers who were called out specifically simply for their identity and the stereotypes the writers created of them in their of a poorly socialized white nerd. This came as a shock to the female gamers who were equally outraged.

            You can look at this self loathing piece of work and the comments:

            http://www.forbes.com/...

            Gender identity needn't be something we resent or feared.  It's obvious this man feels he must think ill of males to be accepted. That's not a good thing, I don't want that for our sons.

            •  ^ and there you go (6+ / 0-)

              Are there any more doubts, really?

              Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

              by pico on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 03:40:27 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Hell, I knew what he was about from the get go.... (5+ / 0-)

                Hell, I knew what he was about from the get go. Apparently, for some men, sexism isn't visible unless a man is flat out calling us whores.

              •  Am I a witch or Shall I drink the Hemlock? (0+ / 0-)

                I cite an example of men slaughtering men in Africa and you have the nerve to dismiss this man hating man incident in defense of feminsm?  What is your problem?  You want to orthodoxy police so you can control the dialogue and keep us focused who you want to talk about.  I actually care about all the people at the same time. The truth is you need to hate to intimidate. You want to ban anyone who doesn't agree with your exclusive clique of insiders that lay down the law through social aggression. I get it, I've seen it before.  It's oppressive as hell.

                 I don't become sexist because I recognize men's problems and considering the problems facing black men I'd be a treacherous fool for selling out my people to assuage your attempts at intimidation.
                 Whites push a women focus while blacks have gender issues affecting black males that are orders of magnitude greater than those affecting white women who dominate the social justice conversation with the help of white men who'd rather talk about each other than aide black and brown. I explained that in the post.

                 Look at household incomes, who has insurance, who's in prison, who's got the powerful roles, and you'll see whites working hard to uplift their own. When we talk about gender we assume the men have life outcomes that are preferable. This is statistically not true for black men. You need to adjust your views to work with that reality.

                Your priority is not Black America, it's protecting your own influence.  If I have a voice it's not going to be for your agenda, it's going to be the black agenda.  I'm tired of being bullied by those who think social justice belongs to them.

    •  Lies on both counts (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Brecht

      You get your facts from the media but you never went over to the Hash tag did you? We don't need a party full of echo chamber idiots who become shallow and full of themselves trying to be like writers passing snap judgments on vast swaths of humanity.

      #GamerGate is strongly left wing. Back when the left instinctively sided with the people against the censors we'd be right on it. Taking down the establishment, resisting censors, and those spreading moral panic was done without question even if it was defending a stature of someone pissing on Jesus's head. Now we have a new guard spreading what sounds just like far right moral fundamentalism but under a new label.  I'm not buying it and neither are a lot of other people. We've seen this before.  

      Toxic is you're labeling of people to silence them. I prefer to think. Try having a real debate without the power of intimidating people into silence.

      •  The best place to find an echo chamber these days (4+ / 0-)

        Is #GamerGate

        #GamerGate is strongly left wing. Back when the left instinctively sided with the people against the censors we'd be right on it. Taking down the establishment, resisting censors, and those spreading moral panic was done without question even if it was defending a stature of someone pissing on Jesus's head. Now we have a new guard spreading what sounds just like far right moral fundamentalism but under a new label.  I'm not buying it and neither are a lot of other people. We've seen this before.
         

        So slut shaming, rape and death treats against women to silence them are strongly Left Wing values and a defense of freedom of expression?

        No one has silenced you.

        Shit, even machines are listening to your adolescent rants.

  •  The hate this is generating is amazingly sad. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    BeingHuman

    I think the first step down the right path should be obvious and rather painless, but it looks as if folks are going to wait until bottom lines become impacted before taking that step.

    The last thing gaming companies and the gaming press should want is to allow their brands to become negatively associated.

    You will never see progress if you aren't willing to choose the better choice on the ballot in each and every cycle.

    by sebastianguy99 on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 09:44:55 AM PDT

  •  You do realize that the discussion logs (6+ / 0-)

    on 4chan where the gamergate campaign was planned are now available, right? There are dozens of links, but I'll just give you this one http://wehuntedthemammoth.com/...

    So, while my first instinct is to use language I generally try to avoid, let me just say this: you are making it up.

    •  1.4 million tweets and 2 months in... (0+ / 0-)

      Nobody cares....

      Seriously you try to so hard to silence people it's really troubling. I see how police states must emerge when you have snakes turning in their neighbors for thought crimes.  If you want to talk about collusion among free people to organize a protest then that's fine by me. It doesn't change what #GamerGate is about nor any narrative from unethical journalist or their defenders who think their supporting the left by protecting those abusing progressive ideals like social justice and making a total mockery of what people fought long and hard to give credibility.  

