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Dear Israel:

I want to say that I am sorry about the UN disaster.  Actually, I am so, so sorry about so many things.  I should have spoke up a lot sooner.  I don’t know with the Americans if it the guilt or the knowledge that they failed to do too little, too late or is it our own Canadian wish to play with the big boys that led us down this road.  At the end of the day, it came down to you, the United States and us, along with a few States that can be barely defined as nations, against the world.  My heart reached out to you, even full well knowing that it is a misery you created for yourself.  At some point in time, one has to stop pointing fingers at everyone else, and start looking inward.  A little reflection is good for the soul and perhaps some serious soul searching is in order.  With that said, we all do share the blame for we led you down the road to hell which is always paved with good intentions.

When you were created, we easily forgave what were viewed as slight flaws in your character.  Mighty big shoes were left for you to fill.  We understood you were in a new environ, unfamiliar with the landscape.  We understood the fear you must have felt and admired your chutzpah.  We forgave your mishaps, believing that you would learn as you get older and wiser.  We cajoled you when you were angry, we dried your tears when you cried and we continued to give you, your heart’s desire.   We believed that gentle guiding rather than the rod would develop your character, failing to realize that we gave you no example to follow.

We failed to tell you that your birth came at the expense of another people, that lived, loved, laughed, cried for centuries on that same plot of land we awarded to you to make up for our failings, not yours, but ours.  It eased our conscience. We failed to tell you that they would be angry, unhappy, rightfully so.  We failed to tell you how incredibly difficult it would be to overcome the anger and hate you would face.  The wounds of what happened to you and your people were still fresh and raw, we didn’t want to make it worse.  We were shamed that we didn’t act sooner, braver and stopped the horrors you were subject to.  even when we privately hung our heads in shame.

As you grew, there were times we had to correct your path, we would admonish you, but it never lasted long.  We weren’t very consistent; we gave into your demands.  We attributed your tantrums to growing pains, to teenage angst, we looked the other way.  We clung to the hope that you would one day you would grow into your long pants and become the state you were destined to be. We told stories about you thickly laced with superlatives, expounding on your fairness, decency and strong moral compass.  We rightfully so, bragged to the neighbours about medical development, progressive thinking, technological advancement you were bringing to the world.  We heard rumblings of what others were saying under their breath.  They never quite met our eyes when they politely inquired about you and we filled their ears with our pride in your accomplishments in such a short time.  We dismissed their behavior satisfying ourselves in the secret pleasure that they were jealous, as green as the olives grown in the orchards.  If they dared to question our shining monologue of such great accomplishment, we would react with such scorn and contempt, they never dared to question your superiority again.

There were times you made us so very proud.  Against your own instinctive response, you reached your hand and took a chance to make a peace that has lasted for over three decades.  We know how hard and difficult it was to do this, the uncertainty and fear you must have overcome to reach across the abyss and take a chance on peace.  We know how you suffered for it, at the hands of your own people, but the sacrifice made by blood saved countless of innocent lives.  We were so proud, overwhelmed by your true efforts at achieving peace, making the world a better place.

We don’t know quite what happened after that.  We would have understood that if you had gambled and lost, you would have been hesitant in building the bridges between yourself and other nations.  The courageous risk you made for peace though paid off better than ever expected.  What made you stop abruptly in your tracks becoming an opportunist, benefiting from the pain and suffering of others?  Demanding what was not yours, raising the bar a little higher for them to reach, yet failing to meet the same bar.

As you continued to careen drunkenly around, subverting any chance for peace, it became harder and harder for the friends that loved you to stay and watch.   You became isolated, alone in the world, your stature eroding with each and every escapade.  Occasionally, you seemed to approach the situation with new found resolve, with an exceptional insight into the situation. Was it fear or was it cowardice which made you turn away?

You became mean and then hurtful, joyful in the pain and horrors you inflicted on another.  You made their lives a living hell, denied their basic, fundamental rights, maimed, killed, all the while playing the perpetual victim.  After decades of misery, they dared to fight back, to defend themselves and you squashed them like the cockroaches you believed them to be.  You interpreted their resistance, their self-defense as a “direct threat” to your security and safety, rather than a response to your actions.  It never occurred to you that your behavior, your use of unacceptable disproportionate force was the catalyst to which they responded to, not the other way around.  If anyone dared question your motives, your cruelty, they were met with such a violent response, they no longer dared to speak.

