I had not seen this and think it is worthy of discussion.
Insurance companies win. Time to kill this monstrosity coming out of the Senate.
about 18 hours ago from TweetDeck
markos
Markos on Twitter
I'm sure Markos will expand on his thoughts, but I felt a diary for civil discussion was fitting. More after the fold.
I cannot disagree with Markos. The insurance companies won and it looks as if progressives will fold.
So will President Obama and the Democratic Party try to win back the disillusioned base (the economy, unemployment, health care insurance debacle, and almost 70,000 troops sent to Afghanistan in an escalation of the war)?
I can write about peace on Daily Kos all I want. I can continue to compromise, compromise, compromise with this administration, as I have done, until there are few beliefs left other than knee jerk support of the President and Democrats (and although there may be some who disagree, I have compromised over and over this year). None of that matters. I'll likely vote and even if I keep my money for my loved ones instead of giving it to politicians, the corporations likely will make up the difference. I'm not very important, but there are many disillusioned folks out there who may walk away.
Will the Democrats even bother trying to win their base back? Will President Obama?
And do you agree with Markos? Should Markos be troll rated and viciously attacked? Should he be praised? Both?
Discuss. Compare and contrast real change with 2009.
Update I: More Markos from twitter (from PixieThis in the comments)
here's some more Markos comments from twitter (3+ / 0-)
Recommended by:missLotus, TomP, A Runner
My position on #HCR -- kill it if it includes mandate. Strip out the mandate, then what's left is inoffensive. Not reform, but inoffensive. about 1 hour ago from TweetDeck
RT @xxxxxx: What is irksome, and deadly, is that individual mandate is not off the table. So this turns into a bad ins. subsidy bill about 1 hour ago from TweetDeck
Insurance industry came into 2009 fearing reform, may exit it with windfall mandate. Pays to be a failed industry these days! 37 minutes ago from TweetDeck
Mandate: Feds forcing individuals to buy for-profit product from industry protected w/ anti-trust exemption. That's supposed to be good? 18 minutes ago from TweetDeck
"... a dream that became a reality and spread throughout the stars" - Captain Kirk (Whom Gods Destroy)
by PixieThis on Tue Dec 15, 2009 at 11:43:14 AM PST
[ Reply to This | RecommendHide ]
(Bolding added by me)
Update II: The Plum Line is reporting:
Howard Dean: "Kill The Senate Bill"
Dean said the removal of the Medicare buy-in made the bill not worth supporting, and urged Dem leaders to start over with the process of reconciliation in the interview, which is set to air at 5:50 PM today on Vermont Public Radio, political reporter Bob Kinzel confirms to me.
snip
In an excerpt Kinzel gave me, Dean says:
"This is essentially the collapse of health care reform in the United States Senate. Honestly the best thing to do right now is kill the Senate bill, go back to the House, start the reconciliation process, where you only need 51 votes and it would be a much simpler bill."
Kinzel added that Dean essentially said that if Democratic leaders cave into Joe Lieberman right now they’ll be left with a bill that’s not worth supporting.
Hat tip to Arcparser in the comments who brought the news and link here.
Update III: FemLaw has a very articulate expression of the position that the bill is worth passing. It's well worth reading and considering. Because it is long, I'll just excerpt a few parts here. Even if you disagree with her, please show her respect. She is a good person and we need all positions here:
If I had to sum up why the bill is worth it - I couldn't do better than this Socratic dialogue about how the bill without a public option helps a single Mom working at Wal-Mart:
My DD: "This is quite a system. What do you call it?"
She also links to Jon Cohn at the New Republic:
Jon Cohn on long term political benefits to the left of public option fight:
http://www.tnr.com/...
Disappointed progressives may be wondering whether their efforts were a waste. They most decidedly were not. The campaign for the public option pushed the entire debate to the left--and, to use a military metaphor, it diverted enemy fire away from the rest of the bill. If Lieberman and his allies didn't have the public option to attack, they would have tried to gut the subsidies, the exchanges, or some other key element. They would have hacked away at the bill, until it left more people uninsured and more people under-insured. The public option is the reason that didn't happen.
And if public option supporters lost in the Congress, they won in the country as a whole. The underlying political problem for liberals remains what it has been for a generation: profound and widespread distrust of government. But polls consistently showed voters thought the public option advocates were right--that, at least when it comes to health insurance, government can be trusted. It was a small victory, but it's on top of such small victories that political movements are built. Someday in the future, that movement may be powerful enough to win more sweeping changes. Who knows, maybe those changes will include a government-run insurance plan.
There are other links and statements. For an understanding of the pro- bill position, please read Femlaw.