      "So, while my first instinct is to use language I generally try to avoid, let me just say this: you are making it up."

      I've had enough of being told how to think by white people who think social justice belongs as if decedents of oppressors that stole the very land on which we live and brought my people here as slaves to work that land were the most appropriate stewards of a Civil Rights and Human Rights legacy that arose primarily to check abuses of their white privilege.

      What do you have to say about people who'd encourage others to start a violent backlash against black men?  NOTHING!  Yet I'm to trust this generation of young liberal whites with my freedom.  I don't thinks so.

    •  Whatever...1,500,000 tweets + 2 months later (0+ / 0-)

      You need to stop fooling yourself. Those powerful people you back don't deserve support. Demand ethical people who treat the public with common respect take their place. We don't need nasty tyrannical bullies having the run of the media. I don't care if they were working to bring universal healthcare or empty the prisons, there is some conduct that's just too far gone to be defended.  If they can't hold each other accountable then the public has to step up to protect itself from bad people who aim to hurt them and I've seen people nearly brought to tears reading the stuff coming out of this Gaming Press. The press has no business engaging in that kind of hate mongering especially some wanna be progressive press but I wouldn't dare disrespect progressives by labeling them that.

  •  I need to ask - what online games do you (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bakeneko

    regularly play, and what specific situations have you run into that provoked this diary?

    If this is simply an attempt to argue from an outside viewpoint, I'd like to know. If it isn't, then a discussion of just what kind of problems you've had would be more to the point.

    •  Doesn't seem like thoughtful analysis to me. (0+ / 0-)

      This is what it is. You can adjust your expectations to deal with that reality. My motives should be clear enough. I can copy paste from the diary if further explanation is needed.

      I'm not taking orders from those who think they are above the rest of us. The specific problem?  A lack of respect from those with a lot of power who have abused it in egregious ways.

      •  I'm looking for something to analyze. All I've (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bakeneko, susans

        seen so far is mock revolutionary rhetoric. If you don't play, why do you care?

        •  You need to read '#gamergate issue with two sides' (0+ / 0-)

          The mock revolutionary? People are fighting actual power. They are facing down threats, attacks by the mass media,  and immense waves of censorship & propaganda.  This is the real deal.  They banned the conversation on 4Chan outright by connecting with it's owner.  They blocked the conversation on Reddit deleting 25,000 comments in a single day.  The banned the shared repository on GitHub.   Do you realize that the future of a free and open online discourse depends on people defending that freedom when it's challenged? If they could the Hash Tag would have been banned on twitter.  What would the people do then?  If it's that easy to purge conversations and get away with it we're in trouble.  

          •  So you don't actually do any online gaming? (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            bakeneko, susans, Paul Rogers, poco

            I checked out almost every link you included in the diary, though I have no desire to explore 4chan.

            The future of a free and open online discourse depends on having multiple alternatives available. Any individual site can have any rules they like without affecting the overall availability of soapboxes, and DK is almost unique in not allowing comments to be deleted.

            It seems to me that you had no trouble at all finding voices yelling on both sides - how much more free and open do you want?

          •  This isn't a freedom of speech issue. (6+ / 0-)
            Do you realize that the future of a free and open online discourse depends on people defending that freedom when it's challenged?
            Just like the owner of this site, the owners of 4Chan, Reddit, and GitHub are not governmental agencies. Their choosing not to allow their sites to be used to promote the cause of the GamerGate types is in no way, shape, or form an infringement on anyone's freedom.

            As an aside, I think I'd seriously question aligning myself with a cause if that cause was so odious that even the owner of 4chan, the seediest of seedy underbellies of the Internet, said "I don't want this stuff on my site."

            "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." --Dom Helder Camara, archbishop of Recife

            by JamesGG on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 03:00:08 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  "Free and open discourse" is not free speech. (0+ / 0-)
              Critics will argue that someone banned on Reddit or neoGAF can simply go elsewhere on the Internet rather miss the point. Censorship is about denying certain views of an audience. Giving someone the freedom to speak in a deserted forest (or an unvisited website) doesn’t actually mean a great deal.
              http://techcrunch.com/...

              I wish more actually read the linked articles. Dancing around this free speech issue isn't what people who care about freedom do. That's what those who care about controlling others freedom do. I don't like the authoritarian streak running through parts of the left fight now.

              4Chan got taken censored because people who knew M00T pressured him to do so. It coincided with his appearance at the XOXO tech & art conference which was the whitest thing you'd ever seen for a bunch of folks so concerned with diversity.  Not even Asians, just white.  

              I'd be afraid of being afraid to associate freely in America. If people are this scared then we need a revolution to win our courage back. This is no way to live.