Gaza, poor, poor Gaza and what you have done to them.  We stayed silent fearing your wrath.  The horrors you inflicted upon a defenseless civilian population, we witnessed, we knew, we said nothing.  In 2008 and early 2009, your justifications and denials no longer no longer held water, the sheer arrogance and brutal disdain you demonstrated made us feel criminal.  You killed 9 human rights activists participating in the flotilla to break your inhumane siege on Gaza claiming them to be terrorists, silence.  You killed an American non violent protestor, silence.  You spat in the face of the United States, so filled with self-righteousness that people wondered what nation they were dealing with and yet we remained silent.

The final recent assault on Gaza has now led us to this very spot we stand, You, the United States, Canada, Panama, Nauru, Palau, Micronesia, the Czech Republic and the Marshall Island against the rest of the world.  The people who truly were your friends, fled long ago. The countries that abstained in yesterday’s UN debacle showed true friendship, the error of your ways.  They could no longer support your destructive aggression.  They realized that friends do not watch and allow other friends to drive off a cliff recklessly.  Their message to you is clear, take this last chance, this last opportunity which may never arise again and take the olive branch which is being offered, sit down at the table and negotiate not from what you feel you deserve, but what you are actually legally entitled to.  Remember that no matter what race we all descend from, we are all the same, we are all human beings wanting the same simple things from life, to be safe, to be respected, to have food on our table, warmth in our hearth, a better life for our children and to be loved.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Israel Has A Big Thumb, & It Employs It.... (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mindara, FrY10cK, Fishtroller01, corvo

    Gaza deserves a fair shake.  Come on Israel, play fair.  

    I really don't give a hoot what Sheldon Adelson wants for the bully nation.  

    •  You have no compassion for the 700,000 (6+ / 0-)

      Palestinians driven from their homes, olive groves, places of work, etc. circa 1948 to create the new state of Israel?

      No compassion for the Palestinians penned in the ghetto of Gaza, attacked with U.S. supplied F-16s, Apache attack helicopters, and other high tech weapons.

      No compassion for the Palestinians who have nothing to fight back with but Soviet era unguided munitions and explosives strapped to their own bodies? Who live sometimes without drinking water and electricity?

      One atrocity cannot be remedied by the perpetration of another (lesser) atrocity.

      Reaganomics noun pl: belief that unregulated capitalism can produce unlimited goods for unlimited people on a planet with finite resources and we the people can increase revenue by decreasing revenue.

      by FrY10cK on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 05:46:41 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  You have no compassion (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        volleyboy1, FG, FrugalGranny, Mets102, debedb

        for the Israelis killed in suicide bombings?  For the family of settlers killed in their sleep, including a 10 month old baby? Oh, right ... those were evil Jooo colonialsts!

        "Valerie, why am I getting all these emails calling me a classless boor?"

        by TLS66 on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 08:09:43 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  The Palestinians are defending (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Fishtroller01

          themselves against an imperial occupier who plans to grab all Palestinian lands. The result will be a system of apartheid or ethnic cleansing.

          It is an insult to the world's intelligence and patience when Israel builds settlements in the middle of Palestinian land, then claims "self-defense" when the Palestinians target those settlements. Imagine if during the Cold War the Russians dropped a few settlements in the middle of Iowa, and fenced it off with heavy military protection. Could the Russians then claim "self-defense" and launch into military excursions to protect their settlements? Could they take the high moral ground by claiming how those "evil Americans" were targeting innocent Russian civilians?

          Those ever expanding settlements are a threat to the very existence of Palestine. Yet it is the Israelis who claim the moral high ground by saying the Palestinian resistance - no match for the Israeli military - represents a threat to Israel's existence.

          Anyone who buys the Israeli propaganda is a fool.

        •  Compassion - where is your compassion? (0+ / 0-)

          I have to wonder, do you believe an Israeli life is more valuable than a Palestinian's?  

          from Sept. 29, 2000 to September 30, 2012

          6,620 Palestinians killed of which 1,238 were children
          1,094 Israelis killed of which 129 were children

          During the time period the ten month old Fogel baby died (in post Operation Cast Lead era), 6 Israeli minors were killed, yet 38 Palestinian minors were killed.  In regard to total fatalities (which includes the above mentioned fatalities of children), 320 Palestinians were killed, yet only 25 Israelis perished.  Of the 320 Palestinians killed, only 30 were the subject of a targeted killing.  Exactly 1/2 of the Palestinians killed were participating in the hostilities (on Palestinian land, btw).  Is that an acceptable ratio of self defense when half of the people killed were not part of or if it was not known that they were participating in hostilities.  

          Do you even know that names of the Israeli children who died?   Isn't it a tat hypocritical for you to scream about the death of a ten month old baby, yet not even acknowledge the deaths of Palestinian children?  Considering Motti Fogel's (brother, uncle and brother-in-law to the Udi Fogel family) stated "A person is born for himself, to his parents and siblings, and dies for himself, he is not a symbol or a national event, and death must not be allowed to become an instrument of something".  For people to actually politicize the murder of these people with complete disregard for the family's wishes is incredibly low.  

          In fact do you even know the names of the dead Israeli children or is it just convenient for you to invoke the one death so publicized in order to justify your hypocrisy?  Here they are from September 29, 2000 to September 30, 2012.

          Shaked Lasker , Avihai Levy Aviad Mansour , Hadar Hatuel, Merav Hatuel, Roni Hatuel, Hila Hatuel, Shaked Avraham, , Gavriel Hoter, Lenoy Saroussi, Hadas Turjeman, Shuv-El Dikstein, Yonatan Gamliel, Sarah Tiferet Shilon, Prematurely born baby of severely wounded woman, Avishai Shabo, Neria Shabo, Zvika Shabo, Shmuel Yerushalmi, Gal Eisenman, Avraham Sitton, Gilad Stieglitz, Nathaniel Riahi, Daniel Shefi, Keren Shatsky, Rachel Thaler, Nehemia ‘Amar, Yael Ohana, Yair ‘Amar, Avraham Nahman Nitzani, Menashe Regev, Shoshana Ben Ishai, Ronen Landau,Yehuda Haim Shoham,Kobi Mandell, Yosef Ishran, Shalhevet Pass, Ophir Rahum, Neria Cohen, Segev Peniel Avihail, Avraham David Mozes, Yonatan Yitzhak Eldar, Rachel Ben Avu, Nofar Horowitz. Ayala-Haya Abukasis, Yuval Abebeh, Dorit Inso, Avial Atash, Afiq Zahavi-Ohayon, Assaf Staier, Liran Zer-Aviv, Noya Zer-Aviv, Tomer Almog, Benyamin Bergman, Avraham Bar-Or, Issachar Dov Reinitz, Shmuel Zargari, Elisheva Meshulami, Tehilla Nathanson, Noam Leibowitz, Elizabeth Katzman, Abigail Litale, Daniel Haroush, Yuval Mendellevich, Kamar Abu Hamed, Assaf Tzur, Tom Hershko, Smadar Firstater, Tal Kehrmann, Yafit Revivo, Ilan Perlman, Mikha’el Shershevsky, Hodaya Asraf, Matan Ohayon, Noam Ohayon, Gaston Perpinal, Osnat Abramov, Shani Avi Zedek, Galila Bugala, hadar Hershkowitz,Adi Dahan, Sinai Keinan, Elmar Dezhabrielov, Gal Koren, Ofer Ron, Orly Ofir,Adi Shiran, Rachel Levy, Aviya Malka, Shauli Nehmad, Shiraz Nehmad, Liran Nehmad, Lidor Ilan, Oriah Ilan, Ya’akov Avraham Eliahu, Avraham Eliahu Nehmad, Assaf Avitan, Golan Turgeman, Adam Weinstein, Idan Cohen, Israel Ya’akov Danino, Yocheved Shushan, Malka Roth, Hemda Schijveschuurder, Michal Raziel, Ra’aya Schijveschuurder, Avraham Yitzhak Schijveschuurder, Tamara Shimashvili, Aliza Malka, Yael Yulia Sklianik, Yevgeniya Dorfman, Liana Sakiyan, Irina Nepomneschi, Mariana Medvedenko, Katherine Kastaniyada Talkir, Yulia Nelimov, Maria Tagilchev, Raisa Nimrovsky,Anya Kazackovkov, Marina Berkovizki, Naftali Lanzkom and Eliran Rosenberg Zayat, Yonatan Palmer, Yoav Fogel, Ela’d Fogel, Hadas Fogel, Shlomo Nativ and Daniel Viflic.