              •  So you're suggesting... (4+ / 0-)

                ...that the owners of popular websites have a moral or ethical obligation to allow their websites to be used as platforms to promote speech they find abhorrent and odious, simply to ensure that it's not "censored" from their audience.

                Further, you're suggesting that those who think that website owners should have the right to decide what speech they would like associated with themselves and their brands, have an "authoritarian streak" and don't "care about freedom."

                To say that I find your position problematic would be a profound understatement.

                "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." --Dom Helder Camara, archbishop of Recife

                by JamesGG on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 06:26:58 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

    •  Funny thing (0+ / 0-)

      I used to play a couple of obscure titles where gamers are largely anonymous and now I play Eve, where my primary character is female (I am not, but she is a character I created for a long ago role playing game that I particularly liked).  I will be really interested to see what reaction I get there

      •  Why is that a big deal? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        poco

        Women have been playing male characters since the dawn of video games.

        Two hundred fifty years of slavery. Ninety years of Jim Crow. Sixty years of separate but equal. Thirty-five years of racist housing policy. Until we reckon with our compounding moral debts, America will never be whole. - Ta-Nehisi Coates

        by moviemeister76 on Sat Oct 18, 2014 at 06:57:42 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Did I say it was? (0+ / 0-)

          More unrelenting hostility.   You'd think I'd be used to it

          However, my only point was that it will be interesting to see how female in game characters are treated differently

          •  I don't think you'll get the full experience (0+ / 0-)

            unless you're voice chatting with a female-sounding voice.

          •  In my experience, most male gamers assume every... (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            bakeneko, Paul Rogers, poco, Ozy

            In my experience, most male gamers assume everyone in an mmo is a male, even if you play a female. And I'm hostile because you're clueless enough to think that you playing a female character could give you any kind of insight when male gamers will automatically assume you're a guy, and if you use voice chat, you will experience none of the hostility I and some other female gamers experience when our actual gender becomes known.

  •  Take Audre Lorde's advice (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bakeneko

    And work on that piece of misogynist oppressor inside of you, it's causing your head to spin.

    •  Try addressing white supremacy... (0+ / 0-)

      I'm not interested in being lectured on oppression by those taking an approach to social justice that marginalizes the issues of black males by defining them as "privileged" when 33% of them go to prison in their lifetime as compared 6% of white men and 0.9% or of white women. When you are in the nation that already has the worlds largest prison population that's 93.3% male but all you want to talk about are the issues of women  then black men and thus black people are going to lose.

       They can't afford to operate within gender dynamics of presumptive white male dominance justifying arbitrary dismissal of major concerns facing one sex to serve another. They can't afford to have their issues reduced to a intersection with gender theory centered on patriarchy and not white supremacy. Let's keep in mind Romney won the white women vote and it was women of color providing for the wide gender gap.

       I'm not interested in seeing the legacy of social justice reduced to a story constructed to maximize the attention we devote to white women already benefiting for the success of white households just like their brothers. Whites still have an average household wealth 20 times that of Blacks and Hispanics and 80% of that is inherited.

      Audre may have had a male oppressor in mind but we're dealing with a crisis of fatherless homes. Priorities change when you focus on black peoples needs.

      •  Gee, and I thought you were interested in (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bakeneko, Paul Rogers, koNko

        talking about gaming. How on earth could I possibly have come to that conclusion, I wonder?

      •  Yes, I understand (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        serendipityisabitch, bakeneko

        You are pretty dismissive of women, although that might be understating it.

        I guess if it was just white women having to deal with this abuse you might have a remotely valid point, but actually, women of color, particularly those who are economically disadvantaged, including particularly, those who are struggling single mothers, have to put up with even more of this shit from men and are less empowered to do anything about it.

        So I repeat: take Audre Lorde's advice.

        Because, based on your comments on this site, your own attitude toward women in general and the backflips you do to portray men as the "equal" victims suggest you haven't come to terms with that oppressor inside.

        None of us are 100% clean, we are all "being human", but your general animosity toward women is pretty obvious.

        By the way, the toxic nature of the #GamerGate movement and it's not quite repressed MRM branded misogyny has now become so obvious that lot of gamers are trying to distance themselves from it to avoid it poisoning the well.

        Does that explain why you now have gone so far off topic here?  Having second thoughts about the diary subject?

  •  I'm skeptical of gamergate. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    serendipityisabitch

    Entirely due to how I had been first introduced to the movement.  I may have had a bad introduction, but my further interaction with gamergate supporters has been rather disappointing.

    There is sexism in games and gaming culture that is worthy of being addressed, but discussing these issues seems to be defended via poor logic and evidence.  And the people doing so seem to be supporters of gamergate.  Which only serves to drive my skepticism of the movement in general.

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