          I cannot list the 1,238 children who died in that same time period, because unfortunately there isn’t enough room to do so.

      •  They started it. So not really. (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        FrugalGranny, Mets102, volleyboy1

        And my problem with the diary is the presumption by the diarist that he/she is the only one who knows what to do and is now dictating his/her divine wishes to everyone else.

        •  I don't read it that way (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          FG, Fishtroller01, volleyboy1, poco

          Or, perhaps, I would ask how that is different from any other opinion piece or diary.

          I think that your statement "they started it" is as simplistic as a Palestinian saying "Israel started it." The more one delves into the actual history of the area the more one finds that the question of who started "it," and what "it" is, is an entirely arbitrary one.

          There is a legitimate argument in Jewish tradition about whether we are supposed to feel compassion for the "other", the non Jews who we deal with. I say yes, as a Jew I have an obligation to feel compassion for every human being no matter how they got into whatever situation they are in. You may disagree.

          If you believe that ALL criticism of Israel is antisemitic, you're an idiot.
          If you believe that NONE of the criticism of Israel is antisemitic, you're a fool.
          If you call EVERYONE who criticizes Israel antisemitic, you're just an a$$hole

          by A Gutin Daf on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 11:30:58 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  It is just my opinion but to me it reads more (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            volleyboy1

            condescending than most other opinion pieces on the subject. Yes, the 'they started it' premise is simplistic and it's wrong to blame people for things that other people in the same ethnic group did. But thru most of the history of modern Israel the other side has been an aggressor so the claims of the diary that it should be pitied are not acceptable to me. Of course, that doesn't give Israel the license to behave abominably towards Palestinians as it often does.

          •  Assumptions (0+ / 0-)

            Perhaps your non Jew assumption is exactly what it is, an assumption.

            Canadian mother of four, works at Canadian University, blogs and co-host of Blog Talk Radio's "Lies My Country Told Me" with co-host and love of my life, Fred Lemon.

            by mmayer on Thu Dec 20, 2012 at 10:35:08 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  FG- your comment is sheer nonsense. (0+ / 0-)

          Too bad there's not a box to check for that.

        •  They started it. So not really. (0+ / 0-)

          Sorry, no divine wishes at all.  Just want the petulant child of the State of Israel to start growing up and throwing tantrums.  Their tantrum actually kills people.

  •  I don't think that during her entire history (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bluedust, TLS66, Dogs are fuzzy, FrY10cK

    Israel " continued to careen drunkenly around, subverting any chance for peace" ANY chance? Rabin etc...

    It's much worse now with the right wing government they have.

    I always think that countries behave like individuals but on a larger scale (sorry to be so innarticulately obvious). What I mean is, Israel behaves like a person with a trauma history. She reacts to assault or what seems to her like assault in a way that seems to everyone else like an over reaction.

    She behaves like a person with PTSD. That would make a lot of sense.

    not excusing behavior (before so many jump down my throat) just musing on the causes. I don' t think ANY people is inherently evil or different than others...behavior of people and I surmise countries is explainable by looking at human nature and psychology of how we are made.

    •  Actually no (4+ / 0-)

      They Israel is behaving exactly like the third son of a Victorian English lord with the worst of imperial arrogance.

      (The first son inherited the title, the second was destined for the church and the third was sent out to make his fortune in one of the imperial possessions).

      Although there are many examples of such situations the best analogy is the white settlers in Kenya who set up their plantations having acquired land that had been removed from its traditional owners either by force or by ignoring tradition land ownership. That land was thier's because of their heritage and they attempted to preserve a pseudo-English lifestyle by staying within their cliques and ignoring the traditions around them.

      That's the closest in terms of individuals however the actions of Israelis closely reflect all the groups that have moved from their original countries and been transplanted to a foreign land for imperial purposes. I would cite the Protestants in Ireland, the Europeans in South America, most of the white Commonwealth (New Zealand being perhaps the exception) and the USA.

      An even more close analogy with a particular group is with the Afrikanners in South Africa. Having originally been Dutch colonisers, many moved out of the Cape in the Voortrek to set up the Orange Free State and eventually gained political power in the whole of South Africa in the 1950s with a national myth with similarities to that of Israel. They used the excuse of being driven out to go on to justify their behaviour and assert a right to power (the Voortrekker monument outside Pretoria is a physical statement of this).

      I have also heard arguments from members of the white tribes in South Africa to justify minority rule using many of the arguments about how they had developed the land in contrast to the "natives" that Israelis now use to justify their country as a success - all that nonsense about "making the desert bloom" when it is at the expense of draining millenia old acquifers and ignoring the local climate. A similar situation to those in Las Vegas who insist on playing on lush golf courses and going back to a home surrounded by lawns.

      "Who stood against President Obama in 2012?" - The trivia question nobody can answer.

      by Lib Dem FoP on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 08:49:07 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  I don't know (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    too many people, FrY10cK

    who is right and who is wrong on this issue. Maybe right and wrong isn't even the best way to look at it. Can someone please explain why the Jews weren't given a large part of Germany after the war. Wouldn't that have made more sense? I know there must have been a reason. Can someone enlighten me on how this came to be?

    •  Would they have wanted it? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      jakedog42

      There were religious aspirations for what's now Israel, and an urge to put distance between the Jews and their persecutors. Uganda was considered, for example.

    •  the Brits had owned Palestine since the 1920's (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      jakedog42

      and after WWII in their wisdom, decided to create Israel within its borders.

      I think that is the one sentence answer.  I'll be corrected if I'm mistaken, I'm sure.

    •  Racism -- some of the strongest proponents (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      jakedog42, Christy1947

      of Israel in Britian were antisemites.   Get "those people" off of my lawn.   A lot had to do with worries about a flood of Jews coming to Europe from other countries -- if you read between the lines.

      http://www.zionism-israel.com/...

      'It seems evident that, for these and other reasons, Zionism will mitigate the lot and elevate the status of no negligible fraction of the Jewish race. Those who go to Palestine will not be like those who now migrate to London or New York. They will not be animated merely by the desire to lead in happier surroundings the kind of life they formerly led in Eastern Europe. They will go in order to join a civil community which completely harmonizes with their historical and religious sentiments; a community bound to be land it inhabits by something deeper even than custom; a community, whose members will suffer from no divided loyalty, nor any temptation to hate the laws under which they are forced to live. To them the material gain should be great; but surely the spiritual gain will be greater still.
      In other words, they won't be here.
      •  Thanks (0+ / 0-)

        These answers all make sense. I know even though there was tremendous sympathy for the Jewish people after the war, there was still a lot of antisemitic feelings towards them. I remember reading about a survey the US Army took after the war and just as many soldiers were against serving with Jews as there were against serving with African-Americans.

        •  IIRC, there was also not a small thread in Britain (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          jakedog42

          at that time of the same end times thinking we here are so familiar with in our Fundys. Not only did they want their Jews and the ones who had escaped from the Cossacks and the pales out of Britain, it had the additional advantage of beginning the return of all Jews to Israel which is a marker and part of the process of Christ's return for those who believe in that version of the Christian religion.

        •  Except the partition plan (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          volleyboy1

          predates the war. Once the details of the Shoah came out it may have accelerated matters, but Palestine was headed in the Jewish State direction by the mid to late 1930s.

          If you believe that ALL criticism of Israel is antisemitic, you're an idiot.
          If you believe that NONE of the criticism of Israel is antisemitic, you're a fool.
          If you call EVERYONE who criticizes Israel antisemitic, you're just an a$$hole

          by A Gutin Daf on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 12:02:32 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

  •  HR'ed for two reasons... (8+ / 0-)

    First, the condescension that FG refers to above.  After millennia of what gentiles put Jews through, the last thing that needs to be said by them is such specific details on how Jews should be running the Jewish state.  Unfortunately, however, that is the relatively minor reason for the HR.

    The major reason is that this passage is nothing more than an apologia and excuse for terrorism, which, last I checked, is eminently HR'able:

    After decades of misery, they dared to fight back, to defend themselves and you squashed them like the cockroaches you believed them to be.  You interpreted their resistance, their self-defense as a “direct threat” to your security and safety, rather than a response to your actions.  It never occurred to you that your behavior, your use of unacceptable disproportionate force was the catalyst to which they responded to, not the other way around.
    Blowing up a bus full of people going about their everyday lives, blowing up a pizza place full of teenagers, blowing up a Passover Seder, is not "resistance."  It's murder and it's terrorism.  HR'ed accordingly.  Shame on those that uprated the diary.

    Enacting our agenda requires winning elections. Oh, and me on Facebook and Twitter.

    by Mets102 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 08:26:13 PM PST

    •  murder, terrorism are of course rife on both sides (0+ / 0-)

      I'll accept your justification for the HR of this diary if you accept that hand-picking three examples of atrocities on the part of one side can be equivalently matched by hand-picking three examples of atrocities on the part of the other side.

      Or, to soften the above, I'll even accept your HR if you don't accept my comment, as it's not my place to judge either party, and your HR doesn't require my acceptance anyway.

    •  Are you supposed to HR opinions? (8+ / 0-)

      This diarist has a right to her opinion, which is shared by much of the world. I read it as saying that Palestinian attacks were in reaction to Israel's land theft and oppression. Hamas came into existence in response to Israel's occupation. Saying that doesn't deny the suffering of Israelis as well. But most Israel apologists on DKos refuse to admit that the elephant in the room is the occupation, which is illegal and inhumane. I hesitate to even use the word "terror" since it is often misused. Both sides of this conflict have killed civilians. The Palestinians have no army, so what are they supposed to do? Just sit by as Israel builds settlements? Restricts their movement? Denies them tax revenues and even food? I wish that the Palestinians had their own MLK, and that nonviolent resistance could work there. I just fear they'd get crushed even quicker.

      The civil rights, gay rights and women's movements, designed to allow others to reach for power previously grasped only by white men, have made a real difference, and the outlines of 21st century America have emerged. -- Paul West of LA Times

      by LiberalLady on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 08:56:46 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Although actually Hamas was created by Israel (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        SCFrog, letsgetreal, corvo

        as a counterweight to the secular Palestenian Liberation Organization.   Heck, the son of Hamas' current leader turns out to be an Israeli spy.

        http://www.israelnationalnews.com/...

        Mosab Hassan Yousef, son of jailed Hamas terrorist leader Sheikh Hassan Yousef, operated undercover in the service of Israel's intelligence agency for a decade. Yousef reveals this information in an upcoming book, and in an interview with Israeli newspaper Haaretz to be published this weekend
        How, um, "convenient."   Kind of makes you wonder whose side Hamas is really on.   In my opinion very few "leaders" in the area are truly on the side of the Palestenian people and those who were are either dead or among the thousands in jail in Israel : http://en.wikipedia.org/...)

        For a fairly reasonable view of the situation see the movie http://www.imdb.com/...   -- and see what happens to peaceful protests over attempts to divide one Palestenian town in half, with one half on the side of the wall that Palestenians are not allowed to go on.    What is very interesting is how little support the protestors get from the recognized Palestenian leadership and how the people who lead the protests -- which include many liberal Israelis -- are targeted by the IDF.

      •  As Gandhi said (0+ / 0-)
        I wish that the Palestinians had their own MLK, and that nonviolent resistance could work there.  I just fear they'd get crushed even quicker.
        I think that would be a good idea.
    •  Shame on you for not recognizing that a people (3+ / 0-)

      oppressed for long enough, driven from their homes and penned into a ghetto, attacked with billions of dollars worth (annually) of U.S. supplied high-tech weapons, will fight back with whatever they have at their disposal.

      For the Palestinians this is Soviet era unguided munitions and explosives strapped to their own bodies. If they had massive military installations, F-16s, cruise missiles, Apache attack helicopters etc., I sure they would go after hardened military targets.

      The are under constant assault. They fight back with what they have. Take back your unjustified HR.

      Reaganomics noun pl: belief that unregulated capitalism can produce unlimited goods for unlimited people on a planet with finite resources and we the people can increase revenue by decreasing revenue.

      by FrY10cK on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 05:55:19 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  HR'd (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      SCFrog

      For abusing HR.

  •  Mr, Haniyeh, is that you? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    volleyboy1

    "mmayer", my ass!  This is no Jew!

    "Valerie, why am I getting all these emails calling me a classless boor?"

    by TLS66 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 09:11:24 PM PST

  •  erm (4+ / 1-)
    Recommended by:
    Govinda, FrugalGranny, TLS66, volleyboy1
    Hidden by:
    FrY10cK
    When you were created, we easily forgave what were viewed as slight flaws in your character.
    go to hell.
    •  Your comment contributes nothing. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      SCFrog

      Pure vitriol. Not useful. Buh-bye.

      Reaganomics noun pl: belief that unregulated capitalism can produce unlimited goods for unlimited people on a planet with finite resources and we the people can increase revenue by decreasing revenue.

      by FrY10cK on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 05:57:06 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Who were you before you were (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    TLS66, volleyboy1, FrugalGranny, leftynyc

    mmayer?

    Done with politics for the night? Have a nice glass of wine with Palate Press: The online wine magazine.

    by dhonig on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 05:23:57 AM PST

  •  In the US we have been an incredible (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    SCFrog

    amount of propaganda about the justification for the creation of the state of Israel. We continue to buy into it in the form of bending over backwards with a "partner" who spies on us and thumbs their nose at us when we ask for reasonable restraints on settlement expansion. We allow a lobbying group (AIPAC) to ride roughshod over Congress and bully anyone who questions the actions of Israel (see Jimmy Carter and Professors Walt and Mearsheimer) with the accusation of "antisemitism".

    I see this same type of bullying going on here in the form of HRs.

    This diarist expresses what I and many have come to feel about Israel.  They are not a democracy. Look behind the curtain and see what they do with the Arab population who are citizens of Israel in terms of voting and property rights. Netanyahu shows the world a face of Israel that has popped up again and again in its history- the face of dominionism. It is nothing new. The settlers in early America did the same thing with the native Americans, and much of that was due to a religious conviction of divine favoritism.

    I have argued before and will do so again that religious beliefs play a large and corruptive role in all of this.
    As the award winning title song of the film Exodus says:

    "This land is mine, God gave this land to me
    This brave and ancient land to me
    And when the morning sun reveals her hills and plain
    Then I see a land where children can run free

    So take my hand and walk this land with me
    And walk this lovely land with me
    Though I am just a man, when you are by my side
    With the help of God, I know I can be strong

    Though I am just a man, when you are by my side
    With the help of God, I know I can be strong

    To make this land our home
    If I must fight, I'll fight to make this land our own
    Until I die, this land is mine"

    When one feels divinely favored over others, and no one questions that opinion because it's someone's religious beliefs, we all pay for it.  When others agree that land can be claimed because of mythologies in a religious text, we all pay for it.  The world allowed the creation of a state based on guilt and theft.  How could this have ever produced any kind of peace?

  •  not all jews wanted to emigrate to Israel after WW (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    SCFrog

    Apparently Zionists put a great deal of pressure on the Allies to close off alternative migration from displaced persons camps. No doubt, anti-semitism made this appealing as well in parts of Europe that Jews might have wanted to emigrate to... and also in the US. Neverheless, there was a srtrong desire on the part of Zionists to increase the population in what would become Israel.
    Incidentally, as shown in the current Israeli documentary, The Flat, pre-war Zionists occasionally collaborated with Nazis in the late 30s to promote emigration. Eichmann was a big proponent of that and the film shows one of his close associates visiting Palestine with a prominent German Jewish Zionist. Politics always creates strange bedfellows (e.g., KKK apparently had  clandestine contacts with black separatists re: a sepoarate state for blacks).

    Another irony is that Israel secretly funded Egypts Muslim Brothrhood decades ago (Hamas' daddy). Why would they do such a thing? Because israel's enemy then was Nasser, a secular pan-Arab leader, and the Brotherhood seemed to be a group that might just be into religious issues and apolitical and if they could attain power Egypt would lose interest in the palestinian issue.  

    •  I think you need to source this assertion (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      volleyboy1, poco
      Apparently Zionists put a great deal of pressure on the Allies to close off alternative migration from displaced persons camps.
      Where do you get this from? There are a lot of conspiracy theories about the Israeli Pioneers - this one is a new one to me, though.

      What I do know is that, during the war, ships full of Jews were repeatedly refused by countries around the world.

      If you believe that ALL criticism of Israel is antisemitic, you're an idiot.
      If you believe that NONE of the criticism of Israel is antisemitic, you're a fool.
      If you call EVERYONE who criticizes Israel antisemitic, you're just an a$$hole

      by A Gutin Daf on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 12:05:25 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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